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http://i1149.photobucket.com/albums/o589/lupinw45/GF_zpsmpz4ryfu.jpg

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http://i1149.photobucket.com/albums/o589/lupinw45/OS_zps5pphybiy.jpg

Goblin Force. It took out the PF, Galactus (even though a later writer seems to have forgotten this), and devastated the entire race of Celestials before it was imprisoned by the survivors. It later went on to possess and devour the remains of the Beyonder. It took Havok with the Nexus of All Realities to destroy it.

Originally posted by zopzop

Goblin Force.
It took out the PF,
Galactus (even though a later writer seems to have forgotten this), and devastated the entire race of Celestials before it was imprisoned by the survivors.
It later went on to possess and devour the remains of the Beyonder.

It took Havok with the Nexus of All Realities to destroy it.
Hey there good friend. That sounds great on paper, always has.

We should first point out that those are all Alternate reality (not 616) victims.

Those Alternates were weak-sauce.

That PF was less than global.
That same Galactus was defeated by the FF with a cruise ship, blood and sweat. (no stipulations)
Those Celestials must've been a joke since they were devastated by a less than global power.
That Beyonder was comatose/defenseless like a life-less shell.

How do I know the GF was less than global?

Because only after it absorbed the PF and that dead-like Beyonder,
did the GF become an actual Global threat.

It was never anything more dangerous than a planetary threat.

Why Havok with so much power to kill it?

Havok didn't just erase that GF from reality 1298,
but every GF from every individual reality.

Originally posted by Mr Master
Hey there good friend. That sounds great on paper, always has.

We should first point out that those are all Alternate reality (not 616) victims.

Those Alternates were weak-sauce.

That PF was less than global.
That same Galactus was defeated by the FF with a cruise ship, blood and sweat. (no stipulations)
Those Celestials must've been a joke since they were devastated by a less than global power.
That Beyonder was comatose/defenseless like a life-less shell.

How do I know the GF was less than global?

Because only after it absorbed the PF and that dead-like Beyonder,
did the GF become an actual Global threat.

It was never anything more dangerous than a planetary threat.

Why Havok with so much power to kill it?

Havok didn't just erase that GF from reality 1298,
but every GF from every individual reality.
I get why you'd be skeptical of it's power level because all of this happened in an alternate reality but......

It can't be a planetary power if it destroyed entire galaxies and was on it's way to destroying the universe according to the Watcher of that reality :
https://s15.postimg.org/55boe7sqv/1266196-gq1cy0.jpg

And regarding erasing it from all realities, how then did Ian Mcnee (a small time mage) from 616 know of it's existence and mention it in the Marvel Tarot series (which is canon) long after the chain of events that lead to it's erasure takes place AND the fact that the GF has never appeared in 616 reality before?

Also Galactus losing to the FF isn't something to be ashamed of. Reed and his alts have beaten high level cosmics and abstract level beings before. Even the LT was humiliated by an alt Reed via forced BFR.

Originally posted by zopzop
Goblin Force. It took out the PF, Galactus (even though a later writer seems to have forgotten this), and devastated the entire race of Celestials before it was imprisoned by the survivors. It later went on to possess and devour the remains of the Beyonder. It took Havok with the Nexus of All Realities to destroy it.

Oblivion was a metaverse level threat. It took plot device to be as ble to contain it. It was eating everything in the entire DCU.

Originally posted by zopzop

I get why you'd be skeptical of it's power level because all of this happened in an alternate reality but......

It can't be a planetary power if it destroyed entire galaxies and was on it's way to destroying the universe according to the Watcher of that reality
Perhaps it was more powerful when it first manifested,
perhaps it is more powerful in its natural state,
but as host/Mady-GF? ... barely global.
Originally posted by zopzop

And regarding erasing it from all realities, how then did Ian Mcnee (a small time mage) from 616 know of it's existence and mention it in the Marvel Tarot series (which is canon) long after the chain of events that lead to it's erasure takes place AND the fact that the GF has never appeared in 616 reality before?
Because many times rogue writers simply convolute info
by not paying close attention to stories they're basing their stories from.

That aside, I'm not sure how this is relevant though good friend.
Originally posted by zopzop

Also Galactus losing to the FF isn't something to be ashamed of. Reed and his alts have beaten high level cosmics and abstract level beings before.
The FF didn't pull out some exotic cosmic weapon like on the Celestials,
it was a simple space cruise ship smaller than Han Solo's joint.

It was literally stated: they beat G 'with blood, sweat and guts' (nothing more)
Originally posted by zopzop

Even the LT was humiliated by an alt Reed via forced BFR.
The LT was humiliated (via force bfr) by the combined power of:

Himself (LT) -
Lord Chaos/Master Order -
Master Hate -
In-Betweener -
Shaper of Worlds -
and the Stranger -

The merged powers of all of those cosmics PLUS Reed's super canon, was the culprit, not just "Reed."

Originally posted by Mr Master
Perhaps it was more powerful when it first manifested,
perhaps it is more powerful in its natural state,
but as host/Mady-GF? ... barely global.
Oh no doubt Mr M. It was even mentioned on panel. The final battle with the entire race of Celestials weakened it severely and it was imprisoned. It was still feeble when it possessed Madelyn and was able to be exercised by Scotty (Havok's kid who apparently had high level TP). It only started to regain some of it's former glory when it possessed and then devoured the Beyonder's corpse.


I merely bought this up because I found it incredible that a no name upstart mage from 616 reality knew of the GF's existence despite it never manifesting in 616 reality and having been erased long before the series of events that took place in Marvel Tarot.


But we don't know what was on that cruise ship. Reed has normal sized guns capable of killing Celestials with one shot.


I think it WAS just Reed. The cannon he used was meant to destroy/stop Galactus but at the last second he sensed the Cosmic Powers attempting to destroy Galactus and feared Earth's entire solar system would be destroyed in the backlash, so he focused the cannon on them instead :
https://s13.postimg.org/guvsqprxf/3241642-2565808379-29859.jpg https://s13.postimg.org/zbq7hj7vn/3241643-0855502799-29859.jpg https://s13.postimg.org/psgio2kdf/3241644-4301594686-29859.jpg

So... how does the GF destroy an aspect of Oblivion? IIRC, Superman, Metron, and the rest of the Next crew needed plot device to contain it.

Originally posted by Zack M
So... how does the GF destroy an aspect of Oblivion? IIRC, Superman, Metron, and the rest of the Next crew needed plot device to contain it.
The GF was taken down by power on a universal scale. The first time it was defeated it had already gone through : the PF, Galactus, and devastated the ENTIRE RACE of Celestials of it's reality before it was contained and imprisoned.

The second time it was beaten it was still in it's crippled form and even then it had to be exercised by Scottie (the son of Alex Summers of that reality that was apparently some uber mutant).

The third and final time it was defeated was by Havok with the Nexus of all Realities :
http://panels-of-interest.tumblr.com/post/30333830956/havok-vs-the-goblin-force-the-evil-counterpart
Here's a glimpse of the power it took to beat her and I'm quoting :
"And right now with the help of Dr. Strange, Baron Mordo, Xavier, and your own Reed Richards, I'm tapping into raw power that which will never again be unleashed in this or any other dimension"

OS is metaversal or whatever.

Originally posted by zopzop

Oh no doubt Mr M. It was even mentioned on panel. The final battle with the entire race of Celestials weakened it severely and it was imprisoned. It was still feeble when it possessed Madelyn and was able to be exercised by Scotty (Havok's kid who apparently had high level TP).

It only started to regain some of it's former glory when it possessed and then devoured the Beyonder's corpse.
I see.

But that alternate Beyonder corpse was but a global threat before ending up comatose,
aside from being defeated by heroes and being put into a death coma.
Originally posted by zopzop

I merely bought this up because I found it incredible that a no name upstart mage from 616 reality knew of the GF's existence despite it never manifesting in 616 reality and having been erased long before the series of events that took place in Marvel Tarot.
It's an interesting detail I must say. But remember old friend,
in-comic history is based on writers' interpretations/perspectives,
which is why so much shit is contradictory across many arcs.

I mean, it's not like it was "really erased" ... it was that writer's private story that claimed it was erased,
some jag-off writer involved in 616 comes around and mentions the GF years later,
leaving us confused and with questions.
Since this isn't real life, any writer can warp something we thought we knew prior.

The reason we catch these nuances, is cause we're a bunch of aficionados who dive deep into all details.

I once had a debate with an actual Marvel writer regarding cosmics. I felt like I was teaching him.
Originally posted by zopzop

But we don't know what was on that cruise ship.
Reed has normal sized guns capable of killing Celestials with one shot.
And we know that, cause it was mentioned on panel.

We also know the FF cruise ship wasn't special,
cause the writer stated it was 'blood, sweat and guts' that got the job done.

It's not impossible you're wrong btw, but I rather not speculate since nothing hinted for me to do so.
Originally posted by zopzop

I think it WAS just Reed. The cannon he used was meant to destroy/stop Galactus but at the last second he sensed the Cosmic Powers attempting to destroy Galactus and feared Earth's entire solar system would be destroyed in the backlash, so he focused the cannon on them instead : https://s13.postimg.org/psgio2kdf/3241644-4301594686-29859.jpg
My friend, Reed shot his canon at the merger of cosmic power, not at the cosmics themselves.

It was the combination of their own power, plus the canon: Clearly depicted in that above scan.