Religion is a Virus

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Mr Matt Damon
Pure and simple, it served a purpose once, it brought large groups of people together under common causes and gave purpose to early building projects to cement that commonality. . Now it serves none.

Recently I was in Coptic Cairo, this place is a bit like a Christian Disney world! You have the end of the route where the the holy family entered Egypt when avoiding Herod, a holy well they drank out of and 20 yards away where St George was held and kept getting tortured and resurrected.

You can drink from the well, it's next to a necropolis.

Islam so much has been said, but if you really want a laugh read about Hellfire which is literally believed in.

No evidence for anything supernatural exists, religions have been being created and dying since man first imagined.

Truth is, man should worship himself as the miracles he has worked are far more practical. Antibiotics and therapies in general, electricity ect. ect.



All religion does like capitalist economics is divide, we need a new more adult model for a species growing up. Or the virus that is religion will kill us!

Bentley
I have never seen proof of religion being capable of destroying humanity. Specially since to do so it would need our so called "human miracles" (read weapons or particle accelerators).

If there was evidence of the supernatural existing probably we wouldn't call it supernatural anymore mmm

Mr Matt Damon
Originally posted by Bentley
I have never seen proof of religion being capable of destroying humanity. Specially since to do so it would need our so called "human miracles" (read weapons or particle accelerators).

If there was evidence of the supernatural existing probably we wouldn't call it supernatural anymore mmm

It will be the conflict of ideas that destroys us through our technological miracles. I work in North Africa and the Middle East. It is getting more unstable all the time. Yes people like BAE almost certainly have off switches in everything they sell to Saudi Arabia. So many bombs are going off in Cairo these days they don't even make the news. IS are the tip of the iceberg for the problems going on out here. Sad thing is most of the people are lovely. Then a muslim might ask you what you think of Israel or a copt what you think of the Muslims. Then a bomb might go of at the Carrefour an hour after you have left it.

Bentley
Originally posted by Mr Matt Damon
It will be the conflict of ideas that destroys us through our technological miracles.

Well, is that really a religious thing? The way these divisions are played aren't a question of belief as much as artificial ways of putting up people against each other. I guess we will never know, since religion exists and it gives a name to the people killing each other, but it's likely that we never needed those "faith" tags to carry ideas and hit each other with bombs.

Star428
Originally posted by Mr Matt Damon
Pure and simple, it served a purpose once, it brought large groups of people together under common causes and gave purpose to early building projects to cement that commonality. . Now it serves none.

Recently I was in Coptic Cairo, this place is a bit like a Christian Disney world! You have the end of the route where the the holy family entered Egypt when avoiding Herod, a holy well they drank out of and 20 yards away where St George was held and kept getting tortured and resurrected.

You can drink from the well, it's next to a necropolis.

Islam so much has been said, but if you really want a laugh read about Hellfire which is literally believed in.

No evidence for anything supernatural exists, religions have been being created and dying since man first imagined.

Truth is, man should worship himself as the miracles he has worked are far more practical. Antibiotics and therapies in general, electricity ect. ect.



All religion does like capitalist economics is divide, we need a new more adult model for a species growing up. Or the virus that is religion will kill us!


LOL. Atheism is the virus, dude. "Plain and simple". Not religion. Keep trying to convince yourself otherwise though if it makes ya feel better. It's a fact that those who have low morals or even no morals at all tend to be those who do not have a strong belief in the true creator God. The real god . The god of Abraham and Isaac. Not the Islamic make-believe one and the imaginary prophet Mohammed.

Reflassshh
Big LoL @ different ways of thinking being 'viruses'.

Ignorance and intolerance is what killed the most throughout history.

Star428
I'm sure you're well acquainted with ignorance aren't you? LOL.


The fact is more and more people in America turning away from the creator God and dismissing Him as a fairy tale is a sickness that is spreading just like a virus. And it's one of the major reasons why this country is having so many problems on so many levels.

Spawningpool
Originally posted by Star428
I'm sure you're well acquainted with ignorance aren't you? LOL.


The fact is more and more people in America turning away from the creator God and dismissing Him as a fairy tale is a sickness that is spreading just like a virus. And it's one of the major underlying problems with what's wrong with this country.
Not gonna lie this really changed my life

Digi
Crime rates are down, average life span is up, and there are hosts of variables that suggest an improvement of life, in the US at least. Nothing is ever perfect, and many things are still "bad," but if we're talking about better or worse in the country, religion probably isn't the root cause of either one.

In terms of its structure, religion is a notoriously strong memeplex, and I use meme in the sense that it was originally coined, not the internet usage of the term. But in terms of how it spreads through minds, it can indeed be described as virus-like.

That said, I'm not using "virus-like" in a negative sense. Many ideas can be described in similar terms, positive or negative. A catchy song that sweeps through the country is an incredibly strong analogue to the behavior of viruses, for example. I'm describing only its mechanical structure.

I was hoping this thread would lead us into meme theory as it applies to religion. Alas, the OP is on a needless rant that is neither specific enough to produce any productive insights, nor sensitive enough to the variations and uses of religious thought to do anything but offend.

Reflassshh
Originally posted by Star428
I'm sure you're well acquainted with ignorance aren't you? LOL.


The fact is more and more people in America turning away from the creator God and dismissing Him as a fairy tale is a sickness that is spreading just like a virus. And it's one of the major reasons why this country is having so many problems on so many levels. I find myself reading your posts here quite frequently, so yes. Good catch.

Quit crying for people not sharing your beliefs, preacher.

Spawningpool
Originally posted by Reflassshh
I find myself reading your posts here quite frequently, so yes. Good catch.

Quit crying for people not sharing your beliefs, preacher.

Star428
Just to be clear, I don't have a problem with atheists in general. I know some of them are genuinely good people. As I've said in a different thread, as long as a person's beliefs doesn't hurt anyone I don't care what they believe or don't believe but when some little insignificant dipshit posts a thread insulting my beliefs and calls what I believe in a "virus" it offends me deeply. I was just striking back at his "non-belief" the way he insulted my beliefs. That's all.

Digi
Originally posted by Star428
Just to be clear, I don't have a problem with atheists in general. I know some of them are genuinely good people. As I've said in a different thread, as long as a person's beliefs doesn't hurt anyone I don't care what they believe or don't believe but when some little dipshit posts a thread insulting my beliefs and calls what I believe in a "virus" it offends me deeply. I was just striking back at his "non-belief" the way he insulted my beliefs. That's all.

Eye for an eye? Some might try to turn the other cheek. Escalating insults rarely work out in these matters.

BUT, I'm glad to hear the first part of your post. It's not always obvious from your posts, so you're going to get more negative reactions than anything else. But the "as long as they don't hurt anyone" clause is a great one to include with any belief system.

thumb up

krisblaze
Originally posted by Star428
Just to be clear, I don't have a problem with atheists in general. I know some of them are genuinely good people. As I've said in a different thread, as long as a person's beliefs doesn't hurt anyone I don't care what they believe or don't believe but when some little insignificant dipshit posts a thread insulting my beliefs and calls what I believe in a "virus" it offends me deeply. I was just striking back at his "non-belief" the way he insulted my beliefs. That's all.

This guy is a comedy goldmine.

Robtard
Originally posted by Star428
It's a fact that those who have low morals or even no morals at all tend to be those who do not have a strong belief in the true creator God. The real god . The god of Abraham and Isaac. Not the Islamic make-believe one and the imaginary prophet Mohammed.

Here you go, this was just one hit of many in a simple google search

List of Christian evangelist scandals <--- clicky

This one's my favvy fav

16) Ted Haggard was the pastor of the New Life Church in Colorado Springs, Colorado and was the president of the National Association of Evangelicals (NAE) from 2003 until November 2006. Haggard’s position allowed him occasional access to President George W. Bush. In 2006 it was alleged that Haggard had been regularly visiting a male prostitute who also provided him with methamphetamine. Haggard admitted his wrongdoing and resigned as pastor of New Life church and as president of the NAE. The high-profile case was significant also because it immediately preceded the 2006 mid-term elections and may have even affected national voting patterns. In January 2009, Haggard admitted to a second homosexual relationship with a male church member on CNN-TV and other national media, and when asked, would not directly answer a question about his other possible homosexual relationships.

http://www.cantrell.org.uk/david/journal/images/haggard.jpg

Spawningpool
Originally posted by Robtard
Here you go, this was just one hit of many in a simple google search

List of Christian evangelist scandals <--- clicky

16) Ted Haggard was the pastor of the New Life Church in Colorado Springs, Colorado and was the president of the National Association of Evangelicals (NAE) from 2003 until November 2006. Haggard’s position allowed him occasional access to President George W. Bush. In 2006 it was alleged that Haggard had been regularly visiting a male prostitute who also provided him with methamphetamine. Haggard admitted his wrongdoing and resigned as pastor of New Life church and as president of the NAE. The high-profile case was significant also because it immediately preceded the 2006 mid-term elections and may have even affected national voting patterns. In January 2009, Haggard admitted to a second homosexual relationship with a male church member on CNN-TV and other national media, and when asked, would not directly answer a question about his other possible homosexual relationships.

http://www.cantrell.org.uk/david/journal/images/haggard.jpg
Again rob you amaze me again laughing

Digi
Unfortunate as the Haggard thing is, I tend to dislike individual stories as refutation. They're too easily dismissed as not indicative of the whole. It isn't No True Scotsman, it's a small sample size, so a Christian defense in light of that link could be valid if presented correctly. However, there exists ample data to support the idea that atheists aren't inherently immoral, and in fact tend to be slightly more moral than those who are religious.

http://www.killermovies.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&postid=10279321#post10279321

I quote this numerous times on this forum, but it remains relevant to various discussions.

I also don't want to use the data to claim the moral superiority of any system of belief over another. That would be drawing conclusions that the data doesn't necessarily lead to. But it does an excellent, thorough job of dismissing ideas like this:
Originally posted by Star428
It's a fact that those who have low morals or even no morals at all tend to be those who do not have a strong belief in the true creator God. The real god . The god of Abraham and Isaac.

...which seems emotionally, not empirically, driven.

Mr Matt Damon
Originally posted by Digi
Crime rates are down, average life span is up, and there are hosts of variables that suggest an improvement of life, in the US at least. Nothing is ever perfect, and many things are still "bad," but if we're talking about better or worse in the country, religion probably isn't the root cause of either one.

In terms of its structure, religion is a notoriously strong memeplex, and I use meme in the sense that it was originally coined, not the internet usage of the term. But in terms of how it spreads through minds, it can indeed be described as virus-like.

That said, I'm not using "virus-like" in a negative sense. Many ideas can be described in similar terms, positive or negative. A catchy song that sweeps through the country is an incredibly strong analogue to the behavior of viruses, for example. I'm describing only its mechanical structure.

I was hoping this thread would lead us into meme theory as it applies to religion. Alas, the OP is on a needless rant that is neither specific enough to produce any productive insights, nor sensitive enough to the variations and uses of religious thought to do anything but offend.

How's America managing to keep it's ailing economy going by raping other nations working out for Africa and the Middle East? As India, China and Brazil rise, things will get very interesting. It was easy to damage Russia, e'll see how easy it is to do that to India. How are tings for the Poor in America, hey who owns Detroit now?

Your Dawkinesque explanation of religion is fine. Dawkin and you miss a lot though, as religion does have roles for some poor people which are positive e.g. hope and for the state as a control, lever etc. All reasons our economic model needs changing. All other arguments.

I live in a beautiful apartment in a compound, that looks out onto an upmarket street for ex pats in a third world capital. In the doorway of the 7-11 200 yards from the compound entrance is a man sleeping in carpets, he gets up washes and gets changed at the local mosque and goes to work for the day. Then he works 16 hours and comes home to no home. The mosque does serve a purpose, he serves a purpose, he reminds me of my humility and I try to give him something every week.

He also reminds me that regardless of our differences we are all just upright hairless chimps and sadly our behaviours reflect this. Would we have tribal and national disputes without Religion? Certainly! It serves our leaders and the Economic structure where I watch a flat screen T.V. and eat out and have a filipino maid and he sleeps in a blanket.

Does religion help some people by giving them a false hope sure... While it does though nothing will change for them.

Does religion make it harder for many people to see through the minor differences of race and ethnicity? Sure it adds another cultural layer of hate and bigotry on both sides.

Can I do anything about it.. Hell no! Does it sometimes make me feel dirty having so much relatively when surrounded by those who have so little. All the time.

Do I believe because a story in a book is old, the laws of physics then were different. No, and neither should anyone else.

Digi
Originally posted by Mr Matt Damon
How's America managing to keep it's ailing economy going by raping other nations working out for Africa and the Middle East? As India, China and Brazil rise, things will get very interesting. It was easy to damage Russia, e'll see how easy it is to do that to India. How are tings for the Poor in America, hey who owns Detroit now?

Your Dawkinesque explanation of religion is fine. Dawkin and you miss a lot though, as religion does have roles for some poor people which are positive e.g. hope and for the state as a control, lever etc. All reasons our economic model needs changing. All other arguments.

I live in a beautiful apartment in a compound, that looks out onto an upmarket street for ex pats in a third world capital. In the doorway of the 7-11 200 yards from the compound entrance is a man sleeping in carpets, he gets up washes and gets changed at the local mosque and goes to work for the day. Then he works 16 hours and comes home to no home. The mosque does serve a purpose, he serves a purpose, he reminds me of my humility and I try to give him something every week.

He also reminds me that regardless of our differences we are all just upright hairless chimps and sadly our behaviours reflect this. Would we have tribal and national disputes without Religion? Certainly! It serves our leaders and the Economic structure where I watch a flat screen T.V. and eat out and have a filipino maid and he sleeps in a blanket.

Does religion help some people by giving them a false hope sure... While it does though nothing will change for them.

Does religion make it harder for many people to see through the minor differences of race and ethnicity? Sure it adds another cultural layer of hate and bigotry on both sides.

Can I do anything about it.. Hell no! Does it sometimes make me feel dirty having so much relatively when surrounded by those who have so little. All the time.

Do I believe because a story in a book is old, the laws of physics then were different. No, and neither should anyone else.

This post is all over the place. Obviously I don't disagree with you on everything, but your approach seems to lack enough coherence and tact to make an impact on those from either side of the religious debate here.

Robtard
Originally posted by Digi
Unfortunate as the Haggard thing is, I tend to dislike individual stories as refutation. They're too easily dismissed as not indicative of the whole. It isn't No True Scotsman, it's a small sample size, so a Christian defense in light of that link could be valid if presented correctly. However, there exists ample data to support the idea that atheists aren't inherently immoral, and in fact tend to be slightly more moral than those who are religious.

http://www.killermovies.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&postid=10279321#post10279321

I quote this numerous times on this forum, but it remains relevant to various discussions.

I also don't want to use the data to claim the moral superiority of any system of belief over another. That would be drawing conclusions that the data doesn't necessarily lead to. But it does an excellent, thorough job of dismissing ideas like this:


...which seems emotionally, not empirically, driven.

I wholeheartedly agree, but if someone's going to throw the "Amoral Atheist" mud-blanket-attack, I fling some back

Digi
Originally posted by Robtard
I wholeheartedly agree, but if someone's going to throw the "Amoral Atheist" mud-blanket-attack, I fling some back

Lol, fair enough. They certainly do seem more high-profile, at least.

Robtard
Possibly because they're so god damn hysterically awful as people?

"Homosexuality is wrong and being a homosexual is an affront to God." *goes out and has gay sex while doing meth*

Mr Matt Damon
Originally posted by Digi
This post is all over the place. Obviously I don't disagree with you on everything, but your approach seems to lack enough coherence and tact to make an impact on those from either side of the religious debate here.

That's because you and they are used to debating from outside the issue. You simply cannot picture a world outside your school debating society where things have real impact. You simply haven't seen enough of the world to be able to picture what I am trying to describe for you. Your world view comes only from the media and internet. I try and put you in the real world, which is not coherent, it is extremely incoherent and you unfortunately become lost. I just had two people beg money from me for my white face in the time in took me to go off compound and get a coffee. Yes, things are great if you are white and educated and have no conscience.

Digi
Originally posted by Mr Matt Damon
That's because you and they are used to debating from outside the issue. You simply cannot picture a world outside your school debating society where things have real impact. You simply haven't seen enough of the world to be able to picture what I am trying to describe for you. Your world view comes only from the media and internet. I try and put you in the real world, which is not coherent, it is extremely incoherent and you unfortunately become lost. I just had two people beg money from me for my white face in the time in took me to go off compound and get a coffee. Yes, things are great if you are white and educated and have no conscience.

Oneness?

The lack of coherence comes from your writing style, and inability to focus on a single topic long enough to do it justice. Not from the things you mentioned.

Also, the assumptions made here are hilarious. And Wtf is a school debating society?

Originally posted by Robtard
Possibly because they're so god damn hysterically awful as people?

"Homosexuality is wrong and being a homosexual is an affront to God." *goes out and has gay sex while doing meth*

Yeah, gotta love how thick the irony is laid on in such situations.

Mr Matt Damon
Originally posted by Digi
Oneness?

The lack of coherence comes from your writing style, and inability to focus on a single topic long enough to do it justice. Not from the things you mentioned.

Also, the assumptions made here are hilarious. And Wtf is a school debating society?



Yeah, gotta love how thick the irony is laid on in such situations.

As are your assumptions equally hilarious, I suspect I have more degrees from better Universities than you. No the incoherence comes from painting a picture with broadstrokes hoping you are bright enough to fill in the gaps. That's what the world is like. A school debating society, is a bit like a college debating society although more at the level of this forum.

Robtard
Yet here you our still making sock accounts 11+ years later, Whirly smile

ps Never change

Digi
http://i.imgur.com/SWtc7u5m.jpg

Mr Matt Damon
Originally posted by Robtard
Yet here you our still making sock accounts 11+ years later, Whirly smile

ps Never change

Ha, if you only saw the locations I live on ip Like Digi does or saw me on Bardocks wall when I saw you before I deleted my facebook forever. Ha, you lives are so much smaller than mine.

But that's why I come back occasionally. To feel better about myself. I have all the things you guys pretend to have. :-)

Oh, that and to troll of course smile

Robtard
Originally posted by Mr Matt Damon
Ha, if you only saw the locations I live on ip Like Digi does or saw me on Bardocks wall when I saw you before I deleted my facebook forever. Ha, you lives are so much smaller than mine.

But that's why I come back occasionally. To feel better about myself.

I have all the things you guys pretend to have. :-)

Oh, that and to troll of course smile

Honestly, not sure what you're trying to say here

Occasionally? You never left, Whirls :O

Such as?

To troll *full stop*

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