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- no cis/to the death

- they fight in a train yard on the ground, and johnny is in human state (until he willingly transforms)

http://i54.tinypic.com/3308tc9.jpg

Hrm...
Battle starts
Johnny instantly goes hot
Wolverine starts to make to Johnny
Cyclops let's loose with all he's got.
..: scott dies a fiery death
Wolverine loses all his flesh and collapses on the ground
Johnny is pulverized to death...

Wolverine gets up thirty seconds later... Looks around at a dead cyclops and a dead human torch... Shrugs...

Wolverine wins

Originally posted by psycho gundam
- no cis/to the death

- they fight in a train yard on the ground, and johnny is in human state (until he willingly transforms)

http://i54.tinypic.com/3308tc9.jpg Torch

i mean they start on the ground so nobody has a sight/position advantage from the get go

Originally posted by psycho gundam
i mean they start on the ground so nobody has a sight/position advantage from the get go Which makes the human form pointless. Still Torch.

Wouldn't Cyclops blunt force knock Torch before his flames hit?

Nova flame FTW!

Originally posted by vansonbee
Wouldn't Cyclops blunt force knock Torch before his flames hit?

that's what i was thinking. scott/johnny is quickdraw and since johnny is human to start i think cyke could take him out alone.

they can't see each other cause of the storage containers, unless johnny flies and the x-men scale the boxes

Originally posted by psycho gundam
they can't see each other cause of the storage containers, unless johnny flies and the x-men scale the boxes I believe X-Men has legal H2H skills and army training...

Human Torch just shoots fire, never seen him display H2H feats before.

he can fly whenever he wants, he just doesn't start out in the air is what i mean. all their powers are all allowed once the fights starts

In character the first think Johnny will do is shout "Flame on!" and fly into the air. Once Cyclops sees a burning figure against the skyline, he quick draw snipes him with an optic blast, and the goes home.

Johnny certainly can take out Scott by making use of the flame duplicates.

Originally posted by srankmissingnin
In character the first think Johnny will do is shout "Flame on!" and fly into the air. Once Cyclops sees a burning figure against the skyline, he quick draw snipes him with an optic blast, and the goes home.

yeah, i agree. his flame self won't save him from the blast. if it's whoever sees who first, scott still wins--i'd wager his beam travels faster than johnny's flame. johnny may take him out in a double ko, but logan's still standing so team wins.

not sure how torch can win this.

Without CIS it is just a quick draw between cyclops and storm. But since johny doesnt' really have to aim when he goes nova. He can just flame on (quietly) and nova killing cyclops while cyclops has to at least find johny's general direction before he shoots.

Wolverine will be charred to the bone for a bit while johny flies up and just shoots anything that moves.

And those flame duplicates can give him an extra second too if he tries them.

Johny should win the majority unless cyclops gets lucky and picks the right direction to fire before johny does.

I'm thinking Cyclops could win this himself. Wolverine is pretty much a non-factor due to Torch's flight and range attacks. Wolvie could stand around on the sidelines making smart-assed comments and using stray flames to light a cigar.

Hard to say. I think cyclops cinches this unless Johnny turns the whole area into a scene reminiscent of a nuclear blast zone via nova.

It's not hard to say at all.

Johnny kills them almost instantly.

Originally posted by leonidas
not sure how torch can win this. By having CIS off

Originally posted by SuperiorTech
Johnny certainly can take out Scott by making use of the flame duplicates. Originally posted by Mindset
It's not hard to say at all.

Johnny kills them almost instantly.

Originally posted by Parmaniac
By having CIS off

doesn't matter that cis is off--he stills needs to flame on THEN attack. cyke justs sees him and kills him. it's quickdraw and i think cyke activates his powers first. even without cis. at best, they could kill each other i guess, but i still the the speed advantage being cyke's.

Originally posted by leonidas
but i still the the speed advantage being cyke's. And here we simply disagree.

While HT can manouver Cycke will more or less stay on the ground. Before we go into "HT is faster" vs. "No Cyke is faster" let's just agree to disagree.

EDIT: Fire duplicates are another advantage.

It was stated a few times that Summers' beam travels as fast as light.

Cyke asks Wolverine where Storm is, takes off his visor and kills him

Originally posted by Mindset
It's not hard to say at all.

Johnny kills them almost instantly.



Yeah. Without CIS, what's to stop Johnny from just obliterating them and the immediate area?

Originally posted by JakeTheBank


Yeah. Without CIS, what's to stop Johnny from just obliterating them and the immediate area?

I don't know... maybe his personality?

Originally posted by Parmaniac
And here we simply disagree.

While HT can manouver Cycke will more or less stay on the ground. Before we go into "HT is faster" vs. "No Cyke is faster" let's just agree to disagree.

EDIT: Fire duplicates are another advantage.

the dupes wouldn't have the chance to come into play. i'm still not understanding just HOW you see johnny having the advantage. cyke has near-bullseye level aim with his beam and it travels (according to some) near light speed. just how quick does torch get to nova heat? just don't see his power working before cyke's.

i've no problem with you disagreeing--i simply don't understand how you think ht's powers work faster than cyke's.

Originally posted by srankmissingnin
I don't know... maybe his personality? His personality doesn't matter when there's no CIS and he's bloodlusted.

So I guess we both agree Johnny wins in a couple seconds.

Originally posted by leonidas
the dupes wouldn't have the chance to come into play. i'm still not understanding just HOW you see johnny having the advantage. cyke has near-bullseye level aim with his beam and it travels (according to some) near light speed. just how quick does torch get to nova heat? just don't see his power working before cyke's.

i've no problem with you disagreeing--i simply don't understand how you think ht's powers work faster than cyke's. How would Cyclops aim matter when he can't see Johnny and Johnny can just go nova as soon as the fight starts, where he's standing...out of sight?

Originally posted by Mindset
His personality doesn't matter when there's no CIS and he's bloodlusted.

So I guess we both agree Johnny wins in a couple seconds.

CIS off just removes self imposed limitations, it doesn't completely overrule the characters personality.

Originally posted by srankmissingnin
CIS off just removes self imposed limitations, it doesn't completely overrule the characters personality. No CIS + Bloodlust completely changes a character's personality.

It's basically powerset vs. powerset, except we use what they actually shown to be able to do.

Johnny wins, case closed.

Originally posted by Mindset
How would Cyclops aim matter when he can't see Johnny and Johnny can just go nova as soon as the fight starts, where he's standing...out of sight?

ohhhhhh..... i see the issue. you and the other guy don't think cyke can see johnny?? not sure why i assumed line of sight. that's usually the case in a forum battle, no? even though it's a trainyard, i just figured they could see each other.

if cyke can't see johnny, then you're right absolutley--johnny kills them and they never see it coming. if they ARE in line of sight, cyke takes him out.

see, we're both right.

Originally posted by Mindset
No CIS + Bloodlust completely changes a character's personality.

It's basically powerset vs. powerset, except we use what they actually shown to be able to do.

Johnny wins, case closed.



Johnny rapes.

assuming they start facing each other, even if crates are blocking the view, cyclops can instantly blow the whole yard to shrapnel along with the HT by widening the scope of his blast. the same goes for johnny going nova and incinerating the two.

this remais a quickdrawn contest and cyke is likely to win that

wolverine is pretty useless here, except in the scenario that cyke and johnny draw at the same time, killing each other and he then regrows from a neuron left in his skull after an hour

Scenario 1

The mutants know they've been teleported into a maze to fight HT.
HT knows he's been teleported into a maze to fight Wolverine and Cyclops to the death.

The Mutants die horribly.

HT immediately goes Nova, then grabs wolverine's skeleton and buries it in the active, and currently erupting Kilauea Volcano in Hawaii for lulz.


Scenario 2:

HT knows there are two powerful fighters in the maze out to get him.

He can't see them but he knows they are there.

Wolverine does not know the identity of their opponent The Maze of trailers in the arena restricts the movement of air.

Cyclops knows they are up against a powerful opponent and they have to get into a position where they can see, without giving away their position.

They don't know if their opponent has enhanced senses or if he/she/it is close by.
The first thing wolverine will do is make a sign to cyclops not to make a sound. In the past they have worked together as a stealth team with great results. Wolverine will take point.

HT knows he's up against powerful enemies. He doesn't know whether or not they have flight capability.

He knows he's up against a serious threat to his life. A threat he can neither see nor hear. He doesn't know how close it is or what it is capable of.


The HT is in a shoot first ask questions later scenario.


Instant Flame On & Nova ftw.