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Two very powerful, but insane, energy/matter manipulators (Michael and Owen) vs two high ranking Skyfathers (Odin and Surtur) on Neutral territory...

Odin can call Gungnir if need be, but thats all...

Average showings for all characters involved...


Battle to the Death or KO with no BFR allowed...

Who wins?

Team 2.

Originally posted by TheGodKiller
Team 2.

I am curious, what are you basing that conclusion upon?

Better feats and fights.

Originally posted by TheGodKiller
Better feats and fights.

Gotcha...

But you know, based on implied power, Korvac stands above Odin or Surtur (individually of course)...

Based on implied power, Shuma-Gorath should utterly demolish Odin as well. But that's never gonna happen, so...

Originally posted by TheGodKiller
Based on implied power, Shuma-Gorath should utterly demolish Odin as well. But that's never gonna happen, so...

Even still, you cant discount implied power; it isnt the "be-all" obviously, but it does factor in...

I mean Love and Hate are severely lacking in feats and fights (but possess tons of implied power); would you doubt that either of them would annihilate Odin and Surtur?

Team 1 wins.

odin is the weakest link IMO. Korvac is the strongest IMO.

Team 1 wins

Team Two all day every day.

Better fights, better feats and far more consistent in terms of showings.

How powerful is current Thor next to Odin?

Originally posted by Mr Master
How powerful is current Thor next to Odin?

Compared to Bendis Molecule Man? Lol, this guy.

Originally posted by Mr Master
How powerful is current Thor next to Odin?

He's powerful enough to briefly stagger Odin with a couple of Mjolnir strikes before Odin utterly humiliates him without trying.

To that end, the gap between Thor and Odin is still as large as it's always been pretty much.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Compared to Bendis Molecule Man? Lol, this guy.

Bendis' Owen would get curbed by Odin.

Originally posted by TheLordofMurder
Even still, you cant discount implied power; it isnt the "be-all" obviously, but it does factor in...

I mean Love and Hate are severely lacking in feats and fights (but possess tons of implied power); would you doubt that either of them would annihilate Odin and Surtur?
Non-sequiter. Love and Hate have partaken in the battle against Thanos with the Infinity Gauntlet, and even managed to momentarily affect him, which is far better than any fight that Odin or Surtur have ever had.

Your analogy fails, bringing up Love and Hate like that.

Originally posted by TheGodKiller
Non-sequiter. Love and Hate have partaken in the battle against Thanos with the Infinity Gauntlet, and even managed to momentarily affect him, which is far better than any fight that Odin or Surtur have ever had.

Your analogy fails, bringing up Love and Hate like that.

Bring up the Infinity Arc=fail.

Thor knocked the crap out of an IG amped Thanos (and even had him down "momentarily affected"...lol!!!) and Wolverine stabbed right through that same IG amped Thanos; I guess they have eclipsed Odin and Surtur as well...eh?


There were alot of suspect events occuring in that arc...

For example...Order, Chaos, Death, Galactus, 2 Celestials, the Stranger, Mephisto, Eon, and an IG amped Thanos failing to destroy the galaxy they were in as a side effect of their battle...

Odin and all the Skyfathers on Earth being stranded in Asgard because "the dimensional portals" or some such garbage was damaged...


So yeah, bring up Love and Hate in regards to the Infinity Arc=fail.

Outside of that arc what have they done thats significant?

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Compared to Bendis Molecule Man? Lol, this guy.

Sorry M, meant to quote this guy:
Originally posted by Raisen
odin is the weakest link IMO. Korvac is the strongest IMO.

Team 1 wins

Originally posted by Mr Master
How powerful is current Thor next to Odin?

Pretty much the same as they've always been.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Team 1 wins.

Why do you feel that team 1 wins Quan?

Originally posted by TheLordofMurder
Bring up the Infinity Arc=fail.

Thor knocked the crap out of an IG amped Thanos (and even had him down "momentarily affected"...lol!!!) and Wolverine stabbed right through that same IG amped Thanos; I guess they have eclipsed Odin and Surtur as well...eh?


There were alot of suspect events occuring in that arc...

For example...Order, Chaos, Death, Galactus, 2 Celestials, the Stranger, Mephisto, Eon, and an IG amped Thanos failing to destroy the galaxy they were in as a side effect of their battle...

Odin and all the Skyfathers on Earth being stranded in Asgard because "the dimensional portals" or some such garbage was damaged...


So yeah, bring up Love and Hate in regards to the Infinity Arc=fail.

Outside of that arc what have they done thats significant?
Are you kidding me? Bringing up those examples?

What Thor and Wolverine did was a direct result of Thanos nerfing himself to impress Mistress Death. That's not up for debate.

And as far as the battle of the Abstracts entities goes, this is what happened when Galactus, Eon and Stranger followed up the Celestials' onslaught:
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/9/91339/2434729-thanosiggalactusstaggers.png
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/9/91339/2434730-thanosigcelestialsowned.png

Looks fairly impressive to me.

Your non-sequiter still remains that, a non-sequiter.

Team 2

Originally posted by TheGodKiller
Are you kidding me? Bringing up those examples?

What Thor and Wolverine did was a direct result of Thanos nerfing himself to impress Mistress Death. That's not up for debate.

And as far as the battle of the Abstracts entities goes, this is what happened when Galactus, Eon and Stranger followed up the Celestials' onslaught:
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/9/91339/2434729-thanosiggalactusstaggers.png
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/9/91339/2434730-thanosigcelestialsowned.png

Looks fairly impressive to me.

Your non-sequiter still remains that, a non-sequiter.

I say nay; Thanos clearly states that all he did was nerf his sensory input when he fought the heroes with the IG...

He said that he would retain infinite power, but simply wouldnt know their next move...

So yeah, using Thor and Wolverine are legit examples of all the wrong that occured in that arc...

So according to your logic, because Thor and Wolverine affected Thanos with the IG, they have equaled Love and Hate and have surpassed Odin and Surtur combat feat wise...

Dude, that logic=pure fail...


Anyway, just remember the value of implied power; its not useless...

Ok, you think the Skyfather team wins, and theres nothing wrong with that, but just keep in mind that its implied that Korvac is more powerful than either Odin or Surtur (that point was emphasized repeatedly during the arc with Classic Korvac)...


PS...those scans have nothing to do with what I am stating here and you know it; you are just trying to deflect to argument...

Originally posted by TheGodKiller
Non-sequiter. Thor and Wolverine have partaken in the battle against Thanos with the Infinity Gauntlet, and even managed to momentarily affect him, which is far better than any fight that Odin or Surtur have ever had.

Your analogy fails, bringing up Love and Hate like that.

You cant see the big flaw with your logic as pertains to bringing up the Infinity Gauntlet arc in regards to using Thanos as some sort of gauge as pertains to Love and Hate with the above bolded fact in mind?

This is exactly what your are saying with your reasoning; because Love and Hate affected an IG weilding Thanos, they clearly stand above Odin and Surtur...well that means that Thor and Wolvie stand above those two Skyfathers as well doesnt it?

Especially since all Thanos nerfed was sensory input; his power level stayed the exact same (he clearly states this to Mephisto while formulating his plan to impress Mistress Death)...

^Reported for trolling.

Originally posted by TheGodKiller
^Reported for telling the truth.

There fixed it for you...

Let the mods see the above; its 100% true and you know it...

Originally posted by TheLordofMurder
Why do you feel that team 1 wins Quan? by beating the other team.

Originally posted by TheLordofMurder
There fixed it for you...

Let the mods see the above; its 100% true and you know it...
Reported aagin.

Originally posted by quanchi112
by beating the other team.

Well obviously they have to beat the Skyfather team to win...

Why does team 1 win Quanchi? Any specific reasons?

Originally posted by TheLordofMurder

Thanos clearly states that all he did was nerf his sensory input
when he fought the heroes with the IG...

He said that he would retain infinite power
I agree with the analogy your using to argue the Love/Hate comparison,
but "infinite power" can be related to the Power Gem alone if harnessed fully,
which by that time Thanos was able to do so.

But that still doesn't mean he's at "Full Power"
because he needs to wield all 6 Gems to be complete.

Therefore,
by cutting off his sensory input to the other Gems save for the PG,
he disconnected the influence he obtained from those 5 Gems.

This is why at the end of the battle,
Thanos states:

"Let me once again be All that I can be.
I will myself back to full power."

http://s4d4.turboimagehost.com/t1/15698245_Thanos.jpg

---------------------------------------------------

Don't get me wrong, Cosmic Awareness is bad ass,
but there's no way I'll believe CA (alone)
would make any difference whatsoever to someone who has
absolute control/mastery over Reality/Soul/Mind/Space/Time & Power.

Heck, utilizing the Reality Gem's affects alone with the IG
would've gave him the win with a thought.

So yea, I've argued this particular before,
and I still stand by Thanos employing the Power Gem alone in that scene,
which boosted his own inherent abilities ridiculously.