Click HERE to see this thread with all of the graphics, features, and links.

Current wonder woman

VS

Venom (flash)
Carnage (Cassidy)
Toxin (Eddie)

No speed blitz, no BFR
Fight takes place in a random urban surrounding (doesn't matter which does it?)
Round 1/ with lasso
Round 2/ without lasso

Who wins and why?

Wonder Woman stomps.

Diana stomps them into little lumps of mindless putty.

Carnage solos.

So does Flash if he lets Venom take over.

Originally posted by Golgo13
Carnage solos.
Originally posted by Kazenji
So does Flash if he lets Venom take over. QFT.

Originally posted by Kazenji
So does Flash if he lets Venom take over.
venom in control was what I was thinking when I made this thread.

What's even venom-in-control going to do to a high-tier foe like her?

Venom pretty much beat the U-Foes.... the exact same U-Foes who knocked out Thor.

Originally posted by Kazenji
Venom pretty much beat the U-Foes.... the exact same U-Foes who knocked out Thor.

You mean the U-Foes who combined their attack with Norman while he was down :/

They're strong but classically they've gotten trumped pretty hard once Thor or Hulk stepped up their game. They're like the Wrecking Crew almost.

Originally posted by Q99
What's even venom-in-control going to do to a high-tier foe like her? Take her over. Symbiotes have been shown capable of taking over characters with high level of to resistance. Both Venom and Carnage can do that. Probably Toxin.

Originally posted by SamZED
Take her over. Symbiotes have been shown capable of taking over characters with high level of to resistance. Both Venom and Carnage can do that. Probably Toxin.

What characters?

I feel like this would be something akin to when Venom tried to bite Hercules. She's just too strong and durable for these guys to do anything.

Originally posted by curryman
What characters?

I feel like this would be something akin to when Venom tried to bite Hercules. She's just too strong and durable for these guys to do anything.
http://25.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m7ss9jd8O81rxbn1bo1_500.jpg
http://superherocostumesstore.files.wordpress.com/2013/01/ms-_marvel_venom.jpg

Originally posted by curryman
What characters?

I feel like this would be something akin to when Venom tried to bite Hercules. She's just too strong and durable for these guys to do anything.
Venom symbiote has taken over ms Marvel, just recently Red Hulk, Carnage at one point took over Silver Surfer. Even average "fodder" symbiotes were taking over the avengers.

That was Gargan and he's a joke.

Ok, so they can merge with her (perhaps- she is rather resistant to control), but I'll point out that's not the same as defeating her. Rather, that sounds like doom for every symbiont and host who isn't joined to her.

Originally posted by SamZED
Venom symbiote has taken over ms Marvel, just recently Red Hulk, Carnage at one point took over Silver Surfer. Even average "fodder" symbiotes were taking over the avengers.

That was Gargan and he's a joke.

Cosmic Carnage was some grade A garbage if I ever read it. Nor would it actually bring him any closer to actually defeating the Surfer.

Ms.Marvel just isn't close to Wonder Woman in any aspect.

Red Hulk is a very good feat!

The point of all this is to win against her in a fight thought, and I don't see what they bring to the table in that regard.

Originally posted by curryman

The point of all this is to win against her in a fight thought, and I don't see what they bring to the table in that regard.

Well, merging would make her more violent and able to form weapons, as well as giving her an additional layer of damage resistance. That's kinda like defeating someone, right?

Notice that Diana is just not allowed to speed blitz, she can still use her superior speed, reflexes and flight defensively. I cannot see these guys touching her at all.

Originally posted by Q99
Ok, so they can merge with her (perhaps- she is rather resistant to control), but I'll point out that's not the same as defeating her. Rather, that sounds like doom for every symbiont and host who isn't joined to her.
Originally posted by curryman
Cosmic Carnage was some grade A garbage if I ever read it. Nor would it actually bring him any closer to actually defeating the Surfer.

Ms.Marvel just isn't close to Wonder Woman in any aspect.

Red Hulk is a very good feat!

The point of all this is to win against her in a fight thought, and I don't see what they bring to the table in that regard. Weird as that sounds symbiotes are loyal to their primary hosts. For instance when venom sym took over Rulk he made him run into a gas station then returned to Flash while Ross was recovering from the explosion. Besides symbiotes don't even have to leave their hosts in order to take someone over. Turning WW into a mindless slave (Carnage USA style) would count as win. Or just mindrape her. Also's been done before by the syms.

Originally posted by SamZED
Weird as that sounds symbiotes are loyal to their primary hosts. For instance when venom sym took over Rulk he made him run into a gas station then returned to Flash while Ross was recovering from the explosion. Besides symbiotes don't even have to leave their hosts in order to take someone over. Turning WW into a mindless slave (Carnage USA style) would count as win. Or just mindrape her. Also's been done before by the syms.

Bro, good luck mind****ing Wonder Woman.

Originally posted by curryman
Bro, good luck mind****ing Wonder Woman. Current WW has tp resistance feats already? Even if so, enslaving her is still an option. Even pre reboot her resistance was not beyond the likes of Hulk or Surfer afaik. And i'm yet to see symbiotes fail to take somebody's mind over.

Originally posted by SamZED
Current WW has tp resistance feats already? Even if so, enslaving her is still an option. Even pre reboot her resistance was not beyond the likes of Hulk or Surfer afaik. And i'm yet to see symbiotes fail to take somebody's mind over.

Ah, it's current WW.

They never touch her then.

Why not? No speed blitz allowed and all symbiotes are bullet-timers plus Venom's displayed ability to get into peoples minds without touching them. Plus all three can use camouflage.

Originally posted by SamZED
Why not? No speed blitz allowed and all symbiotes are bullet-timers plus Venom's displayed ability to get into peoples minds without touching them. Plus all three can use camouflage.

So she won't blitz them.

They still won't touch her.

ok.

And unless her power's changed, their invisibility wouldn't help.

Originally posted by curryman
So she won't blitz them.

They still won't touch her.

ok.

And unless her power's changed, their invisibility wouldn't help.
It's a fight, she won't be flying out of their range, she'd have to engage them in a fight in a featureless environment.

Why won't it help?

Originally posted by SamZED
It's a fight, she won't be flying out of their range, she'd have to engage them in a fight in a featureless environment.

Why won't it help?

Dodging someone's attack isn't blitzing them.

Parrying most certainly isn't.

Because of her true-sight and/or superhuman senses.

I'm also trying to figure out how any of these are going to hurt her.

Old Diana has a buncha mental resistance feats, but new one is still a demi-god and still has the lasso.

Originally posted by curryman
Dodging someone's attack isn't blitzing them.

Parrying most certainly isn't.

Because of her true-sight and/or superhuman senses.

I'm also trying to figure out how any of these are going to hurt her. Punching her wont do them much good obviously. But they don't have to hurt her to win.

Each of the symbiote can release over a dozen invisible tendrils each moving faster than bullets and that can change direction in mid attack. She tries to fight them in CQC she's gonna get tagged eventually.

Originally posted by SamZED
Punching her wont do them much good obviously. But they don't have to hurt her to win.

Each of the symbiote can release over a dozen invisible tendrils each moving faster than bullets and that can change direction in mid attack. She tries to fight them in CQC she's gonna get tagged eventually.

Why would she?

Not like she can't hit back.

Originally posted by curryman
Why would she?

Not like she can't hit back. CIS is on. She's a warrior, she'd def try to engage them in combat.

Hitting symbiotes is a bad idea. At their best that's like punching a living goo. Brock is no longer just a guy inside of the suit, he's one with the alien.

Originally posted by SamZED
CIS is on. She's a warrior, she'd def try to engage them in combat.

Hitting symbiotes is a bad idea. At their best that's like punching a living goo. Brock is no longer just a guy inside of the suit, he's one with the alien.

Of course she'd fight them.

Doesn't mean they'd ever touch her.

Originally posted by curryman
Of course she'd fight them.

Doesn't mean they'd ever touch her. She punches them - they're touching her.

Originally posted by SamZED
She punches them - they're touching her.

She's touching them.

Obviously I meant land attacks, not "any kind of physical contact".

Originally posted by curryman
She's touching them.

Obviously I meant land attacks, not "any kind of physical contact". She's punching a living goo that sticks, spreads and can influence her mind. Even if it's a little fraction that sticks to her fist. It's a two way street.

She can't use the lasso?

On all three attacking from different directions? Sure she could go full speed and tie them up but wouldn't it qualify as a speed blitz?

The symbiotes have their own spider sense, right?

If Diana knows their weaknesses she can use her superspeed to make sonic booms and then bind the team. Technically a sonicboom is not a speed blitz attack as long as they get to react against it.

Originally posted by Bentley
The symbiotes have their own spider sense, right?

If Diana knows their weaknesses she can use her superspeed to make sonic booms and then bind the team. Technically a sonicboom is not a speed blitz attack as long as they get to react against it. It's a myth, ey don't have SS, they just "see" in every direction.

Sonic boom might work on Venom. Carnage and Toxin don't have that weakness.

Unless Diana fights in a very uncommon fashion for her standards I think she would go down eventually. She has the skill edge, but her range is very diminished, without the lasso she lacks of a good way to dispose the Symbiotes quickly and the numbers advantage is big enough to matter.

I'd probably give her the majority over two symbiotes, but three seems like stretching. She may snatch some wins with the lasso.

Originally posted by SamZED
She's punching a living goo that sticks, spreads and can influence her mind. Even if it's a little fraction that sticks to her fist. It's a two way street.

If she punches one of them then they die.

Though I do agree that the stuff would probably stick to her

She still has her tiara the she can use for long or close range attacks. Could the symbiotes even survive that type of attack?

Originally posted by curryman
If she punches one of them then they die.

Though I do agree that the stuff would probably stick to her Not according to their history. They're very hard to kill. She's definitely not oneshotting anyone here.

Originally posted by SamZED
Not according to their history. They're very hard to kill. She's definitely not oneshotting anyone here.

History of never fighting anyone like Wonder Woman....

Originally posted by curryman
History of never fighting anyone like Wonder Woman.... Hulk, classic Juggernaut, Hercules, Red Hulk.

Originally posted by SamZED
Hulk, classic Juggernaut, Hercules, Red Hulk.

Hulk is traditionally not as strong as Wonder-Woman, especially not when he's fighting Spider-man and such.

Juggernaut fight; are you talking about that joke with terrible art? Where Venom was clearly stronger than Juggernaut....

Hercules? Okay, when?

Red Hulk, some fight that was.

Nor are any of these ANYTHING like Wonder Woman. The symbiotes are slow as molasses against Diana.

Originally posted by curryman
Hulk is traditionally not as strong as Wonder-Woman, especially not when he's fighting Spider-man and such.

Juggernaut fight; are you talking about that joke with terrible art? Where Venom was clearly stronger than Juggernaut....

Hercules? Okay, when?

Red Hulk, some fight that was.

Nor are any of these ANYTHING like Wonder Woman. The symbiotes are slow as molasses against Diana. Venom wasnt stronger, he was getting beat up but taking the damage like a boss. And its consistent with the symbiotes, people assume that its not... just because theyre Spidey villains. No PIS Spider-man's punches dont even tickle Venom and he's never beaten him without a plot device.

The beating Gargan took from Hercules in DA. Gargan sucks but damage soak wise it was impressive.

What's wrong with that Rulk fight?

All of the characters ive mentioned are around WW strength level. Dont see hows she supposed to oneshot them, especially if the go goo-form.

Interesting thread. I've always felt Venom and Carnage are under rated when looking at all the fights they've had. People shout PIS, but then it's a whole history of PIS.

And yes they don't go down easy by physical attacks. The symbiots are supposed to be able to absorb physical attacks (mostly).

Originally posted by DARTH POWER
Interesting thread. I've always felt Venom and Carnage are under rated when looking at all the fights they've had. People shout PIS, but then it's a whole history of PIS.

And yes they don't go down easy by physical attacks. The symbiots are supposed to be able to absorb physical attacks (mostly). Exactly, they absorb physical attacks. I mean Venom at one point was shot with an anti-tank missile followed by few dozen grenades. And laughed at it.

I realise im playing devil's advocate here and WW is a whole different league but I believe symbiotes are being sold short in the thread concidering the stips.

Old Wondy could use her zeus-bracers to zap 'em ^^

Originally posted by curryman
Cosmic Carnage was some grade A garbage if I ever read it. Your opinion on this is irrelevant considering, besides Parker getting rid of the symbiote which later formed Venom with Brock (so major PIS), no symbiote ever failed to take a character over.

Carnage:
Silver Surfer
Entire town + Captain America, Wolverine, Thing and Hawkeye
Technopathically ****ing up Iron Man and corrupting his system

Venom: Ms Marvel, Reed Richards, Rulk

No name symbiote: Captain America

Non 616 symbiotes: Deadpool, Thor

There are more but I can't recall atm

If anyone here has to prove something it's you because Wonder Woman was mind controlled more than once.

Also lol at them not touching her, they can turn invisible and expand their tendrils in the surrounding to get a hold on their victim (Brock did exactly that and Flash did something similar while being blinded but he was visible).

Recently symbiots displayed massive HFs like Toxin regrowing 1 arm and 1 hand in like 4 panels and kept on fighting as if nothing happened. Carnage regrowing Cassidys legs. Venom was impaled by Toxin.

Also a lot of DC fans deem the crossover canon and Venom catched both Flash and Quicksilver at the same time and was giving Supes hell.

Huh? When did Venom catch Flash and QS? Never read it, are there scans???

Originally posted by Parmaniac
Also lol at them not touching her, they can turn invisible and expand their tendrils in the surrounding to get a hold on their victim (Brock did exactly that and Flash did something similar while being blinded but he was visible).

This has been brought up and responded to.

Also lmfao at invisible to Wonder Woman.

Originally posted by Parmaniac
Your opinion on this is irrelevant considering, besides Parker getting rid of the symbiote which later formed Venom with Brock (so major PIS), no symbiote ever failed to take a character over.


Mad PIS.

Glad its your opinion that dictates and not anybody elses.

Originally posted by Parmaniac
Carnage:
Silver Surfer
Entire town + Captain America, Wolverine, Thing and Hawkeye

Venom: Ms Marvel, Reed Richards, Rulk

No name symbiote: Captain America

If anyone here has to prove something it's you because Wonder Woman was mind controlled more than once.

So these are the only relevant ones.

The Surfer Incident, which Carnage eventually failed in and some low level guys

Originally posted by Parmaniac
Recently symbiots displayed massive HFs like Toxin regrowing 1 arm and 1 hand in like 4 panels and kept on fighting as if nothing happened. Carnage regrowing Cassidys legs. Venom was impaled by Toxin.

That's great, they can regrow and let Wonder Woman one-shot them again.

Originally posted by Parmaniac
Also a lot of DC fans deem the crossover canon and Venom catched both Flash and Quicksilver at the same time and was giving Supes hell.

Ah, excellent. An uncanon crossover some guys deem canon.

So what is it that you have then?

Some low level guys getting controlled. Surfer breaking out, and the Rulk.

On the other hand we have the extremely skilled, fast, durable and strong Wonder Woman. With a long ass history of true-sight, superhuman senses and resistance. But hey, that doesn't even matter because her durability is sooooo far beyond anything these three can dish out. She can tank several hits from Supergirl for christs sake.

You should stick to your curry man

Originally posted by Parmaniac
You should stick to your curry man

Nothing like these mad class 40s hurting Wonder Woman right

Supergirl going all out can't do enough damage but these guys sure can!

Originally posted by curryman
Hulk is traditionally not as strong as Wonder-Woman, especially not when he's fighting Spider-man and such. No. Just no.

Originally posted by 753
No. Just no.

The Hulk that appears in low-level comics is as strong as Wonder Woman? That rarely happens.

Originally posted by SamZED
Huh? When did Venom catch Flash and QS? Never read it, are there scans???

It was a vague scene in that old fan voited Marvel vs DC. He seemed to use his shapeshifting to catch them by surprise.

Originally posted by 753
No. Just no.

I think curryman is referring mostly to older comics when Hulk's base wasn't that strong. Sure, he can continue to power up with anger, but it takes awhile for him to build up to the level of quite a few herald characters.

Not, like, current Hulk or WWH, who have a much higher base.