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He said Kanan and the crew are Level 3, maybe reached Level 4 End of season 1. Vader is a whopping level 80. Where would you rank other Jedi/Sith using this level, assuming level 100 is the max?

It was fun downplaying Bane while it lasted, but he would rape the Ghost crew.

Not if they bring some mercenaries

Originally posted by The Merchant
He said Kanan and the crew are Level 3, maybe reached Level 4 End of season 1. Vader is a whopping level 80. Where would you rank other Jedi/Sith using this level, assuming level 100 is the max?


Convenient he gave Vader an 80, when Lucas said Vader was 80% of Palpatine. Guess everyone's "level" is their percentage measurement against Palpatine's 100.

Anyway I guess that puts Old Ben in the 70-75 range. He was after all stalemating Vader in ANH.

^
As I remember, you consider Vader as stronger then Dooku or Mace. So, at that point is Ben equal or superior to them as well? And what's Maul's % in your opinion?

Personally I find this whole "levels" thing to be kind of dumb. NOBODY performs at their absolute best every single time. Even Man. United have bad games sometimes. Conversely look at Scout's match against Chizzik, she notes that usually they were about even but he was on especially good form that day.

Even if we assume that said characters are at their "usual" level, there's still a ton of other factors to consider. Environmental hazards, location, other priorities, tactics, etc. It's not as simple as "A is level 7 and B is level 6 so A wins."

^
Yeah, sure thing. That's why Obi-Wan was able to to fight equally with Maul and Savage at once. Same thing might be told about Mace and Sora's duel.
But overall, Mace is above Sora, and brothers combined are far above Kenobi.

But basing on all feats and statements, we should be able to succesfully rank those all guys.

Originally posted by McP
^
As I remember, you consider Vader as stronger then Dooku or Mace. So, at that point is Ben equal or superior to them as well? And what's Maul's % in your opinion?

It's hard to compare different generations tbh which is why I largely avoid those debates nowadays. But I do think Vader probably has superior Tk to Dooku or Windu. And don't forget I'm still rating Old Ben a bit below Vader.

Maul was pretty equal to Late TCW/ROTS Kenobi last we saw him. No idea how good he'll be when we see him next.

Originally posted by DARTH POWER
Convenient he gave Vader an 80, when Lucas said Vader was 80% of Palpatine.

What's even more interesting is that 80 split in half is 40, which is the age Kasdan was when he wrote ESB!

Half Life 3 confirmed.

100: Palpatine, Luke

90: Vitiate, Yoda

80: Vader, Windu

70: Ob-wan, Maul

I'm pretty sure Filoni was just exaggerating to make his point that Vader's way above them. It shouldn't be used as an official power level.

100 Palpatine, Plagueis, Caedus


50 Kolar, Malgus, Ulic

10 Commander Gree, Sora Bulq, Darth Reave

1 The Inquisitor, Kanan, Ezra

-100 Vitiate, Nihilus, Bane

@ KJ
Who knows, in other interview, he stated Vader to be level 50:

http://www.starwars.com/news/interview-dave-filoni-on-star-wars-rebels-part-3

Well it should be used.

Originally posted by |King Joker|
I'm pretty sure Filoni was just exaggerating to make his point that Vader's way above them. It shouldn't be used as an official power level.

Originally posted by DARTH POWER
Convenient he gave Vader an 80, when Lucas said Vader was 80% of Palpatine. Guess everyone's "level" is their percentage measurement against Palpatine's 100.

Anyway I guess that puts Old Ben in the 70-75 range. He was after all stalemating Vader in ANH.

It's a coincidence. In another quote he said Kanan was a level 5 and Vader was like a "level 50 or so". Clearly it was just a random number.

Originally posted by NewGuy01
It's a coincidence. In another quote he said Kanan was a level 5 and Vader was like a "level 50 or so". Clearly it was just a random number.


I know. They usually are random numbers. In fact I'm sure Lucas's own 80% of Palpatine was also pretty random and not an exact Official rating.

Take it about as seriously as power levels in Dragon Ball/Yu Yu Hakusho either way.

Because that's basically what "percentage of Sidious" or "RPG levels" are.

Always got a chuckle out of people trying to derive how powerful characters are via power levels by taking percentage of such and such's power level compared to another's.

As if the relationship was treated as linear.

That's how you end up with planet razing farmer with shotgun :maybe

Originally posted by The Merchant
He said Kanan and the crew are Level 3, maybe reached Level 4 End of season 1. Vader is a whopping level 80. Where would you rank other Jedi/Sith using this level, assuming level 100 is the max?

Where did Filoni say that?

In an interview on the season finale of Rebels.

Originally posted by Darth Abonis
Where did Filoni say that?


In his interview with IGN.

On his Interview with starwars.com he gave Kanan a 5 and Vader a 50.

Originally posted by ChaosTheory123
Take it about as seriously as power levels in Dragon Ball/Yu Yu Hakusho either way.

Because that's basically what "percentage of Sidious" or "RPG levels" are.

Always got a chuckle out of people trying to derive how powerful characters are via power levels by taking percentage of such and such's power level compared to another's.

As if the relationship was treated as linear.

That's how you end up with planet razing farmer with shotgun :maybe

YYH's power levels worked fairly well really. The grading system worked in a relatively linear fashion until around S- class, then stuff started to become exponential. DBZ was insane though.

Star Wars Jedi can be applied to the YYH system. Let me try:

Palpatine - S+
Yoda - S+
Luke - S+

Vader - S
Dooku - S
Mace - S

Kenobi - S-
Maul - S-

Then the dropoff into A class would be severe....

Qui Gon - A+
Kit Fisto - A+

etc. etc.

Pretty much all the Jedi we talk about on this forum would be in the S range, since there's so much variation at the top, and since any of them would crush your run of the mill Jedi or Sith.

Hope you YYH fans appreciated this XD

Yea, YYH works well. Better than fiddly numbers.

Instantly thought of Naruto games and their rank missions lol.

Yo @ Hero of Python. Where would Anakin and old Abby-loth go? In your.opinion.

Originally posted by Fated Xtasy
Instantly thought of Naruto games and their rank missions lol.

Yo @ Hero of Python. Where would Anakin and old Abby-loth go? In your.opinion.

Anakin would flux between S and S+, sorta like Yusuke at the end of the show. Abeloth would be a god tier S+, same as the Mortis trio.

I'm trying to think of who would make up the B range (powerful and unique individuals but not special or amazing in the grand scheme of things). Maybe guys like Jango Fett, HK-47, and Jedi Academy Jaden.

It's more like Yu Yu Hakusho than Naruto, Fated.

Though Python, I'd have to disagree with the notion that the gap between Dooku and Sidious is akin to the gap between Dooku and Maul.

Originally posted by NewGuy01
It's more like Yu Yu Hakusho than Naruto, Fated.

Though Python, I'd have to disagree with the notion that the gap between Dooku and Sidious is akin to the gap between Dooku and Maul.

I agree with you. Though YYH scales exponentially between S-/S/S+, so an S- is far closer to S than an S is to an S+.

Plus there are variations between each. Me personally, I'd have Maul at a strong S- level and Dooku at a weak S level. Palps would inhabit the high S+ range, just scraping the god tier but not quite, so he'd stomp either Dooku or Maul, whereas Maul could beat Dooku under certain circumstances.

I still think, that Tiers are a better option. Especially if each tier weill be separated for high, mid and low sections.

Originally posted by Hero of Python
YYH's power levels worked fairly well really. The grading system worked in a relatively linear fashion until around S- class, then stuff started to become exponential. DBZ was insane though.

Star Wars Jedi can be applied to the YYH system. Let me try:

Palpatine - S+
Yoda - S+
Luke - S+

Vader - S
Dooku - S
Mace - S

Kenobi - S-
Maul - S-

Then the dropoff into A class would be severe....

Qui Gon - A+
Kit Fisto - A+

etc. etc.

Pretty much all the Jedi we talk about on this forum would be in the S range, since there's so much variation at the top, and since any of them would crush your run of the mill Jedi or Sith.

Hope you YYH fans appreciated this XD

For the bolded?

The class system worked

I was talking about the bullshit Togashi introduced during the 3 Kings Arc where actual numbers were listed

Hokushin had a power level of 36,000 for instance.

Yomi was somewhere into the 1,000,000s

Trying a linear interpretation?

Someone like 100% Toguro would hold a power level less than 1 for this shit to work given the hilarious gap in showings between a demon like him and CB Yusuke.

Made worse if Genkai Tournament punch machine readings correspond to Yomi's power level scale (where Yusuke was already around 150 a la punching machine in terms of reiki)

You can't take numbers like these as anything serious, because a linear scale between them doesn't actually exist in a useable form.

The difference between the power to crush a wall (Genkai Tournament), wreck a stadium (Dark Tournament), and **** up mountains (shown in the Chapter Black fight in Makai)/wreck a country (a la Reikai's assertion and threat warning system) are hilariously too disparate to be covered over a range that only heads into the low millions... low ten thousands technically given Hokushin shits on both Sensui and Yusuke in CB.

100 can't be maximum, Full-Potential Anakin is 120.

Originally posted by ChaosTheory123
For the bolded?

The class system worked

I was talking about the bullshit Togashi introduced during the 3 Kings Arc where actual numbers were listed

Hokushin had a power level of 36,000 for instance.

Yomi was somewhere into the 1,000,000s

Trying a linear interpretation?

Someone like 100% Toguro would hold a power level less than 1 for this shit to work given the hilarious gap in showings between a demon like him and CB Yusuke.

Made worse if Genkai Tournament punch machine readings correspond to Yomi's power level scale (where Yusuke was already around 150 a la punching machine in terms of reiki)

You can't take numbers like these as anything serious, because a linear scale between them doesn't actually exist in a useable form.

The difference between the power to crush a wall (Genkai Tournament), wreck a stadium (Dark Tournament), and **** up mountains (shown in the Chapter Black fight in Makai)/wreck a country (a la Reikai's assertion and threat warning system) are hilariously too disparate to be covered over a range that only heads into the low millions... low ten thousands technically given Hokushin shits on both Sensui and Yusuke in CB.

Oh yes, the Three Kings arc was pretty BS and it was clear they were trying to come up with a way to easily show power progression, but it fell flat on its face.

More egregious to me is that a B+* like Toguro and Minoru Sensui were made to be absolute jokes in the 3K arc, when A+* Hiei took on 500 A class demons on his own. That kind of power scaling works in DBZ, but in YYH all it did was make everything wonky.

An easy fix would be to get rid of the run-of-the-mill S class demons like Hokushin and Sachi, make them A classes. Then make all the fodder A classes in the 3K arc B classes. Then leave S class to a handful of the top tier characters. That's it. That also makes the Dark Tournament demons seem to be a bit more respectable, since in this format B to B+* would be considered strong enough to not be absolute jokes.

The real problem is that the Gods were so insanely OP. They should have been Canon Hokushin level at best. The 3 Kings Arc sort of reminded me of DBZ Battle of the Gods. No matter how much the main characters powered up, the Gods were still able to beat them. Good for story but not very cathartic for the viewer...imo.

Holy Yu Yu Hakusho digression batman!