Click HERE to see this thread with all of the graphics, features, and links.

Dos Doomsday is rampaging New York City... bodies every where; what hero would you send?

The Spot.

If you MUST have a 'hero', Cloak.

Hulk

Sentry, stable.

Fantomex

Squirrel Girl

Franklin Richards says "Hello".

Reed.

Just tell him to grab the entropy gun out of his closet on his way to the fight.

Dr. Strange. No need to soil any hands here.

Originally posted by Galan007
Reed.

Just tell him to grab the entropy gun out of his closet on his way to the fight.

Or hook the Zeno room up.

is he considered a zombie since he dies and then comes back? if so black panther.

or manifold or franklin richards

Try not to go outside of low trans to high Herald. You all are calling out Abstracts.

Originally posted by carver9
Try not to go outside of low trans to high Herald. You all are calling out Abstracts.
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
The Spot.
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
If you MUST have a 'hero', Cloak.
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Fantomex
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Or hook the Zeno room up.

I could see the Avengers failing and Thor sacrificing himself like Superman did.

since you said hero as in singular its kinda hard to think of anyone in lower tiers that has the durability to withstand superman damage and have the speed to strike and defend, and strength to actually make a difference.

still say manifold

Mortal Hercules, fully geared up.

ironman

Sentry

Wolverine, Mimic, or kitty pryde.

Thor, Dr. Strange, Snow Bird, Meggan, Tailsman, Reed Richards, Franklin Richards, Moelcule Man take your pick

Originally posted by carver9
Dos Doomsday is rampaging New York City... bodies every where; what hero would you send?

Anyone can beat him, really.

I'm sending Daredevil.

Originally posted by deathslash
she phases him underground. A minor inconvenience at best:
http://i.imgur.com/F3x2qSPl.jpg

Originally posted by deathslash
How is wolverine useless? I mean, a massively amped Superman only managed to give DD a minor fleshwound, with an all-out strike from a New Genosian sword:
http://i.imgur.com/1HBFo3qm.jpg http://i.imgur.com/XRjJNOIm.jpg

Granted that was H/P Doomsday, but still... Even IF we assume Wolverine can puncture DD's hide at all(he IS an ancient Kryptonian, after all), his stabby stabs would still be less effective on DD than they were on WWH. So yeah, I'd say he's pretty useless, tbh. /shrug

You convinced me, Galan.

DD gets sliced in half with a karate blow

Pixie or Magik just dump him in some other dimension.

Hulk could just smash him... http://images.killermovies.com/forums/icons/v2/icon4.gif

and what's that gonna do
n8a8UJnk2HY

Originally posted by MrMind
and what's that gonna do
n8a8UJnk2HY lol, I love how you bring up that sad excuse for a fair fight as if it has any basis in anything.Originally posted by Galan007
A minor inconvenience at best:
http://i.imgur.com/F3x2qSPl.jpg

I mean, a massively amped Superman only managed to give DD a minor fleshwound, with an all-out strike from a New Genosian sword:
http://i.imgur.com/1HBFo3qm.jpg http://i.imgur.com/XRjJNOIm.jpg

Granted that was H/P Doomsday, but still... Even IF we assume Wolverine can puncture DD's hide at all(he IS an ancient Kryptonian, after all), his stabby stabs would still be less effective on DD than they were on WWH. So yeah, I'd say he's pretty useless, tbh. /shrug there's a difference between doomsday getting out of a space ship and punching his way up, and having his molecules become fused to the ground.
https://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/0/7666/783132-kitty1_md.jpeg
https://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/0/7666/783134-kitty2_md.jpeg
I mean...............I thought you knew that.

DoS Doomsday is significantly less powerful and HP Doomsday evolved after fighting Superman, Martian Manhunter, Maxima, Guy Gardner, Fire, and Ice. There's such a massive power bump in HP that any comparison made doesn't even matter tbh.

Originally posted by deathslash
lol, I love how you bring up that sad excuse for a fair fight as if it has any basis in anything. there's a difference between doomsday getting out of a space ship and punching his way up, and having his molecules become fused to the ground.
https://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/0/7666/783132-kitty1_md.jpeg
https://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/0/7666/783134-kitty2_md.jpeg
I mean...............I thought you knew that. As I said, it would only equate to a momentary inconvenience for DD, just like it was for Hulk... And that's IF it even worked on DD's physiology in the first place.

Originally posted by deathslash
DoS Doomsday is significantly less powerful and HP Doomsday evolved after fighting Superman, Martian Manhunter, Maxima, Guy Gardner, Fire, and Ice. There's such a massive power bump in HP that any comparison made doesn't even matter tbh. Eh, the only person who made DD 'evolve' was an all-out Superman, who was fighting in a completely uninhibited/bloodlusted capacity(we wouldn't see him fully cut loose like that again until OWAW.) Everyone else was swatted aside casually.

Moreover, by that point in his life DD had already solo'd hundredS of Green Lanterns, endured a Guardian's pointblank kamikaze detonation, fought Radiant, etc... And like I said: he's an ancient Kryptonian to boot.

I mean, do you honestly think Wolverine is just going to waltz up and slice DD in half or..? Frankly, I cannot believe anyone would seriously try and argue that f*cking Kitty Pryde and Wolverine would make any sort of difference against DD. Wow. none

Agreed Deathslash.

Tired of seeing people mention Doomsday hitting Martian Manhunter. Major context during that showing.

Originally posted by carver9
Tired of seeing people mention Doomsday hitting Martian Manhunter. Major context during that showing.

So context only matters when it defends a character you like? Good to know.

Originally posted by -Pr-
So context only matters when it defends a character you like? Good to know.

Lol... where did you get that from?

Originally posted by carver9
Lol... where did you get that from?

Your posting history, mainly.

Originally posted by Galan007
Reed.

Just tell him to grab the entropy gun out of his closet on his way to the fight.

Does he have one of those, or are you talking about the UN?

Originally posted by Galan007
As I said, it would only equate to a momentary inconvenience for DD, just like it was for Hulk... And that's IF it even worked on DD's physiology in the first place.

Eh, the only person who made DD 'evolve' was an all-out Superman, who was fighting in a completely uninhibited/bloodlusted capacity(we wouldn't see him fully cut loose like that again until OWAW.) Everyone else was swatted aside casually.

Moreover, by that point in his life DD had already solo'd hundredS of Green Lanterns, endured a Guardian's pointblank kamikaze detonation, fought Radiant, etc... And like I said: he's an ancient Kryptonian to boot.

I mean, do you honestly think Wolverine is just going to waltz up and slice DD in half or..? Frankly, I cannot believe anyone would seriously try and argue that f*cking Kitty Pryde and Wolverine would make any sort of difference against DD. Wow. none so she just keeps phasing him back into the ground until he dies from it. Would you say that DoS Doomsday is above WWH?

Did any of them try cutting him? Did any one of them use weapons that have cut up the hulk, Thor, Thanos,or anyone of an equal level? You act as if I'm saying that they can oneshot him, but I'm not.

Originally posted by -Pr-
Your posting history, mainly.

Stop posturing, Pr. We all remember how your last fight with carver went:

Originally posted by Damborgson
https://i.imgur.com/JzXJWdq.jpg

He's not the Carver you once knew.

Originally posted by deathslash
so she just keeps phasing him back into the ground until he dies from it. Would you say that DoS Doomsday is above WWH? Just like she did to Hulk, right? On that note, when has Kitty ever 'spam-fazed' until she killed her opponent?

Physically speaking, I'd say DD was at least near that level. Except a LOT faster and more durable.

Originally posted by deathslash
Did any of them try cutting him? Did any one of them use weapons that have cut up the hulk, Thor, Thanos,or anyone of an equal level? You act as if I'm saying that they can oneshot him, but I'm not. You're not understanding DD's full capabilities if you think some stabby-stabs make any sort of difference. Doomsday is FAST -- fast enough that even Superman had to keep increasing his speed just to keep up. Maxima and a few others also made note of his ridiculous speed.

Even IF Wolverine's claws could pierce DD's hide, DD would pummel the living shit out of him immediately afterward w/o issue. Think about what Hulk did... Expect DD wouldn't stop.

Galan brought up a good point about his physiology, molecular entrapment probably wouldn't work for long. Sure it would probably hurt, but DD has no organs to speak of. He's a pure battle tank. You'd probably have to get someone like Magic to send him to Limbo.

Molecular dis-corporation would work as well. The Ultimate Nullifier would do the trick as well.

With the way that the Juggernaut is portrayed these days, he'd just end up being slaughtered. Old school Juggernaut probably could have held him for a very long period of time.

For the Hulk to break even, or become enraged enough to KO or put him into a coma, he'd have to fight in a place that has no innocents around to be threatened. He holds back too much otherwise.

Originally posted by deathslash
lol, I love how you bring up that sad excuse for a fair fight as if it has any basis in anything.

These people know more than you so there's that

Originally posted by MrMind
These people know more than you so there's that right.....they also use alternate reality feats, and ignore pertinent information.

Originally posted by deathslash
right.....they also use alternate reality feats, and ignore pertinent information.

lol marvel earth is so pathetic, they let wwhulk shit all over them, yet the earth mightiest forces (sentry and hulk) get this, only destroyed part of the island in their battle.

not saying doomsday win here because he doesn't especially when tp and magic are in play

but damn, how lulzy marvel earth can be, if civil war or secret empire happen in dc, can be stopped by one high herald alone.

Did someone actually say Wolverine and Shadowcat?

rm81LSKJC2k

Originally posted by MrMind
lol marvel earth is so pathetic, they let wwhulk shit all over them, yet the earth mightiest forces (sentry and hulk) get this, only destroyed part of the island in their battle.

not saying doomsday win here because he doesn't especially when tp and magic are in play

but damn, how lulzy marvel earth can be, if civil war or secret empire happen in dc, can be stopped by one high herald alone. you seem to be fond of throwing rocks inside of glass houses friend. Do I need to remind you that Superman and Maxima both got knocked out by a gas station explosion? Perhaps you need to be told that Supermans most powerful punches only broke a few windows....

We can low-ball all day, or we can debate like actual intellectuals.

Doomsday would just adapt to their attacks. Just like he did in DOS and HP storylines.

I thought DOS Doomsday adapted to Radiant.

Originally posted by MrMind
lol marvel earth is so pathetic, they let wwhulk shit all over them, yet the earth mightiest forces (sentry and hulk) get this, only destroyed part of the island in their battle.

not saying doomsday win here because he doesn't especially when tp and magic are in play

but damn, how lulzy marvel earth can be, if civil war or secret empire happen in dc, can be stopped by one high herald alone. could you sound anyone more of a sad retarded DC fanboy if you tried ?

Originally posted by MrMind
lol marvel earth is so pathetic, they let wwhulk shit all over them, yet the earth mightiest forces (sentry and hulk) get this, only destroyed part of the island in their battle.

not saying doomsday win here because he doesn't especially when tp and magic are in play

but damn, how lulzy marvel earth can be, if civil war or secret empire happen in dc, can be stopped by one high herald alone.

https://media.tenor.com/images/dbc04438e4a959b727f6b104e1610340/tenor.gif

But why couldn't DD just break free? Certainly he's strong enough.

Originally posted by Insane Titan
could you sound anyone more of a sad retarded DC fanboy if you tried ?


https://media.giphy.com/media/mz3GhecUM9CE0/giphy.gif

^you need to lighten up, chocking on thanus' purple balls all day can't possibly be good for your health

Originally posted by Zack M
But why couldn't DD just break free? Certainly he's strong enough. the question isn't whether he can break free. The question is whether having cement, gravel, rocks, metal, and other such materials phased into his body will kill him. This tactic nearly worked on WWH and unlike that comic, this is a forum where both characters are fighting at their best. There's no reason for kitty to hold back on the mindless monster that's rampaging through New York. Unlike WWH, she's not going to go for crippling DD, she's going to try to kill him.

Can he break free of the ground that he's going to get phased into? Undoubtedly. Can he even touch the person that can phase him into the ground from a mile away and who's going to keep doing it until he bleeds out or dies from the physical damage? No, not if she doesn't want him to. Can he lose if she phases him a few miles underground and he can't get back in the fight inside of a ten count? Yes.

Originally posted by MrMind
These people know more than you so there's that

They use non-canon evidence and are terribly biased.

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
They use non-canon evidence and are terribly biased.

biased how? there are even amount of marvel and dc wins in death battle, maybe it's you who are biased.

regarding non-canon evidence, I wasn't using the video to actually debate forum battle so chill out

Originally posted by MrMind
lol marvel earth is so pathetic, they let wwhulk shit all over them, yet the earth mightiest forces (sentry and hulk) get this, only destroyed part of the island in their battle.

not saying doomsday win here because he doesn't especially when tp and magic are in play

but damn, how lulzy marvel earth can be, if civil war or secret empire happen in dc, can be stopped by one high herald alone.

What did Superman and Doomsday destroy in their fight? Ironman and Hulk fight split New York clean in half. Hulk and Black bolt fight knocked a chunk out of the moon the size of a state and WWH and Skaar fight shook the planet.

Originally posted by deathslash
the question isn't whether he can break free. The question is whether having cement, gravel, rocks, metal, and other such materials phased into his body will kill him. This tactic nearly worked on WWH and unlike that comic, this is a forum where both characters are fighting at their best. There's no reason for kitty to hold back on the mindless monster that's rampaging through New York. Unlike WWH, she's not going to go for crippling DD, she's going to try to kill him.

Can he break free of the ground that he's going to get phased into? Undoubtedly. Can he even touch the person that can phase him into the ground from a mile away and who's going to keep doing it until he bleeds out or dies from the physical damage? No, not if she doesn't want him to. Can he lose if she phases him a few miles underground and he can't get back in the fight inside of a ten count? Yes.

He's not bleeding out.....

Magneto + Wolverine

It would look hilarious when a knocked out Wolverine will non stop being fast ball specialed claws first into Doomsday.

I don't see phasing having any real significant effect.

Molding you into concrete and iron wouldnt do anything? Making you one (your brain, internals, EVERYTHING) with whatever is under you isnt doing nothing? I doubt that.

Hadn't thought about phasing brain. Was basing it off Kitty phasing WWH.

Doomsday has no internal organs...

Originally posted by celeyhyga17
Hadn't thought about phasing brain. Was basing it off Kitty phasing WWH.

If it wasnt for these showings, I think it wouldve killed Hulk as well.

https://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11132/111321350/6306686-gyojfmd.jpg
https://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11132/111321350/6306687-gzpazen.jpg

https://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11132/111321350/6306691-3156622-6631681194-savag.jpg

https://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11132/111321350/6306692-3156623-8921647645-savag.jpg

https://www.supermanhomepage.com/images/LexFiles/NoInternalOrgans.jpg

How does he die if he doesnt have any internals? If he is solid mass.

Originally posted by MrMind
biased how? there are even amount of marvel and dc wins in death battle, maybe it's you who are biased.

regarding non-canon evidence, I wasn't using the video to actually debate forum battle so chill out the make the more popular character win half of the time by basing it off of rediculous calculations that often times don't even make sense.

........you were the one that brought up a death battle after people said that hulk could beat doomsday. Yes, we're going to debate forum policy when you're literally the idiot that decides to bring up a terribly biased fight in this thread.Originally posted by DarkSaint85
He's not bleeding out..... sorry, but in DoS Doomsday didn't have a healing factor. At least, it wasn't one that worked in any actual battlefield capacity. After the sixteenth time of getting phased into concrete, do you honestly think that it's going to do nothing?Originally posted by celeyhyga17
Hadn't thought about phasing brain. Was basing it off Kitty phasing WWH. keep in mind, kitty only went for crippling him and he still had chunks of cement sticking out of his hands and legs. Instead, she's going to go for killing DD and he's going to have chunks of concrete sticking out of his head, back, chest, and we'll, everywhere. And she's going to keep doing this......until he dies from it.

Originally posted by carver9
If it wasnt for these showings, I think it wouldve killed Hulk as well.

https://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11132/111321350/6306686-gyojfmd.jpg
https://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11132/111321350/6306687-gzpazen.jpg

https://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11132/111321350/6306691-3156622-6631681194-savag.jpg

https://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11132/111321350/6306692-3156623-8921647645-savag.jpg
DD has healing factor. And DS pointed out no internal organs. So....

Originally posted by MrMind
biased how? there are even amount of marvel and dc wins in death battle, maybe it's you who are biased.

regarding non-canon evidence, I wasn't using the video to actually debate forum battle so chill out

They're just some fans... of course they're biased af.

They had Superman beat SSJ4 and SSJGSSJ Goku, if you want an example The calculator they use for assessing speed is literally broken, too.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Doomsday has no internal organs... Originally posted by Parmaniac
https://www.supermanhomepage.com/images/LexFiles/NoInternalOrgans.jpg that makes no sense. How the phuck does he function if he doesn't have a brain? How does he die if he has no internal organs to get damaged?

Originally posted by deathslash
that makes no sense. How the phuck does he function if he doesn't have a brain? How does he die if he has no internal organs to get damaged? I never said it makes sense or that I like how they put it. I merely provided the scan. I'm even willing to put this away as stupid shit instead of being an explanation of DD's body.

It's comics *shrug*

One can argue him being 'killed' was PIS, in that case. Or him getting KOd is PIS, lol. But that's the facts of the matter - Doomsday has no internal organs as per his creator. Stupid? Yeah of course. But we're arguing characters who, thanks to errors in their genetic code, are able to reshape reality and control magnets, lol.

Originally posted by Parmaniac
I never said it makes sense or that I like how they put it. I merely provided the scan. I'm even willing to put this away as stupid shit instead of being an explanation of DD's body. oh, I'm not upset with you. I'm actually glad that you provided the scan, but what DD creator is saying is that a living, breathing, sentient life form is functioning off of photosynthesis entirely and that makes no goddamn sense at all.Originally posted by DarkSaint85
It's comics *shrug*

One can argue him being 'killed' was PIS, in that case. Or him getting KOd is PIS, lol. But that's the facts of the matter - Doomsday has no internal organs as per his creator. Stupid? Yeah of course. But we're arguing characters who, thanks to errors in their genetic code, are able to reshape reality and control magnets, lol. you're not wrong. But consider this, his creator made this statement, what, a few thousand years before DoS? What if in that time, DD came across the need for internal organs? I mean, all his creator was doing was feeding him to the ravenous wildlife right? What if doomsday came across a situation that required more organs? For example, later on, he devolps intelligence. Now how is he smarter without a brain?

No single mainstream MCU hero can beat Doomsday, aside from the Sentry (whom I wouldn't really call mainstream).
The Hulk is another exception, as always. I would typically favor Doomsday over the Hulk, but the Hulk can beat almost anyone on a good day.

Like I said, comics.

How does Hulk's pants stay where they are? The gluteus Maximus is the largest muscle in the body, so logically, any growth would hit that area like a ton of bricks etc etc.

And sure, we can assume he later grows organs (even though it was never shown). I can just as well assume he develops telepathy and reality warping, even though it was never shown.

Not being snippy, likeParm, am merely pointing out what was shown.

This bio also says he has no organs:

https://osck.files.wordpress.com/2008/05/doomsday-origin-2.jpg

And in H/P, he had no organs either.

Let's be honest here, if I thought he had organs, Susan Storm would've been first on the scene lol.

Originally posted by carver9
What did Superman and Doomsday destroy in their fight? Ironman and Hulk fight split New York clean in half. Hulk and Black bolt fight knocked a chunk out of the moon the size of a state and WWH and Skaar fight shook the planet.

You want to play this useless game?

It was retcon that Kal and DD shook the planet in their fight!

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Like I said, comics.

How does Hulk's pants stay where they are? The gluteus Maximus is the largest muscle in the body, so logically, any growth would hit that area like a ton of bricks etc etc.

And sure, we can assume he later grows organs (even though it was never shown). I can just as well assume he develops telepathy and reality warping, even though it was never shown.

Not being snippy, likeParm, am merely pointing out what was shown.

This bio also says he has no organs:

https://osck.files.wordpress.com/2008/05/doomsday-origin-2.jpg

And in H/P, he had no organs either.

Let's be honest here, if I thought he had organs, Susan Storm would've been first on the scene lol.

Doomsday's clones were the same, at least in the animated film:

7sSBArpqAQI?t=1m48s

01:48

Perhaps you can provide the scans? Or Diana never says it in the comic?

So yeah, it's a standard part of DD's powerset. As dumb as it may seem to be.

She said the same thing:

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11114/111147274/3711331-5176766619-87cb9.jpg

Thanks

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
Thanks

https://s5.postimg.cc/foiwo8rxj/image.jpg

Originally posted by SquallX
DOS and H/P are two different beast.

H/P was adapting on the fly, DOS never did that. And if he did, it wasn't as fast as H/P. Tbf, there was absolutely nothing that DoS Doomsday *needed* to adapt against, until Superman started going all-out.

Prior to that, he was already capable of outright tanking absolutely everything thrown at him:
https://s7d1.turboimg.net/t1/38890488_6618972.jpg https://s7d1.turboimg.net/t1/38890489_946103.jpg https://s7d1.turboimg.net/t1/38890490_706826.jpg https://s7d1.turboimg.net/t1/38890491_3065734.jpg
*No reason to evolve when you're already a LOT stronger than everyone you're fighting.


However, his strength DID perpetually evolve/increase as he fought an all-out/bloodlusted Superman:
https://i.imgur.com/kHiAudf.jpg


As did his speed:
https://i.imgur.com/Fub6Ywx.jpg


DD's gimmick has ALWAYS been adapting/evolving on an as-needed basis -- that's how Bertron engineered him. This trait didn't just spontaneously 'activate' during the H/P arc. Mind you, I'm not saying DD's ability to adapt on the fly wasn't *better* during the H/P arc -- just saying that perpetual evolution has been part of his powerset for the last 250,000+ years. /shrug

Would they be including "brain" as an internal organ here? Because without doing any research I'm pretty sure DD has been portrayed with a brain a couple times. Hell the whole Brainiac mind control arc.

Not saying it would help Wolverine cut his face off, but him not having a brain would be one of the dumber things I can think of in comics.

DD definitely has some sort of brain. Manchester Black managed to plant a vision in his mind during OWAW, for example:
https://i.imgur.com/yNVSz52.jpg

*And that was technically H/P Doomsday.

Originally posted by Stoic
Does he have one of those, or are you talking about the UN? Sorry, just saw this.

Yes, Reed actually keeps a "universal entropy gun" in his closet. It is capable of one-shot-slagging Celestials, lol:
https://s7d1.turboimg.net/t1/38890499_Fantastic_Four_572-008.jpg https://s7d1.turboimg.net/t1/38890500_Fantastic_Four_572-009.jpg https://s7d1.turboimg.net/t1/38890501_Fantastic_Four_572-014.jpg https://s7d1.turboimg.net/t1/38890502_Fantastic_Four_572-015.jpg

Physically, this would be extremely difficult. But, as others have pointed, there's plenty of hax that could probably take out DD at least once, even if he adapts later. This is essentially a first strike scenario for the Marvel side, so they don't necessarily need to be able to take a hit.

In addition to some others, like Spot or Reed, I'll throw Tempus, Pixie, Wiccan, and Loa into the mix. I can't remember if DD had any real TP defense at that time either, otherwise you can pick a strong telepath at random.

Originally posted by Galan007
Tbf, there was absolutely nothing that DoS Doomsday *needed* to adapt against, until Superman started going all-out.

Prior to that, he was already capable of outright tanking absolutely everything thrown at him:
https://s7d1.turboimg.net/t1/38890488_6618972.jpg https://s7d1.turboimg.net/t1/38890489_946103.jpg https://s7d1.turboimg.net/t1/38890490_706826.jpg https://s7d1.turboimg.net/t1/38890491_3065734.jpg
*No reason to evolve when you're already a LOT stronger than everyone you're fighting.


However, his strength DID perpetually evolve/increase as he fought an all-out/bloodlusted Superman:
https://i.imgur.com/kHiAudf.jpg


As did his speed:
https://i.imgur.com/Fub6Ywx.jpg


DD's gimmick has ALWAYS been adapting/evolving on an as-needed basis -- that's how Bertron engineered him. This trait didn't just spontaneously 'activate' during the H/P arc. Mind you, I'm not saying DD's ability to adapt on the fly wasn't *better* during the H/P arc -- just saying that perpetual evolution has been part of his powerset for the last 250,000+ years. /shrug


By the point DD fought Superman, he had already been through multiple fights with Myhem, a Green Lantern and experienced a Guardian's power and Radiant. His 'base' was already at a level where he was able to take all of those, so no wonder he casually took everything that was thrown at him without needing to change.

He didn't need to adapt to anything, as nothing was bothering him - even Superman was remarking that he wasn't able to hurt him until the end, when he went balls to the wall.

Would you say that Superman only won because he shocked Doomsday by ramping up his attacks so much in such a small timeframe?

Originally posted by One Big Mob
Would you say that Superman only won because he shocked Doomsday by ramping up his attacks so much in such a small timeframe? I'm not sure but if I'd have to wager a guess, I'd say that Superman skyrocketed so ridiculously in power , that Doomsday couldn't adapt that hard, in that short of time, without dying . Which considering he was able to adapt to a Guardian mid-fight ... If we were to isolate the end of the fight , with the rest of the event , DD looks, imo, at least 1-2 tiers above Superman. As in, Iron Man fighting Thor/Hulk level.

Can DD be lulled into a false sense of security and become complacent, or rather his powers of adapting? Or is it just going all the time as needed, and like you said, he hit his limit? I'm going with the latter myself but I just thought of that first part so thought I'd toss it out there.

Also, where would you place all out DoS Supes against OWAW Supes and Rebirth Supes? I personally am blown away by Rebirth DD, but it'd be interesting to see how you'd contrast the Supermen and by proxy the DDs (obviously we know HP/OWAW was more powerful, it's just how did Superman differ and could OWAW fought Rebirth Supes as well as he did) .

Originally posted by One Big Mob
Can DD be lulled into a false sense of security and become complacent, or rather his powers of adapting? Or is it just going all the time as needed, and like you said, he hit his limit?

Also, where would place all out DoS Supes against OWAW Supes and Rebirth Supes? I personally am blown away by Rebirth DD, but it'd be interesting to see how you'd contrast the Supermen and by proxy the DDs.

I think his adaptation is instinctual. I don't think flashing him would work.

I see Supes as having the 'OWAW' state that pops very rarely, and the 'normal state'. His 'normal' state in the Byrne-era < his normal state in the Jeph Loeb era < his normal state 'post Infinite Crisis' < his normal state Rebirth. So I think all the 'owaw' states are superior like that. If I'd have to wager, I'd say balls-to-the-wall OWAW Supes would beat Rebirth Superman, as long as the latter doesn't go balls-to-the-wall, too. Maybe. I dunno...haven't really thought about it in depth.

One more.

Where would you place Superman's power during the Rebirth DD fight? He was trying to end him but he knew he couldn't stand and brawl with him. Does him fighting smart hinder his strength from the "all out OWAW" state?

Originally posted by One Big Mob


One more.

Where would you place Superman's power during the Rebirth DD fight? He was trying to end him but he knew he couldn't stand and brawl with him. Does him fighting smart hinder his strength from the "all out OWAW" state? These are the rambling of a fanboy, but since you asked...

I think going all-out is him letting go of all restrictions, becoming ruthless and 'numbing' himself to the state of violence'/not thinking about anything else as put here:
http://photobucket.com/gallery/user/PhilosophiaKMC/media/cGF0aDovc3VwZXJtYW5jdXRzbG9vc2U0LmpwZw==/?ref=&hotlinkfix=1531761401854
..he is in a trance, basically.
It helps that he was in space, so he didn't have to worry about people around him, like Jon, Lois etc.
I don't think he loses any of his fighting skill - hell, I think he gets even better. Drilling at superspeed, focusing his heat vision in one point etc. He is in 'warrior' mode.

I mean, if we didn't see that, we'd think that this was his all-out state, where he barely beat a probe while seemingly bloodlusted:
http://photobucket.com/gallery/user/PhilosophiaKMC/media/cGF0aDovc3BlZWRibGl0emRlc3Ryb3lzcHJvYmUxLmpwZw==/?ref=&hotlinkfix=1531761590360
http://photobucket.com/gallery/user/PhilosophiaKMC/media/cGF0aDovc3BlZWRibGl0emRlc3Ryb3lzcHJvYmUyLmpwZw==/?ref=&hotlinkfix=1531761592364
http://photobucket.com/gallery/user/PhilosophiaKMC/media/cGF0aDovc3BlZWRibGl0emRlc3Ryb3lzcHJvYmUzLmpwZw==/?ref=&hotlinkfix=1531761594478

And we go even lower, and we see Superman and Mongul barely beating one.

All of them are seemingly 'all out' Superman but see again and again that he has a higher ceiling, until he goes through armies of imperiex probes for extended periods of time.

Rebirth Superman? I think he was above 'conventional' heroes like Wonder Woman , but not close to that mindset where he could really go for the kill. In the scans above, it's heavily implied that Superman, in the OWAW state, could beat Doomsday right then and there.

Superman was explicitly Skyfather level while All Out in OWAW, as shown his ability to fight Darkseid as a peer, which was alluded to as a benchmark of his true power potential waaay back pre DoS in Red Glass in 1991:

Originally posted by panthergod
excellent breakdown -- OWAW explicitly validates the Red Glass Storyline - Superman is in innate potential a peer to Skyfather level characters Darkseid( who when all out he can kill in combat), and can one-two shot kill his Elite top tier peers when he cuts loose, establishing his greatest fear on a sun conscious level is losing control and going insane with power if he taps his full potential, the rationale for his subconscious mind's dynamic holding back factor:

Red Glass pat 1:
https://imgur.com/a/aqMe98y

Red Glass pt 2:
https://imgur.com/a/vWZgIuJ

Red Glass pt 3:
https://imgur.com/a/FlRp62m



Originally posted by abhilegend
So just looking for chronology of Superman in OWAW, I found that Superman went to several levels

of power in one arc alone.

First, Mongul shows Superman that he is limiting his power and he needs to go all out if he wants

to beat Imperiex (Probe).

https://postimg.cc/image/ki6tfqkod/
https://postimg.cc/image/9vd0ac7e5/
https://postimg.cc/image/oek5bqddp/
https://postimg.cc/image/719uwvpsd/
https://postimg.cc/image/x9kzm9x19/
https://postimg.cc/image/xz3ryn5al/
https://postimg.cc/image/wwtlg2zbx/
https://postimg.cc/image/d27jtzezh/
https://postimg.cc/image/q6d46oer1/

But even then Superman struggled to even stagger the imperiex probe even with Mongul helping him.


https://postimg.cc/image/iqdukvyrh/
https://postimg.cc/image/v50ml8df1/
https://postimg.cc/image/3ufbdbpxp/
https://postimg.cc/image/ybv64vsq5/
https://postimg.cc/image/476pjhl25/
https://postimg.cc/image/7qsn9b37h/
https://postimg.cc/image/t0g9k5yxp/
https://postimg.cc/image/nc9yt8s0d/

This same Superman was overpowerd by Validus created by Warworld easily. And Warworld could

easily create hundreds of such holograms.

https://postimg.cc/image/hpdlvachp/
https://postimg.cc/image/jh6kq68p9/
https://postimg.cc/image/72jspvjrx/
https://postimg.cc/image/7s2l28clp/
https://postimg.cc/image/evaghu2lp/
https://postimg.cc/image/fxkn0ddp9/

Then Superman went a level above and with very high difficulty managed to stalemate one probe who

even broke his arm and then defeated it.

https://postimg.cc/image/9wmy3gyul/
https://postimg.cc/image/oslhb2xel/
https://postimg.cc/image/c17b4k871/
https://postimg.cc/image/a9ec9n1ot/
https://postimg.cc/image/4xzfoyah9/
https://postimg.cc/image/84tz8k7rx/

One level above when he managed to do it without getting his arm broken but was messed up by one

probe's explosion.

https://postimg.cc/image/yd53y29wt/
https://postimg.cc/image/z2nwagd19/
https://postimg.cc/image/vvtcqt5fx/
https://postimg.cc/image/4xzfp308d/
https://postimg.cc/image/oslhb77q5/
https://postimg.cc/image/am5qfy1zx/
https://postimg.cc/image/iewe7xnel/

Then a whole another level where he essentially oneshotted innumerable Probes like nothing.

https://postimg.cc/image/4l81ix53x/
https://postimg.cc/image/72jsq7jvh/
https://postimg.cc/image/puvnts0u5/
https://postimg.cc/image/wy3j9dyjx/
https://postimg.cc/image/k6pd2w47h/

And yet another level when Brainiac 13 absorbs the entire power of Imperiex and has the total

power of Warworld at its command, Superman still manages to stalemate B13 in raw strength.

https://postimg.cc/image/puvnttb4t/
https://postimg.cc/image/3vp96lmkt/
https://postimg.cc/image/6d10duyrh/
https://postimg.cc/image/wlc53960d/

And just how powerful was one probe? Fortress Eradicator saw just imperiex probe destroy entire

galaxies and had to fly away from lightyeard of aftershocks just to get away from it.

https://postimg.cc/image/hcm7piewt/
https://postimg.cc/image/wlc53agb1/

One Imperiex probe destroyed Maxima's galaxy.

https://postimg.cc/image/oslhbd7rx/
https://postimg.cc/image/qx5ucg1ot/
https://postimg.cc/image/j4f6kgga5/
https://postimg.cc/image/yd53y8hod/
https://postimg.cc/image/hcm7pkrsd/

The galaxies were destroyed by probes creating a construct and channeling their power to destroy

the galaxy whose power was then channeled into Imperiex's ship.


https://postimg.cc/image/609m7tlod/
https://postimg.cc/image/3vp96qrrh/
https://postimg.cc/image/7qsn9b37h/
https://postimg.cc/image/t0g9k5yxp/
https://postimg.cc/image/nc9yt8s0d/


OWAW/Apokolips Now re-established precedent what was shown through implication in te Krypton Man/Red Glass/Blaze-Satannus War/DoS waaay back in 1991/92 -- a fully unleashed Superman is multiple times more powerful than his standard Elite top tier Class 100 levels at the time, a peer to Darkseid in combat(H/P Supes for example, was nowhere near Darkseid in power), can 1-2 shot kill/destroy elite top tiers/trans(above top tier on average) tier Imperiex Probes when fully cutting loose, and is absolutely on a par with Skyfather class beings. We also saw this when he saw him match Kal-L(1/2 of Silver Age Superman) and both of them directly overpower SBP(who has Silver age levels)

OWAW/Apokolips Now re-established precedent what was shown through implication in te Krypton Man/Red Glass/Blaze-Satannus War/DoS waaay back in 1991/92 -- a fully unleashed Superman is multiple times more powerful than his standard Elite top tier Class 100 levels at the time, a peer to Darkseid in combat(H/P Supes for example, was nowhere near Darkseid in power), can 1-2 shot kill/destroy elite top tiers/trans(above top tier on average) tier Imperiex Probes when fully cutting loose, and is absolutely on a par with Skyfather class beings. We also saw this when he saw him match Kal-L(1/2 of Silver Age Superman) and both of them directly overpower SBP(who has Silver age levels)

Interesting. I have another thing I want to ask but I won't take any more of your time on this subject.

I don't think even with the implication that Supes could have taken DD in OWAW, but that might just be me having the opinion that DD should always be above Supes. srug




Bendis is going to bring him back to kick the shit out of him isn't he?

I like Carver's low key Superman respect thread

Originally posted by One Big Mob
Interesting. I have another thing I want to ask but I won't take any more of your time on this subject.

I don't think even with the implication that Supes could have taken DD in OWAW, but that might just be me having the opinion that DD should always be above Supes. srug




Bendis is going to bring him back to kick the shit out of him isn't he? Now you're making me curious. Ask away.

I think Bendis will present them as threats when they appear , but I also expect at least some to get Nefaria'd, and Superman to steamroll them at some point, maybe towards the end of his run when he gets burned out.

Bendis writing Mxy would unironically be a highlight of the run, if it happens. I can only imagine.

Originally posted by One Big Mob
As silly as it sounds, Bendis keeps his writing pretty serious.

https://i0.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/newsfeed/001/072/236/770.gif

Bendis jokes sure, but an outright joke character? Does Bendis have the feats for that?

Speaking of, has Bendis ever wrote Deadpool?

Originally posted by One Big Mob
Basically if you think Superman should be locked to that mindset being his "max" however many years after. And, if Superman should be better capable of accessing that power without entering a special state after his experience. Different writers and time and all. Plus Doomsday in itself.

Him firing off what 4k worth of punches and purposefully trying to exit populated areas makes me think he was trying very very hard during Rebirth. Just in a different "safer" way. Didn't he try and break DD's neck at one point?
It seemed like a remix of DoS to me, just Superman fighting a lot safer but still going pretty hard to try and finish without taking too much damage. Maybe not "maxed" but definitely not holding back.

Thoughts?



I'm not looking forward to any "rogues" appearing. A coinflip really. I think Darkseid will be the biggest test.



I think he's going to steer clear of that. As silly as it sounds, Bendis keeps his writing pretty serious. He can't write Mxy. Out of every character he can't write Mxy. Oh, while I think his 'all-out' state consistently exists , I definitely think different writers have different interpretations, and the circumstances in which he reaches it being different, depending on who's writing it. But I'd say they're pretty close to each other, overall. Scot Lobdell had Superman 'training' after his confrontation with Helspont/H'el in New 52 reminiscent of Jeph Loeb , then Greg Pak did a variant of the all-out, I'd say, when he ripped DD in half . He even specifically had the newspaper say that Superman exerted power levels 'never seen before'. Jeph Loeb/Joe Casey had the now infamous interpretation. Then we have even writers like Greg Rucka, who put the scans where his solar intake depends on his emotional state in the Ruin arc. Stuff like this. And Dan Jurgens, well, he's one of the biggest proponents of it - which is why I have the interpretation of the Rebirth fight as I have. He's the dude who cemented the 'mental blocks' on Superman, even before Jeph Loeb/OWAW era, and it was recurrent even when he wrote him in Justice League, to the point where Superman holds back on a sub-conscious level:
http://photobucket.com/gallery/user/KMCPhilosophia/media/cGF0aDovc3ViY29uc2Npb3VzYmxvY2tzLmpwZw==/?ref=&hotlinkfix=1531769161985

One of the most interesting things in how Superman's mindset affects fights was in Infinite Crisis, where he 'switches places' with Earth-2 Superman in the fight against Doomsday, and it's made clear that the 'different' Superman's mindset has him win that fight without dying:

https://s7d1.turboimg.net/t/38899616_E2SupermanDD1.jpg https://s7d1.turboimg.net/t/38899617_E2SupermanDD2.jpg https://s7d1.turboimg.net/t/38899618_E2SupermanDD3.jpg



As for Bendis, Darkseid will be...interesting. The Thanos criticism might have changed his perception a bit.

He will tackle the Legion, we'll see how he does there, too.

Posted by Dan Jurgens on Monday, February 23 2004 at 20:11:06 GMT


I also think they fight quite differently. Thor tends to be more of a brawny reactionary type, while Superman probably fights with a more strategic approach. Thor is more likely to cut loose with the full measure of his powers as he does not have the "dampers" on that power that Superman was raised with. Both qualities can be an advantage or disadvantage, depending on the circumstances.

DJ"

Good stuff. I might make a thread about Rebirth Dooms after and see where other people's thoughts are. I know Superman's mindset is a black hole of discussion... so, I'll try to avoid that.

About Darkseid... I don't know. His writing on Thanos only got worse over time, not that it was great in the first place. So if we follow this, his first appearance is really going to tell a lot.

But... why Legion? Everytime I turn around he seems to get more power.

There is some characters capable to stop Doomsday once and for all and others that will be completely stomped.

Doomsday may not have had most of his organs, but he had to have had a brain. There were too many calculative things that he's done in all of his appearances that points to him having a conscious mind.

Originally posted by Stoic
Doomsday may not have had most of his organs, but he had to have had a brain. There were too many calculative things that he's done in all of his appearances that points to him having a conscious mind.

Comics, Stoic. They don't have to make sense.

Maybe he works like a skeleton animated by a necromancy spell or something like that.

Originally posted by Stoic
Doomsday may not have had most of his organs, but he had to have had a brain.

That's actually the opposite with Trump.

Originally posted by RealityWarper
That's actually the opposite with Trump.

Really? Politics?

Anyway, Doomsday would be a huge issue on marvel earth. Any incarnation would.

Any serious non jobbing character on ME can deal with a rampaging non mystical brick

Any character and any Doomsday? There are teams, and a few uber characters but either way it would a bad day for Marvel earth.

Originally posted by Stoic
Doomsday may not have had most of his organs, but he had to have had a brain. There were too many calculative things that he's done in all of his appearances that points to him having a conscious mind.

Maybe he's like Iceman......

Originally posted by meep-meep
Really? Politics?

Nope.

Biological observation.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Maybe he's like Iceman...... Gay?

Well, he did sodomize Superman...

Originally posted by One Big Mob
Gay?

Without any organs, how can you be sure he's a he?

I guess Bertie said INTERNAL organs....

https://brightestyoungthings.com/articles/gay-icon-of-the-week-doomsday

Originally posted by One Big Mob
https://brightestyoungthings.com/articles/gay-icon-of-the-week-doomsday

👍

After seeing how Doc strange went up against the mad titan and with 3 stones to boot i think he alone would be problem for doomsday

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
They're just some fans... of course they're biased af.

They had Superman beat SSJ4 and SSJGSSJ Goku, if you want an example The calculator they use for assessing speed is literally broken, too.

you guys are listing people like wolverine, daredevil, kitty pryde, mimic or cloak and basically saying either two or three of them can stop doomsday
I'm pretty sure 80 percent of this board are more bias than deathbattle. i dont even mind the marvel bias here but at least acknowledge it lol
I do agree goku beat regular superman though, but there are versions of superman that simply stomp even ultra instinct, just not regular superman

Originally posted by MrMind
you guys are listing people like wolverine, daredevil, kitty pryde, mimic and saying they can stop doomsday
I'm pretty sure 80 percent of this board are more bias than deathbattle. i dont even mind the marvel bias here at least acknowledge it lol
I do agree goku beat regular superman though, but there are versions of superman that simply stomp even ultra instinct, just not regular superman Wolverine cuts him into tiny pieces.

Can't evolve past that and that's just a fact.

Doomsday is my favorite character so you can trust my opinion.

Originally posted by Mindset
Wolverine cuts him into tiny pieces.

Can't evolve past that and that's just a fact.

Doomsday is my favorite character so you can trust my opinion.

DD stomp wolverine into a mist

can't regenerate past that and that's just a fact

wolverine is my favorite character so you can trust my opinion

Originally posted by MrMind
DD stomp wolverine into a mist

can't regenerate past that and that's just a fact

wolverine is my favorite character so you can trust my opinion DD can't destroy Wolverine's bones so he'd keep regenerating, sorry.

You clearly don't know these characters well.

Originally posted by MrMind
you guys are listing people like wolverine, daredevil, kitty pryde, mimic or cloak and basically saying either two or three of them can stop doomsday
I'm pretty sure 80 percent of this board are more bias than deathbattle. i dont even mind the marvel bias here but at least acknowledge it lol
I do agree goku beat regular superman though, but there are versions of superman that simply stomp even ultra instinct, just not regular superman yes, because bfr isn't a valid win.

Originally posted by deathslash
yes, because bfr isn't a valid win.

It shouldn't be for this thread, tbh. Kind of kills any creative answering.

Well look at the thread starter.

He knew what he was doing.

In any case, Cloak wins deal with it Mindy.

Originally posted by MrMind
DD stomp wolverine into a mist

can't regenerate past that and that's just a fact

wolverine is my favorite character so you can trust my opinion

DD would eat Wolverine.

Good. Then Logan would kill DD from inside

https://tinyurl.com/yc5n6zwj

Can he even eat Logan? With no internal organs, he has no stomach, how does he eat him?

Originally posted by Stoic
Doomsday may not have had most of his organs, but he had to have had a brain. There were too many calculative things that he's done in all of his appearances that points to him having a conscious mind. Originally posted by Galan007
DD definitely has some sort of brain. Manchester Black managed to plant a vision in his mind during OWAW, for example:
https://i.imgur.com/yNVSz52.jpg

*And that was technically H/P Doomsday.

Lol.

I wonder what would happen with Darwin, actually.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Lol.

I wonder what would happen with Darwin, actually. He'd get overloaded just like against Hulk.

Back to the stomach thing... if DD is a solid block of mass, what's at the end of his throat? Or does he just have one tube that goes directly to his butthole?

Does he even have a butthole?

Like this?

https://pedsurg.ucsf.edu/media/6740863/imperforate-anus-external-male.png

Hope OP clarifies if he intends for DD to have one.

Originally posted by One Big Mob
Like this?

https://pedsurg.ucsf.edu/media/6740863/imperforate-anus-external-male.png

Exactly like this

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Hope OP clarifies if he intends for DD to have one.

I hope so, too.

I'll pm him in a moment.

Send Carver a picture of a butthole asking yes or no. He'll know what you mean

Originally posted by One Big Mob
He'd get overloaded just like against Hulk.

Back to the stomach thing... if DD is a solid block of mass, what's at the end of his throat? Or does he just have one tube that goes directly to his butthole?

DD is a one man Human Centipede.

Hahahahahahaha . For this thread, Doomsday have a butthole. I'm going to PM Bada and see if he can add it to the OP.

Originally posted by carver9
Hahahahahahaha . For this thread, Doomsday have a butthole. I'm going to PM Bada and see if he can add it to the OP.

Thanks

He has a mouth though. You imagine he has a throat. He has no organs.

How far down does that deep throat go? And that naturally leads us to wonder if it goes all the way to his butthole. Otherwise if he ate something, it would just be stuck in there.