How many wins can Silver Surfer Get (DC)

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TethAdamTheRock
How many wins out of ten

1. Superman
2. Orion
3. Captain Marvel
4. Lobo
5. Martian Manhunter
6. Captain Atom
7. Wonder Woman
8. Bizzaro

krisblaze
1. 4
2. 6
3. 6
4. 8
5. 10
6. 4
7. 7
8. 7

quanchi112
Surfer bests them all.

TethAdamTheRock
For the Majority?

quanchi112
Originally posted by TethAdamTheRock
For the Majority? Dominant majority. He'd annihilate Superman because he can exploit his weaknesses.

Genii96
How powerful is current captain atom?

TethAdamTheRock
Pre 52

darthgoober
Originally posted by TethAdamTheRock
Pre 52
All pre 52 or just Atom?

TethAdamTheRock
All

darthgoober
1. 8-9
2. 6-7
3. 6-7
4. 6-7(unless we're talking about Lobo with the blood cloning)
5. 9-10
6. 8-9
7. 8
8. 8-9

abhilegend
Originally posted by darthgoober
1. 8-9
2. 6-7
3. 6-7
4. 6-7(unless we're talking about Lobo with the blood cloning)
5. 9-10
6. 8-9
7. 8
8. 8-9
laughing out loud

Care to prove any of that?

Anyway.

1. 1-2/10
2. 4/10
3. 4-5/10
4. 5/10
5. 7/10
6. 6/10
7. 5/10
8. 6/10

darthgoober
Originally posted by abhilegend
laughing out loud

Care to prove any of that?
That's a lot to ask someone to prove man, I mean we're talking about 8 separate opinions lol

abhilegend
Originally posted by darthgoober
That's a lot to ask someone to prove man, I mean we're talking about 8 separate opinions lol
I ask any. I mean do you think Surfer wins 8-9/10 against Superman? Surfer must be skyfather level if he outclasses Superman to that level.

Or is it the imaginary weakness exploitation tactic? In that case Superman would beat Surfer 10/10 if I start pulling high end feats for Superman.

Likewise he isn't beating J'onn almost every time. J'onn will ruin his day if we go by his TP feats like you go with Surfer.

And somehow Lobo does better than Superman or Wonder Woman.

quanchi112
Originally posted by darthgoober
That's a lot to ask someone to prove man, I mean we're talking about 8 separate opinions lol He asks a lot of others but won't ever address me. Fear.

darthgoober
Originally posted by abhilegend
I ask any. I mean do you think Surfer wins 8-9/10 against Superman? Surfer must be skyfather level if he outclasses Superman to that level.

Or is it the imaginary weakness exploitation tactic? In that case Superman would beat Surfer 10/10 if I start pulling high end feats for Superman.

Likewise he isn't beating J'onn almost every time. J'onn will ruin his day if we go by his TP feats like you go with Surfer.

And somehow Lobo does better than Superman or Wonder Woman.
Nope he's just tailor made to beat Supes in part because of yes... weakness exploitation.

J'onn's got an even more exploitable weakness than Supes and Surfer has a resistance against TP.

Lobo's got no inherent weakness, a killer healing factor, and is absolutely bloodthirsty... it makes total sense that he'd do better than Supes or WW

Philosophía
1. Superman - 2-3/10
2. Orion - 4/10
3. Captain Marvel - 5/10
4. Lobo - 4/10
5. Martian Manhunter - 5-6/10
6. Captain Atom - 6/10
7. Wonder Woman - 4/10
8. Bizzaro - 6/10

Originally posted by abhilegend
laughing out loud Don't make fun of him, he has an objectivity medal from 2000-something.

Do YOU have a medal? Thought so.

Ambient
Originally posted by TethAdamTheRock
How many wins out of ten

1. Superman
2. Orion
3. Captain Marvel
4. Lobo
5. Martian Manhunter
6. Captain Atom
7. Wonder Woman
8. Bizzaro

1.) 7 out of 10
2.) 7 out of 10
3.) 7 out of 10
4.) 8 out of 10
5.) 9 out of 10
6.) 9 out of 10
7.) 8 out of 10
8.) 7 out of 10

abhilegend
Originally posted by darthgoober
Nope he's just tailor made to beat Supes in part because of yes... weakness exploitation.


And Superman is tailor made to beat slow mid tier strength energy manipulators like Surfer.

Ask Hal Jordan how he fares against Superman. Or Captain Atom. And Cap has feats dwarfing anything Surfer has ever done.


And unlike Surfer a GL ring can actually scan someone for his weakness.

https://s1.postimg.org/71nog66shn/RCO025.jpg https://s1.postimg.org/2tl8ki2wnv/RCO026.jpg https://s1.postimg.org/3phpzygvff/RCO027.jpg



J'onn can become immune to fire at will.

Considering Surfer's poor record against telepaths, he will rape Surfer if we go that route.


Except that has never helped him against Superman who has beaten him almost every time.

abhilegend
Originally posted by Ambient
1.) 7 out of 10
2.) 7 out of 10
3.) 7 out of 10
4.) 8 out of 10
5.) 9 out of 10
6.) 9 out of 10
7.) 8 out of 10
8.) 7 out of 10
Care to prove any of that?

Genii96
1) 7-9/10
2) 7/10
3) 8/10
4) 7/10
5) 8-9/10
6) 6-7/10
7) 8/10
8) 8/10

abhilegend

quanchi112
Originally posted by abhilegend
Care to prove any of that? Care to respond to me. Face me.

Ambient
Originally posted by abhilegend
Care to prove any of that?
Nope! Not really, got better things to do. Just my 2 cents Abhi.

darthgoober
Originally posted by abhilegend
And Superman is tailor made to beat slow mid tier strength energy manipulators like Surfer.

Ask Hal Jordan how he fares against Superman. Or Captain Atom. And Cap has feats dwarfing anything Surfer has ever done.

Those characters aren't Surfer and they weren't fighting Supes under the conditions of a forum fight, ABC logic doesn't hold up here.

Originally posted by abhilegend
J'onn can become immune to fire at will.

Considering Surfer's poor record against telepaths, he will rape Surfer if we go that route.

Really he can just remove his weakness at will? News to me, do you have something to support such a thing?


Originally posted by abhilegend
Except that has never helped him against Superman who has beaten him almost every time.

Again, ABC logic doesn't hold up here. We're talking about Supes vs Surfer and Lobo vs Surfer based on how they match up against each other, not how Supes matches up against Lobo

quanchi112
Originally posted by Ambient
Nope! Not really, got better things to do. Just my 2 cents Abhi. thumb up

Well played.

abhilegend
Originally posted by darthgoober
Those characters aren't Surfer, ABC logic doesn't hold up here.


Yeah, they have tangible better showings than Surfer does.

https://s1.postimg.org/71nog66shn/RCO025.jpg https://s1.postimg.org/2tl8ki2wnv/RCO026.jpg https://s1.postimg.org/3phpzygvff/RCO027.jpg

Just post one feat where he actually finds weakness like that mid combat. Just one.

Yes, just has to switch off his telepathy or separate himself in his human guise and Martian side.

But even there we saw Surfer unable to beat Lunatik who koed Surfer straight up.

So how does Surfer beat Lobo?

abhilegend
Originally posted by Ambient
Nope! Not really, got better things to do. Just my 2 cents Abhi.

laughing out loud

Alright. I guess I've to settle with wrecking just Goober.

quanchi112
Originally posted by abhilegend
Yeah, they have tangible better showings than Surfer does.

https://s1.postimg.org/71nog66shn/RCO025.jpg https://s1.postimg.org/2tl8ki2wnv/RCO026.jpg https://s1.postimg.org/3phpzygvff/RCO027.jpg

Just post one feat where he actually finds weakness like that mid combat. Just one.

Yes, just has to switch off his telepathy or separate himself in his human guise and Martian side.

But even there we saw Surfer unable to beat Lunatik who koed Surfer straight up.

So how does Surfer beat Lobo? Abc logic. Just stop.

darthgoober
Originally posted by abhilegend
Yeah, they have tangible better showings than Surfer does.

https://s1.postimg.org/71nog66shn/RCO025.jpg https://s1.postimg.org/2tl8ki2wnv/RCO026.jpg https://s1.postimg.org/3phpzygvff/RCO027.jpg

Just post one feat where he actually finds weakness like that mid combat. Just one.
Basic knowledge man, basic knowledge. Also the whole Gladiator thing.

Originally posted by abhilegend
Yes, just has to switch off his telepathy or separate himself in his human guise and Martian side.
Neither of those options really sound feasible given your pitch for MM to win.


Originally posted by abhilegend
But even there we saw Surfer unable to beat Lunatik who koed Surfer straight up.

So how does Surfer beat Lobo?

Surfer DID beat Lunatic though. At least to the extent that he was interested in doing so.

Genii96
When has surfer been weak to tp anyway? He has among tjr Best to feats, both offense and defense, and can even make shields that stop psychic attacks

abhilegend
Originally posted by darthgoober
Basic knowledge man, basic knowledge. Also the whole Gladiator thing.


Basic knowledge doesn't means Surfer starts acting out of character. Just like basic knowledge does not means Superman punches Surfer to death at Superspeed knowing he is slow as ****.

Gladiator showing is just a bluff seeing he never actually did that




Well, he has actual showings for that in case Surfer started to listen to you.

He was interested in it a lot. All he did was run away while bluffing Lunatik as he later left the planet without dying.

That would be a forum loss.

abhilegend
Originally posted by Genii96
When has surfer been weak to tp anyway? He has among tjr Best to feats, both offense and defense, and can even make shields that stop psychic attacks
Do you want me to post those scans?

Even Wraith queen has mindraped Surfer and she is a piss poor telepath at best.

darthgoober
Originally posted by abhilegend
Basic knowledge doesn't means Surfer starts acting out of character. Just like basic knowledge does not means Superman punches Surfer to death at Superspeed knowing he is slow as ****.

Gladiator showing is just a bluff seeing he never actually did that
Exploiting vulnerabilities in his opponents through energy manipulation is very much in character for Surfer.


Originally posted by abhilegend
Well, he has actual showings for that in case Surfer started to listen to you.
But not is a useful way. He either turns off his telepathy which is the closest thing to shot at winning he has, or he turns into a human and martian who should still has the vulnerability... not good options.

Originally posted by abhilegend
He was interested in it a lot. All he did was run away while bluffing Lunatik as he later left the planet without dying.

That would be a forum loss.
He's not going to forfeit a forum fight abhi lol

abhilegend
Originally posted by darthgoober
Exploiting vulnerabilities in his opponents through energy manipulation is very much in character for Surfer.


Draining only. Superman can easily counter that.

He has never tried radiation weakness in a fight against the likes of Dr Spectrum or Gladiator.
Or even hulk who could revert to Banner by gamma rays in silver age.



And why would Surfer start a fire? Is that in his character now as well?

So how does he beat Lobo when he can't beat a second rate clone?

darthgoober
Originally posted by abhilegend
Draining only. Superman can easily counter that.

He has never tried radiation weakness in a fight against the likes of Dr Spectrum or Gladiator.


Nope, he's screwed with the energies of Jack of Hearts, Wonderman, and some solar powered semi demon looking chick who's name I can't remember without draining their energy. Face it, screwing around with energy is just in his character whether you like it or not.

He easily took care of Spectrum so he proves nothing and he made it clear that he'd have easily taken Glads out via his radiation weakness. You can claim "it was just a bluff!" but the instance doesn't show an aversion to the tactic like you're trying to make it seem.



Originally posted by abhilegend
And why would Surfer start a fire? Is that in his character now as well?
Using his opponents weaknesses against them is definitely within his character. He can create fire, MM is vulnerable to fire... 2+2... I know you hate the application of logic and common sense to an argument, but such things are in fact relevant on KMC just as they always have been smile


Originally posted by abhilegend
So how does he beat Lobo when he can't beat a second rate clone?
Choosing to take accomplish his primary goal easily rather than engage in a prolonged fight isn't same as being "unable to beat him".

abhilegend
Originally posted by darthgoober
Nope, he's screwed with the energies of Jack of Hearts, Wonderman, and some solar powered semi demon looking chick who's name I can't remember without draining their energy. Face it, screwing around with energy is just in his character whether you like it or not.


None of them are as powerful as Superman or store bio energy like Superman.

And Surfer can't manipulate bio energy as shown against Ego.

Yes, it shows he goes to his routine tactics first and never tries weakness exploitation.

Yes, it was a bluff because it never happened.

He didn't try using gamma weakness for Hulk which was a common weakness before merged hulk.

https://s1.postimg.org/3apla7aa4f/Mindless_Hulk_Energy02300.jpg






Could you show us one instance of such a showing where Surfer used weakness manipulation such as fire?

He certainly never used it against Namor who has a known heat weakness.



So his primary goal was to run away after getting his ass kicked? Is that what he is doing here?

darthgoober
Originally posted by abhilegend
None of them are as powerful as Superman or store bio energy like Superman.

And Surfer can't manipulate bio energy as shown against Ego.
You said he only ever drained, those instances prove your statement to be FALSE.


Originally posted by abhilegend
Yes, it shows he goes to his routine tactics first and never tries weakness exploitation.

Yes, it was a bluff because it never happened.

He didn't try using gamma weakness for Hulk which was a common weakness before merged hulk.

https://s1.postimg.org/3apla7aa4f/Mindless_Hulk_Energy02300.jpg

His choosing to drain Hulk rather than use gamma rays(which your scans shows to be a sketchy prospect) proves nothing.





Originally posted by abhilegend
Could you show us one instance of such a showing where Surfer used weakness manipulation such as fire?

He certainly never used it against Namor who has a known heat weakness.

Again abhi, logic and common sense. Just because you have an issue with those things doesn't mean that everyone else does.

Originally posted by abhilegend
So his primary goal was to run away after getting his ass kicked? Is that what he is doing here?
No his primary goal was to stop Lunatik from stirring up more trouble, binding him to that planet did just that.

abhilegend
Originally posted by darthgoober
You said he only ever drained, those instances prove your statement to be FALSE.


He only drained Symphira and her power was similar to power cosmic.

He threw the energy of Wonder Man to a loop but he is a living energy inside an ionic body.

He can't do that to Superman as he has never screwed around bio energy.

It was sketchy as Bruce had committed mental suicide.

It shows he uses draining rather than weakness exploitation.

Why don't you post a single feat of weakness exploitation by radiation weakness if all of these prove nothing?

Heck even Thing has a radiation weakness which causes him to revert to human. And Thanos too for that's how Drax killed him.

So Surfer beats Thanos 10/10?


So why didn't Surfer use it on Namor? Or Worthy Attuma? Or Tyrak?

How does he starts using them only when you're arguing for it?

No, he failed miserably at that as Lunatik slaughtered most of them when he was unconscious for hours. He vowed to have vengeance and failed again.

So he ran away.

Genii96
Originally posted by abhilegend
Do you want me to post those scans?

Even Wraith queen has mindraped Surfer and she is a piss poor telepath at best.


Go ahead, although I believe there are mostly contexts to them

Philosophía
Originally posted by darthgoober
You said he only ever drained, those instances prove your statement to be FALSE.
Don't run away, Gooby. I can see you already dodging, with Namor, for example.

Where has Surfer drained somebody as powerful as Superman?

Superman has forcefully drained Maggeddon's anti-sun energy , which was about to vaporize half the galaxy. Superman has far greater control over the energy which you're wishfully thinking Surfer can drain him of:

http://i738.photobucket.com/albums/xx28/PhilosophiaKMC/absorbingmageddon1.jpg?hotlinkfix=1509389584648
http://i738.photobucket.com/albums/xx28/PhilosophiaKMC/absorbingmageddon2.jpg?hotlinkfix=1509389585151
http://i738.photobucket.com/albums/xx28/PhilosophiaKMC/absorbingmageddon3.jpg?hotlinkfix=1509389585678
http://i738.photobucket.com/albums/xx28/PhilosophiaKMC/absorbingmageddon4.jpg?hotlinkfix=1509389586203

In that tug-of-war, Surfer is the losing man. Unless you can show him draining an energy absorber who is at Galaxy-level?

quanchi112

darthgoober
Originally posted by abhilegend
He only drained Symphira and her power was similar to power cosmic.

He threw the energy of Wonder Man to a loop but he is a living energy inside an ionic body.

He can't do that to Superman as he has never screwed around bio energy.

No he cut Symphira from her solar energy, that's not draining.

Anyway, you do concede that your statement that it's only in character for Surfer to drain people in regards to using energy manipulation to exploit vulnerabilities in his opponents is patently false?


Originally posted by abhilegend
It was sketchy as Bruce had committed mental suicide.

It shows he uses draining rather than weakness exploitation.

Why don't you post a single feat of weakness exploitation by radiation weakness if all of these prove nothing?

Heck even Thing has a radiation weakness which causes him to revert to human. And Thanos too for that's how Drax killed him.

So Surfer beats Thanos 10/10?


So why didn't Surfer use it on Namor? Or Worthy Attuma? Or Tyrak?

How does he starts using them only when you're arguing for it?


Draining against the Hulk IS weakness exploitation abhi.

Your line of reasoning is silly. I mean how many times does Supes have to be hit by people without superspeed to prove that it's not in character for him to use it defensively?



Originally posted by abhilegend
No, he failed miserably at that as Lunatik slaughtered most of them when he was unconscious for hours. He vowed to have vengeance and failed again.

So he ran away.

No he chose to leave because it was the easier and safer option.

darthgoober

Philosophía
Originally posted by darthgoober
Has he ever been drained by less than the Maggeddon? So nothing? Good.

Now you're arguing consistency, while ignoring abhi's argument about Namor et all?

While using a microscopic sample of Surfer's appearances, to prove your case?

Well, this is fun.

How many double standards and position-switching will you take?

abhilegend
Originally posted by darthgoober
No he cut Symphira from her solar energy, that's not draining.


He drained her powers which were closer to power cosmic.



No, because that's what he mainly does.

Why didn't he use gamma radiation to cure Ben?

https://s1.postimg.org/31khzapsij/image.jpg

One more dodge Goober.

Which Superman can easily counter. Where is Surfer using weakness exploitation via radiation weakness?

Except Superman has used speed to do that countless times.

Surfer hasn't used radiation based or fire based exploitation even once.

No, he ran away after getting his ass kicked.

darthgoober

darthgoober
Originally posted by abhilegend
He drained her powers which were closer to power cosmic.
Nope. I'm all but positive that he cut her off from her connection to the sun.


Originally posted by abhilegend
No, because that's what he mainly does.

You said ONLY, only is an absolute.
Originally posted by abhilegend
Why didn't he use gamma radiation to cure Ben?

https://s1.postimg.org/31khzapsij/image.jpg

One more dodge Goober.
Same reason Reed has issues... they want the Thing as a character.

Originally posted by abhilegend
Which Superman can easily counter. Where is Surfer using weakness exploitation via radiation weakness?
So you concede that energy draining constitutes weakness exploitation?

Originally posted by abhilegend
Except Superman has used speed to do that countless times.

Surfer hasn't used radiation based or fire based exploitation even once.
He's exploited other characters weaknesses multiple times, yes or no?

Originally posted by abhilegend
No, he ran away after getting his ass kicked.

Your Surfer hate is showing abhi...

abhilegend
Originally posted by darthgoober
Has he ever been drained by less than the Maggeddon?
He has been drained way less than Surfer.

Originally posted by abhilegend
I did some digging and looks like Surfer has THE worst record against energy draining than ANY herald.

Against Motherboard

http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k508/abhilegend/Marvel/SilverSurferv3024-15.jpg
http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k508/abhilegend/Marvel/SilverSurferv3024-16.jpg
http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k508/abhilegend/Marvel/SilverSurferv3024-17.jpg
http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k508/abhilegend/Marvel/SilverSurferv3024-18.jpg
http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k508/abhilegend/Marvel/SilverSurferv3024-19.jpg
http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k508/abhilegend/Marvel/SilverSurferv3024-20.jpg
http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k508/abhilegend/Marvel/SilverSurferv3024-21.jpg

Against stranger

http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k508/abhilegend/Marvel/SilverSurferv3027-12.jpg

Against demonstar

http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k508/abhilegend/Marvel/SilverSurferv3039-12.jpg
http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k508/abhilegend/Marvel/SilverSurferv3039-13.jpg
http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k508/abhilegend/Marvel/SilverSurferv3039-14.jpg
http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k508/abhilegend/Marvel/SilverSurferv3039-15.jpg

Dynamo city

http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k508/abhilegend/Marvel/SilverSurferv3040-10.jpg
http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k508/abhilegend/Marvel/SilverSurferv3040-11.jpg
http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k508/abhilegend/Marvel/SilverSurferv3040-12.jpg

Captain reptyl

http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k508/abhilegend/Marvel/SilverSurferv3012-01.jpg
http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k508/abhilegend/Marvel/SilverSurferv3012-02-03.jpg
http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k508/abhilegend/Marvel/SilverSurferv3012-06.jpg

Some space pirates

http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k508/abhilegend/Marvel/05.jpg
http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k508/abhilegend/Marvel/06.jpg
http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k508/abhilegend/Marvel/07.jpg

Dampyre

http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k508/abhilegend/Marvel/StarMasters3017.jpg
http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k508/abhilegend/Marvel/StarMasters3019.jpg

Iron man

http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k508/abhilegend/Marvel/norad35bd.jpg
http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k508/abhilegend/Marvel/norad48uz.jpg

Random minions of Pluto.

http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k508/abhilegend/Marvel/DefendersII03p13.jpg

Rulk

http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k508/abhilegend/Marvel/808236-death_of_a_surfer_super.jpg

Sonic shark

http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k508/abhilegend/Marvel/FantasticFour072-19.jpg
http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k508/abhilegend/Marvel/FantasticFour072-20.jpg

Another tech drainage

http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k508/abhilegend/Marvel/SilverSurferv3124p15.jpg

High evolutionary

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v155/thorion/panther/hevol1.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v155/thorion/panther/hevol2.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v155/thorion/panther/hevol3.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v155/thorion/panther/hevol4.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v155/thorion/panther/hevol5.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v155/thorion/panther/hevol6.jpg

Against random energy leecher.

http://s1113.photobucket.com/user/abhilegend/media/Marvel/Silver%20Surfer%20-%20In%20Thy%20Name%20002-022.jpg.html
http://s1113.photobucket.com/user/abhilegend/media/Marvel/Silver%20Surfer%20-%20In%20Thy%20Name%20002-023.jpg.html

Doom's device.

http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k508/abhilegend/Marvel/th_FantasticFourv105715.jpg http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k508/abhilegend/Marvel/th_FantasticFourv105716.jpg

Again.

http://i.imgur.com/iqahvRg.jpg

Kree starwheel.

http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k508/abhilegend/Marvel/th_Defendersv2008-08.jpg

Random solar energy absorber.

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/--U9Oq7nokiA/VcIQ2dhS3bI/AAAAAAAOAPA/rZv4PMtPiHM/s1600/p_17_13.jpg
http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-gRzxn5y0mGs/VcIQ2lj6eeI/AAAAAAAOAPI/GL4Thd8O0Zw/s1600/p_17_14.jpg
http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-sRlSTDdTimk/VcIQ3BSIbEI/AAAAAAAOAPQ/M7wsAzu8hjk/s1600/p_17_15.jpg
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-O3L885RUWAc/VcIQ31f4NcI/AAAAAAAOAPc/tvt3PTjMvvo/s1600/p_17_17.jpg
http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-u3eVbTUPsWk/VcIQ4F_8SpI/AAAAAAAOAQM/-FDobn1uXVA/s1600/p_17_18.jpg

LMAO. Nobody brings up that against Surfer though.

thumb up

Also Surfer is powered by starlight.

https://s1.postimg.org/6bbojxhebf/image.jpg

Superman can absorb starlight.

https://static2.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11129/111299885/5499155-3.png

Plot twist, Superman drains Surfer.

abhilegend
Originally posted by darthgoober
Nope. I'm all but positive that he cut her off from her connection to the sun.


Nope.

You're in absolute negative though. No showings or feats at all.

That didn't stop him from draining and curing Hulk.



Can you show one radiation based weakness exploitation as you claim for years?

Radiation or fire based weakness as you claimed here? No.

So tell us where Surfer koed Lunatik?

Philosophía
Originally posted by darthgoober
No I'm arguing the level to which an ability is consistantly shown and abhi and arguing a character outright "forgetting" abilities for the sake of the plot. So in Surfer's case it's the plot's fault, while in Superman's case is that it's not consistent - according to your vast knowledge of Superman's history, of course!

Holy double-standards, Batman!

This will go sideways for you, when it's shown that if anybody is doing the draining, it's Superman.

edit:

And there we go!

Philosophía
Somehow, I doubt goob even has an idea what kryptonite is.

Firestorm, while sitting at a table, uninterrupted and seeing it first-hand took a while and multiple tries just to create one chunk:

https://i.imgur.com/kjEKROp.jpg

Surfer, who has ZERO experience with it , will create it mid-battle.

One of the most COMPLEX elements in the whole of DCU

Because of ZERO evidence.

This really is fun.

krisblaze
Afaik Firestorm doesn't have cosmic awareness and has to actually know the makeup of what he's creating?

Surfer seemingly detected Gladiator's weakness no problem.

darthgoober
Originally posted by abhilegend
Nope.
Do you have scans of the instance? Again, I'm all but positive that's what happened. If you don't it's cool, I can ask Ambient for them I just figured I'd check with you first.

Originally posted by abhilegend
You're in absolute negative though. No showings or feats at all.
Is that dodge you way of conceding the fact that the notion that Surfer never uses any form of weakness exploitation other than draining is false?


Originally posted by abhilegend
That didn't stop him from draining and curing Hulk.

From one plot to another lol



Originally posted by abhilegend
Can you show one radiation based weakness exploitation as you claim for years?
I can show it's within his character to do so simply with his exchange with Glads.

Originally posted by abhilegend
Radiation or fire based weakness as you claimed here? No.
Stop trying to set the terms to match your predetermined conclusion, has he exploited the weaknesses of others multiple times or not?

Originally posted by abhilegend
So tell us where Surfer koed Lunatik?

He ended up not having to because he was able to simply trap him on the planet.

Philosophía
Originally posted by krisblaze
Afaik Firestorm doesn't have cosmic awareness and has to actually know the makeup of what he's creating?

Surfer seemingly detected Gladiator's weakness no problem. Surfer has to know the make-up of what he is creating, too - and there's no proof that his Cosmic Awareness enables him to look at Superman's DNA, deduce the weakness and then create kryptonite, one of the most complex elements in the DCU in mid-fight. And Firestorm, even while knowing the configuration, had a hard time creating it on the spot, and it took practice.

Saying that the Gladiator scene means that he suddenly could do the same with Superman, just because the word 'radiation' was mentioned in relation to Gladiator is a false equivalence.

CosmicComet
Surfer ain't making K-Nite. It doesn't even exist in his universe. Even if he did it would be of his universe's making and wouldn't affect Supes anyway.

Red sun radiation is a different matter however, Surfer should know about that pretty easily.

Still, tanking the absorbtion of galaxy levels of anti-sunlight > What Surfer will conjure up.

abhilegend
Originally posted by krisblaze
Afaik Firestorm doesn't have cosmic awareness and has to actually know the makeup of what he's creating?

Surfer seemingly detected Gladiator's weakness no problem.
Surfer knew his weakness presumably. There is no evidence of him detecting it on a whim. Hulk did that however.

It's no secret that strontians have radiation weakness.

darthgoober

darthgoober

darthgoober
Originally posted by abhilegend
Surfer knew his weakness presumably. There is no evidence of him detecting it on a whim. Hulk did that however.

It's no secret that strontians have radiation weakness.
And K-nite is outright mentioned in regards to "common knowledge" in the forum rules.

celeyhyga17
Easiest way to beat someone is to exploit their weakness especially if said character or characters have very specific ones. Either that or there's a matchup mismatch based on powerset that gives one character a distinct advantage over the other.

abhilegend
Originally posted by darthgoober
Do you have scans of the instance? Again, I'm all but positive that's what happened. If you don't it's cool, I can ask Ambient for them I just figured I'd check with you first.


You can ask him. He wouldn't tell you this though.

https://s1.postimg.org/3ukcdqgy7f/sil08.jpg




Are you continuing your years long dodging to show a single Surfer radiation based weakness exploitation?

Should I take your concession that you don't have any such scans?

So you don't have any explanation and are just flinging your opinion as fact for years?

Figured.

Where he did not actually do that? And neither did he against Krosakis who had his powers.





Has he used radiation based weakness or fire weakness? As you claimed is in character for him so he must have used it a lot.

Yes or not?

That was just a bluff. Lunatik left the planet later without dying in Drax series.

abhilegend
Originally posted by darthgoober
And K-nite is outright mentioned in regards to "common knowledge" in the forum rules.

Kryptonite is. It's radiation make up isn't.

And if you try to simulate kryptonite and you are from a different universe, it doesn't works.

abhilegend
Originally posted by darthgoober
His resistance is inconsistent, yes. Surfer has things about him that are inconsistent as well, and for those things we try to establish an average. Forgetting powers that would end a fight quickly though... don't we have a specific term for that kind of thing?
Yes, in character clause. Which you always ignore anyway.

krisblaze
@Phil, that's the exception not the rule.

quanchi112
Originally posted by abhilegend
Kryptonite is. It's radiation make up isn't.

And if you try to simulate kryptonite and you are from a different universe, it doesn't works. So you concede Superman doesn't stand a chance if he created Knite.

abhilegend
Originally posted by krisblaze
@Phil, that's the exception not the rule.

No, that's the rule. Kryptonite is incredibly difficult to create and even if you create the radiation, it wouldn't affect an alternate universe kryptoninan.

abhilegend
What this really proves is that Hulk has cosmic awareness.

https://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/13/136540/3044919-0373038393-Hulkv.jpg

He "knew" Gladiator has a radiation weakness.

And Surfer fans know deep down that without "imaginary" tactics like weakness exploitation Surfer doesn't stands a chance against Superman.

Isn't that right Goober?

krisblaze
Originally posted by abhilegend
No, that's the rule. Kryptonite is incredibly difficult to create and even if you create the radiation, it wouldn't affect an alternate universe kryptoninan.
Surfer wouldn't be creating Marvel-Kryptontite, he'd obviously create earth-1 kryptonite or whatever works on the Superman he's fighting.

Characters rarely have to know the makeup of the energy or whatever they create. That's usually been the stick for some of the Firestorms, never for the Surfer. And if it was then he could cosmic awareness it easily enough or get it like he did from an easy scan against Glads.

I usually ignore weakness exploitation, but you'd have to be borderline retarded to deny this.

darthgoober
Originally posted by abhilegend
You can ask him. He wouldn't tell you this though.

https://s1.postimg.org/3ukcdqgy7f/sil08.jpg

Wait if you have those scans, do you have the ones in which she was depowered?

Originally posted by abhilegend
Are you continuing your years long dodging to show a single Surfer radiation based weakness exploitation?

Should I take your concession that you don't have any such scans?
His encounter with Glads demonstrates it.


Originally posted by abhilegend
So you don't have any explanation and are just flinging your opinion as fact for years?

Figured.

The plot is an explanation lol

Originally posted by abhilegend
Where he did not actually do that? And neither did he against Krosakis who had his powers.

He didn't need to do that, but the threat shows it's within his character. Any proof that Krosakis(who also had the enigma force) shared Glad's weakness?

Originally posted by abhilegend
Has he used radiation based weakness or fire weakness? As you claimed is in character for him so he must have used it a lot.

Yes or not?
Yeah, he's used a radiation based weakness against the hulk. And he's used various forms of energy manipulation against multiple people. And there's the thing against Glads.

Originally posted by abhilegend
That was just a bluff. Lunatik left the planet later without dying in Drax series.
It wasn't a bluff. Lunatik escaped that planet before his run in with Drax. He actually escaped it in an issue that explained he was constantly evolving past things(kinda like Doomsday). He escaped, went to Earth, beat Hercules h2h, and then got beaten by either the Black Widow or Wasp I believe lol. But anyway it wasn't a bluff, he simply evolved past Surfer's effect apparently.

darthgoober
Originally posted by abhilegend
What this really proves is that Hulk has cosmic awareness.

https://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/13/136540/3044919-0373038393-Hulkv.jpg

He "knew" Gladiator has a radiation weakness.

And Surfer fans know deep down that without "imaginary" tactics like weakness exploitation Surfer doesn't stands a chance against Superman.

Isn't that right Goober?
Well that whole thing is bogus because his weakness is against STROMIAN(or however it's spelled) radiation not radiation in general. So the whole thing is simply poor writing.

abhilegend
Originally posted by krisblaze
Surfer wouldn't be creating Marvel-Kryptontite, he'd obviously create earth-1 kryptonite or whatever works on the Superman he's fighting.


He isn't that adapt. There are differences due to quantum nature of the different universes.

Well he never scanned Gladiator to begin with.

And Surfer can't create something with no knowledge. That's consistent over the years as well.



What's retarded is that he has never used it once in 60 years but somehow every time Surfer uses it against Superman.

Can he create Drax's weakness radiation to kill Thanos too?

By that logic Superman uses counter vibrations to erase him from the existence and unlike Surfer he has actually used it.

StiltmanFTW
Originally posted by darthgoober
STROMIAN(or however it's spelled)

Strontian.

darthgoober
Originally posted by abhilegend
He isn't that adapt. There are differences due to quantum nature of the different universes.

Well he never scanned Gladiator to begin with.

And Surfer can't create something with no knowledge. That's consistent over the years as well.



What's retarded is that he has never used it once in 60 years but somehow every time Surfer uses it against Superman.

Can he create Drax's weakness radiation to kill Thanos too?

By that logic Superman uses counter vibrations to erase him from the existence and unlike Surfer he has actually used it.
Where has it been consistently shown that he can't create something of which he has no knowledge? As I pointed out, he can't even operate a computer without the power cosmic but can with the power cosmic. Hell he can reprogram super computers with the power cosmic.

DarkSaint85
Even if Surfer detects Supermans weakness/has common knowledge, the opposite is also true.

And what is easier to argue, creating the specific type of Kryptonite or whatever...or a punch to the face?

All the arguments that Surfer is tailor made to take out Superman kinda ignores that Surfer also has a 'weakness' that Superman is tailor made to exploit - being punched.

Not to mention,Superman has a villain who's literally his weakness - Metallo. And another who is a specialist in draining - Parasite.

darthgoober
Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
Strontian.
My bad lol

abhilegend
Originally posted by darthgoober
Wait if you have those scans, do you have the ones in which she was depowered?


Yes, of course.

Where?

Not for 50 years and no such feats from Surfer.

Him not using it shows he does not.

Any proof that he didn't? Anyone using strontians powers is susceptible to their weaknesses too.



He drained Hulk. Never used radiation weakness.

Never used it against Gladiator. Or Krosakis. Or Dr Spectrum. Or Namor. Or Tyrak. Or Attuma.

It was AFTER that scene.

Let me know where he evolved from what Surfer did as you're just making it up.

abhilegend
Originally posted by darthgoober
Well that whole thing is bogus because his weakness is against STROMIAN(or however it's spelled) radiation not radiation in general. So the whole thing is simply poor writing.
He said Gladiator is weakened to a particular weakness.

Let it be clear, Surfer knowing Gladiator's weakness out of blue is cosmic awareness but Hulk knowing it is poor writing?

Hulk uses Gladiator's weakness 10/10? Right?

abhilegend
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Even if Surfer detects Supermans weakness/has common knowledge, the opposite is also true.

And what is easier to argue, creating the specific type of Kryptonite or whatever...or a punch to the face?

All the arguments that Surfer is tailor made to take out Superman kinda ignores that Surfer also has a 'weakness' that Superman is tailor made to exploit - being punched.

Not to mention,Superman has a villain who's literally his weakness - Metallo. And another who is a specialist in draining - Parasite.
Goober thinks Surfer creating kryptonite is easier than Superman throwing a punch though.

abhilegend
And once again a thread is consumed by Goober's imaginary tactics being argued ad nauseam.

How about actual in character feats Goober? Or are you just chicken that Surfer will never beat Superman that way?

darthgoober
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Even if Surfer detects Supermans weakness/has common knowledge, the opposite is also true.

And what is easier to argue, creating the specific type of Kryptonite or whatever...or a punch to the face?

All the arguments that Surfer is tailor made to take out Superman kinda ignores that Surfer also has a 'weakness' that Superman is tailor made to exploit - being punched.

Not to mention,Superman has a villain who's literally his weakness - Metallo. And another who is a specialist in draining - Parasite.
Surfer's got the defensive abilities to make punching him more difficult and sufficient durability to shrug off a fair amount of damage. He's got a great ranged game, good speed, force fields, and intangibility to buy time even if we assume for some reason that he's going to take a minute or two to "will" blasts of kryptonite radiation. Or red sun energy.

Philosophía
Originally posted by darthgoober
His resistance is inconsistent, yes. Surfer has things about him that are inconsistent as well, and for those things we try to establish an average. Forgetting powers that would end a fight quickly though... don't we have a specific term for that kind of thing? You haven't provided anything on Surfer's side to be even a drop in the ocean as far as Superman's energy absorbtion/control is concerned against Surfer's draining his opponents. In fact, you keep spouting 'his resistance is inconsistent' without knowing shit about how it is, since you don't even read Superman comics.

The sooner you drop this 'Surfer can drain him', the sooner you'll be better. Because this will take an unfortunate turn of events when it will be insisted on that Superman can drain Surfer.

Originally posted by darthgoober
No he doesn't. He's got nothing to support the idea that he has the technical knowledge to build a spaceship from the ground up yet he's built spaceships with the power cosmic. Hell there was even an instance where he was without powers and a lady asked him if he could operate a computer and he flat out said that he could if he had his power cosmic but couldn't without it.

Please, show me Surfer scanning an opponent he has never met's DNA, understanding a weakness he doesn't even know to search for, then recreating that highly-complex element that he has never encountered...mid-fight. The same element that a matter-transmutator of the highest order had to take time, while sitting on a table, while KNOWING OF ITS EXISTENCE, and KNOWING ITS MAKE-UP, in order to replicate it, in multiple attempts.

darthgoober
Originally posted by abhilegend
Yes, of course.

Cool do you mind posting them?

Originally posted by abhilegend
Where?
Because he lets him know that he's both willing and able to do it, hence it's in character.

Originally posted by abhilegend
Not for 50 years and no such feats from Surfer.

You're asking about why he didn't turn Ben Grim human, the plot absolutely is an explanation.

Originally posted by abhilegend
Him not using it shows he does not.

Any proof that he didn't? Anyone using strontians powers is susceptible to their weaknesses too.
No him not using it shows that it didn't come to that nothing more.

Now you're asking for proof a negative. It's your claim that Krosakis had Glad's weakness, where was this in anyway suggested? He didn't become stomian, h just absorbed Glad's energy.

Originally posted by abhilegend
He drained Hulk. Never used radiation weakness.

Never used it against Gladiator. Or Krosakis. Or Dr Spectrum. Or Namor. Or Tyrak. Or Attuma.

He was blasting Hulk to revert him in one encounter, that's not draining.


Originally posted by abhilegend
It was AFTER that scene.

Let me know where he evolved from what Surfer did as you're just making it up.
What do you mean, after what scene?

Are you familiar with the issue in question? I'm pretty sure it opens talking about Lunatik's evolutionary abilities.

darthgoober
Originally posted by abhilegend
And once again a thread is consumed by Goober's imaginary tactics being argued ad nauseam.

How about actual in character feats Goober? Or are you just chicken that Surfer will never beat Superman that way?

carver9
Diana would be his hardest fight imo due to skill, the bracelets, lasso and strength. The rest of the people, Surfer could get a clean sweep if he actually tried. He could wrap majority of these people in adamantium and they wouldn't be able to do a thing against it afterwards.

darthgoober
Originally posted by abhilegend
And once again a thread is consumed by Goober's imaginary tactics being argued ad nauseam.

How about actual in character feats Goober? Or are you just chicken that Surfer will never beat Superman that way?
Hey were we supposed to have a BZ where weakness exploitation was off the table as a rule, you refused to participate when you realized you were going to lose lol.

carver9
Originally posted by quanchi112
Care to respond to me. Face me.

He fears you. You are his Freddy Krueger.

Philosophía
Originally posted by darthgoober
Hey were we supposed to have a BZ where weakness exploitation was off the table as a rule, you refused to participate when you realized you were going to lose lol. I'll gladly have a battlezone with you forum Superman vs forum Surfer. I'm not taking anything off the table - forum rules. This weekend?

darthgoober

darthgoober

Philosophía
Originally posted by darthgoober
You're a higher caliber of debater than Abhi by a fair share, I would actually feel the need to gather a good amount of scans and such if I were to debate you so it would take a while because my library is LONG gone lol. If you honestly want to have a Supes vs Surfer BZ in the future then we absolutely, but it'll actually take me a while to get ready for such a thing. I was asking because I took a few days off from work at the end of the week.

Oh well, maybe in the future.

Anyhow, maybe this topic should get back to other stuff, like Surfer vs Captain Marvel or whatnot. Or Wonder Woman. There's only so much it can be talked about creating kryptonite.

Genii96
This is funny
Superman is one of 8 xters in the OP,yet this already derailed to a surfer vs superman thread


Just type your opinion and move on,jeez

darthgoober

darthgoober
Originally posted by Genii96
This is funny
Superman is one of 8 xters in the OP,yet this already derailed to a surfer vs superman thread


Just type your opinion and move on,jeez
I tried, abhi turned it into a whole big thing lol

Philosophía
Originally posted by darthgoober
Ah, yeah see my scan library is a distant memory due to an unfortunate incident involving a 44oz mountain dew and my external harddrive that I won't go into right now lol. But yes, we can totally have such a thing in the future if I can figure out how to reacquire all of my comics. Or we might be able to have one sooner if you want to have something like a "partners match" with me and someone like Ambient against you and someone else like abhi. I lost all of my Superman respect threads due to the 'ransom virus' which crypted all of my files , so I had to wipe all my hardware out.

Suffice to say, it was maddening.

Maybe abhi wants to debate ambient, but I'm not into the tag-teams, lol.

carver9
@Philo,

Hulk drained energy that had enough power to kill every living being on the planet (super humans, Skyfathers, etc...) and Surfer was still able to drain him. Don't understand the point of those scans.

DarkSaint85
The point was that Hulk detected Gladiator's weakness,much like Surfer did.

panthergod
The people pretending Surfer has a better than 3/10 shot at best are hilarious delusional Marvel partisans, exclusively. Superman can oneshot KO Surfer at will with any one of his conventional standard powers and tactics, as he has to people on a apr with and far above Surfer, but Surfer gonna do shit he does less than 30% of the time off the bat because... lol, delusion.

StiltmanFTW
This one, Phil?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/WannaCry_ransomware_attack

panthergod
Originally posted by darthgoober
Surfer's got the defensive abilities to make punching him more difficult and sufficient durability to shrug off a fair amount of damage. He's got a great ranged game, good speed, force fields, and intangibility to buy time even if we assume for some reason that he's going to take a minute or two to "will" blasts of kryptonite radiation. Or red sun energy.
so.. nothing then?

Because Superman is FAR faster tactically, can destroy any defenses Surfer can erect with ease, and can disrupt intangible beings.

issue, page number and panel where Surfer ever created Kryptonite?

I'll wait.

Philosophía
Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
This one, Phil?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/WannaCry_ransomware_attack Mine didn't have a timer. It had a .html page in every folder, linking me to instructions on how I can recover my file. I'd be able to tell you the exact one if I could remember the extension all of the crypted files were put in, but I forgot.

It was something very similar, either way.

leonidas
@phil--ambient v abhi would be hilarious. i actually can't believe no one has ever bz'd superman v ss before. if this were summer, i'd def take you up on the offer. thumb up of course, we still have our finals to finish. lol

Prof. T.C McAbe
How many wins out of ten

1. Superman 3/10
2. Orion 3/10
3. Captain Marvel 5/10
4. Lobo 4/10
5. Martian Manhunter 5/10
6. Captain Atom 7/10
7. Wonder Woman 6/10
8. Bizzaro 10/10

h1a8
Originally posted by darthgoober
1. 8-9
2. 6-7
3. 6-7
4. 6-7(unless we're talking about Lobo with the blood cloning)
5. 9-10
6. 8-9
7. 8
8. 8-9
I have some questions. I just want to know your opinion.

How do you think Surfer will beat Superman?

How do you think Surfer will beat Orion?

How do you think Surfer will beat WW?

abhilegend
Originally posted by darthgoober
Surfer's got the defensive abilities to make punching him more difficult and sufficient durability to shrug off a fair amount of damage. He's got a great ranged game, good speed, force fields, and intangibility to buy time even if we assume for some reason that he's going to take a minute or two to "will" blasts of kryptonite radiation. Or red sun energy.

And Superman has flash level Superspeed that makes it highly difficult for anyone to do that.

And his ridiculous punching power means it will take at most two to three punches to ko Surfer.

abhilegend
Originally posted by darthgoober
Cool do you mind posting them?


Yes, I do mind. Get your own damn scans.

No, because he has never done so. Or Superman uses counter vibrations to remove Surfer from existence.

No, it isn't. Not by your logic where he goes to exploit weaknesses from get go.

If he used it even once in 50 years, maybe.

Right now? He never uses it period.

Why is that a proof of negative? He had Gladiator's powers, he had his weaknesses as Gladiator wasn't born with the level of power he has. He went to a treatment and that's how he got the radiation weakness.

You're once again running away from proving your points.

Where? In Hulk 250 it was simply draining, in S'S 125 it was simply draining and in Order 3 it was Dr Strange who thought of reverting him to another persona.



You can read I presume?

Where is it stated that he evolved to get off the planet as you claimed?

abhilegend
Originally posted by darthgoober
Hey were we supposed to have a BZ where weakness exploitation was off the table as a rule, you refused to participate when you realized you were going to lose lol.
That's some Hilary Clinton level revision of history.

Who went begging to judges for favor gooby?

abhilegend
Originally posted by darthgoober
Surfer can drain his opponents from a distance, Supes can't as far as I know. What's more, I'm not sticking to energy absorption as THE way for Surfer to win so I don't know why you're so hung up on it.


Superman can cover any distance between them with his speed.

Yes, because he has never actually done it so you can't even show how much time it will take.

laughing out loud

abhilegend
Originally posted by darthgoober
You're a higher caliber of debater than Abhi by a fair share.

I'm higher caliber of debater than you too. Wanna know why? I actually prove what I say and don't rely on the favors of others to do it for me.

I'm ready for BZ as per forum rules anytime gooby, don't start running to judges for favor this time.

Philosophía
Originally posted by leonidas
@phil--ambient v abhi would be hilarious. i actually can't believe no one has ever bz'd superman v ss before. if this were summer, i'd def take you up on the offer. thumb up of course, we still have our finals to finish. lol I'd really like to see abhi vs goober, tbh.

Goober keeps talking shit about him, and I remember the last bz they tried went sideways because goob's opening post was basically shit-talking abhi and whatnot.

The hate is real.

I also think abhi would destroy him, tbh. lol

He knows a lot more about Surfer than goob knows about Superman.

DarkSaint85
I'm still willing to judge the BZ between Abhi and goober.

I certainly don't think goobers OP was doing anything wrong. Shit talking and their ilk all have their place, I was all set for a good match.

abhilegend
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
I'm still willing to judge the BZ between Abhi and goober.

I certainly don't think goobers OP was doing anything wrong. Shit talking and their ilk all have their place, I was all set for a good match.
I was not in a good position to the judges at the time and Goober knew it.

It may look like just shit talking to you but it wasn't and that's why I called him out. He was honestly surprised that I called out saint Goober on his BS. You should've seen his sycophants. It was like I committed some kind of crime.

laughing out loud

But yeah, I would destroy him and he knows it too. That's why he ran away the last time I asked him for BZ.

DarkSaint85
I was one of the judges.

abhilegend
Originally posted by carver9
He fears you. You are his Freddy Krueger.
laughing out loud

Somebody actually fears Quan? Get out.

abhilegend
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
I was one of the judges.
I know. It was right around the issue with me and Nihilist (Insane Titan).

Suffice to say I wasn't particularly well liked.

leonidas
if you're waiting around to be liked you'll never bz anyone. no expression

DarkSaint85
As opposed to leo, who is well liked but rarely wins thumb up

quanchi112
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
I'm still willing to judge the BZ between Abhi and goober.

I certainly don't think goobers OP was doing anything wrong. Shit talking and their ilk all have their place, I was all set for a good match. Phil somehow believes he doesn't shit talk and never ever uses double standards. It isn't because both he and Abhi favor Superman or anything to do with that obvious factoid. Goober would decimate Abhi and he already defeated him with one post. Abhi is just a scan dumper and nothing more.

quanchi112
Originally posted by abhilegend
laughing out loud

Somebody actually fears Quan? Get out. We were supposed to have a Superman battlezone but you walked away scared. How does that feel ?

https://media.giphy.com/media/sZlPeAYn3QXCM/giphy.gif

krisblaze
So it's settled then.

Abhi vs Goober.

Superman vs Surfer.

I'll gladly judge.

abhilegend
Originally posted by leonidas
if you're waiting around to be liked you'll never bz anyone. no expression
I've grown out of that phase where I wanted to be liked.

abhilegend
Originally posted by krisblaze
So it's settled then.

Abhi vs Goober.

Superman vs Surfer.

I'll gladly judge.
Goober would never agree. He wants him to be control of the character and uses imaginary tactics never used by the character.

I only argue for what's in the comics. And Goober knows he will lose that way.

krisblaze
I think you'd both feel a lot better after doing the BZ.

abhilegend
I really doubt it for Goober.

Ambient

Ambient

Stoic
Lobo is extremely resistant to energy assaults. Since the Surfer wouldn't find any glaring weaknesses in Lobo, he could very well be one of the most physically challenging opponents on the list. I could also see the Surfer dealing with him much in the same way that he dealt with Lunatik.

darthgoober
Originally posted by abhilegend
Yes, I do mind. Get your own damn scans.

Gee I wonder why that would be... possibly because when we look at the scans we don't see Surfer actually draining her...

https://comicvine.gamespot.com/images/1300-3750557
https://comicvine.gamespot.com/images/1300-3750558
https://comicvine.gamespot.com/images/1300-3750559

... I mean I certainly don't see any energy being transferred from her to Surfer.



Originally posted by abhilegend
No, because he has never done so. Or Superman uses counter vibrations to remove Surfer from existence.
Yes because he made it known he was willing to and the claim doesn't go against his nature as demonstrated when he's used energy manipulation to exploit vulnerabilities in his opponents before. If I have a history that includes hitting someone with a bat for pissing me off and I threaten to throw a chair at someone if they piss me off it can totally be said the instance supports throwing a chair to be within my character even if someone steps in to prevent the other person from pissing me off any further.

Originally posted by abhilegend
No, it isn't. Not by your logic where he goes to exploit weaknesses from get go.

I never said that he'd go for weakness exploitation from the get go.

Originally posted by abhilegend
If he used it even once in 50 years, maybe.

Right now? He never uses it period.

But he demonstrated his willingness to do so with the threat. The fact that he end up needing to is irrelevant.

Originally posted by abhilegend
Why is that a proof of negative? He had Gladiator's powers, he had his weaknesses as Gladiator wasn't born with the level of power he has. He went to a treatment and that's how he got the radiation weakness.

You're once again running away from proving your points.

Because you're asking for proof that he DIDN'T(a negative) have Glad's weakness when there was absolutely nothing to suggest that he did. Thus, you're asking for proof of a negative.

Originally posted by abhilegend
Where? In Hulk 250 it was simply draining, in S'S 125 it was simply draining and in Order 3 it was Dr Strange who thought of reverting him to another persona.

The time when Hulk screams that Surfer's killing him. I'm all but positive that Surfer's blasting him when he was screaming that.


Originally posted by abhilegend
You can read I presume?
Yes but your statements don't make sense.

Originally posted by abhilegend
Where is it stated that he evolved to get off the planet as you claimed?
You're claim is that Surfer had to be bluffing because Lunatik escaped but in the story where he escaped it was specifically talked about that Lunatik evolves past things. Thus his escape itself doesn't support your claim.

darthgoober
Originally posted by abhilegend
That's some Hilary Clinton level revision of history.

Who went begging to judges for favor gooby?
No that's what happened. You threw a hissy fit and refused to post.

darthgoober
Originally posted by abhilegend
I'm higher caliber of debater than you too. Wanna know why? I actually prove what I say and don't rely on the favors of others to do it for me.

I'm ready for BZ as per forum rules anytime gooby, don't start running to judges for favor this time.

Gee that's a mixed message abhi, do you really mean "as per forum rules" or...

Originally posted by abhilegend
Goober would never agree. He wants him to be control of the character and uses imaginary tactics never used by the character.

I only argue for what's in the comics. And Goober knows he will lose that way.

...which means that a character who can manipulate radiation won't create a specific frequency just because it's never been relevant for him to do so in his history?

DarkSaint85
Originally posted by Stoic
Lobo is extremely resistant to energy assaults. Since the Surfer wouldn't find any glaring weaknesses in Lobo, he could very well be one of the most physically challenging opponents on the list. I could also see the Surfer dealing with him much in the same way that he dealt with Lunatik.

Lobo uses his weakness awareness power, to pinpoint Surfers weaknesses and exploit them.

abhilegend
Originally posted by darthgoober
Gee I wonder why that would be... possibly because when we look at the scans we don't see Surfer actually draining her...

https://comicvine.gamespot.com/images/1300-3750557
https://comicvine.gamespot.com/images/1300-3750558
https://comicvine.gamespot.com/images/1300-3750559

... I mean I certainly don't see any energy being transferred from her to Surfer.


We don't see it happening it several times before. Not to mention her powers closely resembled power cosmic and he could drain it as he has far better control.

It's entirely irrelevant to draining Superman. She is a entirely featless character.

I'm specifically asking for radiation based weakness exploitation as you claimed. Don't change the goalposts.

Draining is not the same as detecting weakness as kryptonite or red sun radiation and actually doing it.

Don't change the goalposts. You said Surfer has a history of detecting weakness like kryptonite and red sun radiation. Show that now or concede you're a liar.

How much time will it take? How many times has he done it on panel?

I'm specifically asking for radiation weakness exploitation if you are not understanding still. Not energy manipulation.

It's entirely relevant as he never even tried it on someone with Gladiator's powers. Firestorm has used kryptonite on Superman and even SBP.

That's called weakness exploitation in character.

Surfer making a bluff isn't.

Because you claim this was a proof of Gladiator's weakness exploitation when it wasn't shown anywhere before or after.

I'm asking you to prove your claim.

In SS 125? He was draining Hulk and Hulk was already dying with no control over his energy.

Irrelevant.

In your alternate world maybe where Surfer can detect weaknesses.

But it wasn't shown in the Drax story where he actually escaped.

But I like your insinuation that the only way surfer can win against Lobo is run away from the fight.

abhilegend
Originally posted by darthgoober
No that's what happened. You threw a hissy fit and refused to post.

That's some revisionist history. I accepted to post again but you and your sycophants caused so much trouble everyone was banned and you ran away for years again.

abhilegend
Originally posted by darthgoober
Gee that's a mixed message abhi, do you really mean "as per forum rules" or...



...which means that a character who can manipulate radiation won't create a specific frequency just because it's never been relevant for him to do so in his history?

As per forum rules, characters fight IN CHARACTER. You seem to think you're controlling the character, it's not a tournament.

If you can prove its in character for Surfer to use it, sure you can. I won't argue that Firestorm will use kryptonite against Superman because he actually does that every time he goes against Superman.

So good luck with that.

darthgoober
Originally posted by abhilegend
We don't see it happening it several times before. Not to mention her powers closely resembled power cosmic and he could drain it as he has far better control.

It's entirely irrelevant to draining Superman. She is a entirely featless character.

He didn't drain her, that's the point. You claimed that all he did was drain her, I showed scans to indicate that he didn't.


Originally posted by abhilegend
I'm specifically asking for radiation based weakness exploitation as you claimed. Don't change the goalposts.

Draining is not the same as detecting weakness as kryptonite or red sun radiation and actually doing it.

He's done more than simple draining before.

Originally posted by abhilegend
Don't change the goalposts. You said Surfer has a history of detecting weakness like kryptonite and red sun radiation. Show that now or concede you're a liar.

How much time will it take? How many times has he done it on panel?

His face to face with Glads demonstrates it whether you like it or not. You act as though I'm the only one who supports that interpretation, I'm not.


Originally posted by abhilegend
I'm specifically asking for radiation weakness exploitation if you are not understanding still. Not energy manipulation.

It's entirely relevant as he never even tried it on someone with Gladiator's powers. Firestorm has used kryptonite on Superman and even SBP.

That's called weakness exploitation in character.

Surfer making a bluff isn't.

I have no problem saying that such a specific scenario thing hasn't come up before man. You act like I'm dodging a point, I'm not.


Originally posted by abhilegend
Because you claim this was a proof of Gladiator's weakness exploitation when it wasn't shown anywhere before or after.

I'm asking you to prove your claim.

It never came up again lol

Originally posted by abhilegend
In SS 125? He was draining Hulk and Hulk was already dying with no control over his energy.

Irrelevant.

He was using an energy blast, he wasn't pulling energy from Hulk into himself. Come to think of it, that's the exact kind of thing you were questioning before when you were talking about the way he always drained hulk instead of using radiation against him.


Originally posted by abhilegend
In your alternate world maybe where Surfer can detect weaknesses.

He can.

Originally posted by abhilegend
But it wasn't shown in the Drax story where he actually escaped.

But I like your insinuation that the only way surfer can win against Lobo is run away from the fight.

The Drax story wasn't the one in which he escaped the planet Surfer trapped him on. I told you, he escaped in the prior issue where he fought the Avengers.

darthgoober
Originally posted by abhilegend
That's some revisionist history. I accepted to post again but you and your sycophants caused so much trouble everyone was banned and you ran away for years again.
Hey you were the one arguing with the judges, that's the only trouble that was going down in our thread.

Originally posted by abhilegend
As per forum rules, characters fight IN CHARACTER. You seem to think you're controlling the character, it's not a tournament.

If you can prove its in character for Surfer to use it, sure you can. I won't argue that Firestorm will use kryptonite against Superman because he actually does that every time he goes against Superman.

So good luck with that.
lol

Damborgson
I volunteer to judge the battlezone.

Superman vs Surfer

3 posts each, counting your initial post as 1.

Winner is whoever can prove that their character is more likely to win. 3 judges.

Fighters are in character. What do you guys say?

Philosophía
Originally posted by Damborgson
I volunteer to judge the battlezone.

Superman vs Surfer

3 posts each, counting your initial post as 1.

Winner is whoever can prove that their character is more likely to win. 3 judges.

Fighters are in character. What do you guys say? I think you need more than 3 posts each, given the sheer volume.

Forum rules should be enough, imo.

Damborgson
Sure, that can be agreed on by the participants.

abhilegend
Originally posted by darthgoober
He didn't drain her, that's the point. You claimed that all he did was drain her, I showed scans to indicate that he didn't.


Where did you prove that? Where did he cut off her from her powers?

Radiation based weakness exploitation only as you said.

Argumentum ad populum? Now that's the last straw that you are desperate.

I don't care if the whole world agrees with you. It's incorrect and that's it.







See guys, the guy kept arguing for a scenario that has never been done by Surfer for a decade.

Concession accepted mate.




Surfer has never fought Gladiator or anyone with a specific weakness? He has fought atlanteans who are weakened against heat.

Never used it there too.

He was draining hulk. He refences him curing Hulk by draining him and Hulk even says that can't happen again because he was separated from Banner.

Are you really this desperate?

Are you sure? You just conceded that he has never done so.



You really have no idea where he appeared again, do you? He appeared again in Cosmic Powers Unlimited and he was never specifically stated to evolve to escape.

abhilegend
Originally posted by darthgoober
Hey you were the one arguing with the judges, that's the only trouble that was going down in our thread.


Like I said revisionist history mate.

Something funny with the forum rules? But you just conceded that you basically argued an imaginary scenario for a whole decade, so I don't think you follow any forum rules or any comics.

darthgoober
Originally posted by abhilegend
Where did you prove that? Where did he cut off her from her powers?

I posted the scans showing he didn't drain her, that's where I proved it.


Originally posted by abhilegend
Radiation based weakness exploitation only as you said.
Against the Hulk, as you've brought my attention to.



Originally posted by abhilegend
Argumentum ad populum? Now that's the last straw that you are desperate.

I don't care if the whole world agrees with you. It's incorrect and that's it.

I'm not saying that I'm right because most people agree with me, I'm saying that your staunch denial of my interpretation of so subjective of a topic is obviously misguided.

Originally posted by abhilegend
You know, if the whole world disagreed with your interpretation you really my want to consider that you're interpreting it wrong. The fact that you wouldn't even in that particular extreme really shows there's some underlying issue with your thought process. Hell just flip it and say that there's absolutely nothing wrong with me or anyone else making any claim they want about comics and just say that everyone else in the world is wrong.


See guys, the guy kept arguing for a scenario that has never been done by Surfer for a decade.

Concession accepted mate.

You think I've been going around telling people that last week Surfer replicated the scene last week lol

Originally posted by abhilegend
Surfer has never fought Gladiator or anyone with a specific weakness? He has fought atlanteans who are weakened against heat.

Never used it there too.

Nope he never fought Gladiator, but he has fought the Hulk and used it there.

Originally posted by abhilegend
He was draining hulk. He refences him curing Hulk by draining him and Hulk even says that can't happen again because he was separated from Banner.

Are you really this desperate?

He was using an energy blast that was draining Hulk not simply absorbing his energy, obviously he was using some kind of "counter energy" or some such thing.


Originally posted by abhilegend
Are you sure? You just conceded that he has never done so.

No I said that specific scenario hasn't come up, not that he'd never detected the radiation weakness in an individual and made it known he was willing and able to use it against the guy.

Originally posted by abhilegend
You really have no idea where he appeared again, do you? He appeared again in Cosmic Powers Unlimited and he was never specifically stated to evolve to escape.

Hey just because nothing short of an on the nose statement makes things clear to you in regards to Surfer doesn't mean that everyone else falls so short at deductive reasoning.

darthgoober
Originally posted by abhilegend
Like I said revisionist history mate.

Something funny with the forum rules? But you just conceded that you basically argued an imaginary scenario for a whole decade, so I don't think you follow any forum rules or any comics.
Do you need to see the screenshots of our match as a reminder of who it was causing a ruckus in our BZ?

Of course Surfer creating K-night hasn't happened, he's not in DC... duh. But him using energy manipulation to exploit his opponents weaknesses/vulnerabilities is a thing, his ability to create specific frequencies of energy/radiation to that effect is a thing.

darthgoober

abhilegend
Originally posted by darthgoober
I posted the scans showing he didn't drain her, that's where I proved it.


Where is that shown? All he did was depower her. There is no indication that he cut her off from her powers.

So you really are THAT desperate.



http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-4cTepkFgm3Q/VoTXY1PNFDI/AAAAAAAAS2I/FjH8_4hAkQA/s1600-Ic42/RCO025.jpg
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-PnzVhyRoJ0o/VoTXZFHB5vI/AAAAAAAAS1w/pcEFdTE-DIw/s1600-Ic42/RCO026.jpg
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-F9q_SWPSNBs/VoTXZAUnpUI/AAAAAAAAS1w/Sntk8g0KMYw/s1600-Ic42/RCO027.jpg

Surfer flat out says that as he once drained the gamma radiation from Hulk, he is doing it again.

And fails to drain the hulk totally who stuns him and leaps away.

laughing out loud

It's not denial. You're just wrong.

Are you not going around in every thread featuring Superman and Surfer that Surfer goes for weakness exploitation since last decade?

Imagine me going in every thread claiming Superman oneshots kills Surfer. It's exactly like what you claim.

Because it has never happened.

No, he didn't. You're just grasping at straws now.

crylaugh

He was doing the exact thing he did in Hulk 250, draining his gamma radiation.

It's just an artistic interpretation of Surfer draining hulk.

In which he failed BTW.



No backtracking now.

You said it yourself that Surfer has never done so.

Live with that now.

You sure can't read a simple statement as well.

abhilegend
Originally posted by darthgoober
Do you need to see the screenshots of our match as a reminder of who it was causing a ruckus in our BZ?


Of mine posts only I assume? Do you have what you posted?

When has he created a specific frequency too? Kryptonite is DC specific, but red sun radiation isn't.

Let's see how many times he has created specific frequencies to bring down a specific character.

I hope you have at least that.

darthgoober
Originally posted by abhilegend
Where is that shown? All he did was depower her. There is no indication that he cut her off from her powers.

He obviously did if he she ended up powerless without him draining her. 2+2 man.


Originally posted by abhilegend
So you really are THAT desperate.



http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-4cTepkFgm3Q/VoTXY1PNFDI/AAAAAAAAS2I/FjH8_4hAkQA/s1600-Ic42/RCO025.jpg
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-PnzVhyRoJ0o/VoTXZFHB5vI/AAAAAAAAS1w/pcEFdTE-DIw/s1600-Ic42/RCO026.jpg
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-F9q_SWPSNBs/VoTXZAUnpUI/AAAAAAAAS1w/Sntk8g0KMYw/s1600-Ic42/RCO027.jpg

Surfer flat out says that as he once drained the gamma radiation from Hulk, he is doing it again.

And fails to drain the hulk totally who stuns him and leaps away.

He didn't do it that way before, he's using some form of energy blast this time. Again, 2+2.


Originally posted by abhilegend
laughing out loud

It's not denial. You're just wrong.

And it's ok for you to think I'm wrong, but the way you seem to insinuate that there's no reason for me to believe such a thing is obviously a stretch because there are plenty of people who share my interpretation.

Originally posted by abhilegend
Are you not going around in every thread featuring Superman and Surfer that Surfer goes for weakness exploitation since last decade?

Imagine me going in every thread claiming Superman oneshots kills Surfer. It's exactly like what you claim.

Because it has never happened.

No I'm not. I generally try not even to get involved in drawn out debates between the two because it's been done to death. I do believe it's an option for him that he will use if such a thing becomes necessary and there's plenty to support that stance IMO. But I've never said that he creates specific frequencies of radiation to beat opponents all the time in comics or anything like that, just that he's exploited weaknesses/vulnerabilities via energy manipulation quite a bit.


Originally posted by abhilegend
No, he didn't. You're just grasping at straws now.

crylaugh

He was doing the exact thing he did in Hulk 250, draining his gamma radiation.

It's just an artistic interpretation of Surfer draining hulk.

In which he failed BTW.

Sure he did, you posted the scans.



Originally posted by abhilegend
No backtracking now.

You said it yourself that Surfer has never done so.

Live with that now.

We're talking here about whether or not he can detect weaknesses, I never said that he's never detected a weakness. If you believe I said or insinuated such a thing, please quote it and what it's in response to.


Originally posted by abhilegend
You sure can't read a simple statement as well.
I can read a simple statement just fine, whether or not it can be understood is dependent upon the other parties ability to adequately confer his thoughts wink

darthgoober
Originally posted by abhilegend
Of mine posts only I assume? Do you have what you posted?

When has he created a specific frequency too? Kryptonite is DC specific, but red sun radiation isn't.

Let's see how many times he has created specific frequencies to bring down a specific character.

I hope you have at least that.
No I'm pretty sure I have screenshots of the whole thread. As for what I posted, do you mean my opening or my repeated attempts at getting you to respond?

Against the Hulk with that blast. He also let Glads know he could create such a specific frequency smile

abhilegend
Originally posted by darthgoober
He obviously did if he she ended up powerless without him draining her. 2+2 man.


Hahaha, what? Drained characters become powerless as well.

Exactly, he can drain with an energy blast. It does not means it was something else.

What you're trying to say is exactly opposite of what the comic says.

It was just draining. Nothing else.

Then they are wrong too. Simple as that.



Then why have you failed to produce a single feat of such other than a statement which turned out to be a bluff?

Where are the feats dude? You're only talking out of your ass now.

laughing out loud

Those were only draining. You're objectively wrong again.

You never posted anything that shows he can detect weakness like Karnak.

You showed him stating that he knows Gladiator's weakness.

So did Hulk out of blue.

So did Rocket Raccoon and Rachel Summers.

So did Skrulls.

So did Shiar Emperor.

Do all these characters detect weakness too?

You simply can't at this point. Interpretating that Surfer was doing anything but draining hulk in SS 125 merely confirms it.

abhilegend
Originally posted by darthgoober
No I'm pretty sure I have screenshots of the whole thread. As for what I posted, do you mean my opening or my repeated attempts at getting you to respond?


Post those then. Let's see who did what.

He only drained hulk.

He only stated so. He never actually did that.

You don't have him creating any specific frequency as well, do you?

Forget kryptonite, prove Surfer can even produce red sun radiation now.

darthgoober
Originally posted by abhilegend
Hahaha, what? Drained characters become powerless as well.
But as we saw, he didn't drain her

Originally posted by abhilegend
Exactly, he can drain with an energy blast. It does not means it was something else.

What you're trying to say is exactly opposite of what the comic says.

It was just draining. Nothing else.

Hey if he can create a specific kind of energy that exploits Hulk's radiation based weaknesses... seems pretty relevant to the discussion. He wasn't simply absorbing energy as he'd done previously. Hell that's the exact kind of thing you were asking for on page two when you questioned why he never used gamma radiation to revert the Hulk to human form.


Originally posted by abhilegend
Then they are wrong too. Simple as that.

lol



Originally posted by abhilegend
Then why have you failed to produce a single feat of such other than a statement which turned out to be a bluff?

Where are the feats dude? You're only talking out of your ass now.

It didn't just turn out to be a bluff.

I already told you, stuff like his showings against Wonderman, Jack of Hearts, and that demon looking chick. Those are instances of him exploiting weaknesses other than draining... duh.


Originally posted by abhilegend
laughing out loud

Those were only draining. You're objectively wrong again.

Him creating a specific kind of energy which was draining Hulk.


Originally posted by abhilegend
You never posted anything that shows he can detect weakness like Karnak.

You showed him stating that he knows Gladiator's weakness.

So did Hulk out of blue.

So did Rocket Raccoon and Rachel Summers.

So did Skrulls.

So did Shiar Emperor.

Do all these characters detect weakness too?

You're obsessing over the wrong aspect of it. It's not a big deal that he knew there was a weakness, it's that he knew could detect the specific frequency of radiation to do the job. No matter what he knows that Supes has the vulnerability in accordance with forum rules. Either His cosmic senses/cosmic awareness will clue him in on the specific frequency necessary to do the job or he doesn't need to know the specific frequency and just "wills" K-nite blasts and leaves the details up to the power cosmic.

Originally posted by abhilegend
You simply can't at this point. Interpretation that Surfer was doing anything but draining hulk in SS 125 merely confirms it.

With a form of energy...

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