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http://i1149.photobucket.com/albums/o589/lupinw45/GT_zpsix6xgvyt.jpg

vs

http://i1149.photobucket.com/albums/o589/lupinw45/WR_zpswj9m7tgg.jpg

Uatu... If only because of his battle with Aron. /shrug

Aren't Watchers supposed to be in Galactus's power range?

If not a notch below.

Originally posted by Flyattractor
Aren't Watchers supposed to be in Galactus's power range? Yeah, they're supposed to be quite powerful -- but because of their "we do not interfere" vow, Uatu doesn't exactly have a plethora of high-end feats under his belt. Lots of accolades/lip-service, but not a whole lot of action.

Uatu beating Aron was very impressive, though, given the latter's showings... But I don't remember off-hand if there were extenuating circumstances behind that victory..? If I remember, I'll look when I get home.

Their respect thread are pretty good.

You mean before all of the links went dead? Yes, it was.

True Guy would be good now with his pics

Originally posted by Galan007
Uatu... If only because of his battle with Aron. /shrug
Nope.

Ganthet wins.

Watcher wins.

Originally posted by abhilegend
Nope.

Ganthet wins.


See, this was my first thought too. Ganthet is one of the more powerful members of his race, BUT......my gut still says Uatu.

People sleep on Watchers because they are mostly passive but they do have some respectable feats/fights to their name. Too bad their respect thread's links aren't all working. Some very good stuff there.

During Uatu's fight with Aron, they battled across "the infinite rivers of reality", which ultimately ended with Uatu converting Aron into pure energy -- the same Aron who beat Molecule Man without much trouble. Granted, Owen was unable to control organic molecules at the time, but he was still regarded as one of the most powerful beings in existence.

If Uatu cuts loose like that here, I think he wins. If not, Ganthet could take it.

Originally posted by Galan007
During Uatu's fight with Aron, they battled across "the infinite rivers of reality", which ultimately ended with Uatu converting Aron into pure energy -- the same Aron who beat Molecule Man without much trouble. Granted, Owen was unable to control organic molecules at the time, but he was still regarded as one of the most powerful beings in existence.

If Uatu cuts loose like that here, I think he wins. If not, Ganthet could take it.
And then got beaten up by Rulk.



And three Guardians cutting loose can beat Old Timer with the power of whole CPB and five Guardians can contain entire living galaxy.

Heck, even Xavier and Phoenix have fought on infinite planes of reality. That's just a cool word to use for writers.

Uatu isn't without low showings(though neither is Ganthet )

But when he truly cuts loose(which he's rarely done), we've seen what Uatu can do. He can be damned impressive, in all honesty.

Originally posted by abhilegend
Heck, even Xavier and Phoenix have fought on infinite planes of reality. That's just a cool word to use for writers.

I was just going to mention this.

Also regarding the version of Molecule Man that Aaron beat, not only COULDN'T he manipulate organic matter he also didn't have any of his time/space manipulation powers. He was also being controlled by Puppet Master!

^ It was NEVER alluded to that Owen's powers were dampened due to PM's mind-control. And again: Owen was still regarded as one of the most powerful beings in existence in the very same arc, yet Aron beat him fairly easily.

You can downplay all you want, but that IS impressive. *How* impressive is the only part that is debatable.

Originally posted by Galan007
Uatu isn't without low showings(though neither is Ganthet )

But when he truly cuts loose(which he's rarely done), we've seen what Uatu can do. He can be damned impressive, in all honesty.
So can be Ganthet. He beat down Kyle channeling every lantern ring and casually destroyed hundreds of GLs while nearly powerless.

Originally posted by zopzop

I was just going to mention this.

Also regarding the version of Molecule Man that Aaron beat, not only COULDN'T he manipulate organic matter he also didn't have any of his time/space manipulation powers. He was also being controlled by Puppet Master!
Add Starhawk and Korvac there too.

Originally posted by Galan007
^ It was NEVER alluded to that Owen's powers were dampened due to PM's mind-control. And again: Owen was still regarded as one of the most powerful beings in existence in the very same arc, yet Aron beat him fairly easily.

You can downplay all you want, but that IS impressive. *How* impressive is the only part that is debatable.
Klaw beat him during that time too.

*sighs* Yet still no mention of Ganthet's low showings, eh? Lol, not doing this again. It's obvious where it's going.

You and zop can have fun.

Originally posted by Galan007
*sighs* Yet still no mention of Ganthet's low showings, eh? Lol, not doing this again. It's obvious where it's going.

You and zop can have fun.
I'm not knocking Aaron or Uatu, I'm just pointing out that that was probably the most FEEBLE version of Molecule Man ever and that other writers have made use of that same phrasing used during the Aaaron/Uatu fight.

Originally posted by Galan007
*sighs* Yet still no mention of Ganthet's low showings, eh? Lol, not doing this again. It's obvious where it's going.

You and zop can have fun.
Uh he was beaten by Krona?

srug

Originally posted by Galan007
*sighs* Yet still no mention of Ganthet's low showings, eh? Lol, not doing this again. It's obvious where it's going.

You and zop can have fun. It is all abhi knows.

Ganthet has been outperformed by Kyle and Kilowog on two occasions (against the Xadai and in the blind instance iirc), he destroys the universe) and containing the quantum singularity. Since then he's stomped Parallax empowered Kilowog, John and Guy (one of whom solo'd the entire JLA), was destroying dozens of GLS in a weakened state until Mogo put him down and beat Kyle w/6 rings all the while withstanding Zamarons' blasts; he's also created an entire color of the emotional spectrum along with sayd

Still I wouldn't place the guardians on the same level as the watchers. Uatu's power level is more towards Odin and Galactus/Celestials on several occasions; since he doesn't interfere much, small details like nullifying Galactus' telepathy, was also owned by a regular GL who was in turn defeated by a rookie GL. But that was pre-Rebirth and he still had pretty impressive showings like surviving entropy (the one that his What If fight, and the Watchers/Celestials war along with various statements and several implications do seem to portray him as such.

Guardians have actually very impressive collective feats but individually id definitely put them below the watchers. Uatu wins here imo.

i agree--uatu and odin are very close imo, in general at least. yes, both have lesser feats, ganthet does too. i really don't know who would take this. ganthet's better feats would put him in this tier as well. no one sweeps. hrm, i really don't know. i think i'd chicken out and call a split.

Originally posted by operator616
Ganthet has been outperformed by Kyle and Kilowog on two occasions (against the Xadai and in the blind instance iirc), he destroys the universe) and containing the quantum singularity. Since then he's stomped Parallax empowered Kilowog, John and Guy (one of whom solo'd the entire JLA), was destroying dozens of GLS in a weakened state until Mogo put him down and beat Kyle w/6 rings all the while withstanding Zamarons' blasts; he's also created an entire color of the emotional spectrum along with sayd

Still I wouldn't place the guardians on the same level as the watchers. Uatu's power level is more towards Odin and Galactus/Celestials on several occasions; since he doesn't interfere much, small details like nullifying Galactus' telepathy, was also owned by a regular GL who was in turn defeated by a rookie GL. But that was pre-Rebirth and he still had pretty impressive showings like surviving entropy (the one that his What If fight, and the Watchers/Celestials war along with various statements and several implications do seem to portray him as such.

Guardians have actually very impressive collective feats but individually id definitely put them below the watchers. Uatu wins here imo.
By that token Ganthet is called near Spectre level in power which is beyond Galactus/Celestials or Odin in power.

mmm

Originally posted by abhilegend
By that token Ganthet is called near Spectre level in power which is beyond Galactus/Celestials or Odin in power.

mmm

My post got ****ed up after I edited it for some reason. Here's the correct wording of my post:
Originally posted by operator616
Ganthet has been outperformed by Kyle and Kilowog on two occasions (against the Xadai and in the blind instance iirc), he was also owned by a regular GL who was in turn defeated by a rookie GL. But that was pre-Rebirth and he still had pretty impressive showings like surviving entropy (the one that destroys the universe) and containing the quantum singularity. Since then he's stomped Parallax empowered Kilowog, John and Guy (one of whom solo'd the entire JLA), was destroying dozens of GLS in a weakened state until Mogo put him down and beat Kyle w/6 rings all the while withstanding Zamarons' blasts; he's also created an entire color of the emotional spectrum along with sayd

Still I wouldn't place the guardians on the same level as the watchers. Uatu's power level is more towards Odin and Galactus/Celestials on several occasions; since he doesn't interfere much, small details like nullifying Galactus' telepathy, his What If fight, and the Watchers/Celestials war along with various statements and several implications do seem to portray him as such.

Guardians have actually very impressive collective feats but individually id definitely put them below the watchers. Uatu wins here imo.

As you can see I didn't just use statements to base my opinion.

Moreover, Ganthet wasn't just called near Spectre's level, rather the spectre's power was implied to be nothing compared to the guardians'. This is obviously a hyperbole and shouldn't be taken seriously.

More importantly though, in Blackest Night, Ganthet said that if he joined the Parallax/Spectre fight he would be obliterated as an afterthought.

Originally posted by operator616
My post got ****ed up after I edited it for some reason. Here's the correct wording of my post:


As you can see I didn't just use statements to base my opinion.

Moreover, Ganthet wasn't just called near Spectre's level, rather the spectre's power was implied to be nothing compared to the guardians'. This is obviously a hyperbole and shouldn't be taken seriously.

More importantly though, in Blackest Night, Ganthet said that if he joined the Parallax/Spectre fight he would be obliterated as an afterthought.

Ganthet has beastly feats himself.

And in Blackest Night he was called near Spectre level too.

Frankly, him and Sayd creating blue Lantern power battery out of their own power is enough to beat Uatu.

Originally posted by abhilegend
Ganthet has beastly feats himself.

And in Blackest Night he was called near Spectre level too.

Frankly, him and Sayd creating blue Lantern power battery out of their own power is enough to beat Uatu. Not based off Uatu's consistent portrayal and power. Frankly, Uatu wins.

Originally posted by abhilegend
Ganthet has beastly feats himself.

And in Blackest Night he was called near Spectre level too.

Frankly, him and Sayd creating blue Lantern power battery out of their own power is enough to beat Uatu.

Do you have the scans of the Spectre incident?

Yeah, but Ganthets lantern corps is like, the shittiest corps.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Yeah, but Ganthets lantern corps is like, the shittiest corps.
Seriously. Are they even considered herald level?

Why not? Saint Walker and one another Blue Lantern turned a red sun into blue sun and reduce its age by 8.6 billion years.

http://i.imgur.com/EMhw4Js.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/xMOCPAY.jpg

In comparison, Surfer was explicitly not able to change a sun by his own power and needed extra power from some ships to stabilize the sun for mere 1000 years.

http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k508/abhilegend/Marvel/th_SilverSurferv3103-07.jpg http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k508/abhilegend/Marvel/th_SilverSurferv3103-08.jpg

http://s6d5.turboimg.net/t1/29646404_SS_v3_103_15a.jpg http://s6d5.turboimg.net/t1/29646405_SS_v3_103_16a.jpg http://s6d5.turboimg.net/t1/29646406_SS_v3_103_17a.jpg

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Yeah, but Ganthets lantern corps is like, the shittiest corps.

Their offensive prowess is extremely limited in comparison to the other Corps. They are best suited as GL batteries.

the blue ring's capabilities have been inconsistent, they were first introduced as not having any direct offensive capablitiles. they were capable of supercharging green and depowering yellow along with healing capabilities and the only one that can negate red plasma and curing a red lantern without the user dying, later on however they suddenly developed full blown offensive capabilities, they were creating constructs and shooting energy beams just as easily as the GLs could from what I remember, and after that they also developed the ability to supercharge other colors as well.

However, creating a color of an emotional spectrum isn't necessarily an abstract level feat, since we've seen Atrocitus do that by harnessing the blood of the inversion beings. Also Larfleeze packs the power of the entire orange corps, yet he's in the low skyfather range.

Originally posted by operator616
the blue ring's capabilities have been inconsistent, they were first introduced as not having any direct offensive capablitiles. they were capable of supercharging green and depowering yellow along with healing capabilities and the only one that can negate red plasma and curing a red lantern without the user dying, later on however they suddenly developed full blown offensive capabilities, they were creating constructs and shooting energy beams just as easily as the GLs could from what I remember, and after that they also developed the ability to supercharge other colors as well.

However, creating a color of an emotional spectrum isn't necessarily an abstract level feat, since we've seen Atrocitus do that by harnessing the blood of the inversion beings. Also Larfleeze packs the power of the entire orange corps, yet he's in the low skyfather range.
Atrocitus did by the power of Five Inversions who are galactic level threats and Larfleeze has actually defeated beings who laid waste to an entire universe.

And he rarely uses his full power anyway. That's why his ring can go from 100% to 100000% in an instant.

We have also seen yellow battery capable of destroying entire milky way galaxy. So yes, creating a power battery is absolutely skyfather level.

Originally posted by abhilegend
Atrocitus did by the power of Five Inversions who are galactic level threats and Larfleeze has actually defeated beings who laid waste to an entire universe.

And he rarely uses his full power anyway. That's why his ring can go from 100% to 100000% in an instant.

We have also seen yellow battery capable of destroying entire milky way galaxy. So yes, creating a power battery is absolutely skyfather level.

Remind me again what feats do the five inversions have under their belt? I don't recall anything apart from being beaten by the guardians. And yes, Atrocitus harnessed their blood and created the battery, it's not an abstract feat by any means.

Those beings you are talking about -- it was outright stated that it took them millions of years to waste the universe due to the war and it was their entire race who did that, not only those of the house of tuath-dan. Although I must admit that LF was quite impressive in that series. But still let's not forget that he was beaten by sinestro, Hammond and Hal along with the other GLs. He's a low skyfather, above Thanos id say, but not anything more than that.

My whole point is that the power of the corps' varies. The GLC power battery was stated to be able to destroy the whole universe, not just the galaxy. So evidently, not all the batteries are equal.

Originally posted by operator616
Remind me again what feats do the five inversions have under their belt? I don't recall anything apart from being beaten by the guardians. And yes, Atrocitus harnessed their blood and created the battery, it's not an abstract feat by any means.


They conquered entire galaxies and from their power a skyfather level weapon was created.

I mean where do you rank red lanterns? And how powerful is the red Lantern battery?

I'm quite sure that's not a feat many skyfathers can replicate.

And Hal killed Krona by himself and made Nekron his *****.

You're too fixated on the low showings. And it's retconned how he is connected with the battery like Guardians. Not that he is having the entire power of the battery within him all the time.

Heck, Invictus alone was skyfather level and Larfleeze killed his entire race.



And yet, each power in the spectrum is stated to be equal.

And no, a central power battery is at least skyfather level weapon.

Otherwise the respective Lanterns would be like Street level beings.

Originally posted by abhilegend
They conquered entire galaxies and from their power a skyfather level weapon was created.

I mean where do you rank red lanterns? And how powerful is the red Lantern battery?


And how exactly was that achieved? I don't recall at all them doing that on panel. It was most likely a statement. Conquering a galaxy instantly and over time are two entirely different things.

In regards to the other corps, it depends. Because the different nature of the emotional spectrum some colors are simply a bad match up against others, most notably a red lantern vs a green lantern because of the red's capabilities to drain GL's when they're in close proximity (even though it has been ignored in some cases, and even if GLs have defeated RLs before). In turn however, a blue ring user would do well against a red ring user (in general) because the blue light can extinguish red, and a combination of blue and green can outright detonate a red ring. Against any other ring users, the red should be quite effective because of their lethal plasma. The battery however, it's unknown how powerful it is, as it hasn't been mentioned from what I recall.

Originally posted by abhilegend


I'm quite sure that's not a feat many skyfathers can replicate.


That's debatable. And honestly, individually any skyfather should be more than a match against one of the house, but LF has handled a multidude of them simultaneously and again - it's extremely impressive, not denying that.

Originally posted by abhilegend

And Hal killed Krona by himself and made Nekron his *****.

You're too fixated on the low showings. And it's retconned how he is connected with the battery like Guardians. Not that he is having the entire power of the battery within him all the time.

Heck, Invictus alone was skyfather level and Larfleeze killed his entire race.


Hammond tanked his blasts and ate his lantern. Sinestro also handled him quite easily.

Invictus had the power of every angel of the vega system, he was more powerful than the others.

Originally posted by abhilegend
And yet, each power in the spectrum is stated to be equal.

And no, a central power battery is at least skyfather level weapon.

Otherwise the respective Lanterns would be like Street level beings.

It's inconsistent. Sinestro has tapped into the power of CPB but got defeated by Hal back in the old days.

It's still extremely impressive though, but unquantifiable. You can't say for sure it's an abstract level feat

Either way, agree to disagree.

Originally posted by operator616
the blue ring's capabilities have been inconsistent, they were first introduced as not having any direct offensive capablitiles. they were capable of supercharging green and depowering yellow along with healing capabilities and the only one that can negate red plasma and curing a red lantern without the user dying, later on however they suddenly developed full blown offensive capabilities, they were creating constructs and shooting energy beams just as easily as the GLs could from what I remember Blue Lanterns have always been capable of offensive attacks and whatnot -- they just rarely use their rings in that manner because they are a very peaceful Corps.

And many of those one-off/esoteric abilities popped-up after Johns' run ended. Same with the Indigo Corps. Seems like other writers deviated from Johns' 'plan' a bit, lol.

Originally posted by Galan007
Blue Lanterns have always been capable of offensive attacks and whatnot -- they just rarely use their rings in that manner because they are a very peaceful Corps.

And many of those one-off/esoteric abilities popped-up after Johns' run ended. Same with the Indigo Corps. Seems like other writers deviated from Johns' 'plan' a bit, lol.

Agreed. That and because they need to be in close proximity to a GL to use their offensive capabilities. But I was talking about their capabilities without being in the vicinity of a GL. For instance, when Kyle became a blue lantern he was able to use offensive attacks without being in close proximity to a GL which is contradictory to what has been established. Also when the reach attacked, although that one was more of a revelation than a contradiction. But like you said, other writers deviated.

Originally posted by operator616
And how exactly was that achieved? I don't recall at all them doing that on panel. It was most likely a statement. Conquering a galaxy instantly and over time are two entirely different things.

They were powerful enough to conquer entire galaxy and kill multiple Guardians. Their defeat released



There are other indicators for their power as well. And they are herald level on average.





Nope, not debatable.

And yes, its impressive.





False. Hammond was amped by Krona to seek out the Ophidian. Johns has a hardon for Sinestro anyway.



Larf defeated him at the height of his power.

http://i.imgur.com/8BPBf8r.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/gaHyoEG.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/oEcJEIL.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/oACZBhR.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/TmhkkmT.jpg






Wrong. It was Old Timer's power which allowed Hal to defeat Sinestro and the battery would've destroyed universe in that issue.



I'm saying its a skyfather level feat.



Ok.

Originally posted by abhilegend

There are other indicators for their power as well. And they are herald level on average.



Seems about right, I thought you were asking their ranking in regards to the other corps.

Originally posted by abhilegend
False. Hammond was amped by Krona to seek out the Ophidian. Johns has a hardon for Sinestro anyway.


Krona merely helped him escape captivity. I don't recall him being amped. Scan?

Originally posted by abhilegend
Larf defeated him at the height of his power.

http://i.imgur.com/8BPBf8r.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/gaHyoEG.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/oEcJEIL.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/oACZBhR.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/TmhkkmT.jpg


That's beside the point. You were the one who said that Larfleeze killed Invictus' entire race, and Invictus alone was skyfather, thereby implying that Larfleeze killed an entire race of skyafthers.

My response was that Invictus was far more powerful than the others since he had their combined power.

http://imgur.com/xPq1ztw

So he didn't kill a race of skyfathers. That was my point.

Originally posted by abhilegend

Wrong. It was Old Timer's power which allowed Hal to defeat Sinestro and the battery would've destroyed universe in that issue.


You're the one who's wrong. OT merely restored Hal back to health after which he defeated Sinestro single-handedly.

http://imgur.com/ERQBPFq
http://imgur.com/2Z4rDNi
http://imgur.com/NiuN8sv

Agreed on the second part, ive always considered CPB as universal level. In a later instance, Hal has referred to it as a contained universe of photonic power. Also in a GL one-shot it was stated that the CPB houses the "universal will" which brought everything into existence.

Originally posted by operator616
Agreed on the second part, ive always considered CPB as universal level. In a later instance, Hal has referred to it as a contained universe of photonic power. Also in a GL one-shot it was stated that the CPB houses the "universal will" which brought everything into existence. That was also one of the key elements behind Will World:
http://i.imgur.com/d8fVTva.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/Dd0ENJ5.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/R4pGxpr.jpg

Originally posted by Galan007
That was also one of the key elements behind Will World:
http://i.imgur.com/d8fVTva.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/Dd0ENJ5.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/R4pGxpr.jpg

Yeah, Willworld is the one which I was referring to.

Originally posted by operator616
Yeah, Willworld is the one which I was referring to.

Excellent read.

Originally posted by abhilegend
Klaw beat him during that time too.

Quit lowballing. It's beneath u

Originally posted by operator616
Seems about right, I thought you were asking their ranking in regards to the other corps.

Ok.





He had been amped as well. Hammond wasn't able to even take Hal's blasts under Johns and Larf was shown quite above him.





I never implied anything like that.



Ok. Defeating Invictus is skyfather level though.





Wut? He gave Hal a portion of his power and said that he will be renewed and recharged.

Not that he was just at full power. And he defeated Sinestro by absorbing all the power from CPB and not defeating sinestro straight up.





So Guardians are skyfathers alright. High one at that.

Originally posted by abhilegend
Why not? Saint Walker and one another Blue Lantern turned a red sun into blue sun and reduce its age by 8.6 billion years.
]

Space cheese though, amirite? How do their fight feats compare?