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http://i522.photobucket.com/albums/w344/riv6672/image_zpstdxiceyp.jpg

Standard Namor. Pre DCnu Hal.
No prep. No BFR.
Fully hydrated Namor. Personal shields and amped punches only for Hal.
No flying for either.

http://i522.photobucket.com/albums/w344/riv6672/image_zpsod4xkriz.jpg

Namor imo,which version of hal

PreDCnu. Standard form.

Originally posted by Genii96
Namor imo

Hal.

Taking punches from SBP - hardly a guy known for holding back, AND a Silver Age Kryptonian to boot - is far above what Namor can dish out.

Hal.

Cool, this one seems competitive then.

The way I saw it, is if you consider WHY Hal only does boxing gloves and simple constructs.

It's because he likes to keep things simple.

All his will and strength is poured into the construct, so no concentration is wasted.

You have now concentrated that will even further, by simplifying things. He doesn't have to think about (relatively) fancy constructs - he just needs to punch.

So all that willpower? The same will that enables him to kill Krona (with all the entities)? Tank supernovae/nukes? All that will and concentration is now poured into amping his punches.

Hal knocks him out

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
The way I saw it, is if you consider WHY Hal only does boxing gloves and simple constructs.

It's because he likes to keep things simple.

All his will and strength is poured into the construct, so no concentration is wasted.

You have now concentrated that will even further, by simplifying things. He doesn't have to think about (relatively) fancy constructs - he just needs to punch.

So all that willpower? The same will that enables him to kill Krona (with all the entities)? Tank supernovae/nukes? All that will and concentration is now poured into amping his punches.
^^^Thats a great theory (no sarcasm).
So you figure he can dupe Namor's scanned feat above, or better?

Originally posted by riv6672
^^^Thats a great theory (no sarcasm).
So you figure he can dupe Namor's scanned feat above, or better?

Lol punching thanos?

Originally posted by riv6672
^^^Thats a great theory (no sarcasm).
So you figure he can dupe Namor's scanned feat above, or better?

Yes.

Namor also busted his hand doing that, which I don't see Hal doing....so I reckon he can do better.

And as for the concentration:

https://skoce.files.wordpress.com/2011/05/gl-rebirth-6-of-6-09.jpg

Previous page:

https://skoce.files.wordpress.com/2011/05/gl-rebirth-6-of-6-08.jpg

^^^thank you, DS.

Originally posted by Sin I AM
Lol punching thanos?
THIS is why i didnt make it a general question...

Good Fight. Hal 6/10

Thanks.

Hal.

He could just focus on personal shields and tire Namor out.

Either way, he wins.

Thats a good strategy...

Hal has amped his strength before (like when he fought Mongul for example). He should be able to win this, tbh. And quite solidly too.

Does he get to use contructs If so...is it a slug fest or him just using contructs?

^^^Slug. Fest.

Those aren't his real hands tho....that's not even fair. Lol

Originally posted by riv6672
^^^Slug. Fest.

IOW, giant slug constructs.

Hal knows how to throw a punch (he has the technique):

http://geekhardshow.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/05/HalPunchBats.jpg

He has the power and strength to do it.

Plus the durability.

He wins.

Ha!

Just answering the posted query. I didnt say constructs of any kind (boxing gloves/gastropods) in the OP.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
The way I saw it, is if you consider WHY Hal only does boxing gloves and simple constructs.

It's because he likes to keep things simple.

All his will and strength is poured into the construct, so no concentration is wasted.

You have now concentrated that will even further, by simplifying things. He doesn't have to think about (relatively) fancy constructs - he just needs to punch.

So all that willpower? The same will that enables him to kill Krona (with all the entities)? Tank supernovae/nukes? All that will and concentration is now poured into amping his punches.

Lol, nice contradiction. Keeping it simple would be simple kicking and punching like you said, so come up with another explanation. This is Namors fight. Funny how no one seems to remember that Namor is a better hand to hand fighter as if that wouldn't matter.

What is the contradiction?

Rather than creating constructs (boxing gloves, trains, fight jets) he is just focussing his will on amping himself.

Less distractions, more concentration. Which is more difficult to imagine, a working fighter jet or just thinking yourself to be strong?

^^^i agree with your theory here.

A big question no one's touched on is, what does Hal feel inside thsy shield? Because Namor's going to be pounding something fierce.

I don't think its actually attached to him in anyway, so the shockwaves won't be transmitted to him.

That, or it also dampens attacks. Or both.

Not sure i agree on the shockwaves/dampening things.
I've seen GLs strain/sweat as they held fields together under attacks.
One as close to the skin as in this scenario, with him being smacked around?
It should be an issue for Hal.

My point being, if its not attached in any way to his body, and is just a millimetre above his skin...and is inflexible (hence the strain)....how would he feel the punch?

At the very least, every blow is going to tax Hal's will in order to keep the field cohesive. Thats not a new thing.

Originally posted by riv6672
At the very least, every blow is going to tax Hal's will in order to keep the field cohesive. Thats not a new thing.

many strong opponents break gl constructs. His aura alone and the strength of his punches would be enough to beat Namor? I don't think so.

I really think that Namor would beat up on Hal. He's really a very strong character barring weakness exploitation.

Hal has straight up punched Henshaw's jaw off when he was powered up by ten GL rings. That punch would finish Namor.

And Hal has taken good, solid punches from Darkseid, of all people. And wasn't KOed.

https://comicnewbies.files.wordpress.com/2015/06/green-lantern-vs-darkseid-4.jpg

Assuming darkseid actually hit him with much effort,as he snaps hal's arm like a twig next....namor also took hits from thanos and wasn't ko'd,took a scream and black bolt and swiftly recovered,took a nuke to the face,shrugged off hulk's hits,withstood voidty's hits and was completely fine afterward,withstood a hammer hit from nekkron that iirc,destroyed new atlantis the next page....is a much better fighter than hal,and is a lot more experienced in battle. I give this one to namor

Originally posted by Genii96
Assuming darkseid actually hit him with much effort,as he snaps hal's arm like a twig next....namor also took hits from thanos and wasn't ko'd,took a scream and black bolt and swiftly recovered,took a nuke to the face,shrugged off hulk's hits,withstood voidty's hits and was completely fine afterward,withstood a hammer hit from nekkron that iirc,destroyed new atlantis the next page....is a much better fighter than hal,and is a lot more experienced in battle. I give this one to namor

I would say he did, as his shields are weakened to the point his arm could be snapped like a twig....

Thanos was trying to teach him a lesson, not KO him

Screams/nukes are =/= punches, otherwise Hal has tanked quite a few energy attacks of his own.

Hulk/Voidtry are good, I will give you that.

Better fighter? More experience? It's a slug fest. They stand there punching each other.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
I would say he did, as his shields are weakened to the point his arm could be snapped like a twig....

Thanos was trying to teach him a lesson, not KO him

Screams/nukes are =/= punches, otherwise Hal has tanked quite a few energy attacks of his own.

Hulk/Voidtry are good, I will give you that.

Better fighter? More experience? It's a slug fest. They stand there punching each other.
You are assuming the difference between hal and darkseid was near enough that darkseid had to put effort to break his shields...that's,just an assumption,I could also assume thanos had to put effort to teach namor a lesson(hell he said it had been a while he had faced a good opponent)....pretty sure hal also broke his constructs just smashing into darkseid too iirc,and darkseid oneshotted hal,alongside everyone else bar supes and flash,when he hit the ground. Bottomline, thanos/namor and darkseid/hal,isn't really good to use as durability,as their opponent was far stronger and beat them down while holding back,with no quantifiable measure of how much,you could say it took much effort,I would just disagree and none of us can prove it.

Hal takes energy blasts to the face? Or with his shields/constructs which cnt be used here?..cuz namor took the nuke to the face,and the scream was at near point blank too and his body can easily survive at the bottom of the ocean,the amount of pressuer per inch there would also add to what he can take as physical hits are concerned. Also there is a scan of him being punched into 3 different biomes in one of his respect threads iirc,and he got back up

He also withstood hits from blue marvel and BL thor too,the hammer smash from nekkron and having mountains crumbled and dropped on him(courtesy of tiger shark),among others,a younger version taking down ares and wonderman at the same time,etc

Guys can dodge hits in a slug fest can't they? Or isn't that how it works?

I will be honest: my assumption is that he can use shields (as per OP) - otherwise, yeah I fully agree, his face gets melted off lol.

As for dodging - I don't know. In the Superman slugfests, he usually doesn't have his speed, but OP can clarify.

Ah,didn't see the 'personal shields' if that's allowed then this isn't exactly a slugfest. Though I would give namor a slight advantage,since hal needs to actually come out to hit him,and he should be able to handle average hal's hits and eventually break through that shield after several tries

Same as no constructs, no construct shields. A personal shield is a "skin tight" coating.

So more like an aura, a 'shield' that thin isn't going to help here

If its worth thinking about, its worth over thinking...

GL auto shields (I.e. Their aura) have taken supernovas.....

And blackholes.

A lot of characters have done than and still been beat up. Hardly the endall be all bench mark in a fist fight.

When has Namor bypassed shields capable of tanking supernovas and blackholes? Since he's, you know, the one talked about in this thread.

When has GL stood there taking Hulk level blows with 0 effect?

Originally posted by riv6672
When has GL stood there taking Hulk level blows with 0 effect? Since when is Namor the Hulk?

Originally posted by riv6672
When has GL stood there taking Hulk level blows with 0 effect? When has Namor done that?

Reading. It's fundamental.

Originally posted by riv6672
Reading. It's fundamental. Saying Namor has Hulk level hits implies that he's as strong as Hulk - which he's not. Saying Namor can't breach GL shields doesn't mean Hulk wouldn't.

Understanding your own points. Also fundamental.

Now, if you have no feats of Namor bypassing shields that are capable of withstanding supernovas/black holes, you can go on with your day, and stop wasting mine.

Next time you dont have to answer the PM i sent you saying "please Phil, there arent enough people bitching moaning and generally being douchey in this thread, grace it with your presence!". It'll save you some time.
If you dont agree with my thinking that Namor is a Hulk level character, thats fine.
Being at the same level as the person to your left or right doesnt mean you can do the exact same things as them, just means you're comparable.

Oh hell, you misunderstood "level". No way you'll get "comparable".

Originally posted by riv6672
Next time you dont have to answer the PM i sent you saying "please Phil, there arent enough people bitching moaning and generally being douchey in this thread, grace it with your presence!". It'll save you some time.
If you dont agree with my thinking that Namor is a Hulk level character, thats fine.
Being at the same level as the person to your left or right doesnt mean you can do the exact same things as them, just means you're comparable.

Oh hell, you misunderstood "level". No way you'll get "comparable". Who pissed in your soup?

Go fetch me some feats and then come back here, dumbo.

Until then..
Namor is not Hulk level
Namor can't breach GL shields
Hal beats Namor.

Stop with trying to get 'provocative'
You can only do that when your IQ hits 3 digits, and you're struggling with two.

Originally posted by riv6672
Next time you dont have to answer the PM i sent you saying "please Phil, there arent enough people bitching moaning and generally being douchey in this thread, grace it with your presence!". It'll save you some time.
If you dont agree with my thinking that Namor is a Hulk level character, thats fine.
Being at the same level as the person to your left or right doesnt mean you can do the exact same things as them, just means you're comparable.

Oh hell, you misunderstood "level". No way you'll get "comparable". Shut up, Oprah.

Namor is Thing level.

Hulk is > Thing.

Namor is far above thing level...

Originally posted by Genii96
Namor is far above thing level...

By that I meant, they're in the same tier.

Hell, here on KMC he's aHigh Meta, same as Thing. Assuming we've been generous to Thing, Namor would be Low Herald....

Hulk is Mid, but that's obv wrong, lol.

IOW, Thing is close to Namor than Namor is to Hulk.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
IOW, Thing is closer to Namor than Namor is to Hulk.

Namor > Thanos > Blackholes

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
By that I meant, they're in the same tier.

Hell, here on KMC he's aHigh Meta, same as Thing. Assuming we've been generous to Thing, Namor would be Low Herald....

Hulk is Mid, but that's obv wrong, lol.

IOW, Thing is close to Namor than Namor is to Hulk.
Namor a high meta? Wow.
He stalemates hercules on land every damn time
Stalemates or beats hulk almost every damn time
Has stalemated almost every high end brick
Beat ares and wonderman at once
Supported utopia island etc
We'll,if that is how he is ranked here,that's fine,comic book feats put him easily in hercules and hulk's tier,especially underwater
Hell of a lot above ben grimm,whom he has oneshotted several times

Originally posted by Genii96
Namor a high meta? Wow.
He stalemates hercules on land every damn time
Stalemates or beats hulk almost every damn time
Has stalemated almost every high end brick
Beat ares and wonderman at once
Supported utopia island etc
We'll,if that is how he is ranked here,that's fine,comic book feats put him easily in hercules and hulk's tier,especially underwater
Hell of a lot above ben grimm,whom he has oneshotted several times

Herc is a Low Herald here.

Ares is High Meta.

As is Wonder Man.

So, yeah, Namor seems in the Low Herald, as I said.

GL Hal is still High Herald.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Herc is a Low Herald here.

Ares is High Meta.

As is Wonder Man.

So, yeah, Namor seems in the Low Herald, as I said.

GL Hal is still High Herald. All those rankings are wrong though.

Except Hal.

Originally posted by Mindset
All those rankings are wrong though.

Except Hal.

You're wrong.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
You're wrong. Ok, Hal is actually low herald.

Sorry.

To be a Herald one must possess at least one of the following

1. Flight
2. Teleportation
3. Bullet or greater Speed

This is because without any of these things any Herald level being can bfr them and win every time.

Originally posted by h1a8
To be a Herald one must possess at least one of the following

1. Flight
2. Teleportation
3. Speed

This is because without any of these things any Herald level being can bfr them and win every time.

It still wouldn't make them not a herald, though.

It's about power level and ability, not specific kinds of powers.

Originally posted by -Pr-
It still wouldn't make them not a herald, though.

It's about power level and ability, not specific kinds of powers. sorry, I meant they need at least one of those as a prerequisite to making the Herald tier.

Originally posted by h1a8
sorry, I meant they need at least one of those as a prerequisite to making the Herald tier.

The point still stands, though.

There are plenty of people with none of those that still compete with other heralds.

Originally posted by h1a8
To be a Herald one must possess at least one of the following

1. Flight
2. Teleportation
3. Bullet or greater Speed

This is because without any of these things any Herald level being can bfr them and win every time. No.

Originally posted by -Pr-
The point still stands, though.

There are plenty of people with none of those that still compete with other heralds. That's because the heralds don't attempt to bfr them.
If they did then they would win easily every time.

Originally posted by h1a8
That's because the heralds don't attempt to bfr them.
If they did then they would win easily every time.

No, they wouldn't, because they've tried it, with only varying levels of success.

Not to pull a carver, but:

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11123/111230790/4720135-hulk+goes+wherever+he+wants+to+go.jpg

By your logic, Hulk shouldn't be Herald level.

Originally posted by Genii96
Namor a high meta? Wow.
He stalemates hercules on land every damn time
Stalemates or beats hulk almost every damn time
Has stalemated almost every high end brick
Beat ares and wonderman at once
Supported utopia island etc
We'll,if that is how he is ranked here,that's fine,comic book feats put him easily in hercules and hulk's tier,especially underwater
Hell of a lot above ben grimm,whom he has oneshotted several times
Like i said, Namor is comparable. Especially fully hydrsted. Hal isnt going to shrug off his blows; they'll test his concentration.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Not to pull a carver, but:

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11123/111230790/4720135-hulk+goes+wherever+he+wants+to+go.jpg

By your logic, Hulk shouldn't be Herald level. I stated Hulk wasn't a herald years ago. He's the primary reason I have the stance. Hulk could be bfr into space or another state with a simple throw or punch with sufficient force.
He has to be able to get back to the battlefield in a reasonable time (whatever that is).


Originally posted by -Pr-
No, they wouldn't, because they've tried it, with only varying levels of success. If they are able to avoid bfr with any level of success then that means they have the speed and reflexes to defend against it (which is at least bullet speed and reflexes). Now when i mention speed im not referring to traveling speed necessarily but at least reflex or hand speed. Otherwise, they couldnt defend against getting hit or thrown or teleported far from the battlefield by a herald since they don't have the sufficient reflex or hand speed.

Hulk (and Namor) have caught tank rounds in flight. Thats right about bullet speed. Bullets average between 3,500 and 5,000 feet per second; tank rounds usually top out at 3,500.

Originally posted by h1a8
To be a Herald one must possess at least one of the following

1. Flight
2. Teleportation
3. Bullet or greater Speed

This is because without any of these things any Herald level being can bfr them and win every time.
First off,that's wrong
Second,namor has 1 and 3

Namor has dodged a sonic attack at point blank,dodged a meteor storm while weaving through them in space,caught canon fire,humiliated the whizzer
What makes hercules low herald? Namor can do just about anything hercules can,with the addition of flight and energy absorbtion
Why is hercules higher? And why is namor in the same leage as ares?

Originally posted by h1a8
I stated Hulk wasn't a herald years ago. He's the primary reason I have the stance. Hulk could be bfr into space or another state with a simple throw or punch with sufficient force.
He has to be able to get back to the battlefield in a reasonable time (whatever that is).


If they are able to avoid bfr with any level of success then that means they have the speed and reflexes to defend against it (which is at least bullet speed and reflexes). Now when i mention speed im not referring to traveling speed necessarily but at least reflex or hand speed. Otherwise, they couldnt defend against getting hit or thrown or teleported far from the battlefield by a herald since they don't have the sufficient reflex or hand speed.

You mean the reflexes almost every single superhero has?

Hard to think of a hero that hasn't dodged bullets before.

Originally posted by -Pr-
You mean the reflexes almost every single superhero has?

Hard to think of a hero that hasn't dodged bullets before.

I mean from up close. Thing hasn't I don't think and Juggernaut hasnt. But he's not always a hero.

Originally posted by riv6672
Hulk (and Namor) have caught tank rounds in flight. Thats right about bullet speed. Bullets average between 3,500 and 5,000 feet per second; tank rounds usually top out at 3,500. OK then they might meet the speed criterion. But can Hulk react to those speeds from 5ft away?

Originally posted by Genii96
First off,that's wrong
Second,namor has 1 and 3 lol I'm not claiming Namor isn't herald level. He can fly obviously.

Even if they didn't, I still don't see how it disqualifies them. You act like BFRing is easy. It isn't.

Originally posted by -Pr-
Even if they didn't, I still don't see how it disqualifies them. You act like BFRing is easy. It isn't. It's not. But against a herald level character it is. See how easy Juggernaut was bfr several times in comics (once by Hulk).

Lol iow, Cassandra Cain with a jet pack = herald.

Or Deadpool, when he could teleport.

Does Nightcrawler have bullet timing feats? Herald.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Lol iow, Cassandra Cain with a jet pack = herald.

Or Deadpool, when he could teleport.

Does Nightcrawler have bullet timing feats? Herald. no, I explained earlier those are prerequisites and not the only requirements. It's like the test for divergence. The test doesn't prove convergence.

Originally posted by h1a8
It's not. But against a herald level character it is. See how easy Juggernaut was bfr several times in comics (once by Hulk).

Doesn't make him not a Herald, though.

Originally posted by h1a8
I mean from up close. Thing hasn't I don't think and Juggernaut hasnt. But he's not always a hero.

OK then they might meet the speed criterion. But can Hulk react to those speeds from 5ft away?

lol I'm not claiming Namor isn't herald level. He can fly obviously.

You don't make the rules on who's a Herald or not.

Galactus does.

Originally posted by carver9
You don't make the rules on who's a Herald or not. No one does. There is no official list. This is a versus forum. It's just a matter of opinion. If a character can lose to every herald easily with a certain tactic then I wouldn't say they are on the heralds level.

Hal has taken on stronger beings than Namor and beat them down. Like Mongul or General.

Originally posted by -Pr-
Doesn't make him not a Herald, though.

Oh course it does. Herald is just a made up term with no strict definition. The true meaning of the word is a messenger of good news or a person viewed as a sign of what's to happen. The term used here on kmc stems from the 'heralds of Galactus'. People who are herald level (not necessarily a herald in the true sense ) are those who can compete with heralds of Galactus in a fight.

Those who can't are not herald level.

Originally posted by h1a8
Oh course it does. Herald is just a made up term with no strict definition. The true meaning of the word is a messenger of good news or a person viewed as a sign of what's to happen. The term used here on kmc stems from the 'heralds of Galactus'. People who are herald level (not necessarily a herald in the true sense ) are those who can compete with heralds of Galactus in a fight.

Those who can't are not herald level.

You just contradicted yourself.

Originally posted by -Pr-
You just contradicted yourself. lol, I did? My point is that a character has to be able to defend against a herald to a reasonable degree against the bfr tactic in order to contend with them. I admit that I was more narrow minded as I now see there are more ways to defend. Shields, intangibility, invisibility, etc. So I'll just say that to be a Herald level character one must be able to contend well with a herald of Galactus. This includes having some decent form of defense against bfr.

Originally posted by h1a8
lol, I did? My point is that a character has to be able to defend against a herald to a reasonable degree against the bfr tactic in order to contend with them. I admit that I was more narrow minded as I now see there are more ways to defend. Shields, intangibility, invisibility, etc. So I'll just say that to be a Herald level character one must be able to contend well with a herald of Galactus. This includes having some decent form of defense against bfr.

not every herald level character can bfr though.

Why exactly is namor in the same tier an ares and wonderman?

I'm ok with Namor being a low herald, he does have immense power.

Because the thread hasn't been updated in a while, is why.

Originally posted by -Pr-
not every herald level character can bfr though. Every herald of Galactus can bfr. We are basing a herald level character on the premise he/she can contend with an actual herald of Galactus. This is the very definition of Herald level. Otherwise, why use the word "herald" to describe them?

Originally posted by h1a8
Every herald of Galactus can bfr. We are basing a herald level character on the premise he/she can contend with an actual herald of Galactus. This is the very definition of Herald level. Otherwise, why use the word "herald" to describe them?

Invisible Boy can't.

Not sure Air-Walker, Terrax, Nova etc could...

Originally posted by h1a8
Every herald of Galactus can bfr. We are basing a herald level character on the premise he/she can contend with an actual herald of Galactus. This is the very definition of Herald level. Otherwise, why use the word "herald" to describe them? The Spot is high trans.

Originally posted by h1a8
Every herald of Galactus can bfr. We are basing a herald level character on the premise he/she can contend with an actual herald of Galactus. This is the very definition of Herald level. Otherwise, why use the word "herald" to describe them?

On this forum there are more heralds than heralds of galactus, though.

Originally posted by h1a8
Every herald of Galactus can bfr. We are basing a herald level character on the premise he/she can contend with an actual herald of Galactus. This is the very definition of Herald level. Otherwise, why use the word "herald" to describe them?

You also only use their powersets, rather than their character.

Without actually using constructs and just his aura and fists I don't see how Hal wins. Is there an example of him taking down someone like namor with just his fists? He can't be nearly as strong as opponents namor has fought already. Hulk, thor, sentry, herc, surfer, abom, etc? How could he KO him? Is there an example of him tanking 100+ class blows in a conclusive fight to the end without fields or constructs? I doubt it.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Invisible Boy can't.

Not sure Air-Walker, Terrax, Nova etc could... I didn't say all herald level characters can bfr. I said all heralds of Galactus can. You have to be able to contend with heralds of Galactus to be considered herald level.

Heralds of Galactus could bfr by hitting or throwing someone far away.

Originally posted by h1a8
I didn't say all herald level characters can bfr. I said all heralds of Galactus can. You have to be able to contend with heralds of Galactus to be considered herald level.

Heralds of Galactus could bfr by hitting or throwing someone far away.

The guys I named are heralds of Galactus.

Hulk can throw someone pretty far away.

Originally posted by -Pr-
On this forum there are more heralds than heralds of galactus, though. You mean herald level characters. This is true as they can contend with the heralds of Galactus.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
You also only use their powersets, rather than their character. The key is "can", not will.

Originally posted by h1a8
You mean herald level characters. This is true as they can contend with the heralds of Galactus.

The key is "can", not will.

Exactly. Can, not will.

Other herald level characters can contend with the heralds, as they don't BFR.

Originally posted by h1a8
You mean herald level characters. This is true as they can contend with the heralds of Galactus.

The key is "can", not will.

Semantics.

Originally posted by namorsubby
Without actually using constructs and just his aura and fists I don't see how Hal wins. Is there an example of him taking down someone like namor with just his fists? He can't be nearly as strong as opponents namor has fought already. Hulk, thor, sentry, herc, surfer, abom, etc? How could he KO him? Is there an example of him tanking 100+ class blows in a conclusive fight to the end without fields or constructs? I doubt it.
The fight i see referenced is Mongul, but i've never read it.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Exactly. Can, not will.

Other herald level characters can contend with the heralds, as they don't BFR. But they can't contend if they did bfr. It doesn't matter if they do or don't. This is just my take anyway. I wouldn't call myself a herald level being knowing that I can only contend if the Herald of Galactus chooses not to bfr me.

Someone still hasn't told me how it's conceivable that Hal could KO namor with his fists.

Originally posted by namorsubby
Without actually using constructs and just his aura and fists I don't see how Hal wins. Is there an example of him taking down someone like namor with just his fists? He can't be nearly as strong as opponents namor has fought already. Hulk, thor, sentry, herc, surfer, abom, etc? How could he KO him? Is there an example of him tanking 100+ class blows in a conclusive fight to the end without fields or constructs? I doubt it.

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-evrbQNsuT7g/VgVL_oFwrvI/AAAAAAAQaBE/VmXiUFvl16E/s1600/12_11.jpg
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-ECxiXR_T1TY/VgVMAdCd63I/AAAAAAAQaBg/wruxXh7cJbA/s1600/12_12.jpg

Straight up punched Cyborg Superman's jaw off who had ten GL rings at that point.

Looks like theres a construct on his hand that resembles a spiked metal glove because there is. Extremely high end still.

Hal is not physically strong enough to beat Namor without using his ring or protect himself from namor indefinitely without using his ring. There is no evidence to support this.

Originally posted by namorsubby
Looks like theres a construct on his hand that resembles a spiked metal glove because there is. Extremely high end still.

Hal is not physically strong enough to beat Namor without using his ring or protect himself from namor indefinitely without using his ring. There is no evidence to support this.

http://img19.photobucket.com/albums/v58/Desaad/Hal%20Jordan/Hal%20Jordan2/b662ec0c.jpg

http://img19.photobucket.com/albums/v58/Desaad/Hal%20Jordan/Hal%20Jordan2/7bd5fcaa.jpg

http://img19.photobucket.com/albums/v58/Desaad/Hal%20Jordan/Hal%20Jordan2/efcbd6ea.jpg

His armor is a construct. He just said the guy shattered his arm and knee. He hit him with steels hammer apparently(ie not his fists) so hard it broke and still didn't knock him out immediately.


Seriously namor koed the hulk in one shot. He got an ass kicking from voided sentry but was completely unharmed. No. Way.

Full fight. Mongul is yellow so ring can't directly affect him. Hal amps up his strength and was overpowering him untill Mongul distracted him.

http://s5d4.turboimg.net/t1/24380353_3774118-9150265175-34701.jpg http://s5d4.turboimg.net/t1/24380354_3774119-6863991704-34701.jpg http://s5d4.turboimg.net/t1/24380355_3774120-5883034041-34701.jpg http://s5d4.turboimg.net/t1/24380356_3774121-8525883053-34701.jpg http://s5d4.turboimg.net/t1/24380357_3774122-6264092580-34701.jpg http://s5d4.turboimg.net/t1/24380358_3774123-8428610475-34701.jpg http://s5d4.turboimg.net/t1/24380359_3774124-8589469997-34701.jpg http://s5d4.turboimg.net/t1/24380360_3774126-6310026557-34701.jpg http://s5d4.turboimg.net/t1/24380361_3774128-5868577436-34701.jpg

Originally posted by namorsubby
His armor is a construct. He just said the guy shattered his arm and knee. He hit him with steels hammer apparently(ie not his fists) so hard it broke and still didn't knock him out immediately.


Seriously namor koed the hulk in one shot. He got an ass kicking from voided sentry but was completely unharmed. No. Way.
His armor was to support his body. His ring was't able to harm him directly.

He was physically overpowering Mongul too.

During that fight did you see him once hurt him with his fists? No. Everytime he was hit by his opponent he was seriously injured. When he amped he was powerful enough to lift and throw the other guy which had little affect. He was crawling on the floor reaching for a weapon after mogul hit him a few times. A weapon that saved his life. And his constructed armor was holding him together.

Originally posted by namorsubby
During that fight did you see him once hurt him with his fists? No. Everytime he was hit by his opponent he was seriously injured. When he amped he was powerful enough to lift and throw the other guy which had little affect. He was crawling on the floor reaching for a weapon after mogul hit him a few times. A weapon that saved his life. And his constructed armor was holding him together.
Because he was yellow and his hits were bypassing his shields. Even then Hal was taking hits which oneshot KOED Matrix supergirl in the same story.

He hit Mongul with his strength and a hammer since the ring couldn't affect him. Its a pure strength feat.

Thanks for the scans...

He hit him with a weapon, not his fists. He used constructs. He amped to throw him. For all I know the constructed armor could've also amped his strength.

GL is not as strong as namor there is nothing to prove this. GL can't KO Namor with his fists there's nothing to suggest he can especially after all the 100+ class strength opponents namor has contended with.

The OP said that Hal was allowed to amp himself, though.

And with amping but no constructs is Hal stronger than any of the strongest opponents namor has already faced according to feats? I don't believe so.

Originally posted by namorsubby
And with amping but no constructs is Hal stronger than any of the strongest opponents namor has already faced according to feats? I don't believe so.

He doesn't need to be, though. It isn't like Namor is Hulk level.

I don't see Namor breaking Hal's personal shields, but also I don't see Hal KOing Namor with out constructs

Originally posted by -Pr-
He doesn't need to be, though. It isn't like Namor is Hulk level.
Yes,not like he hasn't stalemated him so many times.or outright beat his ass in their fights and......oh wait!,never mind

^^^Haha.
Thats why used the term Hulk level...

Originally posted by Genii96
Yes,not like he hasn't stalemated him so many times.or outright beat his ass in their fights and......oh wait!,never mind

So you think Namor is a high herald? Really?

Semantics. Arguing of.

You can debate his level all you want theres still no way Hal should be strong enough to knock him out.

^^^I have to agree.
The point is, Namor CAN affect GL with his blows; he's plenty strong enough.

Why can't Hal be strong enough to knock him out if he amps?

Besides there being no evidence that hes that strong even if he amps?

Originally posted by namorsubby
Besides there being no evidence that hes that strong even if he amps?

Strong enough to fight Mongul isn't strong enough?

He didn't injure mogul with his fists he did it by constructing armor and using steels hammer. Important details to mention.

Originally posted by namorsubby
He didn't injure mogul with his fists he did it by constructing armor and using steels hammer. Important details to mention.

So the part where he picks him up and ****s him across the room isn't strength?

His armour doesn't protect him against Mongul's yellow hands. And wielding the hammer still requires strength to be able to hit Mongul that hard.

Lifting and throwing mongul without significantly injuring him does not make him strong enough to KO Namor. He probably amped with the constructed armor because I've never seen a strength feat from him alone worth a damn and relative to this match. It's still a weapon though. And he doesn't have one in this scenario

Originally posted by namorsubby
Lifting and throwing mongul without significantly injuring him does not make him strong enough to KO Namor. He probably amped with the constructed armor because I've never seen a strength feat from him alone worth a damn and relative to this match. It's still a weapon though. And he doesn't have one in this scenario Agreed that hitting someone with a blunt weapon amps hitting power over hitting with fists. But not by that much. We can still prove strength by the feat. You are acting if strength can't be approximated if someone damages something with a blunt object. It can. Thor shattered the top of mountains after slamming into Exitar with the hammer. Surely that proves strength right?

Anyway one shotting Mongol with a blunt weapon is equivalent to being able to damage Namor significantly with fists alone. Especially since Mongol is very far above Namor.

Originally posted by namorsubby
Lifting and throwing mongul without significantly injuring him does not make him strong enough to KO Namor. He probably amped with the constructed armor because I've never seen a strength feat from him alone worth a damn and relative to this match. It's still a weapon though. And he doesn't have one in this scenario

So because you say he "probably" did something, we disregard that he went toe to toe with a herald while injured?

Rings can and have made biological changes to Lanterns bodies before. Armour wouldn't protect him from yellow fists either. Hell, it even shows him without armour throwing Mongul.

Originally posted by -Pr-
So you think Namor is a high herald? Really?
Nope,but neither is hulk,I am saying he is at hulk's level,because his feats say so,and I am pretty sure normal hulk isn't a high herald. Not to mention,his enchanted adamantium trident that oneshotted hulk when it was used to stab him,and allows namor several tricks

Originally posted by Genii96
Nope,but neither is hulk,I am saying he is at hulk's level,because his feats say so,and I am pretty sure normal hulk isn't a high herald. Not to mention,his enchanted adamantium trident that oneshotted hulk when it was used to stab him,and allows namor several tricks

... Hulk has been called the most powerful being on the planet too many times (while having insane fts) for him to not be a high Herald.

Originally posted by Genii96
Nope,but neither is hulk,I am saying he is at hulk's level,because his feats say so,and I am pretty sure normal hulk isn't a high herald. Not to mention,his enchanted adamantium trident that oneshotted hulk when it was used to stab him,and allows namor several tricks His feats don't say so. His feats in the water is a maybe though.
But outside the water he is thing level. Under the water he is close to Hercules level which is under Hulk level.

Originally posted by carver9
... Hulk has been called the most powerful being on the planet too many times (while having insane fts) for him to not be a high Herald. Hulk can be easily bfr or assaulted from a safe distance. He can never be Herald level.

Originally posted by Genii96
Nope,but neither is hulk,I am saying he is at hulk's level,because his feats say so,and I am pretty sure normal hulk isn't a high herald. Not to mention,his enchanted adamantium trident that oneshotted hulk when it was used to stab him,and allows namor several tricks

He doesn't have his trident in this fight. Nor can he use any tricks.

You really say average Namor is in the same class as average Hulk?

Originally posted by h1a8
His feats don't say so. His feats in the water is a maybe though.
But outside the water he is thing level. Under the water he is close to Hercules level which is under Hulk level.

Originally posted by h1a8
Hulk can be easily bfr or assaulted from a safe distance. He can never be Herald level.

Wut.

Silly question but, is anyone denying the fact This is a daitly even fight?

Yeah, Hal gets one-shotted.

Originally posted by riv6672
Silly question but, is anyone denying the fact This is a daitly even fight?

If you mean fairly, then yes, you can argue that either man can win. So not THAT uneven.

LAL @ this being something worth debating. Jordan murks Namor.

Hulk is a high herald tier level here? I thought he was mid herald tier

Originally posted by -Pr-
He doesn't have his trident in this fight. Nor can he use any tricks.

You really say average Namor is in the same class as average Hulk?





Wut.
I never said he can use his trident here nor his tricks...define 'average hulk' cuz I am damn sure namor could match hulk as he has done every frickin time they have fought,unless u mean 'high end feat' hulk?
I mentioned the trident as his standard equipment in a nrmal fight,not as his fight here

Originally posted by carver9
... Hulk has been called the most powerful being on the planet too many times (while having insane fts) for him to not be a high Herald.
Hulk hasn't been called 'the most powerful being' too many times,on the other hand namoe having strength unrivaled underwater has been stated multiple times

Originally posted by -Pr-
If you mean fairly, then yes, you can argue that either man can win. So not THAT uneven.
Thats all i needed to know!

Originally posted by Genii96
Hulk is a high herald tier level here? I thought he was mid herald tier


I never said he can use his trident here nor his tricks...define 'average hulk' cuz I am damn sure namor could match hulk as he has done every frickin time they have fought,unless u mean 'high end feat' hulk?
I mentioned the trident as his standard equipment in a nrmal fight,not as his fight here


Hulk hasn't been called 'the most powerful being' too many times,on the other hand namoe having strength unrivaled underwater has been stated multiple times

I'm honestly not sure if you're underrating Hulk or overrating Namor.