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which Comic book is the better storyteller based on:
illustrations
Character relevance
storyplots
panel design
character power consistency
Better spin-off and series
comic panel or character power creativeness and orginality like breaking the fourth wall
Better comic titles,team names,comic covers and superhero names
relevant to current coulture and Generation
And smarter storylines.

Well IMO the best Vertigo stuff blows most of the best Marvel stuff out of the water, but I'm not sure if Vertigo counts

Originally posted by Endless Mike
Well IMO the best Vertigo stuff blows most of the best Marvel stuff out of the water, but I'm not sure if Vertigo counts it does as its an imprint/series/spinoff of dc industry

If all the imprints count, DC. Wildstorm had some awesome stuff as well. Sleeper was one of the best things I have read.

When it concerns street level characters, I think DC is much better overall. The protagonists and antagonists are just so much more interesting and varied (although I do love all the X-Men for Marvel). With that said, I think DC is complete garbage when writing stories concerning God-type characters, what with all their 5D Keebler Elves and the very existence of Emperor Joker. Marvel has a much more solid selection of Gods and cosmic characters. Basically anything magic or space related, Marvel stomps, whereas things strictly earth related, DC stomps.

Although nothing beats Classic Dr. Strange. Absolutely nothing.

Originally posted by CortSether
When it concerns street level characters, I think DC is much better overall. The protagonists and antagonists are just so much more interesting and varied (although I do love all the X-Men for Marvel). With that said, I think DC is complete garbage when writing stories concerning God-type characters, what with all their 5D Keebler Elves and the very existence of Emperor Joker. Marvel has a much more solid selection of Gods and cosmic characters. Basically anything magic or space related, Marvel stomps, whereas things strictly earth related, DC stomps.

Although nothing beats Classic Dr. Strange. Absolutely nothing.

Interesting you see it that way (I agree, especially of late), considering that DC has traditionally been seen as full of alien space gods and whatnot, whereas Marvel is seen as the street level,' guy next door you can empathise wit'h comic company.

Well, this will likely devolve into a shitstorm with company lines being toed and whatnot. They both have their strong points and weak areas as far as I'm concerned.

I prefer Marvel's street level/espionage type stories better than DC's, which are generally dominated by the Batman line of books and related characters. I also prefer Marvel's super science aspects.

Conversely, DC's events generally have larger scope on a regular basis and the stakes are larger consistently. Events are also regularly handled better than Marvel's.

I read both to satisfy whatever trope of the superhero genre I'm digging at the moment.

Both have their good; both have their bad.

Anyone who thinks DC can't do relatable is on crack.
Anyone who thinks Marvel can't do heralds is on crack.

Bleh.

Originally posted by CortSether
When it concerns street level characters, I think DC is much better overall. The protagonists and antagonists are just so much more interesting and varied (although I do love all the X-Men for Marvel). With that said, I think DC is complete garbage when writing stories concerning God-type characters, what with all their 5D Keebler Elves and the very existence of Emperor Joker. Marvel has a much more solid selection of Gods and cosmic characters. Basically anything magic or space related, Marvel stomps, whereas things strictly earth related, DC stomps.

Although nothing beats Classic Dr. Strange. Absolutely nothing.

DC has a much more complex and exciting world of mystics than Marvel, IMO. Everything ranging from Swamp Thing, to Zatanna/Fate, to Hellblazer, Shadowpact, Demon Knights, Books of Magic, Sandman, Lucifer, Fate, Red, Green, Marvel family, etc...

IMO, they are both as bad/good as each other. Its less about which company is better, but more abour which writer is better.....

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
IMO, they are both as bad/good as each other. Its less about which company is better, but more abour which writer is better.....

I don't know, man. DC has had some of the BEST writers in the industry crafting their cosmic/mystical mythos. From Sandman (Giaman), Alan Moore, Mike Carey, and now Scott Snyder.

Is there any writer/series in Marvel who wrote a critically acclaimed series like Sandman or Swamp Thing?

Originally posted by -Pr-
Both have their good; both have their bad.

Anyone who thinks DC can't do relatable is on crack.
Anyone who thinks Marvel can't do heralds is on crack.

Bleh. I think these comments were highly prejudicial. r u trying to imply that smoking crack somehow detracts from a persons ability to judge good comics?

Originally posted by Raptor22
I think these comments were highly prejudicial. r u trying to imply that smoking crack somehow detracts from a persons ability to judge good comics?

It's prejudicial to think crack is bad?

Originally posted by Prep-Man
I don't know, man. DC has had some of the BEST writers in the industry crafting their cosmic/mystical mythos. From Sandman (Giaman), Alan Moore, Mike Carey, and now Scott Snyder.

Is there any writer/series in Marvel who wrote a critically acclaimed series like Sandman or Swamp Thing?

Marvel has likewise had some of the best writers in the industry.

And yes, Marvel has had plenty of critically acclaimed series.

Originally posted by Prep-Man
I don't know, man. DC has had some of the BEST writers in the industry crafting their cosmic/mystical mythos. From Sandman (Giaman), Alan Moore, Mike Carey, and now Scott Snyder.

Is there any writer/series in Marvel who wrote a critically acclaimed series like Sandman or Swamp Thing?

Exactly. Its nothing to do with which characters are cooler, or whether you identify with Spiderman over Superman, but how good the writer is. Saying that DC is better, when tomorrow Snyder could be contracted to write for Marvel, doesn't make sense.

An example of this would be Morrison, when he wrote JLA and X-men.

Originally posted by -Pr-
It's prejudicial to think crack is bad? so ur against crack and my bad jokes. I wouldnt want to live under ur dictatorship. We would probably have to worship u AND Aquaman.

Originally posted by Raptor22
so ur against crack and my bad jokes. I wouldnt want to live under ur dictatorship. We would probably have to worship u AND Aquaman.

Probably?

Originally posted by Prep-Man
Is there any writer/series in Marvel who wrote a critically acclaimed series like Sandman or Swamp Thing? Have you ever read Miller's Daredevil?

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Exactly. Its nothing to do with which characters are cooler, or whether you identify with Spiderman over Superman, but how good the writer is. Saying that DC is better, when tomorrow Snyder could be contracted to write for Marvel, doesn't make sense.

An example of this would be Morrison, when he wrote JLA and X-men.

Nah, it's the quality of the characters as well. I don't see say the Celestials or Galactus having their own series. because they are cardboard personalities. Just like Marvel women. DC has a good number of female titles, while Marvel only has 1.

Originally posted by Existere
Have you ever read Miller's Daredevil?

I never said Marvel didn't have quality titles. They have some of the best street levelers runs. What I was referring to was cosmic/mystical types.

Originally posted by Prep-Man
I never said Marvel didn't have quality titles. They have some of the best street levelers runs. What I was referring to was cosmic/mystical types.

Thor, F4/FF, Nova, GoTG, Dr. Strange, SHIELD, etc..

All have had great and critically acclaimed runs.

Abnett/Lanning.

Claremont with the Dark Phoenix.

I guess MArvel don't have a spin-off like Vertigo where they can give their writers free rein to do all their weird stuff, so there IS that...

Again, abstract/godly types. Most of those are top tiers.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Abnett/Lanning.

Claremont with the Dark Phoenix.

I guess MArvel don't have a spin-off like Vertigo where they can give their writers free rein to do all their weird stuff, so there IS that...

Didn't things like Swamp Thing and Hellblazer start off in the DCU, anyway?

Originally posted by Prep-Man
Again, abstract/godly types. Most of those are top tiers.

You said cosmic/mystical, which is exactly what those titles deal with, sometimes both.

And all those titles have dealt with abstract and godly concepts/beings as well.

If you're asking if Marvel specifically has an imprint that deals specifically with the kind of subject matter Vertigo does, the answer is obviously not. But they still have had critically acclaimed titles/series dealing with the arcane and cosmic.

Originally posted by Prep-Man
I never said Marvel didn't have quality titles. They have some of the best street levelers runs. What I was referring to was cosmic/mystical types. Marvel has a different approach to the cosmic, so it's not a black and white comparison

Fantastic Four has consistently been one of the best comics on the market for some time now, and they have been exploring the edges of the Marvel cosmic scene ever since their inception with Stan the Man. The book has a strong sci-fi tone though, and is very angled around individual endeavor with a tone of exploration and adventure - some would say this is often the case with Marvel titles when compared to DC, but your mileage may vary. It's still really good stuff, but very much a different sub-genre than Sandman/Lucifer, Swamp Thing, etc.

Planetary was a critically acclaimed title owned by DC, but its strongest influences lay in Fantastic Four, and the book paid quite a bit of homage to the work and influence Marvel has had on that take on the cosmic scene.

Originally posted by Existere
Marvel has a different approach to the cosmic, so it's not a black and white comparison

Fantastic Four has consistently been one of the best comics on the market for some time now, and they have been exploring the edges of the Marvel cosmic scene ever since their inception with Stan the Man. The book has a strong sci-fi tone though, and is very angled around individual endeavor with a tone of exploration and adventure - some would say this is often the case with Marvel titles when compared to DC, but your mileage may vary. It's still really good stuff, but very much a different sub-genre than Sandman/Lucifer, Swamp Thing, etc.

Planetary was a critically acclaimed title owned by DC, but its strongest influences lay in Fantastic Four, and the book paid quite a bit of homage to the work and influence Marvel has had on that take on the cosmic scene.

Originally posted by Existere
Marvel has a different approach to the cosmic, so it's not a black and white comparison

Fantastic Four has consistently been one of the best comics on the market for some time now, and they have been exploring the edges of the Marvel cosmic scene ever since their inception with Stan the Man. The book has a strong sci-fi tone though, and is very angled around individual endeavor with a tone of exploration and adventure - some would say this is often the case with Marvel titles when compared to DC, but your mileage may vary. It's still really good stuff, but very much a different sub-genre than Sandman/Lucifer, Swamp Thing, etc.

Planetary was a critically acclaimed title owned by DC, but its strongest influences lay in Fantastic Four, and the book paid quite a bit of homage to the work and influence Marvel has had on that take on the cosmic scene.

I agree, FF has had a bunch of good runs, which introduced a bunch of cosmics. I'm just saying, DC's are a bit deeper. Marvel may have things like FF, but DC has had multiple titles doing the same thing.

Adam Strange's series, Challengers of the Unknown, New Gods, Superman, Orion, etc...

Originally posted by Prep-Man
Again, abstract/godly types. Most of those are top tiers. DC places you in the seat of the god, Marvel places you in the seat of the explorer who brushes with the divine. It's not always true, but it's pretty typical of the companies. If you want to look to the Marvel cosmic scene, it'll more often than not be through the lens of a 'top tier'.

Have you ever read Silver Surfer: Requiem?

Oh, you can also ad Legion Of Super-Heroes, REBELS, LEGION, and Omega Men to that list as well.

Originally posted by Existere
DC places you in the seat of the god, Marvel places you in the seat of the explorer who brushes with the divine. It's not always true, but it's pretty typical of the companies. If you want to look to the Marvel cosmic scene, it'll more often than not be through the lens of a 'top tier'.

Have you ever read Silver Surfer: Requiem?

I've only read the first issue. I prefer SS's 90's title to that one.

Originally posted by Raptor22
so ur against crack and my bad jokes. I wouldnt want to live under ur dictatorship. We would probably have to worship u AND Aquaman.

Well, I'm not going to laugh at bad jokes, am I? sneer

Originally posted by Prep-Man
I've only read the first issue. I prefer SS's 90's title to that one. Well... your loss, I guess.

Originally posted by Existere
Well... your loss, I guess.

Did you enjoy his 90's title?

Originally posted by Prep-Man
Did you enjoy his 90's title? I have. To be honest, Surfer with me was always a really strong hit, or '..eh'.

Requiem fell into the former.

Originally posted by Prep-Man
I don't know, man. DC has had some of the BEST writers in the industry crafting their cosmic/mystical mythos. From Sandman (Giaman), Alan Moore, Mike Carey, and now Scott Snyder.

Is there any writer/series in Marvel who wrote a critically acclaimed series like Sandman or Swamp Thing?

Don't forget Grant Morrison.

Originally posted by JakeTheBank yeah this is a hard choice but as much of a dc fan that I am I would choose both why? Well marvel is great at having more characters you can relate to and every good hero needs a greater protagonist and marvels villains dont dissapoint. heck they can grab a boring old powerhouse like hulk and make him complex and relatable(hulk the end) and you feel for his turmoils unlike thor.
Marvel has likewise had some of the best writers in the industry. also marvel has put out more movies with better fan responses.

Dc has there great storylines too and really complex but ultimatly the only characters imo that are relevent is batman and superman. They need to push there other characters more. and another problem with dc is the lame character names and illustrations that feel like they havn't modernize enough just look at amazo hes design screams 50's future space men design. They need to have freasher names and designs. Storywise its a mix bag as some of there older stuff like superman are bad to look at heck back then superman only villian was lex. BUT dc had way better story and crossovers within their mix bags and as of lately it seems they are pushing to make them more modernize.
dc best:
superman vs. aliens, mohammad ali, predator, terminator, marvel, and darkhorse.
best stories:batman beatles missing clues, superman godfall, superman beyond, infinite crisis stories , crisis on two earth, death and reign of supermen,imperiex wars and kingdom come. see thats the problem for me only bats and supes.

marvel best stories: hulk the end, maxium carnage, what ifs,earth x, x-men phenox saga,venom sega, marvel zombies,vampires and wolf, zombies vs. evil dead, days of future past, onslaught saga,civil war, 2099's, and death of the superheros. overall i like spiderman the most. although i would like to be proved wrong and hear good arguments for dc.

And yes, Marvel has had plenty of critically acclaimed series.

Originally posted by Existere true
DC places you in the seat of the god, Marvel places you in the seat of the explorer who brushes with the divine. It's not always true, but it's pretty typical of the companies. If you want to look to the Marvel cosmic scene, it'll more often than not be through the lens of a 'top tier'.

Have you ever read Silver Surfer: Requiem?

Originally posted by Prep-Man
Nah, it's the quality of the characters as well. I don't see say the Celestials or Galactus having their own series. because they are cardboard personalities. Just like Marvel women. DC has a good number of female titles, while Marvel only has 1.

Galactus actually did have a miniseries once

The best Marvel female characters may be on the Runaways cast.

Dear god, you put Superman vs Aliens as one of your top DC reads, and Zombies s Evil Dead/Civil War as one of your top Marvel reads....

Also, LOL:



Galactus, anyone?

Also, did you read Identitiy Crisis, for excample?

Originally posted by -Pr-
Well, I'm not going to laugh at bad jokes, am I? sneer im pretty sure this is a rhetorical question but, if not, taking the previous events into account id have to say, no u r not going to laugh at bad jokes. But a chuckle wouldn't kill ya.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Dear god, you put Superman vs Aliens as one of your top DC reads, and Zombies s Evil Dead/Civil War as one of your top Marvel reads....

Also, LOL:
no, I know predator vs. had bad reviews but I like it . from dc I only like superman expecially as a kid as for marvel I like more spiderman. I for some reason never got into batman but as an adult I really apperciate his movies and stories guess i have add and like more action hmmm lol. Am what you call a casual (really) comic reader and watch more cartoons and movies, I can barely count in one hand How many times i visited a comic store strange because comics always really fasniated me but I guess where I lived there were more video game shops than comic book stores. remember this is all opinion on my part as am not a hardcore reader but I always did buy marvel cards in 90's, read some comics of freands and do wiki searches because comic book characters intrigue me. but like I said not alot of comic shops where I lived and I was mostly expose to marvel through freands but like superman alot so I try not to be bias.


Galactus, anyone?

Also, did you read Identitiy Crisis, for excample?

Originally posted by Bentley
The best Marvel female characters may be on the Runaways cast.

I know Shadowcat had a mini once, but out of all the X-Women, I'd buy a series with her.

Originally posted by Raptor22
im pretty sure this is a rhetorical question but, if not, taking the previous events into account id have to say, no u r not going to laugh at bad jokes. But a chuckle wouldn't kill ya.

Oh, I laughed... At your pain!

Hehe, fair enough.

Some reads for you, not Batman/Superman:

GL: Rebirth
Identitiy Crisis
Swamp Thing: A Murder of Crows (you seem to like crossovers/team books)
JLA (particularyl Morrison's reboot)
Green Arrow (Judd WInick's run)
Gail Simone's run on Secret Six

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Hehe, fair enough.

Some reads for you, not Batman/Superman:

GL: Rebirth
Identitiy Crisis
Swamp Thing: A Murder of Crows (you seem to like crossovers/team books)
JLA (particularyl Morrison's reboot)
Green Arrow (Judd WInick's run)
Gail Simone's run on Secret Six

yeah but I really enjoy stories that deal with cosmic threats(war of gems and secret wars) , end of world and future dis-utopian conflicts like kingdom come and earth x. That and anything spiderman is involved in except that japanese show....

does dc have tragic stories like kingdom come or death of robin?

Morrison's Doom Patrol is up there.

Identity Crisis tugged my heartstrings, def get that.

If you want massive cosmic wars, War of the Lanterns - but really should be reading from Rebirth onwards to get the full story.

Future dystopian futures don't get worse than the JLA: Rock of Ages storyline.

You might enjoy Emperor Joker as well, when the Joker got a hold of Mxy's powers.

Originally posted by Prep-Man
Morrison's Doom Patrol is up there.

Yeah, I thought that, but based off his current faves (Worlds at War, Superman/Aliens etc) I thought I'd ease him in first.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Identity Crisis tugged my heartstrings, def get that.

If you want massive cosmic wars, War of the Lanterns - but really should be reading from Rebirth onwards to get the full story.

Future dystopian futures don't get worse than the JLA: Rock of Ages storyline.

You might enjoy Emperor Joker as well, when the Joker got a hold of Mxy's powers. thanks

Originally posted by Hulkbuster1
yeah but I really enjoy stories that deal with cosmic threats(war of gems and secret wars) , end of world and future dis-utopian conflicts like kingdom come and earth x. That and anything spiderman is involved in except that japanese show....

does dc have tragic stories like kingdom come or death of robin?

death of robin? sure, read death in the family.

Before I starterd coming to comic forums I didn't realize that people had such strong bias towards one company or the other. I always thought comics were comics. Each company has some interesting characters and some not so much. Good plot lines and bad. I always thought a good story was a good story no matter what company it came from.

Originally posted by Raptor22
Before I starterd coming to comic forums I didn't realize that people had such strong bias towards one company or the other. I always thought comics were comics. Each company has some interesting characters and some not so much. Good plot lines and bad. I always thought a good story was a good story no matter what company it came from.

This is very true

Though I do feel Marvels individual titles are generally easier to pick up and read without knowing everything thats going on with all the other tiltles that Marvel has out. For about the last decade or so in DC there always seems to be some sort of company wide crossover that forces u to follow several seperate titles at once in order to follow most of the main story, and each big crossover leads into the next- COIE, Sinestro corps wars, Final crisis, blackest night, brightest day, flash point, and now the new 52. So if u just read one title like Batman and not all the crossovers and tie ins and miss an issue here and there chances are you will be a little lost. Marvel is like that somewhat but not to such a great extent and the huge company spanning crossovers don't happen as frequently and usually don't go one into the next directly into the next and so on.

Vanilla is the best flavor!

Originally posted by -Pr-
Oh, I laughed... At your pain! I think someones been ignoring the sensitivity training that their link provides.

Originally posted by Raptor22
Before I starterd coming to comic forums I didn't realize that people had such strong bias towards one company or the other. I always thought comics were comics. Each company has some interesting characters and some not so much. Good plot lines and bad. I always thought a good story was a good story no matter what company it came from.

While you have a point remember eolution ingrained a competitive spirit within all of us. That said both companies have their ups and downs but at the end of the day they're a business and as such are competiting for our wallets.

Originally posted by Raptor22
I think someones been ignoring the sensitivity training that their link provides.

Originally posted by Prep-Man
I don't know, man. DC has had some of the BEST writers in the industry crafting their cosmic/mystical mythos. From Sandman (Giaman), Alan Moore, Mike Carey, and now Scott Snyder.

Is there any writer/series in Marvel who wrote a critically acclaimed series like Sandman or Swamp Thing? Strange Tales has been rocking for decade brah

For me (your mileage may vary), Marvel and DC have some very different strengths and aspects that I look for.

Marvel rules the streets. DC has a street presence, for sure, but it's either Batman family stories or relatively unknown characters. I don't know how you guys feel, but I read comics for the characters. It's hard to get into a book when I find the hero/heroine rather insignificant, which is part of why I don't care for most of DC's streets. They're so unknown and underdeveloped in the big picture that it seems forced when they stand out, if that makes sense?

DC shines in the space scene, where Marvel has historically lacked. DC titles such as Green Lantern (& spinoffs), LEGION, LoSH, Darkstars, New Gods, etc etc have had great success in sales, longevity, critically acclaimed runs, etc. By contrast, Marvel's space scene consistently lacks in popular heroes and the turnover is pretty high (GotG, Quasar, Nova, etc. are all relatively unknowns).

Then of course there's Vertigo, Wildstorm, etc., which have all found enormous critical success as they've been able to focus on storytelling and character development instead of a forced sales-oriented approach that mainstream DC and Marvel often find themselves stuck with.

Then, as Jake mentioned, DC rules the events. They're consistently bigger, badder, and of a more grand scale and scope than Marvel's. One needs only look at Marvel's recent events to see their level of success (FI, Chaos War, etc). Sure, Marvel's had a lot of success with events in the past, but these days it's weak.

I'm not saying Marvel has nothing going for it, because that would be blatantly false, but DCs been rocking it recently across the board. If you want to talk about the movie scene though....