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Thor doesn't have his hammer for this fight...

XMEN team.

Emma
Beast
X23
Warpath (blades)
Cyclops
Havok
Dust
Colossus
Armor

Who wins?

Team.

Originally posted by carver9
Thor doesn't have his hammer for this fight...

XMEN team.

Emma
Beast
X23
Warpath (blades)
Cyclops
Havok
Dust
Colossus
Armor

Who wins? someone just re-read wwh: x-men

Originally posted by psycho gundam
someone just re-read wwh: x-men

ok, I did just what you said. and then what?

Emma wins.

Without Mjolnir, this will be a difficult battle fpr Thor to win.

Although, hasn't it been established in this forum that Thor doesn't need his hammer to summon most of his powers?

Or was that Surfer without his board? I forget.

Mjolnir grants better control Thor's weather based powers, but the power he has as the God of Thunder is innate.

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
Mjolnir grants better control Thor's weather based powers, but the power he has as the God of Thunder is innate.

If they fight smart, I think the team could take him, but Thor is capable of taking it himself too...

Originally posted by -Pr-
If they fight smart, I think the team could take him, but Thor is capable of taking it himself too...

What happens when Emma makes him think hes a special episode of blossom?

The team is definitely winning this

Originally posted by SasuOna
What happens when Emma makes him think hes a special episode of blossom?

The team is definitely winning this

The thing is, telepathy is the most over rated power in comics.....ever. You'd think it'd be an "I win" power against any non telepath but it doesn't work that way.

Hulk, Gladiator, Superman, and others have massive TP resistance. I'm willing to bet Thor does too.

Thor takes the majority wins and easily too.

a good way to put him down imo is to have the team hold him while colossus knocks him out

Thor

How could they hold them down if he starts dropping lightning bolts and summoning hurricane gale winds?

.

team would likely win the majority.

Can Team even HURT Thor? Team actually has members that are worthless or near worthless against Thor.

For example :
Emma
Beast
X23
Warpath (blades)
Colossus
Armor

are just dead weight. Team's best hope is if Cyclops and Havok can tag team Thor with an enormous energy blast and even then I think Thor's durability can tank it.

Thor uses the God Blast to nuke the entire team to kingdom come...

If Thor is serious, this is spite...even sans Mjolnir.

Colossus VS Thor is a fisticuffs.... This stalls Thor. A stab by x-23 hurts Thor! X-23s damage would be similar to what wolverine can do to nefaria...

I could see Thor walking towards Cyclops and Havok like he did Superman in the JLA/Avengers crossover. I know better than to bring that up...but it would be just awesome if he just tanked their beams and then decapitated both of them with 1 punch.

Originally posted by carver9
Thor doesn't have his hammer for this fight...

XMEN team.

Emma
Beast
X23
Warpath (blades)
Cyclops
Havok
Dust
Colossus
Armor

Who wins? I'm trying to figure out who one this team is going to threaten Thor,

and which ones could still be standing after Thor called down a lightning bolt from the sky.


I think their best bet is with Emma's TP honestly.

Colossus could definitely hold his own for awhile.

Why is he being written off so easily?

not to mention colossus metal body is immune to lightning...

Thor has no massive resistance to A Class telapaths. It would be pretty hilarious to say hes immune to Thanos' telepathy just because

Team is winning this X-23 is basically a stronger and faster version of Wolverine without the adamantium skeleton

Collosus fisticuffs would work him over while Emma enters his mind and shuts his brain down.

Originally posted by Mindset
Colossus could definitely hold his own for awhile.

Why is he being written off so easily?

He'd last about as long as he did vs the Hulk then Thor would cave his chest in or break his arms like Hulk did.



When has TP ever worked on a brick that wasn't holding back? I even gave examples (Gladiator, Hulk, Superman, etc...).

X-23 would be ripped in half if she came withing melee range of Thor. Colossus would likewise die.

Thor's strength, durability, stamina, fighting skills, and weather manip powers >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>anything this team is putting out.

Originally posted by SasuOna
Thor has no massive resistance to A Class telapaths. It would be pretty hilarious to say hes immune to Thanos' telepathy just because

Team is winning this X-23 is basically a stronger and faster version of Wolverine without the adamantium skeleton

Collosus fisticuffs would work him over while Emma enters his mind and shuts his brain down.

Not before getting a lightning bolt to her dome. and Colossus would get beat into the dirt.

Originally posted by zopzop
He'd last about as long as he did vs the Hulk then Thor would cave his chest in or break his arms like Hulk did.



When has TP ever worked on a brick that wasn't holding back? I even gave examples (Gladiator, Hulk, Superman, etc...).

X-23 would be ripped in half if she came withing melee range of Thor. Colossus would likewise die.

Thor's strength, durability, stamina, fighting skills, and weather manip powers >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>anything this team is putting out. WWH >> Thor

Originally posted by Mindset
WWH >> Thor

If it was merely physical strength and durability it'd be debatable and you'd have a good case. But it's more than that. It's Thor's millennia of fighting experience and his weather manip abilities as well as his strength/durability/stamina that gives him 10/10 vs this team.

Emma's TP won't do jack and that was their only hope.

You keep saying it won't do anything because you don't want it to do anything?
Thor has been effected by Telepathy before that should be enough right there not some"Oh well he must have been holding back" like other characters not named Thor apply to his abilities.

While I'm at it I'll just cite every time hes stood up to the power of the mind gem as massive PIS right there since I know you want to reference his fights with Moondragon but ignore all the things before that show he can be effected by TP.

Who is the highest level person that Emma has pulled the "shut down the brain" tactic on?

Is Emma fast enough to shut down Thor completely before the onslaught of lightning, winds, etc? Would she even be able to perform her TP effectively under those conditions provided she wasn't immediately targeted?

As far as Marvel is concerned, I've been under the impression that the speed of thought traveles faster than anything else, barring light.

Emma has enough power to take down Thor, IMO. She's probably Marvel's most accomplished un-assisted (PF, cerebro, cerebra, etc) telepath. If this was like Psylocke or something you'd have a point, but she's the cream of the crop.

So who on Thor's level has she taken out?

Thor has some pretty impressive durability against mental attacks.

http://i388.photobucket.com/albums/oo326/OneDumbG0/Thor%20Stats/ThorMentalDefense04Avengers138.jpg

http://i388.photobucket.com/albums/oo326/OneDumbG0/Thor%20Stats/ThorMentalDefense05240.jpg

he can resist Emma enough to finish her. Colossus wont slow Thor to much. Most of that team is fodder.

Originally posted by Mindset
WWH >> Thor physically.

Originally posted by Damborgson
physically. And that's all that matters in a fight vs Colossus.

He'd last longer vs Thor than he did against WWH. Definitely not going down like zopzop said.

Originally posted by Mindset
And that's all that matters in a fight vs Colossus.

He'd last longer vs Thor than he did against WWH. Definitely not going down like zopzop said. Thor would pound his face in quite easily actually. Way stronger and more durable by alot

Except he wouldn't.

Originally posted by Mindset
Except he wouldn't. If Colossus wasn't Colossus i would agree with you brah

Originally posted by Mindset
And that's all that matters in a fight vs Colossus.

He'd last longer vs Thor than he did against WWH. Definitely not going down like zopzop said. If Thor uses his weather manip powers then Colossus goes down quick. Stuns him with a bolt then batters him with punches. In a pure physical contest Thor is still more skilled than Colossus and could take him down pretty fast. If Thor chooses to try and muscle colossus out of his way then yeah it takes longer than WWH to beat him.

Colossus would do about as well as Ulik in a straight up brawl, provided Thor doesn't use his other powers outside of his fists. Likely more durable, about the same striking power w/pounders, imo.

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
Colossus would do about as well as Ulik in a straight up brawl, provided Thor doesn't use his other powers outside of his fists. Likely more durable, about the same striking power w/pounders, imo. Pretty much. He isnt much of a match for Thor anyway u look at it.

Originally posted by Damborgson
If Thor uses his weather manip powers then Colossus goes down quick. Stuns him with a bolt then batters him with punches. In a pure physical contest Thor is still more skilled than Colossus and could take him down pretty fast. If Thor chooses to try and muscle colossus out of his way then yeah it takes longer than WWH to beat him. Colossus isn't going down fast, you don't know what you're talking about.

Sorry.

Originally posted by Mindset
Colossus isn't going down fast, you don't know what you're talking about.

Sorry. lol dont cry.

apology accepted.

Originally posted by Mindset
Colossus isn't going down fast, you don't know what you're talking about.

Sorry. Rage is about own your ass bro just wait

Originally posted by Damborgson
lol dont cry.

apology accepted. This is chomper level.

Unless Thor straight up tries to annihilate Piotr, Mindset's correct. Mostly everyone else, if they're not BFRed or KOed by storm summoning, they get quaked or punched across the nation.

I think once colossus sees some of his teamates die he enters into his own rage...I mean he still goes down but in a rage he could surprise thor a bit

Originally posted by Mindset
This is chomper level. in a brick to brick fight Colossus isnt going down fast. If thor uses his other abilities and fighting skills he wins fairly quick. how is this wrong???

Originally posted by Mindset
This is chomper level. Damn brah thats harsh
Originally posted by colossulrage
I think once colossus sees some of his teamates die he enters into his own rage...I mean he still goes down but in a rage he could surprise thor a bit Surprise Thor by his futile attempt at fighting Thor solo.

Originally posted by Damborgson
in a brick to brick fight Colossus isnt going down fast. If thor uses his other abilities and fighting skills he wins fairly quick. how is this wrong??? All of it.

The sad fact is, it's not even that Thor is such a physical powerhouse or even that his weather powers are overpowered, it's just that the majority of non-omega level mutants are trash.

That and TP is vastly over-rated.

Thor's weather powers are just going to annoy Colossus.

He will put C down, but it won't be fast.

Originally posted by Mindset
All of it. That didn't answer anything....

whatever...

Originally posted by Mindset
Thor's weather powers are just going to annoy Colossus.

He will put C down, but it won't be fast.

I agree, Thor's weather powers would be a nuisance at best for Colossus. But Thor's fists will mangle that guy just as bad as Hulk did. Thor's a warrior and is known to go berserk occasionally.

Originally posted by zopzop
I agree, Thor's weather powers would be a nuisance at best for Colossus. im gonna have to read up more on colossus.

storm has channeled lightning through colossus body before hasnt she? and it didnt hurt him. but im sure thors lighting is more powerful

wait till colossus gets the gym of cyttorak in xmen 540. he would solo

Originally posted by Damborgson
im gonna have to read up more on colossus. Class 100 strength, his max is 750 tons (stated on panel). has fought gladiator, wwh, king hyperion, hercules, juggernaut and held his own very briefly but ultimately fails
immune to lightning and.electricity . his metal body directs it to the ground

Originally posted by Colossus-Big C

immune to lightning and.electricity . his metal body directs it to the ground that makes sense. So it would be a pure physical contest like Mindset said...http://farm1.static.flickr.com/169/421008297_4809bd7b35.jpg im still green at this....Gonna have to keep reading i guess.

Originally posted by Colossus-Big C
Class 100 strength, his max is 750 tons (stated on panel). has fought gladiator, wwh, king hyperion, hercules, juggernaut and held his own very briefly but ultimately fails
immune to lightning and.electricity . his metal body directs it to the ground What issue was his 750 tons stated??

a few nimrod robots jumped him,( he destroyed a few) and 6 of them held him down while one calculated his strength at 750 tons, he then adapted and damaged colossus arm

Didn't Storm hurt him with lightning during the Roguestorm issue....I seem to recall him screaming in pain.

iirc his powers were drained

and low showings exist, out of 10 times being shown immune to lightning theres bound to be a low showing

Have any of those lightning strikes been on Thor's power level?

Originally posted by Silent Master
So who on Thor's level has she taken out?

Rachel Summers w/ Phoenix? lol
Xavier
Mr Sinister (shut his powers off from half way across the globe)
Lady Mastermind
Stalemated Exodus

I mean, she has the best *consistent* arsenal of telepathy out of any other character I've seen in the last few decades.

Lulz. Colossus would be no challenge to Thor if the Odinson wanted to put him down.

There's a reason why Summers went to Hela for help to deal with Ares instead of Colossus.

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
Colossus would do about as well as Ulik in a straight up brawl, provided Thor doesn't use his other powers outside of his fists. Likely more durable, about the same striking power w/pounders, imo.

I seriously disagree with this assessment. The troll can actually hold his own. Ulik is a fair bit stronger than Colossus and with the pounders strikes significantly harder than the Russian.

I see Emma as major threat and Colossus as a nuisance, rest is cannon fodder...

Don't even bring up x-23, Daken was BBQ by one of Thor lighting bolts during Siege.

If anyone can prove Emma via mind control is strong enough to turn Thor into her blond boy toy. Its current going for Thor for the win~

Current Hulk is stronger than X-men vs WWH arc now. Colossus would be trash-up can, ready to be recycled~

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
I seriously disagree with this assessment. The troll can actually hold his own. Ulik is a fair bit stronger than Colossus and with the pounders strikes significantly harder than the Russian.

Yeah, Ulik can hold his own for really about as long as Thor wants to entertain it, imo, which is how I feel in general about him going up against Colossus. Thor typically fought down to Ulik's level, even when Ulik tried to cheat or win by any means necessary. Typical mindset, Thor would probably just slug it out with him with Piotr faring decent to a point. If/when Thor gets tired of the farce, Colossus is going down hard.

It depends on Thor's mindset, whom he decides to go after first, and his overall method of offense which determines this fight, imo.

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
Yeah, Ulik can hold his own for really about as long as Thor wants to entertain it, imo, which is how I feel in general about him going up against Colossus. Thor typically fought down to Ulik's level, even when Ulik tried to cheat or win by any means necessary. Typical mindset, Thor would probably just slug it out with him with Piotr faring decent to a point. If/when Thor gets tired of the farce, Colossus is going down hard.

It depends on Thor's mindset, whom he decides to go after first, and his overall method of offense which determines this fight, imo.

Nah, Ulik is strong enough to pose an actual challenge to Thor. Over the years, he has been proven to be undoubtedly stronger -under Lee a serious argument could be made for Ulik- but he can put up a fight beyond Colossus' capabilities to match. Strength wise, Ulik is closer to Wonder Woman than Colossus.

I wager that if the two were to brawl, it'd be significantly one sided unless there were circumstances. Such as Thor holding back significantly in fear of killing the Russian such as his battle against the blood lusted Thing.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Nah, Ulik is strong enough to pose an actual challenge to Thor. Over the years, he has been proven to be undoubtedly stronger -under Lee a serious argument could be made for Ulik- but he can put up a fight beyond Colossus' capabilities to match. Strength wise, Ulik is closer to Wonder Woman than Colossus.

I wager that if the two were to brawl, it'd be significantly one sided unless there were circumstances. Such as Thor holding back significantly in fear of killing the Russian such as his battle against the blood lusted Thing. I'm going to disagree here. I have always viewed Ulik as 100 tons max (in the classic days) or low class 100 in later appearances. Some writer's just downplayed Thor to his level (or they just viewed Thor as in the 100-1000 ton range). Trust me, writer's didn't know how much force certain feats required. In their minds Ulik was about class 90 and Thor was somewhat above 100 tons. If you don't accept this logic then that means you view Colossus as almost in Gladiator's strength level since he put up a decent fight with him. And if that is the case, Colossus at best puts up a hell of a fight against Thor.

With that said, x23 is probably the most dangerous in my book. She can definitely do some damage to him, especially if she go for the eyes or try a fastball special with Colossus.

Colossus would last longer than most, but I don't see him being able to put Thor down for the count.

Once again, all of the Xmen here die outright if Thor gets serious and uses the GB on them as he did Durok...

This is spite; Thor 10/10 with ease...

The idea that Thor wins this is ludicrous.

Originally posted by Martian_mind
The idea that Thor wins this is ludicrous.

Ok...so how does the team survive being God Blasted outright?

Originally posted by TheLordofMurder
Ok...so how does the team survive being God Blasted outright?


Show me an example of Thor God Blasting without Mjolnir, without a charge up.

That Durok showing was not a godblast, and even if it was, he was holding Durok close to him at the time......what's he going to do, get the team to stand in a tight circle around him clutching hands and singing "ring-a-round the rosy"?

The team wins this, and easily. People entertaining the notion that Thor can win are pussys fearing having to argue against Thor fanboys, Thor fanboys, or just plain retarded. Which are you?

Well he could definitely grapple with the Russian, active it, and that would kill him and anyone else nearby (I am betting X-23 and Warpath die in exactly this fashion)...

Everyone else dies by Thors hand or lightning strikes...

This fight is over very rapidly if Thor isnt in the mood to play around; Thors CIS (self imposed limitations) is the only hope this team has for survival...

Originally posted by Martian_mind
Show me an example of Thor God Blasting without Mjolnir, without a charge up.

That Durok showing was not a godblast, and even if it was, he was holding Durok close to him at the time......what's he going to do, get the team to stand in a tight circle around him clutching hands and singing "ring-a-round the rosy"?

The team wins this, and easily. People entertaining the notion that Thor can win are pussys fearing having to argue against Thor fanboys, Thor fanboys, or just plain retarded. Which are you?

Wonderful attitude. ermm

You're kidding.

Emma goes for the mindrape of the bat. Cyclops and Havok fire simultaneously. Assuming that doesn't end the fight with Thor on his ass now thinking he's a little girl, he then has the follow up of X-23, Beast, Colossus and Warpath ripping him to shreds/beating him to a pulp. While this is happening, Dust has entered his lungs and is slowly taking him apart from the inside out.

Thor doesn't win no matter how badly he's pissed. He won't have the chance to form a coherent thought, let alone a counterattack.

Originally posted by -Pr-
Wonderful attitude. ermm

It's an accurate assessment, pussy.

Bah...

Ms Frost is useless here; Thor has some pretty good feats of TP resistance and against those superior to Emma...

Outside of this lone hope, team dies horribly...

Again, this is spite...

@Martian Mind...

Calling a mod a p***y!?

Just begging to banned...arent you?

Originally posted by TheLordofMurder
Bah...

Ms Frost is useless here; Thor has some pretty good feats of TP resistance and against those superior to Emma...

Outside of this lone hope, team dies horribly...

Again, this is spite...


So you fail to to make a genuine rebuttal, then just call it spite ignoring the wealth of options every other team member brings to the field. This post makes me declare you a fanboy.

Originally posted by TheLordofMurder
@Martian Mind...

Calling a mod a p***y!?

Just begging to banned...arent you?

This one makes me declare you a retard. Glad I got those classifications sorted.

I've read up a lot on Colossus over the years. He's basically one of if not the best meta level brick you can get. But that's the point he is definitely meta level.

His durability and strength are good but Thor's >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Piotr's.

This isn't even a contest in Strength. You have planetary level strength vs 750 tons at best. As for durability just look at the similar people they have fought to get an idea of just how different it is. Colossus' durability only allows him to hang with the big boys for a limited time. WWH, Juggernaut, Glads. He has been soundly defeated by these guys and Koed by them. Thor on the other hand has taken the best these guys have to offer and was still fighting.


And the reason Piotr generally lasts against bigger threats like Juggernaut and WWH is because of his superior H2H and his greater agility. None of which he would even remotely have here vs Thor.

Martian Mind, no more name calling please.

Somebody is overestimating Thor's strength compared to Colossus but hey thats exactly why we don't play the high end feat game.
also no unless you can show me scans of Thor completely no selling a mental attack from someone who is close to the same class as the Phoenix or Xavier I still think hes getting his brain turned to mush every time.

In fact Thor has no mental resistance whatsoever his will and endurance allow some leeway but if someone shuts his brain down hes not willing himself up from that just like he can't will himself back up when he gets knocked out from getting shot in the head.

Originally posted by Martian_mind
You're kidding.

Emma goes for the mindrape of the bat. Cyclops and Havok fire simultaneously. Assuming that doesn't end the fight with Thor on his ass now thinking he's a little girl, he then has the follow up of X-23, Beast, Colossus and Warpath ripping him to shreds/beating him to a pulp. While this is happening, Dust has entered his lungs and is slowly taking him apart from the inside out.

Thor doesn't win no matter how badly he's pissed. He won't have the chance to form a coherent thought, let alone a countomrerattack.



It's an accurate assessment, pussy.

Emma going for a mindrape right off the bat is hardly her normal tactic.....so since we have people fighting OOC, Thor starts by hitting the team with multiple lightning strikes, followed by a few tornadoes and finishes anyone else off by the godblast

Originally posted by Silent Master
Emma going for a mindrape right off the bat is hardly her normal tactic.....

and this is a normal tactic?

Originally posted by kgkg
and this is a normal tactic?

Seeing as you quoted it, I find it hard to believe that you missed where I said "so since we have people fighting OOC".

Originally posted by Silent Master
Seeing as you quoted it, I find it hard to believe that you missed where I said "so since we have people fighting OOC". The tactic you describe is completely fabricated. Emma attempting mind rapped isn't that farfetched.

Originally posted by kgkg
The tactic you describe is completely fabricated. Emma attempting mind rapped isn't that farfetched.

Thor has used every one of those attacks before.

Originally posted by Silent Master
Thor has used every one of those attacks before. All in one battle? Scan

Originally posted by Silent Master
Thor has used every one of those attacks before.
when has thor ever tried what your pretending he would?

Originally posted by kgkg
All in one battle? Scan

What part of OOC don't you understand?

Originally posted by Silent Master
What part of OOC don't you understand?
what does OOC, stand for?

Out of character.

Originally posted by Dum Dum Dugan
what does OOC, stand for? out of character?

Originally posted by Silent Master
What part of OOC don't you understand? Mindrape is not OOC while what you described is not just OOC is a tactic Thor would never use against the Xmen.

Originally posted by Silent Master
Out of character.
emma mind raping is not out of character in the least, nor would scot telling emma to attack thor mentally be out of character.

Using lightning isn't OOC for Thor, neither is using tornadoes or for that matter using the godblast.

Originally posted by Silent Master
Using lightning isn't OOC for Thor, neither is using tornadoes or for that matter using the godblast. So now it's not OOC?

Originally posted by Silent Master
Using lightning isn't OOC for Thor, neither is using tornadoes or for that matter using the godblast.
It is when your argueing he do them in a row, right off the back.

No more than claiming that starting a fight with a mindrape is a normal tactic for Emma

Originally posted by Dum Dum Dugan
It is when your argueing he do them in a row, right off the back. Using a God blast against heroes is OOC heck using the God blast itself is OOC for Thor.

Originally posted by Silent Master
No more than claiming that starting a fight with a mindrape is a normal tactic for Emma
Yes it is. Emma has started fights numerous times mind raping and scott has told he to use such attacks before, right off the bat.


Honestly if you cant see the difference between emma trying to attack Thor with her mind powers, which is pretty much her only offensive weapon, compared to what you argued, then this debate is pointless, because your bias is on an absurd level.

Using a midrape against heroes is OOC for current Emma, you don't get to complain about the other side using OOC tactics when you're doing the same.

thor hardley uses the god blast, he used it what 3 times in his 70years of comic appearences?

Originally posted by SasuOna
Somebody is overestimating Thor's strength compared to Colossus but hey thats exactly why we don't play the high end feat game.
also no unless you can show me scans of Thor completely no selling a mental attack from someone who is close to the same class as the Phoenix or Xavier I still think hes getting his brain turned to mush every time.

In fact Thor has no mental resistance whatsoever his will and endurance allow some leeway but if someone shuts his brain down hes not willing himself up from that just like he can't will himself back up when he gets knocked out from getting shot in the head. It's not the high end feat game.

It's what Thor's strength level is when he isn't holding back vs Colossus' and the difference is just that wide. Even if you wanted to take away all high end level strength feats for both and go by some rough average. Thor's average would still be >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> than Piotr's.

lol Emma is more likely to have implanted an entire scenario in Thor's brain in which he wins while her team sits back and lets her erase his memories.

The tp resistence feat posted earlier was ok, but is there anything else?

Does anyone have scans of Thor using his weather abilities without his hammer during combat? Does anyone have scans of him using it accurately without Mjlonir?

People are forgetting that the Xmen have some of the best teamwork in comic history... that's why their small powers lead to them taking big victories. Scott could literally take off his glasses and unleash on Thor for prolong amounts of time, distracting him while the rest of the xmen attack.

The team has a good chance at this and its far away from being spite.

if we're assuming the x-men are fighting under cyclops leadership rather than just all rushing him, then yes, the first thing he'd tell emma to do is try to shut thor down.

it's in character for him and for her.

The team wins this if they fight smart.

Originally posted by Silent Master
Using a midrape against heroes is OOC for current Emma, you don't get to complain about the other side using OOC tactics when you're doing the same.

I think mindraping heroes is right up Emma's alley actually. It's kind of her thing. I think Emma has mindraped more heroes than villians actually.

Originally posted by ExodusCloak
I think mindraping heroes is right up Emma's alley actually. It's kind of her thing. I think Emma has mindraped more heroes than villians actually. Lol, this.

When has Emma ever cared about mindraping a hero.

To everyone saying Emma mindrapes him, has she ever mindraped a God? Because Thor's not mortal. He shrugged of a Karmic Blast from Warlock with the Soul Gem and Warlock said his Asgardian soul was fortified from such attacks. I'm willing to bet his mind isn't as easy to dominate, if at all, as a mortal's mind.

So basically we got a group of people who can't even hurt, much less take down, Thor. This thread is nonsensical. OP could have put together a better X-men team than this.

Originally posted by leonidas
team would likely win the majority.

Originally posted by zopzop
To everyone saying Emma mindrapes him, has she ever mindraped a God? Because Thor's not mortal. He shrugged of a Karmic Blast from Warlock with the Soul Gem and Warlock said his Asgardian soul was fortified from such attacks. I'm willing to bet his mind isn't as easy to dominate, if at all, as a mortal's mind.

So basically we got a group of people who can't even hurt, much less take down, Thor. This thread is nonsensical. OP could have put together a better X-men team than this.

His soul has nothing to do with his mind. So essentially what your saying is that Warlock attacking his soul somehow equates to his mental fitness?

If you knew anything about Thor in regards to what were talking about it clearly states he has no immunity to TP but that he can endure those types of attacks through sheer force of will. Its never shown where hes just sitting there ignoring someone attacking his mind like your trying to play it up as.

Any smart TP would just shut his mind down immediately which is something that he can't endure.
Are you going to start claiming that Nate Gray can't shut down his mind because of his asgardian soul?

Originally posted by ExodusCloak
I think mindraping heroes is right up Emma's alley actually. It's kind of her thing. I think Emma has mindraped more heroes than villians actually.

Yea....when she was a villian, which is why I said "current" Emma.

Originally posted by Silent Master
Yea....when she was a villian, which is why I said "current" Emma. Current Emma isn't that different from evil Emma.

Originally posted by SasuOna
His soul has nothing to do with his mind. So essentially what your saying is that Warlock attacking his soul somehow equates to his mental fitness?

If you knew anything about Thor in regards to what were talking about it clearly states he has no immunity to TP but that he can endure those types of attacks through sheer force of will. Its never shown where hes just sitting there ignoring someone attacking his mind like your trying to play it up as.

Any smart TP would just shut his mind down immediately which is something that he can't endure.
Are you going to start claiming that Nate Gray can't shut down his mind because of his asgardian soul?

No, I was merely pointing out Asgardians aren't humans/mortals. If his soul was fortified against an attack by a Soul Gem wielded by an expert user, I'm willing to bet his mind is also harder to shut down/attack than a mortals.

Plus when has Emma ever attacked a God with her TP and won?

Originally posted by Mindset
Current Emma isn't that different from evil Emma.

Then show current Emma midraping heroes.

She did it to Xavier.

Originally posted by Mindset
She did it to Xavier.

Why?

Xavier is a dick.

Originally posted by Silent Master
Then show current Emma midraping heroes.

Off the top of my head, Ms. Marvel, Iron Man, Cyclops. The first too just because they pissed her off. Heck Namor? She was even entering his mind without him knowing because she was bored. She mentally buzzed the Fantastic Four and the X-Men because they were fighting with one another. Emma doesn't give a crap. Not to mention she tortured Bishop under Cyclops' orders.

Yes she did it to Cyclops in Warsong, she made him miss his target on purpose.

Originally posted by ExodusCloak
As the wise Xmarks would say:

Emma tells Tony to f*ck off.

http://img69.imageshack.us/img69/4655/scan0006ns2.th.jpghttp://img156.imageshack.us/img156/9964/scan0007cm2.th.jpghttp://img90.imageshack.us/img90/4725/scan0008sv6.th.jpg


Emma tells Carol to f*ck off.

http://img507.imageshack.us/img507/9863/67261023fy5.th.jpghttp://img230.imageshack.us/img230/3902/img017jx9.th.jpghttp://img423.imageshack.us/img423/2233/img018vc5.th.jpghttp://img222.imageshack.us/img222/596/img019wa1.th.jpg

Originally posted by zopzop
No, I was merely pointing out Asgardians aren't humans/mortals. If his soul was fortified against an attack by a Soul Gem wielded by an expert user, I'm willing to bet his mind is also harder to shut down/attack than a mortals.

Plus when has Emma ever attacked a God with her TP and won?

Originally posted by ExodusCloak
Off the top of my head, Ms. Marvel, Iron Man, Cyclops. The first too just because they pissed her off. Heck Namor? She was even entering his mind without him knowing because she was bored. She mentally buzzed the Fantastic Four and the X-Men because they were fighting with one another. Emma doesn't give a crap. Not to mention she tortured Bishop under Cyclops' orders.

Yes she did it to Cyclops in Warsong, she made him miss his target on purpose.

My firewall wont let me enlarge the pics, but it doesn't seem like she's shutting their minds down.

Originally posted by Silent Master
My firewall wont let me enlarge the pics, but it doesn't seem like she's shutting their minds down.

Does she need to shut down their minds? Your issue is about her having qualms about using her powers on heroes. She shut down Hellions mind, he was her favourite pupil.

She mind controlled Cyclops into blasting Wolverine in Phoenix Warsong.

Oh and at the end of House of M she shut down everyones mind in the mansion cause she couldn't herself think.

In Gen X she mind controlled all her students, she's done that on a few occasions.

She's killed a horse to manipulate a little girl you're mistaken if you think Emma Frost has issues using her powers on heroes. It's a specialty.

Besides, a full on mind blast from a Mind Gem weilding Moondragon couldnt even slow Thor; he completely ignored the attack...

But Emma-freaking-Frost is just going to casually shut his mind down...

I say again, Emma will be useless against Thor and she dies the moment any of his attacks land flush on her frail mortal body...

This is spite...

Originally posted by TheLordofMurder
Besides, a full on mind blast from a mind gem weilding Moondragon couldnt even slow Thor; he completely ignored the attack...

But Emma-freaking-Frost is just going to casually shut his mind down...

I say again, Emma will be useless against Thor and she dies the moment any of his attacks land flush on her frail mortal body...

This is spite...

Warrior Madness.

And Thor has been mindraped by Moondragon without the gem, then there's Bedlam. His resistance depends on the writer. Thors mental resistance ranges. There was a very detailed thread with high and low showings.

Originally posted by ExodusCloak
Does she need to shut down their minds? Your issue is about her having qualms about using her powers on heroes. She shut down Hellions mind, he was her favourite pupil.

She mind controlled Cyclops into blasting Wolverine in Phoenix Warsong.

Oh and at the end of House of M she shut down everyones mind in the mansion cause she couldn't herself think.

In Gen X she mind controlled all her students, she's done that on a few occasions.

She's killed a horse to manipulate a little girl you're mistaken if you think Emma Frost has issues using her powers on heroes. It's a specialty.

SasuOna has mentioned her shutting Thor's brain down more than once...that is the type of "mindrape" that I'm saying isn't a normal tactic.

With most other uses of TP, I believe Thor could withstand long enough to make at least one attack.

Originally posted by Silent Master
SasuOna has mentioned her shutting Thor's brain down more than once...that is the type of "mindrape" that I'm saying isn't a normal tactic.

With most other uses of TP, I believe Thor could withstand long enough to make at least one attack.

Shutting peoples brains down is common for Emma. And she's down it to her own, she did it to Hellion, Elixir. She did it to the entire mansion at the end of HoM.

The Sentry's wife smashed her face off a table because Emma pulled her into his mind.

Originally posted by ExodusCloak
Warrior Madness.

And Thor has been mindraped by Moondragon without the gem, then there's Bedlam. His resistance depends on the writer. Thors mental resistance ranges. There was a very detailed thread with high and low showings.

She only influenced him, she even admitted that she couldn't outright control him, she needed to play to his arrogance.

And that was a Moondragon that had planetary level TP.

Originally posted by Silent Master
She only influenced him, she even admitted that she couldn't outright control him, she needed to play to his arrogance.

And that was a Moondragon that had planetary level TP.

When did she admit that? I don't recall that stated in New Avengers. She said he needed to remain calm so the void didn't kill the other heroes.

She built a room in his mind and messed around with his brain and memories and that was against Bobs will too. She said she could lobotomise a God from that room.

Bedlam got him too. There are other instances as well. His tp resistance is inconsistent.

Oh wait you meant Moondragon. No she froze him telepathically. With a room full of superheroes.

I'm talking about the Avengers 219 and 220.

Originally posted by Silent Master
I'm talking about the Avengers 219 and 220.

Moondragon is able to read Thors secret in his mind and she then mind wipes all the Avengers present in these scans.

http://img228.imageshack.us/img228/6130/avengersv1177page18.th.jpghttp://img705.imageshack.us/img705/3814/avengersv1177page19.th.jpg

Moondragon is able to prevent every Avenger in the room from looking at her, she then freezes them all. His thoughts are interconnected to his suit, so he commands it to carry himself out of her range apparently. Anyway he doesn't jam her psi-powers he makes it difficult to deploy them. She's getting static on every channel. Can be overcome with a little concentration. The Avengers are free and Tony tells them to not give her time to concentrate. She can still deploy her TK though.

http://img43.imageshack.us/img43/9992/avengersv1211page13.th.jpghttp://img861.imageshack.us/img861/8969/avengersv1211page16.th.jpghttp://img705.imageshack.us/img705/7685/avengersv1211page17.th.jpghttp://img3.imageshack.us/img3/5929/avengersv1211page18.th.jpg


Bedlam ensanring Thor, Iron Man and Spider-Man. Xavier counters Bedlam long enough to break his hold on them.

http://img19.imageshack.us/img19/5052/juggernauttheeighthdayp.th.jpghttp://img687.imageshack.us/img687/5052/juggernauttheeighthdayp.th.jpg

Also, Toad used the Strangers machine to cast illusions that fooled Thor.

He's resistant...depending on the writer.

http://i388.photobucket.com/albums/oo326/OneDumbG0/Thor%20Stats/ThorMentalDefense01Annual4.jpg

His mental resistance is really up in the air.

Mijonir is a skyfather weapon. Odin went above and beyond with the hammer while enchanting it, which reflects thor potential but he's not there yet. He will grow one day in innate power to be as efficient with or without mijonir but as of now it would take a team effort to win but they would win barring plot induced stupidity or character induced stupidity.

Originally posted by Colossus-Big C
a good way to put him down imo is to have the team hold him while colossus knocks him out

Yeah, I'm steal leaning on Emma being the deal-breaker.

Originally posted by Colossus-Big C
a good way to put him down imo is to have the team hold him while colossus knocks him out

Do You really think they can hold Thor for 14 hours?

Originally posted by h1a8
I'm going to disagree here. I have always viewed Ulik as 100 tons max (in the classic days) or low class 100 in later appearances. Some writer's just downplayed Thor to his level (or they just viewed Thor as in the 100-1000 ton range). Trust me, writer's didn't know how much force certain feats required. In their minds Ulik was about class 90 and Thor was somewhat above 100 tons. If you don't accept this logic then that means you view Colossus as almost in Gladiator's strength level since he put up a decent fight with him. And if that is the case, Colossus at best puts up a hell of a fight against Thor.

With that said, x23 is probably the most dangerous in my book. She can definitely do some damage to him, especially if she go for the eyes or try a fastball special with Colossus.

Why, I'm correct? So this argument revolves around Ulik rated at 90 tons? Handbooks are worthless when it comes to accurate power levels. I highly doubt you know enough about Ulik to make any accurate assessment. Hell, I'd be shocked if you've even read more than one battle involving the troll.

Flawed analogy. Ulik has had a dozen or so battles with Thor. We can attempt to make an accurate assessment of where he stands. On a good day, you'd need someone in or close to the Thor/Superman class to take him down in a slugfest. At least if he has the pounders. Besides, Claremont wrote a lower end Gladiator. Under his pen, Corsair was able to knock Gladiator out with a blast from his gun and I'm pretty sure he wrote the scene where Gambit knocks him out.

why ulik is stated to be a ninety tonner is beyond me

Handbooks are ridiculous. They're nice for bios and character history as well as important issues/first appearances, but in terms of powers and abilities and the scope of them, they're usually garbage. Even Thor's entry doesn't mention half of the crap he or Mjolnir can do.

Occasionally they are good sources if you want to prove a character has a specific ability but you don't have a scan of them actually using it, since a handbook won't ever say they can do something that they can't actually do (at least, I've never seen that happen)

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
Even Thor's entry doesn't mention half of the crap he or Mjolnir can do.

Not for anything, but that's not the Handbook's fault. That hammer is a plot device, able to come up with anything needed at the particular moment on the fly. Think Reed Richards but in hammer form

Originally posted by Endless Mike
Occasionally they are good sources if you want to prove a character has a specific ability but you don't have a scan of them actually using it, since a handbook won't ever say they can do something that they can't actually do (at least, I've never seen that happen)

Gladiator running at light speed.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Why, I'm correct? So this argument revolves around Ulik rated at 90 tons? Handbooks are worthless when it comes to accurate power levels. I highly doubt you know enough about Ulik to make any accurate assessment. Hell, I'd be shocked if you've even read more than one battle involving the troll.

Flawed analogy. Ulik has had a dozen or so battles with Thor. We can attempt to make an accurate assessment of where he stands. On a good day, you'd need someone in or close to the Thor/Superman class to take him down in a slugfest. At least if he has the pounders. Besides, Claremont wrote a lower end Gladiator. Under his pen, Corsair was able to knock Gladiator out with a blast from his gun and I'm pretty sure he wrote the scene where Gambit knocks him out.

Official Handbooks are ultimate truth UNLESS there exists sufficient comic evidence to overthrow it.

Ulik has no high class 100 feats. I can see if he grappled and either stalemated or overpowered a known class 100 being. I can see if he has some lifting, pulling, throwing, or breaking feats that put him there. I can see if he has some hitting feats where he injures (through the showing of blood) someone of class 100.

Characters are often written down to other characters to make a story. Superman could beat so many people easily yet the writer down played him so that we can have some suspense.

Originally posted by h1a8
Characters are often written down to other characters to make a story. Superman could beat so many people easily yet the writer down played him so that we can have some suspense.

Originally posted by ExodusCloak
Moondragon is able to read Thors secret in his mind and she then mind wipes all the Avengers present in these scans.

http://img228.imageshack.us/img228/6130/avengersv1177page18.th.jpghttp://img705.imageshack.us/img705/3814/avengersv1177page19.th.jpg

Moondragon is able to prevent every Avenger in the room from looking at her, she then freezes them all. His thoughts are interconnected to his suit, so he commands it to carry himself out of her range apparently. Anyway he doesn't jam her psi-powers he makes it difficult to deploy them. She's getting static on every channel. Can be overcome with a little concentration. The Avengers are free and Tony tells them to not give her time to concentrate. She can still deploy her TK though.

http://img43.imageshack.us/img43/9992/avengersv1211page13.th.jpghttp://img861.imageshack.us/img861/8969/avengersv1211page16.th.jpghttp://img705.imageshack.us/img705/7685/avengersv1211page17.th.jpghttp://img3.imageshack.us/img3/5929/avengersv1211page18.th.jpg


Bedlam ensanring Thor, Iron Man and Spider-Man. Xavier counters Bedlam long enough to break his hold on them.

http://img19.imageshack.us/img19/5052/juggernauttheeighthdayp.th.jpghttp://img687.imageshack.us/img687/5052/juggernauttheeighthdayp.th.jpg

Also, Toad used the Strangers machine to cast illusions that fooled Thor.

He's resistant...depending on the writer.

http://i388.photobucket.com/albums/oo326/OneDumbG0/Thor%20Stats/ThorMentalDefense01Annual4.jpg

His mental resistance is really up in the air.

nothing against the other scans, but the moondragon ones--pretty sure she was amped during that period by the dragon of the moon. could be wrong, but i thought that was the case....

Not sure personally.

Originally posted by h1a8
Official Handbooks are ultimate truth UNLESS there exists sufficient comic evidence to overthrow it.

Ulik has no high class 100 feats. I can see if he grappled and either stalemated or overpowered a known class 100 being. I can see if he has some lifting, pulling, throwing, or breaking feats that put him there. I can see if he has some hitting feats where he injures (through the showing of blood) someone of class 100.

Characters are often written down to other characters to make a story. Superman could beat so many people easily yet the writer down played him so that we can have some suspense.

Haha what? An incredibly ridiculous stance. Handbooks are worthless as evidence in regards to accurate power levels. Five gets you ten they outright make shit up at times.

Yup, you definitely have read none of Ulik's battles and are basing this entirely around his handbook entry. The stance is not even worth the few minutes of digging it would take to destroy.

Originally posted by ExodusCloak
Moondragon is able to read Thors secret in his mind and she then mind wipes all the Avengers present in these scans.

http://img228.imageshack.us/img228/6130/avengersv1177page18.th.jpghttp://img705.imageshack.us/img705/3814/avengersv1177page19.th.jpg

Moondragon is able to prevent every Avenger in the room from looking at her, she then freezes them all. His thoughts are interconnected to his suit, so he commands it to carry himself out of her range apparently. Anyway he doesn't jam her psi-powers he makes it difficult to deploy them. She's getting static on every channel. Can be overcome with a little concentration. The Avengers are free and Tony tells them to not give her time to concentrate. She can still deploy her TK though.

http://img43.imageshack.us/img43/9992/avengersv1211page13.th.jpghttp://img861.imageshack.us/img861/8969/avengersv1211page16.th.jpghttp://img705.imageshack.us/img705/7685/avengersv1211page17.th.jpghttp://img3.imageshack.us/img3/5929/avengersv1211page18.th.jpg


Bedlam ensanring Thor, Iron Man and Spider-Man. Xavier counters Bedlam long enough to break his hold on them.

http://img19.imageshack.us/img19/5052/juggernauttheeighthdayp.th.jpghttp://img687.imageshack.us/img687/5052/juggernauttheeighthdayp.th.jpg

Also, Toad used the Strangers machine to cast illusions that fooled Thor.

He's resistant...depending on the writer.

http://i388.photobucket.com/albums/oo326/OneDumbG0/Thor%20Stats/ThorMentalDefense01Annual4.jpg

His mental resistance is really up in the air.

So what's the point of contention? Whether or not Thor can resist Emma's telepathy? Thor's resistance fluctuates but he has had enough feats to justify the stance. We've already had this discussion at length so I'm not going to bother to scans and what not. She has a better chance of creating an illusion to mess with Thor's effectiveness than actually putting Thor down.

For the record, the first set was Donald Blake.