Multiverse Fight

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Time Immemorial
Beyonder

vs

LT and 3 Beyonders.

Prof. T.C McAbe
3 Beyonders > LT > 1 Beyonder imo

Galan007
thumb up

If a single Beyonder could have destroyed LT, 3 of them would not have been sent to fight him.

Branlor Swift
Why is Beyonder fighting 4 people above him?

VastoLord1234
Originally posted by Galan007
thumb up

If a single Beyonder could have destroyed LT, 3 of them would not have been sent to fight him.

But that doesnt make sense, if the beyonder is a child unit, then wouldnt the 3 beyonders be overkill?

Decimus
^It's obviously Beyonder before the retconning...

Galan007
Originally posted by VastoLord1234
But that doesnt make sense, if the beyonder is a child unit, then wouldnt the 3 beyonders be overkill? No. The Beyonder we saw in Secret Wars was retconned into half of a CCU back in F4 #319, and as such, was infinitely below the likes of LT.

VastoLord1234
Originally posted by Galan007
No. The Beyonder we saw in Secret Wars was retconned into half of a CCU back in F4 #319, and as such, was infinitely below the likes of LT.

How many retcons of the beyonder are there? and which one was equivalent to a child unit?

Galan007
Per Pym: Beyonder, as he appeared in Secret Wars, was classified as a "child unit" in comparison to the Ivory Kings:
http://i.imgur.com/jzGBtTF.png


SW Beyonder was retconned into half(ish) of a cube being back in F4 #319(1988):
http://postimg.org/image/kg7xpxbp1/
http://postimg.org/image/kkbeh1cvp/
http://postimg.org/image/b7feqnyid/
http://postimg.org/image/nn7j6o2gl/
http://postimg.org/image/wkwuhrkad/
http://postimg.org/image/6vqt1nrlh/
http://postimg.org/image/bzi2pv2ph/

Confirmed in F4 Annual #23:
http://postimg.org/image/6ol8wklez/

This Beyonder was easily stomped by Kubik, who gesturely warped his entire universe into a palm-sized sphere:
http://postimg.org/image/60zo1vud1/
http://postimg.org/image/tvxgdzpf9/
http://postimg.org/image/kt8z6ypo5/
http://postimg.org/image/ady7kb33p/
http://postimg.org/image/jj6ke66id/
http://postimg.org/image/46mtk57cl/
http://postimg.org/image/v5lmi6nhx/

Kubik later stated that even he was infinitely weaker than a single no-name Celestial:
http://postimg.org/image/496gqnsxb/
http://postimg.org/image/ne4o3b19r/

It was also stated that Beyonder did not defeat the Celestials in Secret Wars II #7--that was an illusion they purposefully cast in his mind:
http://postimg.org/image/rk7j7thm3/


Even the latest issue of New Avengers implied that SW-era Beyonder was universal. The Ivory Kings, however, are obviously multiversal+.

Mr Master
Beyonder's history is a convoluted affair,
but Galan's latest scans imo place Beyonder at a universal level it seems, for now at-least.
But the statement is somewhat open to interpretation imo.

That aside, how in the hell are these 3 Beyonders going to be defeated? laughing out loud

Thanos gets his IG back? stick out tongue

zopzop
Originally posted by Mr Master
Beyonder's history is a convoluted affair,
but Galan's latest scans imo place Beyonder at a universal level it seems, for now at-least.
But the statement is somewhat open to interpretation imo.

That aside, how in the hell are these 3 Beyonders going to be defeated? laughing out loud

Thanos gets his IG back? stick out tongue
I know you're kidding but not even the classic IG is going to cut it. They annihilated the entire MU including the LT.

Only the HotU can stop them at this point.

Branlor Swift
Doom and Molecule Man or Beyonder somehow. Or Beyonder Doom and Molecule Man.

Still somehow though.



The only realistic way though is if Ra's Al Ghul is actually a new oc character and not Beyonder.

zopzop
Originally posted by Branlor Swift
Doom and Molecule Man or Beyonder somehow. Or Beyonder Doom and Molecule Man.

Still somehow though.
How many Beyonders were there? Just three or were there more but they got killed in all the fighting?




laughing

Utrigita
Originally posted by Prof. T.C McAbe
3 Beyonders > LT > 1 Beyonder imo

Wasn't it implied that it was more then 3 Beyonders attacking the LT, they just did it across several dimensions at the same time?

carver9
Thought it was just 3?

carver9
It was 3.

http://www.turboimagehost.com/p/22413530/New_Avengers_2013-_030-021.jpg.html
http://www.turboimagehost.com/p/22413531/New_Avengers_2013-_030-022.jpg.html

Galan007
Originally posted by Branlor Swift
Doom and Molecule Man or Beyonder somehow. Or Beyonder Doom and Molecule Man.

Still somehow though.



The only realistic way though is if Ra's Al Ghul is actually a new oc character and not Beyonder. I hope Rayray Akbar ends up being one of the Reeds... Or the hatched Galactus Seed.

Anyone/thing else will suck a bag of dicks. thumb down

Branlor Swift
That would be cool. Honestly I just want anyone over Beyonder again.

Even some super random character would suffice.

Galan007
thumb up

psycho gundam
Originally posted by Branlor Swift
That would be cool. Honestly I just want anyone over Beyonder again.

Even some super random character would suffice. It's Doom. He wouldn't let Raven Simone show him up

Utrigita
Originally posted by carver9
It was 3.

http://www.turboimagehost.com/p/22413530/New_Avengers_2013-_030-021.jpg.html
http://www.turboimagehost.com/p/22413531/New_Avengers_2013-_030-022.jpg.html

It was just the "The same fight taking place across all realities at the same time" that lead me to believe that in each reality the Beyonders attacked a Mbody of the LT. But cool smile

VastoLord1234
Originally posted by Galan007
Per Pym: Beyonder, as he appeared in Secret Wars, was classified as a "child unit" in comparison to the Ivory Kings:
http://i.imgur.com/jzGBtTF.png


SW Beyonder was retconned into half(ish) of a cube being back in F4 #319(1988):
http://postimg.org/image/kg7xpxbp1/
http://postimg.org/image/kkbeh1cvp/
http://postimg.org/image/b7feqnyid/
http://postimg.org/image/nn7j6o2gl/
http://postimg.org/image/wkwuhrkad/
http://postimg.org/image/6vqt1nrlh/
http://postimg.org/image/bzi2pv2ph/

Confirmed in F4 Annual #23:
http://postimg.org/image/6ol8wklez/

This Beyonder was easily stomped by Kubik, who gesturely warped his entire universe into a palm-sized sphere:
http://postimg.org/image/60zo1vud1/
http://postimg.org/image/tvxgdzpf9/
http://postimg.org/image/kt8z6ypo5/
http://postimg.org/image/ady7kb33p/
http://postimg.org/image/jj6ke66id/
http://postimg.org/image/46mtk57cl/
http://postimg.org/image/v5lmi6nhx/

Kubik later stated that even he was infinitely weaker than a single no-name Celestial:
http://postimg.org/image/496gqnsxb/
http://postimg.org/image/ne4o3b19r/

It was also stated that Beyonder did not defeat the Celestials in Secret Wars II #7--that was an illusion they purposefully cast in his mind:
http://postimg.org/image/rk7j7thm3/


Even the latest issue of New Avengers implied that SW-era Beyonder was universal. The Ivory Kings, however, are obviously multiversal+.

So all the feats by Pre-retconned beyonder (pre-cube), were all illusions the other cosmics created?

Galan007
^ No. Many of the feats Beyonder preformed during SW(such as erasing Death) are still recognized as canon.

Regardless, he was still downgraded into being decisively less powerful than a full Cube Being--that's why Kubik stomped him so easily. Heck, even this recent issue of New Avengers implied that he was just a universal power back in SW.

Branlor Swift
I'm curious of that child statement. Does that mean he can grow up?

Go from a minute bit of energy to a full on Beyonder? I guess we''ll find out when he is revealed to be the big cheese...

Galan007
Originally posted by Branlor Swift
I'm curious of that child statement. Does that mean he can grow up? I'm going with a less evolved unit that hasn't reached its full potential.

...Or maybe that's just how they categorize Cube beings in general. Dunno. /shrug

krisblaze
Beyonders and shit but hoes and tricks.

Reed's going to set it straight

Mr Master
Originally posted by Branlor Swift

I'm curious of that child statement. Does that mean he can grow up?

Go from a minute bit of energy to a full on Beyonder?

I guess we''ll find out when he is revealed to be the big cheese...
That statement, ... I found it can be seen from different perspectives.

I'm kinda leaning towards that idea as well, the "growing up" angle, because he used the term "toy" in the same description.

Darn, I need to get my hands on these copies. Galan, how can you hook a brother up?

Galan007
Check your inbox. smile

Branlor Swift
Originally posted by Mr Master
That statement, ... I found it can be seen from different perspectives.

I'm kinda leaning towards that idea as well, the "growing up" angle, because he used the term "toy" in the same description.

Darn, I need to get my hands on these copies. Galan, how can you hook a brother up? I think if Ronny Coleman is revealed to be Beyonder, it's going to have to be true. IE all Cube Beings have the potential to be real Beyonders as they are children waiting to "grow up". And the only way he could challenge them considering Ronny Coleman is their rival is if he was one of them.

If that's the case, then it stands to reason Molecule Man will somehow grow up too and then it will likely be Beyonder and Molecule Man all grown up in a war against The Beyonders. Also Doom.

srug

Galan007
Doom kept a scrap of Beyonder's essence in him when they merged back in SW. He(and Owen) will use that connection as a weapon against Beyonder.

...Christ, I hope Beyonder has nothing to do with this event. How f*cking boring. thumb down

Branlor Swift
Originally posted by Galan007
Doom kept a scrap of Beyonder's essence in him when they merged back in SW. He(and Owen) will use that connection as a weapon against Beyonder.

...Christ, I hope Beyonder has nothing to do with this event. How f*cking boring. thumb down thumb up

Even though all the pieces fit it wouldn't even make sense for Beyonder to be the great destroyer either. Personality wise. The guy wasn't really that sort of villain.

If it was he'd either have to see some tight shit to change him. Or everything he's "done" would have to be in retaliation to the Beyonders.

That's why I like the alt Reed theory. Because those guys have seen some messed up shit and it makes sense for them to turn to that angle. And instead of raw power (though they could conceivably get some crazy power sources) his "feats" are done with tech. Crazy ass tech.

Galan007
Especially Ultimate Reed. He's a dark mofo.

One_Angry_Scot
Originally posted by Galan007
Especially Ultimate Reed. He's a dark mofo.

I've been hoping your theory about the Galactus Seed is true.

Branlor Swift
Originally posted by Galan007
Especially Ultimate Reed. He's a dark mofo. thumb up

Though it'd have to be some sort of "I was guiding my past self into becoming me" sort of thing with him. Not unlike Adult Frank and Kid Frank though.

Originally posted by One_Angry_Scot
I've been hoping your theory about the Galactus Seed is true. That's the other one I like that I couldn't remember.

Galan007
Originally posted by One_Angry_Scot
I've been hoping your theory about the Galactus Seed is true. I hope so too. That would be the most awesome reveal possible, imo... Though I'd settle for Ult. Reed as well. Not quite as good, but it'd still be pretty epic if he were responsible.

Aside from them, I'm good with anyone except the Beyonder.

VastoLord1234
Originally posted by Galan007
^ No. Many of the feats Beyonder preformed during SW(such as erasing Death) are still recognized as canon.

Regardless, he was still downgraded into being decisively less powerful than a full Cube Being--that's why Kubik stomped him so easily. Heck, even this recent issue of New Avengers implied that he was just a universal power back in SW.

Okay thats just waay too inconsistent, if beyonder stomped death, and beyonder was stomped by kubik, what explanations left to erase this inconsistency?

VastoLord1234
Originally posted by One_Angry_Scot
I've been hoping your theory about the Galactus Seed is true.

What theory about the galactus seed?

Galan007
Originally posted by VastoLord1234
What theory about the galactus seed? He's talking about the theory I originally came up with MONTHS ago:
http://www.killermovies.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&postid=14868647& amp;highlight=galactus+seed+forumid%3A95+userid%3A
98733#post14868647


I further detailed my theory here:
Originally posted by Galan007
thumb up

Yeah, we know that Hickman has no qualms with utilizing the Galactus Seed itself, because he had Galactus express the danger it posed to creation if allowed to hatch back in F4 #600:
http://i.imgur.com/Wu4Qn6X.png
Galactus: "Everything would end... Sooner." Essentially, Galactus is saying that if the Seed were to hatch, it would cause 'the early death of everything'--an in-universe Armageddon that, as you know, has been prophesied ever since Hickman's run on F4/FF years ago, and will fully come into fruition within the next few months.


That, along with Black Swan's comment(s):
-"At the birth of Rabum Alal, the early death of everything began.":
http://s5d4.turboimagehost.com/t1/22190978_New_Avengers_v3_005-020.jpg

-"Rabum Alal... He is impatient and his appetite endless.":
http://i.imgur.com/ZCRARgc.png

...Make me think Rabum Alal could definitely be the hatched Galactus Seed. /shrug


As for how the Seed may have been detached from the World Tree: it could've happened when earth was destroyed, as you mentioned. According to Galactus himself, that's all it would take to send the Seed tumbling through space/time into places that not even he could readily access:
http://i.imgur.com/fwGbTLA.png


But who knows? I'm fine with anyone/thing being this Rabum Alal as long as it's not so simple as #BeyondersBack!! thumb down

VastoLord1234
Originally posted by Galan007
He's talking about the theory I originally came up with MONTHS ago:
http://www.killermovies.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&postid=14868647& amp;highlight=galactus+seed+forumid%3A95+userid%3A
98733#post14868647


I further detailed my theory here:

Im behind on the incursion storyline, i got lost after sun gods universe was destroyed, where do i start reading again? any suggestions? And i mean reading the beyonders storyline and the galactus seed arc?

Galan007
Geeze. To fully catch up on all of that, you'd have to read:
Fantastic Four (#570-588, #600-611)
The Mighty Thor (#01-06)
FF v1 (01-23)

...Along with pretty much every issue of Avengers/New Avengers. Yeah, there's a lot of material behind this event. Hickman's been building it up for years.

celeyhyga17
Originally posted by Galan007
He's talking about the theory I originally came up with MONTHS ago:
http://www.killermovies.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&postid=14868647& amp;highlight=galactus+seed+forumid%3A95+userid%3A
98733#post14868647


I further detailed my theory here:
If you guess right, expect some pm's from me on the next big lottery jackpot.

Galan007
If it's not the Galactus Seed I hope it's a Reed. Based on the evidence we've been given about Rabum Alal, though, the Seed makes a lot of sense. We should know in a few weeks either way. /shrug

VastoLord1234
Originally posted by Galan007
Geeze. To fully catch up on all of that, you'd have to read:
Fantastic Four (#570-588, #600-611)
The Mighty Thor (#01-06)
FF v1 (01-23)

...Along with pretty much every issue of Avengers/New Avengers. Yeah, there's a lot of material behind this event. Hickman's been building it up for years.

Thats waay too much, im gonna be stuck to a position if i read that much.

Galan007
Yeah, it's a lot of material for sure... But the payoff is that it's some of the best material you'll ever read. Especially Hickman's run on Fantastic Four & FF. Tbh, you should go out of your way to at least read those issues.

Brilliant stuff. thumb up

abhilegend
I think it's hyperion who is Rabum Alal. Hickman said he included him for a very important reason and he has done nothing with him.

Sure, it's a long shot but Hickman try to do the unconventional many times.

BeyonderGod

VastoLord1234
Originally posted by Galan007
Yeah, it's a lot of material for sure... But the payoff is that it's some of the best material you'll ever read. Especially Hickman's run on Fantastic Four & FF. Tbh, you should go out of your way to at least read those issues.

Brilliant stuff. thumb up

aye aye captain

Time Immemorial
Originally posted by Decimus
^It's obviously Beyonder before the retconning...

Yes, Pre Rec Beyonder

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