Click HERE to see this thread with all of the graphics, features, and links.

-Strength

-Striking Power

-Healing/Regen

-Raw Speed

-Combat Speed

-Durability

-Damage Soak

-Combat Smarts

-Greats Hyperbolic Statement

Who wins??

http://img860.imageshack.us/img860/5337/zmcomeatmebrolarge.jpg

Strength - Hulk.

Striking Power - Hulk.

Healing/Regen - Split or edge to Lobo.

Raw Speed - Lobo.

Combat Speed - Lobo I guess.

Durability - Hulk.

Damage Soak - Split or edge to Lobo.

Combat Smarts - The Main Man if it's Savage/Mindless but Banner/Merged would probably take it from what I remember.

Greatest Hyperbolic Statement - Hulk.

Hulk wins.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Healing/Regen - Split or edge to Lobo.

Damage Soak - Split or edge to Lobo. Hulk's HF is nowhere near Lobo's... Nor is his damage soak, imo.

Lobo


Strength
Compressing trillion tons into a bite size candy.
http://img822.imageshack.us/img822/7021/loboauth39.jpg

Striking Power
http://img823.imageshack.us/img823/6166/sback0416.jpg
http://img841.imageshack.us/img841/2675/sback0417.jpg


Healing/Regen
Lobo regenerates from a pool of blood.
http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c379/Doggydogg/Lobo/Loboregenerate2.jpg

Raw Speed
Lobo leaps onto the Spaz Frag 666.
http://i160.photobucket.com/albums/t173/EndlessMike9/Lobo/lobobikecontrol.jpg

Combat Speed
Hits faster then superman can react.
http://img442.imageshack.us/img442/3352/supeslobo23hqjy0.jpg


Durability
Tanks a multi-planet attack.
http://img542.imageshack.us/img542/8959/lobothemask0211.jpg
http://img403.imageshack.us/img403/2617/lobothemask0212.jpg
http://img198.imageshack.us/img198/2783/lobothemask0213.jpg

Damage Soak
Sustains the crushing force of a black hole.
http://media.comicvine.com/uploads/8/80612/1479019-scan_loboinblackhole_super.jpg

Combat Smarts
Here we witness first hand, Lobos ability to clone. At this rate, no force in the Galaxy will be able to Lobo.

Lobo with his ability to clone, single handily took out thousands of heavily armored drug lord crafts.
http://img526.imageshack.us/img526/4858/legion0717.jpg
http://img502.imageshack.us/img502/967/legion0718.jpg
http://img265.imageshack.us/img265/8391/legion0719.jpg
http://img208.imageshack.us/img208/1593/legion0720.jpg

Greats Hyperbolic Statement
Hulk is teh strongest. crylaugh0

Who wins??
Lobo

The main man don't do feat wars, he would just frag this big green bastich.duryes

Originally posted by "Id"
Striking Power
http://img823.imageshack.us/img823/6166/sback0416.jpg
http://img841.imageshack.us/img841/2675/sback0417.jpg


Healing/Regen
Lobo regenerates from a pool of blood.
http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c379/Doggydogg/Lobo/Loboregenerate2.jpg I still think this is a better/more straight forward striking feat:
http://img831.imageshack.us/img831/993/71456380.jpg
http://img690.imageshack.us/img690/7780/68030665.jpg

I can't think of too many characters capable of KO'ing Shazam with a single punch... ermm


And while Lobo regenerating from a pool of blood is an astounding feat in it's own right, it should be noted that only a single drop of blood is needed for him to completely regen:
http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/829/39389911.jpg/


...And I'm just going to post this for the lulz...

-Pulsar-
"I possess stellar mass. You lack leverage. This is illogical.

-Lobo-
"I don't do logical" *cue the smash*:

http://img838.imageshack.us/img838/2455/47405758.th.jpg http://img845.imageshack.us/img845/6599/18616222.th.jpg

i get some scans weady

Originally posted by guy222
i get some scans weady Weady, wtf does that mean ?

Lol at Rage. This IS Lobo...

Strength - Lobo

Striking Power - Hulk

Healing/Regen - Lobo

Raw Speed - Lobo.

Combat Speed - Lobo

Durability - Lobo

Damage Soak - Lobo

Combat Smarts - Lobo. People always forget he's a genius....

Greatest Hyperbolic Statement - Not quite sure what this means....

Another feat for regen (he regenerates from a finger. In a toilet):

http://s160.photobucket.com/albums/t173/EndlessMike9/Lobo/?action=view&current=loboregen12.jpg

And continues fighting as a skeleton:
http://s160.photobucket.com/albums/t173/EndlessMike9/Lobo/?action=view&current=loboregen7.jpg

Oh, and fights without a head:
http://s160.photobucket.com/albums/t173/EndlessMike9/Lobo/?action=view&current=lobohegemony.jpg#!oZZ136QQcurrentZZhttp%3A%2F%2Fs160.photobucket. com%2Falbums%2Ft173%2FEndlessMike9%2FLobo%2F%3Fact
ion%3Dview%26current%3Dloboheadless1.jpg

Originally posted by Galan007
Hulk's HF is nowhere near Lobo's... Nor is his damage soak, imo.

Don't get me wrong, Lobo's highs are definitely beyond the Hulk (At least it should be, I wouldn't be surprised at all if Pak had Hulk heal from atomization if angry enough) but I don't think there's a huge difference on a regular brick portrayal. Feel free to disagree, I've read all of his notable feats, not all of his appearances.

What's your definition of damage soak? I want to make this clear before we get into a discussion, people have different ideas about this category.

Edit: If you factor in Lobo's contract, then yea, his always above the Hulk (Even in the shitty appearances).

Damage soak is what a character can handle before being injured,no?

Durability: How much it takes to penetrate your skin.

Damage Soak: How much you can take before going down. Its a broader category, and basically includes durability and regen together to come to a conclusion.

Originally posted by Nihilist
Damage soak is what a character can handle before being injured,no?

Wait, isn't that durability? Lol I'm getting confused now...

Besides, it'll be difficult to show with characters like these - Hulk heals faster than Wolverine can swipe him, so his skin might not be that tough, certainly not Superman level...but we won't be able to see it.

Yeah, the definition of damage soak differs and gets tricky. Especially with someone like Hulk.

The fact that his an off and on again "invulnerable" character doesn't help any.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Wait, isn't that durability? Lol I'm getting confused now...

Besides, it'll be difficult to show with characters like these - Hulk heals faster than Wolverine can swipe him, so his skin might not be that tough, certainly not Superman level...but we won't be able to see it. Id say durability is how much you take before you go down,get ko'd, get killed etc.

To me damage soak is how much before you bleed, get cut open etc.

Originally posted by Nihilist
Id say durability is how much you take before you go down,get ko'd, get killed etc.

To me damage soak is how much before you bleed, get cut open etc.

Ok, so if we use the Thing as an example, his Damage Soak is much higher than his Durability, right?

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Ok, so if we use the Thing as an example, his Damage Soak is much higher than his Durability, right? TBH not sure as im not a Thing fan.

Me neither, but wanted an extreme example where it was very difficult to cut, but yet was easy to KO. Maybe Colossus (pre Cytorrak) would be a better example.

Or maybe damage soak is something like what the Punisher endures? Hmm. In any case, I think if a character wins in the durability category, he/she will win the damage soak category.

Originally posted by CosmicComet
Damage Soak: How much you can take before going down. Its a broader category, and basically includes durability and regen together to come to a conclusion. = my definition as well.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Ok, so if we use the Thing as an example, his Damage Soak is much higher than his Durability, right?

I always thought the 2 go hand in hand.

Now I'm not defending Hulk but I noticed you completely shitted on him. Diarrhea like.

Durability is what a character can endure without visible injury or damage.

Damage soak is how much damage and pain a character can accumulate before being KO'd or killed.

-Strength--draw (though lobo best on-panel is likely>hulk's)

-Striking Power--draw

-Healing/Regen--lobo

-Raw Speed--bo

-Combat Speed--bo

-Durability--draw/edge to bo

-Damage Soak--draw/edge to lobo

-Combat Smarts--bo for sure

-Greats Hyperbolic Statement--hulk

Who wins?? always hard betting against hulk in these types of brick fights but i'd say a slight edge to lobo. be an awesome fraggin fight.....

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Ok, so if we use the Thing as an example, his Damage Soak is much higher than his Durability, right?

yes, that is how i see it.

Let's be honest here, Hulk is above Lobo in physical strength. He takes the win over everyone this side of Thanos and even then, I'd give it to him if sufficiently enraged. This is a post Pak world gentlemen.

Originally posted by Sundipped
I always thought the 2 go hand in hand.

Now I'm not defending Hulk but I noticed you completely shitted on him. Diarrhea like.

Nah, not shitted, its just that comparing in a feat war is like comparing rocket raccoon with bugs bunny....toonforce will win. Especially when Lobo has feats like scaring his own hair to grow, fighting whilst headless and forcing his own writer to change the comic story....

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Let's be honest here, Hulk is above Lobo in physical strength. He takes the win over everyone this side of Thanos and even then, I'd give it to him if sufficiently enraged. This is a post Pak world gentlemen.

Does Hulk have a feat beating the city compression feat then?

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Let's be honest here, Hulk is above Lobo in physical strength. He takes the win over everyone this side of Thanos and even then, I'd give it to him if sufficiently enraged. This is a post Pak world gentlemen.

i agree--in theory hulk would be stronger. but the thread specifies FEATS and lobo's illogical 'stellar' feat is better than anything on panel that hulk has i think. so using JUST feats (given the thread) lobo should win. but it IS hulk, so i couldn't bring myself to allow for anything more than a draw.

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
Durability is what a character can endure without visible injury or damage.

Damage soak is how much damage and pain a character can accumulate before being KO'd or killed.

But is'nt it all durability up until the point a character starts to show visible signs his opponents attacks are taking a toll?

Originally posted by Sundipped
But is'nt it all durability up until the point a character starts to show visible signs his opponents attacks are taking a toll?

Depends on your personal take on it. Perhaps endurance/stamina is a better descriptor of damage soak in the vein of how it's typically used on the forums.

Punisher seems to be the best example (at least for a street level character). He's no more durable than a normal human being, but the amount of damage his body can take and his pain threshold are pretty insane. Thor's a good example for a high herald, too. He's not the most durable of them, but his ability to power through pain and inflicted damage is pretty epic. Durability, to me, suggests the ability to "no sell" attacks and damage soak is how well you handle attacks that you do feel.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Does Hulk have a feat beating the city compression feat then?

- Grey Hulk one shotting an asteroid twice the size of Earth when propelled.
- Sending concussive forces throughout entire dimensions when colliding with Ironclad.
- World Breaker destroying a planet along with 3 other heralds (One as powerful as the Silver Surfer IIRC) and an army of Mindless Ones by trading a punch with an equal.
- Threatening to break off a piece of the continent just by taking a step.
- Going toe to toe with Hercules, Iron Man, Namor, Wonder Man and IIRC She-Hulk while dying.
- Going toe to toe with a crazed Thor.
- Thunderclapping away an attack that destroys a cosmos/Universe.
- Punching through a timestorm that even Kang's time travel technology was useless against.
- Walking through an amped Vector's blast that even tore apart reality.

There's probably more but whatever.

So for example, using these characters, Lobos damage soak might be the time he spent in he'll, powering a part of it with his suffering?

Originally posted by leonidas
i agree--in theory hulk would be stronger. but the thread specifies FEATS and lobo's illogical 'stellar' feat is better than anything on panel that hulk has i think. so using JUST feats (given the thread) lobo should win. but it IS hulk, so i couldn't bring myself to allow for anything more than a draw.

Meh, Hulk has more impressive showings imo.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
- Grey Hulk one shotting an asteroid twice the size of Earth when propelled. This needs to be thrown out.

It is so far beyond what ANY version of Hulk has ever done that it's borderline laughable... Not to mention that characters in the strength class of Thing are generally not known for their planet-busting(++) abilities... ermm

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
Depends on your personal take on it. Perhaps endurance/stamina is a better descriptor of damage soak in the vein of how it's typically used on the forums.

Punisher seems to be the best example (at least for a street level character). He's no more durable than a normal human being, but the amount of damage his body can take and his pain threshold are pretty insane. Thor's a good example for a high herald, too. He's not the most durable of them, but his ability to power through pain and inflicted damage is pretty epic. Durability, to me, suggests the ability to "no sell" attacks and damage soak is how well you handle attacks that you do feel.

Ok so going by this it seems that damage soak is mostly attributed to sheer force of will and determination while taking massive damage. aka "the fighting spirit".

Durability is more so just being invulnerable starting from base state to a certain extent.

Yeah, I used to not think it was SMvsFL, but when you compare it to even the Gamma Father, its a feat far too great.

Honestly, I don't see the issue with the asteroid busting.

I think it would be easier to break apart an asteroid bigger than a planet than a planet itself due to composition. *shrug*

Originally posted by Sundipped
Ok so going by this it seems that damage soak is mostly attributed to sheer force of will and determination while taking massive damage. aka "the fighting spirit".

Durability is more so just being invulnerable starting from base state to a certain extent.

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
Honestly, I don't see the issue with the asteroid busting.

I think it would be easier to break apart an asteroid bigger than a planet than a planet itself due to composition. *shrug* Quantify the feat then. What would busting an asteroid 2x larger than earth be akin to?

See the problem here?

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
- Grey Hulk one shotting an asteroid twice the size of Earth when propelled.
- Sending concussive forces throughout entire dimensions when colliding with Ironclad.
- World Breaker destroying a planet along with 3 other heralds (One as powerful as the Silver Surfer IIRC) and an army of Mindless Ones by trading a punch with an equal.
- Threatening to break off a piece of the continent just by taking a step.
- Going toe to toe with Hercules, Iron Man, Namor, Wonder Man and IIRC She-Hulk while dying.
- Going toe to toe with a crazed Thor.
- Thunderclapping away an attack that destroys a cosmos/Universe.
- Punching through a timestorm that even Kang's time travel technology was useless against.
- Walking through an amped Vector's blast that even tore apart reality.

There's probably more but whatever.

i see all of those as testaments to striking power, not strength. it's a fine difference, maybe, but still, to me those all fit striking power.

Originally posted by Galan007
Quantify the feat then. What would busting an asteroid 2x larger than earth be akin to?

See the problem here?

I can see why people think it's so far out of Grey (and more powerful versions of) Hulk's ability if they think busting an asteroid of that size = busting a planet of the same size. But I personally don't view it in the same light. To me, he just busted a giant ass space rock, not a fully formed and inhabited (or capable of being inhabited) planet with a functioning core. Similar to Glad's "planet busting" feat, imo, in the fact that it's a nice feat, but people shouldn't get stupid about it.

Originally posted by leonidas
i see all of those as testaments to striking power, not strength. it's a fine difference, maybe, but still, to me those all fit striking power.



Not sure if serious.

There's a very direct correlation between strength and striking power in comics, this is especially the case for the Hulk (Someone like the Flash is a rare exception). Those are all showings of raw strength, you can't honestly think otherwise.

Something like the Vector feat is no less valid than the Lobo showing you referenced even using your classification.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Not sure if serious.



of course he has to be strong, but i think strength feats of the type being looked for here are lifting feats. nearly every feat you listed he is STRIKING something (except maybe the footstep feat i guess....) and striking power is a different category here.

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
I can see why people think it's so far out of Grey (and more powerful versions of) Hulk's ability if they think busting an asteroid of that size = busting a planet of the same size. But I personally don't view it in the same light. To me, he just busted a giant ass space rock, not a fully formed and inhabited (or capable of being inhabited) planet with a functioning core. Similar to Glad's "planet busting" feat, imo, in the fact that it's a nice feat, but people shouldn't get stupid about it. If you're going to credit GH with that feat, then you must find a way to downgrade in into FAR less than a planetary feat (as that's where most people tend to go with it.) Like I mentioned before: no one in Thing's strength class is busting a city... Much less a state... Much less a continent... Much less a planet... Much less a planet++.

Originally posted by leonidas


of course he has to be strong, but i think strength feats of the type being looked for here are lifting feats. nearly every feat you listed he is STRIKING something (except maybe the footstep feat i guess....) and striking power is a different category here.

What an incredibly silly distinction. If I were to make a Thanos/Wonder Woman feat war thread, Diana would get the win because he doesn't have her lifting feats? I'm trying to figure out how this works.

Anyways, even with this twisted logic, such a feat should count:
http://www.mynetimages.com/viewimage/61f38505b9
http://www.mynetimages.com/viewimage/2057a235f0
http://www.mynetimages.com/viewimage/e255e809cd

And maybe this:
http://www.mynetimages.com/viewimage/51605c18a3
http://www.mynetimages.com/viewimage/ed68327861
http://www.mynetimages.com/viewimage/dfd434506d

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus


Not sure if serious.

There's a very direct correlation between strength and striking power in comics, this is especially the case for the Hulk (Someone like the Flash is a rare exception). Those are all showings of raw strength, you can't honestly think otherwise.

of course you need to be strong, as i said. but they fit striking power better imo.



walking through a blast that 'tears' reality is impressive, no doubt, but also unquantifiable so hard to gauge.

The difference here is that Id made 2 different categories: Strength, and striking power. Strength might be, for instance, Hulk bracing the mountain in Secret Wars. Striking power might be him punching through a timestorm. See the difference?

If a=strength and b=striking power, then a=b, but b =/= a.

http://i1215.photobucket.com/albums/cc513/dmills31/Nova%20CQB%20protocols/goofygoober2.jpg

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
What an incredibly silly distinction. If I were to make a Thanos/Wonder Woman feat war thread, Diana would get the edge because he doesn't have her lifting feats? I'm trying to figure out how this works.

of course he would lose if it were limited to purely on-panel.

does that mean i think diana is stronger than thanos? no, of course not. if you find the distinction is silly then, (a) don't use feats of him PUNCHING something as proof of strength when there is a STRENGTH category and a STRIKING POWER category. or (b) blame the thread starter for putting forth a 'silly' pair of categories that blend so tightly.



sure. quantifiable? no...... who else could have done the same? did it require full hulk strength or is it equally an impressive durability feat? who knows.....

Originally posted by Galan007
The difference here is that Id made 2 different categories: Strength, and striking power. Strength might be, for instance, Hulk bracing the mountain in Secret Wars. Striking power might be him punching through a timestorm. See the difference?

If a=strength and b=striking power, then a=b, but b =/= a.

exactly.

Originally posted by leonidas
of course you need to be strong, as i said. but they fit striking power better imo.

So Wonder Woman wouldn't get the nod over Thanos?

Can you please explain the criteria here? So far I'm getting a "whatever I feel like" vibe.

Imo, all around strength feats should be used to determine who wins the strength category whether it's smashing a part a planet or lifting a mountain. Otherwise you run into some serious problems.

Originally posted by leonidas
walking through a blast that 'tears' reality is impressive, no doubt, but also unquantifiable so hard to gauge.

You won't get any more concrete numbers with the Stellar mass feat. I personally find the Vector showing more impressive due to the scope but whatever.

Originally posted by leonidas
of course he would lose if it were limited to purely on-panel.

does that mean i think diana is stronger than thanos? no, of course not. if you find the distinction is silly then, (a) don't use feats of him PUNCHING something as proof of strength when there is a STRENGTH category and a STRIKING POWER category. or (b) blame the thread starter for putting forth a 'silly' pair of categories that blend so tightly.

So Thanos would lose to Diana in the strength category? Alright then.

I still think this is very illogical and nitpicks the term to the point it lose it's meaning but whatever, at least you're consistent so I can't fault you.

Originally posted by leonidas
sure. quantifiable? no...... who else could have done the same? did it require full hulk strength or is it equally an impressive durability feat? who knows.....

So it counts, that's good. How do you think it stacks up to the Lobo showing you mentioned?

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
So Wonder Woman wouldn't get the nod over Thanos?

Can you please explain the criteria here? So far I'm getting a "whatever I feel like" vibe.

Imo, all around strength feats are used to determine who wins the strength category whether it's smashing a part a planet or lifting a mountain. Otherwise you run into some serious problems.



You won't get any more concrete numbers with the Stellar mass feat. I personally find the Vector showing more impressive due to the scope though but whatever.

seriously? i don't think this is all that confusing. ironfist is a character who would have low strength but uber striking power. flash is another (think you brought him up). strength obviously HAS to play a part in it, but i see strength feats (in THIS case because the categories have been made distinct by the threadstarter) as DIFFERENT from punching/hitting/striking feats.

strength feats for hulk would be holding the mountain range, keeping the inertia of colliding matter/anti-matter from meeting (also unquantifiable though i'd love to see some of the math guys try and quantify it...), crushing his serpent hammer could also be seen as strength imo. lifting/throwing are strength feats to me (and recall this is my own PERSONAL way to view these categories--you can look at it however you'd like) in the context of this thread.

Originally posted by Galan007
If you're going to credit GH with that feat, then you must find a way to downgrade in into FAR less than a planetary feat (as that's where most people tend to go with it.) Like I mentioned before: no one in Thing's strength class is busting a city... Much less a state... Much less a continent... Much less a planet... Much less a planet++.

Fair enough.

I just don't see the big deal about said feat as it's:

A.) Obviously intended to be a high end feat for Hulk.
B.) Hulk's strength fluctuates on anger (ie. plot), even his weaker forms.
C.) Asteroids <<< Planets.

Maybe I'm in the minority in that I really don't think it's all that impressive in the grand scheme of things (for his weight class? absolutely).

Originally posted by leonidas
seriously? i don't think this is all that confusing. ironfist is a character who would have low strength but uber striking power. flash is another (think you brought him up). strength obviously HAS to play a part in it, but i see strength feats (in THIS case because the categories have been made distinct by the threadstarter) as DIFFERENT from punching/hitting/striking feats.

strength feats for hulk would be holding the mountain range, keeping the inertia of colliding matter/anti-matter from meeting (also unquantifiable though i'd love to see some of the math guys try and quantify it...), crushing his serpent hammer could also be seen as strength imo. lifting/throwing are strength feats to me (and recall this is my own PERSONAL way to view these categories--you can look at it however you'd like) in the context of this thread.

I perfectly understand your reasoning, I just wanted to know how far you'd take it as this logic runs into some serious problems if adhered to like this. Characters like the Flash or Iron Fist are the exception. A direct correlation between striking and strength is generally the rule the higher up you go, even amongst flying bricks. I think you should at least treat it as a case by case basis, in which case characters like Thor/Hulk/Wonder Woman/Thanos/Lobo should be able to draw on all their feats while that wouldn't apply to Iron Fist/Flash/Thor with Mjolnir etc.

But like you said, this is up to one's own personal interpretation so I'll just leave it at this.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
You won't get any more concrete numbers with the Stellar mass feat. I personally find the Vector showing more impressive due to the scope but whatever.

the stellar mass can be pretty easily quantified i think. even if we simply assume the least possible mass for a star the mass is astronomical.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
So Thanos would lose to Diana in the strength category? Alright then.

I still think this is very illogical and nitpicks the term to the point it lose it's meaning but whatever, at least you're consistent so I can't fault you.

welllll..... whew.



i really don't know. i remember reading that feat and thinking it was impressive. i think it's at least as impressive a durability feat as a strength feat. he should have been flayed into a skeleton. i just think it's unquantifiable. not sure how you're gauging the strength level required to move against it. it's a great feat. beyond that.....?

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
I perfectly understand your reasoning, I just wanted to know how far you'd take it as this logic runs into some serious problems if adhered to as firmly as you are. Characters like the Flash or Iron Fist are the exception. A direct correlation between striking and strength is generally the rule the higher up you go, even among flying bricks. I think you should at least treat as a case by case basis,

i'm not sure what problems you're talking about. again, for purposes of THIS thread where the distinction is required by the OP, strength, to me, is evinced by lifting/throwing, striking power evinced by hitting/punching/concussive.

Originally posted by leonidas
the stellar mass can be pretty easily quantified i think. even if we simply assume the least possible mass for a star the mass is astronomical.

I doubt you could find a specific number but whatever, I only took physics as far up as grade 11.

Originally posted by leonidas
i really don't know. i remember reading that feat and thinking it was impressive. i think it's at least as impressive a durability feat as a strength feat. he should have been flayed into a skeleton. i just think it's unquantifiable. not sure how you're gauging the strength level required to move against it. it's a great feat. beyond that.....?

I think it's at least as impressive, almost certainly more so. At the time Vector could repel worlds and the very fabric of reality, Hulk wasn't just tanking that shit, he was walking through it.

I can't give you math equations or whatever, I'm just saying the scope of it makes it more impressive. A feat doesn't automatically become invalid if it can't be attached to numbers.

Originally posted by leonidas
i'm not sure what problems you're talking about. again, for purposes of THIS thread where the distinction is required by the OP, strength, to me, is evinced by lifting/throwing, striking power evinced by hitting/punching/concussive.

What problems?

I think the category of strength loses meaning when you're criteria would have the Thing above the Destroyer Armor because it doesn't have the lifting feats. Like I said, I completely understand your criteria and you can stick to it, but there should be some leg room to apply common sense. Not all characters go around bench pressing buildings or mountains. Someone like Iron Fist should be treated differently from Lobo.

I didn't want to reply but I couldn't help myself.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
I doubt you could find a specific number but whatever, I only took physics as far up as grade 11.



I think it's at least as impressive, almost certainly more so. At the time Vector could repel worlds and the very fabric of reality, Hulk wasn't just tanking that shit, he was walking through it.

I can't give you math equations or whatever, I'm just saying the scope of it makes it more impressive. A feat doesn't automatically become invalid if it can't be attached to numbers.

that's absolutely true, which is why i copped out on answering which feat is more impressive. a lack of numbers DOES make direct comparsions difficult though. could he have blown a star?? seems silly to think so, but, who knows.....

Only problem with lobo is that he is steeped in cartoony portrayals. It's understood that he's at least "part-toon/parody" of 90's comics and how overly macho they were, being he's an amalgam of grey hulk, wolverine, and the punisher on roids

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
What problems?

I think the category of strength loses meaning when you're criteria has Diana above Thanos because he doesn't have the lifting feats. Not all characters go around bench pressing mountains, there should be some room to apply common sense.

you're problem with this is that you're not seperating this thread from other threads like i am. it's not a problem for me because i already said thanos is stronger, and i know that and have no problem saying it. but for purposes of this thread (which is supposed to be a direct comparison of on-panel feats) ww DOES have better strength feats. but i AM capable of using common sense and looking past the collection of on-panel lifting/throwing feats. the 2 are NOT irreconcilable.

Originally posted by leonidas
you're problem with this is that you're not seperating this thread from other threads like i am. it's not a problem for me because i already said thanos is stronger, and i know that and have no problem saying it. but for purposes of this thread (which is supposed to be a direct comparison of on-panel feats) ww DOES have better strength feats. but i AM capable of using common sense and looking past the collection of on-panel lifting/throwing feats. the 2 are NOT irreconcilable.

Fair enough I guess.

I still don't like it though. uhuh

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Fair enough I guess.

I still don't like it though. uhuh

it must inadvertently reflect badly on thor then......?


heh

Originally posted by leonidas
it must inadvertently reflect badly on thor then......?


heh

F*ck you.

g_serious

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Does Hulk have a feat beating the city compression feat then?


tbh I think taking a step and nearly sinking the entire eastern seaboard is a hell of a lot more impressive than compacting a city.

Damage Soak is pain tolerance.

- Walking through an amped Vector's blast that even tore apart reality.

though impressive in its own right, I find Lobo tanking Jenny's reality blast even more impressive.

Originally posted by leonidas
that's absolutely true, which is why i copped out on answering which feat is more impressive. a lack of numbers DOES make direct comparsions difficult though. could he have blown a star?? seems silly to think so, but, who knows..... plus you're debating lobo

stellaris being close to the planet he was on when he pulled him down makes no sense whatsoever, regardless of stellar mass being quantifiable

Did Hulk just destroy a universe just by fist fighting?

http://www.mynetimages.com/viewimage/dfd434506d

Here is a better question. Can Hulk thunderclap a 50 kiloton nuke fart? uhuh

Probably could.

http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=12952643

Originally posted by carver9
Did Hulk just destroy a universe just by fist fighting?

http://www.mynetimages.com/viewimage/dfd434506d His thunderclap did it actually.

Originally posted by Damborgson
His thunderclap did it actually.

That's insane.

Originally posted by Galan007
This needs to be thrown out.

It is so far beyond what ANY version of Hulk has ever done that it's borderline laughable... Not to mention that characters in the strength class of Thing are generally not known for their planet-busting(++) abilities... ermm The reasons it needs to be thrown out are largely because it wasn't even really a strength feat, since Hulk was shot at the thing with some fancy devices that made his jumping much more powerful... I mean, it's still a good feat, but not exactly a strength feat.

well....

modern new earth superman:

http://i1099.photobucket.com/albums/g386/psychogundam1/supesshadowmoon.jpg

grey hulk w/his jump buffed:

http://i1099.photobucket.com/albums/g386/psychogundam1/earthkillingasteroid.jpg

http://i1099.photobucket.com/albums/g386/psychogundam1/greyhulkasteroid1.jpg http://i1099.photobucket.com/albums/g386/psychogundam1/greyhulkasteroid2.jpg

the guy just needed some more momentum to not only surpass what superman did, but he took it a lot better. shit, he could have done the shadow moon too if it was placed behind the asteroid

Joe Fixit is my favorite Hulk, but damn that was stupid. In that one panel the asteroid looks small, definitely not twice the size of the Earth.

yeah but, it was so damn big that the part you see when hulk is almost upon it could be a small part of the tip; for example when you see the earth from far away you can't see mount everest jutting out until you're really close

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
Durability is what a character can endure without visible injury or damage.

Damage soak is how much damage and pain a character can accumulate before being KO'd or killed. Hmm....I remember saying "Hulk`s best healing feat doodoos all over Hulk`s" and you wrote a 500 word essay telling me I was wrong. Yet, here.....you seem to agree with me. Are you a fish? And are you out of water? Why do I ask? Because you be a flip floppin mofo! BURN!!!

I love that so much.

'Hey Hulk. Hope we're not waking you. There's this giant f*cking rock headed on a collision course with our planet. Us scientists have talked about it, and we all agreed that the best, smartest solution would be to strap you to a superpowered set of f*cking pogo sticks have you jump at the thing. Cool?"

Awesome.

bouncing rowdy club goers, shattering an asteroid twice the size of earth, same diff'

Originally posted by long pig
Hmm....I remember saying "Hulk`s best healing feat doodoos all over Hulk`s" and you wrote a 500 word essay telling me I was wrong. Yet, here.....you seem to agree with me. Are you a fish? And are you out of water? Why do I ask? Because you be a flip floppin mofo! BURN!!!

...what?

-Strength-Hulk

-Striking Power-Hulk

-Healing/Regen-Edge To Hulk Since his HF can get better

-Raw Speed-LoBo

-Combat Speed-Split

-Durability-Hulk

-Damage Soak-Split or Edge To Hulk

-Combat Smarts-Edge To Hulk

-Greats Hyperbolic Statement-Lobo

Who wins?? Hulk

-Strength - Hulk

-Striking Power - Hulk

-Healing/Regen - Split

-Raw Speed - Lobo

-Combat Speed - Lobo

-Durability - Hulk

-Damage Soak - Hulk

-Combat Smarts - Hulk

-Greats Hyperbolic Statement - Hulk

Who wins?? - Hulk

Also with regards to the Grey Hulk feat, he has unlimited strength the same as Savage and Green Scar. Why is him destroying the equivalent of a planet such a big shock when it was within his powerset to do so.

What feats does Hulk have for combat smarts?

Lobo has created plagues which killed his own race (and we know how difficult they are to kill), together with the antidotes for himself; his space bike far exceeds anything Bannertech has done...

As for Damage Soak, when he was trapped in Hell, his suffering alone powered Neron's castle - and his healing/regen is def higher than Hulk's...

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
What feats does Hulk have for combat smarts?

Lobo has created plagues which killed his own race (and we know how difficult they are to kill), together with the antidotes for himself; his space bike far exceeds anything Bannertech has done...

He's also built time machines...

Originally posted by Prep-Man
He's also built time machines...

I wasn't going to put that because he reverse-engineered it from some spare parts lying around - not that I can see Banner doing the same.

I just don't think Hulk/Banner is able to create a weapon like the Space Hog, capable of traversing black holes etc. If by combat smarts you mean using tactics etc in a fight, then its more debateable, because neither character needs tactics when they can just smash faces in.

But Lobo realises he's in a comic, comes out, and beats the writer up in order to get a better story.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
What feats does Hulk have for combat smarts?
Read WWH or anything since then. Hulk is backed up by Banners genius brain the guy outsmarted and outfoxed most of the top brains on Marvel Earth in Fall of the Hulks.

That's science smart. I'd give combat smarts to Lobo. Strength could go either way, depending on what Lobo we get.

Originally posted by The Sorrow
Read WWH or anything since then. Hulk is backed up by Banners genius brain the guy outsmarted and outfoxed most of the top brains on Marvel Earth in Fall of the Hulks.

Lol I did, and nothing compares to Lobo outsmarting all of the top brains on Czarnia, and killing them all. And considering he's pretty much unkillable, that's saying something.

And building a time machine out of his bike, which also travels at pretty high speeds across the galaxy, and enters black holes etc unscathed. Whereas BannerHulk needed the Old Ones' ship to come back.

Originally posted by Prep-Man
That's science smart. I'd give combat smarts to Lobo. Strength could go either way, depending on what Lobo we get.

Well, it IS a feat war, so it'll have to be the biggest baddest Lobo ever. On average showings (such as when he was hired by Atrocitus), then yes, WBH takes him out.

But this is a feat war. So whatever illogical stupid things Lobo has done, such as fighting with no head, or with his brains hanging out (which he then controls to attack someone), or regenerating from a finger in a toilet, is and can be used.

I thought combat smart is fighting ability skills. I think Lobo is a smarter fighter all around.

Originally posted by Prep-Man
I thought combat smart is fighting ability skills. I think Lobo is a smarter fighter all around.

Same. Again, advantage Lobo, when he uses combat smarts to beat the comic writer up.

Or when he brawled against a skilled alien martial artist in REBELS.

"The mind of lobo is a wondrous thing. He can instantly analyze any opponent, weighing up their abilities, and defense perfectly, giving him exact knowledge of their Achilles Heel, or weak spot. "

DCU: Last Sons takes it a step farther, and emphasizes that Lobo can strike the weak spot with precision, with out missing.

Whereas Hulk's biggest combat smarts feat was probably BFRing Juggy.....

The Sorrow, and TheHulk. Explain to me how Hulk has better durability? Lobo sustained magical flames that can destroy you body, and soul for years end. Even Nero can not sustain them for long. Then you have him tanking planet wrecking blasts. What does Hulk have to beat it?

Originally posted by Galan007
I still think this is a better/more straight forward striking feat:
http://img831.imageshack.us/img831/993/71456380.jpg
http://img690.imageshack.us/img690/7780/68030665.jpg

I can't think of too many characters capable of KO'ing Shazam with a single punch... ermm


I like it when Lobo punches a God soo hard, his eyeballs pop out. One Hitter Quiter. biscuits

As far as combat smarts goo.

(Lobo's Greatest Hits.)
If Lobo ever regained his ability to clone. He would repopulate Czarnia. Focus on a military campaign. And produce weapons potent enough to wreck entire solar systems.

New-Czarnia would become a force, the universe has never seen.
http://img855.imageshack.us/img855/4707/loboarmy1.jpg
http://img534.imageshack.us/img534/9059/loboarmy2.jpg

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
What feats does Hulk have for combat smarts?

Lobo has created plagues which killed his own race (and we know how difficult they are to kill), together with the antidotes for himself; his space bike far exceeds anything Bannertech has done...

As for Damage Soak, when he was trapped in Hell, his suffering alone powered Neron's castle - and his healing/regen is def higher than Hulk's...

Hulk IS currently Banner. Their minds are one.

You understand the rest and you might need to read WWH on what cho said.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Whereas Hulk's biggest combat smarts feat was probably BFRing Juggy.....

No, Hulk biggest combat ft is destroying cities, destroying Continents and measuring the destruction precision to the point where a single human doesn't get not a single scratch. Again, read what was stated in WWH.

Originally posted by "Id"
The Sorrow, and TheHulk. Explain to me how Hulk has better durability? Lobo sustained magical flames that can destroy you body, and soul for years end. Even Nero can not sustain them for long. Then you have him tanking planet wrecking blasts. What does Hulk have to beat it?



I like it when Lobo punches a God soo hard, his eyeballs pop out. One Hitter Quiter. biscuits

Hulk was in the heart of a planets explosion that took out 3 heralds, a race full of Mindless Ones, along with other super humans as well. The blast was so powerful that it took out nearby planets. Hulk tanked it without a scratch and stood on the edge of a cliff without a scratch.

Rage just posted Hulk combating and the results destroyed a freaking universe and Hulk was in the heart of this and didn't have a scratch.

Lobo can't hang with that. Hell fire? WWH has withstood that as well and how hot was the hellfire Lobo withstood?

hellfire lol

Lobo is a toon character. Most of the feats mentioned are gag feats. It's like comparing superman to bugs bunny in the feat department. Just not doable.

Originally posted by carver9
Hulk was in the heart of a planets explosion that took out 3 heralds, a race full of Mindless Ones, along with other super humans as well. The blast was so powerful that it took out nearby planets. Hulk tanked it without a scratch and stood on the edge of a cliff without a scratch.

Rage just posted Hulk combating and the results destroyed a freaking universe and Hulk was in the heart of this and didn't have a scratch.

Lobo can't hang with that. Hell fire? WWH has withstood that as well and how hot was the hellfire Lobo withstood? This In LoBo Fanboy Logic does not make any logic to them.

Originally posted by carver9
Hulk was in the heart of a planets explosion that took out 3 heralds, a race full of Mindless Ones, along with other super humans as well. The blast was so powerful that it took out nearby planets. Hulk tanked it without a scratch and stood on the edge of a cliff without a scratch.

That's pretty good. Lobo destroyed a solar system with the exploding numbers technique, along with 'hundreds of millions of warships' (Fragtastic Voyage #1) Check page 1, there's another scan where Lobo destroys a solar system and is at the centre of it all.


This one trumps the previous Dark Dimension feat, surprised you didn't lead with this one. But I'd put tanking Jenny Quantum over this.


WWH has? Not counting GR, as he wasn't in full control (and when he was, was kicking Hulk's ass). Unquantifiable with regards to the Hellfire temp Lobo endured, am conjecturing here as he was confined within their top security prison in hell so...I'd say pretty hot? Lol.

Btw carver, am still awaiting those scans you promised me of Hulk tanking mystical negations of his healing factor - maybe this would be the perfect thread to post them?

Originally posted by McNasty996
Lobo is a toon character. Most of the feats mentioned are gag feats. It's like comparing superman to bugs bunny in the feat department. Just not doable.

Agreed. Its like asking who'd win, Taz from Tazmania or Wolverine....

Originally posted by carver9
No, Hulk biggest combat ft is destroying cities, destroying Continents and measuring the destruction precision to the point where a single human doesn't get not a single scratch. Again, read what was stated in WWH.

Oh, you mean the character statement from Cho, the biggest Hulk supporter ever? In which case, I trump your 7th smartest person's statement with Reed and Stark, who said that he HAS caused death and destruction. Read what was stated in Planet Hulk.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Agreed. Its like asking who'd win, Taz from Tazmania or Wolverine.... this.

only change would be that it's not who would win, rather who looks more impressive on paper, and that's obviously going to go to tazz. toons are indestructible at least one level more so than abstracts

Originally posted by carver9
Hulk was in the heart of a planets explosion that took out 3 heralds, a race full of Mindless Ones, along with other super humans as well. The blast was so powerful that it took out nearby planets. Hulk tanked it without a scratch and stood on the edge of a cliff without a scratch.

I posted this first page. srsly
http://img542.imageshack.us/img542/8959/lobothemask0211.jpg
http://img403.imageshack.us/img403/2617/lobothemask0212.jpg
http://img198.imageshack.us/img198/2783/lobothemask0213.jpg

Originally posted by carver9


Rage just posted Hulk combating and the results destroyed a freaking universe and Hulk was in the heart of this and didn't have a scratch.

Lobo can't hang with that. Hell fire? WWH has withstood that as well and how hot was the hellfire Lobo withstood?
It took the collective might of hell to bring down Lobo. And Detain him here.
The enchantments that bind Lobo, would devour lesser being body, and soul.
Not even Lord Neron can withstand the Runespout that contains it.
He spent Years, confined within the runespout since agony/pain is used to power hell. Lobo alone powered the entire Labyrinth.

Etrigan is not hyperboleing, due to the fact that their little dive into the Runespout weakened them to the point of near death.

http://img11.imageshack.us/img11/9975/rih4p18.th.jpghttp://img72.imageshack.us/img72/7475/rih4p19.th.jpghttp://img819.imageshack.us/img819/2766/rih4p20.th.jpghttp://img828.imageshack.us/img828/5038/rih4p2122.th.jpghttp://img59.imageshack.us/img59/1527/rih4p23.th.jpghttp://img507.imageshack.us/img507/1903/rih5p12.th.jpg


http://img11.imageshack.us/img11/9975/rih4p18.jpg
http://img72.imageshack.us/img72/7475/rih4p19.jpg
http://img819.imageshack.us/img819/2766/rih4p20.jpg
http://img828.imageshack.us/img828/5038/rih4p2122.jpg
http://img59.imageshack.us/img59/1527/rih4p23.jpg
http://img507.imageshack.us/img507/1903/rih5p12.jpg


In both instances, Lobo stands with nothing more than a sun tan.

Originally posted by TheHulk
This In LoBo Fanboy Logic does not make any logic to them.

Fanboy logic? Your user name is the Hulk. Arguing for the Hulk.

And your reason as to why, the Hulk beats Lobo in healing/regen is it could get better. abcsarcasm

Not that it is.

Originally posted by McNasty996
Lobo is a toon character. Most of the feats mentioned are gag feats. It's like comparing superman to bugs bunny in the feat department. Just not doable.

Lobo is a humorous character, not a gag character. Its easy to pick him out from a gag or toon character since Lobo is still confined within the limits of plot. In return this lets us know he has well defined limits, to his own physicality.

Lobo isn't Mxyzptlk.

That being said, even if you do separate the "real" feats from the "joke" ones (which can be a dicey endeavor), it's pretty obvious he's intended to be a top tier being more than capable of holding his own with Hulk.

Lobo has had enough serious appearances to determine a level for him. He ranges from a Top Tier to an Elite Top Tier brick with an incredible healing factor.

If the two were ever to fight in a comic, Hulk is the smarter bet imo. I think Lobo at best would stalemate the green idiot while I wouldn't be surprised if he beat Lobo into a stain then like thunder-clapped him away or something.

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
Lobo isn't Mxyzptlk.

That being said, even if you do separate the "real" feats from the "joke" ones (which can be a dicey endeavor), it's pretty obvious he's intended to be a top tier being more than capable of holding his own with Hulk.

I never said Hulk would crush Lobo in feats or that he would be curb stomped in a fight. But as you said it gets very dicey and subjective separating a joke from an actual feat which is what makes using characters like Lobo, Mask, or Mr. Mxy difficult to use sometimes.

Mainstream DC makes no distinction to Lobo self titles. Given that mainstream DC often references events that occurred in Lobo titles to reinforce its mythos.

Case, and Point. Lobo in 52, referencing events that occurred in Jingle Hell/Spring Break Massacre.

My point is, if DC makes no distinction between serious Lobo, and Toon Lobo. Than you shouldn't either. To go about wouldn't just be flawed, but wrong all together since this is how he was introduced (Post Crisis) in the first place.

You need to broaden your views, and accept that silly things will happen if the comic is intended to have a humorous plot.

Assuming this is before Hulk separated from Banner.

Lobo vs Hulk would be fairly competitive. Thats unquestionable. Under normal circumstances, Lobo walks at Superman, Captain Marvel, Elite Green Lantern etc..Class. Its equivalent to Hulk, when he is fighting Gladiator, Thor, Quasar etc..

I emphasize under normal circumstances, as that is how he should be starting off without plot restrictions. We also know that the fight can quickly escalate, once anger/rage is factored in. Since both will benefit from huge stat boost. As its clearly shown respectively in Spring Break Massacre, and Hulk #632.

And even then, there is still isn't a clear answer. But I am with betting my chips on the virtual immortal that matches, and in some cases exceeds Hulk at his best.

I think Hulk amps faster than Lobo.

Originally posted by carver9
I think Hulk amps faster than Lobo.

Absolutely, if its Pre separation. Hulk was amping to World Breaker at the turn of the Key.

Originally posted by "Id"
Absolutely, if its Pre separation. Hulk was amping to World Breaker at the turn of the Key.

You are confusing me. I thought you just said that Lobo amps faster.

Originally posted by carver9
You are confusing me. I thought you just said that Lobo amps faster. santdur

Originally posted by carver9
You are confusing me. I thought you just said that Lobo amps faster.

Damn it carver read my posts. I said both clearly benefit from anger amapage, as the fight progresses.


Now go to your room. facepalm

Originally posted by "Id"
Absolutely, if its Pre separation. lobo doesn't even exist right now, how about that separated hulk might have kept the same power from before

Concept Homicidal you Bastich. The Boo will ne'va die.

Originally posted by "Id"
Damn it carver read my posts. I said both clearly benefit from anger amapage, as the fight progresses.


Now go to your room. facepalm

Lol...gotcha. My bad buddy.

Go to bed, Carver.

Are we underestimating Lobo`s superspeed? Kept up with many flashes and Superman. I dont see Hulk landing a hit unleess lobo wants him to.

Originally posted by Prep-Man
Go to bed, Carver.

Wow.

Canver! The man wants you to hit the sack!.....and also whats you to go to bed.