Superboy Prime vs The Avengers

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Damborgson
Prime's being his whiny b*tchy self like always, and finds himself confronted by the Avengers. So naturally he decided to kill them. Here's the roster:

Ironman

Thor

World War Hulk

Red Hulk

Ares

War Machine



who wins?

http://media.comicvine.com/uploads/0/77/152341-165217-superboy-prime_super.jpg

vs

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/e/e0/Iron_Man_bleeding_edge.jpg/250px-Iron_Man_bleeding_edge.jpg

http://www.dynamicforces.com/images/thor1turner.jpg

http://i.annihil.us/u/prod/marvel/i/mg/2/e0/4bc443053375b/standard_xlarge.jpg

http://images1.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb57887/villains/images/e/e2/Hulk_vs_Red_Hulk.jpg
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/2/2c/Aresherc.png

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/b/bf/IROMcover33F.jpg/250px-IROMcover33F.jpg

Uriel005
Prime

carver9
Everyone dies while WWH and Prime goes at it.

Harbinger
Prime mauls. Most of the team gets one-shotted.

ColossusGrundy
Prime wins, WWH is last one to go down and gives him a few good shots before Prime goes nuts and ends him.

bluewaterrider
If Jeph Loeb writes this, Red Hulk wins by absorbing the cocktail of energies (solar, gamma, cosmic, whatever) in Prime's body and beats him within an inch of his life. The heroes may or may not have to fight Rulk themselves at that point. Historically that answer would depend on whether or not Rulk saw the chance to recruit Prime, any allies Prime came with, for some pet government related cause.

If Greg Pak writes this, Rulk is a non-factor, but World War Hulk turns World Breaker after Prime takes out much of the rest of the field. After trading a few punches, Hulk knocks Prime clear into another dimension with one really big punch, and Prime, despite talk of how "next time" he's going to turn that "Big Green Salad-Headed Idiot" inside out, wisely finds ways to avoid the Marvel Universe from that point on.

juggerman
Carver is dead on here. But he left out the part that Hulk doesn't live much longer than the others



laughing

Sundipped
Prime 11/10.

lawest9
Originally posted by juggerman
Carver is dead on here. But he left out the part that Hulk doesn't live much longer than the others



laughing Yes........that IS funny. And unless this is KING THOR, everyone on this list dies brutally.

Diesldude
Originally posted by bluewaterrider
If Jeph Loeb writes this, Red Hulk wins by absorbing the cocktail of energies (solar, gamma, cosmic, whatever) in Prime's body and beats him within an inch of his life. The heroes may or may not have to fight Rulk themselves at that point. Historically that answer would depend on whether or not Rulk saw the chance to recruit Prime, any allies Prime came with, for some pet government related cause.

If Greg Pak writes this, Rulk is a non-factor, but World War Hulk turns World Breaker after Prime takes out much of the rest of the field. After trading a few punches, Hulk knocks Prime clear into another dimension with one really big punch, and Prime, despite talk of how "next time" he's going to turn that "Big Green Salad-Headed Idiot" inside out, wisely finds ways to avoid the Marvel Universe from that point on. This utter fail because blue you are either ignorant of sbp's powers or lie intentionally so that those who don't know will begin to believe as you want then to.. Sb needed just a touch of light on his fingertips to overpower a half a dozen high heralds. Now think about that, how much will rulk need to absorb when all SBP needs to get to full power is to expose his fingertips to sunlight. You're luck I am wasting my time with a response for you but all it deserves is an LOL.

PillarofOsiris
Originally posted by carver9
Everyone dies while WWH and Prime goes at it.

Coming from the guy who got Superman's top speed from Wizard, I'm not surprised.

In all seriousness, this team dies as Prime rips off Thor's arm that's holding Mjolnir and beats the rest of the team to death with it.

Damborgson
Id like prime more if he wasnt such a little btch. He doesnt deserve al that power he has. But even so he has his cool moments to I guess

Zack Fair
Originally posted by Damborgson
Id like prime more if he wasnt such a little btch. He doesnt deserve al that power he has. But even so he has his cool moments to I guess LoL TBH I love SBP's lunacy. "I'll kill you to death" Out of control Supermen are fun.

As for the fight I don't see Iron Man and War Machine getting past one single shot from Prime.

Ares gets the Voidtry treatment.

Rulk gets destroyed next.

Then Thor gets knocked the **** out for the 101th time.

World War Hulk survives for a while and eventually gets KTFO.

NemeBro
Originally posted by Damborgson
Id like prime more if he wasnt such a little btch. He doesnt deserve al that power he has. But even so he has his cool moments to I guess Stfu Superboy Prime has the best lines in the universe.

*Grabs Guy Gardner by the throat, rendering him a helpless pansy*
"You're rude and offensive Guy Gardner. I wonder who your ring is going to?"

But yeah, Prime kills most of the team to death fairly quickly, leaving Thor and WWH, then he kills them to death too.

Golgo13
I think the lineup of TT is a little more powerful than the Avengers, so I will say Prime.

SamZED
Also he jobbed to TT. It was their very last battle. Did anyone actually expect them to lose? And even then it was shown that it takes of all their combined efforts and there are some really powerful heroes on the team.

JakeTheBank
It also turned the Titans into murderers.

carver9
Hulk gives him a fight but he would "probably" lose in the end..

Damborgson
Originally posted by NemeBro
Stfu Superboy Prime has the best lines in the universe.

*Grabs Guy Gardner by the throat, rendering him a helpless pansy*
"You're rude and offensive Guy Gardner. I wonder who your ring is going to?"

But yeah, Prime kills most of the team to death fairly quickly, leaving Thor and WWH, then he kills them to death too.

Your gayness for Prime clouds your judgement. http://images.killermovies.com/forums/customsmilies/uhuh.gif

but seriously this is the part of Prime I like:
http://img805.imageshack.us/img805/8702/primebadass.jpg

this is the part of Prime I facepalm at:

http://img402.imageshack.us/img402/9550/primepansy.jpg

It's a love/hate sort of thing I guess.

Originally posted by Zack Fair
LoL TBH I love SBP's lunacy. "I'll kill you to death" Out of control Supermen are fun.



"kill you to death" laughing out loud Ugh I just can't make myself like it. His flying fanboy rages against Superman are good though.

juggerman
Hulk give him his jolly green ass for Prime to rape. There's no "probably" about it

Damborgson
Originally posted by juggerman
Hulk give him his jolly green ass for Prime to rape. There's no "probably" about it

thumb up

carver9
Originally posted by juggerman
Hulk give him his jolly green ass for Prime to rape. There's no "probably" about it

I seen nothing from Prime to make me believe he would stomp Hulk. Hulk has the fts proving he would give Prime a fight.

juggerman
Seriously?

carver9
Yes, seriously. Prime is powerful, no doubt, but Hulk is powerful as well.

juggerman
We're talking about a guy that casually kills GLs with his HV while their shields are up. A guy whose HV easily cuts thru Superman while in a weakened state. Why couldn't he just cut off WWH's head with it? He has been shown to be cut by far less iirc

Unless you're saying Hulk will keep fighting without a head which Pak would probably have him do

carver9
Originally posted by juggerman
We're talking about a guy that casually kills GLs with his HV while their shields are up. A guy whose HV easily cuts thru Superman while in a weakened state. Why couldn't he just cut off WWH's head with it? He has been shown to be cut by far less iirc

Unless you're saying Hulk will keep fighting without a head which Pak would probably have him do


He killed fodder GL. His heat vision probably would cut Hulk but cut his head off...hell no. Hulk would probably heal that crap before the damage is done. Then let's not include the fact that heat doesn't work against Hulk. Hulk would give Prime a hell of a fight unless we completely ignore everything just to support Prime.

Also, besides Adamantium, what has cut through Hulk (let's not name everything that had damaged Prime).

carver9
Your argument is like me saying "since Conner beat the hell out of Prime and had blood gooshing from his face, Hulk should be able to punch his head off".

Nephthys
Didn't Prime tank the universe exploding right in his face though?

carver9
Originally posted by Nephthys
Didn't Prime tank the universe exploding right in his face though?

Don't know. I always thought of it as Time Trapper interfering but it doesn't matter since we've seen how well Prime handle punches.

leonidas
if rulk is in grandmaster ko'ing mode, they can win. otherwise they go down....

juggerman
@ carver

Hulk was cut by other things iirc and Prime easily overpowered Superman and other heralds at the same time while laughing.

I'm not ignoring Hulk's feats but Prime's durability was all over the place like tanking universal blasts but getting chipped by weak ass Connor. Or ripping thru Superman MM WW Power Girl and whoever else was there but jobbing to the TT.

Hulk was more consistant imo so saying things like "Connor hurt him so (enter character stronger than Connor) can too" is completely different than saying "Hulk was cut, bloodied, stalemated, or what have you by whomever " since Hulk had limitation that were less muddled.

I completely get your point tho i just see them differently since what will or will not hurt Prime today won't be the same as tomorrow

carver9
@Juggerman..

I'm not debating your judgement because I can see why some consider Prime as a monster but looking at everything as a whole, I can't picture Prime running through Hulk.

Also, Prime didn't easily defeat Superman, it took time. Prime also didn't easily defeat ION either and the fight probably would still be going on if a plot didn't take effect (like lead being around).

Hulk has recently been walking through everyone that has come his way and even before this, he held his own against teams. Prime has as well which again, gives me good reasons to believe Hulk would do well against Prime and if Prime doesn't play his cards right, he could lose.

juggerman
I really can't see Hulk doing anything to Prime

Damborgson
Prime has been hurt from everywhere to Superboy to universe busters. Hurting him isn't the problem so much as putting him down is.

carver9
@Damborgson...

I agree.

@Juggerman...

WTF

juggerman
Ok what i should have said was "I really can't see Hulk beating Prime"

Damborgson
Originally posted by juggerman
Ok what i should have said was "I really can't see Hulk beating Prime" thumb up

abhilegend
SBP pwned Sodam yat+guardian power+Ion Power+Energy of entire Central battery in one panel flat after getting sunlight sucked out of him and oneshotted Brainiac 5's forcefield, which even Time trapper has failed to break. He kills everyone here to death.

dynamix
feat wise, Hulk isnt f'in with Superboy Prime. Prime went up against Monarch and won (arguable though). Besides strange and sentry, i don't see wwh doing too much against the other obstacles that he couldn't do as regular Hulk.

iceman24567
prime stomps

Diesldude
Originally posted by carver9
Don't know. I always thought of it as Time Trapper interfering but it doesn't matter since we've seen how well Prime handle punches. This proves you don't read comics but still continue to state your lies as facts. C'mon carver it was plain as day, prime took the blast, the universe got destroyed and prime was floating unconciously and that's when the trapper then plucked him out. The trapper didnt grab him before or during the explosion. Prime took a universe buster at point blank range. Just admit it dude, WBH dying from a planet buster is more evident than this. We don't see anyone but rubble and umar. In sbp's case we see nothing, no universe just him floating unconsciously. There is no doubt there dude, there is nothing left for misinterpretation. Read a comic bro.

DarkSaint85
Prime wins, but based on his averages, its no stomp.

ColossusGrundy
"RAAARGH HULK BUTTHURT!"

"HULK BUTT ANGRY!"

celeyhyga17
Originally posted by Damborgson
Prime's being his whiny b*tchy self like always, and finds himself confronted by the Avengers. So naturally he decided to kill them. Here's the roster:

Ironman

Thor

World War Hulk

Red Hulk

Ares

War Machine



who wins?

http://media.comicvine.com/uploads/0/77/152341-165217-superboy-prime_super.jpg

vs

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/e/e0/Iron_Man_bleeding_edge.jpg/250px-Iron_Man_bleeding_edge.jpg

http://www.dynamicforces.com/images/thor1turner.jpg

http://i.annihil.us/u/prod/marvel/i/mg/2/e0/4bc443053375b/standard_xlarge.jpg

http://images1.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb57887/villains/images/e/e2/Hulk_vs_Red_Hulk.jpg
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/2/2c/Aresherc.png

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/b/bf/IROMcover33F.jpg/250px-IROMcover33F.jpg

War Machine and Iron Man get their hearts ripped out. Ares gets torn in half. WWH and Rulk get punted into space and die of asphyxiation. Thor will give the best fight, but ultimately get knockedafukout.

Zack Fair
This is the beginning of Ares vs Prime

http://www.bleedingcool.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/02/ow.jpg

Replace the lighting with heat vision and this is what happens to iron Man and War Machine

http://nerdreactor.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/08/Thor-vs-Iron-Man.jpg

http://media.comicvine.com/uploads/10/102836/2323154-captain_america_damage_output.jpg

Then comes Rulk
http://25.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m7d4rejpN61qfb3cko1_500.jpg

And Thor gets humiliated again at superspeed
http://media.comicvine.com/uploads/6/67064/1950005-thorowned.jpg

Meanwhile Hulk is

http://i.imgur.com/YDdi9.jpg

True story.

Damborgson
laughing out loud

ColossusGrundy
Only thing better would have been Hulk saying "STOP HITTING YOURSELF" while beating Thor with his own hammer

Zack Fair
The *gurgle* sound effect makes my day.

carver9
Hulk solos. Prime is the best villain that has ever been created but WWH is a MONSTER.

DarkSaint85
Originally posted by carver9
Hulk solos. Prime is the best villain that has ever been created but WWH is a MONSTER.

Unless he got BFR'ed, of course wink

-Pr-
Originally posted by carver9
Hulk solos. Prime is the best villain that has ever been created but WWH is a MONSTER.

Stop.

carver9
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Unless he got BFR'ed, of course wink

D***, I forgot about that. Prime solos.

carver9
Originally posted by -Pr-
Stop.


Lol...stop what?

JakeTheBank
Prime is the best villain that has ever been created?

Dance in oncoming traffic.

carver9
He is though. This is my opinion (which means a lot).

-Pr-
Originally posted by carver9
He is though. This is my opinion (which means a lot).

To who?

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
Dance in oncoming traffic.

thumb up

JakeTheBank
Your opinion is wrong.

I'm by no means a Prime hater - I think he's pretty cool - but nowhere close to being the best villain ever. Not even top 30, tbh.

DarkSaint85
MORE POWER = COOLER CHARACTER.

carver9
WTF? Alright Jake. IMO he is pretty high up there. I'm referring to modern day villains, not classics.

-Pr-
Originally posted by carver9
WTF? Alright Jake. IMO he is pretty high up there. I'm referring to modern day villains, not classics.

How small a period are we talking?

Zack Fair
All it takes is one pic of Hulk taking a dump to make carv lose it.

carver9
Originally posted by -Pr-
How small a period are we talking?

1995 and up.

carver9
Originally posted by Zack Fair
All it takes is one pic of Hulk taking a dump to make carv lose it.

laughing out loud

-Pr-
Originally posted by carver9
1995 and up.

lol, no.

Larfleeze laughs at you.

That, and Prime was created long before then.

carver9
Originally posted by -Pr-
lol, no.

Larfleeze laughs at you.

That, and Prime was created long before then.

Larfleeze is an interesting character but he isn't Prime interesting.

I know Prime was created before then, he is a classic character. I'm referring to his showings during the crisis.

-Pr-
Originally posted by carver9
Larfleeze is an interesting character but he isn't Prime interesting.

I know Prime was created before then, he is a classic character. I'm referring to his showings during the crisis.

"interesting".

Wut?

Is it your mutual hatred of Superman that brings you together?

carver9
Originally posted by -Pr-
"interesting".

Wut?

Is it your mutual hatred of Superman that brings you together?

People would pick up a Prime book before Larfleeze.

You know what I am talking about Pr. Prime latest showings...nothing classic.

carver9
I like Superman as well.

DarkSaint85
I thought Superboy Prime (and then Superman Prime) were just PC characters, transplanted into the modern age? So his feats are what he's always done in the old comics, its just that the modern age is more restrained?

carver9
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
I thought Superboy Prime (and then Superman Prime) were just PC characters, transplanted into the modern age? So his feats are what he's always done in the old comics, its just that the modern age is more restrained?

His PC days, he seemed far stronger and durable. I really wouldn't pass those fts to current Prime. Then he was pretty lame back then.

DarkSaint85
Wut?

He was stronger and durable during his PC days....then he was pretty lame then? You mean character-wise?

abhilegend
Originally posted by Zack Fair
All it takes is one pic of Hulk taking a dump to make carv lose it.
http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_k8OmTs4WafA/SPk9waEPl8I/AAAAAAAAAzQ/YU0w9q1Pwbs/s400/17_10_2008_0793878001224248779_paul_davey.jpg

carver9
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Wut?

He was stronger and durable during his PC days....then he was pretty lame then? You mean character-wise?


Yes.

-Pr-
Originally posted by carver9
People would pick up a Prime book before Larfleeze.

You know what I am talking about Pr. Prime latest showings...nothing classic.

lol no.

Doesn't matter if you're not going to be anything but vague.

Originally posted by carver9
I like Superman as well.

Sure.

carver9
Originally posted by -Pr-
lol no.

Doesn't matter if you're not going to be anything but vague.



Sure.

Can't believe you are saying that. Prime is more interesting than Larfleeze. To each his own.

Zack Fair
Prime didn't do much during the crisis. All he showed was a resistance to red sun radiation. Punched some shields and shit. Nothing really spectacular.

carver9
Originally posted by Zack Fair
Prime didn't do much during the crisis. All he showed was a resistance to red sun radiation. Punched some shields and shit. Nothing really spectacular.

I know...I'm talking about Prime as a whole though (minus his PC days). He is an awesome character.

-Pr-
Originally posted by carver9
Can't believe you are saying that. Prime is more interesting than Larfleeze. To each his own.

If you genuinely find Prime to be more interesting and entertaining than Larfleeze, I feel bad for you son.

I got 99 problems but a whiney ***** ain't one.

carver9
Originally posted by -Pr-
If you genuinely find Prime to be more interesting and entertaining than Larfleeze, I feel bad for you son.

I got 99 problems but a whiney ***** ain't one.

Just look at the sales Pr. Prime sold more books than Lar. Prime also changed DC as a whole. The character was amazing. His whining did get irritating but I don't think that took the shine from the character either.

-Pr-
Originally posted by carver9
Just look at the sales Pr. Prime sold more books than Lar. Prime also changed DC as a whole. The character was amazing. His whining did get irritating but I don't think that took the shine from the character either.

People bought books with Prime in them hoping to see someone smack the shit out of him, not because he was an intellectually stimulating villain.

Honestly, you're crazy.

carver9
Originally posted by -Pr-
People bought books with Prime in them hoping to see someone smack the shit out of him, not because he was an intellectually stimulating villain.

Honestly, you're crazy.

Uuuummm, people bought Prime book because he was a great character. You have GOT to be playing Pr. You can't be serious.

Lolololol...why am I crazy Pr? Because I like a character 90% of the people on the forum probably likes?

abhilegend
Originally posted by carver9
Uuuummm, people bought Prime book because he was a great character. You have GOT to be playing Pr. You can't be serious.

Lolololol...why am I crazy Pr? Because I like a character 90% of the people on the forum probably likes? facepalm

NemeBro
I'm an outspoken Prime fan, but the greatest villain ever? kinda

Come on man.

carver9
I said in modern days. Not entirely.

-Pr-
Originally posted by carver9
Uuuummm, people bought Prime book because he was a great character. You have GOT to be playing Pr. You can't be serious.

Lolololol...why am I crazy Pr? Because I like a character 90% of the people on the forum probably likes?

I'd ask you the same thing.

You crazy.

carver9
Originally posted by -Pr-
I'd ask you the same thing.

You crazy.

Lol...I'm not crazy. Prime is the best. This conversation is pointless. We are both right.

-Pr-
Originally posted by carver9
Lol...I'm not crazy. Prime is the best. This conversation is pointless. We are both right.

No. I'm right. You're insane.

Nihilist
Prime wins.

Its not even that close, Thor gets one shotted and WWH gets a hole punched through his head and thrown into the sun

bluewaterrider
Originally posted by Diesldude
This utter fail because blue you are either ignorant of sbp's powers or lie intentionally so that those who don't know will begin to believe as you want then to.. Sb needed just a touch of light on his fingertips to overpower a half a dozen high heralds. Now think about that, how much will rulk need to absorb when all SBP needs to get to full power is to expose his fingertips to sunlight. You're luck I am wasting my time with a response for you but all it deserves is an LOL.


If you really felt all my response deserved was some LOL emoticon, you'd have put one here and been done with it, not sent me a message that you even took the time to edit after the fact. Nor, were the post baseless, would you be concerned of other people being convinced of the argument.

As it is, you have no punch coming, I put forth that the writer Jeph Loeb would frame this encounter one way, I put forth that the writer Greg Pak would frame it another. If you want to counter that, you need to give good reason why you think they would not.

Especially given how Loeb and Pak actually structured their Red Hulk and World Breaker Hulk runs, respectively.

Fact is, under Jeph Loeb, Red Hulk took out a lot of people that he actually does not, on his own intrinsic strength levels, match up with.

Hulk himself for starters.
Twice, if memory serves correctly.

Thor.

Abomination.



You tell me that Superboy Prime took out several heralds.

Red Hulk took out Silver Surfer, the being the herald class is NAMED after, and took out one or two more of Galactus's servants for good measure.


Rulk didn't do this because he's just that powerful on his own.
He took them out because he has the ability to absorb the energies of or contained in an opponent.

In Hulk's case, he absorbed Hulk's gamma energy.
In Surfer's case, he absorbed Surfer's cosmic energy.
I doubt that he can absorb magical energy, I would guess Rulk was able to take down Thor in his famous "Moonshot" victory not only for good planning and the sheer element of surprise but also owing to the energy Rulk had previously absorbed from Hulk.
But he would go on to defeat Hulk at least a 2nd time by taking virtually all his gamma energy away from him.

Then, for good measure, Rulk began absorbing the pure sound energy of the villain known as Klaw.

Gamma, Cosmic, Sound.
If Rulk can absorb all those forms of energy, seemingly at will, if his general ability is, in fact to absorb various forms of energy from special beings, why wouldn't he be able to absorb solar energy from someone like Prime?

You want to say that draining and/or energy-absorption attacks don't work on Kryptonians? I direct you to virtually any magazine where the Parasite is the featured villain.

You want to say being in sunlight means Kryptonian healing factor or continual replacement of said energy means the Kryptonian is invincible?
I direct you to the Death of Superman trade, where fighting the high noon showdown in Metropolis, sunlight or no, translated into Superman being sent into coma.

juggerman
Superman=/=Superboy Prime

DarkSaint85
Bluewater, how would Rulks energy absorption help when SBP pushes the planet into the Sun?

juggerman
He absorbs the sun! evil face

iceman24567
Rulk isn't absorbing anything currently so who cares. Prime rips him in half

bluewaterrider
I doubt Rulk could absorb the entirety of the sun itself.

Strangely enough, Marvel DOES have characters that can do stuff like that, Dark Phoenix being the most famous of that sort, but Rulk?

I don't think so.


But you're also talking something not really outlined by this thread.

Remember, the original poster proposed this as the scenario:


Prime's being his whiny b*tchy self like always, and finds himself confronted by the Avengers



In other words, Prime is fighting the Avengers IN CHARACTER.

Superboy Prime, IN CHARACTER, does not push an entire planet into the sun to win a fight. He FIGHTS up close and personal, as comic after comic demonstrates.

Were this purely CISless PISless, purepowerset Prime he might well be able to do something like that.

That option is not a realistic consideration given the Original Poster's premise, though.

juggerman
Rulk absorbing the sun was a joke....

bluewaterrider
As for Superman not being equal to Superboy Prime, presumably you wrote that because Superman is post-Crisis and Superboy Prime is pre-Crisis.

But in that case, I again direct you to any magazine featuring the Parasite. Energy absorption worked just as well on pre-Crisis Kryptonians as post-Crisis ones. Pre-Crisis Parasite proves that to be the case.

iceman24567
Absorption isn't happening why stay on the subject

abhilegend
Rulk doesn't have absorption abilities anymore. He can siphon from gamma mutates only.

juggerman
Actually i wrote it because Superman holds back a huge amount of his power so he won't overly harm anyone including his enemies. Prime has no such handicap. He would go for the kill from jump which means Rulk (with his full absorbing powers) probably wouldn't have to time to absorb anything as his head is being removed from his body faster than he can register the pain from it.

bluewaterrider
Originally posted by iceman24567
Absorption isn't happening why stay on the subject



1. That's what Juggerman is asking about.

2. Energy absorbing Rulk is the kind of Rulk Jeph Loeb wrote.
It's the Rulk I was implicitly asked to defend.

3. You've given no good reason why Rulk wouldn't be doing this.


Prove to me this isn't an option for him.

I have no problem admitting that, WITHOUT energy absorption ability, Rulk would be a non factor in an SBP fight.

But you need to establish that much for me first.

iceman24567
Of course its not an option that shouldnt even be up for discussion

bluewaterrider
Originally posted by juggerman
Actually i wrote it because Superman holds back a huge amount of his power so he won't overly harm anyone including his enemies. Prime has no such handicap. He would go for the kill from jump which means Rulk (with his full absorbing powers) probably wouldn't have to time to absorb anything as his head is being removed from his body faster than he can register the pain from it.


I agree, Superman holds back from overly harming people.

On the other hand, IN CHARACTER, Prime doesn't actually show overmuch concern over killing, one way OR the other. That is, if he feels like it, he won't hesitate to punch someone's head off or rip off an arm or cut an opponent down with heat vision.

At the same time, he's not in any hurry to wrap things up. He doesn't throw planets into the sun, he doesn't throw other planets into a target planet. He mocks, he taunts, he berates. Fighting is one-on-one. There is generally no superspeeding, little if any dodging of assualts, no overall plan. He fights like a man who is unsure of what he really wants to do, which, of course, for him, IS the case.

Looking at the encounter based on Prime's appearances in comics in character, and that of the his Marvel opponents. Rulk versus Prime isn't going to be the first mini-matchup. Ares, one of the Iron Men, or Thor would be the first. Likely Ares, since he is by far the most aggressive, Tony (Iron Man) or James Rhodes (War Machine) only because they are point men, used to giving the initial probe or counter-attack in a group versus villain engagement.

I agree, Ares would get the Voidtry treatment. That is simply the most logical thing to happen. He's the most aggressive, proud, and arrogant. He wields an axe. He's the first to encounter Prime, and he's a goner.

But Iron Man and War Machine would be a bit more circumspect, especially after seeing that happen to their comrade, and Thor and Rulk would know this is a "serious business engagement" at that point, too.
Rulk would not be rushing in or fighting stupid at that point.

abhilegend
We're not writing a comic, its a forum fight. The lengths blue would go to berate anything SUPER! smh.

bluewaterrider
Originally posted by iceman24567
Of course its not an option that shouldnt even be up for discussion



Iceman, as I said you need to show me THAT absorption is not an option and WHY it is not.

Again, under Loeb, that was one of Rulk's basic powers.

Examine the following page, very first entry in fact, and you can see Rulk absorbing cosmic power. Look further on down the page and you can see him doing it for the second or third time against Hulk.

Rulk absorbing some of Prime's energy makes for a fight of the type Loeb gave us many times before.

http://www.killermovies.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=490624&pagenumber=7

juggerman
Also consider SBP was very depowered and sunshine on the tip of his finger powered him back up instantly. I highly doubt he could be drained while he's in sunlight unlike PC Supes. Plus if he has on his armor he will constantly be full powered.

And SBP isn't retarded (tho he acts like it sometimes). Once he notices Rulk stealing his power he will do away with him ASAP

iceman24567
I am saying for this specific thread he doesn't have that ability forum rules unless of course the thread started included the Loeb force Rulk. The way it looks from the opening post its just standard always getting his ass whooped Rulk no absorption

carver9
Hulk solos.

juggerman
Never in a million years Carv

carver9
Originally posted by juggerman
Never in a million years Carv


He really does...especially Prime fights in character.

juggerman
Lalalalalalalalala i can't hear you! Lalalalalalalalalalala

iceman24567
LULz if both Hulk and Prime fight in character Hulk holds back while Prime cuts loose and rips him to shreds

abhilegend
I can't see the scans for some reasons but here is the issue where rulk lost the absorption abilities

http://herochat.com/forum/index.php?topic=235964.0

Somebody else find the scan and shut up blue.

bluewaterrider
Originally posted by iceman24567
I am saying for this specific thread he doesn't have that ability forum rules unless of course the thread started included the Loeb force Rulk. The way it looks from the opening post its just standard always getting whooped Rulk, no absorption


Rulk with energy absorption is actually the standard Rulk, for that was the way he was created, and that's where we see most of his encounters.


If we're concerned with things being "out-of-date" for this thread, the thread itself couldn't exist.

Prime himself is a whole lot less "whiney" after his encounters with the Black Lanterns, for instance, not as he "always" is at all.



And Ares is dead.




Has been for over 2 years now, in fact
(Siege #2, April 2010, released February 3, 2010).


http://marvel.wikia.com/Siege_Vol_1_2


Given that, it's doubtful the original poster could be all that concerned about what's happening in 2012.

(Or any point after Fall 2009, really ...)

iceman24567
Originally posted by bluewaterrider
Rulk with energy absorption is actually the standard Rulk, for that was the way he was created, and that's where we see most of his encounters.


If we're concerned with things being "out-of-date" for this thread, the thread itself couldn't exist.

Prime himself is a whole lot less "whiney" after his encounters with the Black Lanterns, for instance, not as he "always" is at all.



And Ares is dead.




Has been for over 2 years now, in fact
(Siege #2, April 2010, released February 3, 2010).


http://marvel.wikia.com/Siege_Vol_1_2


Given that, it's doubtful the original poster could be all that concerned about what's happening in 2012.

(Or any point after Fall 2009, really ...) Not how forum rules work we use the most CURRENT version nothing else really matters unless stated by the thread starter Rulk is without his Loeb force hes not absorbing shit.

Diesldude
Originally posted by bluewaterrider
If you really felt all my response deserved was some LOL emoticon, you'd have put one here and been done with it, not sent me a message that you even took the time to edit after the fact. Nor, were the post baseless, would you be concerned of other people being convinced of the argument.

As it is, you have no punch coming, I put forth that the writer Jeph Loeb would frame this encounter one way, I put forth that the writer Greg Pak would frame it another. If you want to counter that, you need to give good reason why you think they would not.

Especially given how Loeb and Pak actually structured their Red Hulk and World Breaker Hulk runs, respectively.

Fact is, under Jeph Loeb, Red Hulk took out a lot of people that he actually does not, on his own intrinsic strength levels, match up with.

Hulk himself for starters.
Twice, if memory serves correctly.

Thor.

Abomination.



You tell me that Superboy Prime took out several heralds.

Red Hulk took out Silver Surfer, the being the herald class is NAMED after, and took out one or two more of Galactus's servants for good measure.


Rulk didn't do this because he's just that powerful on his own.
He took them out because he has the ability to absorb the energies of or contained in an opponent.

In Hulk's case, he absorbed Hulk's gamma energy.
In Surfer's case, he absorbed Surfer's cosmic energy.
I doubt that he can absorb magical energy, I would guess Rulk was able to take down Thor in his famous "Moonshot" victory not only for good planning and the sheer element of surprise but also owing to the energy Rulk had previously absorbed from Hulk.
But he would go on to defeat Hulk at least a 2nd time by taking virtually all his gamma energy away from him.

Then, for good measure, Rulk began absorbing the pure sound energy of the villain known as Klaw.

Gamma, Cosmic, Sound.
If Rulk can absorb all those forms of energy, seemingly at will, if his general ability is, in fact to absorb various forms of energy from special beings, why wouldn't he be able to absorb solar energy from someone like Prime?

You want to say that draining and/or energy-absorption attacks don't work on Kryptonians? I direct you to virtually any magazine where the Parasite is the featured villain.

You want to say being in sunlight means Kryptonian healing factor or continual replacement of said energy means the Kryptonian is invincible?
I direct you to the Death of Superman trade, where fighting the high noon showdown in Metropolis, sunlight or no, translated into Superman being sent into coma. Blue where are you taking this? We aren't talking about superman here. We are discussing SBP and you totally missed my point because you got emotional with your hate for superman. What does Superman dying while under a noon sun in dos have to do with SBP? It's shown that sbp absorbs sunlight differently. My point is, rulk can absorb as much solar energy as he wants from SBP. Him absorbing said energy is debateble, hell I am even giving you this without an argument so that you can make your case appear to have a chance here. But now tell me how much will the rulk absorb? Can he completely drain SBP? Ok I'll even let you get this. But as shown, SBP can get to full power with just a sliver of sunlight touching his fingertips. So SBP will be back at full power in no time. So let's say the rulk turns on his absorbing powers again, how much energy does light on fingertips produce? For the rulk it will be enough to probably fart as loud as a whoopie cushion but for SBP it's enough to move planets and overpower half a dozen high heralds. In a nutshell, we are not discussing superman or how he absorbs powers we are discussing SBP. You went off on a tangent and wrote a nice winded post, it was nice and all but irrelevant to this thread.

Diesldude
Originally posted by abhilegend
I can't see the scans for some reasons but here is the issue where rulk lost the absorption abilities

http://herochat.com/forum/index.php?topic=235964.0

Somebody else find the scan and shut up blue. This is true, but I even let him use this in his argument, but it doesn't work here with SBP. SBP will be at full strength with the amount of energy that is produced by light that rests on fingertips. How much will that help rulk if he absorbs it? LOL while SBP gets back at full power. SBP will punch a hole in rulk's head while he is sucking on his fingers tips trying tk absorb more energy.

-Pr-
Guys, current versions unless otherwise stated.

Diesldude
Originally posted by -Pr-
Guys, current versions unless otherwise stated. Sure,
SBP in one of his appearances was getting ganged up on. They showed the sun rising, the heroes displayed their best oh shit faces, prime reaches up, touches sunlight and easily overpowers everyone. This aspect of SBP powers haven't changed, or am I missing something?

iceman24567
Originally posted by Diesldude
Sure,
SBP in one of his appearances was getting ganged up on. They showed the sun rising, the hero's displayed their best oh shit face, prime reaches up, touches sunlight and easily overpowers everyone. This aspect of SBP powers haven't changed, or am I missing something? Don't think he was talking about Prime just common sense ya know

Diesldude
Oh ok, , LOL, I don't know how PR does it. He is on almost 24 hours straight.

iceman24567
Originally posted by Diesldude
Oh ok, , LOL, I don't know how PR does it. He is on almost 24 hours straight. 3 more hours and i have been awake and on KMC for 24 hours straight

Diesldude
Thats crazy dude, u have to get some sleep. dont U have to go back to work? I'd be knocked out right now but am waiting for a repairman to arrive and fix my lawn mower. I just logged in to read up on the ownage thread while I wait.

iceman24567
Originally posted by Diesldude
Thats crazy dude, u have to get some sleep. dont U have to go back to work? I'd be knocked out right now but am waiting for a repairman to arrive and fix my lawn mower. I just logged in to read up on the ownage thread while I wait. The Kitchen, grill and giant fan at my workplace were burned to ashes i haven't been at work for almost a month im going to tie rocks on my ankles and take a swim in the Potomac..

bluewaterrider
Originally posted by Diesldude


My point is, Rulk can absorb as much solar energy as he wants from SBP. Him absorbing said energy is debateble, hell I am even giving you this without an argument so that you can make your case appear to have a chance here.

But now tell me how much will the rulk absorb? Can he completely drain SBP? Ok I'll even let you get this. But as shown, SBP can get to full power with just a sliver of sunlight touching his fingertips. So SBP will be back at full power in no time.



The thing you're overlooking is that, after absorbing power, Rulk HIMSELF is now stronger. When he drained Silver Surfer of his power, for instance, Rulk himself was then able to wield the power cosmic.

When he stole Hulk's power, Rulk himself got stronger.

It isn't JUST that he drains the person and the person becomes a non-threat because of that, although usually that is enough because the person doesn't have the ability to recharge as would be SBP's case,
it is that Rulk HIMSELF becomes more powerful, and remains that way for a time.

Again, think of Parasite. Or, if you want, Rogue.
In fact, Rogue would probably be an even better model.

She kisses and makes contact, she becomes stronger.
Sometimes her opponent becomes weaker. Sometimes not.
But she herself becomes more powerful.

For instance, in her very first appearance, she absorbed a portion of Thor's powers. Temporarily neutralized Thor, but, more importantly, made her strong enough to escape the other Avengers, which she might not have been able to do so easily without Thor's power.

Red Hulk after absorbing SBP's power would be far more powerful than base-level Rulk. Just as Rulk after absorbing Hulk's power was stronger than base-level Rulk. Just as Rulk after absorbing Silver Surfer's power was then Rulk with cosmic power, regardless of what Surfer did afterwards.

It's not that Rulk absorption provides a weaker SBP to deal with.

It's that it provides Team 2 a physically stronger Rulk, potentially one physically matching or exceeding the strength of SBP himself, as was the case with Green Hulk before Prime.

Zack Fair
facepalm

bluewaterrider
Sound, too.

Diesldude
Originally posted by bluewaterrider
The thing you're overlooking is that, after absorbing power, Rulk HIMSELF is now stronger. When he drained Silver Surfer of his power, for instance, Rulk himself was then able to wield the power cosmic.

When he stole Hulk's power, Rulk himself got stronger.

It isn't JUST that he drains the person and the person becomes a non-threat because of that, although usually that is enough because the person doesn't have the ability to recharge as would be SBP's case,
it is that Rulk HIMSELF becomes more powerful, and remains that way for a time.

Again, think of Parasite. Or, if you want, Rogue.
In fact, Rogue would probably be an even better model.

She kisses and makes contact, she becomes stronger.
Sometimes her opponent becomes weaker. Sometimes not.
But she herself becomes more powerful.

For instance, in her very first appearance, she absorbed a portion of Thor's powers. Temporarily neutralized Thor, but, more importantly, made her strong enough to escape the other Avengers, which she might not have been able to do so easily without Thor's power.

Red Hulk after absorbing SBP's power would be far more powerful than base-level Rulk. Just as Rulk after absorbing Hulk's power was stronger than base-level Rulk. Just as Rulk after absorbing Silver Surfer's power was then Rulk with cosmic power, regardless of what Surfer did afterwards.

It's not that Rulk absorption provides a weaker SBP to deal with.

It's that it provides Team 2 a physically stronger Rulk, potentially one physically matching or exceeding the strength of SBP himself, as was the case with Green Hulk before Prime. Blue, pR already stated to use latest showings, i think we should abide by that but if you want to pursue this can you calculate how much energy is produced by light resting on a person's finger tips? That's what rulk will be working with.

DarkSaint85
Ahahahaha

Bluewater, so wait, you argue that SBP cannot BFR the planet into the sun, because that's not what he does?

Wrong.

He does do it, in character:

http://sequart.org/images/Superboy_prime_moves_rann.jpg

Otherwise, another option is, he breaks the 4th wall and tells the writers to make him win:

http://25.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lyquqrRTSV1qzhacqo1_500.png

But WAIT! You said he doesn't do that anymore, most of his subsequent showings show how he likes to get up close and personal. And that would be his undoing, as Rulk would then be able to absorb his powers.

Alas for you, Rulk cannot absorb powers on the same scale. You posted some pretty pictures, now allow me:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v216/Lamashtar/RulkHulk26-8.jpg

So either you take the current versions (and kudos to you for trying to cloud the issue by using dead Ares etc), which would mean last we saw of Rulk, he cannot absorb powers, and SBP has broken the 4th wall...or we arbitrarily take them at a point in time when they were using their powers to the max (so Rulk can absorb powers, and SBP can BFR planets).

Either way, SBP wins.

bluewaterrider
Originally posted by DarkSaint85


Bluewater, so wait, you argue that SBP cannot BFR the planet into the sun, because that's not what he does?




What I wrote was the following, which you can find on page 5 of this thread.




Superboy Prime, IN CHARACTER, does not push an entire planet into the sun to win a fight. He FIGHTS up close and personal, as comic after comic demonstrates.



http://www.killermovies.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=569460&pagenumber=5

DarkSaint85
He also breaks the 4th wall, in character, as several comics have demonstrated, so.....

DarkSaint85
http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_pScx8BN4h3s/SwvYVvjHapI/AAAAAAAAGGU/_svWeBy32Lg/s1600/adv+4-01.jpg

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_5VgL6ZXwkaw/Sm8gT5eizZI/AAAAAAAAP1s/PJ6FkOPW9eY/s1600/Final%2BCrisis%2BLegion%2Bof%2BThree%2BWorlds%2B5-14.jpg

Diesldude
Originally posted by bluewaterrider
What I wrote was the following, which you can find on page 5 of this thread.




Superboy Prime, IN CHARACTER, does not push an entire planet into the sun to win a fight. He FIGHTS up close and personal, as comic after comic demonstrates.



http://www.killermovies.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=569460&pagenumber=5 Iirc he also destroyed a planet by flying through its core. This shows that SBP will do anything to win.

Zack Fair
LOL SBP trolling the DC boards.

SBP in character simply does not give a ****. He will fly through planet cores for the lol.

DarkSaint85
In character? He doesn't care about any earth except his own. He's smashing things up. All the others, in character (except maybe Ares) hold back....even te Hulk and Iron Man.

carver9
Current/latest versions of these characters? Thor and Hulk isn't needed, Ironman solos. Wondergirl gave Prime a fight during his last appearance. Hulk or Thor would destroy him.

iceman24567
Originally posted by carver9
Current/latest versions of these characters? Thor and Hulk isn't needed, Ironman solos. Wondergirl gave Prime a fight during his last appearance. Hulk or Thor would destroy him. For the fail carv for the fail

bluewaterrider
Originally posted by Diesldude
Iirc he also destroyed a planet by flying through its core. This shows that SBP will do anything to win.


He DID destroy a planet by flying through its core.

He destroyed it as Superman Prime (i.e. SBP with the guardian amp) in Countdown 15. But this doesn't show that SBP will do anything to win a fight.

For he wasn't actively fighting anyone when he did this.

Use "ctrl+f" to find the phrase "Earth-15" in the following thread to verify that:

http://www.killermovies.com/forums/f98/t472496.html




Again, Superboy Prime, IN character, WHEN he is actually formally fighting someone, not just behaving wantonly, fights straight-up, up close and personal.

DarkSaint85
When does SBP, when fighting in character, NOT fight wantonly???

Zack Fair
Originally posted by carver9
Current/latest versions of these characters? Thor and Hulk isn't needed, Ironman solos. Wondergirl gave Prime a fight during his last appearance. Hulk or Thor would destroy him. You forgot to take your meds didn't you?

bluewaterrider
Carver is making a valid point but he's stating it the wrong way.

The premise is correct; in order to see what defeats a character, you cannot simply look to whatever the greatest thing they've ever done is.

For instance, someone claimed earlier that Superboy Prime tanked a Universe destroying explosion or something to that effect.

Actually, he did not, the fight against Monarch caused a chain reaction effect. It wasn't one great big blow. Rather a very fast wave.
Earlier, Monarch set off a much smaller detonation that hurt Prime. Prime said as much himself. The explosion was powerful enough to wipe out an entire army. Strangely enough, Donna Troy, in the same proximity as the army, survived the blast, and protected a friend from that same explosion with her body. So we know that explosions can hurt Prime, and at that, explosions that Wonder Girl can survive and remain conscious against. (Proximity is another issue, though. There is often, though not always, discernible difference between taking a ground zero blast and getting hit with an otherwise all-consuming shockwave.)

Moot either way. Ignore that Superboy Prime had the Guardian Amp when he took the blast (that's why he was in the form of SuperMAN Prime and not SuperBOY Prime when it happened).
Ignore that it was a chain reaction effect destroying whatever Universe it was in.
It's still moot. For it's not something the Avengers are likely to be using against Prime in their own Universe even if they CAN replicate such a devastating effect. Moreover, it's unnecessary.

(If they find a way to safely remove bystanders from the equation, though, this does become an option. Or if the Avengers find a way to remove this fight to arena where no one else will get hurt. And this team is probably expertly equipped to do the latter what with Tony Stark and Thor on the team. More on that later. For now, back to the "enduring explosions proves invincibility" fallacy ...)


Explosions are ultimately rapidly expanding gas and/or concussion waves. They aren't something solid being directed against a person's head. Solid objects driven to the head, though? That DOES affect Superboy Prime. It's been proven too many times to dispute. Fists to the face. THOSE hurt him. And those the Avengers have in their ability to deliver with great force.

iceman24567
That amp was all but gone at the time of the blast and we know it was a chain reaction as stated in the narrative it doesnt take away from the feat.

Zack Fair
Lowball away!

iceman24567
Originally posted by Zack Fair
Lowball away! Dis thumb up

bluewaterrider
Originally posted by iceman24567
we know it was a chain reaction as stated in the narrative it doesnt take away from the feat.


The fact it was a chain reaction means it wasn't one huge megablast as people try to portray it.

carver9
Prime does good against this team until he runs into the Hulk.

-Pr-
Originally posted by carver9
Prime does good against this team until he runs into the Hulk.

Then he does even better, right?

DarkSaint85
Originally posted by carver9
D***, I forgot about that. Prime solos.

carver9
BFRing is on. D*** I forgot about that. Prime stomps.

bluewaterrider
Battle Field Removing (BFRing) is more likely to help the Avengers team than Prime, if, as the Original Poster of this thread suggested, everyone is fighting in character.

People forget that Thor, with Mjolnir, has the ability to remove people to other dimensions. With Prime, Thor would have no reason to be concerned with whether or not Prime could handle the trip, not when he sees the kind of damage soak and output Prime possesses.

I also wasn't paying attention to what DieslDude was really telling me. Sunlight on the fingertips enables Prime to overpower heralds?
In other words, Prime can either be easily tricked into fighting in places where sunlight is absent and/or does not have sense or wherewithall to GET to a sunny place and shift things to his advantage?

Really?

Next stop: Umar's Dark Dimension.

If you want to make sure he stays a little while, send in Hulk after him, who now has no reason to hold back, due to their being no innocents left to harm by truly cutting loose.

Then again, with all the tech Tony Stark has, all the floating satellites, and standard forum rules dictating that these groups have at least general knowledge of one another, it won't take long for Tony to figure out a means to flood the area with red solar radiation or block out the yellow sun rays empowering Lunatic Boy. Keeping SBP busy won't be a problem with good ol' Odinson and the Jolly Green Giant, there, either.

DarkSaint85
Oh, so NOW you're letting them fight out of character? Lol.

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