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so, this springs from a different, nearly spite-style thread. this is 1on1, classic diana vs worthy ben. diana has her shield and sword. battle in an open field covered in a dome 5km wide, long and high. curious what others think.

Diana should destroy him.

Diana slices him up good. A better fight is Diana with no weapons against him.

Worthy Ben breaks her back. This is a slaughter.

Originally posted by Blue Area Vet
Worthy Ben breaks her back. This is a slaughter. WB is high Herald at the very least and Diana is at the very best a mid Herald.

Originally posted by Blue Area Vet


LIES!

Classic Diana utterly dominates Grimm.

I have the canon to back this up.

Make your move!

Diana just stabs him in the heart the first moment. This fight is spite. The other fight where Diana fights both is still close to spite in her favor. There is no plot to save Angir from getting heart stabbed or his head lopped off the first instant nor to save Nul from getting his head lopped off too at superseded or her just simply lassoing Nul.
Without weapons for Diana then her and Angir would be a better fight.

They merge! To form ... Angry Bird!

Originally posted by h1a8
Diana just stabs him in the heart the first moment. This fight is spite. The other fight where Diana fights both is still close to spite in her favor. There is no plot to save Angir from getting heart stabbed or his head lopped off the first instant nor to save Nul from getting his head lopped off too at superseded or her just simply lassoing Nul.
Without weapons for Diana then her and Angir would be a better fight.






You keep the chronic within arms reach at all times don't you?

The sword can probably slice him up pretty good- it has no problem cutting Kingdom Come Superman's toughness with no resistance.

Originally posted by Tony Stark



You keep the chronic within arms reach at all times don't you? huh
What is Angir's defense against being stabbed in the heart or his head cut off?
Please enlighten me so that I can know for sure I'm smoking something.

Originally posted by h1a8
huh
What is Angir's defense against being stabbed in the heart or his head cut off?
Please enlighten me so that I can know for sure I'm smoking something.


What's her defense to getting tenderized by the hammer? Diana SUCKS by the way. You guys need to grow up and stop fantasizing.

Huh... What's WW defense for having her sword broken in two by his mallet or for having her head end up like a watermelon in a Gallagher show?

Originally posted by Tony Stark
Huh... What's WW defense for having her sword broken in two by his mallet or for having her head end up like a watermelon in a Gallagher show?

Much greater speed and reflexes, bracers that can block anything, being tough enough to take repeat hits from no-holds-back Superman, Doomsday, and that ilk.


I mean, we are talking a High Herald here.

Originally posted by Tony Stark
Huh... What's WW defense for having her sword broken in two by his mallet or for having her head end up like a watermelon in a Gallagher show? She is vastly faster than him and infinitely more skilled. She lops his head off the first instant of the fight. Or just stabs him in the heart the first moment. This fight is spite.

WW wins

Originally posted by Blue Area Vet
What's her defense to getting tenderized by the hammer? Diana SUCKS by the way. You guys need to grow up and stop fantasizing.

Guys?

Grow up?

Fantasising?

This is a good fight. Just because WW has a chance, to take wins doesn't make us blind fans.

She IS faster and more skilled than Angrir. This much isn't debateable.

She is more durable. This also isn't debateable. Especially with classic Diana and her gauntlets.

He is stronger. This isn't debateable, especially with his power output.

Saying that, he DID take time putting Rulk down - who wasn't exactly at Loeb levels. Who else did Angrir put down? List them, and let's see how formidable he was.

So on balance, with her sword, gauntlets and lasso, she can win more often than not. Fighting powerful stronger bricks isn't exactly new to WW.

^quiet, you! we're all idiots and raging hormonal fanboys except blue because blue says so! gawd i wish the ignore button would prevent us seeing posts quoted by others....be awesome of y'all if you didn't quote him. his posts make my eyes bleed.

Originally posted by leonidas
^quiet, you! we're all idiots and raging hormonal fanboys except blue because blue says so! gawd i wish the ignore button would prevent us seeing posts quoted by others....be awesome of y'all if you didn't quote him. his posts make my eyes bleed.
The crazy thing is, *I cannot stand WW (as a character) and even I can admit she would win. This has nothing to do with "fanboys" so I don't know what Blue is talking about.


*I wanted Mary Marvel to be DC's premier female herald level being but that's never gonna happen

C`mon Diana cuts Worthy Ben into little pebbles and he can`t do jack about it.

Worthy Ben destroys her.
Originally posted by h1a8
Diana slices him up good. A better fight is Diana with no weapons against him.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Guys?

Grow up?

Fantasising?

This is a good fight. Just because WW has a chance, to take wins doesn't make us blind fans.

She IS faster and more skilled than Angrir. This much isn't debateable.

She is more durable. This also isn't debateable. Especially with classic Diana and her gauntlets.

He is stronger. This isn't debateable, especially with his power output.

Saying that, he DID take time putting Rulk down - who wasn't exactly at Loeb levels. Who else did Angrir put down? List them, and let's see how formidable he was.

So on balance, with her sword, gauntlets and lasso, she can win more often than not. Fighting powerful stronger bricks isn't exactly new to WW.

Oh please, it is very much debatable that Worthy Thing is less durable than broken arms Diana! Talking time to put Rulk down is not a negative by any stretch of the imagination. Rulk would pound Diana into duck sauce. She absolutely would not win and she is NOT a high herald no matter how much some fanatics want her to be. Maybe she can take down Deadstroke in ther manner you all are suggesting. Worth Thing would absolutely demolisher her. He's magic based, he has a powerful weapon and Thing was no slouch to start off with. WW wins only if she hops in her invisible jet and skips town ASAP. PHUCK Mary Sue!

Originally posted by Blue Area Vet
Oh please, it is very much debatable that Worthy Thing is less durable than broken arms Diana! Talking time to put Rulk down is not a negative by any stretch of the imagination. Rulk would pound Diana into duck sauce. She absolutely would not win and she is NOT a high herald no matter how much some fanatics want her to be. Maybe she can take down Deadstroke in ther manner you all are suggesting. Worth Thing would absolutely demolisher her. He's magic based, he has a powerful weapon and Thing was no slouch to start off with. WW wins only if she hops in her invisible jet and skips town ASAP. PHUCK Mary Sue!


Let's play.

Name something that has bypassed her bracers.

And despite how her fight record indicates!


Here's a lesser known example: In Doomsday War, Doomsday one-shotted J'onn, a very solid herald. DD then hit Diana four times, and not only did she not drop, but was still in fighting shape.


Plus, she cut Supe's throat in Sacrifice, stalemated Superman in For Tomorrow, has stalemated Captain Marvel, has taken down Supergirl and Powergirl, mid heralds both... and her most physically oriented arch enemy, Cheetah, has taken down Superman.

"Regular stalemates High Heralds (even has the odd win), puts up good fights against trans, and solidly beats mids." Hmm... clearly above mids, below trans, and gets regular stalemates with highs... there's a word for that level, if only I could think of what it was...


Your head-WW does not match up with her fight record.



(Also, this is with additional weapons and shield. Those above were without these weapons. Even if you aren't sure without, with the added power...)

What is Worthy Ben`s fight record? Failing to take down bugboy parker, taking his time with Rulk who at the time was on such a loosing spree it makes Rhino look good, and finally geting ripped apart by Mjolnir in a single panel when Thor got serious?

Diana could take this blindfolded with one arm tied behind her back and in a wheelchair.

Originally posted by Mshinu
taking his time with Rulk who at the time was on such a loosing spree it makes Rhino look good
And the truly pathetic thing is, Rulk could have WON that fight according to MODOK. But he didn't want to use his energy absorption powers!

Diana stomps. H1 was right, a fairer fight would be Diana with NO equipment vs Angrir and she'd still win.

Originally posted by Mshinu


Diana could take this blindfolded with one arm tied behind her back and in a wheelchair.

Originally posted by zopzop
H1 was right

Oh dear, must be a blizzard in hell.

Originally posted by zopzop
And the truly pathetic thing is, Rulk could have WON that fight according to MODOK. But he didn't want to use his energy absorption powers!

Diana stomps. H1 was right, a fairer fight would be Diana with NO equipment vs Angrir and she'd still win.

Pathetic? The guy who killed Silver Surfer and KOed a Watcher with his absorbtion powers, that guy?

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Let's play.

Name something that has bypassed her bracers.

I like Mary Sue better when she was in bondage and doing Kung Fu and stuff. Remember that?

Originally posted by zopzop
And the truly pathetic thing is, Rulk could have WON that fight according to MODOK. But he didn't want to use his energy absorption powers!

Diana stomps. H1 was right, a fairer fight would be Diana with NO equipment vs Angrir and she'd still win.


Lol.

Originally posted by Blue Area Vet
I like Mary Sue better when she was in bondage and doing Kung Fu and stuff. Remember that?

IOW, you have nothing?

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
IOW, you have nothing?

What do you mean, that's plenty. Headband, karate suit, invisible jet, all that iconic stuff. This ***** was never supposed to be anything close to Superman. I mean look at her guns and look at Worthy Things guns. Worthy Thing's gun's are at least as big as Doomsday's and we know what Doomsday's guns did to Mary Sue's guns. Stop overthinking it, Worthy Thing STOMPS Mary Sue and eats that pie she just baked for him.

Blue, I thought you was a Wonder Woman fan?

Originally posted by Mshinu
What is Worthy Ben`s fight record? Failing to take down bugboy parker, taking his time with Rulk who at the time was on such a loosing spree it makes Rhino look good, and finally geting ripped apart by Mjolnir in a single panel when Thor got serious?

Diana could take this blindfolded with one arm tied behind her back and in a wheelchair.

You mean he BEAT Rulk, someting Diana couldn't do in her tingly dreams? Diana would get hoe slapped to hell.

Originally posted by carver9
Blue, I thought you was a Wonder Woman fan?

On what alternate universe did you come up with abomination of a thought?

Originally posted by carver9
Blue, I thought you was a Wonder Woman fan?

Disregard this question. I'm getting you mixed up with Bluewater.

Originally posted by Blue Area Vet
Pathetic? The guy who killed Silver Surfer and KOed a Watcher with his absorbtion powers, that guy?
No, not that guy, my friend. That guy would have stomped.

I'm talking about the guy that didn't use his energy absorption powers to amp (like he did vs Surfer and Uatu) and got beaten when he could have won the fight.

Now, who did Angrir beat that was so impressive?

Originally posted by Blue Area Vet
What do you mean, that's plenty. Headband, karate suit, invisible jet, all that iconic stuff. This ***** was never supposed to be anything close to Superman. I mean look at her guns and look at Worthy Things guns. Worthy Thing's gun's are at least as big as Doomsday's and we know what Doomsday's guns did to Mary Sue's guns. Stop overthinking it, Worthy Thing STOMPS Mary Sue and eats that pie she just baked for him.

Wow. Are you actually trolling or serious?

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Wow. Are you actually trolling or serious?

I think it's hilarious that you MEN take Mary Sue seriously. There, I said it. There is no freaking way she can compete with the big boys and it's a shame that you guys buy what D.C. is selling hook, line and sinker. She's a freaking woman! She can't compete with MEN. Why is that so hard to understand? Do you all get smacked around by woman? No, and I don't either. So why do you think that Mary Sue is capable of competing with MEN on her level? What are you, mice or men? What are you working out for, to get beat up by a women who is 2 3rds of your weight? Geez...

Originally posted by Blue Area Vet
I think it's hilarious that you MEN take Mary Sue seriously. There, I said it. There is no freaking way she can compete with the big boys and it's a shame that you guys buy what D.C. is selling hook, line and sinker. She's a freaking woman! She can't compete with MEN. Why is that so hard to understand? Do you all get smacked around by woman? No, and I don't either. So why do you think that Mary Sue is capable of competing with MEN on her level? What are you, mice or men? What are you working out for, to get beat up by a women who is 2 3rds of your weight? Geez...

Cool, you were serious. Just wanted to check

Originally posted by zopzop
No, not that guy, my friend. That guy would have stomped.

I'm talking about the guy that didn't use his energy absorption powers to amp (like he did vs Surfer and Uatu) and got beaten when he could have won the fight.

Now, who did Angrir beat that was so impressive?

Um, he beat Rulk and that's impressive. Rulk is strong as hell, certainly a lot stronger than Mary Sue.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Cool, you were serious. Just wanted to check

Oh yeah, I am dead serious. Real men are an endangered species in 2013. All things are relative, but not equal. Look at yourselves.... brainwashed and PATHETIC! You probably believe a woman can play in the NFL. A bunch of grown ass men ready to attack because someone dares suggests that a muscle bound gigantic man can physically beat the hell out of an aerobics instructor in high heel boots?

I AM curious, though.

Out of these two guys, who do you think is stronger?

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/scale_medium/12/121062/3052094-9639906776-12686.jpg

Or

http://fc03.deviantart.net/fs71/i/2012/185/8/4/batman_by_nar_by_juan7fernandez-d4spld8.jpg

Based on their guns.

Originally posted by Blue Area Vet
Um, he beat Rulk and that's impressive. Rulk is strong as hell, certainly a lot stronger than Mary Sue.
A Rulk that wasn't using his trump card, his energy absorption abilities. Now who was the most powerful person, non-energy absorption Rulk beat?

I'll wait.

LOL at Diana not being able to beat Rulk

This is pure gold.

I also thought this blue area was the same as bluewater.

It will be good to see what bluewater or fangirl have to say on this matter.

Probably shoot themselves out of despair at the human race.

Who's fangirl?

Diana could play on the NFL

And I have bigger arms than Diana still pretty sure she is stronger than me.

But Diana does have big one's

Seriously based on Diana's feats she should win, regardles of how ****ing hot her body may look like.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Probably shoot themselves out of despair at the human race.

Who's fangirl?


Biggest fan of WW I have ever encounter online.

hangs out on herochat.

Power girl also has big'uns

Originally posted by zopzop
A Rulk that wasn't using his trump card, his energy absorption abilities. Now who was the most powerful person, non-energy absorption Rulk beat?

I'll wait.

I said he was STRONG as hell, so what is it that you are waiting for?

Originally posted by iceman24567
LOL at Diana not being able to beat Rulk

You better laugh to keep from crying. Seeing hot ass slattered all over the pavement is one of the few reasons a man should cry. You probably need to find out who this Rulk guy is. Check him out in his fight against the Lady Liberators.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
I AM curious, though.

Out of these two guys, who do you think is stronger?


Based on their guns.

Based on Spiderman's Super Human guns as opposed to Batman's very human guns, Spiderman.

So....your decision to base your judgement on gun size is completely wrong in some cases?

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
So....your decision to base your judgement on gun size is completely wrong in some cases?

No, it's common sense. When all other things are equal, men kick woman's asses because of superior muscles. Do you disagree with this statement?

Originally posted by Blue Area Vet
No, it's common sense. When all other things are equal, men kick woman's asses because of superior muscles. Do you disagree with this statement?

I disagree. That's some ****ed up logic you got there man.

I know this chick that's been doing martial art for nearly 20 yrs, don't really have the muscle structure as a guy that's been doing the same thing. But i promise you, she'll kick the shit at of most guys.

Unless you think you stand a chance against a woman thats a black belt in
Judo
Karate
Jujitsu
Boxing

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Who's fangirl?
Originally posted by Rao Kal El
Biggest fan of WW I have ever encounter online.

hangs out on herochat.

Power girl also has big'uns
Quan's former nemesis called nverbeenwthagirl. A gay dude that socked around as a woman on a number of comic book boards including this one. IIRC, there was a whole thread on TCT dedicated to showcasing the similarity between their posts as well.

Originally posted by SquallX
I disagree. That's some ****ed up logic you got there man.

I know this chick that's been doing martial art for nearly 20 yrs, don't really have the muscle structure as a guy that's been doing the same thing. But i promise you, she'll kick the shit at of most guys.

Unless you think you stand a chance against a woman thats a black belt in
Judo
Karate
Jujitsu
Boxing

That's fine. I have a friend named Willie who owns Tiger Martial Arts in Portsmouth, VA who is a 9th degree black belt who will absolutely kick the shit out of her. The mofo was ranked nationally for years. I don't know why the truth is ****ed up to you. Again, I said if all things are equal. When we are discussing WW against heralds, MEN, I'm sorry, she gets her ass kicked.

It's funny how every one is on her teet, yet not ONE of her fans could honestly claim she is the equal of Superman or his better. I may be looked upon as the bad guy in this thread, but the jokes on them!

Originally posted by SquallX
I disagree. That's some ****ed up logic you got there man.

I know this chick that's been doing martial art for nearly 20 yrs, don't really have the muscle structure as a guy that's been doing the same thing. But i promise you, she'll kick the shit at of most guys.

Unless you think you stand a chance against a woman thats a black belt in
Judo
Karate
Jujitsu
Boxing
How exactly does one get a black belt in boxing?

Originally posted by Blue Area Vet
You better laugh to keep from crying. Seeing hot ass slattered all over the pavement is one of the few reasons a man should cry. You probably need to find out who this Rulk guy is. Check him out in his fight against the Lady Liberators.
The same fight where he eventually got his ass kicked by She-Hulk alone and was forced to flee?

Originally posted by TheGodKiller
The same fight where he eventually got his ass kicked by She-Hulk alone and was forced to flee?

No, the one where they couldn't put him down with their combined power. The same one in which he was playing with them and faking like he was KOed.

Originally posted by Blue Area Vet
No, the one where they couldn't put him down with their combined power. The same one in which he was playing with them and faking like he was KOed.
Yeah...that's the very same one where he got his ass beat by She-Hulk alone in the end when she got mad enough. Same fight where he also fled from her. You have the air of quite the confused individual about yourself.

Originally posted by TheGodKiller
Yeah...that's the very same one where he got his ass beat by She-Hulk alone in the end when she got mad enough. Same fight where he also fled from her. You have the air of quite the confused individual about yourself.

I'm so not confused. I don't come here and fantasize what it would be like to be a super powered Amazon all damn day.

Originally posted by Blue Area Vet
I'm not confused at all. I don't sit here and fantasize what it would be like to be a super powered Amazon all damn day.
Your confusion regarding Rulk's flight from the LLs says otherwise.

Originally posted by TheGodKiller
Your confusion regarding Rulk's flight from the LLs says otherwise.

And your assessment that She Hulk could beat Rulk is completely comical. Do you think Rulk was going all out or something, because if you do, there's a big continuity problem regarding She Hulk and Rulk's know power levels.

I think Rulk said it best:

http://www.comicbookmovie.com/images/users/uploads/5894/she-hulk-vs-red-hulk-wallpaper-l.jpg

Originally posted by Blue Area Vet
And your assessment that She Hulk could beat Rulk is completely comical. Do you think Rulk was going all out or something, because if you do, there's a big continuity problem regarding She Hulk and Rulk's know power levels.
Considering that my comical assessment is based off of comics, that's quite comicy all the way. She-Hulk has killed friggin' TOAA on-panel himself. Why do you think beating up Rulk is beyond the scope of her capabilities?

Originally posted by TheGodKiller
Considering that my comical assessment is based off of comics, that's quite comicy all the way. She-Hulk has killed friggin' TOAA on-panel himself. Why do you think beating up Rulk is beyond the scope of her capabilities?

Fine, She Hulk rapes both Superman and Wonderwoman and leaves them at the edge of the universe holding each other. You done?

Originally posted by SquallX
I disagree. That's some ****ed up logic you got there man.

I know this chick that's been doing martial art for nearly 20 yrs, don't really have the muscle structure as a guy that's been doing the same thing. But i promise you, she'll kick the shit at of most guys.

Unless you think you stand a chance against a woman thats a black belt in
Judo
Karate
Jujitsu
Boxing

You don't have a clue what you're talking about

Originally posted by Blue Area Vet
When all other things are equal,

And this is where it falls down.

One has been granted power by the Greek pantheon in DC.

The other, (Rulk), wasn't.

In this thread, the other, Angrir, was granted power by the Serpent.

See how your logic doesn't match up? Things are not equal.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
And this is where it falls down.

One has been granted power by the Greek pantheon in DC.

The other, (Rulk), wasn't.

In this thread, the other, Angrir, was granted power by the Serpent.

See how your logic doesn't match up? Things are not equal.

Ah, NO. What does the power source have to do with anything? Is Hulk able to compete with Thor, yes or no? Thor is the blessed son of Odin and Hulk is a geek who got caught in a geek explosion, yet they are peers.

Originally posted by Branlor Swift


You don't have a clue what you're talking about

Let me guess? You do right?

Originally posted by SquallX
Let me guess? You do right? More than "She's a black belt in boxing" I assure you.

You made up a story about a woman you don't know. I don't know why when you could have just used actual women fighters that aren't based on your word.

Originally posted by Branlor Swift
More than "She's a black belt in boxing" I assure you.

You made up a story about a woman you don't know. I don't know why when you could have just used actual women fighters that aren't based on your word.

I was going with the flow, so i forgot to space out Boxing from the other three. A simple mistake, nothing more.

Originally posted by Blue Area Vet
I think it's hilarious that you MEN take Mary Sue seriously. There, I said it. There is no freaking way she can compete with the big boys and it's a shame that you guys buy what D.C. is selling hook, line and sinker. She's a freaking woman! She can't compete with MEN. Why is that so hard to understand? Do you all get smacked around by woman? No, and I don't either. So why do you think that Mary Sue is capable of competing with MEN on her level? What are you, mice or men? What are you working out for, to get beat up by a women who is 2 3rds of your weight? Geez...

Originally posted by Branlor Swift
More than "She's a black belt in boxing" I assure you.

You made up a story about a woman you don't know. I don't know why when you could have just used actual women fighters that aren't based on your word.

He meant "Boxing" like in the Shaw Bros movies.

Apologize. Now.

Originally posted by LordofBrooklyn
He meant "Boxing" like in the Shaw Bros movies.

Apologize. Now. Shut up. Don't mouth off to your superiors. sneer

Originally posted by Badabing
Shut up. Don't mouth off to your superiors. sneer

I'll carve the tongue from your scaly mouth and use it for upholstery!

Originally posted by LordofBrooklyn
He meant "Boxing" like in the Shaw Bros movies.

Apologize. Now. You know less about anything than anything stated in this thread or 20 neighboring threads.

Originally posted by Branlor Swift
You know less about anything than anything stated in this thread or 20 neighboring threads.

I am an expert in many areas.

You can crawl around in the darkness or you can allow me to enlighten you.

Originally posted by LordofBrooklyn
I am an expert in many areas.

You can crawl around in the darkness or you can allow me to enlighten you. Kissing dudes and licking balls isn't that many areas.

Unless you meant area codes.

Originally posted by Branlor Swift
Kissing dudes and licking balls isn't that many areas.

Unless you meant area codes.

Don't project your encounters with SIN I AM on me.

Originally posted by LordofBrooklyn
I'll carve the tongue from your scaly mouth and use it for upholstery!

Originally posted by Branlor Swift
Kissing dudes and licking balls isn't that many areas.

Unless you meant area codes.

Not really, sure what a sword or shield really adds here. If her lasso can score her some sort of weapon, she wins. Otherwise, she loses.

Diana wins.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Not really, sure what a sword or shield really adds here. If her lasso can score her some sort of weapon, she wins. Otherwise, she loses.

Lasso's good for people vulnerable to mind hax, which I gather the worthy aren't. Swords good for chopping high-toughness foes up. She doesn't even have to do anything as tricky as tie someone up with the lasso and fully secure them, she just has to swing the sword and make major wounds.




Originally posted by Blue Area Vet
I think it's hilarious that you MEN take Mary Sue seriously. There, I said it. There is no freaking way she can compete with the big boys and it's a shame that you guys buy what D.C. is selling hook, line and sinker. She's a freaking woman! She can't compete with MEN. Why is that so hard to understand? Do you all get smacked around by woman? No, and I don't either. So why do you think that Mary Sue is capable of competing with MEN on her level? What are you, mice or men? What are you working out for, to get beat up by a women who is 2 3rds of your weight? Geez...

Hah! That's so dumb...


One of the famous skilled duelists in France- real life France- was a woman. Why? Because swords don't care *that* much about how big your muscles are, and she was fast and skilled and beat man after man, making money as a professional duelist. And that's with real life limits and only a piece of metal as an equalizer, not, like, the weapons of the gods and divine strength and speed.


Diana is, to begin with, from a race of superhuman immortals stronger than normal humans (A Bana Amazon can carry as much as an adult male soldier when she was *10*). Then she's got the blessings of the gods to give her power totally unrelated to anything like muscle size- just like every other top tier. How Super someone is has nothing to do with muscle size.


Like a poster above said- by your logic, Spidey shouldn't be able to compete with Batman due to Bruce having bigger guns.

Or Captain Marvel shouldn't be able to beat much of anyone, because he's a little kid.


What matters is how much super you've got and how you use it, nothing else. The sexism reasoning is just dumb.

Originally posted by Blue Area Vet
Ah, NO. What does the power source have to do with anything? Is Hulk able to compete with Thor, yes or no? Thor is the blessed son of Odin and Hulk is a geek who got caught in a geek explosion, yet they are peers.

But according to your logic, Thor shouldn't be able to be a peer to Hulk because of the size of their guns.

Originally posted by Blue Area Vet

It's funny how every one is on her teet, yet not ONE of her fans could honestly claim she is the equal of Superman or his better. I may be looked upon as the bad guy in this thread, but the jokes on them!


How is the joke on us when we think WW is 'near but a bit below Superman' and your own opinion is way off? That applies to Captain Marvel and most others too. I mean, she *has* beaten Superman when he fights too aggressively, after all.


Mind you, even though "Same tier, but with an edge to Supes," is my opinion, and what the comics normally indicate,
Sometimes the comics say their own thing (JLA, John Byrne run).

Q99 reminded me...

Originally posted by Blue Area Vet

It's funny how every one is on her teet, yet not ONE of her fans could honestly claim she is the equal of Superman or his better. I may be looked upon as the bad guy in this thread, but the jokes on them!

She doesn't have to be Superman's peer. But...

Superman and Thor are peers, not arguable.

Let's say WW is below Superman. Not by much, but still, below.

A wounded Thor tore through Angrir whilst fighting Nuul at the same time.

ABC logic seems to be the only way to get through to you..

I'll let your draw your own conclusions, but you might hurt yourself.

Originally posted by Q99
How is the joke on us when we think WW is 'near but a bit below Superman' and your own opinion is way off? That applies to Captain Marvel and most others too. I mean, she *has* beaten Superman when he fights too aggressively, after all.


Mind you, even though "Same tier, but with an edge to Supes," is my opinion, and what the comics normally indicate,
Sometimes the comics say their own thing (JLA, John Byrne run).

Then you would be WRONG. Captain Marvel is not below Superman, but he and Superman are above Wonderwoman. Everyone knows that.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Q99 reminded me...



She doesn't have to be Superman's peer. But...

Superman and Thor are peers, not arguable.

Let's say WW is below Superman. Not by much, but still, below.

A wounded Thor tore through Angrir whilst fighting Nuul at the same time.

ABC logic seems to be the only way to get through to you..

I'll let your draw your own conclusions, but you might hurt yourself.

Well my friend, I might or might not hurt myself by at least I didn't let someone else's point go completely over my head like you did. Second time around, the point is that Wonder Woman would be Superman's equal if it weren't for the fact that she is a WOMAN. She has every reason to beat him, but she can't. She is supposedly faster in combat and she is blessed by the patheon- magic. So what's the problem? The problem is that she is a woman and she can't beat the man at her level. It's biology.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
But according to your logic, Thor shouldn't be able to be a peer to Hulk because of the size of their guns.

I said that with respect to a man and woman's guns. Bigger, stronger MALE muscles. Now, do you understand or are you going to ask me the same thing again?

Originally posted by Blue Area Vet
I said that with respect to a man and woman's guns. Bigger, stronger MALE muscles. Now, do you understand or are you going to ask me the same thing again?

What does biology have to do with it???

The gain their powers from different sources.

One source can be more powerful than the other (so for example, getting your power from a source like Odin > getting your power from a minor god . Or they can derive more power from their source (so the Leader and the Hulk both got their powers from the same source, but Hulk gets more power. Or a better example is Batman making more use of his human physiology than say, Booster Gold).

your argument would be better suited to arguing Valkyrie and Thor, as they both have similar power sources. Or Mary Marvel and Billy Batson.

Your comparison of WW and Superman, or WW and Rulk and Angrir, is nonsensical, because you're not comparing like with like.

But why don't you and I debate. You ran away from the Proxima Midnight/WW thread, so I am calling you out here. Feel honoured. Back your assertions up with proof.

Post some scans of Angrir having resistance to magical weapons, perhaps. Or of his speed to react. Or some kind of magical resistance. Or indeed, any of his fights which leads you to believe that he wins.

Beyond the fact he's male, and WW is female. Because that reasoning is retarded in a thread where one is a cosmic experiment gone wrong then amped by the long lost brother of the Norse god Odin, and the other is an immortal clay statue given life by the Greek gods.

Originally posted by Blue Area Vet
Then you would be WRONG. Captain Marvel is not below Superman, but he and Superman are above Wonderwoman. Everyone knows that.

Funny, she has wins against Supes, CM doesn't, and they're both tapped to stalemate Superman about as often. She's stalemated CM (when they were both champions of the Greek/Roman pantheons, respectively. It should be noted they have nigh-identical power sources, and thus nigh-identical performances head-to-head makes a lot of sense). Her lasso lets her de-transform CM (as done multiple times). Superman dubbed her, not CM, Earth's next line of defense if he went missing.

It is curious how your 'everyone knows that' doesn't line up with fight records in the comics themselves, isn't it? It's more that you're just assuming CM is stronger, and not a rough equal, based on your own biases.



Originally posted by Blue Area Vet
I said that with respect to a man and woman's guns. Bigger, stronger MALE muscles. Now, do you understand or are you going to ask me the same thing again?

So to you, muscle size difference only matters when comparing different genders?


You are an idiot.

Originally posted by Blue Area Vet
Then you would be WRONG. Captain Marvel is not below Superman, but he and Superman are above Wonderwoman. Everyone knows that.
She is NOT below CM. She's easily his peer (if not more powerful). All this is without bringing in her gear, with them, she's clearly his superior.

is that....sexism I'm smelling in this thread?

Sexism? Online? With a comic book fan? Perish the thought!

Let Wondy break out her gear and she whups pretty much every herald except a few bad matchup powerset-wise. Diana is the warrior Kal and Billy want to grow up to be.

i'm dissapointed now...

Originally posted by Q99
Funny, she has wins against Supes, CM doesn't, and they're both tapped to stalemate Superman about as often. She's stalemated CM (when they were both champions of the Greek/Roman pantheons, respectively. It should be noted they have nigh-identical power sources, and thus nigh-identical performances head-to-head makes a lot of sense). Her lasso lets her de-transform CM (as done multiple times). Superman dubbed her, not CM, Earth's next line of defense if he went missing.

It is curious how your 'everyone knows that' doesn't line up with fight records in the comics themselves, isn't it? It's more that you're just assuming CM is stronger, and not a rough equal, based on your own biases.





So to you, muscle size difference only matters when comparing different genders?


You are an idiot.

and a douchenozzle to boot

I think everyone is getting Blue Vet wrong.

He is just saying that logically We men are stronger than Women, that is just how nature made us. Up to that point I agree with him.

But I still think Diana wins, even if that muscle logic were to somehow apply, she has her gear and warrior born training plus her reflexes and speed.

Even if she were 3 times weaker than the male opponent (which I don't think she is) She is much much faster than him.

And when you have someone who is 3 times weaker than you trading 15 punches to 1 against you (which you may or may not connect) then it becomes pretty clear who has the advantage.

Originally posted by Q99
Funny, she has wins against Supes, CM doesn't, and they're both tapped to stalemate Superman about as often. She's stalemated CM (when they were both champions of the Greek/Roman pantheons, respectively. It should be noted they have nigh-identical power sources, and thus nigh-identical performances head-to-head makes a lot of sense). Her lasso lets her de-transform CM (as done multiple times). Superman dubbed her, not CM, Earth's next line of defense if he went missing.

It is curious how your 'everyone knows that' doesn't line up with fight records in the comics themselves, isn't it? It's more that you're just assuming CM is stronger, and not a rough equal, based on your own biases.





So to you, muscle size difference only matters when comparing different genders?


You are an idiot.

Thanks, and you are an ignoramus for thinking men and women's muscles are the same.

Originally posted by Warlord
is that....sexism I'm smelling in this thread?

No, but it might be some PC bs.

Originally posted by Q99
Funny, she has wins against Supes, CM doesn't, and they're both tapped to stalemate Superman about as often. She's stalemated CM (when they were both champions of the Greek/Roman pantheons, respectively. It should be noted they have nigh-identical power sources, and thus nigh-identical performances head-to-head makes a lot of sense). Her lasso lets her de-transform CM (as done multiple times). Superman dubbed her, not CM, Earth's next line of defense if he went missing.

It is curious how your 'everyone knows that' doesn't line up with fight records in the comics themselves, isn't it? It's more that you're just assuming CM is stronger, and not a rough equal, based on your own biases.





So to you, muscle size difference only matters when comparing different genders?


You are an idiot.
She doesn't have any wins against Superman. Cap has two wins against her though, one in Underworld Unleashed and in JLA/JSA virtue and vice. Also Cap was weakened in WOTG where she stalemated him.

Originally posted by Rao Kal El
that is just how nature made us.


But....no. Not in this case. Not in the case of a fictional comic book character who is a clay statue given life and given blessings from the gods. You're (and he) are not comparing like for like.

Fine, in the real world, take the average man and the average woman, and yes, the man would be stronger. There will always be outliers, but on average, men are stronger.

In comics, when dealing with clay princesses and irradiated spider people? Who the frell knows. We then have to throw real world 'logic' out the window, and use their feats and showings. And WW, on panel, has shown that she has the strength to match and beat heralds.

Originally posted by Rao Kal El
I think everyone is getting Blue Vet wrong.

He is just saying that logically We men are stronger than Women, that is just how nature made us. Up to that point I agree with him.

But I still think Diana wins, even if that muscle logic were to somehow apply, she has her gear and warrior born training plus her reflexes and speed.

Even if she were 3 times weaker than the male opponent (which I don't think she is) She is much much faster than him.

And when you have someone who is 3 times weaker than you trading 15 punches to 1 against you (which you may or may not connect) then it becomes pretty clear who has the advantage.

You about three times smarter than the metrosexuals arguing with me. What I am saying is not at all difficult to understand. Kindergartners understand that men are stronger than women. Oh and by the way, my publicist advised me not to take any more questions on the anatomical differences between men and women.

Originally posted by zopzop
She is NOT below CM. She's easily his peer (if not more powerful). All this is without bringing in her gear, with them, she's clearly his superior.
Really? That's why he beat up a group consisting of her, kyle, j'onn, guy gardner while having a broken arm.

http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o106/bigbran1/comic/49-underworldunleashed3pg20.jpg
http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o106/bigbran1/comic/49-underworldunleashed3pg21.jpg
http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o106/bigbran1/comic/49-underworldunleashed3pg22.jpg
http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o106/bigbran1/comic/49-underworldunleashed3pg23.jpg
http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o106/bigbran1/comic/49-underworldunleashed3pg24.jpg
http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o106/bigbran1/comic/49-underworldunleashed3pg25.jpg
http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o106/bigbran1/comic/49-underworldunleashed3pg26.jpg
http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o106/bigbran1/comic/49-underworldunleashed3pg27.jpg

Hardly the best example....they were like zombies in that fight.

Originally posted by Blue Area Vet
You about three times smarter than the metrosexuals arguing with me. What I am saying is not at all difficult to understand. Kindergartners understand that men are stronger than women. Oh and by the way, my publicist advised me not to take any more questions on the anatomical differences between men and women.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Hardly the best example....they were like zombies in that fight.
Yet, WW fangirls don't have any problem citing WOTG where Cap was mindcontrolled and weakened.

Originally posted by abhilegend
Yet, WW fangirls don't have any problem citing WOTG where Cap was mindcontrolled and weakened.

I have problems with it.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
But....no. Not in this case. Not in the case of a fictional comic book character who is a clay statue given life and given blessings from the gods. You're (and he) are not comparing like for like.

Fine, in the real world, take the average man and the average woman, and yes, the man would be stronger. There will always be outliers, but on average, men are stronger.

In comics, when dealing with clay princesses and irradiated spider people? Who the frell knows. We then have to throw real world 'logic' out the window, and use their feats and showings. And WW, on panel, has shown that she has the strength to match and beat heralds.

So all this about a ball of clay? Hell, why not a collection of molecules? You can minimize the argument in an effort to win, but at the cost off the argument being completely ridiculous and meaningless.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85


I ran from nothing. I can't even say nice try. Looks like you are quitting on the argument that mean are overwhelmingly stronger than women and for good reason.

So you're saying they're the same?

What about Wonder Woman and say......Captain America? Oh, your argument will probably be because he is only peak human.

How about Wonder Woman and Luke Cage? Spiderman? Wolverine? Curt Connors? Beast? All of them have superhuman strength, are male, and some of them have bigger guns.

Originally posted by Blue Area Vet
I ran from nothing. I can't even say nice try. Looks like you are quitting on the argument that mean are overwhelmingly stronger than women and for good reason.

I thought you quit, because your publicist told you so. If you really want to go for it, then let's go. Carver and others know I will not back down and let it go for weeks on end.

Originally posted by Blue Area Vet
I ran from nothing. I can't even say nice try. Looks like you are quitting on the argument that mean are overwhelmingly stronger than women and for good reason.

By the way, didn't you admit wt was stronger? If so, why are you engaging in this argument?

Originally posted by Blue Area Vet
By the way, didn't you admit wt was stronger? If so, why are you engaging in this argument?

Show some scans, please. What makes you think Worthy Thing is stronger?

But why don't you and I debate. You ran away from the Proxima Midnight/WW thread, so I am calling you out here. Feel honoured. Back your assertions up with proof.

Post some scans of Angrir having resistance to magical weapons, perhaps. Or of his speed to react. Or some kind of magical resistance. Or indeed, any of his fights which leads you to believe that he wins.

Beyond the fact he's male, and WW is female. Because that reasoning is retarded in a thread where one is a cosmic experiment gone wrong then amped by the long lost brother of the Norse god Odin, and the other is an immortal clay statue given life by the Greek gods.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
I have problems with it.
You are a WW fangirl?

I have no real feeling one way or the other about her. so wouldn't class me as a fan.

Or a girl. Though it would be strange for you guys after all this time if that was a lie and I turned out to be one, right?

Originally posted by abhilegend
Really? That's why he beat up a group consisting of her, kyle, j'onn, guy gardner while having a broken arm.

http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o106/bigbran1/comic/49-underworldunleashed3pg20.jpg
http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o106/bigbran1/comic/49-underworldunleashed3pg21.jpg
http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o106/bigbran1/comic/49-underworldunleashed3pg22.jpg
http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o106/bigbran1/comic/49-underworldunleashed3pg23.jpg
http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o106/bigbran1/comic/49-underworldunleashed3pg24.jpg
http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o106/bigbran1/comic/49-underworldunleashed3pg25.jpg
http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o106/bigbran1/comic/49-underworldunleashed3pg26.jpg
http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o106/bigbran1/comic/49-underworldunleashed3pg27.jpg
They obviously weren't in their right minds. The instant she had that lasso around him she could have ended the fight by forcing him to say the magic word and transform him back into Billy.

It's Superman>>>>Wonder Woman>>>>>>>>>>Captain Marvel in terms of power/strength/versatility.

Quite true! A fact a lot of people overlook when it comes to her HtH skills and bracer defense- a little less muscle strength does not translate into a fight disadvantage if she's going to be hitting a lot more.



Originally posted by abhilegend
Really? That's why he beat up a group consisting of her, kyle, j'onn, guy gardner while having a broken arm.




I can't help but noticing Wonder Woman's not even remotely near 'down' in that. Actually, it's kinda weird, page 22 shows her punching him (and him reacting like it hurt), page 23 has him holding the lasso and getting away from her while she's just holding her head like she's got a headache but looks in much better shape than him, and in fact he doesn't so much as punch her once. I mean, pretty good escape for him there, but he hardly 'beat them all up.'


Also, I know full well you've been exposed to tones of examples of WW doing high feats, Abhilegend. And you know my opinion on you ignoring all the damage Wondy did to Superman in Sacrifice- like I often say, you can't make an argument by ignoring half the facts.




In Virtue and Vice, he did take her down, but that was gluttony possessed Captain Marvel who'd stolen the power of Mary, CM3, and Black Adam. So, heck yea a CM who's probably twice as strong as normal is gonna take her out, that CM was well above Supes too. Also, it was her lasso who took him out a moment later, demonstrating the effectiveness of her arsenal against him.


In Underworld Unleashed... well, thank you for bringing that up.


What you consider not-a-win for Wondy: "I, Superman, have had my *throat cut open*, am kneeling with my hands around my throat, and fail to act even when I strongly want to stop her from doing something, and it takes about 20 seconds to close so I can remove my hands (and this is actually timed in the recording, btw, not an estimate -Q). Also I was walking with a limp earlier where she kicked me, and ditto holding my side where she hit there."

Or: "I, Superman, have been controlled by Circe and filled with rage, and covered with doomsday spikes, growing visibly more muscled. While dumber, I have lost no power whatsoever, look to have gained some, will attack relentlessly, and one of Wondy's other foes stole her lasso at the start of the fight. Woops, even with those advantages she lassoed me!" (Even if you don't count this as a 'Supes loss', it's still a victory against an easily High Herald foe!)


What you consider a win against Wonder Woman: "I, Captain Marvel, got her lasso and, I dunno, maybe did something off-panel? Possibly it was the effects of something one of the others did, Flash ran right by her. Well, she seems to have a headache, though she is clearly conscious and has no visible wounds. I'm outa here!"


The double standard is astounding.


It's really quite hard to take you seriously when your argument relies so much on ignoring data on one hand, and massively overstating on the other.

Originally posted by zopzop
It's Superman>>>>Wonder Woman>>>>>>>>>>Captain Marvel in terms of power/strength/versatility.



Wtf?

I do like how we're attracting counterparts to the anti-fans who just refuse to accept Diana's as strong as her feats Balancing things out.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus


Wtf?

Exactly, WTF?? So people are just making up random shite, okay.

Superman, Worthy Hulk, Worthy Thing, Captain Marvel >>> Mary Sue

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus


Wtf?
What's so controversial?

I'd put Thor in Superman's league too. If you were to include Marvel characters in that list it'd be :

Superman/Thor/BrB>>>>Wonderwoman/Gladiator>>>>>>>>>>>>Captain Marvel/Black Adam/Wonderman.

Originally posted by Q99
Quite true! A fact a lot of people overlook when it comes to her HtH skills and bracer defense- a little less muscle strength does not translate into a fight disadvantage if she's going to be hitting a lot more.






I can't help but noticing Wonder Woman's not even remotely near 'down' in that. Actually, it's kinda weird, page 22 shows her punching him (and him reacting like it hurt), page 23 has him holding the lasso and getting away from her while she's just holding her head like she's got a headache but looks in much better shape than him, and in fact he doesn't so much as punch her once. I mean, pretty good escape for him there, but he hardly 'beat them all up.'


Also, I know full well you've been exposed to tones of examples of WW doing high feats, Abhilegend. And you know my opinion on you ignoring all the damage Wondy did to Superman in Sacrifice- like I often say, you can't make an argument by ignoring half the facts.




In Virtue and Vice, he did take her down, but that was gluttony possessed Captain Marvel who'd stolen the power of Mary, CM3, and Black Adam. So, heck yea a CM who's probably twice as strong as normal is gonna take her out, that CM was well above Supes too. Also, it was her lasso who took him out a moment later, demonstrating the effectiveness of her arsenal against him.


In Underworld Unleashed... well, thank you for bringing that up.


What you consider not-a-win for Wondy: "I, Superman, have had my *throat cut open*, am kneeling with my hands around my throat, and fail to act even when I strongly want to stop her from doing something, and it takes about 20 seconds to close so I can remove my hands (and this is actually timed in the recording, btw, not an estimate -Q). Also I was walking with a limp earlier where she kicked me, and ditto holding my side where she hit there."

Or: "I, Superman, have been controlled by Circe and filled with rage, and covered with doomsday spikes, growing visibly more muscled. While dumber, I have lost no power whatsoever, look to have gained some, will attack relentlessly, and one of Wondy's other foes stole her lasso at the start of the fight. Woops, even with those advantages she lassoed me!" (Even if you don't count this as a 'Supes loss', it's still a victory against an easily High Herald foe!)


What you consider a win against Wonder Woman: "I, Captain Marvel, got her lasso and, I dunno, maybe did something off-panel? Possibly it was the effects of something one of the others did, Flash ran right by her. Well, she seems to have a headache, though she is clearly conscious and has no visible wounds. I'm outa here!"


The double standard is astounding.


It's really quite hard to take you seriously when your argument relies so much on ignoring data on one hand, and massively overstating on the other.

at "(and this is actually timed in the recording, btw, not an estimate -Q)." and "It's really quite hard to take you seriously when your argument relies so much on ignoring data."

Oh, so now you can scientifically prove that Diana > Superman. I LOVE IT! This is proof there are different levels of nerdom.

Originally posted by Blue Area Vet
Exactly, WTF?? So people are just making up random shite, okay.

Superman, Worthy Hulk, Worthy Thing, Captain Marvel >>> Mary Sue

Post scans of Worthy Thing which show how powerful he is. Prove it. Or I'll report you for trolling.

Originally posted by zopzop
What's so controversial?

I'd put Thor in Superman's league too. If you were to include Marvel characters in that list it'd be :

Superman/Thor/BrB>>>>Wonderwoman/Gladiator>>>>>>>>>>>>Captain Marvel/Black Adam/Wonderman.

Try Superman, Thor, Black Adam, Captain Marvel, Gladitor
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Wonder Woman and you'd be getting warmer.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Post scans of Worthy Thing which show how powerful he is. Prove it. Or I'll report you for trolling.

I'm not posting a d@mn thing and you can report me all you want. His fight has been covered more than once so dive in the archives dumpster if you want to know. Posting scans is not PROOF of how powerful a character is either, so I kick your straw man argument in his straw balls.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Post scans of Worthy Thing which show how powerful he is. Prove it. Or I'll report you for trolling.

http://img851.imageshack.us/img851/4323/worthything012.jpg
http://img855.imageshack.us/img855/9607/worthything013.jpg

http://img847.imageshack.us/img847/2589/worthything.jpg
http://img822.imageshack.us/img822/1213/worthything2.jpg
http://img41.imageshack.us/img41/3014/worthything3.jpg
http://img3.imageshack.us/img3/8813/worthything4.jpg
http://img198.imageshack.us/img198/2939/worthything5.jpg
http://img5.imageshack.us/img5/254/worthything6.jpg
http://img571.imageshack.us/img571/5830/worthything7.jpg
http://img200.imageshack.us/img200/7707/worthything8.jpg
http://img13.imageshack.us/img13/4018/worthything9.jpg
http://img534.imageshack.us/img534/3365/worthything010.jpg
http://img840.imageshack.us/img840/3812/worthything011.jpg

All the Worthy hammers were incredibly powerful:
http://s23.postimg.org/i65mpskxl/FITD_02_0009_copy.jpg

Originally posted by Blue Area Vet
I'm not posting a d@mn thing and you can report me all you want. His fight has been covered more than once so dive in the archives dumpster if you want to know. Posting scans is not PROOF of how powerful a character is either, so I kick your straw man argument in his straw balls.

So in other words, you have nothing. Run along then.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus


Thanks for making the effort and actually having proof.

Rulk at the time wasn't all that, IMO. Definitely some way from his Watcher fighting days. And Angrir still didn't get to KO him, and had to BFR him. Still, it was a pretty brutal beat down.

I mean, I'm sure you've seen the Godwave feat, which I place above what Angrir can dish out.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Thanks for making the effort and actually having proof.

Rulk at the time wasn't all that, IMO. Definitely some way from his Watcher fighting days. And Angrir still didn't get to KO him, and had to BFR him. Still, it was a pretty brutal beat down.

Any time.

He wasn't as uber as he use to be but Rulk was still an elite who was noticeably stronger then Diana. And that's not a knock against Wonder Woman as Thor pointed out that Rulk was even stronger then Hulk. Bendis doesn't give a f*ck.

Had to bfr him? Rulk was completely finished at that point. I think that last hit was the finishing blow that took him out, not a specific attempt to get him away from the area.

Fyi, Rulk took a beating from the Hood wielding the Power/Reality Gems IIRC and was in similar shape. Rulk can take a beating about as well as anyone.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
I mean, I'm sure you've seen the Godwave feat, which I place above what Angrir can dish out.

Are you talking about when Diana specifically prays to the Olympian Gods to empower her, they debate, and agree to it? That's not really relevant to this thread.

Is this the sword that one shots Angrir?
http://i44.tinypic.com/2vja77k.jpg

http://i43.tinypic.com/2ij6xef.jpg

Yup. Don't underestimate the power of paper cuts:
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/7/71810/2033631-superman_v2_211__2005___team_dcp__pg11.jpg
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/7/71810/2033641-superman_v2_211__2005___team_dcp__pg12.jpg
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/7/71810/2033655-superman_v2_211__2005___team_dcp__pg17.jpg

well, in that pic, supes did save mongul from dying once he was down.....basically my point wayyyyyy back was that the sword could pierce thing. i also said that if it did so, in a vital area, it COULD kill him, or at least imo severely incapacitate him to allow follow-ups to kill him. it seemed ready to cleave mongul's head. question is, could diana land a potentially crippling blow against ben? with her speed and skill, i don't see why not. at the very least it IS a debatable point unlike what some are suggesting. ben wasn't a lightweight, clearly, but he doesn't have to be to be beaten by someone arguably who is arguably as strong, much faster, more skilled, than he is, and who is wielding a weapon capable of piercing his vital organs..... but, to each their own.

in the second scans, the sword looks like a dagger. AND supes was fast enough to grab diana. ben? not gonna have that option....again, it's not ben's physical power that is in doubt--least not by me. ww is in his class and has a skill and speed advantage with a weapon capable of killing him with the right hit. i'm not thinking that stance is particularly unreasonable....

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
So in other words, you have nothing. Run along then.

You know, you are barking out an aweful lot of commands from your dormatory. Where did you get the idea that you can make me do anything I don't chose to do? Declare victory all you want, but until you have some scans showing me WW defeating WT in battle, my OPINION is just as valid as your OPINION. And no, I still am not posting any "scans of power" because all you are going to do in discard them. You know it and I know it.

Originally posted by Branlor Swift
Is this the sword that one shots Angrir?
http://i44.tinypic.com/2vja77k.jpg

http://i43.tinypic.com/2ij6xef.jpg

LMAO!! That's one shiney nail file.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Yup. Don't underestimate the power of paper cuts:
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/7/71810/2033631-superman_v2_211__2005___team_dcp__pg11.jpg
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/7/71810/2033641-superman_v2_211__2005___team_dcp__pg12.jpg
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/7/71810/2033655-superman_v2_211__2005___team_dcp__pg17.jpg

Superman just smacked a hoe like it was the 1950's!! So, um, what happened to her super speed, or did she just tank the attack because she got all emotional? Sure does look like she was moving slow as hell.

Originally posted by leonidas
by someone arguably who is arguably as strong

Strongly disagreed. I think Worthy Thing is a good deal stronger then Diana. Rulk alone is stronger then her.

In the very same comic that Thor killed him, he took a charged Mjolnir throw to the face and was only slightly budged:
http://s3d2.turboimagehost.com/sp/0a2d8cb5a38559d1be3bed1ee86096b9/FI_5_Oroboros_CPS_006.jpg

He also withstood a beating from Rulk that would leave Wonder Woman bruised, bleeding and broken without a scratch. He's noticeably more durable as well.

Originally posted by leonidas
in the second scans, the sword looks like a dagger. AND supes was fast enough to grab diana. ben? not gonna have that option....again, it's not ben's physical power that is in doubt--least not by me. ww is in his class and has a skill and speed advantage with a weapon capable of killing him with the right hit. i'm not thinking that stance is particularly unreasonable....

I think it's the exact same shit: Mystical blade she brings to a fight. Are you talking about the length of the metal?

How about you post an example of Diana using her sword to kill anyone of any noticeable stature? Because as far as I've seen, all the sword has ever done is break the skin of an opponent and despite all her supposed skill and speed, has never actually won her a fight.

Fyi, in the comic Bran posted, Wonder Woman destroys the sword by tossing it on the ground:


So yea, lol.

Originally posted by Blue Area Vet
Where did you get the idea that you can make me do anything I don't chose to do?

my OPINION is just as valid as your OPINION.

For someone with such negative opinions of women u kind of come off sounding like a chick.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Strongly disagreed. I think Worthy Thing is a good deal stronger then Diana. Rulk alone is stronger then her.

In the very same comic that Thor killed him, he took a charged Mjolnir throw to the face and was only slightly budged:
http://s3d2.turboimagehost.com/sp/0a2d8cb5a38559d1be3bed1ee86096b9/FI_5_Oroboros_CPS_006.jpg

He also withstood a beating from Rulk that would leave Wonder Woman bruised, bleeding and broken without a scratch. He's noticeably more durable as well.



I think it's the exact same shit: Mystical blade she brings to a fight. Are you talking about the length of the metal?

How about you post an example of Diana using her sword to kill anyone of any noticeable stature? Because as far as I've seen, all the sword has ever done is break the skin of an opponent and despite all her supposed skill and speed, has never actually won her a fight.

Fyi, in the comic Bran posted, Wonder Woman destroys the sword by tossing it on the ground:


So yea, lol.

well, she IS a good guy, so expecting to see her gut someone? not happening. it's cut supes and mongul in the scans shown. that's enough to say it could pierce ben i think. the blade did seem very short, so of course that would make a difference. stabbing ben with a dagger vs a long sword? far more difficult clearly....as for his being far stronger? definitely disagree. stronger? i allowed for that earlier. enough of a difference to be the difference maker here? certainly not imo. you're arguing she can't do something because she hasn't--ie stab/kill a herald. that's usually a reasonable stance to take, one i take more often than not. in this case though, like logan has taken out abomination when he stabbed him through the head/neck, the weapon makes a big difference IF it is used in a lethal way--something she doesn't typically do. IF she wanted to kill though, i see no reason why she couldn't kill a lot of herald type beings who are much slower, and less skilled than she is. you seem to be arguing more AGAINST her doing it, than suggesting ways for ben to COUNTER it. to me, this is just an interesting discussion. i don't really have a horse in the race. but styles make fights and this doesn't seem to be the type of opponent that ben was made to handle.

Originally posted by leonidas
well, she IS a good guy, so expecting to see her gut someone? not happening. Then she probably shouldn't use a sword at all. And she shouldn't slash at the top half of someone's body with it.

And it probably shouldn't be after she brutally killed Maxwell Lord on worldwide TV.

Originally posted by Raptor22
For someone with such negative opinions of women u kind of come off sounding like a chick.

I'll take your personal comments off the air. By the way, it's a common practice of male chauvinist to refer to women as chicks. Got an opinion on the topic or are you just taking a sTROLL through the park?

Originally posted by Branlor Swift
Then she probably shouldn't use a sword at all. And she shouldn't slash at the top half of someone's body with it.

And it probably shouldn't be after she brutally killed Maxwell Lord on worldwide TV.


Lmao! And her supporters should probably stop talking abouy how the blessed ball of clay chops high heralds up like a serial killer.

Doesn't Angrir have range advantage? I remember him using blasts to level buildings and at close range against Rulk.

Originally posted by Branlor Swift
Then she probably shouldn't use a sword at all. And she shouldn't slash at the top half of someone's body with it.

And it probably shouldn't be after she brutally killed Maxwell Lord on worldwide TV.

probably not but her character, like all characters, has evolved over the last bunch of years. she really shouldn't be ready to utterly cleave someone's skull either, but it's those odd showings here and there that allow me to say she can do what she would do with the sword and not be entirely ooc, though it is still a minor question in my mind.

Originally posted by leonidas
well, she IS a good guy, so expecting to see her gut someone? not happening. it's cut supes and mongul in the scans shown. that's enough to say it could pierce ben i think. the blade did seem very short, so of course that would make a difference. stabbing ben with a dagger vs a long sword? far more difficult clearly....as for his being far stronger? definitely disagree. stronger? i allowed for that earlier. enough of a difference to be the difference maker here? certainly not imo. you're arguing she can't do something because she hasn't--ie stab/kill a herald. that's usually a reasonable stance to take, one i take more often than not. in this case though, like logan has taken out abomination when he stabbed him through the head/neck, the weapon makes a big difference IF it is used in a lethal way--something she doesn't typically do. IF she wanted to kill though, i see no reason why she couldn't kill a lot of herald type beings who are much slower, and less skilled than she is. you seem to be arguing more AGAINST her doing it, than suggesting ways for ben to COUNTER it. to me, this is just an interesting discussion. i don't really have a horse in the race. but styles make fights and this doesn't seem to be the type of opponent that ben was made to handle.

So it's unreasonable for me to ask evidence of her gutting anyone from a comic book but here you are arguing that she's going to win by seriously maiming Angrir? Fyi, around Infinite Crisis, Wonder Woman was actually pretty ruthless; she wasn't holding back against Mongul and it did here absolutely no good.

Yes, Angrir is noticeably stronger then Diana, to the point it would make a difference (Like any other fight against a High Herald such as Thor, Hulk, Superman etc.). As a matter of fact, Rulk at the time under Bendis was also stronger then Diana (Easily on the level of beings like Thor/Hulk) and he couldn't do absolutely anything to Angrir. Basically, if she tried to fight Angrir in close combat directly? It would not go well for her. A direct shot from that meat cleaver to the face would really mess up her day.

Also, why are you assuming the sword can even pierce Ben enough to do any serious damage? Neither of us can think of any instance when the sword has maimed someone of noticeable durability enough to give her a win. This is especially notable because Diana easily broke the sword by tossing it on the ground. For all it's sharpness, it's not particularly durable apparently. Heck, can you even think of a time when the sword has made a noticeable difference in a fight? Because she's been ***** slapped every time I've seen her whip it out.

Fyi, Thing has shown that he can fly, use powerful energy blasts, control the weather and lighting. The Worthy have also shown teleportation energy absorption and other such Thor-like tricks so there are a variety of counters that Angrir can fall back on.