Click HERE to see this thread with all of the graphics, features, and links.

http://www.jesus-is-savior.com/False%20Religions/Wicca%20&%20Witchcraft/anton_lavey.htm
This person thinks so

I did not know Star had his own website.

But seriously they have quotes from people quite literally telling them what "satanism" truly means and how Satan isn't an actual being. They just dismiss them with utter nonsense.

Originally posted by Surtur
I did not know Star had his own website.

But seriously they have quotes from people quite literally telling them what "satanism" truly means and how Satan isn't an actual being. They just dismiss them with utter nonsense.

That is just an atheistic group. Much different than theistic satanism.

Originally posted by Surtur
I did not know Star had his own website.

But seriously they have quotes from people quite literally telling them what "satanism" truly means and how Satan isn't an actual being. They just dismiss them with utter nonsense.


Lavey's wife telling people that Lavey actually did believe in Satan as an actual being and writing so in his biography is "utter nonsense"?

Originally posted by bluewaterrider
Lavey's wife telling people that Lavey actually did believe in Satan as an actual being and writing so in his biography is "utter nonsense"?

We call it utter marketing 131

Originally posted by bluewaterrider
Lavey's wife telling people that Lavey actually did believe in Satan as an actual being and writing so in his biography is "utter nonsense"?

So just to be clear the wife wrote the autobiography and claimed he did believe in Satan. Well gee, that proves something I guess.

Even though it doesn't actually change what I said about Satanism.

Originally posted by bluewaterrider
Lavey's wife telling people that Lavey actually did believe in Satan as an actual being and writing so in his biography is "utter nonsense"?

I can post multiple quotes of Lavey denouncing and mocking all religion, and his wife's words don't contradict the fact the man was an atheist.

Originally posted by Surtur
I did not know Star had his own website.

But seriously they have quotes from people quite literally telling them what "satanism" truly means and how Satan isn't an actual being. They just dismiss them with utter nonsense.

You miss the point. If Lavey's own wife disagrees, and validly so, then Lavey was NOT telling you what "satanism" truly means. He was, in that case, lying.

If she doesn't validly disagree, then she, being a Satanist, was lying.
Proving that Satanists lie.


Or perhaps you're calling the idea of anything whatsoever being supernatural "utter nonsense" and just worded your response poorly?

Originally posted by carthage
I can post multiple quotes of Lavey denouncing and mocking all religion ...

I'm sure you can. You'd expect a Satanist to denounce and mock Abrahamic religions by definition, and Christianity especially.


Originally posted by carthage
his wife's words don't contradict the fact the man was an atheist.


I do not understand you when you say this.

Perhaps you are taking the stance of Richard Dawkins, i.e. that the monotheist is an atheist regarding any deity other than his own?

Otherwise "My husband Anton Lavey believed in and worshipped Satan as an actual being" (or whatever was written in Lavey's biography) does, indeed, contradict the supposition Lavey did not believe in an actual Satan.

Originally posted by bluewaterrider
I'm sure you can. You'd expect a Satanist to denounce and mock Abrahamic religions by definition, and Christianity especially.


Don't get me wrong, it is odd an atheist would identify with Satanism. He should just be an atheist without using religious figures.




I do not understand you when you say this.

Perhaps you are taking the stance of Richard Dawkins, i.e. that the monotheist is an atheist regarding any deity other than his own?

Otherwise "My husband Anton Lavey believed in and worshipped Satan as an actual being" (or whatever was written in Lavey's biography) does, indeed, contradict the supposition Lavey did not believe in an actual Satan.

Why would he lie about his beliefs? There are many Satanists that actually worship Satan/Lucifer. They practice black magic/animal sacrifice, etc. In fact, these groups despise Lavey's atheistic Satanism. Why would Lavey worship Satan privately and tell his followers the devil doesn't exist?

Don't get me wrong, it is odd that a professed atheist would want to identify with Satanism, even if it is just in name only. He could have founded an atheistic society without religious overtones.

Originally posted by Tattoos N Scars
Why would he lie about his beliefs? There are many Satanists that actually worship Satan/Lucifer. They practice black magic/animal sacrifice, etc. In fact, these groups despise Lavey's atheistic Satanism. Why would Lavey worship Satan privately and tell his followers the devil doesn't exist?


Well, for starters, he'd appear saner if he told people that, attract more followers, and have more influence.

Note the kind of circles Anton Lavey actually travelled in, how many celebrities and men of means he knew and had influence with.

I personally haven't read the LaVey biography, so I don't even know if the claim is true, or taken out of context, but even if the widow had said that, I am not sure why we would default to taking her word over his words and actions during his lifetime.

Originally posted by Tattoos N Scars
Don't get me wrong, it is odd that a professed atheist would want to identify with Satanism, even if it is just in name only. He could have founded an atheistic society without religious overtones.

It was the 60's, people did weird shit.

Originally posted by Bardock42
I personally haven't read the LaVey biography, so I don't even know if the claim is true, or taken out of context, but even if the widow had said that, I am not sure why we would default to taking her word over his words and actions during his lifetime.

Well, 2 things again here:

1. Anton Lavey and his wife, if the 2 had any semblance of a relationship, was privy to far more of his actions than you or I. Far more than got published. If you're looking for a good source of information, unless their marriage was pure hell, the spouse is a better place to start than just about anyone else.

2. Anton Lavey was noted as a con-man. Read the Wikipedia entry for his daughter Zeena Schreck, for corroboration. In other words, he had a reputation for being dishonest. It's not like we're talking about Abe Lincoln here ...

Fair enough, I still doubt it. But I don't even care enough to read up on the biography.

At any rate, even if LaVey was someone who believed in Satan as a real figure, the Church of Satan he founded does most explicitly not.

The church of satan can continue on without LaVey

The Church of Satan (LaVeyan Satanism) is a fake cult. It's viewed as a mockery by many major Satanic sects. It was established by an atheist with Messianic Complex and ADD disorder. His church is no different to the modern Christian cults we have today (ex. Westboro Baptist, Iglesia ni Cristo, Ang Dating Daan, etc.) He was looking for a means to attain fame and fortune.

His wife is doing the same. She wants LaVey to stay relevant hence she's lying to the public that her husband was a worshipper of Satan, just to stir some controversy in hoping the book becomes a bestseller.

As regards to LaVey being evil, he is no different to any other businessman. He wanted fame and fortune and he achieved it. He found success by establishing his scam religion.

Anton LaVey: Legend and Reality

Originally posted by bluewaterrider
1. Anton Lavey and his wife, if the 2 had any semblance of a relationship, was privy to far more of his actions than you or I. Far more than got published. If you're looking for a good source of information, unless their marriage was pure hell, the spouse is a better place to start than just about anyone else.

So you feel the fact she is telling people the dude thought Satan was a real thing means they had a good marriage? When he went out of his way to make sure people thought otherwise? Strange.

Also if the guy truly believed in Satan then the marriage probably was HELL. Get it? You get it?



If he is a con-man then how can we trust anything he said to anyone? Whether it be his wife or anyone else? Con-men tend to lie a lot, even to those closest to them.

Though you still realize if he was conning people into believing he didn't believe in Satan then that is irrelevant to the overall views of the church of Satan, right? It doesn't mean everyone involved actually believes. The quote this entire discussion started off of was not me talking specifically about the beliefs of one man, but the church.