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Who wins?

depends on monet's tp feats. doubt sabra has any protection. if the tp falls short sabra would likely take it. strength would be close but the quills should work just fine on monet and take her out.

I had to look up Sabra and see where she was power wise, due to that dang TP issue.
I agree with Leonidas.

Monet's tp gets overstated, but she does also have tk. Sabra has the quills which should balance things out. I imagine a few of the quills would be dodged or tk blocked by Monet. I could also see some landing, so I'm leaning 6/10 or so to Monet. Sabra definitely takes some due to energy quill shenanigans though. Those things even worked on Hulk.

I think the more interesting match is Monet vs Sabra in h2h only. Sabra is likely more skilled, but Monet has some pretty crazy speed feats. Multiple "outrace bullets fired at someone else and catching them" type of things.

https://postimg.org/image/4y0mnh8fn/
https://postimg.org/image/sqejcqzub/
https://postimg.org/image/7i0uvbldf/
https://postimg.org/image/4cg9542r7/

How would Arclight do against these two?

Originally posted by StyleTime
Monet's tp gets overstated, but she does also have tk. Sabra has the quills which should balance things out. I imagine a few of the quills would be dodged or tk blocked by Monet. I could also see some landing, so I'm leaning 6/10 or so to Monet. Sabra definitely takes some due to energy quill shenanigans though. Those things even worked on Hulk.

I think the more interesting match is Monet vs Sabra in h2h only. Sabra is likely more skilled, but Monet has some pretty crazy speed feats. Multiple "outrace bullets fired at someone else and catching them" type of things.

https://postimg.org/image/4y0mnh8fn/
https://postimg.org/image/sqejcqzub/
https://postimg.org/image/7i0uvbldf/
https://postimg.org/image/4cg9542r7/

Wouldn't that depend on Monet's invulnerability? If Monet's toughness far exceeded the quills ability to puncture her, no tk field would be needed in that way. She could just use it to push Sabra around, or even up any strength gap that may exist. It would be virtually impossible for Sabra to hurt Monet, having been kicked into another state by WW Hulk without injury. I'd give Monet a higher win percentile than you at around 8.5/10.

Sabra originally appeared in/fought the Hulk.
He didnt send her to another State of course.
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-lcr44z8pzJI/VVXRe6URhgI/AAAAAAAAlaw/zdI_ztcpKME/s1600/hulk256_19.jpg

Guess she's fought him more than once, which i'd firgotten.
https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/5c/c2/f5/5cc2f5b8da9868d6668bb5ea51cda433.jpg

Originally posted by Stoic
Wouldn't that depend on Monet's invulnerability? If Monet's toughness far exceeded the quills ability to puncture her, no tk field would be needed in that way. She could just use it to push Sabra around, or even up any strength gap that may exist. It would be virtually impossible for Sabra to hurt Monet, having been kicked into another state by WW Hulk without injury. I'd give Monet a higher win percentile than you at around 8.5/10.
True, that is a big issue here, and I'm open to arguments. I'm giving Sabra the benefit of the doubt because the quills pierced Hulk, although in their subsequent encounters, she had to shoot into his ear/mouth for full effect.

It really depends on whose hide you think is harder to pierce: Hulk's or Monet's.

And then there is the issue of skill. Amora did show us Monet can be choked out.
Originally posted by riv6672
Snipped since you stretched the page uhuh
For the first scan, Hulk one-shotted her earlier in that issue. She wasn't able to tangle with him until she landed her quills, which weakens opponents.
https://postimg.org/image/8uzrxf99f/
https://postimg.org/image/wyvlity1v/

Here's the rest of that scuffle in your second scan. Hulk was still weakened, but had recovered enough to no-sell her attacks.
https://postimg.org/image/pg7ed30df/
https://postimg.org/image/vif13kotf/

By contrast, full strength WWHulk thought Monet was too much hassle to try to KO, so he BFR'd her. Considering the people WWHulk was smashing, Monet's seems more impressive.

Not to undercut Sabra here. I still think this is a competitive match.

i'm of the mind that are quills would work--at least to some degree. her ability to erect a tk shield is, admittedly, something i didn't really consider. i always forget she has tk. it hasn't been showcased very often i don't think. i wonder at how good she is with it. i know she is supposed to fly using it (is that still the explanation for her flight??) and she has stopped a bullet once, but i wonder if she could keep it up? seems she might stop the quills once, but when she attacks physically she would leave herself open to getting hit again. maybe?

def speed advantage, but i think sabra would have the edge in skill and strength, though that would be close. better overall durability to m too. tp still seems like it could be a deal breaker, but i know she's mostly passive with it and wasn't there some confusion with her siblings and her tp powers?? i swear, without actively keeping track of some of the x-people, it is damn near impossible to keep all their abilities straight... lol

Well, I'm just theorizing on the TK part. I see her psychic powers accounting for maybe 2-3 wins. She barely uses them. And the biggest TK example floating around on the web is a confusing instance anyway. I always thought she just caught the bullet, as she has done in the past. I can see how it could be interpreted as TK though.

https://postimg.org/image/3oob7vgu5/


I am curious though. Why do you feel Sabra has the strength edge? All their feats seem interchangeable to me.

Sabra's durability is suspect though, as she was taken out by a sniper rifle once.

i recall an issue of new warriors where i remember thinking--uh, that's pretty good. i think she was owning vance right through his tk field. vance had some pretty solid feats in that series. i also thought i remembered her doing all right against hulk. monet was basically....punted for a bfr in her battle. and she had a team. i guess i see sabra's as better. i could be misremebering some of her more recent fight with hulk. no longer have the issue to check. i've always thought of sabra around cl50ish. wouldn't put monet that high. maybe cl25-30ish? could be wrong though.

re that bullet feat--i think the author stated it was tk as well. by art though looks to me like a tk feat. /shrug

Originally posted by StyleTime
True, that is a big issue here, and I'm open to arguments. I'm giving Sabra the benefit of the doubt because the quills pierced Hulk, although in their subsequent encounters, she had to shoot into his ear/mouth for full effect.

It really depends on whose hide you think is harder to pierce: Hulk's or Monet's.

And then there is the issue of skill. Amora did show us Monet can be choked out.

For the first scan, Hulk one-shotted her earlier in that issue. She wasn't able to tangle with him until she landed her quills, which weakens opponents.
https://postimg.org/image/8uzrxf99f/
https://postimg.org/image/wyvlity1v/

Here's the rest of that scuffle in your second scan. Hulk was still weakened, but had recovered enough to no-sell her attacks.
https://postimg.org/image/pg7ed30df/
https://postimg.org/image/vif13kotf/

By contrast, full strength WWHulk thought Monet was too much hassle to try to KO, so he BFR'd her. Considering the people WWHulk was smashing, Monet's seems more impressive.

Not to undercut Sabra here. I still think this is a competitive match.
Thats a lot of text, which was appreciated, even though i'll just respond with:
My scans were meant to hopefully stir up some more back and forth on a good match.
Guess they did!

Originally posted by leonidas
def speed advantage, but i think sabra would have the edge in skill and strength, though that would be close. better overall durability to m too. tp still seems like it could be a deal breaker, but i know she's mostly passive with it and wasn't there some confusion with her siblings and her tp powers?? i swear, without actively keeping track of some of the x-people, it is damn near impossible to keep all their abilities straight... lol
It seems like the psionic angle has been mostly dropped for Monet. The feat against Emma was definitely the twins though, and Emma has controlled and KO'd them psychically at other instances anyway too.

Problem with Monet, is that she was meant to be vague and mysterious. It's why she kept having different powers pop up out of nowhere.

I can't get behind Sabra being more durable though. She's got a few questionable KO's on her resume.

https://postimg.org/image/uc646aqij/
Originally posted by leonidas
i recall an issue of new warriors where i remember thinking--uh, that's pretty good. i think she was owning vance right through his tk field. vance had some pretty solid feats in that series. i also thought i remembered her doing all right against hulk. monet was basically....punted for a bfr in her battle. and she had a team. i guess i see sabra's as better. i could be misremebering some of her more recent fight with hulk. no longer have the issue to check. i've always thought of sabra around cl50ish. wouldn't put monet that high. maybe cl25-30ish? could be wrong though.

re that bullet feat--i think the author stated it was tk as well. by art though looks to me like a tk feat. /shrug
Well, I disagree on the Hulk thing. Hulk was weakened, and it was a lesser Hulk. Once the quills wore off, Sabra's attacks literally had no effect on him. Monet was BFR'd, but against a full-strength WWHulk. The feats just seem interchangeable to me, strength wise. They were both completely ignored by Hulk. I'm fine giving the strength nod to Sabra, but I'm thinking of the plane feat she had, and maybe that thing on the bridge with Vance.

I'm fine with it being tk. I just wish the artist had better represented it. She did the bullet catch thing in the past, so I just chalked it up to her super-speed. I do think it adds an interesting layer to match though. I don't think anyone has redirected quills back at Sabra, not that it's guaranteed of course.
Originally posted by riv6672
Thats a lot of text, which was appreciated, even though i'll just respond with:
My scans were meant to hopefully stir up some more back and forth on a good match.
Guess they did!
Oh, yeah, I was just added some tinder to the fire. I think it's an interesting match.

Personally, I think Monet's diverse powerset will win the day overall, but Sabra's quills are problematic. There are a few unknowns as well, like how Monet's durability will affect the quills. In their second encounter, she had to land shots in Hulk's mouth and ears to get the full effect.

Did that mess up her hands at all?

I'm not sure what you mean.

Punching someone in the mouth tends to **** up your hands.

Oh, I meant she had to fire the quills into his mouth for maximum effect.

Oy vey you are all antisemites

I'm more against dentists than Jews.

https://41.media.tumblr.com/fe60eb07372c55ed884363383ed595c6/tumblr_mrihl0LkAF1rmuzd4o1_500.png