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What if the fight in JLA 2 had gone until one side was KO'ed? Who would have won?

DCnU Superman

vs

DCnU Hal, Flash and Batman

I would have to go with the trio

According to that specific comic - it looked like Superman would have ended up winning.

In a forum setting, the three win.

Flash is the biggest threat.

Superman was fast enough to flick him away with a finger and it wasn't jobbing on Flash's part either, he was totally shocked that Superman could hit him with his femtosecond speed when he had never been hit before.

After Barry goes down, there is nothing Hal or Batman can do.

Batman brings out the green rock. Its over

A non jobbing flash should make superman seem like a statue, atleast thats how it is in Pre DCnU (see flash vs zoom)

Originally posted by Shabazz916
Batman brings out the green rock. Its over

That will feel like its taking an eternity to Superman.

Pre DCnU Hal vs Supes would have went either way.

Since the DCnU likes to seem to nerf Hal, I'd say the team wins if they play it smart, loses if they fight without a strategy

DCnU Hal doesn't have the reflexes to make it competitive.

In a forum fight, it actually goes worse for the trio than it did in the comic.

Originally posted by CosmicComet
Flash is the biggest threat.

Superman was fast enough to flick him away with a finger and it wasn't jobbing on Flash's part either, he was totally shocked that Superman could hit him with his femtosecond speed when he had never been hit before.

After Barry goes down, there is nothing Hal or Batman can do.

how was the issue timed? I mean the issue of Justice League in which they fight was out before the issue of flash where he learned how to "slow" things down. Was the timeline different then the issue release?

Anyways I don't think flash was moving as fast as he can because everything would have been frozen in that fight because 1 second is to 1 million years as 1 femtosecond is to 1 second.

1 Second is 1 Million Years To Flash.

Nuff said

kind of the point I was making

EDIT: If it takes a relative million years to move from a femtosecond to a second then seconds would be stretched into crazy long moments as well and when they fought it didn't seem like everything around them were frozen. I think he wasn't moving at full speed since nothing has been able to tag him previously. So in essence he was being a little cocky and was surprised.

Originally posted by Colossus-Big C
A non jobbing flash should make superman seem like a statue, atleast thats how it is in Pre DCnU (see flash vs zoom)

It was clearly implied that superman was going to win in the comic.

Originally posted by Shabazz916
Batman brings out the green rock. Its over

He doesn't have one in DCnU.

Anyway, Supes wins. He already tagged Flash and it didn't seem to involve CIS or PIS.

As far as the Flash's appearances, I've only read Flash #1 in DCnU and all the JLA appearances. What are his best speed feats in the new 52?

Oh I would have given that fight to Superman had it kept going. Hal was getting worked and Superman could have delivered a KO shot instead of a flick had he felt like it in my opinion. Supes ftw.

Originally posted by Colossus-Big C
1 Second is 1 Million Years To Flash.

Nuff said

No it isn't. If it was, he'd be insane.

Originally posted by PillarofOsiris
As far as the Flash's appearances, I've only read Flash #1 in DCnU and all the JLA appearances. What are his best speed feats in the new 52?

he learned how to access the speed force through his mind(issue #3-4) so he could speed it up so much everything appears to be frozen. Barry said it was like seeing every possible outcome unfold in front of his eyes. The down side is if he gets to caught up in sorting out the different outcomes he will stand entirely still until he gets tagged. But while things are frozen he said he can move without even being seen now. The instance he first used it he moved and arranged objects because a car was going to crash into someone. Now keep in mind someone was talking to him and he was gone and back so fast that he didn't even miss half a word of what was being said. Not to mention he did it all out of costume.

Superman.

Batman is a non-factor because he has little to no intel on Superman by that time. Hal Jordan would have been owned worse than the beating Diana gave him had Barry not interfered. I also think Flash would have been knocked out had Superman punched instead of using his finger. Barry was messing around...but he was lucky Superman was messing around too.

Originally posted by BlackZero30x
he learned how to access the speed force through his mind(issue #3-4) so he could speed it up so much everything appears to be frozen. Barry said it was like seeing every possible outcome unfold in front of his eyes. The down side is if he gets to caught up in sorting out the different outcomes he will stand entirely still until he gets tagged. But while things are frozen he said he can move without even being seen now. The instance he first used it he moved and arranged objects because a car was going to crash into someone. Now keep in mind someone was talking to him and he was gone and back so fast that he didn't even miss half a word of what was being said. Not to mention he did it all out of costume.

Thanks. I haven't kept up on the Flash books because I'm already getting bogged down with buying every issue Superman, Superboy, Action Comics, JLA, Stormwatch, and Detective as soon as they come out ....and that's just DCnU. I wish I could keep up with GL, Flash and WW also, but it's too much at this point. It will be good when there's some hardcovers.

No problem. Flash is my main book so I never miss an issue. Some occasions I might be a little late on picking it up but I never miss it lol
I don't have a huge list of books though. lol

Originally posted by -Pr-
No it isn't. If it was, he'd be insane.

lol well this is comics. The land where a million years fail to make someone insane.
Flash and Superman in the diner showed how flash views things (frozen time) when he is using his powers. Also Flash has fought for more than a second using speed. That means a million years is no problem to him

Originally posted by h1a8
lol well this is comics. The land where a million years fail to make someone insane.
Flash and Superman in the diner showed how flash views things (frozen time) when he is using his powers. Also Flash has fought for more than a second using speed. That means a million years is no problem to him

True, that he can accelerate to that speed, but when you think about the day to day tasks that must take forever. Like making breakfast or having a shower, for instance.

Originally posted by BlackZero30x
he learned how to access the speed force through his mind(issue #3-4) so he could speed it up so much everything appears to be frozen. Barry said it was like seeing every possible outcome unfold in front of his eyes. The down side is if he gets to caught up in sorting out the different outcomes he will stand entirely still until he gets tagged. But while things are frozen he said he can move without even being seen now. The instance he first used it he moved and arranged objects because a car was going to crash into someone. Now keep in mind someone was talking to him and he was gone and back so fast that he didn't even miss half a word of what was being said. Not to mention he did it all out of costume.

Dcnu flash is already a damn beast. Imo he's the only character in the Dcnu who's feats are even close to what they were before. Considering these kind of feats, if flash was serious I don't think supes would have ever touched him. Supes' Dcnu feats just don't stack up yet. Hal wouldn't last long, it would come down to supes and flash.

Wasn't the only reason Superman tagged him because he flicked his finger after missing a punch, which Flash wasn't expecting at all? Extending his reach and all that.

Been a while since I seen it, but Batman wins.

Originally posted by Branlor Swift
Wasn't the only reason Superman tagged him because he flicked his finger after missing a punch, which Flash wasn't expecting at all? Extending his reach and all that.

Been a while since I seen it, but Batman wins.

I didn't read it that way at all. It looked like Flash was actively trying to avoid Superman. To me it seemed like a big slow boxer vs a smaller quicker boxer. Clearly Flash was faster, but Superman wasn't so slow that he was a statue to Flash either, and eventually Superman was going to land a blow, just like if the two boxers stay in the same ring together long enough, the big one will eventually hit the quick one. That's my own personal take anyway.

Originally posted by Branlor Swift
Wasn't the only reason Superman tagged him because he flicked his finger after missing a punch, which Flash wasn't expecting at all? Extending his reach and all that.

Been a while since I seen it, but Batman wins.

That's how I viewed it.

Originally posted by Colossus-Big C
1 Second is 1 Million Years To Flash.

Nuff said

Originally posted by PillarofOsiris
I didn't read it that way at all. It looked like Flash was actively trying to avoid Superman. To me it seemed like a big slow boxer vs a smaller quicker boxer. Clearly Flash was faster, but Superman wasn't so slow that he was a statue to Flash either, and eventually Superman was going to land a blow, just like if the two boxers stay in the same ring together long enough, the big one will eventually hit the quick one. That's my own personal take anyway. The way I viewed it was Berry was being cocky. I distinctly remember him saying something like " don't even try it's never been done before". Superman punched and missed a bunch then as flash came around instead of swinging at him superman flicked his finger out and caught him. I attributed it to flash being cocky (not expecting supermans speed) and superman used it to time an unexpected attack. I also think the reason he didn't actually swing was 1 to show off a bit also and 2 he felt flicking a finger would be less noticeable then swinging a whole arm.

When I read it, I took it to mean Superman had thrown a punch, but pulled it at the last second, just enough to make Flash stop. The shock of being stopped gave Superman the opening to hit him, which he did.

I could see that as a possibility. I will have to re read it and refresh my memory Its been soooooooo long lol

Originally posted by -Pr-
When I read it, I took it to mean Superman had thrown a punch, but pulled it at the last second, just enough to make Flash stop. The shock of being stopped gave Superman the opening to hit him, which he did.
That's cause you're a fanboy.uhuh

Originally posted by Branlor Swift
Wasn't the only reason Superman tagged him because he flicked his finger after missing a punch, which Flash wasn't expecting at all? Extending his reach and all that.

http://i47.tinypic.com/34xeum8.jpghttp://i49.tinypic.com/211m1dx.jpg

http://i47.tinypic.com/bfm0z8.jpg

Superman timed that attack...appears he seen a pattern. Flash was clearly faster than him...much faster.

I love how you try to make him look good just so you can try to hide your put-down in the same post.

Originally posted by Blair Wind
http://i47.tinypic.com/34xeum8.jpghttp://i49.tinypic.com/211m1dx.jpg

http://i47.tinypic.com/bfm0z8.jpg

That supports my reasoning, imo.

team wins..Hal and Flash together is too much for Supes..Supes can win if Hal spend his time protecting Batman..

Superman beats all three.

Who do u think wins this fight, Pr?

I think due to that scan its open to interpretation but I can see Blairs point. Superman has a fully extended arm then once flash stops he flicks his finger outward. But it does destroy the argument that superman tagged him because "he was fast enough".

Originally posted by Branlor Swift
Wasn't the only reason Superman tagged him because he flicked his finger after missing a punch, which Flash wasn't expecting at all? Extending his reach and all that.

Been a while since I seen it, but Batman wins. Flash is looking right at him - Superman does a turn, stops his punch right in front of Flash's face, flicks his finger and exerts enough control not to rip his face off, yet it's less impressive of a speed showing than..tagging him?

Flash was actively avoiding Superman. Superman went to punch him and it looked like he WOULD HAVE PUNCHED HIM....If he had wanted to, but instead he flicked him. Downplay it all you want, it's a great speed feat for DCnU Supes.

facepalm

It clearly looks like Superman swung his fully extended arm - meaning he didn't pull a punch or that he could tag him with a normal punch. He didn't stop the motion of his punch going forward because his arm wasn't going in that direction - it was going sideways. He stopped the motion of his already fully extended arm, there was still a finger's length of distance between his arm and Flash, and he took advantage of that.

I mean, why would he pull a punch after trying to punch him for two pages?

He is obviously fast enough to be able to react to Flash - the flick being proof of that - but he's most definitely slower and didn't punch him because he couldn't. I don't see that as "downplaying" Superman in any way. In my opinion he would have dominated that fight if it had continued with the three of them being nothing but paste.

Clearly there's about 5 people in this thread who disagree with you. It clearly looked to me like he had timed it to stop his punch right before Flash's face and then flick him. Clearly.

Originally posted by keiththegreat
Clearly there's about 5 people in this thread who disagree with you. It clearly looked to me like he had timed it to stop his punch right before Flash's face and then flick him. Clearly.


Look who the people are that disagrees with him.

Originally posted by PillarofOsiris
Who do u think wins this fight, Pr?

In a forum setting the three should win. In that comic though, Superman did seem like he was going to be hard to put down.

Originally posted by Blair Wind
facepalm

It clearly looks like Superman swung his fully extended arm - meaning he didn't pull a punch or that he could tag him with a normal punch. He didn't stop the motion of his punch going forward because his arm wasn't going in that direction - it was going sideways. He stopped the motion of his already fully extended arm, there was still a finger's length of distance between his arm and Flash, and he took advantage of that.

I mean, why would he pull a punch after trying to punch him for two pages?

He is obviously fast enough to be able to react to Flash - the flick being proof of that - but he's most definitely slower and didn't punch him because he couldn't. I don't see that as "downplaying" Superman in any way. In my opinion he would have dominated that fight if it had continued with the three of them being nothing but paste.

Except that to me, it looked like he stopped his punch before it collided with Flash's face. When you swing your am back in that direction, it can go further, so why did he stop?

I'm not accusing you of anything; the page is open to interpretation.

Originally posted by carver9
Look who the people are that disagrees with him.

Don't even try it.

Originally posted by Blair Wind
facepalm

It clearly looks like Superman swung his fully extended arm - meaning he didn't pull a punch or that he could tag him with a normal punch. There was still a finger's length of distance and he took advantage of that.

I mean, why would he pull a punch after trying to punch him for two pages?

He is obviously fast enough to be able to react to Flash - the flick being proof of that - but he's most definitely slower and didn't punch him because he couldn't. I don't see that as "downplaying" Superman in any way. In my opinion he would have dominated that fight if it had continued with the three of them being nothing but paste. Superman didn't try to punch him for two pages - he was trying to grab him. The scans blatantly show that, and it's consistent with what Superman did the next page - flick him away (to Flash's surprise that Superman managed to tag him):

http://i49.tinypic.com/211m1dx.jpg

I hope I don't have to elaborate on it, because it would be idiotic.

On the other hand, we have your position, which is that Superman wanted to punch Flash straight in the face, missed but somehow managed to stop his fist right in front of Flash's face (who was looking at him this whole time), and flick him away carefully enough not to disfigure him, eventough, by your accounts, he was looking to fist him in the face a literal fraction of a second earlier.

I know you like Flash, but your position is illogical.

Superman wins and he could have won that fight.

Originally posted by keiththegreat
Clearly there's about 5 people in this thread who disagree with you. It clearly looked to me like he had timed it to stop his punch right before Flash's face and then flick him. Clearly.

People are gonna interpret how they want but the point is no matter how you interpret it Flash was clearly faster and messing around. Though I think at that point flash would have worn out before causing any damage to superman so superman would have won that fight.

Originally posted by -Pr-
Except that to me, it looked like he stopped his punch before it collided with Flash's face. When you swing your am back in that direction, it can go further, so why did he stop?

Because you lose all your power when you swing behind your body, unless you're moving with it. Plus it's stupid as hell.
There's a reason Brock Lesnar was laughed at for throwing a standing hammer fist at Cain in that fight.

Mind you, Superman still has tons of power doing anything, but it doesn't mean he automatically pulled his punch, since that's pretty much the angle where you pretty much have no power.

He still tagged him, so there's that. And I think he would tag him anyway eventually without that, but that feat doesn't really mean much outside Flash has pretty shitty durability. It's more of those "haha cute" things IMO. And with Superman's J-Biebish hair, it doesn't get much cuter than that.

Lol...

Originally posted by Branlor Swift
Because you lose all your power when you swing behind your body, unless you're moving with it. Plus it's stupid as hell.
There's a reason Brock Lesnar was laughed at for throwing a standing hammer fist at Cain in that fight.

Mind you, Superman still has tons of power doing anything, but it doesn't mean he automatically pulled his punch, since that's pretty much the angle where you pretty much have no power.

He still tagged him, so there's that. And I think he would tag him anyway eventually without that, but that feat doesn't really mean much outside Flash has pretty shitty durability. It's more of those "haha cute" things IMO. And with Superman's J-Biebish hair, it doesn't get much cuter than that.

So you think he swung back as far as he was able?

Originally posted by Branlor Swift

He still tagged him, so there's that. And I think he would tag him anyway eventually without that, but that feat doesn't really mean much outside Flash has pretty shitty durability.

?

Originally posted by -Pr-
So you think he swung back as far as he was able? I think he swung as far back as was natural. Look at the way he swung. He pretty much just extended his elbow. Doing that, you don't get very far before you stop.
Which was smarter than giving it a full swing since there's less recovery needed and less tell involved, and it obviously... worked.

Originally posted by Branlor Swift
I think he swung as far back as was natural. Look at the way he swung. He pretty much just extended his elbow. Doing that, you don't get very far before you stop.
Which was smarter than giving it a full swing since there's less recovery needed and less tell involved, and it obviously... worked. I agree, it's just a coincidence that Superman's fist (the one he apparently wanted to use on Flash's face) stopped right in front of Barry's face, a flick away.

Originally posted by Blair Wind

I don't like or dislike Flash. And not really. I know you for the guy who has a hard on for Iron Man and Flash, and is apparently tough shit in the tournaments. Pretty sure I'm right.

And yes really.

Originally posted by PillarofOsiris
What if the fight in JLA 2 had gone until one side was KO'ed? Who would have won?

DCnU Superman

vs

DCnU Hal, Flash and Batman iirc flash doesn't have his "dwarf star" punches (that don't even hit like dwarf stars), so i really can't see him harming superman other than the punch him in the same spot 30 times before breaking his carpals.

superman stomps

Superman would have won if that fight continued.

Lol @ people accusing other people of having agendas and the like, though.

Superman kills Hal, and Flash in one shot.

Batman wins.

Originally posted by Branlor Swift
I think he swung as far back as was natural. Look at the way he swung. He pretty much just extended his elbow. Doing that, you don't get very far before you stop.
Which was smarter than giving it a full swing since there's less recovery needed and less tell involved, and it obviously... worked.

So do you think he stopped intentionally, or because he was just reaching his limit?

Originally posted by Blair Wind
Here is where I think the disconnect, between you and I at least, exists.

We both agree that he stopped his punch on purpose. However, we disagree as to why. I feel that he would have clearly missed - and he would have had to twist his body to go through the full range of motion of the punch. In my scenario he stopped because he realized he wouldn't be able to hit him via punching him - so he "extended" his reach with the finger flick.

You think he would have hit the Flash's face and that is why he stopped. In my opinion, they were moving in a circular motion with the Flash getting closer (for hitting) and farther away (for dodging). I think the flash was in the middle of a dodging sequence when Superman flicked him - there was just enough space for Flash to dodge the punch (which is what he was expecting) but not enough to dodge the flick (which he was not expecting).

And I know you're not accusing me PR. We can have a disagreement without name calling or insulting.



I don't like or dislike Flash. And not really.

I disagree, tbh, purely because there's a delay: Superman swings his arm, then stops. Flash reacts, stopping himself. and then there's that moment of shock from Barry, before Superman clocks him with the flick.

That delay to me, signals that Superman used the shock to his advantage, rather than reached the limit of his reach.

Originally posted by -Pr-
So do you think he stopped intentionally, or because he was just reaching his limit? Just swing your forearm out like Superman did. See where you stop naturally.

I'm just looking at it with how he did it, and using real world logic (I know, I know comics) in a way that makes the most sense to me. Had Superman just threw a massive swinging backfist then he would have stopped intentionally, but with the way he threw it, meh.

I don't know what the real intention of that scene was, like people pretend to, but it's open to debate. And that's my angle I guess.

http://i615.photobucket.com/albums/tt240/ScarletSpeed/justice-league-5-02.jpg
http://i615.photobucket.com/albums/tt240/ScarletSpeed/justice-league-5-03.jpg

Originally posted by Branlor Swift
Just swing your forearm out like Superman did. See where you stop naturally.

I'm just looking at it with how he did it, and using real world logic (I know, I know comics) in a way that makes the most sense to me. Had Superman just threw a massive swinging backfist then he would have stopped intentionally, but with the way he threw it, meh.

I don't know what the real intention of that scene was, like people pretend to, but it's open to debate. And that's my angle I guess.

I actually did that before starting to post in this thread. When I swing, I have to physically stop myself, or I swivel (even a little) and my fist keeps going due to the momentum.

And your angle is fine; I understand why you see it that way. Just, to me, logically, he physically stops himself. The angle of his fist makes me wonder too.

Originally posted by -Pr-
I actually did that before starting to post in this thread. When I swing, I have to physically stop myself, or I swivel (even a little) and my fist keeps going due to the momentum.

And your angle is fine; I understand why you see it that way. Just, to me, logically, he physically stops himself. The angle of his fist makes me wonder too. If you don't stop yourself, do you just keep spinning around?

Different strokes for different folks I guess.

Originally posted by Branlor Swift
If you don't stop yourself, do you just keep spinning around?

Different strokes for different folks I guess.