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Which hero wins? This fight takes place on a Oil Tanker.

Not sure what weapons Cy normally has on him.

He isn't hitting Spiderman though.

LOL. Spider-Man wins easily.

DC Cyborg, yeah? I'm unfamiliar with New 52 Cyborg, but if he has any decent AoE attacks: energy spray, sonics, etc., then Spidey is in some trouble. Anyone saying he doesn't hit Spider-Man must only be considering H2H and directional attacks. On that, we agree. But Vic wouldn't be put down quickly, so I doubt it's so easy.

Cyborg wins at least 8/10 if he has a competent array of AoE attacks. If he doesn't, it likely swings the other way.

Spider-Man has range attacts but Cyborg should have computer reaction and aim.

Cyborg has a white noise cannon that completely disintegrated Darkseid's parademons.

Spider-Man can't even hurt Cyborg.

Can vic swim?

he can fly and he can open boom tubes.

he's not getting drowned if that's what you're getting at.

also, he has fought in deep sea.

Originally posted by marwash22
Cyborg has a white noise cannon that completely disintegrated Darkseid's parademons.

Spider-Man can't even hurt Cyborg.

Yeah, this seems like the best assessment I've seen so far.

I don't know about "can't even hurt" - Pete has laid the lumber to some heavy hitters before - but the overall opinion is sound.

Cyborg wins.

Spiderman can hurt Vic, and I honestly can't see him tagging Spiderman.

Vic tanked a punch from Superman; Superman was weakened by kryptonite at the time, but he was still way stronger than Spider-man.

Vic doesn't need to tag Spidey, his white noise cannon has a huge radius... Spidey can't even get close to Vic.

Honestly, this isn't a fair fight unless you give Spidey prep.

Originally posted by marwash22
Vic tanked a punch from Superman; Superman was weakened by kryptonite at the time, but he was still way stronger than Spider-man.

Vic doesn't need to tag Spidey, his white noise cannon has a huge radius... Spidey can't even get close to Vic.

Honestly, this isn't a fair fight unless you give Spidey prep.



Cyborg is atleast a full notch/tier segment above Spidey...

Cyborg 10/10...

Originally posted by marwash22
Vic tanked a punch from Superman; Superman was weakened by kryptonite at the time, but he was still way stronger than Spider-man.

Vic doesn't need to tag Spidey, his white noise cannon has a huge radius... Spidey can't even get close to Vic.

Honestly, this isn't a fair fight unless you give Spidey prep.

You know debating doesn't work like that. Spiderman has endured hits from top tiers as well.

I agree, if Vic starts off with an attack like that, it would probably end the fight. Glad CIS is on and wasn't that parademon showing non canon to the real Vic?

Cyborg.

Originally posted by carver9
You know debating doesn't work like that. work like what, stating facts?



Originally posted by carver9
Spiderman has endured hits from top tiers as well. doesn't matter what Spiderman has endured, we're discussing the damage he can dish out, not the damage he can take... and it's a fact that he can't come close dishing out the amount of force even a weakened Superman can.


Originally posted by carver9
I agree, if Vic starts off with an attack like that, it would probably end the fight. Glad CIS is onit's evident you've lost an argument when you fall back on the CIS rule.

anyhow, CIS about stupidity, the rule implicitly states that CIS is "any natural mental limitations that characters impose upon themselves and reduce their ability to use their own skills and powers effectively". Cyborg is not stupid, He's basically a walking computer, one of the most logical fighters you will find.

to suggest he wouldn't use his best attack on a foe at the start of a match is asinine.



Originally posted by carver9
and wasn't that parademon showing non canon to the real Vic? what do you mean?

Originally posted by carver9
Spiderman can hurt Vic, and I honestly can't see him tagging Spiderman.

As long as he has competent AoE, you're wrong.

I'll throw you a bone on the comparative durability debate you're having with marwash. If we take highest showings, both have tanked blows from characters well beyond their range. Vic's durability is clearly higher, and it would be problematic for Pete to put him down. But likely not impossible, though it would take time.

However, the AoE is the killer. It's been an Achilles of Spidey for years.

I misread the title. I thought it was Cyclops (from X-MEN) vs Spider-Man. LOL. I change my vote to Cyborg.

Originally posted by marwash22
work like what, stating facts?



doesn't matter what Spiderman has endured, we're discussing the damage he can dish out, not the damage he can take... and it's a fact that he can't come close dishing out the amount of force even a weakened Superman can.


it's evident you've lost an argument when you fall back on the CIS rule.

anyhow, CIS about stupidity, the rule implicitly states that CIS is "any natural mental limitations that characters impose upon themselves and reduce their ability to use their own skills and powers effectively". Cyborg is not stupid, He's basically a walking computer, one of the most logical fighters you will find.

to suggest he wouldn't use his best attack on a foe at the start of a match is asinine.



what do you mean?

Claiming 10/10 against a character the caliber of Spiderman with the combat prowess and success record is also asinine. I think Cyborg wins a small majority.

Originally posted by marwash22
work like what, stating facts?



doesn't matter what Spiderman has endured, we're discussing the damage he can dish out, not the damage he can take... and it's a fact that he can't come close dishing out the amount of force even a weakened Superman can.


it's evident you've lost an argument when you fall back on the CIS rule.

anyhow, CIS about stupidity, the rule implicitly states that CIS is "any natural mental limitations that characters impose upon themselves and reduce their ability to use their own skills and powers effectively". Cyborg is not stupid, He's basically a walking computer, one of the most logical fighters you will find.

to suggest he wouldn't use his best attack on a foe at the start of a match is asinine.



what do you mean?

That Vic average is that high.

Lol...when Spiderman gets serious, he damage people like Ironman, Firelord, Masterson Thor, Angrir, and Absorbing Man, all who is above Cyborg. Cyborg can not win a ft war against Parker.

Honestly, CIS helps Victor more than anything. A CIS LESS Spiderman would be blitzing the hell out of Victor before he had the chance to react. Victor doesn't have the speed to tag Spiderman or to get off an attack before Spiderman would. Webbing plays a huge role here and you already know why.

What showing are you talking about with the Parademon because if it's the one I think you are talking about, it isn't canon to the real Vic.

Originally posted by Digi
As long as he has competent AoE, you're wrong.

I'll throw you a bone on the comparative durability debate you're having with marwash. If we take highest showings, both have tanked blows from characters well beyond their range. Vic's durability is clearly higher, and it would be problematic for Pete to put him down. But likely not impossible, though it would take time.

However, the AoE is the killer. It's been an Achilles of Spidey for years.

Read above. If anyone is getting off an attack first, trust me, it will not be Vic.

Originally posted by carver9
Lol...when Spiderman gets serious, he damage people like Ironman, Firelord, Masterson Thor, Angrir, and Absorbing Man, all who is above Cyborg. Cyborg can not win a ft war against Parker. I'm not going to entertain massive examples of PIS, unless you'd like to start a thread featuring Thor vs. Spiderman and argue on the side of Spiderman.

stahp it. Cyborg tanked a bomb that was directly on his body. Spidey ain't hurting him.


Originally posted by carver9
Honestly, CIS helps Victor more than anything. A CIS LESS Spiderman would be blitzing the hell out of Victor before he had the chance to react. Victor doesn't have the speed to tag Spiderman or to get off an attack before Spiderman would.

lol. his brain is as fast as the watchtower computer (which can process a couple trillion calculations per second) and he can fly fast enough to keep up with Superman and Firestorm.

Spidey is not blitzing him, and even if he could, it wouldn't matter, because again, Spidey can't hurt Cyborg.

Originally posted by carver9
Webbing plays a huge role here and you already know why.nah, i don't.

Originally posted by carver9
What showing are you talking about with the Parademon because if it's the one I think you are talking about, it isn't canon to the real Vic. happened in an earlier issue of JL during the Darkseid invasion.

How was that not the real Vic?

Spiderman can definitely hurt Cyborg we can't just ignore all the impressive showings Pete has under his belt of hurting top level dudes. There are quite a few of them and they're canon. If Cap and Batman get all the shine they get around here for hurting and beating guys out of their classes why not Spidey?

Originally posted by Digi
Yeah, this seems like the best assessment I've seen so far.

I don't know about "can't even hurt" - Pete has laid the lumber to some heavy hitters before - but the overall opinion is sound.

Cyborg wins.

Two counters:

Web cocoon

Web shield
If Vic's cocooned, it's over. Rogue was trapped by it, and Thing struggled to tear out half a cartridge of it.

I don't know how fast Vic's reflexes are in the Nu52, but Spidey could set up some insanely large web structures in an instant. Shields against explosions, webbing up the entire upper half of Matt's body (In the issue when he was in a Kingpin fat suit), and even quickly setting up an insane amount of webbing at the bottom of skyscrapers to catch people during AvsX..

Originally posted by JayDaDon
Spiderman can definitely hurt Cyborg we can't just ignore all the impressive showings Pete has under his belt of hurting top level dudes. There are quite a few of them and they're canon. If Cap and Batman get all the shine they get around here for hurting and beating guys out of their classes why not Spidey?

On the same hand what about Cyborg feats of tanking stuff above spidey?

What counts and what doesn't?

Originally posted by JayDaDon
Spiderman can definitely hurt Cyborg we can't just ignore all the impressive showings Pete has under his belt of hurting top level dudes. There are quite a few of them and they're canon. If Cap and Batman get all the shine they get around here for hurting and beating guys out of their classes why not Spidey? okay, then go start a thread featuring Spiderman versus one of those guys you're talking about, and argue on the side Spiderman. I doubt you'll do it because those occasions are not indicative of Spider-Man's actual level of power, instead they're examples of PIS.

Batman often hurts people stronger than himself by utilizing nerve strikes and such, not by straight up punching them with force hard enough to actually hurt them. If you wanna make the case that Spider-Man can hurt Thor with a punch, i challenge to make that thread.

Originally posted by carver9
Read above. If anyone is getting off an attack first, trust me, it will not be Vic.

Ok, that's fine. But it's going to take a lot more than one attack to put Cyborg down. I'm with you in saying Pete can put him down. What I'm telling you is, a good AoE attack neutralizes Spidey's advantage. Then it's just a short walk to pain-town for Pete.

Originally posted by cdtm
Two counters:

Web cocoon

Web shield
If Vic's cocooned, it's over. Rogue was trapped by it, and Thing struggled to tear out half a cartridge of it.

I don't know how fast Vic's reflexes are in the Nu52, but Spidey could set up some insanely large web structures in an instant. Shields against explosions, webbing up the entire upper half of Matt's body (In the issue when he was in a Kingpin fat suit), and even quickly setting up an insane amount of webbing at the bottom of skyscrapers to catch people during AvsX..

Sure, ok, this helps. But it also falls squarely into the "I'm going to imagine what one person can do while the other stands around" camp of debate. Pete may have initiative, but he's not the Flash. This is more delaying tactic than a route to victory.

Pete has an excellent route to victory against mid-level bricks. But that's not all Cyborg is.

Spidey didn't beat Thing. And just because he successfully webbed up Rogue, doesn't mean I think he could beat her consistently.

But the strength of the webbing is pretty consistent, as is his speed/efficiency using it. Spidey himself was trapped in his own webbing, and had to wait for it to dissolve.

Originally posted by marwash22
okay, then go start a thread featuring Spiderman versus one of those guys you're talking about, and argue on the side Spiderman. I doubt you'll do it because those occasions are not indicative of Spider-Man's actual level of power, instead they're examples of PIS.

Batman often hurts people stronger than himself by utilizing nerve strikes and such, not by straight up punching them with force hard enough to actually hurt them. If you wanna make the case that Spider-Man can hurt Thor with a punch, i challenge to make that thread.

Hurt doesn't mean defeat. He has hurt plenty of these guys and defeated others, that's fact. Doesn't mean he's taking a majority over Thor, nobody said that.

Originally posted by Digi
Ok, that's fine. But it's going to take a lot more than one attack to put Cyborg down. I'm with you in saying Pete can put him down. What I'm telling you is, a good AoE attack neutralizes Spidey's advantage. Then it's just a short walk to pain-town for Pete.



Sure, ok, this helps. But it also falls squarely into the "I'm going to imagine what one person can do while the other stands around" camp of debate. Pete may have initiative, but he's not the Flash. This is more delaying tactic than a route to victory.

Pete has an excellent route to victory against mid-level bricks. But that's not all Cyborg is.

Again, I don't know how good Vic's reflexes are, though...

Spidey's no Flash, sure, but for all intents and purposes, he DOES straddle that line between speedster and bullet timer. You're either fast enough to stomp him, or slow enough where he can dance around you a good long while (Which, as you say, may only delay the inevitable..)

Originally posted by cdtm
Again, I don't know how good Vic's reflexes are, though...

Spidey's no Flash, sure, but for all intents and purposes, he DOES straddle that line between speedster and bullet timer. You're either fast enough to stomp him, or slow enough where he can dance around you a good long while (Which, as you say, may only delay the inevitable..)

Targeting computer + AoE. Sorry, but our boy's in trouble. I need to be really generous in my interpretation of the fight to lend any credence to your line of thinking here.

Also, I'll grant you he's in between bullet time and speedster. But it's not necessarily an equivalent gap.

Like a "GOML" area attack?

I'll give you he isn't dodging a wide area attack. More, I'm saying he could try gumming up his sonic blaster/webbing his gun arm, or cover the arena with web bunkers...

It's Vic's fight to lose, definitely. Iron Fist, who I back against Spidey, would be in trouble against a wide area sonic attack that could vape people..

Originally posted by cdtm
It's Vic's fight to lose, definitely.

Probably best to leave it with a to this. I don't have the stomach to fight against Spidey too hard, and anything beyond this sentence of yours will just be picking nits.

Originally posted by Digi
Targeting computer + AoE. Sorry, but our boy's in trouble. I need to be really generous in my interpretation of the fight to lend any credence to your line of thinking here.

Also, I'll grant you he's in between bullet time and speedster. But it's not necessarily an equivalent gap.

Ironman has the best computer system in the world and still have trouble hitting Peter. That isn't good enough.

Originally posted by SamZED
Not sure what weapons Cy normally has on him. Just pick whichever character you like more and say they stomp.

Have I taught you nothing?

Originally posted by Digi
Probably best to leave it with a to this. I don't have the stomach to fight against Spidey too hard, and anything beyond this sentence of yours will just be picking nits. Nope, Spiderman stomps.

Originally posted by carver9
Ironman has the best computer system in the world and still have trouble hitting Peter. That isn't good enough.

You really want to make this comparison? Tony has half a dozen attacks that would floor Pete. Cyborg doesn't have that kind of versatility, but one good spread attack is plenty. Again, I would agree with you if all we were talking about were directional attacks.

Originally posted by marwash22
okay, then go start a thread featuring Spiderman versus one of those guys you're talking about, and argue on the side Spiderman. I doubt you'll do it because those occasions are not indicative of Spider-Man's actual level of power, instead they're examples of PIS.

Batman often hurts people stronger than himself by utilizing nerve strikes and such, not by straight up punching them with force hard enough to actually hurt them. If you wanna make the case that Spider-Man can hurt Thor with a punch, i challenge to make that thread. I agree with Carver on this one. A>B>C logic should work both ways, not just in Vic's favor. Just because he took a punch from weakened Superman that one time doesn't mean that nothing short of Superman-level punches can put him down, doesn't work that way in comics. It's an equivalent of me saying that just because Spider-man has hurt high heralds with his attacks in the past he is going to one shot kill Cy because he is no high herald. And going by SM history I believe he is more than capable of damaging Cyborg if he gets the chance.

That said, I'm not saying Pete wins, from what I heard here Vic should take it. Question is how much of a fight it's going to be. His white noise cannon.. how different it is from the old DC version?

I'm not saying high-end/low-end feats don't count, I'm saying the Thor feat is complete and utter nonsense and shouldn't be mentioned ever because Spider-man should in no way fathomable be able to so much as make Thor wince with a punch. The person who wrote that should never be allowed to use words again.


as for the white noise cannon, i don't know exactly what it's composition is, all i know is that it completely vaporized being who have higher durability than Spider-man.

Cyborg noise cannon or.... Or some kind of bright light to distract spider man the. Blast him to pieces

Originally posted by marwash22
I'm not saying high-end/low-end feats don't count, I'm saying the Thor feat is complete and utter nonsense and shouldn't be mentioned ever because Spider-man should in no way fathomable be able to so much as make Thor wince with a punch. The person who wrote that should never be allowed to use words again.


as for the white noise cannon, i don't know exactly what it's composition is, all i know is that it completely vaporized being who have higher durability than Spider-man. Putting aside Pete's showings against high heralds he's very consistent when it comes to hurting the more average strongmen of Marvel like Thing, Iron Man etc. I believe Cy falls under the same category in terms of durability.

In that case he better not get hit even once. If it's the same straight beam of sound/energy as in DColdU I don't think he will.

Originally posted by SamZED
Putting aside Pete's showings against high heralds he's very consistent when it comes to hurting the more average strongmen of Marvel like Thing, Iron Man etc. I believe Cy falls under the same category in terms of durability.

In that case he better not get hit even once. If it's the same straight beam of sound/energy as in DColdU I don't think he will.

Well, people were tossing around the term "area attack", which I assumed meant at least a "Get off my lawn" type wide beam.

If that's the case, Pete's in trouble.. If it's more of a standard type beam, then he could dodge it.

Carver, why is the white noise cannon not canon to the 'real' Cyborg?

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/12/120679/3234196-jl4-3.jpg
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/12/120679/3234197-jl4-4.jpg

It was his FIRST, instinctive, go-to weapon when attacked. If Spidey tried blitzing him, you really think he'd blitz Cyborg??? Hell, as can be seen, he wasn't even consciously controlling it - the AI was. So CIS is not applicable.

GTFO lol.

Not to mention, the promethium nanites will repair any damage sustained from Spidey.

He can assimilate tech, too. Spidey's webshooters? Gone. That nifty cellphone that he carries? A potential bomb.

As to throwing him off the tanker?

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/12/120679/3235233-aquaman-16-pg-011.jpg

He could also freeze Spidey in his tracks (yes, Z and Firestorm are there too, but he has an ice cannon):
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/12/120679/3235261-justiceleague_17_thegroup-012.jpg

Not to mention, Boom tubes. Which are now silent.
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/12/120679/3235352-2013-04-17+07-41-17+-+jla-016.jpg

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Carver, why is the white noise cannon not canon to the 'real' Cyborg?

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/12/120679/3234196-jl4-3.jpg
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/12/120679/3234197-jl4-4.jpg

It was his FIRST, instinctive, go-to weapon when attacked. If Spidey tried blitzing him, you really think he'd blitz Cyborg??? Hell, as can be seen, he wasn't even consciously controlling it - the AI was. So CIS is not applicable.

GTFO lol.

Not to mention, the promethium nanites will repair any damage sustained from Spidey.

He can assimilate tech, too. Spidey's webshooters? Gone. That nifty cellphone that he carries? A potential bomb.

As to throwing him off the tanker?

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/12/120679/3235233-aquaman-16-pg-011.jpg

He could also freeze Spidey in his tracks (yes, Z and Firestorm are there too, but he has an ice cannon):
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/12/120679/3235261-justiceleague_17_thegroup-012.jpg

Not to mention, Boom tubes. Which are now silent.
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/12/120679/3235352-2013-04-17+07-41-17+-+jla-016.jpg



All salient points. Cyborg wins.

Spidey wins this fairly easily if Cyborg doesn't use any AOE attacks.
Like Digi said, Cyborg must have some AOE attacks or he can't win.
Spidey has superspeed, and pre-cog Spider sense to avoid attacks even before they are launched.
Spidey has the sufficient strength to damage Cyborg and the speed in which to damage him fast.

Originally posted by h1a8
Spidey wins this fairly easily if Cyborg doesn't use any AOE attacks.
Like Digi said, Cyborg must have some AOE attacks or he can't win.
Spidey has superspeed, and pre-cog Spider sense to avoid attacks even before they are launched.
Spidey has the sufficient strength to damage Cyborg and the speed in which to damage him fast.

Lol.

IOW, if Spidey brings his A game, and Cyborg brings his B game, Spidey wins.

If both bring their A game, then Spidey loses.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Carver, why is the white noise cannon not canon to the 'real' Cyborg?

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/12/120679/3234196-jl4-3.jpg
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/12/120679/3234197-jl4-4.jpg

It was his FIRST, instinctive, go-to weapon when attacked. If Spidey tried blitzing him, you really think he'd blitz Cyborg??? Hell, as can be seen, he wasn't even consciously controlling it - the AI was. So CIS is not applicable.

GTFO lol.

Not to mention, the promethium nanites will repair any damage sustained from Spidey.

He can assimilate tech, too. Spidey's webshooters? Gone. That nifty cellphone that he carries? A potential bomb.

As to throwing him off the tanker?

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/12/120679/3235233-aquaman-16-pg-011.jpg

He could also freeze Spidey in his tracks (yes, Z and Firestorm are there too, but he has an ice cannon):
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/12/120679/3235261-justiceleague_17_thegroup-012.jpg

Not to mention, Boom tubes. Which are now silent.
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/12/120679/3235352-2013-04-17+07-41-17+-+jla-016.jpg

Solid post.

Spiderman stomps.

Originally posted by Mindset


Solid post.

Spiderman stomps.

Originally posted by marwash22
work like what, stating facts? Always remember that the abyss stares back into you

I say Spider-Man dodges some blast and from then on fights on his toes and from a distance also don't forget Spider-Man is great at using things around him as weapons manhole covers, wrecking ball, and cement.

Cyborg can pull so much nonsense out of his ass at times.

I'd take Spidey in a physical fight, but yeah..cyborg has so many gadets and the like.

Originally posted by Mindset


Solid post.

Spiderman stomps. sneer