Women Born into Islam Nation vs Judao Christian Nation

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Time-Immemorial
Are women more likely to succeed being born in a Muslim nation vs a Judao Christian nation?

Surtur
Obviously the Christian nation. In a lot of countries with a majority Muslim population women are barely seen as people.

In some of these countries if a woman gets raped she either needs to marry her rapist or go to prison lol.

Right now Islam is the religion most incompatible with western society.

Time-Immemorial
So why is there a vote in the first category?

StiltmanFTW
Welcome back, Time.

JKBart
Originally posted by Surtur
Obviously the Christian nation. In a lot of countries with a majority Muslim population women are barely seen as people.

In some of these countries if a woman gets raped she either needs to marry her rapist or go to prison lol.

Right now Islam is the religion most incompatible with western society.

nothing more to add

Time-Immemorial
So people are actually voting and saying women have a higher chance of success in Islamic nations.laughing out loud

Lord Lucien
I voted Islam. Because my definition of a woman's success involves staying at home where she belongs and not driving.












j/k it actually involves cutting off their clitoris.

Surtur
So that is one vote accounted for. Who are the other 2 people for voted for Islam?

MF DELPH
I think the main determining factor is whether it's a 1st world nation versus a 3rd world nation rather than whether the nation is primarily Christian or Islamic. An Islamic woman in Qatar, Indonesia, or Pakistan is likely going to have better prospects than a Christian woman in Uganda or Zimbabwe. Not all Islamic Countries practice Sharia Law and oppress women. For example, Indonesia had a female president (Megawati Sukarnoputri) a little over a decade ago and women there are allowed to receive an education, work, drive, etc. Pakistan had a female Prime Minister as far back as the 80s. The more oppressive regimes like Saudi Arabia, Afghanistan, and the like are terrible though. If we're talking only 1st World Nations like the US or France and comparing them to Saudi Arabia and Afghanistan then of course the contrast is apparent but when you go further down the line those theocracies aren't the only examples of Islamic States.

Also, I didn't vote. It's a loaded question.

Surtur
But Indonesia is the country where they stick their fingers in a womans vagina to make sure she is a virgin before she is allowed to join the army.

So isn't it horrifying this is one of the more moderate Muslim countries? That right there should tell us all a lot about Islam.

MF DELPH
I think that's a disgusting custom, but being objective, that's not a universally practiced custom of Islam, and customs like genital mutilation and male/female circumcision could, and in many cases are, also seen as barbaric, and also aren't universally practiced customs of Christians (at least not female circumcision. Most Judeo-Christian men are circumcised).

Surtur
I'm saying Indonesia is one of the places commonly brought up in a discussion about a more moderate Muslim country.

In other words, the Muslim definition of "moderate" is all kinds of f*cked up.

MF DELPH
Yeah, I don't understand why they need to check whether a woman is a virgin in order for her to engage in military service, but beyond that sick custom women are afforded the rights to pursue an education and occupation like a man. I don't understand the obsession with virginity in Islamic culture.

-Pr-
Originally posted by MF DELPH
Most Judeo-Christian men are circumcised).

I'd be very surprised if that was the case outside of America. Not saying you're wrong, just that I would still be surprised if that was the case.

Even accounting for it being a Jewish thing, etc.

Surtur
Originally posted by MF DELPH
Yeah, I don't understand why they need to check whether a woman is a virgin in order for her to engage in military service, but beyond that sick custom women are afforded the rights to pursue an education and occupation like a man. I don't understand the obsession with virginity in Islamic culture.

Oh if you don't understand why you will LOVE their totally sane logic.

You see men in the army are all rapey and so they felt only letting virgins in..would lessen some of that.

It doesn't make any actual sense.

MF DELPH
LMAO

Time-Immemorial
People are actually saying women have just as much chances for success in Islam based Theocracys?

MF DELPH
Personally, I'm saying that not all Islamic nations are theocracies, and not all Christian nations are like the US (Uganda, for example). It's not as clear cut as the question suggests. My sister was in the Air Force and is going to college to become a nurse. She's a Christian. If we'd grown up in Uganda (also a Christian Nation) she likely would not have been afforded the life she has been able to lead here in the US and would have had her clitoris severed as a child. She'd also face a myriad of backwards customs regarding birth control and STDs which are fostered by the perverted interpretation of Christianity and Catholicism in Africa. If she grew up in Afghanistan and we were raised Muslims instead of Jehovah's Witnesses she wouldn't have had the opportunity (or choice) to gain an education or serve in the military at all. In Indonesia or Pakistan (or several other "Islamic" Nations) my sister could get an education and pursue a career, becoming a politician, teacher, scientist, or member of the armed forces. However, if she tried to join the military in Indonesia they'd force her to have her vagina examined to prove she was a virgin out of some perverted and disgusting train of thought regarding men being less likely to rape women if they were pure (and also the custom that women who are raped having to marry the person who assaulted them, which seems very counterproductive).

Basically, not so cut and dry and is a case by case scenario. Not all Christian or Islamic nations operate in the same manner and the customs aren't static.

Time-Immemorial
Originally posted by MF DELPH
Personally, I'm saying that not all Islamic nations are theocracies, and not all Christian nations are like the US (Uganda, for example). It's not as clear cut as the question suggests. My sister was in the Air Force and is going to college to become a nurse. She's a Christian. If we'd grown up in Uganda (also a Christian Nation) she likely would not have been afforded the life she has been able to lead here in the US and would have had her clitoris severed as a child. She'd also face a myriad of backwards customs regarding birth control and STDs which are fostered by the perverted interpretation of Christianity and Catholicism in Africa. If she grew up in Afghanistan and we were raised Muslims instead of Jehovah's Witnesses she wouldn't have had the opportunity (or choice) to gain an education or serve in the military at all. In Indonesia or Pakistan (or several other "Islamic" Nations) my sister could get an education and pursue a career, becoming a politician, teacher, scientist, or member of the armed forces. However, if she tried to join the military in Indonesia they'd force her to have her vagina examined to prove she was a virgin out of some perverted and disgusting train of thought regarding men being less likely to rape women if they were pure (and also the custom that women who are raped having to marry the person who assaulted them, which seems very counterproductive).

Basically, not so cut and dry and is a case by case scenario. Not all Christian or Islamic nations operate in the same manner and the customs aren't static.

Which African Countries are democratic societies based in western judao christian societies that are cutting women privates off? As with most arguments here, when no one has one, they go to Africa.

Undoubtably one can always find an answer to their problems by finding it there because it has so many.

While I applaud you for looking for a problem in BFA, that is really not the scope of the topic.

Which is comparing the middle east islaic theocracies to western culture judeo christian democracies.

Time-Immemorial
The poll is really great, I am glad I did it, I hope the numbers go towards Islamic Theocracy. This will really highlight the hypocrisy of the left towards women.

MF DELPH
Oh, in that case, nevermind. I was going by the OP. I didn't realize this was intended to simply be European Christian Democracies Vs. Arab Islamic Theocracies.

Uganda is actually a democracy, btw. They have open elections, a multi party system, and a constitution which can be amended based on the European model (being a former colony and commonwealth of England). It's just a corrupt and backwards as f*ck country. Just like many nations in South America.

Time-Immemorial
People here obviously think women born in to middle eastern theocracies have just as much opportunity as women in the west.

If that is true, why do so many people immigrate to the US from the Middle east.

How many women CEO's are in the middle east?

Surtur
We now have 4 votes for Islam and I have to admit I'm genuinely curious as to the logic of that.

Time-Immemorial
Originally posted by Surtur
We now have 4 votes for Islam and I have to admit I'm genuinely curious as to the logic of that.

The poll is really great, I am glad I did it, I hope the numbers go towards Islamic Theocracy. This will really highlight the hypocrisy of the left towards women. Shows they really dont care about women at all.

Surtur
They care about women about as much as they care about minorities. Which means they only tend to really care about once every 4 years.

Time-Immemorial
Do you notice how these Islamic threads get so much attention? Its given more attention by people then any other thread. Its like there is some inherent bias towards Islamic Theocracy.

If people really believed Islamic Theocracies were the way to go, why are all the liberals not moving to Iran?

Lord Lucien
Islamic Theocracy is the worst. Even worse than Christian theocracies with absolute monarchies.

Surtur
Well yeah, the Christians aren't blowing themselves up in crowded areas or beheading people or tossing homosexuals off buildings.

Lord Lucien
Given the comments sections of some websites and forums, I think that they would if they could.

Time-Immemorial
Originally posted by Lord Lucien
Islamic Theocracy is the worst. Even worse than Christian theocracies with absolute monarchies.

The Pope is the biggest criminal of all. He steals billions of peoples money and claims it is "for Gods work"laughing out loudlaughing out loud

Surtur
Originally posted by Lord Lucien
Given the comments sections of some websites and forums, I think that they would if they could.

Maybe, maybe not. But at least they are smart enough not to act out those feelings.

Lord Lucien
They're smart enough to acknowledge the socially-imparted consequences if they do. Most of the time. Not all of it. When the government and legal system says "It's cool, go for it", you can bet even ostensibly good, honest, Western folk--that otherwise decry this kind of shit--would revert to barbarism if it was sanctioned. That doesn't excuse the nations that do allow it, but I'd be cautious about placing one group of people up on a higher podium and assuming they always have and always will deserve it.

Time-Immemorial
So women born in Muslim Theocracies have a better chance of success?

Lord Lucien
So Apple Jacks cereal doesn't even taste like apples?

Surtur
Originally posted by Time-Immemorial
So women born in Muslim Theocracies have a better chance of success?

They do, they really do.

However, this is only if your definition of "success" involves genital mutilation and forcing women to marry men who have raped them because the alternative is the female goes to prison.

Remember, if you're a solider: our government will PUNISH you from stopping these shitheads from raping little boys. Where the f*ck are the rape culture people for THAT type of stuff? That is a true rape culture lol. Where if you get raped your BEST option is to marry the rapist. Feminazi's take note, that is what a rape culture looks like.

Time-Immemorial
The people on this forum that voted for Islam are disgusting

Lord Lucien
The people on this forum that think it matters are wetodded.

Time-Immemorial
So why do you think women in Islamic Theocracies have just as much chance for success as women in the west.

Lord Lucien
Originally posted by Lord Lucien
I voted Islam. Because my definition of a woman's success involves staying at home where she belongs and not driving.












j/k it actually involves cutting off their clitoris.

Time-Immemorial
Isn't that sexist?

Lord Lucien
Unimaginably.

Time-Immemorial
hahaha the poll!!

YOU PEOPLE ARE IDIOTS

Time-Immemorial
laughing out loud

Surtur
I'm just going to assume people are voting just to troll. I find it hard to believe even 3 people could legitimately believe this.

Time-Immemorial
No they really believe it.

Surtur
I dunno, I think if they truly believed it they'd be here trying to explain why they feel this way.

So far I haven't seen anyone post any real convincing arguments as to why Islam would be the choice.

Time-Immemorial
So what you are saying is they hate to admit Christianity is better for women?

Surtur
That is what confuses me because I feel someone blind enough to truly believe Islam is the better choice here would have no qualms about arguing against Christianity.

Lord Lucien
Modern Christianity is better for women. Probably because it doesn't use their ancient collection of desert scribblings as a yardstick. At least not often and not everywhere. Islam kinda does.


Try to see that the slow, generation-spanning development of nation-states and countries involves many multiple variables and processes-- religious adherence, religion-based rule-of-law, and religious ritual and custom being just a couple factors. Important, sure, but not the bulk of influence. When an entire country or cultural group treats half its population a certain way for so many centuries, you can bet there's more to it than just "They're religion says so". Take their faith away today and those same people will just find another excuse to continue their long-standing marginalization of women. Their religion excuses their treatment, it's not the cause of it.


Simple, pathetic, human desires are always the cause of everything we do. We just like to make up excuses for ourselves to feel better about it.

Time-Immemorial

Shakyamunison
Both choices are bad.

Surtur
Originally posted by Shakyamunison
Both choices are bad.

Not equally bad though.

Shakyamunison
Originally posted by Surtur
Not equally bad though.

Well, maybe so, but both Christian and Muslim religions place women in a subservient position.

Emperordmb
Honestly, I feel like most of the muslim votes are meant to spite TI

Time-Immemorial
You dont really have proof of that.

Surtur
Originally posted by Shakyamunison
Well, maybe so, but both Christian and Muslim religions place women in a subservient position.

Yeah, but the Christians don't mutilate the women's genitals if they disobey.

Surtur
Originally posted by Time-Immemorial
You dont really have proof of that.

http://www.killermovies.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=622117&pagenumber=6#post15967669

Check out some of the quotes I found from this religion of "peace".

Adam_PoE
Originally posted by Surtur
Yeah, but the Christians don't mutilate the women's genitals if they disobey.

They do in Africa.

Time-Immemorial
Originally posted by Adam_PoE
They do in Africa.

The African defenselaughing out loud

Thats the only one you have, dummylaughing out loud

Adam_PoE
Originally posted by Time-Immemorial
The African defenselaughing out loud

Thats the only one you have, dummylaughing out loud

African Christians are Christians.

Time-Immemorial
Africa!! Yes that backwards country represents all of Christianity. Question, how stupid are you?

Surtur
Originally posted by Adam_PoE
They do in Africa.

In which religion do you feel this happens more often?

Adam_PoE
Originally posted by Surtur
In which religion do you feel this happens more often?

As MF DELPH pointed out on the first page, it is most common in third world countries, regardless of religion.

Time-Immemorial
No shit dummy.

Lord Lucien
Originally posted by Time-Immemorial
Africa!! Yes that backwards country




Originally posted by Time-Immemorial
Question, how stupid are you?

Time-Immemorial
Nice one, I didn't know Nigeria wasn't a country

Shakyamunison
Originally posted by Surtur
Yeah, but the Christians don't mutilate the women's genitals if they disobey.

That is true today, but Christianity has a history.

Newjak
Originally posted by MF DELPH
I think the main determining factor is whether it's a 1st world nation versus a 3rd world nation rather than whether the nation is primarily Christian or Islamic. An Islamic woman in Qatar, Indonesia, or Pakistan is likely going to have better prospects than a Christian woman in Uganda or Zimbabwe. Not all Islamic Countries practice Sharia Law and oppress women. For example, Indonesia had a female president (Megawati Sukarnoputri) a little over a decade ago and women there are allowed to receive an education, work, drive, etc. Pakistan had a female Prime Minister as far back as the 80s. The more oppressive regimes like Saudi Arabia, Afghanistan, and the like are terrible though. If we're talking only 1st World Nations like the US or France and comparing them to Saudi Arabia and Afghanistan then of course the contrast is apparent but when you go further down the line those theocracies aren't the only examples of Islamic States.

Also, I didn't vote. It's a loaded question. I feel like this should be the open and closing statement of this thread.

Not much more needs to be said. Yes there are barbaric Islamic cultures but there are similar Christian ones. People seem so willing to dismiss Africa. Honestly I think the correct answer is not which religion is better for women. It's more which countries has evolved enough not to let their theological leanings allow them to dominate a gender.

Make no mistake their have been plenty of brutal Christain nations throughout history that have treated women like garbage, objectified being, and second class citizens.

Lord Lucien
Originally posted by Time-Immemorial
Nice one, I didn't know Nigeria wasn't a country There is no way you're really this oblivious. Africa you said... that's a continent. It filled with countries. Right... you get that, right?

Time-Immemorial
Why are you always looking for a fight?

Lord Lucien
Originally posted by Time-Immemorial
Why are you always looking for a fight? Attention seekers who say stupid things make for easy targets...






...is why I always look for a fight with you.

Time-Immemorial
Sure it is.

Time-Immemorial
At least your as not jacked up as themlaughing out loud

Lord Lucien
Originally posted by Time-Immemorial
At least your as not jacked up as themlaughing out loud It's as Greg King wrote: there's just no point arguing with stupid people, is there? They're always goings to bring you down to their level and beat with you experience.

NemeBro
Originally posted by Time-Immemorial
Why are you always looking for a fight? Originally posted by Time-Immemorial
The poll is really great, I am glad I did it, I hope the numbers go towards Islamic Theocracy. This will really highlight the hypocrisy of the left towards women.

You're the one looking for a fight you stupid retard, lol.

Time-Immemorial
Says the guy who been locked up, lol.

Time-Immemorial
Originally posted by Newjak
I feel like this should be the open and closing statement of this thread.

Not much more needs to be said.

And you get to decide what needs to be said, and what does not?

Newjak
I am not the final decision maker on this topic. Still I find it hard for anyone to really add anything meaningful to the conversation. To me Delph has pretty much summed up everything that needs to be said on this topic in this context.

Robtard
Only four pages, but this thread is amusing thumb up

Time-Immemorial
Originally posted by Newjak
I am not the final decision maker on this topic. Still I find it hard for anyone to really add anything meaningful to the conversation. To me Delph has pretty much summed up everything that needs to be said on this topic in this context.

You might find it hard to add anything meaninful, but other people are allowed to say whatever they want.

Newjak
That doesn't mean they will add anything meaningful to the conversation and based on what I've seen most people haven't.

Time-Immemorial
I can tell you are very committed here. I wonder why.

Newjak
What are you talking about now TI?

Time-Immemorial
I see you came and latched on to me again. I guess Ill have to ignore you for a while.

Newjak
Originally posted by Time-Immemorial
I see you came and latched on to me again. I guess Ill have to ignore you for a while. I would like to point out you're the one who engaged me in conversation.

Surtur
Originally posted by Newjak
I feel like this should be the open and closing statement of this thread.

Not much more needs to be said. Yes there are barbaric Islamic cultures but there are similar Christian ones. People seem so willing to dismiss Africa. Honestly I think the correct answer is not which religion is better for women. It's more which countries has evolved enough not to let their theological leanings allow them to dominate a gender.

Make no mistake their have been plenty of brutal Christain nations throughout history that have treated women like garbage, objectified being, and second class citizens.

No, this isn't really all that needs to be said. What needs to be said are things like: In countries considered "moderate" Muslim countries like Indonesia they have the two finger test for women who want to join the army.

You can surely talk about the various countries in Africa, but Indonesia is no longer considered a 3rd world country, so that excuse goes away too.

Nobody said Christianity was perfect, especially in the past. But if I was a female in the present day I would choose to live in a first world country dominated by Christians over one dominated by Muslims.

It is easy to say religion doesn't play a significant role, but we need to stop tippy toeing around this stuff. Since religion plays a bigger part than most want to admit. Why? Because we're so damn worried about offending somebody. Except with Islam you have to worry about them shooting you in the face if you offend them or their horrid religion. The sickest part? Via their religion, that type of behavior is REWARDED.

Newjak
Originally posted by Surtur
No, this isn't really all that needs to be said. What needs to be said are things like: In countries considered "moderate" Muslim countries like Indonesia they have the two finger test for women who want to join the army.

You can surely talk about the various countries in Africa, but Indonesia is no longer considered a 3rd world country, so that excuse goes away too.

Nobody said Christianity was perfect, especially in the past. But if I was a female in the present day I would choose to live in a first world country dominated by Christians over one dominated by Muslims.

It is easy to say religion doesn't play a significant role, but we need to stop tippy toeing around this stuff. Since religion plays a bigger part than most want to admit. Why? Because we're so damn worried about offending somebody. Except with Islam you have to worry about them shooting you in the face if you offend them or their horrid religion. The sickest part? Via their religion, that type of behavior is REWARDED. I really wouldn't consider Indonesia a first world country. They are getting closer but still has some growing to do.

And I'm not saying religion doesn't play a significant role it clearly can. I think people tend to forget that religion including Christianity generally play negative roles. It's not about offending someone. It's about calling a spade a spade and the truth is Islam and Christianity have both traditionally been pretty bad for women. It's only in countries that have started to separate the religion from the government where good strides have been made. This includes modrrn Christianity in Africa.

Surtur
Indoesia isn't 3rd world though, and before the reason used was "it's just due to them being 3rd world countries". Plus remember: Indonesia is a place that people have held up as an example of a moderate muslims.

Since the truth is both have been bad, but if we're calling spades spades that should come with the acknowledgement that modern day Islam is worse.

It is fine to acknowledge both religions have caused plenty of suffering in the past, but I also feel we do a disservice to those who have suffered at the hands of the Islamic faith if we try to pretend like both are equally bad at the present time.

Stigma
Originally posted by Time-Immemorial
So people are actually voting and saying women have a higher chance of success in Islamic nations.laughing out loud
These people are also known as libtards.

Stigma
Originally posted by Newjak
I think people tend to forget that religion including Christianity generally play negative roles.
Oh boy, that is some tough argument to defend. You may now extrapolate. Please be clear and concise. Thanks thumb up

Surtur
Is there anyone here who, if they were told they had to live the rest of their life as female, would choose to live in a Muslim dominant country over a Christian one?

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