Something we call the Force...

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Evil Windu
Anyone with a mild familiarity with the Prequels, knows that Qui-Gon Jinn and Obi-Wan Kenobi had different approaches to the Force. We've come to know them as separate philosphies or believes within the construct of the Force.

There's the Living Force and the Unifying Force. The most objective definitions tell us the Living Force is a very "now" centered view of the Force, and deals with the moment, feeling rather then thinking. The Unifying Force has been known as the Force which focuses on contemplation and reservation before action. It tells us to be mindful of the future and the events our actions may take, whereas the former tells us to act instead of think, to trust our feelings.

There was the belief a while back that the Living Force was an incomplete view of the Force, only part of the Unifying Force, which is the proper approach for a Jedi. The belief said that only through this approach a Jedi could become one with the Force, which would be a Jedi's goal. This is cemented through the fact that during the time of the Prequels the predominant view of most Jedi is that of the Unifying Force, propitioners of the Living Force are viewed as brazen and headstrong. Qui-Gon Jinn, Count Dooku, and Anakin Skywalker all show signs of this belief, and that the Living Force requires acting on feelings, it comes perilously close to the dark side view, powered by emotions and not contemplation.

Another belief holds that the Living Force is indeed part of the Force, but so is the Unifying Force. They are both two halves of the Force, both by themselves are incomplete, but together they allow a Jedi to consider both the present and the future at the same time. When a Jedi learns the difference between a time for contemplation and a time for action, then they can achieve their fullest in the Force.

Or, the third belief, which I'm gaining more and more affinity towards, is that the Unifying Force is the view of the Force which is limiting, and the Living Force can either be the true way or the path that leads to the dark side. This is seen in the fact that the Jedi, during the Prequels, were for the most part propitioners of the Unifying Force, in such their ideals for the Republic and what the system could become in the future blinded them for what it was now. Qui-Gon Jinn and Count Dooku knew of the corruption, and while Dooku was turned to the dark side, Qui-Gon Jinn was the one who found Anakin Skywalker, the Chosen One. Both of them were very aware of the Sith Lords returning for revenge, and Qui-Gon was very keen on the role Anakin had in this return. That he was to remove it, and eliminate the disorder and imbalance from the Force. It's further confirmed with us in the Original Trilogy, when suddenly instead of Yoda and Obi-Wan Kenobi still being encased in their steady, calm, constantly-considering-the-odds approach (as they were in the Prequel Trilogy with the Sith, the Clone Wars, and with the corruption in the Senate), they were aggressive and active. After being hermits for nearly two decades, once Luke Skywalker approached Obi-Wan concerning the rebellion, then they went into overdrive. Suddenly Luke has to train to be a Jedi (at the old age of 20, twice as old as his father who was initially thought to have started too old; this was wrong, and was also an approach from within just the Unifying Force). Yoda, in his training of Luke, was constantly telling him to concentrate on the moment, and let the Force flow through him. When Luke's mind wandered to the future, to his friends or to his future adventures, Yoda pushed on him to return back to his training, back to the present. This is the exact opposite of what he told Obi-Wan over three decades earlier, "Too be mindful of the future."

One might say that the Living Force makes people act on their emotions, and this leads to fear, anger and then aggressive, the path of the dark side. However, this is not always the case. The Living Force simply means that one acts, allowing the Force to dictate their actions, not meditation or contemplation. It follows in line with Qui-Gon Jinn's words to Anakin, about being in-tune with the Force, being able to hear it speak to you.

So what do you think? Which one of these beliefs do you think best presents the way the Force should be viewed, or do you think they are all inaccurate and you have the inside line on what the Unifying Force and the Living Force have to do with each other?

yerssot
imho, the force is the force and the living or unifying part is just what you center most on. If you're future minded you follow the unifying force, which doesn't matter because it's the same force.

Ushgarak
First of all, 'unifying' force is a fan term. GL calls it 'Cosmic'

Secondly, GL describes the Cosmic Force as the 'Greater' part of the Force- to quote:

"The Force itself breaks into two sides: the living Force and a greater, cosmic Force. The living Force makes you sensitive to other living things, makes you intuitive, and allows you to read other people's minds, et cetera. But the greater Force has to do with destiny. In working with the Force, you can find your destiny and you can choose to either follow it, or not"

yerssot
I retract my previous post and bow to the wisdom of GL

Member.
so the force is all around and we humans are just too un-psionic to detect them and hear them talking to us. i wish i could use the force.

cookies2006
I would too. But like i said somewhere else before, only certain people deserve something like that. Look below!

Julie
Force is force is force

GordonSkywalker
That reminds me of an archaic song.

cookies2006
Whats that skywalker?

GordonSkywalker
Just reminded me of an old song that's all. We should try to keep on topic I think. big grin

cookies2006
Yeah! uh...... Only certain people deserve to have something as special as a jedi has.

GordonSkywalker
Absolute power can corrupt absolutely. I agree my friend. We will see what happens when Anakin Skywalker fails to understand this important lesson during the next film in the series.

Tevesh
the road to hell is often paved through innocence of the heart and goodness of the soul

GordonSkywalker
I could not have said it better myself Tevesh!

Captain REX
I like EvilWindu's theory. It works well, in my opinion. Plus, Yoda's and Obi-Wan's views of the Force do change between the PT and the OT.

GordonSkywalker
Yes I was reading something about that just the other day. Yoda is more cautious and laid back in the new films as opposed to the earlier ones.

Tevesh
i believe that EU did explain this a bit more. they mentioned something about yoda and obiwan shaping luke into more of a weapon to defeat the emporer and vader, and to focus on the living force and such.

Ushgarak
Not that they ever mentioned it to him. Everything Yoda points Luke towards is in keeping with what GL terms the Cosmic Force, not the Living.

GordonSkywalker
Luke didn't seem to know what he was expected to do about Vader but Obi Wan sure thought he would have to kill him and the Emperor.

yerssot
hmm...
what was lukes quote before OB1 said
"Then the emperor has already won..." (ESB) ?

GordonSkywalker
In ROTJ Luke says he cannot kill his own father(Vader) then Obi Wan says the Emperor has already won.

Captain REX
No, in ESB Gordon, not ROTJ.

I think it was because Luke was being unruly and was doing the whole "I have to go" thing. He hadn't finished his training and Obi-Wan was thinking that Luke was either going to a) get diced into bantha bites or b) fall to the Dark-Side.

GordonSkywalker
That is not the quote I was thinking of.

Ushgarak
Yeah, Gordon's right, Rexy, yerssot was asking about an ROTJ quote.

Obi-Wan thought Vader would have to be killed because he had already failed to do what Luke ended up doing.

"Obi-Wan once thought as you did," says Vader, when Luke talks of the good he can still sense inside Vader.

Captain REX
Oh, sorry. I haven't seen ROTJ in awhile.

Tevesh
which type of force do you guys think the Emporer and Vader use?

Ushgarak
Errr... it doesn't really work like that. Everyone just uses 'The Force', just the Force is a wide-ranging concept and some prefer some aspects of it to others.

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