Top 10 Sith/Jedi

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XSUPREMEXSKILLZ
These types of lists are always fun to make, so who are your top 10 sith and jedi?

Fated Xtasy
Jedi List.

#1. Luke Skywalker
#2. Yoda/Mace Windu
#3. Revan/HoT/Barsen'thor
#5. Satale Shan/Jaina Solo
#6. Obi-Wan Kenobi/Meetra Surik
#7. Kyle Katarn/Mara Jade
#8. Jaden Korr/Quinlan Vos
#9. An'ya Kuro/Shaak Ti
#10. Qui Gon Jinn

Sith List.

#1. Darth Sidious.
#2. Darth Plagueis
#3. Darth Bane
#4. Emperor Vitiate
#5. Marka Ragnos/Darth Traya/Darth Nihilius
#6. Darth Caedus/Darth Vader
#7. Exar Kun/Count Dooku
#8. Darth Maul/Lumiya
#9. Darth Sion.
#10. Ajunta Pall.

DarthAnt66
You included like a thousand guys.

WildBantha88
Satele
Vader
Bane
Kenobi
Malgus
Gnost Dural
Aryn Leneer
Dooku
Fisto
Shaak Ti

FreshestSlice
That list has Qui-Gon over Cade. That list must die, FX.

carthage
Sidious
Caedus
Plagueis
Vader
Tyranus
Krayt
Kun
Malgus
Traya

Fated Xtasy
Originally posted by FreshestSlice
That list has Qui-Gon over Cade. That list must die, FX.

Oh shit! i knew i forgot somone. Cade and Krayt confused **** me. sorry

Lord Stark
1. Luke
2. Sidious
3. Yoda
4. Vitiate
5. HoT
6. The Rest.

XSUPREMEXSKILLZ
Damn lazy, stark. stick out tongue

NewGuy01
I really have a hard time addressing that Jedi list, Xtasy.



blink Why?



I really don't see Lumiya being an equal to Maul. It's feasible in terms of swordsmanship, but her capabilities with the Force are harshly lacking.

AncientPower
Taking every measuring stick into account:

1.Luke.
2.Sidious.
3.Yoda.
4.Caedus.
5.Exar Kun.
6.Plagueis.
7.Fay.
8.Krayt.
9.Windu.
10.Jaina.

DarthAnt66
Originally posted by AncientPower
7.Fay.
LMFAO!

AncientPower
Originally posted by DarthAnt66
LMFAO!

Near Yoda level according to Kenobi, could heal herself from two lightsabers through the upper chest instead healed Kenobi to full. TK'd a factory, KO'd Ventress with ease, TK storms, centuries of knowledge and growth, possibly could have lived forever.

LMFAO all you want, I could really care less.

Board Walker
1. Revan
2. Luke
3. Caedus
4. SW mythos

Sinious
Originally posted by Board Walker
1. Revan
2. Luke
3. Caedus
4. SW mythos

This seems pretty accurate. thumb up

Lord Stark
Jedi:
1. Luke Skywalker
2. Yoda
3. Hero of Tython
4. Revan/Barsen'thor
6. Mace Windu
7. Nomi Sunrider
8. Anakin Skywalker
9. Jedi Dooku
10. Satele Shan

Sith:
1. Darth Sidious
2. Emperor Vitiate
3. Darth Plagueis
4. Darth Caedus/Tulak Hord
6. Emperor Malgus/ Darth Bane
8. Darth Vader/ Darth Krayt
10. Darth Tyranus

Nalaniel
1. Luke
2. Sidious
3. Yoda
4. Caedus
5. Plagueis
6. Vitiate
7. Bane
8. Hero of Tython
9. Krayt
10. Revan

Fated Xtasy
Originally posted by NewGuy01
I really have a hard time addressing that Jedi list, Xtasy.

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11115/111159183/3806775-8268480290-c2631.jpg
Everything is proceeding as i have foreseen



Because of this http://www.narutoforums.com/showthread.php?t=813621 in all seriousness though, if i hadn't forggoten about Krayt i would've put Caedus and Ragnos on the same level.

Gotta love that Ragnos hype :P






That is what i based it Around pure swordsmenship, regardless of what you think, Lumiya's impressive, she's one of the few people that has consitently bested Luke in nearly every fight they had. i'm being generous when i put Maul on the same tier with her considering how i dislike the walking pile of feats, at least i acknowledged his power, gotta give me credit stick out tongue

Nephthys
I like how everyone forgot about Darth Nihilus.

Sinious
Jedi:

Haven't made a list yet.

Sith: (excluding the Dread Masters)

1) Sidious
2) Vitiate
3) Nihilus
4) Plagueis
5) Caedus
6) Tulak Hord
7) Bane
8) Exar Kun
Ragnos/Krayt/Vader/Jadus (these should follow)

DARTH POWER
Not sure why just about everyone is putting Vader above Dooku.

Board Walker
I have revised my list

BEYOND JEDI AND SITH
1. Revan
2. The ones
3. All other force users

Sith
1. Darth Nihilus
2. Darth Caedus
3. All other sith

Jedi
1. Luke skywalker
2. HoT
3. All other Jedi

Nephthys
Shouldn't Vitiate be above Revan since he whooped his ass?

Board Walker
Oh my list includes Post Ascended Revan, not pre ascended revan.

Nephthys
Is that pre or post Got Wrecked By The Imperial Strike Team Revan?

Board Walker
This is post Ascension Evolution Force Entity Revan, who emerged after he willed himself back into existance with the entirity of the force after his battle in tor.

Lord Stark

DarthAnt66
Top 5 Jedi:
1. Luke Skywalker
2. Master Yoda
3. Hero of Tython
4. Revan (Novel)
5. Anakin Skywalker

Top 5 Sith:
1. Darth Sidious
2. The Sith Emperor
3. Darth Nihilus
4. Tulak Hord
5. Darth Plagueis

FreshestSlice
Originally posted by Board Walker
I have revised my list

BEYOND JEDI AND SITH

3. All other force users


Good to know that random little girl/boy who uses the Force on instinct is more powerful than Jedi or Sith. laughing out loud

Sinious
Originally posted by Board Walker
This is post Ascension Evolution Force Entity Revan, who emerged after he willed himself back into existance with the entirity of the force after his battle in tor.


big grin

XSUPREMEXSKILLZ
my personal list:

1. Sidious
2. Vitiate
3. Nihilus
4. Tulak Hord
5. Darth Plagueis
6. Darth Bane (RoT Incarnation)
7. Darth Caedus (kinda thinking of moving him up, though)
8. Darth Krayt
9. Freedon Nadd
10. Emperor Malgus

Note: This list is certainly subject to change.

Will post jedi list later.

NewGuy01
thumb up That's fair.



I'm not sure I can justify ranking Hord quite this highly when you didn't include poor Aloysius Kallig.



Yeah, I'd raise Caedus up above Bane. (Hord, too. cool )



Your high estimation of Darth Krayt pleases me. Your lack of Darth Vader displeases me.



I will be waiting eagerly. Happy Dance

XSUPREMEXSKILLZ
Originally posted by NewGuy01
I'm not sure I can justify ranking Hord quite this highly based on the little information we have on him, especially when you didn't include Aloysius Kallig.

Yeah what was the context under which Kallig is implied to be up to par with Hord?

NewGuy01
Well, Kallig has a statement from a historian saying that he may have been the most powerful Sith Lord of his time. Tulak also feared that Kallig would overthrow him, and killed him in an organized ambush instead of facing him directly.

XSUPREMEXSKILLZ
Originally posted by NewGuy01
Well, Kallig has a statement from a historian saying that he may have been the most powerful Sith Lord of his time.

wheeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeere?


Originally posted by NewGuy01
Tulak also feared that Kallig would overthrow him, and killed him in an organized ambush instead of facing him directly.

The Sith Emperor feared that Naga Sadow's spirit would challenge him. Sidious was always wary that Vader would overthrow him.

Zett
1. Sidious
2. Plagueis
3. Vitiate
4. Vader / Dooku
5. Vader / Dooku
6. Bane
7. Revan (as a Sith Lord)
8. Tenebrous
9. Maul
10. Kreia

Guys post-ROTJ are not included to my list.

Sinious
@ Skilled

Im surprised to see you place so many above Exar Kun. And cmon now, Malgus and Nadd don't belong there.

XSUPREMEXSKILLZ
Originally posted by Sinious
@ Skilled

Im surprised to see you place so many above Exar Kun.

Why?

Originally posted by Sinious
And cmon now, Malgus and Nadd don't belong there.

Originally posted by Me
Why?

Sinious
The last 3 has nothing above Kun force wise and as a duelist I think you would agree that he would take them all.


I don't think Malgus is above Vader and Nadd above Ragnos. Its a matter of perspective perhaps but I didn't know you placed them so high.

P.S At least we still have the same names in top 7 big grin

NewGuy01
I certainly wouldn't. Krayt is a baws.

DarthAnt66
Originally posted by XSUPREMEXSKILLZ
my personal list:

1. Sidious
2. Vitiate
3. Nihilus
4. Tulak Hord
5. Darth Plagueis
6. Darth Bane (RoT Incarnation)
7. Darth Caedus (kinda thinking of moving him up, though)
8. Darth Krayt
9. Freedon Nadd
10. Emperor Malgus

Note: This list is certainly subject to change.

Will post jedi list later.
Me and Skillz made our lists together, so it is mostly the same. thumb up

1. Darth Sidious
2. The Sith Emperor
3. Darth Nihilus
4. Tulak Hord
5. Darth Plagueis
6. Darth Bane (RoT)
7. Darth Caedus
8. Darth Krayt
9. Darth Malgus
10.

XSUPREMEXSKILLZ
Originally posted by Sinious
The last 3 has nothing above Kun force wise and as a duelist I think you would agree that he would take them all.

Nothing?

Krayt is just an all around beast, I think that is generally an agreed-upon notion. While his hype probably isn't the same as Exar Kun's, his all around feats are probably better.

Freedon Nadd? He's the greatest sorcerer who ever lived up till his time, has knowledge of every force technique, has a sorcery-enhanced blaster that has killed more people than has Tulak Hord's lightsaber, and blasted Vodo from across the galaxy as a spirit. Just look at Ommin and Zannah. Their powers derived from Nadd's. His saber skill in his prime isn't lacking either.

Emperor Malgus? The dude has demonstrated lightsaber feats that are comparable to Exar Kun's, his lightning can blast through the saber defenses of Aryn Leneer, bring the protag strike team to their knees, and he possesses mastery of force maelstrom, a step below what is by far the most powerful dark side ability ever manifested, the Force Storm. His TK was also able to blast back the strike team, throw/ragdoll Aryn Leneer, destroy star fighters with a force scream, etc. Exar Kun vs. Emperor Malgus is a pretty controversial one, as is Kun vs. Nadd.

Nephthys
Originally posted by DarthAnt66
Me and Skillz made our lists together, so it is mostly the same. thumb up

1. Darth Sidious
2. The Sith Emperor
3. Darth Nihilus
4. Tulak Hord
5. Darth Plagueis
6. Darth Bane (RoT)
7. Darth Caedus
8. Darth Krayt
9. Darth Malgus
10.

Kun, Nox, Vader or Zannah seem to me to be the choices for 10. Which do you think is the best in terms of whatever criteria we're deciding this on?

Sinious
Originally posted by XSUPREMEXSKILLZ
Nothing?

Krayt is just an all around beast, I think that is generally an agreed-upon notion. While his hype probably isn't the same as Exar Kun's, his all around feats are probably better.




Im not denying the capabilities of Krayt. While it is a close fight, I still think Kun has the upper hand.



I didn't know about the "killed more than Hord" thing. Where does it state that he knows every force technique? I've never heard of that.



Performances against the protag strike team is always tricky. I'm not sure how being able to push back 2 force users before the fight started is as impressive as you make it sound. Also, he eventually lost and died in that confrontation. For me, Vader is a good tool to compare Kun and Malgus. I think Vader is a bit improved version of Malgus and even Vader would fall against Kun IMHO.

Kun's force scream is still more impressive as it was heard by every jedi throughout the galaxy. He was deemed superior to Ulic and IIRC, he had that thing where afterimages occurred while dueling so I don't think Malgus is at Kun's level in dueling both technique and speed wise.

NewGuy01
Krayt wins hype too.

DarthAnt66
"A vile weapon that once belonged to Freedon Nadd, this blaster has killed more Jedi then any lightsaber."
--Star Wars Knights of the Old Republic II: The Sith Lords

"Freedon Nadd has knowledge on all Jedi and Sith Force powers presented herein as well as those abilities still hidden in ancient Holocrons and tomes."
--Star Wars: Tales of the Jedi Companion

DarthAnt66
Originally posted by Nephthys
Kun, Nox, Vader or Zannah seem to me to be the choices for 10. Which do you think is the best in terms of whatever criteria we're deciding this on?
Zannah wouldn't make my Top 20. no expression
Kun, Nox, Vader, and Nadd are the ones I am thinking over, yeah.

Q99
Originally posted by DarthAnt66

"A vile weapon that once belonged to Freedon Nadd, this blaster has killed more Jedi then any lightsaber."
--Star Wars Knights of the Old Republic II: The Sith Lords



An example of why I find some of the quotes silly/likely hyperbole- I mean, Freedon Nadd was never shown with a blaster, all the stories have him using either a saber or sorcery, and yet he suddenly went on an all-time record killing spree with a weapon we've never seen him in the same room as or heard mentioned before??

He used his saber to kill his master and force sorcery to kill Kun, those are his famous acts.

FreshestSlice
Originally posted by Sinious


Performances against the protag strike team is always tricky. I'm not sure how being able to push back 2 force users before the fight started is as impressive as you make it sound.
I mean the party makes the first strike, so I think they're prepared for his TK.

XSUPREMEXSKILLZ
Originally posted by Sinious
Im not denying the capabilities of Krayt. While it is a close fight, I still think Kun has the upper hand.

NewGuy01 is one convincing mofo. Raising Krayt as we speak.



Originally posted by Sinious
I didn't know about the "killed more than Hord" thing. Where does it state that he knows every force technique? I've never heard of that.

Ant posted them above.



Originally posted by Sinious
Performances against the protag strike team is always tricky. I'm not sure how being able to push back 2 force users before the fight started is as impressive as you make it sound. Also, he eventually lost and died in that confrontation. For me, Vader is a good tool to compare Kun and Malgus. I think Vader is a bit improved version of Malgus and even Vader would fall against Kun IMHO.

Kun's force scream is still more impressive as it was heard by every jedi throughout the galaxy. He was deemed superior to Ulic and IIRC, he had that thing where afterimages occurred while dueling so I don't think Malgus is at Kun's level in dueling both technique and speed wise.

It really wasn't before the fight. He kinda sprinted towards em and, y'know, aggressively jumped in their faces before directly TK'ing them. no expression

Yoda eventually lost and was forced to flee against Sidious, but that doesn't make directly TK'ing Palpatine unimpressive. Caedus TK'ing Luke is still impressive despite Caedus being beaten by Luke. Put in Vitiate for Yoda and HoT for Sidious and you'll understand. Happy Dance

Fair enough, Kun's force scream is stronger. Though it doesn't have too much relevance when comparing them overall. Malgus is also superior to Ulic, and Quinlan Vos has produced afterimages. Say what you will, but if we're going by raw feats here, both of them should be roughly equal. Though implications on Exar Kun's side might give him an edge there.

AncientPower
Lol at the people contradicting canon by putting Ancient Sith Lords above Kun. *facepalm*

DarthAnt66
Lol at you living. *disgrace*

AncientPower
Originally posted by DarthAnt66
Lol at you living. *disgrace*
I love how seriously you take these debates, I want to believe that you are trolling but somehow it seems sadder than that.

The Merchant
Sidious
Vitiate
Plagueis
Nihilus
Hord
Vader/Krayt/Malgus
Bane/Zannah
Kun
Nadd
Marka Ragnos/Naga Sadow

The Merchant
Oh, I would put Dooku on Bane/Zannah's tier too. For Jedi:

Luke
Yoda
Hero of Tython/Mace Windu
Baresen'thor
Revan Reborn
Meetra Surik
Obi-Wan
Kyle Katarn
Kyp Durron
Jaden Korr

Sinious
Originally posted by DarthAnt66

"A vile weapon that once belonged to Freedon Nadd, this blaster has killed more Jedi then any lightsaber."
--Star Wars Knights of the Old Republic II: The Sith Lords

"Freedon Nadd has knowledge on all Jedi and Sith Force powers presented herein as well as those abilities still hidden in ancient Holocrons and tomes."
--Star Wars: Tales of the Jedi Companion

Thank you.

Originally posted by XSUPREMEXSKILLZ
NewGuy01 is one convincing mofo. Raising Krayt as we speak.

I'm here for you bro. I'll make you replace Kun. stick out tongue



True but there are other examples like Dessan TKing Luke. Malgus is a though SoB but like I said, I'd put him right below Darth Vader still.



Don't try to call me a fanboy mad




All the characters we compare here are very close to each other power wise. It's hard to determine the victor in such debates so I think those little details and implications should be examined carefully. Kun seems to be better as a duelist or at least has the chance to be. His force mastery also seems closely above. His sorcery and sith alchemy is far above Malgus'. He knew techniques that only the most powerful Dark Lords knew like Force drain and Essence transfer. So I don't see any reasons to call them equals.

NewGuy01
Pre-Deceived Malgus's Force Scream blew up a fleet of ships. As if Exar's could compete. cool

Stigma
Jedi:

1. Luke
2. Yoda
3. Mace
4. Marek
5. HoT
6. Revan
7. Kyp
8. Kyle
9. Barsen'thor
10. Shaak Ti


1. Sidious
2. Nihilus
3. Plagueis
4. Caedus
5. Vader
6. Krayt
7. Tenebrous
8. Kun
9. Malgus
10. Dooku

NewGuy01
Sith:

1. Sidious
2. Plagueis
3. Caedus
4. Vitiate
5. Krayt
6. Vader
7-10. Tbc

Jedi: Tbc

DarthAnt66
Originally posted by NewGuy01
6. Vader

I lol'ed.

NewGuy01
Good for you.

WildBantha88
Originally posted by DarthAnt66
I lol'ed. i guess you forgot how power Vader truly is

DarthAnt66
Originally posted by NewGuy01
Good for you.
You knew I had to comment. wink

The Merchant
Originally posted by NewGuy01
Pre-Deceived Malgus's Force Scream blew up a fleet of ships. As if Exar's could compete. cool

Really? If so then he should be higher on the list.

Nephthys
It was a squad of fighters, he's no fleet buster. Still very impressive though.

The Merchant
Do you know how many fighters?

Nephthys
No, it just says "a wave of" them. I'd guess maybe a half dozen?

NewGuy01
Originally posted by WildBantha88
i guess you forgot how power Vader truly is

It really seems he has.

NewGuy01
Originally posted by DarthAnt66
You knew I had to comment. wink

Ur comment was dumb tho

DarthAnt66
Originally posted by NewGuy01
Ur comment was dumb tho
Ur list was dumb moar tho

The Merchant
Where would you guys rank the Dark Council members? I would say most of them are in Vader's tier on my list anyways.

carthage
Most of them are garbage apart from Baras, Thanaton, and Nyriss.

None of those three are on Vader's tier, more like Ulic/Katarn/Wyyrlok/Satele tier.

The Merchant
Two questions that I have. First, who was the Sith that said he was able to use the Force to protect his ship from the Dark council? And two, is it true that Nyriss when Meetra met her said that she had a Darkness that surpassed the Sith that she met in the past?

XSUPREMEXSKILLZ
1. Darth Jadus

2. No. But Nyriss is pretty badass.

The Merchant
Thanks, I knew that the Nyriss thing had to be made-up. And yeah she is, even Vitiate valued her. Hmm, I usually think Sith who have the ability to affect ships with their force would be numbers 5 or 6. Is there any other Sith that surpassed Jadus? I know he's number 2 but I would think that one of the protags surpassed him in power about now.

The Merchant

NewGuy01
Originally posted by The Merchant
Thanks, I knew that the Nyriss thing had to be made-up. And yeah she is, even Vitiate valued her. Hmm, I usually think Sith who have the ability to affect ships with their force would be numbers 5 or 6. Is there any other Sith that surpassed Jadus? I know he's number 2 but I would think that one of the protags surpassed him in power about now.

It's not made up, what it means is just up for interpretation. Meetra had said Nyriss's presence was far more sinister than any she had ever encountered iirc.

The Merchant
Oh, sorry. I'm trying to see if anyone would post the quote. Has Drew ever commented about that too BTW? I mean Dark Council members are strong but Jadus's best feat that I know of is shielding his ship, which is impressive but nowhere on the tier of power that Nihilus demonstrated and Jadus is the strongest Sith barring the Emperor himself.

XSUPREMEXSKILLZ
Originally posted by The Merchant
Jadus is the strongest Sith barring the Emperor himself.

Nah. There are stronger sith. Dread Masters/Malgus/Nox/First Son, namely.

The Merchant
Well he is a high-tier is what I'm saying. Also Nox surpassed Jadus?

XSUPREMEXSKILLZ
I'd say so, yeah. Darth Marr didn't think anyone could remove Thanaton, much less stomp him with such impunity.

Sinious
Originally posted by The Merchant
Also Nox surpassed Jadus?

I don't think so. Jadus has yet to reveal his power but whats known of him suggests the rumors of his powers are to be true.

The Merchant

Emperordmb
you put so much work into that... but you won't fix your signature.

XSUPREMEXSKILLZ
My personal Jedi List:

1. Luke
2. Yoda
3/4. Hero of Tython-Jacen Solo
5. Revan
6. Barsen'thor
7. ROTS Anakin
8. Master Windu
9. Cade Skywalker
10. Nomi Sunrider

NewGuy01
Originally posted by XSUPREMEXSKILLZ
My personal Jedi List:

1. Luke
2. Yoda
3/4. Hero of Tython-Jacen Solo
5. Revan
6. Barsen'thor
7. ROTS Anakin
8. Master Windu
9. Cade Skywalker
10. Nomi Sunrider

If you're including Anakin, Jacen, and Revan in that estimation--Shouldn't you also be inclusive of Dooku? He's a very often forgotten Jedi on these types of things.

(Just realized, DE Luke might be an interesting choice to put on a Sith list as well...)

Also--I think Kyp Durron should be considered for inclusion, I know there are more but I can't think of any right now. Also, Barsen>Anakin is messin' with me brah.

Board Walker
Nihilus should be at the top of everyone's list

Nephthys
thumb up

Lord Stark
Originally posted by Board Walker
Nihilus should be at the top of everyone's list

I exclude him simply because he's so haxxx he should be #1 on most lists.

XSUPREMEXSKILLZ
Originally posted by NewGuy01
Also--I think Kyp Durron should be considered for inclusion, I know there are more but I can't think of any right now. Also, Barsen>Anakin is messin' with me brah.

Ah yes, I'd forgotten about Kyp.

Now concede to the power of the Barsen'thor bro. http://r19.imgfast.net/users/1916/39/10/06/smiles/3691928536.gif

The Merchant
Yeah Kyp Durron when he had his potential unlocked by Kun should be in the top 10, he lifted the Sun Crusher and his lightning was strong enough to paralyze Luke

The Merchant
So what do people think of my list anyways? Also I'm wondering were to put The Jedi Exiles such as Ajunta Pall and the Dread masters on my list, for some reason I feel the Dread Masters could possibly be Hord/Caedus level IMO or quite possibly Nihilus level since they have the power to affect fleets as well and individually are monsters too. As for the Jedi Exiles we have Karness Muur capable of amp'ing people like Celeste Morne to be able to fight off Vader and Krayt, and Vader theorized he could kill Sidious with it although I feel that's unlikely considering the lore behind Sidious.

The Merchant
So what do people think of my list anyways? Also I'm wondering were to put The Jedi Exiles such as Ajunta Pall and the Dread masters on my list, for some reason I feel the Dread Masters could possibly be Hord/Ca

Q99
Not a bad set of lists, though I'd definitely rate some different (I don't put Maul in top-10, for example).

The Merchant
I think Maul is extremely underrated. He has feats and accolades to be on top 10 really. Not many Sith Lords have killed council level Jedi, and the ones who did are usually Dark Lords themselves.

XSUPREMEXSKILLZ
Originally posted by Q99
Not a bad set of lists, though I'd definitely rate some different (I don't put Maul in top-10, for example).

thumb up

Yeah, I wouldn't say Maul is top 10 sith material. Probably not Dooku either, to be completely honest.

The Merchant
I feel like in my list I should switch Krayt with Bane and Krayt be on 7 while Bane on 6.

FreshestSlice
Originally posted by The Merchant
Not many Sith Lords have killed council level Jedi, and the ones who did are usually Dark Lords themselves.
I don't think this is really true anymore.

The Merchant
Examples? Just wondering. Also should the Dread Masters be in a top 10 when they're working in unison? And are the Emperor's Hands worth mentioning in a top 10 or nah?

Q99
Originally posted by The Merchant
Examples? Just wondering. Also should the Dread Masters be in a top 10 when they're working in unison? And are the Emperor's Hands worth mentioning in a top 10 or nah?

The sharing of power thing makes the DMs hard to place.



And the Hands, no. They seem to be the 'behind the scenes shadow types who direct the Wraith and similar,' rather than being direct combatants.



For TOR Hands. For Sidious's Hands... well, none of them were top ten level, and not top contenders in general, of course. Darth Krayt's Hands were fairly strong, but more the equivalent of his council-warrior types.

The Merchant
Ah, thanks for clearing up the Hands, I was reading a bit on them and the way they were described as being another layer between the Council and the Emperor and how only a few Council members know of their existence makes them seem powerful.

NewGuy01
They were really not special at all, informants basically.

The Merchant
So what about the Children of the Emperor, specifically the First Son? I forgot about him and realized that he probably should be on the list as well but don't know much about him except he took on Barsen'thor.

Emperordmb
Originally posted by The Merchant
So what about the Children of the Emperor, specifically the First Son? I forgot about him and realized that he probably should be on the list as well but don't know much about him except he took on Barsen'thor.
First Son is good, but there's only ten spots, and a lot of powerful Sith, so I'd hesitate to put First Son on it.

FreshestSlice
Originally posted by The Merchant
Examples? Just wondering.
Of killing Jedi councilor level opponents?

Wrath
Nox
Marek
Malgus(before he was a Darth)
Ventress
Savage(obviously, since he was brought up first)
Lord Nefarid
General Grievous
Lord Praven
Lord Scourge
etc.

None of them were Darths and they all defeated Council level opponents. TOR particularly are full of them.

NewGuy01
Nefarid?

FreshestSlice
Originally posted by NewGuy01
Nefarid?
The one who fought Din on Alderaan. The smelly one.

Q99
The most powerful Emperor's Hand of all time is Darth Nihl wink

NewGuy01
I know who he is. Unaware that he fought Din.

NewGuy01
Originally posted by Q99
The most powerful Emperor's Hand of all time is Darth Nihl wink

Mara Jade?

The Merchant
Well TOR Sith for the most part would have been Dark Lords if they existed in other eras. Marek is top 10 Jedi material honestly.

Q99
Originally posted by NewGuy01
Mara Jade?

Not when she was a Hand. She grew stronger after becoming a Jedi and training with Kyle and Luke.

SIDIOUS 66
Originally posted by Lord Stark
I exclude him simply because he's so haxxx he should be #1 on most lists.


Not really. Silver2467 debunked the notion that Nihilus is this all powerful being that no one can defeat.


http://www.comicvine.com/forums/battles-7/yoda-vs-darth-nihilus-677179/


Both Neph and JediXMan put up a valiant effort against Silver, but Silver casually defeated them.

DarthAnt66
That was 2 years ago...

SIDIOUS 66
Originally posted by DarthAnt66
That was 2 years ago...


Exactly, which is why Idk why the silly arguments about his "supremacy" is being brought up again.

Nihilus is all hype and has no combat feats to back them up.

SIDIOUS 66
In fact, most of what we see from him onscreen contradict a lot of his quotes.

Nephthys
Originally posted by SIDIOUS 66
Not really. Silver2467 debunked the notion that Nihilus is this all powerful being that no one can defeat.


http://www.comicvine.com/forums/battles-7/yoda-vs-darth-nihilus-677179/


Both Neph and JediXMan put up a valiant effort against Silver, but Silver casually defeated them.

I already told you that Silver didn't defeat me, he ragequit in another thread (Obi-Wan vs Zannah) so I saw no point in continuing in that one.

SIDIOUS 66
I thought it was Obi Wan vs Bane?

I don't believe Silver actually believes that Obi Wan could win that one, TBH.

Nephthys
Maybe. We were discussing Zannah at the time.

The_Tempest
Originally posted by SIDIOUS 66
Not really. Silver2467 debunked the notion that Nihilus is this all powerful being that no one can defeat.


http://www.comicvine.com/forums/battles-7/yoda-vs-darth-nihilus-677179/


Both Neph and JediXMan put up a valiant effort against Silver, but Silver casually defeated them.

Yeah, he really did take Neph to the curb, didn't he?

Nephthys
Only if we walked over to it so that he could withdraw some money to pay for my dry cleaning like a good sub would.

XSUPREMEXSKILLZ
Originally posted by XSUPREMEXSKILLZ
my personal list:

1. Sidious
2. Vitiate
3. Nihilus
4. Tulak Hord
5. Darth Plagueis
6. Darth Bane (RoT Incarnation)
7. Darth Caedus (kinda thinking of moving him up, though)
8. Darth Krayt
9. Freedon Nadd
10. Emperor Malgus

Note: This list is certainly subject to change.

Will post jedi list later.

Moving up Exar Kun, removing Hord completely because atm idk where exactly he places.

1. Sidious
2. Vitiate
3. Nihilus
4. Darth Plagueis
5. Darth Bane (RoT Incarnation)
6. Darth Caedus
7. Exar Kun
8. Darth Krayt
9. Freedon Nadd
10. Emperor Malgus

Note: this list is still subject to change.

DarthAnt66
Originally posted by DarthAnt66
You disgust me.

Tzeentch
Nihilus
Sideous
Bane
Everyone else

Luke
Yoda
Revan
Everyone else

Haven't played TOR so I don't know anything about those people- haven't read LotF so I don't know anything about those people (sans Luke).

The_Tempest
Originally posted by Tzeentch
Nihilus
Sideous

This is clearly not in order. uhuh

Tzeentch
Cry about it nerd!

Originally posted by Tzeentch
http://i46.photobucket.com/albums/f122/blaxican_templar/depois1_zps3a3e197e.gif~original

The_Tempest
Originally posted by The_Tempest
This is clearly not in order. uhuh

Tzeentch
uhuh

The_Tempest
ahuh

AncientPower
Caedus should be above Plagueis and Bane.

The Merchant
Well, thinking of what DarthAnt said about statements on the Books are just ads basically, Plaguies probably should be lower on the list. Although he did affect the Galaxy with the Force and his death released a tremor that shook Coruscant, but Nihilus still has better feats.

Sinious
Top 10 Jedi:

1) Luke Skywalker
2)Yoda
3/4)Jacen Solo / HoT
5)Revan
6)Mace Windu
7)Barsen'thor
8)The Exile
9)Anakin Skywalker
10)Satele Shan

(Not concrete though)

Fated Xtasy
Originally posted by Sinious
Top 10 Jedi:

1) Luke Skywalker
2)Yoda
3/4)Jacen Solo / HoT
5)Revan
6)Mace Windu
7)Barsen'thor
8)The Exile
9)Anakin Skywalker
10)Satele Shan

(Not concrete though)

This goes for me too. and is subject to change as well thumb up

Trocity
Top Ten Jedi
1. Grandmaster Luke
2. Yoda
3. HoT
4. Mace Windu
5. Barsen'thor
6. Kyp Durron
7. Revan
8. Grandmaster Satele
9. Obi Wan Kenobi
10. Jaina Solo



Top Ten Sith
1. Sidious
2. Vitiate
3. Nihilus
4. Caedus
5. Plagueis
6. Orbalisk Bane
7. Exar Kun
8. Reborn Krayt
9. Vader
10. Malgus



Tough to make these.

List isn't final.

XSUPREMEXSKILLZ
My list at this particular moment of time:

1. Palpatine
2. Nihilus
3. Vitiate
4. Plagueis
5. Orbalisk Bane
6. Darth Caedus
7. Exar Kun
8. Reborn Krayt
9/10. Darth Malgus-Darth Vader

Trying to figure out where to place Tulak Hord and Marka Ragnos at the moment.

NewGuy01
Originally posted by XSUPREMEXSKILLZ
Nah. There are stronger sith. Dread Masters/Malgus/Nox/First Son, namely.

I'd say no for Nox, and the First Son is technically Vitiate. Really it's just the Dread Masters, Emperor Malgus, and of course Vitiate that top Jadus. An argument can also likely be made for Darth Marr.

XSUPREMEXSKILLZ
Not seeing why The First Son doesn't count. He has some of the Emperor's power and shares his thoughts, but other than that is a separate entity.

The Merchant
I see his point, first Son is basically an extension of Vitiate's own power rather then his own. If anything it just solidifies Vitiate being in a top 5 since I can't think of anyone really doing that. Only thing similar that comes to mind is Sidious turning non-force sensitives to force sensitives with his own power.

carthage
Jedi:

1. Luke Skywalker
2. Yoda
3. Jacen Solo
4.Anakin Skywalker
5. Hero of Tython
6. Revan
7. Obi Wan Kenobi
8. Satele Shan
9. Ulic Qel Droma
10. Plo Koon

The Merchant
Your list is pretty legit Carthage.

NewGuy01
Where's Mace and Dooku, or the Barsen'thor? Galen Marek and Kyp Durron are also plausible additions. Cade, too.

The_Tempest
On the discussion of tiers, can anyone point to two characters who belong in the same tier but wherein one stands as dominant over the other?

NewGuy01
Revenge Kenobi and Dynasty Bane is probably a decent example, though likely a bit of a stretch.

How about Quinlan and Sora?

Nephthys
You... put Bane and Obi-Wan on the same level?

Based
Originally posted by The_Tempest
On the discussion of tiers, can anyone point to two characters who belong in the same tier but wherein one stands as dominant over the other?

Luke and Yoda?

NewGuy01
Originally posted by Nephthys
You... put Bane and Obi-Wan on the same level?

It really depends on how wide of a gap you would define as "a level", or "a tier". Temp asked for two characters on the same playing field, but with one figure being dominant to the other--And yes, they fit that description nicely.

Kenobi can compete with Vader, he can compete with Bane as well.

DarthAnt66
smokin'
/watch?v=90HUOD5b8EI

NewGuy01
Can't see the video ATM, but gewd. smokin'

DarthAnt66
1. Luke Skywalker
2. Master Yoda
3. Revan Reborn
4. Jacen Solo
5. Anakin Skywalker
6. Hero of Tython
7. Mace Windu
8. Cade Skywalker
9. Galen Marek
10. Jaina Solo

NewGuy01
Originally posted by DarthAnt66
1. Luke Skywalker
2. Master Yoda
3. Revan Reborn
4. Jacen Solo
5. Anakin Skywalker
6. Hero of Tython
7. Mace Windu
8. Cade Skywalker
9. Galen Marek
10. Jaina Solo

Fairly solid, considering you have Revan>Caedus and Anakin. I don't think I'd put Cade>Galen though, tbh, especially if we're being inclusive of his clone's feats.

As far as what characters are on the lists, we match up pretty seamlessly--though for some reason you refuse to include Master Dooku. erm

What about Kyp and the Barsen'thor, btw? I don't really have solid rankings for them, but they should be up there.

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