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If Legacy Krayt was truly, ROTJ Sidious level. Then I would side with Valkorion.

Originally posted by Haschwalth
If Legacy Krayt was truly, ROTJ Sidious level. Then I would side with Valkorion.

Don't worry, he's not.

Krayt isn't even > RotS Sidious.

If Sidious actually gets Tenebrae tier feats.

The only Sheev who might surpass Krayt is DE, primarily thanks to Force storms.

Originally posted by DarkTransfer69
The only Sheev who might surpass Krayt is DE, primarily thanks to Force storms. You overate Krayt.

Your mother is a dog

Originally posted by victreebelvictr
You overate Krayt.

Nah, Krayt's position is perfect.

Vitiate being a better character than, and more important to the universe than Sidious. Which would make Anakin and Vader less important, thereby making Star Wars less enjoyable as a whole.

Change the mind about what?

I would probably put Valkorion over RotS Sidious if a case could be made for why the unbalancing feat isn't beyond Valkorion.

I would put Valkorion over RotJ Sidious if Byss and the Lusankya are mitigated or matched, Valkorion's spirit feats are shown to be superior, and (requiring basically all of these) if Ziost is shown to be comparable to or greater than force storms.

I would put Valkorion over DE Sidious if he really did drain a star, he can do the galaxy ritual by himself without prep, or Ziost is otherwise shown to be significantly beyond force storms.

Dark Empire Darth Sidious has been equaled or surpassed in feats by Darth Nihilus or Vitiate given the creators of The Old Republic love to go with their own "canon" and ignore the movies/books of Lucas' canon.

Originally posted by AncientPower
If Tenebrae actually gets Sidious tier feats.

He does, DarthBane77.

1.Who TF is DarthBane77.

2.No he doesn't.

^

absolutely nothing because sidious is thematically destined to be the best ever https://www.kanyetothe.com/forum/Smileys/default/3w2MWDX.png

1. My bad. But your user name is similar to his.
2. Yes. Unless you have proof to back that up(other than Force storms and misunderstood context performances)

Idk, man. I have DE Sidious above Valkorion at this point, (though on the same level/in the same tier), but it ultimately comes down to where Ziost puts Valkorion in relation to Sidious, as Elm said. If the Ziost feat is like ROTJ Sidious tier, then I think the case can be made that FP Valkorion has parity with DE Sidious.

Originally posted by Freedon Nadd
1. My bad. But your user name is similar to his.
2. Yes. Unless you have proof to back that up(other than Force storms and misunderstood context performances)

So the accolades that list him as the best as well as superior feats don't count. Ok.

Not sure why you think the most powerful quotes apply to Valkorion mmm

Originally posted by XSUPREMEXSKILLZ
Idk, man. I have DE Sidious above Valkorion at this point, (though on the same level/in the same tier), but it ultimately comes down to where Ziost puts Valkorion in relation to Sidious, as Elm said. If the Ziost feat is like ROTJ Sidious tier, then I think the case can be made that FP Valkorion has parity with DE Sidious.

A Force storm generated by wielding Dark Side energies>a Force sensitive who absorbed into himself the power of two planets? Alrighty, then.

Originally posted by DarthCaedus77
So the accolades that list him as the best as well as superior feats don't count. Ok.

Accolades are useless in a versus thread if a character has shown more than enough on-screen to confirm or infirm those certain statements. I should have included accolades at the misunderstood context section. The blame falls surely on my shoulders.

Originally posted by XSUPREMEXSKILLZ
Not sure why you think the most powerful quotes apply to Valkorion mmm

Not really. I usually dismiss such accolades with "x" being the strongest character that has ever lived. But it is self-evident that Bioware has taken another direction with their major characters. They clearly do not follow Lucas' vision of what Star Wars should be like.

Originally posted by XSUPREMEXSKILLZ
Not sure why you think the most powerful quotes apply to Valkorion mmm

Valkorion may have abandoned the sith but he was still a sith at one point, it says Sidious was more powerful than every sith, not specifically when they were a sith if that makes sense. Valk isn't bad by any means but I hold him below base ROTS-ROTJ Sidious, DE Sidious demolishes him.

Originally posted by Freedon Nadd
Not really. I usually dismiss such accolades with "x" being the strongest character that has ever lived. But it is self-evident that Bioware has taken another direction with their major characters. They clearly do not follow Lucas' vision of what Star Wars should be like.

Ain't that the truth. >.> They really went off the rails....I mean vanilla TOR is fine, but everything after that...yeah..

Eh, fair enough Sidious still beats him by feats in my opinion so whether or not those quotes stand matters little to me.

Originally posted by Zenwolf
Ain't that the truth?>.> They really went off the rails....I mean vanilla TOR is fine, but everything after that...yeah..

I fixed your comment.

Originally posted by XSUPREMEXSKILLZ
Not sure why you think the most powerful quotes apply to Valkorion mmm

The Emperor is still called the most powerful force of evil the galaxy had ever known, which is pretty explicit.

Plagueis, when he mentions Valkorion, doesn't seem to be that enamored or interested about his power, but maybe this is because there was so little information on Valkorion by that point.

He calls him the closest thing the Sith ever got to immortality, though it's only a vaguely referenced Sith Emperor. On the other hand, Plagueis doesn't believe in Sith spirits or even the Netherworld of the Force. So how relevant his opinions are is highly debatable.

Originally posted by Azronger
The Emperor is still called the most powerful force of evil the galaxy had ever known, which is pretty explicit.

Now go and analyze the context of the source, then come back and tell us why is that

Powerful force of evil in what context? What's the source?

This is the signature of Azronger and his friends. They cite sources out of context when they see absolute accolades.

Az just does it for a laugh, so he's fine. Pretty sure he's referring the old 2006 Complete Visual Dictionary, that only covers the PT/OT.

Most likely.

showing me a feat better than plagueis reaching out to everyone in the galaxy would be a nice start.

Nihilus was literally feeding off of the psyches of the entire population of the Galactic Republic. And Tenebrae as of the Nathema Ritual makes Nihilus his *****.

Try harder.

Originally posted by Rockydonovang
showing me a feat better than plagueis reaching out to everyone in the galaxy would be a nice start.

That was not meant to be taken literally. Why the heck would Plagueis contact everyone in the galaxy?

Originally posted by AncientPower
Nihilus was literally feeding off of the psyches of the entire population of the Galactic Republic. And Tenebrae as of the Nathema Ritual makes Nihilus his *****.

Try harder.

And yet Vitiate needed the Zildrog to do so. I cannot see how that makes Nihilus his inferior given Nihilus has had a greater planet consumption than Vitiate. And Nihilus was only drawn by planets rich in The Force.
Not to mention that each time Vitiate needs to feed he has to gather huge amounts of Dark Side energy from conflicts(a la thought bomb) to do so. Meanwhile Nihilus does it on his own.
It is ironic how you discard/debunk absolute accolades regarding Darth Sidious, yet when it comes about Vitiate you do not try to see the context anymore and dismiss certain statements about Vitiate.

What is with this love for Vitiate? He is a pathetic character. He is nothing more but a rip-off of Sidious and Nihilus.

1.Zildrog is irrelevant when Tenebrae subsequently absorbed such power that his very state of being became a void in the Force that was far worse than any mere wound.

2.The number of planets absorbed is utterly irrelevant when the power that Tenebrae absorbed had warped reality and tore the Force from an entire planet.

3.Nihilus using his hunger to sap life from a world and Tenebrae ripping the Force itself are two entirely different things. One is vastly more complex and destructive.

4.Nihilus' power literally kills him if he doesn't feed. Tenebrae's is self-sustaining.

5.Nihilus couldn't handle his power and had to transfer his essence to his mask. Tenebrae had made his body immortal with his power and was fully capable of sustaining his essence for 1,300 years.

6.Nihilus was dominated by his power and became a being of instinct. Tenebrae's will was godly and he fully mastered his control of the Force.

Tenebrae is just bigger and better, he's literally what Kreia was warning them about.

Originally posted by The Ellimist
I would probably put Valkorion over RotS Sidious if a case could be made for why the unbalancing feat isn't beyond Valkorion.

I would put Valkorion over RotJ Sidious if Byss and the Lusankya are mitigated or matched, Valkorion's spirit feats are shown to be superior, and (requiring basically all of these) if Ziost is shown to be comparable to or greater than force storms.

I would put Valkorion over DE Sidious if he really did drain a star, he can do the galaxy ritual by himself without prep, or Ziost is otherwise shown to be significantly beyond force storms.

I agree with : unbalancing the force, Lusankya, maybe Byss (to a certain extent).
I disagree with : Force Storm being above Ziost feat, Spirits feats of Valkorion being below Sheev ones.

Originally posted by AncientPower
Drew Karpyshyn is a stupid writer. He did not make his research on Knights of the Old.Republic 2. Therefore, his statements regarding Vitiate's character when compared to those characters should be taken as grain of salt.

Originally posted by AncientPower
Nihilus was literally feeding off of the psyches of the entire population of the Galactic Republic.
Citation needed.

Except that the force literally punsihes Plagueis by killing his experiments:



It's very possible there's missing context here, but it's been a year now, and nobody on the tor side has bothered to point it out.

The closest I've seen to a response is:
"that was mediclohiran manipulation, not telepathy!"

Off course that doesn't make much sense since the mechanics match the machanics of tp:

We've never seen beings being "Informed" with midi manip., and I don't see how midi manip is less impressive.

When yall can't even directly address this, you shouldn't be suprised when this happens:
http://www.killermovies.com/forums/f6/t649574.html

Looks to me Plagueis is Force whinning.

An actually good argument for Valkorion would change my mind.

Originally posted by MythLord
An actually good argument for Valkorion would change my mind.

'Cause Void in The Force

WHEN THE LAST THING IN THE UNIVERSE FINALLY DIES

Originally posted by Rockydonovang
Citation needed.



The balance of the Force was eradicated by the Sith and the citizens of the Republic created such a high level of negative psychic energy that the Triumvirate could literally feed off of the latent misery of the entire Republic.

To give you an idea for cross reference:

I need a citation for that.

re: RotS Sidious vs. Valkorion

- if someone showed gaps between Sidious and everyone comparable to the gaps between Valkorion and everyone

- if the unbalancing can be better compared to Valkorion's feats

- if it can be argued that Sidious as of RotS could do his feats as of RotJ, or at least have something to match Ziost

They are both old hags.