Scenario: Sidious won back in RoTJ, Abeloth is coming.

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Jmanghan
What happens now?

There were specific things that Luke had to do to kill Abeloth, so now that he (and presumably every other rebel) died at the Battle of Endor, and the universe is finally Palpatine's, how does he deal with Abeloth?

DarthSkywalker0
Abeloth wouldn't be coming.

One Big Mob
Sidious makes her cum

Kurk
He an hero's

Zentrex
The bringer of Chaos brings chaos.

Trocity
Originally posted by DarthSkywalker0
Abeloth wouldn't be coming.

thumb up

Azronger
Originally posted by DarthSkywalker0
Abeloth wouldn't be coming.

This, or Sheev waits until he's powerful enough to confront her

Jmanghan
Originally posted by Azronger
This, or Sheev waits until he's powerful enough to confront her I mean, Palps could train for centuries and still not be powerful enough to confront her. Not by himself, anyway.

NewGuy01
Originally posted by DarthSkywalker0
Abeloth wouldn't be coming.

The Ellimist
Uhhh if Sidious defied the Force's will and defeated Anakin, wouldn't this be a "release Abeloth"-tier event?

Emperordmb
Originally posted by DarthSkywalker0
Abeloth wouldn't be coming.
She came before Jacen did his thing. Jacen doing his shit isn't the only thing capable of releasing her. Something would've certainly happened at some point to bring her down upon the Galaxy.

DarthSkywalker0
Originally posted by Emperordmb
She came before Jacen did his thing. Jacen doing his shit isn't the only thing capable of releasing her. Something would've certainly happened at some point to bring her down upon the Galaxy.

I am aware of that. But, the question is, is Sidious's victory against the force's will in this alternate reality?

Jmanghan
Originally posted by DarthSkywalker0
I am aware of that. But, the question is, is Sidious's victory against the force's will in this alternate reality? Sidious found ways to (sorta) live forever, in the form of getting new bodies, so whenever it DID happen, Sidious would still be around.

Sinious
Sidious could easily surpass her given enough time, which probably wouldn't be more than a couple centuries.

Jmanghan
Originally posted by Sinious
Sidious could easily surpass her given enough time, which probably wouldn't be more than a couple centuries.

People, have limitations, except if they're the chosen one.

Yoda had a very long lifespan and was only able to keep up with RoTS Palpatine.

There are some people you just can't touch.

You think a few centuries is enough to put him above someone who could stomp an Amped Luke that had achieved Oneness, with the help of Darth Krayt? Darth Krayt also being one of the most powerful beings in the galaxy?

Rockydonovang
Originally posted by Sinious
Sidious could easily surpass her given enough time, which probably wouldn't be more than a couple centuries.
A mortal having the capacity to surpass an embodiment of the force would be the dumbest thing since...

Dark Empire 2.

Sinious
Originally posted by Jmanghan
People, have limitations, except if they're the chosen one. This is rather stupid. Every being has limits, unless they're truly omnipotent. Did Yoda ever try to achieve more power than his natural growth like Palpatine? If not, this comparison is pointless. If Abeloth is truly untouchable, how did they stop her? If you mean she is vastly above them, but not actually untouchable, then yes, it is possible for Palpatine to reach that power given enough time. Originally posted by Rockydonovang
A mortal having the capacity to surpass an embodiment of the force would be the dumbest thing since...

Dark Empire 2. LMFAO. What does mortal mean? If you use the word loosely, then Palpatine is immortal as well. If not, then the Ones aren't even immortal themselves. Don't forget the Father grew too old in time and was dying.

What does embodiment of the Force mean? If you take that literally, why not take similar quotes about Palpatine literally? Also, if you're actually suggesting that they represent the full power of an alignment (which means a quarter of the power Force itself has?), then how did the likes of Luke and Krayt perform as well as they did against Abeloth? If you're not taking it so literally, then just how much power does being an embodiment of the Force translate to?

The dumbest thing here would be the idea of Luke being like %10 of a literally universal being.

Jmanghan
Originally posted by Sinious
This is rather stupid. Every being has limits, unless they're truly omnipotent. Did Yoda ever try to achieve more power than his natural growth like Palpatine? If not, this comparison is pointless. If Abeloth is truly untouchable, how did they stop her? If you mean she is vastly above them, but not actually untouchable, then yes, it is possible for Palpatine to reach that power given enough time. LMFAO. What does mortal mean? If you use the word loosely, then Palpatine is immortal as well. If not, then the Ones aren't even immortal themselves. Don't forget the Father grew too old in time and was dying.

What does embodiment of the Force mean? If you take that literally, why not take similar quotes about Palpatine literally? Also, if you're actually suggesting that they represent the full power of an alignment (which means a quarter of the power Force itself has?), then how did the likes of Luke and Krayt perform as well as they did against Abeloth? If you're not taking it so literally, then just how much power does being an embodiment of the Force translate to?

The dumbest thing here would be the idea of Luke being like %10 of a literally universal being.

We're saying that it's impossible, even if given 10,000 years, for Palpatine to surpass Abeloth, his limits are below her power.

I'd even doubt Palpatine can surpass Oneness Luke, tbh, who Abeloth is much more powerful then.

If Luke was alone he would have gotten absolutely destroyed, it would have been a complete Massacre, Krayt managed to have powers that significantly contributed to the fight, if not more then Luke did, and thats the only reason they "stopped her", had Krayt just been some powerhouse Jedi, they would have been destroyed.

Hell, I doubt even 2 Oneness Lukes could defeat her, just because they don't have the right powerset to deal with her.

Sinious
Originally posted by Jmanghan
We're saying that it's impossible, even if given 10,000 years, for Palpatine to surpass Abeloth, his limits are below her power.

I'd even doubt Palpatine can surpass Oneness Luke, tbh, who Abeloth is much more powerful then.
Based on what? Palpatine was planning on draining every living thing in the galaxy, and then do the same to other galaxies until there is nothing left. Read The Apotheosis of Palpatine and properly understand what a couple centuries with Palpatine means for the galaxy. thumb up

The idea of Palpatine spending centuries draining every living being his empire encounters and not surpassing Oneness Luke is beyond ludicrous.
So, Palpatine spending centuries to gain more and more power doesn't even add up to Krayt's abilities? laughing out loud

The fact that they could touch her means that she isn't some galaxy buster. She is still relatively close enough to be surpassed given enough time, which is a lot shorter for Palpatine.

Sinious
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Geistalt
Abeloth destroys the Sith and restores balance to the Force.

Jmanghan
Originally posted by Sinious
Based on what? Palpatine was planning on draining every living thing in the galaxy, and then do the same to other galaxies until there is nothing left. Read The Apotheosis of Palpatine and properly understand what a couple centuries with Palpatine means for the galaxy. thumb up

The idea of Palpatine spending centuries draining every living being his empire encounters and not surpassing Oneness Luke is beyond ludicrous.
So, Palpatine spending centuries to gain more and more power doesn't even add up to Krayt's abilities? laughing out loud

The fact that they could touch her means that she isn't some galaxy buster. She is still relatively close enough to be surpassed given enough time, which is a lot shorter for Palpatine. Abeloth was just going to straight up destroy everything.

Sinious
Originally posted by Jmanghan
Abeloth was just going to straight up destroy everything. What does that even mean?

Zentrex
Originally posted by Sinious
What does that even mean?

It means Abeloth is the bringer of chaos, and she was going to bring chaos to the universe. Also, the son and daughter are universe-level, and they're not as powerful as Abeloth, even combined.

Sinious is going totally Azronger here, but yeah, now that I think about it, if Palpatine went through with his "magocracy" plan, then he'd defenitely be able to defeat Abeloth.

But I've always hated that Palpatine. So, if we're going by the Palpatine that would never have gained "power of the ultimate sort," then he has a very small chance, though it is possible that through his other dark siders and his immense knowledge, he'd be able to put up some sort of a fight.

Sinious
So, you guys are saying that Luke and Krayt can contend with universe level beings (in your case, Palps can as well), and I'm saying that these characters are inconceivably far from universe level, so Abeloth who is defeated by them can't really be universe level, but I'm the one who is pulling an Azronger here? Yep, that totally makes sense. thumb up

Zentrex
They had as much on their side as they possibly could, and still they got lucky with what happened. Abeloth may not be universe level, but she's far above the powers of Dark Empire Palpatine.

Azronger
Originally posted by Zentrex
Sinious is going totally Azronger here

laughing out loud

Sinious
Originally posted by Zentrex
They had as much on their side as they possibly could, and still they got lucky with what happened. Abeloth may not be universe level, but she's far above the powers of Dark Empire Palpatine. So, in your post right before this one, you claim that Abeloth is above the combined powers of two universal beings, but now you're saying that she isn't universe level. Your stances change every 2 minutes because they're disgustingly illogical and therefore impossible to defend. That's probably why you try to survive via strawmans.

For example, I never said Abeloth isn't far above DE Sidious, but I did point out how he could easily become incomparably more powerful to the point where his mere presence would melt the likes of Luke and his DE self, especially if he is given a couple centuries to do it. If you actually are capable of reading, then read the Apotheosis link I provided earlier in this thread.

Zentrex
Abeloth is more powerful than the Son and the Daughter. The problem with "Universe level" statements is that we don't know how long it would take the Son and Daughter or Abeloth to tear apart the universe, but they could all do it. As shown from Abeloth's fight, however, they couldn't do it on the snap of a finger.

I know about Sidious' magocracy plan, I even admitted that if he went through with it, he might win, but as I said, if Sidious were to not go through with it and just maximize his potential as a mortal force wielder, then he would be about Dark Empire Palpatine level, if not a little greater. That's not enough to defeat Abeloth.

Sinious
Clearly, you're not familiar enough with what Palpatine's capable of:

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-2hDT3QwO6ec/WzjtrYOb1WI/AAAAAAAAQ3U/DiRX5dx_UBs7HwXOV5nObm8ekTrT1OWoQCL0BGAYYCw/h140/7475569986673457639%253Faccount_id%253D1

Given how you like to take such statements literally, I can't wait to see you defend Palpatine's universe tier powers from this point on. thumb up

Azronger
Technically, "all of space" may not be constricted to just a single third dimensional universe. If you really want to go there, you could argue that it's referring to all universes in the multiverse or even all of fourth dimensional space, which would mean Palpatine has infinite power and can consume all of time. Or it could mean all of fifth dimensional space and so Sidious would be beyond the concept of time entirely, making him already superior to Abeloth since time is irrelevant to him.

Just give up, Zentrex. You can't beat Sheev.

Sinious
thumb up

Let's all embrace the new era of KMC, where Bart and ILS are gone and Palpatine is One Above All tier. laughing out loud

Rockydonovang
Originally posted by Sinious
If you use the word loosely, then Palpatine is immortal as well.

I'm aware of all the opness sidious has. All of which remains incredibly stupid from a narrative point of view.

Zentrex
Originally posted by Sinious
Clearly, you're not familiar enough with what Palpatine's capable of:

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-2hDT3QwO6ec/WzjtrYOb1WI/AAAAAAAAQ3U/DiRX5dx_UBs7HwXOV5nObm8ekTrT1OWoQCL0BGAYYCw/h140/7475569986673457639%253Faccount_id%253D1

Given how you like to take such statements literally, I can't wait to see you defend Palpatine's universe tier powers from this point on. thumb up

"All of space" doesn't have to mean "universe." It can mean lots of things. It tears the fabric of space itself, so it could be referring to the concept of space holistically.

Originally posted by Azronger
Technically, "all of space" may not be constricted to just a single third dimensional universe. If you really want to go there, you could argue that it's referring to all universes in the multiverse or even all of fourth dimensional space, which would mean Palpatine has infinite power and can consume all of time. Or it could mean all of fifth dimensional space and so Sidious would be beyond the concept of time entirely, making him already superior to Abeloth since time is irrelevant to him.

Just give up, Zentrex. You can't beat Sheev.
Don't you see? You're the one beating Sheev. What makes a villain in star wars scary is that they're powerful and evil. What makes Sidious terrifying is that he's a bigger mastermind than he is a force wielder, and that's after being the most powerful dark sider to ever live. To rob him of his dangerous mind by making his abilities capable of destroying the universe is spitting on His Majesty's face.

Seriously though, Palpatine's powerful, but Abeloth is meant to be a goddess, much more than any mere mortal, save for the Chosen One or the hypothetical "power of the ultimate sort" Palpatine, can ever be.

Azronger
Wat

Sinious
Originally posted by Azronger
Wat

Zentrex
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MCn9lL94sxQ

Zentrex
No, seriously. I mean, even Azronger has agreed that the Son is more powerful than Palpatine, and the Son is not as powerful as Abeloth. When you say that Palpatine's above Abeloth, you're not bringing Palpatine up, you're bringing Abeloth down. Unless you legit believe that non-magocracy Palpatine is universe level.

And that first (well, technically second) paragraph was a joke. Although I do believe that making Palpatine more powerful than literally the second most powerful character in the mythos robs him of his greatness, and as Rocky said, "incredibly stupid"

Sinious
Dude, you take these sources literally when it comes to other characters, but try real hard not to when there is a source stating the same thing about Palpatine. We're simply pointing out your disgustingly transparent double standards, but you're too stupid to even understand the argument. The conclusion you should be reaching here is that none of these characters are anywhere near universe or even galaxy tier, which makes it possible for Palpatine to surpass them in the future given enough time, but you're still talking about how DE Sidious is inferior to Abeloth like anyone ever said otherwise. laughing out loud

I don't think I'll waste my time with you any further. This is Nadd tier stuff.

Azronger
Zentrex, if you call yourself a Sheevite, this idiocy stops now. You will prostrate yourself before His Imperial Majesty and beg for absolution of your sins. Otherwise you can forget about your place in my Sheevite academy. I'll teach you only if you're willing to learn. This current behavior is unacceptable.

Jmanghan
Originally posted by Azronger
Zentrex, if you call yourself a Sheevite, this idiocy stops now. You will prostrate yourself before His Imperial Majesty and beg for absolution of your sins. Otherwise you can forget about your place in my Sheevite academy. I'll teach you only if you're willing to learn. This current behavior is unacceptable. Tempest is the leader of the Sheevite movement, not you. (Though he hasn't been around for awhile so I guess the title is up for grabs)

Zentrex
Sinious
I'm not underselling Sidious, you're underselling Abeloth. Our disagreement isn't even on how powerful Sidious is, it's on how powerful Abeloth is. You think, for a reason that I can't figure out for the life of me, that Abeloth's quotes should not be taken literally. Why else would they be there? We both scale Sidious at the same place in legends. So stop trying to make this a case of me "ignoring Sidious' quotes and not taking them literally"

Originally posted by Azronger
Zentrex, if you call yourself a Sheevite, this idiocy stops now. You will prostrate yourself before His Imperial Majesty and beg for absolution of your sins. Otherwise you can forget about your place in my Sheevite academy. I'll teach you only if you're willing to learn. This current behavior is unacceptable.

Wow. You're actually trying to turn your order into the definitve meaning of being a sheevite. A true sheevite would never stand for this. I will be the Martin Luther to your Julius II. Let the reformation begin.

Azronger
Originally posted by Jmanghan
Tempest is the leader of the Sheevite movement, not you. (Though he hasn't been around for awhile so I guess the title is up for grabs)

facepalm

Tempest named me the head of the Church of Sheev like over six months ago.

Azronger
Originally posted by Zentrex
Wow. You're actually trying to turn your order into the definitve meaning of being a sheevite. A true sheevite would never stand for this. I will be the Martin Luther to your Julius II. Let the reformation begin.

Just what kind of twisted logic is going through your head? So by wanking Sheev to high heavens and heaping praise unto him I am spitting in his face? And a "true Sheevite" like yourself would repeatedly argue against His Imperial Majesty? That practise is known as Vitidiocy, not Sheevism, lmao.

But sure, let's see how many devout followers your pseudo reformed Sheevism will attract. laughing out loud

Zentrex
I have not argued against Sidious, not in this thread, I have simply argued for Abeloth.

And yeah, wanking a character in a serious discussion is insulting that their realistic versions. The versions that I care about, that is.

You define your beliefs as the ultimate way to praise the lord Sheev. What's worse is, you can't stretch your head beyond the concept of an order of sheevites. Sheev belongs to the people. His greatness can be experienced in whatever way anyone likes. You think you can own Sheev, but he is beyond ownership.

snoke123
abeloth with a wave of his hand, would kill sidious

Jmanghan
Originally posted by snoke123
abeloth with a wave of his hand, would kill sidious Agreed.

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