Loki (A:EMH!) vs. Darkseid (JLU)

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JakeTheBank
Odin Force empowered Loki as seen in the final episodes of Season 1 of Avengers: Earth's Mightiest Heroes!

versus

Brainiac infused Darkseid from the series finale of Justice League Unlimited.

Galan007
Is 'Avengers: Earth's Mightiest Heroes' any good?

JakeTheBank
I like it a lot. Easily one of the best shows Marvel's ever produced if not the best one. It's not quite as good as JL/JLU, but you'd be hard pressed to find a cartoon series that's better than the Timmverse's best.

Of course, Jeph Loeb is likely going to see that it gets cancelled in favor for a new Avengers series which compliments Ultimate Spider-Man. ermm

Galan007
Hmm. mmm

You've convinced me to DL it. thumb up

JakeTheBank
I don't think you'll be disappointed. It's generally lighter than the Timmverse stuff, which got pretty dark for a "kid's cartoon", but it's still pretty fun.

byrdgang21
Originally posted by Galan007
Hmm. mmm

You've convinced me to DL it. thumb up

It's on Netflix too if you have that

Zack Fair
Watch it Galan. Show is quite fun and truthful to the source material...well for the most part.

Estacado
Originally posted by Galan007
Is 'Avengers: Earth's Mightiest Heroes' any good?
The art is not that good but some of the battles are superb!!!

Galan007
Okay so after watching the final episodes of season 1, I feel pretty confident in saying that Loki /w/ Odinforce would win with a fair amount of ease. Superman alone was beating the bejesus out of the Darkseid/Brainiac amalgam one-on-one, until DS used tech (the agony matrix, I think it was called?) to gain the upper hand.

Loki, on the other hand, beat the collective Avengers lineup with literal gestures. He was a LOT more impressive.

Estacado
Originally posted by Galan007
Okay so after watching the final episodes of season 1, I feel pretty confident in saying that Loki /w/ Odinforce would win with a fair amount of ease. Superman alone was beating the bejesus out of the Darkseid/Brainiac amalgam one-on-one, until DS used tech (the agony matrix, I think it was called?) to gain the upper hand.

Loki, on the other hand, beat the collective Avengers lineup with literal gestures. He was a LOT more impressive.
So do you like it?

Galan007
The episodes I watched were really good. Good enough that I'm now DL'ing the entire first season. smile

Estacado
Originally posted by Galan007
The episodes I watched were really good. Good enough that I'm now DL'ing the entire first season. smile
thumb up
I have to start watching season 2...

Endless Mike
From what I've seen so far it's good

JakeTheBank
Originally posted by Galan007
Okay so after watching the final episodes of season 1, I feel pretty confident in saying that Loki /w/ Odinforce would win with a fair amount of ease. Superman alone was beating the bejesus out of the Darkseid/Brainiac amalgam one-on-one, until DS used tech (the agony matrix, I think it was called?) to gain the upper hand.

Loki, on the other hand, beat the collective Avengers lineup with literal gestures. He was a LOT more impressive.

Glad you like them.

And those are good points, but one thing I think some people gloss over is that Superman's "no holding back" punches, while they did send Darkseid flying across Metropolis, once he landed and activated the Agony Matrix, he literally seemed no worse for the wear. He just activated the tech and monologued about whatever until Lex showed up with the ALE and they both BFRed themselves out of the picture. To be able to stand after Superman's best punches was mightily impressive.

Conversely, Loki, using Gungnir, was able to destroy Cap's shield, which is highly impressive as well.

Starscream M
Originally posted by JakeTheBank
you'd be hard pressed to find a cartoon series that's better than the Timmverse's best.
ermm btas

jalek moye
Originally posted by Starscream M
btas

Thats part of Timmverse and as a whole < JLU imo

Endless Mike
Originally posted by JakeTheBank
Glad you like them.

And those are good points, but one thing I think some people gloss over is that Superman's "no holding back" punches, while they did send Darkseid flying across Metropolis, once he landed and activated the Agony Matrix, he literally seemed no worse for the wear. He just activated the tech and monologued about whatever until Lex showed up with the ALE and they both BFRed themselves out of the picture. To be able to stand after Superman's best punches was mightily impressive.

Conversely, Loki, using Gungnir, was able to destroy Cap's shield, which is highly impressive as well.

Does the shield have any good durability feats in the cartoon?

JakeTheBank
Originally posted by Endless Mike
Does the shield have any good durability feats in the cartoon?

It's withstood Mjolnir strikes, Hulk's punches, Kang and Ultron's energy blasts, etc.

CosmicComet
Originally posted by Starscream M
btas

way to fail.

Galan007
Originally posted by JakeTheBank
Glad you like them.

And those are good points, but one thing I think some people gloss over is that Superman's "no holding back" punches, while they did send Darkseid flying across Metropolis, once he landed and activated the Agony Matrix, he literally seemed no worse for the wear. He just activated the tech and monologued about whatever until Lex showed up with the ALE and they both BFRed themselves out of the picture. To be able to stand after Superman's best punches was mightily impressive.

Conversely, Loki, using Gungnir, was able to destroy Cap's shield, which is highly impressive as well. It's true that DS wasn't really damaged from Superman's melee, but he still appeared totally defenseless.

As far as displayed power goes, Loki seemed a good margin superior.

CosmicComet
There's no shame in being on the losing end to animated Superman going all out.

He's thousands of times faster than anyone on Avengers EHM.

I don't think Loki would be able to do anything about the Agony Matrix.

psycho gundam
Originally posted by CosmicComet
There's no shame in being on the losing end to animated Superman going all out. superman lost that fight anyway

coincidence? nah evil face

CosmicComet
JLU Superman could solo everyone in EHM if he wanted though.

No joke.

psycho gundam
except hulk

CosmicComet
Him too.

Big target. No flight. No speed feats whatsoever.

psycho gundam
doesn't need speed, just uses the same thing darkseid/grundy used: being simply strong enough to withstand the speed onslaught till superman's puss mode reestablishes itself and then hulk uses the pain matrix (aka repeated punches to superman's skull)

CosmicComet
They used plot convenience?

Wouldn't happen here, as its a hypothetical fight, not an episode we are writing that's meant to contain some semblance of conflict and struggle even when its not realistic to the situation.

Rage.Of.Olympus
Originally posted by CosmicComet
JLU Superman could solo everyone in EHM if he wanted though.

No joke.

Lol, it's like you didn't watch either shows at all.

psycho gundam
grundy with an imitation of hulk's power wrecked the league (superman included)

CosmicComet
Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Lol, it's like you didn't watch either shows at all.

Actually, if you recall, in previous threads like this I argued for EHM Thor over JLU Superman quite fiercely.

Too bad I went back and watched his feats across Superman TAS and JL/JLU again.

Yeah, he speed blitzes the entire EHM roster quite easily if he's letting off the kid gloves. Seeing as he's easily thousands upon thousands of times faster than any of them.

Rage.Of.Olympus
I've watched every appearance of the big blue in the animated verse. Superman would lose to either Hulk or Thor bro.

The former is potent enough physically to tank any blitz, and the latter is powerful/versatile enough to counter.

As a matter of fact, Thor can fly as fast as Superman -or faster- without Mjolnir.

JakeTheBank
Not that I want to derail my own thread, but what speed feats did the Timmverse Superman perform to suggest him being able to solo the entire Avengers roster?

CosmicComet
Who's talking about flight speed? (not that I'm sure Thor's flight speed is greater than Superman's at all here, both have gone from from Earth to space in a mere seconds and other stuff) I'm talking about Superman's physical speed and reflexes, he's massively hypersonic by feats in S:TAS/JL/JLU.

Being durable enough to take a few punches doesn't mean you are suddenly going to be able to mount an offense AT ALL.

Thor and Hulk are no higher in reflexes than any other fit human like Cap.

With PIS off, they are going to be slugs.

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
Not that I want to derail my own thread, but what speed feats did the Timmverse Superman perform to suggest him being able to solo the entire Avengers roster?

i'll respond in more detail tomorrow if you're still interested. good night for now. It partly has to do with the Flash race episode.

Rage.Of.Olympus
Originally posted by CosmicComet
Who's talking about flight speed? (not that I'm sure Thor's flight speed is greater than Superman's at all here, both have gone from from Earth to space in a mere seconds and other stuff) I'm talking about Superman's physical speed and reflexes, he's massively hypersonic by feats in S:TAS/JL/JLU.

Being durable enough to take a few punches doesn't mean you are suddenly going to be able to mount an offense AT ALL.

Thor and Hulk are no higher in reflexes than any other fit human like Cap.

Flight speed being on par is noteworthy because of how Superman usually charges at someone. Not sure about that.

Not really. Thor's tough enough to be able to counter with lighting and Hulk when pushed is strong enough that he could reach a state where he simply tanks the shit.

Originally posted by CosmicComet
With PIS off, they are going to be slugs.

So basically were not talking about how a fight would likely go but how you want it to?

Yea, fanboy nonsense is just that. You think Superman illustrated the required combination of sustained speed and strength level to batter someone like Thor and Hulk unconscious, how about you send an episode my way because I'm drawing a blank here.

Mongul, Doomsday, Lobo, Metallo, Darkseid, Grundy and like every other brick/monster that Superman has fought laughs at this argument.

Diesldude
The hulk physically taking on superman is a fail. Darkseid couldn't hang with non holding back sups and had to use a plot device, hulk has no such device.

Zack Fair
Hulk kind of has a glass jaw.

Estacado
Originally posted by CosmicComet
JLU Superman could solo everyone in EHM if he wanted though.

No joke.
Lulz...Thor would fcuk him up badly.

JakeTheBank
Originally posted by Diesldude
The hulk physically taking on superman is a fail. Darkseid couldn't hang with non holding back sups and had to use a plot device, hulk has no such device.

According to feats, which physical feats of Darkseid suggest that he's clearly beyond Hulk in the Timmverse?

And Darkseid basically no sold Superman's non holding back punches anyway. He literally got up, slapped the Agony Matrix on him and was uninjured.

Galan007
Originally posted by psycho gundam
grundy with an imitation of hulk's power wrecked the league (superman included) JLU Grundy > JLU Amazo. The guy was too powerful.

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
According to feats, which physical feats of Darkseid suggest that he's clearly beyond Hulk in the Timmverse?

And Darkseid basically no sold Superman's non holding back punches anyway. He literally got up, slapped the Agony Matrix on him and was uninjured. Loki beating the entire Avengers roster with literal gestures trumps Darkseid tanking Superman's punches, before using tech to gain the upper hand, imo.

I wonder what'd happen to Darkseid if Loki use Gungnir on him in the same manner he used it on Cap's shield?

psycho gundam
Originally posted by Galan007
JLU Grundy > JLU Amazo. The guy was too powerful. we both know that's not really true. imo, amazo's new-found CIP screwed him up more than anything else. he could have bfr'd him like he did oa, or remembered that he already had an nth metal template....or better yet he could have copied grundy's power no expression. him having to teleport out of the entire series for good was PIS

iirc grundy beat on some other characters after amazo departed, and this was after the revelation his power is "without limit".

/tangent

Galan007
^ I can't recall all the particulars off hand, but wasn't Grundy able to absorb Amazo's powers, without Amazo being able to defend? If that was the case, perhaps Grundy could have simply absorbed the energy Amazo uses to BFR?

...Or it was just a classic case of CIS, as you said. stick out tongue

iceman24567
Whatever was powering Grundy was tapping into Amazos power

Rage.Of.Olympus
Amazo was now a hero facing a single threat during a team up.

He was going to get jobbed one way or another, that's just how these things work. Better to just not have included him in the battle.

psycho gundam
amazo also copied the ninja-law on his space voyage

CosmicComet
Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Flight speed being on par is noteworthy because of how Superman usually charges at someone. Not sure about that.

Not really. Thor's tough enough to be able to counter with lighting and Hulk when pushed is strong enough that he could reach a state where he simply tanks the shit.

Not really, what?

Again, the speed argument is absolutely immutable on your behalf.

Thor and Hulk are durable enough to take plenty of blows from Superman, but they have absolutely no reflex feats whatsoever to suggest they would be able to mount a comeback offense at all, unless Superman LETS them.

Again, Thor, and Hulk, are no quicker on the draw than Captain America on the show.

They will take maybe a full second or so to register that they've been hit multiple times by Superman, make visual contact with Supes, and then attempt to throw an attack back.

While one second may seem like an insignificant amount of time for Thor and Hulk, one second is a very long time for Superman's perception speed.



Not quite, we're talking about how the fight will go if accurately portrayed, not how you would want it to go.

What you are wanting to happen, is that Superman punches (since you basically admit that they will have no choice but to get punched by him), and then he chooses to stay-put while slow motion punches come his way and deliberately takes them in order to sabotage his own chances of winning, which is of course, absurd.

And no, those bricks don't laugh at the argument, seeing as Darkseid couldn't lay a single hand on Superman once Clark got serious.

All the bricks laying hands on Supes, has already been accounted for;

At best for them, they simply get the argument that their reflexes are fast enough to tag Supes, at worst, they simply have the benefit of plot convenience which demands for some semblance of tension, and/or PIS/CIS/Idiot Ball moment and what not. The latter of which is the most likely explanation, seeing as (a) Darkseid got casually blitzed by Superman once Clark tried and (b) Superman has on screen stated before in JL/JLU that he deliberately takes a lot of hits because he's the 'invulnerable one' and that 'every shot i take is a shot my team-mates don't have to'.

So there, specifically said that he allows himself to be hit at times to draw attention towards him and away from his comrades, along with a statement that he's constantly holding back, and backed that statement up by toying with and blitzing one of the top bricks in the show (Brainiac-infused Darseid).

Maybe if Hulk or Thor ever even managed to tag someone even a portion as fast as Superman in EHM, then the argument could be made that they would--barring of course the counter that the speedster may have been jobbing, just as Supes sometimes does with far slower people.

As always, there is no argument against the speed argument. Just the usual, hollow route of hoping Superman fights like an idiot in a hypothetical fight where there is no plot/story consideration in place that would make sense for him to fight like an idiot.

Basically, the argument unwittingly admits that the only way for Thor or Hulk to win is if Superman grants them the chance of a win. The argument isn't that they have any sort of counter for the speed, just that they expect Superman to not use his power as well as he could. It's why I've always found it amusing.

This has nothing to do with fanboy-ism. It's acknowledging the significance and meaning of feats, the only objective way to debate. Not acknowledging/ignoring the meaning of feats and coming up with some way for them not to matter is the fan-boy-ism route.

This is why I so definitely argued for EHM Thor over JLU Superman in the past despite being more of a Superman fan, because from my recollection I didn't remember any awesome speed feats for Superman that would make for trouble, nor did I remember any power displays that stacked up against that 'Graviton buster' level lightning bolt that Thor displayed. Or a strength level on par with slowing down Manhattan.

But then I watched episodes and clips of STAS/JL/JLU again.

And I realized Superman on the show has dodged cloud-to-ground lightning against Captain Marvel, and even outran a lightning bolt from Weather Wizard iirc. He also had a foot-race against Flash in which both were being tracked by satellite, and the speed they showed would have allowed them to cross the width of Australia in a few minutes or less--and they were passing through cities too during their race and didn't run into any buildings or cars whatsoever. All of that is massively hypersonic in speed and reflexes, and all of that is thus thousands upon thousands of times above Thor or Hulk's reflexes in EHM. And being thousands of times faster in reflexes and raw speed is far more than needed to blitz someone.

I also saw that Superman once spread the width of his HV so far that it basically covered spanned several city blocks, to take out a whole bunch of parademons--which is at least on par with Thor's final lightning against Graviton as I mentioned before, in collateral damage. Not to mention, this is the same heat vision that was hot enough to easily pierce through Doomsday's skull the first time around, the same doomsday who was talking just seconds before about how his skin has easily withstood nuclear explosions. So just imagine how hot that has to be, likely millions of degrees celcius.

And about Thor slowing down Manhattan falling on him from Graviton, as flashy as that feat was, I realized that Superman had a strength feat from STAS that handily matches or beat it. He was able to slow down/redirect a huge meteor that would have destroyed all of metropolis or more--iirc darkseid actually sent the meteor to destroy all life on earth, so if that's true it would have been at the very least equal to the KT extinction event. A large chunk of it broke off too after a bit and ended up exploding in supergirl's face, and she ended only being ko'd for a bit. Which makes for great power-scaling for Superman's durability vs Thor's durability showing against Kang's potential new york city busting lazer blast from the mother ship.

Superman would own any of the Avengers in EHM. I'm sorry. He's far faster than any of them, and he's at least as strong and durable as Thor/Hulk.

Galan007
Holy phuck that was a long post. g_twitch

carver9
Lol @ some of the stuff being said here. Thor and Hulk are clearly more powerful than anyone on the JLA.

jalek moye
Originally posted by carver9
Lol @ some of the stuff being said here. Thor and Hulk are clearly more powerful than anyone on the JLA.

Didn't you claim, Timmverse supes > new Earth supes?

carver9
EDIT.

carver9
Originally posted by jalek moye
Didn't you claim, Timmverse supes > new Earth supes?

Never...the only thing I ever discussed about anyone vs the two companies is when I said Frieza could solo both verses without breaking a sweat.

jalek moye
Originally posted by carver9
Never...the only thing I ever discussed about anyone vs the two companies is when I said Frieza could solo both verses without breaking a sweat.

What? Timmverse is just some of the DC animated shows. It's not some other company

carver9
Originally posted by jalek moye
What? Timmverse is just some of the DC animated shows. It's not some other company

I know.

jalek moye
Originally posted by carver9
I know.

Then why'd you bring up someone vs the two companies at all?

Mine was about superman vs another version of superman

carver9
Originally posted by jalek moye
Then why'd you bring up someone vs the two companies at all?

Mine was about superman vs another version of superman

I dont remember saying that though.

Hellos
Originally posted by CosmicComet
JLU Superman could solo everyone in EHM if he wanted though.

No joke.

Here's the problem champ, the actual physical strength difference between EMH's Thor / Hulk compared to the JLU's Superman is immense, to the point him actually physically hurting them would be mind boggling.

To grind that point home: The Graviton Fight.
watch?v=qyM7LsOXQDk

5:45
Giant Man replicates JLU Superman's best strength feat, lifting a cargo ship, then proceeds to toss it at Graviton from water. Superman wasn't that strong.
6:00
Thor throws an attack from the sky that I would place heavy doubt Superman would dodge, given far less giant attacks have tagged him and given the slew of showing of him getting owned by electricity, I'd be shocked if it didn't kill him.

To bring the point home in terms of how much stronger Thor was depicted as in the series:
watch?v=_p4FSE3QG-o&feature=related

12:26
Graviton lifts a massive chunk of the city from the ground.
13:20
Thor catches it and slows it's descent to the ocean floor. This makes him leagues, leagues stronger than Superman was physically in JLU.

Then when Khang pulls a Deathstar and begins charging up a blast that is going to level New York.
watch?v=9cIB_SsdcuM&feature=related

3:24
Thor proceeds to speed down to tank it and deflect the damn thing right back into Khang's ship. It knocks him out, but otherwise it makes Superman's watchtower tanking feat a lot less impressive.

But what also should be mentioned is the sheer inconsistency that was Superman from his own series and the JLA-JLU. His powers varied tremendously, the fight against Darkseid was essentially fan service given complaints about how weak we was. That was a brief momentary power up by the gods that be, which even if considered does not make a good case for him being able to hurt Thor. Blitz? Sure. Do any damage? Unlikely.

As for this fight, if I recall Loki was putting out enough juice to destroy the realms themselves from that uncontrolled power. That blows any threat Darkseid posed out of the water by a mile.

ares834
Loki stomps.

As for Superman vs the Avengers... He loses. But he can give Thor or Hulk a fight.


Originally posted by Hellos

5:45
Giant Man replicates JLU Superman's best strength feat, lifting a cargo ship, then proceeds to toss it at Graviton from water. Superman wasn't that strong.

That's not close to Superman's greatest strength feat. In Little Girl Lost, he stopped a planet destroying meteor.



He is actually shown to dodge lightning several times in the series like in his fight against CM and the Weather Wizard.




Not really no. Superman stopping a planet destroying comet is more impressive.



Quite impressive. But where is it stated that it would destroy NY? Pym states it will destroy "everything" which is clear hyperbole. Regardless, Supes is able to hurt DD who is stated to be able to tank Nukes.



Wrong. It's not some brief power up, that's him not holding back. That's how strong he actually is as stated in the dialogue.

Hellos
That's not close to Superman's greatest strength feat. In Little Girl Lost, he stopped a planet destroying meteor.

Are you talking about that meteor that Supergirl flies through and knocks herself out on? Because Superman in that series struggled lifting a falling crane, much less planet destroying meteors. That just comes off not only incredibly inconsistent, but idiotic for the writers if he did anything close.

Not really no. Superman stopping a planet destroying comet is more impressive.

Comet? Are you joking?
Anyhow, feel free to post a link to this "planet destroying comet". I'd love to see it.

Quite impressive. But where is it stated that it would destroy NY? Pym states it will destroy "everything" which is clear hyperbole. Regardless, Supes is able to hurt DD who is stated to be able to tank Nukes.

You're taking the word everything out of context.
"But we're right over the city, a blast that size will destroy everything."
He isn't talking about the Earth, the universe or "everything" Pym's referring to the city below. Given the sheer destruction Graviton did, as Khang's whole invasion across the globe, the stakes are set high, not to galactic proportions.

Maybe Kree Bomb was planet busting, I'm not sure. But this was a city buster.

Wrong. It's not some brief power up, that's him not holding back. That's how strong he actually is as stated in the dialogue.

So your trying to say he's been that strong his own series and the entirety of the JLA / JLU? No, that isn't the case. Otherwise that power would have been applied countless other times, especially when he was completely enraged at Darkseid and went to slug out with him. He received a fanservice bump in the last episode, power that wasn't remotely consistent with his already shaky record in his own series.



Show me him dodging a blast of lightning that encompasses multiple skyscrappers and levels them. Superman's been hit by just about every blast energy pointed at him in the series, lightning or not. Trying to play him out to be this hyper sonic untouchable character is ridiculous, him dodging quite literally a giant lightning bolt that large isn't something he ever did in the series.

ares834
Originally posted by Hellos
Are you talking about that meteor that Supergirl flies through and knocks herself out on? Because Superman in that series struggled lifting a falling crane, much less planet destroying meteors. That just comes off not only incredibly inconsistent, but idiotic for the writers if he did anything close.

A portion falls off that threatens to destroy Metropolis and Supergirl busts it, yes. And it's a cartoon, they typically are wildly inconsistent.



http://movpod.in/iinfgkcknkvj

At about 18:30.



Perhaps. My point is you are determining what Pym stated rather then presenting what is actually said. In this context "everything" may refer to the city or it could simply be hyperbole. Honestly, I'd go with the former but I'm just presenting it as a possibility.



Said "fanservice bump" is canon to Supes. And their is an in-universe explanation for it regardless if you like it or not.




I did not say that he would dodge it, but rather presented evidence suggesting that he could. Furthermore, if we wish to play the inconsistency card, I could argue that this lightning blast is inconsistent with Thor in the rest of the series. And no I'm not saying Superman is untouchable. In fact, I'm inclined to believe he would slug it out with Thor at "normal" speeds as he usually does.

Hellos
Sorry for the wait, I had to watch the entire episode on this.

Originally posted by ares834
A portion falls off that threatens to destroy Metropolis and Supergirl busts it, yes. And it's a cartoon, they typically are wildly inconsistent.

At about 18:30.


Cartoons come in all shapes in sizes, when I say inconsistent I'm referring to Superman's level of power here, not across the entire medium. Laughably enough, this is the episode I always remembered Superman and Supergirl getting floored by electric whips, just couldn't even remember the name. Didn't remember the electric collar though.

And it was a comet that would somehow cover the Earth in dust on impact, extinguishing all life the dinosaur way. What an attack on anyone's intelligence this episode was. From magnets to pull a ball of ice and rock in to the Earth's direction, to how in gods name something that small, traveling that slow could do anything to Earth.

Regardless, lets break it down:
- Superman couldn't stop it. It was pushing him and it was still heading straight into the planet.
- It actually breaks nearly in half due to Superman's struggles, what a brittle weak earth ender this is.
- The large chunk of it that breaks off is easily destroyed by Super Girl causing no collateral damage, which the exception of knocking her clear out.
- For some godly unknown reason Superman is now able to change it's course, not slow down or stop it.

I'd considering lifting an entire cargo ship, easily much larger than this comet a MUCH better feat. A feat that actually we can come up with a number, 10,000 tons. TAS Superman, wasn't that strong, same character, but none the less the guy that couldn't stop a crane from falling from a building or even this comet, wasn't that strong. In this episode he's actually having to exert effort to move debris out of way, it's ridiculous.

We can choose to disagree, but based off this showing, Giant Man is stronger than Superman.

Perhaps. My point is you are determining what Pym stated rather then presenting what is actually said. In this context "everything" may refer to the city or it could simply be hyperbole. Honestly, I'd go with the former but I'm just presenting it as a possibility.

The word "everything" by itself is hyperbole, but Pym establishing they are over the city and it's depicted as targeting Avenger Mansion. It doesn't take leaps or bounds in logic to understand what Pym's referring to. Much less given Thor's actual showings of his own destructive power, city busting shots to knock him unconscious seems reasonable. Especially when Loki later is being hyped into a being that will destroy Earth and the rest of the realm's through Odin's power uncontrolled.

Said "fanservice bump" is canon to Supes. And their is an in-universe explanation for it regardless if you like it or not.

Sure, so is him not stopping a crane from falling from a skyscrapper. Getting beaten half to death by Wonder Woman. Getting brought down by electricity more times than I can count. He has a plethora of low showings, one brief moment of actual power that was outright said to have been done due to fan complaints is certainly canon and just inconsistent as everything else. It's not about whether I like or not, I'm pointing out a clear fact of matter. His range was from struggling to lift bus and not being as fast as the Flash, suddenly the last episode has him the strongest member of the JLU.

I did not say that he would dodge it, but rather presented evidence suggesting that he could. Furthermore, if we wish to play the inconsistency card, I could argue that this lightning blast is inconsistent with Thor in the rest of the series. And no I'm not saying Superman is untouchable. In fact, I'm inclined to believe he would slug it out with Thor at "normal" speeds as he usually does.

I'd say it is damn unlikely he will, given the plethora of much smaller, slower moving attacks that have hit him in the past.

Inconsistent? Did Thor struggle to produce similar results? As far as I remember from watching the series, Thor doesn't replicate those lifting or lightning feats from that episode(haven't watched the new season yet), but he hasn't had to. He's depicted as one of the most powerful characters on the team, if not the most powerful. There is a reason why the bad guys end up teaming up against him or they have to remove him from fights / situations entirely. Hell when they thought he was dead, his immediate return consisted of him tearing Ultron apart in single strikes when the rest of the team was struggling against him.

ares834
So if you don't like the feat you disregard it. Gotcha. As for the comet, it's not only the size that counts but the velocity as well.

Hellos
Originally posted by ares834
So if you don't like the feat you disregard it. Gotcha. As for the comet, it's not only the size that counts but the velocity as well.

Well can you tell if this feat actually was a better strength feat than lifting something that was 10 thousand tons? Because seeing Superman fail to stop it or even slow it down doesn't fill me to the brim of confidence that it is. So again, does it require more than 10 thousand tons of strength to nudge that comet up?

Just ignore the part where I mention how dirt slow and small the comet is. If the comet isn't big enough to even survive entry(which in this TAS episode, doesn't even seem to burn things entering the Earth's atmosphere)it isn't much of an civilization ender, which is more the size of Texas rather than the size of a house(which is on the small size of comets).

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