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The Phantom vs The Batman
http://img521.imageshack.us/img521/7524/thephantom.pnghttp://img842.imageshack.us/img842/2299/baaaae.png

Phantom biography

The Phantom or; The Ghost Who Walks, The Man Who Cannot Die and Guardian of the Eastern Dark as are his other titles is a guardian of the bengali jungles. There is a myth featuring The Ghost Who Walks, a powerful and indestructible guardian of the innocent and fighter of all types of injustice. Because he seems to have existed for generations, many believe him to be immortal. In reality, the Phantom is a legacy hero, descended from 20 previous generations of crimefighters who all adopt the same persona. When a new Phantom takes the task from his dying father, he swears the Oath of the Skull: "I swear to devote my life to the destruction of piracy, greed, cruelty, and injustice, in all their forms, and my sons and their sons shall follow me".

Expert in

1 Weapon Master
2 Unarmed Combat
3 Agility
4 Stamina
5 Marksmanship
6 Stealth
7 Power Item
8 Animal Control
9 Swordsmanship
10 Tracking
11 Attractive Male
12 Insanely Rich
13 Intellect
14 Escape Artist
15 Leadership


Batman Biography

As a child, billionaire Bruce Wayne watched helplessly as his parents Thomas and Martha were shot and killed by a petty mugger named Joe Chill. Upon witnessing their deaths, the young Wayne took an oath of vengeance against crime so that no one else would have to suffer the tragedy that he had. Wayne spent years venturing the world, learning many forms of combat and training himself to physical and intellectual perfection. Upon his return to Gotham, Wayne delved into crime-fighting, with disastrous results. As the injured young man sat alone in his study dwelling upon his dilemma and the fact that criminals are a "cowardly, superstitious lot", he figured that the best way to get to them was through sheer terror. At that moment, as if a sign from God, a huge bat flew in through his study window. This bat provided Bruce with the inspiration he had been searching for. He donned a costume complete with a long, black cape and a cowl with huge, pointed ears and became the creature the criminals of Gotham would now know and fear: The Dark Knight... Batman.

Expert in

1 Intellect
2 Insanely Rich
3 Gadgets
4 Unarmed Combat
5 Agility
6 Weapon Master
7 Power Suit
8 Attractive Male
9 Stamina
10 Escape Artist
11 Leadership
12 Swordsmanship
13 Tracking
14 Marksmanship
15 Stealth

The battle takes place in a rocky landscape. Batman has his suit and his many gadgets, the phantom has his guns and a 18th century sword. There is no preparation and the characters have no morals at all, they fight to kill. The Phantom has his jungle reflexes and weapons expertise behind him. While Batman has a bullet proof west and many tools at his disposal. Who will win this battle; Tarzan with guns and the intellect of a samurai warrior or the ninja with the most durable suit in the world.

It took some time finding those images now DEBATE!

The Ghost is awesome, but I don't see him gaining the upper hand against The Goddamn Batman.

billy zane wins. the phantom loses.

Since there is no prep I think Phantom stomps, he is just overall a better fighter. Batman has his suit that could protect him from some of the phantom's bullets. But that is about it, if the phantom gets close to Batman the Batman is dead. Also the Phantom has more impressive combat feats. Plus Batman has been exeggerrated to the point of inacurracy. He is just a high tech ninja, yet he is often compared to Super man and others in terms of capability to kick ass. He is just human after all..

Which character debuted first in media? Just wondering.

Anyone have any h2h feats for Phantom?

Originally posted by Mumrik
Since there is no prep I think Phantom stomps, he is just overall a better fighter. Batman has his suit that could protect him from some of the phantom's bullets. But that is about it, if the phantom gets close to Batman the Batman is dead. Also the Phantom has more impressive combat feats. Plus Batman has been exeggerrated to the point of inacurracy. He is just a high tech ninja, yet he is often compared to Super man and others in terms of capability to kick ass. He is just human after all..

Batman is one of the top martial artist in his universe. He hang and he's respected by Superman and he's deemed as one of the most dangerous member of the JLA, who is consisted by said Superman, Martian Manhunter and a plethora of bad asses (Aquaman non included). If Phanton is a better overall fighter, which can be argued a lot (IMO, Batman crush him), Batman still has all his toys, and his super brain.

At the end of the day, Batman kick his butt, one way or another.

I think that would be the phantom; 1936.

There are over 12000+ comic books featuring the phantom only. Sadly there aren't too many fans of him that uses the web since most of these comics are from 1960-2000. I got a few from my childhood, let's see what I can recall.

-Wrestling and beating a orangutang.
-Won over red beard, basically a infamous viking pirate. (Could crush a coconut with his hand)
-Wrestled and won over lions and tigers in fistfights.

Well there are a lot more, but he is basically a powerhouse. Batman wouldn't have a chance against a lion in hand to hand battle. If you want proof I could dig out and scan some impressive feats in.

I found this online, when he defeated a necromancer and his demons...

http://www.karileppanencomics.fi/devilforrest%202.jpg
http://www.karileppanencomics.fi/english-devilforrest%201.jpg

Ah. Seems like he is almost Conan of the jungle, lol. Him defeating necromancers and demons makes me think of some of the other worldly things Conan has defeated.

Seems like this would be quite a matchup against Bruce...

Originally posted by Mumrik
It took some time finding those images now DEBATE!

their is nothing to debate.. Batman takes care of business..

I wouldn't be putting the bat against the phantom if the outcome couldn't be debated. I can tell you're a batman fanboy, but you know believing something to be true doesn't mean it is. Prove he is better or accept that he is not.

Originally posted by Mumrik
Batman wouldn't have a chance against a lion in hand to hand battle.

This is a joke, right? He's fought Solomon Grundy and won, iirc. And even ignoring that feat (because, let's be honest, it's a bit ridiculous) he's got hundreds of wins over enemies that are at least Lion+

Phantom's cool. One of the originals. But I feel like proving any version of him wins is an uphill battle.

Originally posted by Digi
This is a joke, right? He's fought Solomon Grundy and won, iirc. And even ignoring that feat (because, let's be honest, it's a bit ridiculous) he's got hundreds of wins over enemies that are at least Lion+

Phantom's cool. One of the originals. But I feel like proving any version of him wins is an uphill battle. Batman also schooled several gorillas h2h.

Gorilla are powerful but not very smart and Batman is somewhere between athlete and peak human and is a master of fight techniques but imo Gorillas are stronger

Originally posted by Digi
This is a joke, right? He's fought Solomon Grundy and won, iirc. And even ignoring that feat (because, let's be honest, it's a bit ridiculous) he's got hundreds of wins over enemies that are at least Lion+

Phantom's cool. One of the originals. But I feel like proving any version of him wins is an uphill battle. There is no NORMAL human on earth that could take on a lion without being stomped. Like take for example one of Batman's opponents Bane. he wouldn's survive a lion. Especially not a barbary lion...which I think was what the phantom defeated.
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Sultan_the_Barbary_Lion.jpg/250px-Sultan_the_Barbary_Lion.jpg
Also here I found a durability feat, he survived a hanging...was buried alive and managed to escape. Nothing Bruce Vayne would be able to do, his neck would have snapped.
http://www.karileppanencomics.fi/wild%20image%201.jpg
Also here is him fighting a tiger...
http://www.karileppanencomics.fi/english%20extrajobs%20image-8.jpghttp://www.karileppanencomics.fi/english%20extrajobs%20image-7.jpg

Also I remember although cannot find the comic online, that the phantom pulled the sword of excalibur out of the stone and actually guided Arthur to it. Can't recall exactly what happened...another strenght feat Batman could only hope of accomplishing. Also here is Redbeard, the viking pirate. 2.5 meters tall with incredible strenght. Batman fought and won over him...I remember it was a close call though.
http://seriewikin.serieframjandet.se/images/5/5d/R%C3%B6dsk%C3%A4gg.png

Batman couldn't wrestle a barbary lion to the ground, his neck would snap like that and he would also have problem with a tiger. And yes he would get his ass kicked by almost anyone from the past centuries...inclduing red beard. People were naturally stronger back then. Playboy rich kid Bruce Vayne is nothing compared to viking pirates of the past.

Phantom stomps Batman...well...if he can get to him. But that shouldn't be a problem, he has better stealth than Batman having grown up in the jungle.

Batman has tangled with wild animals plenty of times.

Pretty sure he wrestled down some wild buffalo before.

And that's 1,200-2000 lbs of animal. A lot bigger and stronger than any single big cat.

Depends on what kind of wild buffalo. If it's more or less cattle, then you know it's possible to grab their neck in such a way that they are forced to lay down. If it's a bison...well dream on. He must have sedated it or something. It's just not possible for any human to wrestle down a bison. Not even Captain America would be able to do that.

The sole reason phantom was able to defeat a lion and tigers and such in h2h combat is because of the fact that he has grown up in the jungle since birth and actually been trained for the day he will become the phantom. Bruce wayne went for ninja training for how many years? 2-3? The phantom we are talking about is probably in his prime around 25-30 years old. That is 30 years of wild fighting training in the jungle. Not to mention the expert weapons training.

Thing with Batman is that he needs prepartaion or a plan before heading into battle. He isn't a warrior more of a ninja, he needs to rely on stealth and the cover of darkness to really take on anyone. Sure the cliffs might benefit him since they are dark and there are a lot of places to hide. The only way Batman could get the upper hand is if he somehow uses his many tools like smoke bombs and tear gas and then ambushes the phantom.

Maybe uses his batarang as a knife in close combat. Still...the phantom's strenght alone would probably overwhelm Batman. Question is how the phantom would kill him, his protective suit actually renders the sword useless. He could maybe shoot him in the mouth, but the gun would be hard to use among the cliffs. If he gets him in close combat I guess he could break the Batman's spine...but maybe his outfit will protect him...

I think Batmans area under the jaw throat area isn't as heavy armored. Maybe the phantom could strange him to death. I give Batman maximum 3 min then he is dead with maybe minor cuts on the phantom.

Give Batman some credit, Mumrik.

Originally posted by Mumrik
Depends on what kind of wild buffalo. If it's more or less cattle, then you know it's possible to grab their neck in such a way that they are forced to lay down. If it's a bison...well dream on. He must have sedated it or something. It's just not possible for any human to wrestle down a bison. Not even Captain America would be able to do that.

The sole reason phantom was able to defeat a lion and tigers and such in h2h combat is because of the fact that he has grown up in the jungle since birth and actually been trained for the day he will become the phantom. Bruce wayne went for ninja training for how many years? 2-3? The phantom we are talking about is probably in his prime around 25-30 years old. That is 30 years of wild fighting training in the jungle. Not to mention the expert weapons training.

Thing with Batman is that he needs prepartaion or a plan before heading into battle. He isn't a warrior more of a ninja, he needs to rely on stealth and the cover of darkness to really take on anyone. Sure the cliffs might benefit him since they are dark and there are a lot of places to hide. The only way Batman could get the upper hand is if he somehow uses his many tools like smoke bombs and tear gas and then ambushes the phantom.

Maybe uses his batarang as a knife in close combat. Still...the phantom's strenght alone would probably overwhelm Batman. Question is how the phantom would kill him, his protective suit actually renders the sword useless. He could maybe shoot him in the mouth, but the gun would be hard to use among the cliffs. If he gets him in close combat I guess he could break the Batman's spine...but maybe his outfit will protect him...

I think Batmans area under the jaw throat area isn't as heavy armored. Maybe the phantom could strange him to death. I give Batman maximum 3 min then he is dead with maybe minor cuts on the phantom.

You gave Batman his tools, and this is another major reason why he wins. How the Phantom would react to a knock-out gas?

And you say that the Phantom can beat a lion with his bare hands?
Big whoop. Batman beat multiple dudes with GUNS. Which is far more hardcore than a couple of lions.

They were Cape Buffalo that Batman handled.


And Captain America would f*cking easily handle a Bison.

Are you crazy? Do you known what the man (either man really) has done?

Originally posted by Mumrik
There is no NORMAL human on earth that could take on a lion without being stomped. Like take for example one of Batman's opponents Bane. he wouldn's survive a lion.

Do you read Batman comics? He's beaten people who can literally crush lions with their bare hands.

At this point you're going to have to display to me some comprehension of my points, and a basic acknowledgement of feats and facts. If not, you won't be worth debating with. Because you seem like you're trolling at this point. And while I'm happy to let you waste your own time, I value mine.

Good point, but I'm quite sure the Phantom has resisted sedation etc. He is very much like some huge conan the barbarian when it comes to resistance towards things. His hanging feat is evidence of this, a normal man's neck would snap but the phantom's did not. I'm quite sure that what would knock out a normal human would only slow him down or make him dizzy. 100 % sure Phantom has a resist gas feat...too bad it's not on the internet.


Well if you're impressed with defeating people with guns then it's a big whoop for the phantom. Phantom has shot the guns out of thugs hands more times than I can count. He never uses deadly force and don't even hurt the villains. He shoots their guns from their hands then knocks them out. He is a much better weapons user than the Batman.

While impressive it's not something the phantom couldn't do. He has more impressive animal vs feats than that.

No...even a human being in the best physical form wouldn't be able to wrestle an american bison to the ground. Have you any idea how huge these animals are? Here I found a reference for you:
http://www.motifake.com/image/demotivational-poster/1012/undercover-police-work-buffalo-car-demotivational-posters-1292464920.jpg
How would captain america take that thing down without using any tools? Try to grab it's neck and force it down...lmao good luck.

In hand to hand combat, if he has it's PIS. A lion is just physically far stronger than ordinary humans. Batman might have trained as a ninja for 3 years but it wouldn't really help against a lion. Hell...even a wolf would be a challenge for the batman. If you look iin the movie he gets at some point wrestled to the ground by jokers dogs...

I have countered everything you have said...I'm trying to look at this battle realistically while you bring up PIS feats that let's be honest are ridiculous. Batman is great don't get me wrong, but he is the kind of hero that needs a bat jet and thousands of tools and gadgets then a plan and the element of suprise to defeat his enemies. Great fighter in close combat, but you can't really compare him to the Phantom. Put the agility speed and strength of Tarzan together with the intellect wisdom and intelligence of a samurai and you got the phantom...yah and give this samurai two guns...

What gadgets are you giving Batman? I think the problem here, Mumrik, is that you are trying to apply real world logic to a comic book (i.e Batman is merely human, and thus, cannot tangle with wild animals etc).

I think in order to make this fight balanced Batman would have to use most of his in belt gadgets. That is:

-4 batarangs
-Tear gas
-Smoke grenade
-Graphook
-Gloves with razor knifes on

Yeah that is his standard equipment isn't it. That would even things out...

Originally posted by Mumrik
Batman wouldn't have a chance against a lion in hand to hand battle.

http://media.comicvine.com/uploads/10/102707/1889706-batman_vs_lion_super.jpg

At last some actual evidence of batman's strength. However do you notice how small the lion seem to be in that image. That is definetely an african lion and it doesn't even look grown up. Barbary lions are like siberian tigers but lions...the barbary lions however were extinct in he 19th century. But the phantom actually lived back then...in the story. One can't really compare fighting a barbary lion with an african lion. It's like comparing a black bear with a grizzly bear.
Notice the length 3.4 meters tall...as you can see the lion in that picture you posted well I imagine it's standing on it's hind legs and while doing that reaches to Batman's height which is about what...1.8 meters. That is definetely not a barbary lion...let's see...
That is an ordinary lion...so that means that batman is either fighting a really small male lion or a really large female lion. A male barbary lion is double the size of a large female NORMAL lion. So that feat you just posted isn't really very impressive.

Also look what I found, phantom is 10 times more man than batman...and has a sense of humour lmao.
http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_X6F4HnEqbd8/SCnlS44NU4I/AAAAAAAAA_Y/hgcGfm3eCD0/s400/fantomen.jpeg
http://tobiastobias.blogg.se/images/2010/photo2_119766999.jpg

Lol only way the batman could win over the phantom is to do a sex change...and then undress.
http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_WwesQGTLhoE/S68eWHqO_cI/AAAAAAAADVY/eSnam86_XCs/s1600/Fantomen+av+Giordano.jpg

Originally posted by Mumrik
At last some actual evidence of batman's strength. However do you notice how small the lion seem to be in that image. That is definetely an african lion and it doesn't even look grown up. Barbary lions are like siberian tigers but lions...the barbary lions however were extinct in he 19th century. But the phantom actually lived back then...in the story. One can't really compare fighting a barbary lion with an african lion. It's like comparing a black bear with a grizzly bear.
Notice the length 3.4 meters tall...as you can see the lion in that picture you posted well I imagine it's standing on it's hind legs and while doing that reaches to Batman's height which is about what...1.8 meters. That is definetely not a barbary lion...let's see...
That is an ordinary lion...so that means that batman is either fighting a really small male lion or a really large female lion. A male barbary lion is double the size of a large female NORMAL lion. So that feat you just posted isn't really very impressive.

Also look what I found, phantom is 10 times more man than batman...and has a sense of humour lmao.


Lol. I was going to post evidence refuting your points...

but then realised people have done so in his respect thread.

http://www.killermovies.com/forums/f98/t492648.html

Note for example how he dodges machine gun fire, bends metal with his bare hands etc etc. To just look at him as 'merely human' ignores a vast swathe of what he has actually accomplished.

huh...didn't know that "attractive male" was a skill set.

Originally posted by Flyattractor
huh...didn't know that "attractive male" was a skill set.

takes work looking this good!

edit: Seriously i known and ****ed women that would think it's a damn skill set lol

You can't post an entire respect thread and expect me to respond to all that.
Dodge machine gun fire ANYONE can do...soldiers do it all the time in war. Also...he has a bullet proof west so he probably took a few bullets I'm sure. As for bending metal:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=laqwYZyFQTA&feature=player_detailpage#t=26s
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7qHL2PSpecI&feature=player_detailpage#t=54s

Refuted...

Originally posted by Mumrik
You can't post an entire respect thread and expect me to respond to all that.
Dodge machine gun fire ANYONE can do...soldiers do it all the time in war. Also...he has a bullet proof west so he probably took a few bullets I'm sure. As for bending metal:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=laqwYZyFQTA&feature=player_detailpage#t=26s
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7qHL2PSpecI&feature=player_detailpage#t=54s

Refuted...

Lol, no, I don't expect you to respond to all of it - but you must admit, there were pretty good feats in there. Such as defeating Ra's, a master swordsman with more experience than the Phantom, dodging machine gun fire from the Reaper, a better marksman than the Phantom, and defeating Azrael/KGBeast/Bane/Lots of different martial artists.

Also, I highly doubt soldiers do it ALL the time.,..otherwise, guns would be pretty useless, no? And you might assume that he took a few bullets due to his vest...but you have to, you know, prove it.

Originally posted by Mumrik

No...even a human being in the best physical form wouldn't be able to wrestle an american bison to the ground. Have you any idea how huge these animals are? Here I found a reference for you:
How would captain america take that thing down without using any tools? Try to grab it's neck and force it down...lmao good luck.



ow boy someone doesnt read comics, i find it both funny and irritating at the same time how you are trying to make batman and captain america simple humans but boast the phantom for beating a lion.

batman displayed feats that clearly tell us he can break the neck of a lion with 1 hand, try reading batman for a change.

as for captain america Lol at you, a guy that can rip out robot parts with his bare hands, rip off metal doors with easy, lifting statues and trees left and right, one shotting buildings and tearing metal chains like toys cant handle a bison? dude seriously thats a straight up lowballing both for batman and cap, did you really think you can come here present phantom beating up a lion and some jack sparrow on roids and expect everybody to take it up the a$$ just because you will lowball batman and try to portray him as the averege human being? a lion will break his neck? really? a lion will beat bane on venom? dude go read comics and dont come back until you do.

Btw, I just thought it pertinent to the comic book humans vs lions debate...

Naked Doom vs a lion:

http://i345.photobucket.com/albums/p388/proteus_lives/Scan10915.jpg

http://i345.photobucket.com/albums/p388/proteus_lives/Scan10916.jpg

http://i345.photobucket.com/albums/p388/proteus_lives/Scan10917.jpg

http://i345.photobucket.com/albums/p388/proteus_lives/Scan10918.jpg

Lol even the old batman chocked out a lion

http://media.comicvine.com/uploads/10/102707/1889706-batman_vs_lion_super.jpg


seriously ROFL at batman not being able to handle a lion.

Originally posted by red sabre
Lol even the old batman chocked out a lion

http://media.comicvine.com/uploads/10/102707/1889706-batman_vs_lion_super.jpg

Yeah, I posted it, but it was downplayed as a small lion. DEspite the fact that I only posted it in answer to his assertion that 'no human could fight a lion'.

With more experience than the phantom?
That is from his bio, hmm expanded life span. Seems he is about 600 years old, while that means he must be a master at swordfighting it doesn't necessarly mean he is a better fighter than the phantom. To my knowledge Ra's hasn't spent 30 of his 600 years in the jungles like a wild man wrestling with wild animals on a weekly basis.

Also do ask yourself how long time it takes to become a master swordsman, there are only so many moves one can learn. We are talking about the phantom in general, that means any of his 20 incarnations. I found some scans online of him with swords...
http://www.karileppanencomics.fi/the%20golden%20falcon%20collage.jpg
http://www.karileppanencomics.fi/death%20ring%20image%202.jpg
http://www.karileppanencomics.fi/death%20ring%20image%201.jpg
Also note that every phantom guy leaves the jungle at age 18 to study at oxford or some high esteem school. Here is the phantom training sword fighting as a teen.
http://www.karileppanencomics.fi/english-my%20swedish%20enemy%20image.jpg
http://www.karileppanencomics.fi/english%20gov-and-scar%20im-4.jpg
http://www.karileppanencomics.fi/phantom%20in%2030-years%20war.jpg
http://www.karileppanencomics.fi/norman%20worker%20memory-1.jpg
http://www.karileppanencomics.fi/crusader-by-frew.jpg

There is no real proof that Ra's is better at swords than the phantom and even if he were he wouldn't be as strong as the phantom. That Batman, a ninja for three years proves that 600 years of sword fighting means nothing. Since he were able to defeat Ra's.

What I'm saying is...that defeating Ra's can't possibly be considered a much more impressive feat than to defeat a couple of bandits with guns.

lol

Batman could beat a lion. Captain America would obliterate one.

Originally posted by Mumrik
To my knowledge Ra's hasn't spent 30 of his 600 years in the jungles like a wild man wrestling with wild animals on a weekly basis.

And Phantom hasn't spent years of his life intimidating and owning a universe full of superhumans that could eviscerate jungle animals, being one of the top martial artists and strategic thinkers on the planet, and being rich enough to prep for anything with gadgets. You're going to give a cool character a bad name on the forums if you keep ignoring this.

But please, find us some more scans of Phantom doing his George of the Jungle thing. I think I'm nearly convinced.

i dont understand 1 thing, how can this mumrik guy come in here, show us a scan of phantom spanking women on her butt chiks, claim that phantom defeated a lion, and somehow try to present this "case" as the reason why he can beat batman?

Originally posted by Mumrik
With more experience than the phantom?
That is from his bio, hmm expanded life span. Seems he is about 600 years old, while that means he must be a master at swordfighting it doesn't necessarly mean he is a better fighter than the phantom. To my knowledge Ra's hasn't spent 30 of his 600 years in the jungles like a wild man wrestling with wild animals on a weekly basis.

No, it means that he has spent easily 30 (at least, most likely much much more than that) fighting with a sword.


That's like saying chess 'only' has a certain number of moves (bishops can only move diagonally etc), therefore, it doesn't take that long to become a chess grandmaster. Sure, it can't take 100s of years to learn all the moves in swordfighting - but its experience that counts.


So if Bats defeats anyone, that automatically means they can't be that skilled? But if the Phantom wrestles lions etc, that must mean the Phantom's uber?

How about we turn it around, and say that Barbary lions can't actually be that uber, because the Phantom could obviously defeat them?


Its defeating a guy who has trained most of his life in swords, has way more experience than you, and has near enough stats to you, that makes it impressive.

Fighting animals in the jungle > fighting psychopathic super criminals and villains

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
Fighting animals in the jungle > fighting psychopathic super criminals and villains

There IS Doom....

Lion > deer > wolverine > hulk = phantom >>>> hulk

Doom could fight both Batman and Phantom at the same time and it would still be spite against them.

Naked.

Originally posted by red sabre
i dont understand 1 thing, how can this mumrik guy come in here, show us a scan of phantom spanking women on her butt chiks, claim that phantom defeated a lion, and somehow try to present this "case" as the reason why he can beat batman?

It's the internet, and KMC. Is it really that unbelievable? It's good for some comedy though. This was same guy saying that Surfer could effortlessly take over Marvel Earth last week.

Captain america is a human with the best possible attributes in terms of physical prowess. Not even the most atheletic perfect example of the human species could wrestle an american bison to the ground. At the end of the day Batman and Captain america are homo sapiens...big apes that is. While it's possible for a human to dominate wild animals, some animals are simply constructed in such a way that it's impossible for a human to take them on in h2h combat. Bruce wayne with his ninja skills would have big problems with a barbary lion and other animals too. Captain america could probably win over a lion but no he wouldn't wrestle a 2 tonned american bison to the ground. Also remember from the movie, Batman had problem with the joker's dogs...
I'm trying to look at this encounter between the phantom and batman realistically. There is no human that can break the neck of a lion with one hand...so whatever feat you are reffering to it's PIS.
Oh so having influence over others is a feat, being rich too? Well then I'm sure you would say.

Obama>Phantom in hand to hand combat?

As for top martial artist, he was defeated by Batman. Batman who has spent how many years training as a ninja? Fact is that there are many people in this world that would be able to kick Batman's ass. He is a rich play boy after all...he would be little without his gadgets and suit and element of suprise. Listen I know the writers have been giving Batman BJ's in the comics. But I'm trying to ignore unrealistic PIS feats and look at this REALISTICALLY. One can't come to a conclusion if one doesn't look at things realistically.

Also the phantom and Ra's are from different universes. So the title of best martial artist in the world doesn't really matter, that goes for Batman as well.
Experience counts, yet batman who has lived far less than 600 years beat Ra's...so...experience doesn't matter?
Actually yes, when it comes to hand to hand combat fighting super villians isn't as impressive as taking on a barbary lion.

Actually, Captain America is legitimately superhuman, not peak human, which Batman is. Physically, there's nothing Bruce could do that Steve couldn't do and to greater effect with more ease. That includes fighting lions, and tigers, and bears (or bison).

That said, Batman's high end feats are still mightily impressive for a peak human, which still shits on the real world. Batman sure as hell does have PIS feats, but he also has plenty of non-Batgod fueled feats that suggest him beating wild animals...such as the times he's beaten wild animals. That's without factoring in his gadget spamming abilities.

Lol @ trying to grossly downplay Batman's martial arts skill, though. The guy is one of the top fighters on his Earth, and no spin control or lowballing can change that. He's a detective first and foremost, but still, the guy is a master martial artist. Even someone like Srank would admit that much.

But in your opinion taking on a barbary lion is more impressive than fighting Bane on Venom or Solomon Grundy or Clayface or Killer Croc, right?

Originally posted by Mumrik
Captain america is a human with the best possible attributes in terms of physical prowess. Not even the most atheletic perfect example of the human species could wrestle an american bison to the ground. At the end of the day Batman and Captain america are homo sapiens...big apes that is. While it's possible for a human to dominate wild animals, some animals are simply constructed in such a way that it's impossible for a human to take them on in h2h combat. Bruce wayne with his ninja skills would have big problems with a barbary lion and other animals too. Captain america could probably win over a lion but no he wouldn't wrestle a 2 tonned american bison to the ground. Also remember from the movie, Batman had problem with the joker's dogs...
I'm trying to look at this encounter between the phantom and batman realistically. There is no human that can break the neck of a lion with one hand...so whatever feat you are reffering to it's PIS.
Oh so having influence over others is a feat, being rich too? Well then I'm sure you would say.




oh boy, Cap is a peak human based on what? let me save it for you, "based on wikipedia and some bio i see from 30 years ago", seriously i am tired at poiting out the same point to dozens of people here, dont you read other threads? you didnt see my point for cap? by feats captain america is a clear super human, i just listed you some of his feats didnt you notice that? didnt you look at my post? i presented you several of the feats that put him in the super human category and all you do is repeating like some robot that he is a peak human just because its stated so in some bio and wikipedia? its also stated that sabretooth is as strong as a guy his own size that doing physical training daily, i guess sabretooth has human strength right? when will people start reading comics and start to figure things out on their own? such a fail.

you are basically claiming that at the end of the day batman and captain america are just humans even with the fact they presented from peak human to super human feats? how dumb is that? at the end of the day luke cage is also just human with tough skin so he cant beat a bison as well? the whole point of comics is presenting us those "humans" reaching unrealistic levels of physical ability and other abilities as well, batman by feats defeated several buffalos with his bare hands, but you go up against a comics showing and against all his showings claiming all that is bullshit because he is a human? do you even think before you type something?

now you bring out the movie version of batman having problem with dogs to somehow try and back your case up??? movie version???? really? do you even know whats this forum about? dude the fail is too big with you i cant take it.

Mumrik, saying anything Batman does beyond what a normal human can do is calling almost his entire canon PIS. It just doesn't hold up to scrutiny. Comics aren't real-life, and Batman can do things that normal humans can't.

Also, yeah, Cap's legit superhuman. So your assessment of him is factually wrong.

To everyone else: I'd be careful about getting too worked up. There's a fair chance he's just trolling at this point.

yeah he must be, but i feel like some things must be explained otherwise other people might actually think he got a point that batman and Cap are only humans.

but yeah i think the usage of movie version batman having trouble with dogs blew away his cover.

Listen guy, I'm imagening the characters as if they were real. The recent batman movies are what I'm imagening Batman to be. And those are actually far more realistic and less ridiculous than most of the comics. Increase the size of this cat 75% and you got a barbary lion:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B9KcbDk-lmE&feature=player_detailpage

Now tell me how would a ninja playboy like Bruce wayne wrestle such a beast to the ground? Let's be realistic for a moment huh? The phantom is far more likely to be able to deal with such a beast, in fact I'd say his most impressive h2h feat is wrestling a barbary lion to the ground.

You bring up killer croc and bane as examples of humans who are more impressive than a barbary lion. Well maybe in the fictional world of the comics but if one wants to come to some truth like I want to. Then you need to look at things realistically, bane couldn't possibly achieve anything but world's strongest man status. Humans are simply inferior to most animals alright?

Batman can't do it without his many gadgets and a plan before heading into battle. The phantom is a better close combat fighter, therefore the only way Batman could defeat the phantom would be to use his many tools that being:

-Tear gas
-Smoke nades
-Batarangs
-Razor gloves

in combination with luck...but still he might be a good martial artist, but the phantom is much stronger and smarter! The phantom isn't a brute like one would think. Imagine a noble ARIAN samurai in the jungles...with the agility and speed of Tarzan. Physically superior to bruce and therefore even with his gadgets Batman would die...I think I'll lower the time for Batman. 2 minutes and his spine is broken...

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
That includes fighting lions, and tigers, and bears (or bison).



LOL

Originally posted by Mumrik
Listen guy, I'm imagening the characters as if they were real.

and thats my friend is the problem here.

Originally posted by Mumrik
Listen guy, I'm imagening the characters as if they were real. The recent batman movies are what I'm imagening Batman to be. And those are actually far more realistic and less ridiculous than most of the comics. Increase the size of this cat 75% and you got a barbary lion:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B9KcbDk-lmE&feature=player_detailpage

Now tell me how would a ninja playboy like Bruce wayne wrestle such a beast to the ground? Let's be realistic for a moment huh? The phantom is far more likely to be able to deal with such a beast, in fact I'd say his most impressive h2h feat is wrestling a barbary lion to the ground.

You bring up killer croc and bane as examples of humans who are more impressive than a barbary lion. Well maybe in the fictional world of the comics but if one wants to come to some truth like I want to. Then you need to look at things realistically, bane couldn't possibly achieve anything but world's strongest man status. Humans are simply inferior to most animals alright?

Batman can't do it without his many gadgets and a plan before heading into battle. The phantom is a better close combat fighter, therefore the only way Batman could defeat the phantom would be to use his many tools that being:

-Tear gas
-Smoke nades
-Batarangs
-Razor gloves

in combination with luck...but still he might be a good martial artist, but the phantom is much stronger and smarter! The phantom isn't a brute like one would think. Imagine a noble ARIAN samurai in the jungles...with the agility and speed of Tarzan. Physically superior to bruce and therefore even with his gadgets Batman would die...I think I'll lower the time for Batman. 2 minutes and his spine is broken...

Well, therein lies the problem.

You're imagining the characters as how you picture them to be or should be instead of how they're actually portrayed, claiming it's PIS.

Unfortunately, this is a comic book forum and realism is often thrown out of the door, even with street level (especially with street levelers at times). You can't just ignore what doesn't fit with your preconceived notions and neuter abilities and skills shown on panel on a consistent basis just to give your guy a shot at the win. It was the same kind of flawed argument that got your Silver Surfer vs. Marvel Earth thread closed. Well, that, and the fact that it was colossal spite against Surfer.

No way in hell is Phantom a better close combat fighter than Batman. You've not proved that he's stronger or skilled than Wayne outside of "well, Batman is unrealistic, so I'm going to make him a real world human" mindset.

Captain America would dismantle Phantom in moments.

So essentially, its Christian Bale vs Billy Zane? Is that what you're saying?

Bale wins, handily.

Originally posted by Mumrik
Experience counts, yet batman who has lived far less than 600 years beat Ra's...so...experience doesn't matter?

So....Batman is just that good, was the point I was trying to make.


But they're not, they're comic book characters.


So...film depiction of Batman, but comic book depiction of Phantom? Why don't you make them equal, and use the film adaptation of the Phantom? Is it because he sucked?


Again, you allow unrealistic depictions for the Phantom, but decry any Batman feats as PIS? Hmm, Ok.


You mean, like in a COMIC BOOK versus forum?


He has way more than that, usually.



Why would the fact that he is 'ARIAN' matter? This smells suspiciously like racism....



That's the thing. Batman has fought faster, stronger opponents than him before. He's still fine.

LMAO, are you serious...I have pointed you to a lot of feats that are far more impressive than anything Batman has done. Also the jungle sayings...

-When the Phantom moves the lightning's still
-Phantom sneaks quietly than jungle cat
-There are nights when the Phantom leaves the jungle and walk the city streets as a common man
-You will never find the Phantom - he finds you
-Phantom voice ice blood
-Phantom is hard on the hard
-Aim never to Phantom
-Phantom has a thousand eyes and a thousand ears
-Phantom has ten tiger strength
-Anyone who sees the phantom face die a horrible death
-When the answer to ask Phantom
-Waking in the dark and watch the Phantom - a horror of evil men
-Phantom rests only when peace prevails in the world

Sorry for the crappy google translation. This comic book is just so dead outside of america you know. Note the strength of 10 tigers, nothing the batman can handle.

Originally posted by Mumrik
LMAO, are you serious...I have pointed you to a lot of feats that are far more impressive than anything Batman has done. Also the jungle sayings...

-When the Phantom moves the lightning's still
-Phantom sneaks quietly than jungle cat
-There are nights when the Phantom leaves the jungle and walk the city streets as a common man
-You will never find the Phantom - he finds you
-Phantom voice ice blood
-Phantom is hard on the hard
-Aim never to Phantom
-Phantom has a thousand eyes and a thousand ears
-Phantom has ten tiger strength
-Anyone who sees the phantom face die a horrible death
-When the answer to ask Phantom
-Waking in the dark and watch the Phantom - a horror of evil men
-Phantom rests only when peace prevails in the world

Sorry for the crappy google translation. This comic book is just so dead outside of america you know. Note the strength of 10 tigers, nothing the batman can handle.

Oh sh*t, jungle sayings! Batman has zero of those, therefore, he loses....

Especially the '-Phantom is hard on the hard'. If he's hard on the hard, there is no way Batman can compete with that.

Are you actually being serious? I doubt it.

Originally posted by Mumrik
LMAO, are you serious...I have pointed you to a lot of feats that are far more impressive than anything Batman has done. Also the jungle sayings...

-When the Phantom moves the lightning's still
-Phantom sneaks quietly than jungle cat
-There are nights when the Phantom leaves the jungle and walk the city streets as a common man
-You will never find the Phantom - he finds you
-Phantom voice ice blood
-Phantom is hard on the hard
-Aim never to Phantom
-Phantom has a thousand eyes and a thousand ears
-Phantom has ten tiger strength
-Anyone who sees the phantom face die a horrible death
-When the answer to ask Phantom
-Waking in the dark and watch the Phantom - a horror of evil men
-Phantom rests only when peace prevails in the world

Sorry for the crappy google translation. This comic book is just so dead outside of america you know. Note the strength of 10 tigers, nothing the batman can handle.

You got jokes, son? These "feats" you've pointed out are better than anything Batman's ever done?

Well, it's obvious you have no earthly idea what Batman has done, then. And your hyperbole statements?

Batman's got hundreds of them.

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
You got jokes, son? These "feats" you've pointed out are better than anything Batman's ever done?

Well, it's obvious you have no earthly idea what Batman has done, then. And your hyperbole statements?

Batman's got hundreds of them.


Can Batman or even Doom compete with this, though??? Leaving the jungle and walking like a commoner???


I thought that was Chuck Norris


I can see why the Phantom has lasted so long, if jungle 'wisdom' is never to aim at the Phantom....

Originally posted by Mumrik
LMAO, are you serious...I have pointed you to a lot of feats that are far more impressive than anything Batman has done. Also the jungle sayings...

-When the Phantom moves the lightning's still
-Phantom sneaks quietly than jungle cat
-There are nights when the Phantom leaves the jungle and walk the city streets as a common man
-You will never find the Phantom - he finds you
-Phantom voice ice blood
-Phantom is hard on the hard
-Aim never to Phantom
-Phantom has a thousand eyes and a thousand ears
-Phantom has ten tiger strength
-Anyone who sees the phantom face die a horrible death
-When the answer to ask Phantom
-Waking in the dark and watch the Phantom - a horror of evil men
-Phantom rests only when peace prevails in the world

Sorry for the crappy google translation. This comic book is just so dead outside of america you know. Note the strength of 10 tigers, nothing the batman can handle.

chuck norris got far more sayings he stomps.

now seriously this guy is trolling.

http://benison.files.wordpress.com/2009/01/troll1.jpg

Actually that would be more like, The phantom is harsh towards the harsh. as for:
Well the vikings were originally really tall and incredibly physically strong. I'm just saying that he is not some skinny Mowgli guy. Ever heard of controlled breeding? It just so happens to be the case that he has since the 16th century mated with only perfect women. Physically and intellectually sophisticated women. Which has lead to him having a natural physically superior built to normal men.
Actually the movie is quite true to the phantom comics, except that Billy Zane doesn't live up physically to the phantom. So yeah...atually one would be able to say that this thread is more of movie vs movie. Yeah and I forgot the phantom has captured a giant too...
http://i241.photobucket.com/albums/ff237/thephantomhead/PhantomBlueGiant_S098.jpg

Originally posted by Mumrik
Actually that would be more like, The phantom is harsh towards the harsh. as for:
Well the vikings were originally really tall and incredibly physically strong. I'm just saying that he is not some skinny Mowgli guy. Ever heard of controlled breeding? It just so happens to be the case that he has since the 16th century mated with only perfect women. Physically and intellectually sophisticated women. Which has lead to him having a natural physically superior built to normal men.

And you equate perfection with Aryans? Dangerous ground there, mate.



Lol. So, back to my point, you use the movie depiction of Batman (being savaged by dogs) but ignore the Phantom's movie depiction, because...Zane didn't portray the ridiculousness of the comic? And then in the very same breath, show a comic book feat?

Riiiiiight.

http://legacy-cdn.smosh.com/smosh-pit/112010/main-troll.jpg

Actually I happen to know that a scene was cut from the phantom movie...a scene in which billy zane is fighting a lion and winning. See:
So basically that wouldn't matter...the phantom comic and movie phantom are equal...so yeah movie batman against movie phantom...actually movie/comic phantom since there is no difference between them...

Originally posted by Mumrik
Actually I happen to know that a scene was cut from the phantom movie...a scene in which billy zane is fighting a lion and winning. See:
So basically that wouldn't matter...the phantom comic and movie phantom are equal...so yeah movie batman against movie phantom...actually movie/comic phantom since there is no difference between them...

So he wrestled a lion and a snake, did he win?

IF he did, can you prove it?

And after you've proved it, there's still the fact that comic book Batman>film Batman, and there is also the fact that this should then be moved to the comic film thread, not the comic BOOK thread.

Its not our fault you didn't put the versus match in the right thread. You should have put this match in the comic film thread, not here.

Duh of course he won, you seriously think he would half way through the movie wrestle a lion and die...he got the snake and the lion. Thing is...there is no difference between the movie phantom and comic book phantom.

I'm trying to argue realistically, and batman in the dark knight is far more realistic than anything out of the PIS comics. So...batman had problem with Joker's dogs...phantom wrestled a big snake and a lion to the ground....

He is simple a superior fighter, here are some clips from the movie. Although they don't quite live up to the REAL physical strength agility and speed of the phantom but it's close enough.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=au3Frf2ID28&feature=plcp

In other words, you're conceding that comic-verse Batman would mop the floor up with comic/movie-verse Phantom?

You also can't write off every feat you don't like or disagree with as PIS, which seems to be the case here and in other threads.

PIS to my knowledge means plot induced stupidity as in...the plot feat is just unrealistic. You're saying Batman can kick trees down and that he can break the kneck of a lion with one hand etc...well that is unrealistic which to my knowledge means it's PIS. It's realistic for someone like super man to do it, but Batman has no super powers....so no:

Any Phantom>Batman

In close hand to hand combat that is...it has been proven.

Originally posted by Mumrik
Duh of course he won, you seriously think he would half way through the movie wrestle a lion and die...he got the snake and the lion. Thing is...there is no difference between the movie phantom and comic book phantom.

But there is a difference between movie Batman and comic Batman.



Ok, so finally, you admit that its movie Batman (Bale) vs movie Phantom? Or do you want to use Clooney Batman? Or Keaton Batman? Which one?



Wait, I thought you said:



Which is it?

The movie version is quite accurate, the body of zane however doesn't live up to the comic book guy. But his feats as in defeating a lion, taking on 10+ pirates...well pretty accurate to the comics. Though there are more impressive feats in the comics the movie version realistically shows some of the phantom's feats. Therefore I'd say SINCE WE WANT TO COME TO SOME REALISTIC TRUTH:

Comic/movie phantom
vs
Bale's batman

It's the most realistic scenario, much of what has been done in the batman comics is unrealistic and therefore PIS...only way this isn't how it's suppose to go is if PIS means something other than not realistic...

We want to come to a REALISTIC truth...not something that is unrealistic and false right?

So, yes, you don't agree with the feat so it becomes PIS in your eyes?

Face it, in the world of comic books, or even most forms of fiction really, "normal" humans do stuff that you can't do in reality, especially "normal" humans trained to the level of "peak perfection". Furthermore, your obvious double standard is extremely telling.

You make a thread in which you obviously beleive Phantom "stomps" Batman, and then turn around and disallow Batman's feats as being "PIS" and "unrealistic" for humans and attempt to pigeon hole Batman into being "movie" Batman because that's acceptable to you (namely because he got mauled by dogs, and big game cats > dogs).

You then cite Phantom as being able to wrestle and beat up these same animals...which is clearly beyond the realm of "normal" humans.

It's so crystal clear here that you desperately want to prove Phantom > Batman, but you can't, so you basically ignore what you don't like and try to change the scenario so that it's movie Batman (which is more "realistic" versus Phantom (who can use any of his feats from any medium, apparently).

Hell, you do realize that the typical action movie hero shits on your conceived notions of "realistic"? Watch Die Hard, Rambo, Lethal Weapon, etc, and tell me real people can do that shit.

Realistically?

Movie Bale hides in the Tumbler, and fires rockets at the sword and pistol wielding Phantom.

Originally posted by Mumrik
Duh of course he won, you seriously think he would half way through the movie wrestle a lion and die...he got the snake and the lion. Thing is...there is no difference between the movie phantom and comic book phantom.

I'm trying to argue realistically, and batman in the dark knight is far more realistic than anything out of the PIS comics. So...batman had problem with Joker's dogs...phantom wrestled a big snake and a lion to the ground....

He is simple a superior fighter, here are some clips from the movie. Although they don't quite live up to the REAL physical strength agility and speed of the phantom but it's close enough.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=au3Frf2ID28&feature=plcp

how do you know he was suppose to win? maybe he was supposed to get injured and hurt badly so that his girlfriend could save him to make it more romantic? can you prove he was suppose to win in that fight?

how can you argue realisticly a character that isnt realistic? how can you aply realism to comics? how can you say someone can shoot lasers out of their eyes but then again look at you normally and choose when to use this power source? or how can someone fly? or how can someone turn himself and all his organs into pure metal and live? how can someone get super human powers by getting bit by a spider? how can someone survive a gama explosion and absorb it making him turn into giant green mosnter? how can he grow into a giant green mosnter and not rip his pants?

wait wait first you said there is no difference between the movie version and the comics version and now you say the movie version doesnt portray him as physically strong as the comics?

Originally posted by Mumrik
But his feats as in defeating a lion, taking on 10+ pirates...well pretty accurate to the comics.


when did he take a lion in the movie? i didnt see no lion in the movie.

defeating 10 pirates is a feat? pirates have no fighting training what so ever, they are just guys woith rotten teeth, christian bale defeating a group of ninjas is >>>>> those pirates

Originally posted by red sabre
when did he take a lion in the movie? i didnt see no lion in the movie.



It was cut because the directors felt it was unrealistic

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
It was cut because the directors felt it was unrealistic

they felt he cant really survive a lion therefor they cut it.

so basically mumrik you dont discuss about batman in this thread, you discuss about other fictional version you personally invented that in your eyes suppose to be batman, then you make your own version of phantom and try to debate that version? ok i cant play this game as well.

lets do your version of phantom vs my version of captain america, my version of captain america use the entire planet earth as his shield and he can cut the galaxy in half with a shield throw, prove your phantom beats him.

Originally posted by red sabre
lets do your version of phantom vs my version of captain america, my version of captain america use the entire planet earth as his shield and he can cut the galaxy in half with a shield throw, prove your phantom beats him.

That's the real Cap.

Everyone knows Rogers is a galaxy buster.

I think I have proven you wrong, I win this ok. Batman simply is a inferior hand to hand fighter. The Phantom will break him!

PHANTOM APPROVED
http://www.bossescomics.com/Fantomen/fantomhand.jpg

Originally posted by Mumrik
I think I have proven you wrong, I win this ok. Batman simply is a inferior hand to hand fighter. The Phantom will break him!


Are you confirming that its movie Batman vs comic/movie Phantom?

Be glad I didn't bust out "Batgod" mode Batman feats.

This would have turned into outright spite.

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
Be glad I didn't bust out "Batgod" mode Batman feats.

This would have turned into outright spite.

Hush, you.

The Phantom is the ultimate street level character. If anybody does anything better than him, its due to PIS. They are only allowed to be inferior to his superior Aryanness.

no one can beat a lion or 10 pirates.

Originally posted by red sabre
no one can beat a lion or 10 pirates.

Its a good thing the Phantom wasn't in Marvel.

Skrull Invasion? All Phantom Skrulls would explode from attempting to replicate his sheer awesomesauce. The remainder would be soloed by Billy Zane.

House of M? The Phantom would have been the top dog in that reality.

Civil War? Every issue would have been either Tony or Steve pleading with the Phantom to join them, as he would tip the entire battle in their favour. No fights, just page after page of the two sides begging him.

WWH? Pfft. Who needs the Sentry.

In the marvel universe, the phantom would indeed be the best street level character.

Originally posted by Mumrik
In the marvel universe, the phantom would indeed be the best street level character.

Uh-oh.

Originally posted by Mumrik
In the marvel universe, the phantom would indeed be the best street level character.

lol absolutely not.

by the way mumrik, you said batman cannot beat a lion because he is human and humans cant beat lions, when a feat of batman defeating a buffalo was presented it was treated as PIS because once again he is human right? so in that case the phantom is also a human, by your statement a human cannot beat a lion and therefor that phantom feat is also PIS, in that case what other feats does he have?

Originally posted by Mumrik
-Phantom is hard on the hard
I think it is 'Phantom is hard on the herd', or 'Phantom is hard on the hard of hearing'.

Originally posted by Mumrik
-Aim never to Phantom
I certainly aim never to Phantom.

Originally posted by Mumrik
-Waking in the dark and watch the Phantom - a horror of evil men
Is it talking about the crappy Phantom movie?

Originally posted by Mumrik
-When the answer to ask Phantom
What was the question?

Originally posted by Mumrik
Sorry for the crappy google translation. Yes.

Phantom is cool though. A purely H2H fight would be interesting.

Bruce Wayne vs The Phantom gauntlet:
http://www.killermovies.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=519690&goto=nextoldest

You can't be very old...of course a human can beat a lion and maybe even batman could as shown. But I pointed out that that lion wasn't a barbary lion and therefore it's not really something that could prove Batman being physically stronger or better fighter in any way. Since Phantom has actually defeated a BARBARY lion. Also humans can beat lions, just not normal humans. I recall Phantom being close to death in that fight and it was by shear luck he took the lion. So it wasn't PIS, in fact not a lot in the phantom comics are pis or unrealistic. There are even some comics in which he suffers, gets captured or has to spend months in bed. There are some comics in which he dies as well, often he is ambushed by someone...like when his son betrayed him to some pirates...the concious of the son were too much and he returned taking the phantom oath. (Random thing I just remembered).

There are no PIS feats in the phantom comic...there are a lot of them in the bat comics. Anyway I have already proven him to be superior to the batman.

No you haven't, only maybe superior to the Movie Batman.

Maybe.

He hasn't even really proved that, but chose to focus on Batman having trouble with dogs while focusing on Phantom fighting a lion. Batman with no morals as evidenced in the OP, would gadget spam the shit out of Phantom for the murder.

Originally posted by Mumrik
You can't be very old...of course a human can beat a lion and maybe even batman could as shown. But I pointed out that that lion wasn't a barbary lion and therefore it's not really something that could prove Batman being physically stronger or better fighter in any way. Since Phantom has actually defeated a BARBARY lion. Also humans can beat lions, just not normal humans. I recall Phantom being close to death in that fight and it was by shear luck he took the lion. So it wasn't PIS, in fact not a lot in the phantom comics are pis or unrealistic. There are even some comics in which he suffers, gets captured or has to spend months in bed. There are some comics in which he dies as well, often he is ambushed by someone...like when his son betrayed him to some pirates...the concious of the son were too much and he returned taking the phantom oath. (Random thing I just remembered).

There are no PIS feats in the phantom comic...there are a lot of them in the bat comics. Anyway I have already proven him to be superior to the batman.

you said a lion will break batmans neck and that batman cannot beat a lion because he is just human, now you change your version to maybe batman can beat a lion? what is your meassurement scale then? what is your definition to batman abilities? if you say phantom can beat a lion which you stated yourself a human cannot then its safe for me to say batman wrestled down a buffalo, killer croc, bane, solomon grundy and hurt wonder woman , if you pull phantom out of the "human" buble you defined yourself than i am doing the same thing with batman and credit him his well deserved feats.

you didnt prove anything, you presented phantom spanking some woman on her butt chicks, and you said he defeated a lion which you didnt even care to present or perhaps i missed it i dont know show me phantom beating a lion, then people presented to you batman ripping out steel doors, steel bars, breaking chains, wrestling buffalo, physically overpower killer croc and bane who are above human physically.

you didnt present any feats and i know you are just trolling but still its fun to prove you wrong even when you troll.

Well, there IS this little gem he/she posted in another thread:



So.....

Lol

Guy there are over 12000 phantom comic books, my father owned like I don't know 100 and I read some of them. I'm not going to go down the basement and spend 45 min looking for the phantom killing a lion. He has done so more times than I can count, that is why I brought it up...here a few min of searching on the internet and this is what I have found.

http://www.seriesam.com/pc/fantomen197623.jpg
That says the lion mystery, don't remmeber if it's the one I read.
http://www.karileppanencomics.fi/frewcover-ibis%201.jpg
Don't know exactly what that being is, but it looks like some mythological beast.
http://www.karileppanencomics.fi/ph%20glad%20arena.jpg
Here he has a sword, but still that is a lion.
http://fantomen.ratata.fi/data/fantomen/images/xl/xl_221992.JPG
Oh look at that, tied up broke loose then knocked out a tiger. Take that suit off and do the same mr playboy.
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_aLzwvFGTR20/TK0capYX6UI/AAAAAAAAEuo/WA3k3hDOtOA/s1600/2.jpg
Here is him wrestling what looks like a tiger...
http://www.harnby.com/Seriesida/images/Fantomen/basta_omslag/1990_21_bo.jpg
Also here...
http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_aLzwvFGTR20/TIbMo1xooWI/AAAAAAAAEko/BohAZkFGS3s/s1600/PH30.jpg
Another big cat...

Also I stumpled upon this...look at that beast. That is at least grundy maybe hulk strength.
http://t0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRwyiYbXefklhrE8xrtQrMR7oqJ0Xv-EaY32nzQwAjI2RcVGR_U17PWSUd-pQ

Grundy/Hulk strength?

Are you serious?

Oh look I found a bunch of covers of the phantom...let's see what gems we can find in here to prove your wrong...
http://www.schapter.org/wiki/Category:Fantomen_issues

Originally posted by Mumrik
http://www.seriesam.com/pc/fantomen197623.jpg
That says the lion mystery, don't remmeber if it's the one I read.
http://www.karileppanencomics.fi/frewcover-ibis%201.jpg
Don't know exactly what that being is, but it looks like some mythological beast.
http://www.karileppanencomics.fi/ph%20glad%20arena.jpg
Here he has a sword, but still that is a lion.
http://fantomen.ratata.fi/data/fantomen/images/xl/xl_221992.JPG
Oh look at that, tied up broke loose then knocked out a tiger. Take that suit off and do the same mr playboy.
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_aLzwvFGTR20/TK0capYX6UI/AAAAAAAAEuo/WA3k3hDOtOA/s1600/2.jpg
Here is him wrestling what looks like a tiger...
http://www.harnby.com/Seriesida/images/Fantomen/basta_omslag/1990_21_bo.jpg
Also here...
http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_aLzwvFGTR20/TIbMo1xooWI/AAAAAAAAEko/BohAZkFGS3s/s1600/PH30.jpg
Another big cat...

Also I stumpled upon this...look at that beast. That is at least grundy maybe hulk strength.
http://t0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRwyiYbXefklhrE8xrtQrMR7oqJ0Xv-EaY32nzQwAjI2RcVGR_U17PWSUd-pQ

why is he humping all those animals? this is weird seriously a guy in purple tights humping tigers and lions..... beastality is too weird for me sorry.

See first post for realistic artistic rendition of the character. And yeah one needs to be quite strong to be raping lions and tigers, batman wouldn't be able to do it.

Originally posted by Mumrik
See first post for realistic artistic rendition of the character. And yeah one needs to be quite strong to be raping lions and tigers, batman wouldn't be able to do it.

they let him, they were trained proffesional beastality stars.

but honestly taking a comic book cover as a feat is dumb, the cover itself isnt the storyline itself and is just a picture to present what will happen in that issue, covers cannot be feats.

but seriously after darksaint85 posted a quote of you admiting you dont read comics and only look for wikipedia bios on the web i am not going to waste my time with you further.

I don't read american comics no...I'm not from america you know. And that reminds me european comics are much much better than marvel and DC.

Originally posted by Mumrik
I don't read american comics no...I'm not from america you know. And that reminds me european comics are much much better than marvel and DC.

where are you from if its not too personal to ask?

Let's use your logic Mumrik. Phantom is a comic book and movie character. He possesses feats that would probably kill a normal man. Therefore, if we want a realistic outcome, we have to assume that all feats you've listed for Phantom are PIS. There's no way he could be the fierce jungle sex cat in real life.

So, now it's an in-shape guy in purple vs. an in-shape guy in black. We're no longer talking about Batman and Phantom, but their "realistic" counterparts.

Flip a coin, heads will be Batman, tails Phantom. Let me know how it goes. That's who wins.

Most. Retarded. Logic. Ever.

Even better, let's go full on internet rage-boner and meet up in real life. I'll dress as Batman and bring some sleeping gas grenades, and you can dress in purple and bring...I dunno, a tiger penis or something. We'll fight. It will be a realistic outcome. We'll post the results to end the debate forever.

Originally posted by Mumrik
I don't read american comics no...I'm not from america you know. And that reminds me european comics are much much better than marvel and DC.

This is hilarious. Please tell me you see the flaw.

"I don't drink orange juice ever, but cranberry juice is better than orange juice."

Seriously, are you trolling? Or do you just not understand what Batman is capable of, and think that making things up as you go along will fly with anyone else?

Actually it's theoretically possible...however there is no way batman could break the neck of a lion with one hand. That is not possible or kick down a tree for that matter.
Lmao no I'll just bring two guns and my black belt.
Lol, yeah well visually better and has better characters. I have actually seen the many characters that have been created within the DC and marvel universes and most of them are quite lame. The stories are quite bad too, bad guy...super guy comes shoots lasers users secret weapon etc etc. Many of the comics in europe including phantom actually got good stories and good characters.

12 000 comic books about a single character, I wonder if any of the thousands of different super heroes from marvel could say the same. Imagine the history the phantom character has in comparison to let's say Captain america or wolverine for example.
I'm not trolling however I do enjoy this...as for making things up no I'm not. I'm just trying to come to some kind of truth. Batman had 3 years of training as a ninja, the phantom which is a highly trained physical guy from the jungles...not some playboy guy. He is a legend...omg the very idea of the phantom. He is like the male archetype of physical and heroic perfection. You obviously don't know who the phantom is...Hell I'd probably say Tarzan would knock batman out as well...

Originally posted by Mumrik
Lmao no I'll just bring two guns and my black belt.

Uh-oh, it's on now. Way to reinforce the stereotype I was going for, it's appreciated.



Originally posted by Mumrik
Lol, yeah well visually better and has better characters. I have actually seen the many characters that have been created within the DC and marvel universes and most of them are quite lame. The stories are quite bad too, bad guy...super guy comes shoots lasers users secret weapon etc etc. Many of the comics in europe including phantom actually got good stories and good characters.

Poor grammar aside, you're acting like this is the only type of comic Americans produce. it's not, by a long shot. Again, you simply aren't working with full knowledge of what you're talking about.

Originally posted by Mumrik
12 000 comic books about a single character, I wonder if any of the thousands of different super heroes from marvel could say the same. Imagine the history the phantom character has in comparison to let's say Captain america or wolverine for example.

This is also flawed logic. You're using appearances alone to suggest power levels. If a character has 5 appearances but destroys a planet, is he less powerful than a martial artist with 12,000?

Second, you yourself have said that Phantom isn't one guy, but like 20. So cut the 12,000 by 20 and you're at under 1,000 for each. Wolverine has had more appearances than that in the last decade, let alone his whole history.

So yes, plenty have this kind of history. More evidence that you don't have the requisite knowledge to debate this.

Originally posted by Mumrik
I'm not trolling however I do enjoy this...as for making things up no I'm not. I'm just trying to come to some kind of truth.

Ignoring a character's history and feats as "PIS" will not get you to the truth. There's a reason that literally everyone in this thread disagrees with you, and it's not because we're not aware of the Phantom's capabilities.

Originally posted by Mumrik
Batman had 3 years of training as a ninja, the phantom which is a highly trained physical guy from the jungles...not some playboy guy. He is a legend...omg the very idea of the phantom. He is like the male archetype of physical and heroic perfection. You obviously don't know who the phantom is...Hell I'd probably say Tarzan would knock batman out as well...

Lulz, irony.

You very much need to be well-versed on both characters before entering a debate. As it is, it's very clear you're not. This invalidates your opinion to everyone here. You'll have to do a better job of removing this bias or you won't be taken seriously.

You've also said things like a tiger being close to Grundy or Hulk in strength, suggesting that you've never read anything about them. Hulk recently destroyed a planet. Grundy has KO'd Superman.

Go do some research. We have a forum that will help:
http://www.killermovies.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?forumid=98
Come back in a month when you actually understand what comics are like. Or continue to look like an ill-informed jerk that ignores anything said against his opinion. Your choice.

Lol, you basically come in here saying you don't read American comics because the stories suck and Batman's feats are all PIS and then turn around and state he only has three years training as a ninja and have the gall to say "I'm not trolling"?

He was probably basing the 3 years thing on the movie, after all that seems to be the version he is most familiar with.

Anyway his argument is stupid, he might as well say the Phantom can beat Pre-Crisis Karate Kid, because Karate Kid is "just human" so all his feats are PIS.

Golden thread.