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No bfring. Who wins?

Does he have the Power Gem? If no, Lord Mar-vell takes it.

No power gem.

Originally posted by carver9
No power gem.
Lord Mar-vell all the way!
rip Thor. I guess that's one way to cure him of his madness.

Lord Mar-vell wins.

Maybe someone can enlighten me, because it's possible I haven't read all the issues where Lord Mar-vell has appeared.

Other than destroying Surfer's board (which Surfer easily repaired), and beating Nova Prime, what did he do that's impressive?

Originally posted by Cogito
Maybe someone can enlighten me, because it's possible I haven't read all the issues where Lord Mar-vell has appeared.

Other than destroying Surfer's board (which Surfer easily repaired), and beating Nova Prime, what did he do that's impressive? Oneshotted Magus to death with one attack by mistake.

A Magus whose only feat was fighting Nova.

So the only basis of comparison essentially involves only low-mid heralds.

K.

Originally posted by Cogito
A Magus whose only feat was fighting Nova.

So the only basis of comparison essentially involves only low-mid heralds.

K. Surfer's a low mid herald ? I guess Magus working the gotg and faking out a cc user while at the same time altering the fault lines with his power and further weakening himself right before all this is totally mid herald. Weird.

Originally posted by Cogito
Maybe someone can enlighten me, because it's possible I haven't read all the issues where Lord Mar-vell has appeared.

Other than destroying Surfer's board (which Surfer easily repaired), and beating Nova Prime, what did he do that's impressive?

Well, easily defeating two high heralds is impressive enough, especially if one of them is the Silver Surfer.

But he almost killed the entire Annihilators lineup when he exited with a Cthulhu like energy spell. Quasar had to take the collective energy of all the Annihilators + company in order to shield them from the blast.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Surfer's a low mid herald ? I guess Magus working the gotg and faking out a cc user while at the same time altering the fault lines with his power and further weakening himself right before all this is totally mid herald. Weird.

Honestly I'm just trying to get my facts straight. I don't think I've read everything involved here.

And no, obviously I don't consider Surfer to be low-mid herald. His fight with Mar-vell lasted only a panel and involved his board getting broken and then Mar-vell moving on to fight Nova. I don't think we can extrapolate much at all from that.

As for Magus, the only combat feat I know of was his fighting with Nova - who isn't a top tier.

Just trying to separate facts from assumptions.

Originally posted by Cogito
Honestly I'm just trying to get my facts straight. I don't think I've read everything involved here.

And no, obviously I don't consider Surfer to be low-mid herald. His fight with Mar-vell lasted only a panel and involved his board getting broken and then Mar-vell moving on to fight Nova. I don't think we can extrapolate much at all from that.

As for Magus, the only combat feat I know of was his fighting with Nova - who isn't a top tier.

Just trying to separate facts from assumptions. Then you need to reacquaint yourself because going by portrayal he was well beyond the Surfer.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Then you need to reacquaint yourself because going by portrayal he was well beyond the Surfer.

I'm not disputing the possibility.

But I'm also not convinced he's legit based on a fight that lasted a single page and didn't end. Honestly, that would be like drawing conclusions to Superman vs. Doomsday in DOS after this.

Originally posted by Cogito
I'm not disputing the possibility.

But I'm also not convinced he's legit based on a fight that lasted a single page and didn't end. Honestly, that would be like drawing conclusions to Superman vs. Doomsday in DOS after this. Except we didn't see the Surfer nor Nova shrug anything he did off. Unlike the Superman/DD fight we didn't see Mar-vell challenged by anyone high herald level.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Except we didn't see the Surfer nor Nova shrug anything he did off. Unlike the Superman/DD fight we didn't see Mar-vell challenged by anyone high herald level.

We didn't see a real fight between Mar-vell and a high herald, is my point. Oftentimes a hero gets pushed around before he comes out guns blazing.

Drawing conclusions from the very first interaction between Lord Mar-vell and Surfer (in which Surfer's board is destroyed) is akin to drawing conclusions from the very first interaction between Superman and Doomsday (where it looked like Doomsday punched like a girl).

If the had more time, or if Surfer were actually one shot, that would be a different story.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Unlike the Superman/DD fight we didn't see Mar-vell challenged by anyone high herald level.

Originally posted by Cogito
We didn't see a real fight between Mar-vell and a high herald, is my point. Oftentimes a hero gets pushed around before he comes out guns blazing.

Drawing conclusions from the very first interaction between Lord Mar-vell and Surfer (in which Surfer's board is destroyed) is akin to drawing conclusions from the very first interaction between Superman and Doomsday (where it looked like Doomsday punched like a girl).

If the had more time, or if Surfer were actually one shot, that would be a different story. You didn't read the comic so you really have no real understanding and are drawing false parallels.

Perhaps my Supes/DD analogy was too complicated for people here?

Originally posted by quanchi112
You didn't read the comic so you really have no real understanding and are drawing false parallels.

I did read TI.

Look, you keep thinking I'm challenging you. I'm just trying to gather facts.

We don't know what level Lord Mar-vell is at because he wasn't ever challenged, and he never had a legitimate fight with any top tier.

Originally posted by Cogito
I did read TI.

Look, you keep thinking I'm challenging you. I'm just trying to gather facts.

We don't know what level Lord Mar-vell is at because he wasn't ever challenged, and he never had a legitimate fight with any top tier. He was challenged by Thanos. Anyone else lower wasn't close to even garnering his attention and the Magus kill was a mistake. That's power.

Originally posted by quanchi112
He was challenged by Thanos. Anyone else lower wasn't close to even garnering his attention and the Magus kill was a mistake. That's power.

Christ...

He was challenged by Thanos because someone had to be. Mar-vell was the one who performed the original necropsy, and it was fitting (or necessary?) for him to be the one to bring Death back.

I realize that the Magus kill was an impressive feat. I'm not about to declare him skyfather+ for it though.

Originally posted by Cogito
I did read TI.

Look, you keep thinking I'm challenging you. I'm just trying to gather facts.

We don't know what level Lord Mar-vell is at because he wasn't ever challenged, and he never had a legitimate fight with any top tier.

It was a flash showing, but I think the writers got their point across. Mar-vell was clearly meant to be above the team and a threat that only Thanos could put down or whatever.

I'm trying to find his floor & ceiling.

His floor is obviously at or slightly above Surfer.

His ceiling is somewhere between Surfer and Thanos, and I'm inclined to believe it's closer to Surfer.

Originally posted by Cogito
I'm trying to find his floor & ceiling.

His floor is obviously at or slightly above Surfer.

His ceiling is somewhere between Surfer and Thanos, and I'm inclined to believe it's closer to Surfer.

I tend to agree. Obviously he wasn't on Thanos' level, somewhere above Surfer seems about right. And its worth mentioning what he did to Nova. Shields smashed with a punch, mind probed with utter ease, Worldmind phased out. Not even the Sphinx was ever capable of that, and he's tried a few times. Although Nova wasn't at full power until issue 6, so there is that to consider.

Originally posted by Cogito
Honestly, that would be like drawing conclusions to Superman vs. Doomsday in DOS after this.

Woah.

I bet Superman kicked his ass, easily.

Originally posted by Cogito
Christ...

He was challenged by Thanos because someone had to be. Mar-vell was the one who performed the original necropsy, and it was fitting (or necessary?) for him to be the one to bring Death back.

I realize that the Magus kill was an impressive feat. I'm not about to declare him skyfather+ for it though. You can place him wherever you want but above Thor or any elite top tier is consistent with his portrayal. Thanos is so far up the chain him just straight owning Mar-vell rams the point home.

Originally posted by quanchi112
and the Magus kill was a mistake.


http://i1099.photobucket.com/albums/g386/psychogundam1/lordmar-vellslayingmagus1.jpghttp://i1099.photobucket.com/albums/g386/psychogundam1/lordmar-vellslayingmagus2.jpg

looked intentional to me

Originally posted by quanchi112
Lord Mar-vell wins.

Marvel is low trans. Teh way he treats high heralds is proof. But low trans because Thanos put a thrashing on him (great fight but you knew who was clearly superior) and I would place Thanos right below skyfather level.

Originally posted by psycho gundam
http://i1099.photobucket.com/albums/g386/psychogundam1/lordmar-vellslayingmagus1.jpghttp://i1099.photobucket.com/albums/g386/psychogundam1/lordmar-vellslayingmagus2.jpg

looked intentional to me



Quanchi has a history of lying to make Thanos appear to be stronger than he truly is...

And his only reason for wanting to trump up Lord Marvell is because Thanos beat him...

Anyway, to get back on topic, I think Blood and Thunder Thor (who was performing above average everyday Thor by a significant margin) gets a majority against Marvell...

Perhaps 7 out of 10 in favor of BT Thor...

Originally posted by TheLordofMurder


Quanchi has a history of lying to make Thanos appear to be stronger than he truly is...

And his only reason for wanting to trump up Lord Marvell is because Thanos beat him...

Anyway, to get back on topic, I think Blood and Thunder Thor (who was performing above average everyday Thor by a significant margin) gets a majority against Marvell...

Perhaps 7 out of 10 in favor of BT Thor...

Pretty much. Low trans level sounds about right though.

Can someone post scans of Thanos owning Mar-vell. I'd like to see that.

Lord Mar-Vell stomps. One shot kill on Magus. Surfer and Nova were absolutely tooled at the same time.

Originally posted by nimbus006
Can someone post scans of Thanos owning Mar-vell. I'd like to see that.


http://i1238.photobucket.com/albums/ff492/twinzeeto/Miscelaneous/th_ti-16.jpg http://i1238.photobucket.com/albums/ff492/twinzeeto/Miscelaneous/th_ti-21.jpghttp://i1238.photobucket.com/albums/ff492/twinzeeto/Miscelaneous/th_ti-22.jpg http://i1238.photobucket.com/albums/ff492/twinzeeto/Miscelaneous/th_ti-23.jpg http://i1238.photobucket.com/albums/ff492/twinzeeto/Miscelaneous/th_ti-24.jpg

Originally posted by psycho gundam
looked intentional to me

Yes..and no...

I see where Quan is getting the unintentional thing. Mar-vell said "A universe where things can still die. That will take some time getting used to."

It's a vague statement. It could imply that he forgot that his attack would kill (rather than inflict pain, which may have been his intention), or it could just be something he said after intentionally killing him. Either way, we'll never know.

Originally posted by psycho gundam
http://i1099.photobucket.com/albums/g386/psychogundam1/lordmar-vellslayingmagus1.jpghttp://i1099.photobucket.com/albums/g386/psychogundam1/lordmar-vellslayingmagus2.jpg

looked intentional to me You need to read the dialogue where he states a universe where thing can still die. The blast was intentional but someone dying from this blast he wasn't expecting due to death being wiped out in his own universe. Originally posted by TheLordofMurder


Quanchi has a history of lying to make Thanos appear to be stronger than he truly is...

And his only reason for wanting to trump up Lord Marvell is because Thanos beat him...

Anyway, to get back on topic, I think Blood and Thunder Thor (who was performing above average everyday Thor by a significant margin) gets a majority against Marvell...

Perhaps 7 out of 10 in favor of BT Thor... Please read the dialogue and once you grasp the meaning of the words I expect an apology. Thor was downed by Bill who then let off mar-vell was never challenged by any character on this level.

Even if Marvell didn't intend to kill, why would that indicate he's holding back. If he was under the impression Magus couldn't die, he could blast him with all his might and yet not kill him.

@quan,

But just before the blast he asks; "so death still lives here?" Magus says yes but... Then gets blasted. The killing was intentional.

Originally posted by TheLordofMurder


Quanchi has a history of lying to make Thanos appear to be stronger than he truly is...

And his only reason for wanting to trump up Lord Marvell is because Thanos beat him...

Anyway, to get back on topic, I think Blood and Thunder Thor (who was performing above average everyday Thor by a significant margin) gets a majority against Marvell...

Perhaps 7 out of 10 in favor of BT Thor...

I agree with this statement , I was thinking low trans at best, as where BT Thor w/ gem was like mid trans level before Thanos stop him.

Originally posted by Bentley
Even if Marvell didn't intend to kill, why would that indicate he's holding back. If he was under the impression Magus couldn't die, he could blast him with all his might and yet not kill him. I'm just saying that's how powerful he is whether intentional or not oneshotting the Magus is no small potatoes.Originally posted by dmills
@quan,

But just before the blast he asks; "so death still lives here?" Magus says yes but... Then gets blasted. The killing was intentional. I disagree the blast was not the death part.

Originally posted by quanchi112
I'm just saying that's how powerful he is whether intentional or not oneshotting the Magus is no small potatoes.

I disagree the blast was not the death part.

Agreed. That's peeps kinda lowballing right there. Hell the fact that the Magus would even prostrate himself before Mar-vell should tell you something.

Huh?

low at the lowballin of Marvell/Magus. Adam Magus had the power to fool a cosmic cube.

Originally posted by Nihilist
low at the lowballin of Marvell/Magus. Adam Magus had the power to fool a cosmic cube.

Is that a durability feat? What kind of feat is that?

Originally posted by Cogito
Is that a durability feat? What kind of feat is that? Starlord was using the cube to put Magus down which he didnt do as Magus was able to fake his own death. on way or another its good feat which seems to get overlooked for various reasons.

Originally posted by Cogito
Is that a durability feat? What kind of feat is that?

A generalized powerset feat I guess? A cube is a top flight reality manipulating device/being, so someone able to fool its reach of power would have to be pretty damn powerful as well I suppose.

Originally posted by dmills
Agreed. That's peeps kinda lowballing right there. Hell the fact that the Magus would even prostrate himself before Mar-vell should tell you something.

Huh? I'm saying the blast was intentional not the killing him aspect of the blast that followed.

Blood and Thunder Thor (Minus the Power Gem) and Lord Mar-Vell are on the same level of power I'd say. From what I remember, Lord Mar-Vell would annihilate a Herald (Based on the Magus showing because the Surfer/Nova fight was a bit underwhelming imo) but would get edged out by Thanos. By the time Thor picked up the Infinity Gem, I'd say no one short of Thanos had a chance of stopping him.

I know this isn't a popular idea (Mostly because it makes Surfer look like utter shit) but I've never considered Thanos to have a large edge in power over Thor and such. An all out or high end Superman/Thor taking down Thanos is a very real possibility.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Blood and Thunder Thor (Minus the Power Gem) and Lord Mar-Vell are on the same level of power I'd say. From what I remember, Lord Mar-Vell would annihilate a Herald (Based on the Magus showing because the Surfer/Nova fight was a bit underwhelming imo) but would get edged out by Thanos. By the time Thor picked up the Infinity Gem, I'd say no one short of Thanos had a chance of stopping him.

I know this isn't a popular idea (Mostly because it makes Surfer look like utter shit) but I've never considered Thanos to have a large edge in power over Thor and such. An all out or high end Superman/Thor taking down Thanos is a very real possibility.

Holy shyte! Your balls are the size of grapefruits my friend lol!

Let them get mad.

Besides, you can find threads out there dozens of pages long where I've debated Thanos/Thor with every Thanos fan on this board. Any reply made won't contain anything new.

Originally posted by Cogito
Yes..and no...

I see where Quan is getting the unintentional thing. Mar-vell said "A universe where things can still die. That will take some time getting used to."

It's a vague statement. It could imply that he forgot that his attack would kill (rather than inflict pain, which may have been his intention), or it could just be something he said after intentionally killing him. Either way, we'll never know. Originally posted by quanchi112
You need to read the dialogue where he states a universe where thing can still die. The blast was intentional but someone dying from this blast he wasn't expecting due to death being wiped out in his own universe. well, those guys fear him cause he obviously doesn't hold back his anger, and yes, in his universe he can do whatever he feels like and the guy will just come back, killing force is irrelevant. i think he just meant that he can't lash out and kill his men there like he could back home from that point farward, but he did mean to "destroy" magus.

simply put: he shouldn't rage kill in 616 anymore

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Blood and Thunder Thor (Minus the Power Gem) and Lord Mar-Vell are on the same level of power I'd say. From what I remember, Lord Mar-Vell would annihilate a Herald (Based on the Magus showing because the Surfer/Nova fight was a bit underwhelming imo) but would get edged out by Thanos. By the time Thor picked up the Infinity Gem, I'd say no one short of Thanos had a chance of stopping him.

I know this isn't a popular idea (Mostly because it makes Surfer look like utter shit) but I've never considered Thanos to have a large edge in power over Thor and such. An all out or high end Superman/Thor taking down Thanos is a very real possibility. Based on absolutely nothing and even Thor at his highest showing ever with the aid of a power gem only caused a nosebleed from Thanos despite the power gem making him unable to be put down physically. That absolutely kills your case because his absolute greatest showing he fell short of even seriously harming Thanos.

Thor just recently was unable to even seriously hurt the Surfer and Odin didn't even oneshot him so downplaying Mar-vell when he didn't even treat the Surfer as a true threat while Thor who was out for blood and yet failed to even really hurt the Surfer destroys your case.

Surfer and Thor are peers Thanos looks down at them just as Mar-vell does. Superman is in the same league as Surfer and Thor not these two mighty mammoths.

Told you. Classic Quan.

A few clarifications, even I can't ignore everything:

- Blood and Thunder wasn't Thor's highest showing, he just operated more consistently at a level of power he's displayed before. He's operated above even Herald wrecking power. Nothing new.

- Thor vs. Surfer has -hopefully- not yet concluded and Thor is weakened. I guess Drax vs. Thanos counts.

- Odin never even struck Surfer. He grabbed him by his neck and tossed him.

- For the last time, the Power Gem (At that point at least) doesn't mean you can't be knocked out. Thor did it to Drax in that same arc.

Assuming that B&T Thor wasn't actualy in control of the Power Gem during most of his fight with Thanos, I would say that he has a good chance of winning this fight. Thanos seemed to have a far easier time restraining Mar-Vell, than he did with Thor.

Here are my thoughts on Lord Mar-vell. It's very tricky placing a guy like him based on a few quick showings. However, going by averages, not even an elite top tier is doing what he did to Magus, Nova and Norrin. Not a chance. But the flip side to that is that Nova and crew (as Norrin alluded to after the fight) had no clue what they were getting into with him and it could be argued that the Magus got caught off guard (weak sauce argument yes, but still plausible).

Sticking to Nova and Surfer for a second, neither were shown at their best. Surfer basically just flew in and grabbed Mar-vell, and Richard, as we saw in issue 6, has another gear that he can go to altogether. So one has to wonder how a rematch between the three would play out.

Conjecture aside though, dude is above heralds.

Originally posted by dmills
Here are my thoughts on Lord Mar-vell. It's very tricky placing a guy like him based on a few quick showings. However, going by averages, not even an elite top tier is doing what he did to Magus, Nova and Norrin. Not a chance. But the flip side to that is that the Nova and crew had no clue what they were getting into with him and it could be argued that the Magus got caught off guard (weak sauce argument yes, but still plausible).

Sticking to Nova and Surfer for a second, neither were shown at their best. Surfer basically just flew in and grabbed Mar-vell, and Richard, as we saw in issue 6, has another gear that he can go to altogether. So one has to wonder how a rematch between the three would play out. You gotta agree easily overpowering the Worldminds mental defences was impressive and destroying Thanos ship with a simple twitch of his fingers is pretty good aswell.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Told you. Classic Quan.

A few clarifications, even I can't ignore everything:

- Blood and Thunder wasn't Thor's highest showing, he just operated more consistently at a level of power he's displayed before. He's operated above even Herald wrecking power. Nothing new.

- Thor vs. Surfer has -hopefully- not yet concluded and Thor is weakened. I guess Drax vs. Thanos counts.

- Odin never even struck Surfer. He grabbed him by his neck and tossed him.

- For the last time, the Power Gem (At that point at least) doesn't mean you can't be knocked out. Thor did it to Drax in that same arc. Give me Thor's highest showing in terms of formidability than Blood and Thunder because that's as high as he's ever went and it still wasn't good enough.

Give some examples, that rival dominating the Surfer and warlock or Ares and Pluto to make me feel otherwise.

Thor isn't fighting with it slowing him down nor is he using it as an excuse he's a peer to the Surfer and always has been outside of blood and thunder. Try to actually be objective for once.

That's attacking the Surfer whereas Mar-vell really didn't lay into him either just his board which was completely destroyed.

Originally posted by Stoic
Assuming that B&T Thor wasn't actualy in control of the Power Gem during most of his fight with Thanos, I would say that he has a good chance of winning this fight. Thanos seemed to have a far easier time restraining Mar-Vell, than he did with Thor. Thor used the power gem prior to the Thanos fight. Do you ever read these comics ? Thanos is also more powerful than when he fought Thor. Please try and actually read up from time to time so I don't need to point out the obvious flaws in your reasoning.

Originally posted by Nihilist
You gotta agree easily overpowering the Worldminds mental defences was impressive and destroying Thanos ship with a simple twitch of his fingers is pretty good aswell.

No doubt. He did things with ease that most heralds would work have to work very hard for. In a nutshell that's why I say he's above them.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Give me Thor's highest showing in terms of formidability than Blood and Thunder because that's as high as he's ever went and it still wasn't good enough.

Give some examples, that rival dominating the Surfer and warlock or Ares and Pluto to make me feel otherwise.

Thor isn't fighting with it slowing him down nor is he using it as an excuse he's a peer to the Surfer and always has been outside of blood and thunder. Try to actually be objective for once.

That's attacking the Surfer whereas Mar-vell really didn't lay into him either just his board which was completely destroyed.

There are at least a few such instances such as when he's fought Surtur, Odin, Glory or what have you. He was operating on a higher end level more consistently but that wasn't his peak.

"He possesses more strength than I could ever know."

Thor isn't being slowed down because he's extremely tough. That doesn't take away from his condition. He's still gravely wounded, I'm guessing Loki will have to save his life because he'll be on death's door soon. Thanos vs. Drax is valid I guess.

Are you comparing a blast to a toss?

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
There are at least a few such instances such as when he's fought Surtur, Odin, Glory or what have you. He was operating on a higher end level more consistently but that wasn't his peak.

"He possesses more strength than I could ever know."

Thor isn't being slowed down because he's extremely tough. That doesn't take away from his condition. He's still gravely wounded, I'm guessing Loki will have to save his life because he'll be on death's door soon. Thanos vs. Drax is valid I guess.

Are you comparing a blast to a toss? Neither of those are instances since he wasn't close to harming either Surtur or Odin. Glory he prayed for help against and the comic was mostly unsupportable hyperbole. Thor was downing characters he'd otherwise be in a fight against just one on one which leads me to believe it's his best arc ever.

Strength doesn't have to be taken literally and we see Thor can't best him with his strength anyways so I laugh at thee.

Do you think Thor without this injury can dominate the Surfer ? Thanos was beaten by Drax while weakened and via plot device outside Drax's own powers which negate Thanos'. Context. Thor also ha dbattle armor on which obviously helps him against the Surfer.

Did the blast hit the Surfer ? Did Odin toss Surfer or his board ? If someone destroys my surfboard does it hurt me more or less than if someone physically tosses me ? This is soooooooo easy.

Thor has also contained a blast that would have destroyed an entire universe, so while Mar-Vells feats were impressive, some people should remember some of Thor's as well.

@ Quanchi, tell me what book it was that Thor used the Power Gem in because i don't recall it ever stating that he was in full control of the gem. Furthermore, Thor could not have even known how to use the PG when he couldn't spell his own name, and resembled a rabid animal. As far as anyone can tell as I mentioned several times, Thanos may have been battling a Thor that simply had no inhibitions to killing.

Thanos was given new abilities, it was never shown that he was leaps and bounds above what he was shown to be in the mid to late 90s. If so could you tell me what book it was that stated his enormous increase of power, and not that he was given new abilities, such as being barred from death, and that his touch can kill the undead?

Saying that he was exponentially more powerful than ever in my opinion is false. That would mean that because Lobo can not die that he is somehow more powerful, or because Drax has the power to kill Thanos, that he is more than he really is.

Originally posted by Stoic
Thor has also contained a blast that would have destroyed an entire universe, so while Mar-Vells feats were impressive, some people should remember some of Thor's as well.

@ Quanchi, tell me what book it was that Thor used the Power Gem in because i don't recall it ever stating that he was in full control of the gem. Furthermore, Thor could not have even known how to use the PG when he couldn't spell his own name, and resembled a rabid animal. As far as anyone can tell as I mentioned several times, Thanos may have been battling a Thor that simply had no inhibitions to killing.

Thanos was given new abilities, it was never shown that he was leaps and bounds above what he was shown to be in the mid to late 90s. If so could you tell me what book it was that stated his enormous increase of power, and not that he was given new abilities, such as being barred from death, and that his touch can kill the undead?

Saying that he was exponentially more powerful than ever in my opinion is false. That would mean that because Lobo can not die that he is somehow more powerful, or because Drax has the power to kill Thanos, that he is more than he really is. Thor has more impressive feats he'd been in over a thousand comics compared to Marvell's what 7. Thor used the power gem on panel showing he did know exactly what to do with the power gem. saying he acted like a rabid animal is completely untrue when reading the arc. He simply was impulsive and without restraint and wanted to kill everyone in his path to Odin. You really didn't even read the arc as your points are explicitly shown to be false.

So Thanos was always immune to death ? You didn't even read this comic either. You say just random things hoping someone will believe you. Thanos' power changed unless you think being immune to death and being able to cause death to unkillables in a universe where death has been destroyed.

Thanos mopped the floor with someone well above elite top tier. When else has Thanos ever done so prior to ? If you need time to actually look at these comics take all the time you need.

With Drax, I'm going to try and find it, but it was stated that basically his power was to figure out how to destroy any threat or some such. But the heart rip out he did to Thanos he also did to Magus. It just didn't work because the Magus had no heart or some crap.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Neither of those are instances since he wasn't close to harming either Surtur or Odin. Glory he prayed for help against and the comic was mostly unsupportable hyperbole. Thor was downing characters he'd otherwise be in a fight against just one on one which leads me to believe it's his best arc ever.

Quan, why are you lying to me about Thor? There's no point.

If you didn't bother reading the comics, then ask for scans or simply drop it. You're wrong on all three accounts. If you really want me to, I'll post scans.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Strength doesn't have to be taken literally and we see Thor can't best him with his strength anyways so I laugh at thee.



I wonder if you actually believe that.

"You possess more strength than I could ever know"

"His hammer is truly mightier than my Power Cosmic."

Clearly Surfer was on Thor's level.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Do you think Thor without this injury can dominate the Surfer ? Thanos was beaten by Drax while weakened and via plot device outside Drax's own powers which negate Thanos'. Context. Thor also ha dbattle armor on which obviously helps him against the Surfer.

History says it's within his capabilities.

Context? Drax killed Thanos with an Anti-Matter grenade. Anyways, I guess Thanos vs. Drax is valid just like Surfer vs. a severely injured Thor is valid.

Why do you say things that you can't support? It's not an occasional thing but like the norm with you. The battle armor provided protection from space and flight capabilities. That's all. I do find it hilarious though that a Thanos fan is using technology to downplay a character.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Did the blast hit the Surfer ? Did Odin toss Surfer or his board ? If someone destroys my surfboard does it hurt me more or less than if someone physically tosses me ? This is soooooooo easy.

I know you're being your usual stubborn self but I'm not wasting my time with this any longer. Lord Mar-Vell attacked Surfer with a blast which knocked him off his feet:
http://thumbnails29.imagebam.com/9719/1a20ef97181836.jpg

Odin grabbed Surfer and specifically didn't want him to be put down:
http://s3d3.turboimagehost.com/t/7827692_The_Mighty_Thor_3_010-11.jpghttp://s3d3.turboimagehost.com/t/7827693_The_Mighty_Thor_3_012-13.jpg

That doesn't indicate inferiority.

I'm not debating this matter further. You want to continue, I'll battle zone you.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Thor has more impressive feats he'd been in over a thousand comics compared to Marvell's what 7. Thor used the power gem on panel showing he did know exactly what to do with the power gem. saying he acted like a rabid animal is completely untrue when reading the arc. He simply was impulsive and without restraint and wanted to kill everyone in his path to Odin. You really didn't even read the arc as your points are explicitly shown to be false.

So Thanos was always immune to death ? You didn't even read this comic either. You say just random things hoping someone will believe you. Thanos' power changed unless you think being immune to death and being able to cause death to unkillables in a universe where death has been destroyed.

Thanos mopped the floor with someone well above elite top tier. When else has Thanos ever done so prior to ? If you need time to actually look at these comics take all the time you need.


Issue numbers helps, pointing fingers to make yourself feel somehow superior doesn't.

My point if you decide to take your head out of the dirt, was how did the new abilities that Thanos was given equate to him receiving an amplification in terms of physical power, and damage yield? Prove it, and if you can't don't say or try to mislead others.

You were and may still be under the impression that IT Thanos would be able to defeat Odin, or Galactus, and yet there is nothing to support such a wild assumption.

This of course is about Thor vs Mar-Vell, and as I stated earlier, The Power Gem must be learned of its uses, which has been written time and time again. Thanos lovers just want to believe that Thanos was able to take a beating from a PG wielder, and that would have been true, if he were able to slug it out sans shields with the champion, and we all saw that he wasn't.

@Stoic

But Thor was tapping the Power Gem, it said so on panel. So Thanos was taking a beating from a Power Gem user (an enraged one at that).

Originally posted by zopzop
@Stoic

But Thor was tapping the Power Gem, it said so on panel. So Thanos was taking a beating from a Power Gem user (an enraged one at that). Dont waste your time trying to tell him its pointless.

Originally posted by zopzop
@Stoic

But Thor was tapping the Power Gem, it said so on panel. So Thanos was taking a beating from a Power Gem user (an enraged one at that).


How much was Thor drawing from the Gem though? When did Thor begin tap into it? Was Thor tapping the Gem before or after being placed in a force block? Details are what I'm getting at.

Originally posted by Nihilist
Dont waste your time trying to tell him its pointless.

Nah, Stoic is one of the cooler posters on the forum. I'll try to find the scan to prove it to him. But at worst, we'll just agree to disagree.

Originally posted by Stoic
How much was Thor drawing from the Gem though? When did Thor begin tap into it? Was Thor tapping the Gem before or after being placed in a force block? Details are what I'm getting at.

Oh WAAAAY before the power block incident. Remember the Moondragon mind rape attempt? And the Dr. Strange/Warlock tag team fiasco? He was tapping the Gem and it was mentioned on panel.

Originally posted by zopzop
Nah, Stoic is one of the cooler posters on the forum. I'll try to find the scan to prove it to him. But at worst, we'll just agree to disagree. You cant be serious about him can you? you guy is bias as hell, lacks any knowledge about characters he's debating against and tries to use the same feats over and over again despite them being debunked.

THOR!

Originally posted by Nihilist
You cant be serious about him can you? you guy is bias as hell, lacks any knowledge about characters he's debating against and tries to use the same feats over and over again despite them being debunked.

Maybe you caught him on a bad day? We all have those

Originally posted by zopzop
Nah, Stoic is one of the cooler posters on the forum. I'll try to find the scan to prove it to him. But at worst, we'll just agree to disagree.

Hey I read the fight that Thor had with Thanos, I may have forgotten the finer details, but didn't it say that Thor's power was increasing after Thanos placed him in a force block?

this comes down to who is more powerful as well.

Is Odin more powerful than Galactus, who is less powerful than a Gem wielder, that knows how to use it? Odin broke out of Thanos' block of force easily, while Thor was rendered nearly helpless. So how much could he have been tapping of the PG? You see my point?

Originally posted by zopzop
Maybe you caught him on a bad day? We all have those Bad days dont happen in every post.

Specially when you're either Zop or Nihil


Edit: I was actually answering to Zop's comment, but with your post the answer sounds way too cool

Originally posted by Bentley
Specially when you're either Zop or Nihil

Hush you! I'll never forget your Kang betrayal! whip

Originally posted by Stoic

Is Odin more powerful than Galactus, who is less powerful than a Gem wielder, that knows how to use it? Odin broke out of Thanos' block of force easily, while Thor was rendered nearly helpless. So how much could he have been tapping of the PG? You see my point?

I chalk that up to comic book inconsistency.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Quan, why are you lying to me about Thor? There's no point.

If you didn't bother reading the comics, then ask for scans or simply drop it. You're wrong on all three accounts. If you really want me to, I'll post scans.





I wonder if you actually believe that.

"You possess more strength than I could ever know"

"His hammer is truly mightier than my Power Cosmic."

Clearly Surfer was on Thor's level.



History says it's within his capabilities.

Context? Drax killed Thanos with an Anti-Matter grenade. Anyways, I guess Thanos vs. Drax is valid just like Surfer vs. a severely injured Thor is valid.

Why do you say things that you can't support? It's not an occasional thing but like the norm with you. The battle armor provided protection from space and flight capabilities. That's all. I do find it hilarious though that a Thanos fan is using technology to downplay a character.



I know you're being your usual stubborn self but I'm not wasting my time with this any longer. Lord Mar-Vell attacked Surfer with a blast which knocked him off his feet:
http://thumbnails29.imagebam.com/9719/1a20ef97181836.jpg

Odin grabbed Surfer and specifically didn't want him to be put down:
http://s3d3.turboimagehost.com/t/7827692_The_Mighty_Thor_3_010-11.jpghttp://s3d3.turboimagehost.com/t/7827693_The_Mighty_Thor_3_012-13.jpg

That doesn't indicate inferiority.

I'm not debating this matter further. You want to continue, I'll battle zone you. I'm not asking for scans I wanted examples and the ones you gave me don't add up. Thor has never been a threat to Odin or Surtur just like Loki hasn't been either despite Simon's battle between the two iirc.

Strength isn't always the physical kind and Thor's a much grittier warrior than the Surfer ever has been so on that level it makes sense.

Thor is more powerful than the Surfer but not more formidable. I would also rather have the pc as opposed to Thor's abilities in a heartbeat.

An anti matter grenade isn't his power it's a plot device just like no one is going to use Iron Man's satellite beam depowering Wb Hulk as something he can do on his own outside that plot device in that story. Do you even understand my points or do you just want to repeat yourself which is something you're known for.

Thanos has always used tech Thor doesn't. Thor needing a battle suit to aid him against Galactus and the Surfer is completely outside his standard gear. Do you understand ? Is Thor's belt of strength considered standard gear ?

So you won't answer the question and concede as usual. Mar-vell is simply more than the Surfer unlike Thor. I agree Odin and mar-vell are both superior to Thor and the Surfer it's obvious. Thor was also put down momentarily by Bill in his own arc showing he isn't beyond elite top tier.

I just did another battlezone not too long ago which makes 3. I don't have the time or the energy to battlezone you newcomers to it just because you don't have the stomach to carry it over here.

Originally posted by Stoic
Issue numbers helps, pointing fingers to make yourself feel somehow superior doesn't.

My point if you decide to take your head out of the dirt, was how did the new abilities that Thanos was given equate to him receiving an amplification in terms of physical power, and damage yield? Prove it, and if you can't don't say or try to mislead others.

You were and may still be under the impression that IT Thanos would be able to defeat Odin, or Galactus, and yet there is nothing to support such a wild assumption.

This of course is about Thor vs Mar-Vell, and as I stated earlier, The Power Gem must be learned of its uses, which has been written time and time again. Thanos lovers just want to believe that Thanos was able to take a beating from a PG wielder, and that would have been true, if he were able to slug it out sans shields with the champion, and we all saw that he wasn't. Issue numbers ? These are two small arcs if you don't know what occurred in two very short arcs you shouldn't be in the debate.

Give me an example of him easily dominating an above elite top tier character in the same vein as Mar-vell. Acting like he's always been immune to death and still claiming he received no new powers is lying.

Thor used the gem to actively repel attacks in the issue prior to Thanos. Read the issue I hate arguing with someone who simply doesn't know any better. You keep repeating yourself while others have even stated he actively used it. Come on, stoic.

Originally posted by quanchi112
I'm not asking for scans I wanted examples and the ones you gave me don't add up. Thor has never been a threat to Odin or Surtur just like Loki hasn't been either despite Simon's battle between the two iirc.

Yes they do. Making baseless claims doesn't mean they don't count. Claiming Thor was never a threat and couldn't hurt Odin/Surtur is a blatant lie. Thor also never prayed while fighting Glory -he couldn't- and took him on solo. For the record, Glory was compared to Zeus taking all of the Olympians and becoming one in regards to power.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Strength isn't always the physical kind and Thor's a much grittier warrior than the Surfer ever has been so on that level it makes sense.

Surfer made the statement while Thor effortlessly shattered a cosmic barrier.

I'm not going to waste any more time here. Once again, if you want to continue this discussion I'll battle zone you.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Thor is more powerful than the Surfer but not more formidable. I would also rather have the pc as opposed to Thor's abilities in a heartbeat.

That's no argument and I don' care.

Originally posted by quanchi112
An anti matter grenade isn't his power it's a plot device just like no one is going to use Iron Man's satellite beam depowering Wb Hulk as something he can do on his own outside that plot device in that story. Do you even understand my points or do you just want to repeat yourself which is something you're known for.

Thanos has always used tech Thor doesn't. Thor needing a battle suit to aid him against Galactus and the Surfer is completely outside his standard gear. Do you understand ? Is Thor's belt of strength considered standard gear ?

If you attempt to ignore Thor being injured, I'll ignore Thanos being weakened. Which makes the showing valid for Thanos vs. threads. Stay consistent.

So what? That doesn't detract from the irony.

I understand that it's not standard gear but you claimed it obviously helped him against Surfer. I want to know why you'd even make such a claim as the only think those suits do is provide flight and protection from space which is something Thor showed to posses by his lonesome.

Don't make baseless claims.

Originally posted by quanchi112
So you won't answer the question and concede as usual. Mar-vell is simply more than the Surfer unlike Thor. I agree Odin and mar-vell are both superior to Thor and the Surfer it's obvious. Thor was also put down momentarily by Bill in his own arc showing he isn't beyond elite top tier.

What question do you want me to answer? I must have missed it.

Mar-Vell isn't superior to Thor. At least not this Thor.

Skill and sufficient power could put Thor down. At least at that point but by the time he was wrecking the Infinity Watch, no one short of Thanos had a chance to put him down straight up. No, not even Bill. Herald level attacks just seemed to be annoyances at that point.

Originally posted by quanchi112
I just did another battlezone not too long ago which makes 3. I don't have the time or the energy to battlezone you newcomers to it just because you don't have the stomach to carry it over here.

Whatever you say. Concession accepted.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Issue numbers ? These are two small arcs if you don't know what occurred in two very short arcs you shouldn't be in the debate.

Give me an example of him easily dominating an above elite top tier character in the same vein as Mar-vell. Acting like he's always been immune to death and still claiming he received no new powers is lying.

Thor used the gem to actively repel attacks in the issue prior to Thanos. Read the issue I hate arguing with someone who simply doesn't know any better. You keep repeating yourself while others have even stated he actively used it. Come on, stoic.


Nice dodge. You didn't answer my post, but nice dodge.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Yes they do. Making baseless claims doesn't mean they don't count. Claiming Thor was never a threat and couldn't hurt Odin/Surtur is a blatant lie. Thor also never prayed while fighting Glory -he couldn't- and took him on solo. For the record, Glory was compared to Zeus taking all of the Olympians and becoming one in regards to power.



Surfer made the statement while Thor effortlessly shattered a cosmic barrier.

I'm not going to waste any more time here. Once again, if you want to continue this discussion I'll battle zone you.



That's no argument and I don' care.



If you attempt to ignore Thor being injured, I'll ignore Thanos being weakened. Which makes the showing valid for Thanos vs. threads. Stay consistent.

So what? That doesn't detract from the irony.

I understand that it's not standard gear but you claimed it obviously helped him against Surfer. I want to know why you'd even make such a claim as the only think those suits do is provide flight and protection from space which is something Thor showed to posses by his lonesome.

Don't make baseless claims.



What question do you want me to answer? I must have missed it.

Mar-Vell isn't superior to Thor. At least not this Thor.

Skill and sufficient power could put Thor down. At least at that point but by the time he was wrecking the Infinity Watch, no one short of Thanos had a chance to put him down straight up. No, not even Bill. Herald level attacks just seemed to be annoyances at that point.



Whatever you say. Concession accepted. Thor was never ever a threat in bringing Odin or Surtur down under his own power. It's not a lie. Thor's also fled from his dear old dad before.


Hyperbole aside Glory was all lip service. Glory can't beat Zeus nor has he. You have to put up or shut up I tire of your exaggerations.

What does it matter anyways since Thor's strength didn't put the Surfer down despite him really going balls to the walls against the Surfer who tried reasoning with him.

Ok, so you agree Surfer is more formidable. We are finally getting somewhere.

Thor had a battle suit on while Thanos was defeated via plot device similar to Iron Man's satellites outside Drax's own power.


So if you admit it aided Thor's flight in space you admit it aids Thor. According to this writer Thor needs it to battle the Surfer in space. I am glad you are agreeing with me. I'm proud of you.

How isn't he superior to a Thor who was down and acting crazy to Beta Ray Bill. Give me anything to suggest BrB can do the same to Mar-vell.

Thor had the power gem against the watch hence the reason he was winning but he doesn't have the power gem here. Context.

When you abandon this thread you concede. I don't start screaming battlezone in threads demanding they cease arguing. Put up or remain silent.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Thor was never ever a threat in bringing Odin or Surtur down under his own power. It's not a lie. Thor's also fled from his dear old dad before.

That's not what you said Quan. You claimed he was never a threat and has never been capable of causing them harm. Which is an outright lie.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Hyperbole aside Glory was all lip service. Glory can't beat Zeus nor has he. You have to put up or shut up I tire of your exaggerations.

It doesn't matter what you think. Glory was intended to be a Skyfather plus being and was Glory's most powerful lieutenant.

Nothing I posted is an exaggeration.

What does it matter anyways since Thor's strength didn't put the Surfer down despite him really going balls to the walls against the Surfer who tried reasoning with him.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Ok, so you agree Surfer is more formidable. We are finally getting somewhere.

I never said anything of the sort.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Thor had a battle suit on while Thanos was defeated via plot device similar to Iron Man's satellites outside Drax's own power.

So if you admit it aided Thor's flight in space you admit it aids Thor. According to this writer Thor needs it to battle the Surfer in space. I am glad you are agreeing with me. I'm proud of you.

There's not even any indication the armor made him faster than before. At best it let Thor exert less energy in some venues as flying -not that it was tiring before- but it's no comparison to Thor's injury.

Originally posted by quanchi112
How isn't he superior to a Thor who was down and acting crazy to Beta Ray Bill. Give me anything to suggest BrB can do the same to Mar-vell.

Why would he be? Mar-Vell can wreck Heralds but so could Thor. That's the best point you've made so far but unfortunately I think Thor had reached a point where Herald level attacks were simply incapable of putting him down after he got up.

For the record, we never saw Mar-Vell's durability tested. He got knocked down by Thanos but doesn't tell us much except he's not as tough as Thanos.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Thor had the power gem against the watch hence the reason he was winning but he doesn't have the power gem here. Context.

Not that fight.

Originally posted by quanchi112
When you abandon this thread you concede. I don't start screaming battlezone in threads demanding they cease arguing. Put up or remain silent.

I don't stop debating with you nowadays because I concede, I stop debating with you because I tire of your shtick.

In a battle zone you won't have an unlimited number of posts where you can just drag shit out for no real reason.

I'm pretty much bored at this point. You want to debate this further, PM and I'll battle zone you. Debating for large lengths of time has never been a problem for me, keeping interest has been.

And watching you squirm as I systematically destroy you would be interesting.

"Is Blood and Thunder Thor's highest showing?", " How powerful was Surfer in comparison to Thor in their first battle?" etc. are all topics I'd love to do.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
That's not what you said Quan. You claimed he was never a threat and has never been capable of causing them harm. Which is an outright lie.



It doesn't matter what you think. Glory was intended to be a Skyfather plus being and was Glory's most powerful lieutenant.

Nothing I posted is an exaggeration.

What does it matter anyways since Thor's strength didn't put the Surfer down despite him really going balls to the walls against the Surfer who tried reasoning with him.



I never said anything of the sort.



There's not even any indication the armor made him faster than before. At best it let Thor exert less energy in some venues as flying -not that it was tiring before- but it's no comparison to Thor's injury.



Why would he be? Mar-Vell can wreck Heralds but so could Thor. That's the best point you've made so far but unfortunately I think Thor had reached a point where Herald level attacks were simply incapable of putting him down after he got up.

For the record, we never saw Mar-Vell's durability tested. He got knocked down by Thanos but doesn't tell us much except he's not as tough as Thanos.



Not that fight.



I don't stop debating with you nowadays because I concede, I stop debating with you because I tire of your shtick.

In a battle zone you won't have an unlimited number of posts where you can just drag shit out for no real reason.

I'm pretty much bored at this point. You want to debate this further, PM and I'll battle zone you. Debating for large lengths of time has never been a problem for me, keeping interest has been.

And watching you squirm as I systematically destroy you would be interesting.

"Is Blood and Thunder Thor's highest showing?", " How powerful was Surfer in comparison to Thor in their first battle?" etc. are all topics I'd love to do. A threat is someone who can best you that's what I meant. Thor can never beat either and isn't a true threat to either.

Glory doesn't have the showings to prove anything other than a villain whose sole purpose is to lose to Thor. That's it.

Thor's strength can't beat the Surfer so it's irrelevant to Mar-vell especially if it hasn't shown the ability to down the new surfer.

So you just flip flopped. You said no argument there and now want to take it back.

You admit it aided Thor so you agree. It balances everything else out and the fact Surfer was trying to reason with Thor most of the time.

Thor can also be beaten by heralds unlike Mar-vell. That's the entire point. Mar-vell was never tested by anyone save Thanos because everyone else he went up against was nothing to him unlike Thor who got drummed by BrB.


The other fight wasn't impressive.

I told you I don't have the time nor the desire to battlezone every petty disagreement here and there. Just don't respond so you can begin the healing process.