Living Tribunal vs Scathan the Approver

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Jynocidus
no BFR

eaebiakuya
Like BFR would matter in a fight like that, lol.

zopzop
Scathan stomps a hole in the LT's chest.

He effortlessly put an end to the Protege's rampage and held him fast against his will while the LT passed judgement. The Protege was incapable of copying Scathan's powers despite being free from the Celestial muzzle, yet he had no problem copying Hawk God/Mephisto/Eternity/Beyonder/Living Tribunal's powers.

Jynocidus
Scathan stopped a material being who had no business with abstract power, of course he was able to disprove of it.

How would his approval fair against the actual abstract entity?

zopzop
Originally posted by Jynocidus
Scathan stopped a material being who had no business with abstract power, of course he was able to disprove of it.

How would his approval fair against the actual abstract entity?
That has nothing to do with what I just mentioned. Scathan approving or disapproving of the LT's judgement on the Protege had ZERO to do with Scathan stopping the Protege's rampage, muzzling him, then restraining him while the LT passed judgement.

Protege with the LT/Eternity/Hawk God/Beyonder/Mephisto's power couldn't break free of Scathan's grip or copy him.

LT gets beaten into a coma.

Jynocidus
Originally posted by zopzop
That has nothing to do with what I just mentioned. Scathan approving or disapproving of the LT's judgement on the Protege had ZERO to do with Scathan stopping the Protege's rampage, muzzling him, then restraining him while the LT passed judgement.

Protege with the LT/Eternity/Hawk God/Beyonder/Mephisto's power couldn't break free of Scathan's grip or copy him.

LT gets beaten into a coma.

How?

Epicurus
The Living Trilobite wins.

Insane Titan
LT Wins

TheLordofMurder
Scathan annihilates the LT...

On panel, Scathan stopped a being that the LT himself was incapable of stopping...

I agree with zop; Scathan beats the LT into a coma...

Jynocidus
LT is beyond approval

Mr Master
Scathan one shot the combined power of: (including Protege's)

the Living Tribunal, multiversal Eternity, multiversal Hawkgod, multi-universal Beyonder, Mephisto, Malevolence & GOTG.

There's no need for any further discussion.

DarkSaint85
Originally posted by Epicurus
The Loving Trilobite wins.

Fixed.

http://s5d4.turboimagehost.com/t/19612570_5201191.jpg

AsbestosFlaygon
Scathan restrained a being more powerful than LT.

The only physical threats in Marvel who could go up against him are Thanos w/ THOTI, The Alien Entity and probably Edifice Rex.

Jynocidus
It makes no sense for Scathan to be above the LT. In a dire situation such as the one where Protege was muzzled, he was able to shine. Without order being disturbed, he can't disprove of the LT.

Just like Protege had to wait until LT made his move, had to watch. He couldn't just outright do it. That's what I'm saying here.

What does Scathan NEED to win this match? There is no Protege here, nobody else. Scathan stopped a material being (Protege), who had mimicked abstract entity powers. You think Scathan can muzzle LT?

zopzop
Originally posted by Jynocidus
It makes no sense for Scathan to be above the LT. In a dire situation such as the one where Protege was muzzled, he was able to shine. Without order being disturbed, he can't disprove of the LT.

Huh? Even after everything he did to restore order to the court and restrain the Protege so the LT could pass judgement, Scathan still wasn't done. After the LT passed judgement, it seemed Scathan's approval was needed to cement the LT's decision.

Scathan ROFLstomps.

Jynocidus
I see the way the plot had THAT story go, I'm saying in this VS thread.

Can Scathan muzzle a nigh-omnipotent abstract, or is his limit material beings with mimicked abstract capabilities?

I don't think Scathan has the authority to outright defeat, replace, or obliterate the LT.

There's a reason why LT is top dog and not Scathan

zopzop
Originally posted by Jynocidus
I see the way the plot had THAT story go, I'm saying in this VS thread.

Can Scathan muzzle a nigh-omnipotent abstract, or is his limit material beings with mimicked abstract capabilities?

I don't think Scathan has the authority to outright defeat, replace, or obliterate the LT.

There's a reason why LT is top dog and not Scathan
Except the LT wasn't the "Top Dog" in that arc. He wasn't even second. He was a distant third after Scathan and the Protege.

Jynocidus
Where did Protege get his greatest power from?

Who did Scathan restore order for?

Estacado
Scatman.

Utrigita
I have always wondered what happened after LT imprisoned Protege in the hourglass, did he trap Protege inside himself, or did he absorb him?

zopzop
Originally posted by Jynocidus
Where did Protege get his greatest power from?
From the LT, who sans Scathan, was the most powerful being there.


For the LT, so he could pass judgement. The same way a bailiff maintains order in a courtroom so the Judge can do his job.

Jynocidus
LT was the top dog then, like I said.

Mr Master
Originally posted by Utrigita

I have always wondered what happened after LT imprisoned Protege in the hourglass, did he trap Protege inside himself, or did he absorb him?
That's a mystery.
Originally posted by Jynocidus

Can Scathan muzzle a nigh-omnipotent abstract
That's not Scathan's only ability, to "muzzle" heads.

When Protege was about to erase the LT, Eternity and the rest,
Scathan interrupted Protege with a blast of energy, stomping Protege and sending everyone flying.

Next page, we see Protege in-affective and with a muzzle on his head. (portraying a prisoner)

Next page Scathan removes the muzzle, and restrains Protege with his bare hands, while LT passes judgement.

All that time, Protege was > LT. (and handbookS confirm that on panel proof)

Jynocidus
That's all good for that comic or saga

But in this thread, what is required for Scathan to "blast" or "muzzle" equity?

The way I see it, Protege wasn't impartial to all other beings in the way that LT was. Thus, not a true abstract. Protege acted selfishly, telling others to get on their knees....foolishly thinking he was the new One Above All. LT was no such dictator, and knew he wasn't TOAA. That's why with LT inactive, Scathan could go into effect.

Scathan couldn't blast LT the way he did Protege. In fact, Scathan is subordinate to the LT.

zopzop
Originally posted by Jynocidus
In fact, Scathan is subordinate to the LT.
What you're not understanding is that being subordinate in RANK doesn't mean you are subordinate in POWER (assuming Scathan is even subordinate to the LT, see below).

A judge is king of the court but without the bailiff what's stopping the criminal from jumping the bench and breaking the judge's neck? This is exactly what happened with Scathan/LT/Protege. The judge lost control of the court and the bailiff had to step in and restore order.

All this assumes Scathan is subordinate in rank to the LT. This can't be true since even after the LT passed judgement, Scathan had to approve of it.

Jynocidus
Scathan had no choice to approve of LT's decision. LT is impartial, as the embodiment of Equity. He prolly agreed with it, it's supposed to be the most logical.

Scathan did not approve of Protege because he wasn't impartial, he was selfish and had malicious intent. The reason why fleshly beings don't need to tamper with abstract concepts in the first place. Protege's weak material body couldn't handle a blast from a celestial, where as plot had LT nearly usurped by mimicry. Mimicry of his own incredible power by a material being. You think LT can't take celestial blasts? You think LT is going to be muzzled?

The Cosmic court isn't like the normal court system. In this case, LT has the power of the bailiff no doubt, Scathan was the back up. Scathan still in no way accounts for as much as the LT.

Jynocidus
LT is only defeated by plot. No fictional character can contend with him face to face no BFR by themselves. LT isn't one of those "Superman vs Doomsday" characters, and this isn't one of those type of battles IMO. It's not even a battle at all...

I bet you if Protege got released in Marvel NOW, he wouldn't be able to override LT's authority. I'd like to see him vs Molecule Man

Jynocidus
I think THOTI was able to definitely do it. Protege was nearly able to do it, but it didn't happen...nor would it have made sense to.

Just like it wouldn't have made sense for Pre-Retcon Beyonder to be TOAA.

I acknowledge their power, but only THOTI is truly acceptable to me as having surpassed. Protege is like a Thor - level being, maybe? Instead of having something like telepathy or energy beams, he has mimicry. He doesn't embody abstract concepts for me to say he'd ever be as strong as LT. If he did away with LT in the story, then maybe.

I think in a Vs thread no BFR, just like if Protege got released logically in Marvel NOW, LT would prevent him from overriding his authority just like he put limitations on the Infinity Gems. It's well within his capability.

Jynocidus
Protege would have been a neat character, they had to quarantine him. He served his purpose, no doubt.

Mr Master
Scathan was above the LT in status and power in that arc.

Here's the evidence that can't be debated:

http://www.killermovies.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=492799&pagenumber=6

Since I've discussed this subject before, it's all laid out perfectly for yall in that thread.

quanchi112
Scathan wins.

Epicurus
Originally posted by zopzop

From the LT, who sans Scathan, was the most powerful being there.
But as revealed later on, the LT was drawing power from the Eye of Agamotto. Maybe he kept the bulk of his powers hidden, to deceive Protege, thereby allowing the only other Abstract whom Protege wasn't focusing on(Scathan) to act swiftly and muzzle up Protege.

I know it's all speculation on my part, but that doesn't mean it's not possible.

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