Suicide Squad vs. X-Force

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byrdgang21
Deathstroke
Black Manta
Cheetah
Deadshot
Parasite


Vs


Wolverine
Archangel
Psylocke
Deadpool
Fantomex


Who wins?

Quick Freeze
This would be a dope crossover. I don't know who wins. Deadpool/Fantomex would have to know to shoot Parasite first, but they would basically be in a shootout with Deadshot/Deathstroke, which is pretty even. Psylocke could def take Cheetah, but Black Manta is basically a powerhouse compared to the rest. If XF can somehow take out Parasite like I said, it probably just comes down to Wolverine/DP vs Black Manta/Deathstoke, which actually makes me feel SS takes it. Pre-cog, Manta's suit, and power-stealing are all huge advantages even against two w healing factors

Kazenji
X-Force wins.

Sin I AM
Fantomex solos

MrMind
holy shit the Fantomex wank need to stop

Kazenji
Except that we're not waking his powers.

Flyattractor
Parasite as in the Superman Villain?


if so... DC STOMPS!!!!!!

Quick Freeze
I have to admit I thought Fantomix was just great with guns and drinks Fanta. It appears he can also create "illusions"? Either way the combo of Parasite, Deathstroke, and Black Manta pretty much outclasses XF imo

shiv
Parasite Mind Rapes X-Force using Fantomex's and Psylockes Powers With Absolutely Zero Restraint.

shiv
Deadshot would do well to retreat to a nice safe one thousand yard sniping position where he can lay down covering fire.

DarkSaint85
Fantomex wins smile

shiv
Not Against This Squad Friend.

The Muties' Best Bet is For Deadpool to take out The Parasite with his small arsenal of conventional kinetic + incendiary armaments.

Deadpool Is Not Going To Do Anything Like That.

He Is Going To Be Jabbering With Deathstroke and Deadshot Over Who And What Is Cooler -- -- Stroke -- -- Shot -- -- Pool -- --

DarkSaint85
Against this squad?

Parasite drains them all and feeds on them like a buffet.

Only to realize that in actual fact he's been feeding on his teammates.

Then he gets mind raped.

leonidas
not sure x-force has an answer for cheetah. she's a 1000x faster than anyone one on the marvel side and could blitz at least a couple before anyone could do anything. a misdirect could work to buy time but i think EVERYONE is screwed by a misdirect--his team included. maybe i'm wrong there, but i recall times where even his teammates (psylocke for one) were unable to recognize they were in a misdirect. i also can't recall a time where he cast a misdirect and had a group of powerful villains attack each other. his own weapons were inconsistent and wouldn't kill most of the dc side imo. even with misdirect, i think dc wins this.

leonidas
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Against this squad?

Parasite drains them all and feeds on them like a buffet.

Only to realize that in actual fact he's been feeding on his teammates.

Then he gets mind raped.

that's possible i guess. not sure it would last long enough but parasite could drain a couple first.

DarkSaint85
Originally posted by leonidas
not sure x-force has an answer for cheetah. she's a 1000x faster than anyone one on the marvel side and could blitz at least a couple before anyone could do anything. a misdirect could work to buy time but i think EVERYONE is screwed by a misdirect--his team included. maybe i'm wrong there, but i recall times where even his teammates (psylocke for one) were unable to recognize they were in a misdirect. i also can't recall a time where he cast a misdirect and had a group of powerful villains attack each other. his own weapons were inconsistent and wouldn't kill most of the dc side imo. even with misdirect, i think dc wins this.

That's exactly what happened with the Horsemen.

They were fighting Wolverine, thought they were killing him, then realized that at some point Fantomex had arrived, rescued Wolverine and was long gone, whilst they had been fighting themselves.

Senor Cage
Originally posted by Kazenji
Except that we're not waking his powers.

Fantomex is slow. Gambit managed to pull a fast one on him. Cheetah with her speed would likely gut him. Parasite absorbs everyone else.

Senor Cage
BTW, if Parasite absorbs Fantomex, he also gains his powers. Hmmm...

StyleTime
As much as I want X-Force to win, Cheetah would legitimately solo them.

Unless we're using highest end only Wolverine or something.

Kazenji
So we're all just going to also lowball Archangel too?

Senor Cage
Originally posted by StyleTime
As much as I want X-Force to win, Cheetah would legitimately solo them.

Unless we're using highest end only Wolverine or something.

Pretty much. Cheetah has the power to kill gods now.

DarkSaint85
Originally posted by Senor Cage
Fantomex is slow. Gambit managed to pull a fast one on him. Cheetah with her speed would likely gut him. Parasite absorbs everyone else.

That assumes we know exactly how and when his misdirection works.

DarkSaint85
Originally posted by Senor Cage
Pretty much. Cheetah has the power to kill gods now.

Yeah but it's with their Kryptonite, the God Tear.

That's like saying Metallo has the power to kill Skyfathers ( Golden Superman Prime).

Technically accurate, but very contextually specific.

Senor Cage
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
That assumes we know exactly how and when his misdirection works.

I just feel the SS are just too powerful here. Parasite can drain his psychic energy, Cheetah can cut him before he actually gets off an illusion, etc...

Senor Cage
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Yeah but it's with their Kryptonite, the God Tear.

That's like saying Metallo has the power to kill Skyfathers ( Golden Superman Prime).

Technically accurate, but very contextually specific.

She still has the bite, which can still mess with Fantomex or anyone on the field.

https://i.imgur.com/CebAJXm.jpg

DarkSaint85
Originally posted by Senor Cage
I just feel the SS are just too powerful here. Parasite can drain his psychic energy, Cheetah can cut him before he actually gets off an illusion, etc...

But it's not psychic energy....no one actually knows how it works.

And again, that implies he has to 'fire' an illusion off. And maybe he does, maybe he doesn't. He always lies about his powers (plus writers have no idea, lol).

Plus it kinda assumes Cheetah targets him first.

Cutting him may not even do anything. His nervous system is in EVA.

Senor Cage
Fantom still carries energy within him. Energy that Parasite can use against him and X-Force.

The entire team of X-Force is pretty slow compared to Cheetah (who tagged Flash multiple times). She'd likely solo the field.

DarkSaint85
But Parasite would need to Target him.

And in doing so, would likely target his team mates instead.
Like so:

https://i.postimg.cc/V6Z9NZvh/6r-J9my2-d.jpg

He's badly injured here, btw.

Senor Cage
Cheetah's bite doesn't just injure, though. It turns them into something different. Does Fantom have any defense against that?

Parasite can still drain Fantomex, too. Make him weak to the point where he'll just die or lose concentration.

DarkSaint85
Originally posted by Senor Cage
Cheetah's bite doesn't just injure, though. It turns them into something different. Does Fantom have any defense against that?

Parasite can still drain Fantomex, too. Make him weak to the point where he'll just die or lose concentration.

But what would it turn? He can switch his nervous system around so it's not being affected.

And we still haven't moved past the initial point, which is how Parasite or Cheetah targets Fantomex in the first place, knowing 100% certainty that they're draining/biting the right person.

Senor Cage
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
But what would it turn? He can switch his nervous system around so it's not being affected.

And we still haven't moved past the initial point, which is how Parasite or Cheetah targets Fantomex in the first place, knowing 100% certainty that they're draining/biting the right person.

I didn't know Fantomex had defenses against mystic attacks. I'd like to see him do such a thing.

Parasite can absorb normal humans, not just meta humans. He can also absorb entire crowds/teams of people, so he doesn't really need to target one specific member.

StyleTime
Parasite is threatening generally, but he's being given far too much weight here. X-Force has more than enough hax to answer him.

It's Cheetah that is the deal breaker. She's just too fast.
Originally posted by Kazenji
So we're all just going to also lowball Archangel too? Archangelacolypse and with the Death Seed, sure, Angel becomes a different issue. He wasn't on X-Force though once transformed. He was their enemy.

Regular Archangel would probably split or so with Deadshot. I figured that is who the OP meant.

Senor Cage
Originally posted by StyleTime
Parasite is threatening generally, but he's being given far too much weight here. X-Force has more than enough hax to answer him.

It's Cheetah that is the deal breaker. She's just too fast.
Archangelacolypse and with the Death Seed, sure, Angel becomes a different issue. He wasn't on X-Force though once transformed. He was their enemy.

Regular Archangel would probably split or so with Deadshot. I figured that is who the OP meant.

Parasite's absorption is pretty hax. Not only did he absorb Brainiac's universal telepathy, he was also absorbing a good portion of the Speed Force. He'd dry up any X-Force member in a matter of moments and gain their experience, skills, and powers.

DarkSaint85
Only to discover he'd actually drained his team

Senor Cage
Yes, he'd drain both parties. Hes that greedy.

Flyattractor
Yeah. It would be a Parasite with the Powers and Abilities of Said Team which he would then use to Drain Team X.

SO yeah... Diff Situation... Same Out come.

Team SS wins.

DarkSaint85
Originally posted by Senor Cage
Yes, he'd drain both parties. Hes that greedy.

But not Xforce. That's how the misdirection works.

But good to see that we've moved on from Parasite targeting Fantomex and picking him out first, for some strange reason.

Senor Cage
There isn't anyone stopping parasite, though. On top of cheetahs speed, X-Force is screwed.

Deadline
Whose gonna stop Cheetah and Parasite? facepalm

DarkSaint85
Originally posted by Deadline
Whose gonna stop Cheetah and Parasite? facepalm

Fantomex, with the misdirection.

Senor Cage
Cheetah eats him.

shiv
Originally posted by Deadline
Whose gonna stop Cheetah and Parasite? facepalm

Ikr

It's Like, Too Easy.

The Parasite will absorb E.V.A. and every little thing the writers know and do not know about Chuck's clever little nervous system and how to use it like hot toast on butter.

Deadline
Actually in hindsight maybe Fantomex can do misdirection on Parasite. It's been a long time since I read X-force but I think Fantomex was able to trick an Apocalypse ship and as far as I'm aware that's Celestial tech. Eventhough Parasite absorbed Brainiacs universal telepathy maybe Fantomex's power will work because of the decpetive nature of the powers. If it works he could get Parasite to drain Cheetah. However I'm kinda skeptical of Parasite absorbing Brainiacs universal telepathy cos it makes him sound invincible I suspect there are other showings that are less impressive. For starters how is Parasite going to know that there is anything to absorb?

Maybe Archangel can fly into the air before Cheetah can get to him and engage with Cheetah while he is in the air. This is the only possible scenerio which i could see X-force winning. How fast is Cheetah she's not FTL is she? Archangel has superhuman reflexes and a bloodlusted Archangel made it difficult for X-force to follow in the Blackbird. The blackbird moves at supersonic speed.

shiv
Manta is going to look Birdie right in the eye and shoot him right out the sky (if he even allows his animal themed buddy to get airborne)

Manta is just gonna Omni Blast X-Force
They're Not Gonna See Hear Or Feel Cheetah Coming
And They Won't Know Parasite Is Feeding On Them Until Its All Over.

Inside Wolverine the early stages of a thought will begin to form To Charge Forward! coz he's Wolvy and he has got to show all these young whipper-snappers how its done. Ditto Wade, a neuron or two will commence prep-work on an impulse To Charge! and of course to draw on the charge + say something clever cuz he's not going to be out-done by some old man with whiskers - not a good look for his Image.

They'll probably register something brushing against them a decisecond to a millisecond after Manta optic beam connects (Parasite Thrown Forward in a fastball special by Cheetah) and immediately black out after being tagged by Cheetah herself leaving them dead on their feet for Deathstroke to take a free hit at and Deadshot to blast every vital organ they have before they've hit the ground.

btw

Psylocke is probably not going to be alive long enough for Parasite to feed well.

Deadline
In hindsight I think X-force can get some wins but Suicide Squad for the majority. This thread is actually better than I thought.

StyleTime
Originally posted by Senor Cage
Parasite's absorption is pretty hax. Not only did he absorb Brainiac's universal telepathy, he was also absorbing a good portion of the Speed Force.
He absorbed only a portion of it, and it was from a comatose Lois, who had the powers herself, and was overloaded by it. He also admitted he has poor control over psionic energy, and Superman pointed out that he'd take time to understand how to use it.
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Only to discover he'd actually drained his team
thumb up

He has zero counter to Fantomex's misdirect.

Parasite has an unclear relationship to psionic energy, but I'm not convinced Psylocke can't mindscrew him. Or make him think he's draining everyone despite having his powers disabled like she did to Omega Red. Or just psi-blading him.

We've already seen Pied Piper mind control him, granted it's a slightly different mechanism at play.
Originally posted by shiv

Psylocke is probably not going to be alive long enough for Parasite to feed well.
In my view, Psylocke can one shot most of that team by literally thinking "sleep." In a forum setting, Cheetah is the only thing stopping that.

Senor Cage
It's not like Parasite hasn't absorbed psychic energy before. He overloaded, yes, but Brainiac's power (even a portion of it) is beyond Psylock's.

https://i.imgur.com/6wdFBLW.jpg

Shouldn't use Pied Piper's example, as he uses the Anti-Life equation, IIRC.

Senor Cage
BTW, Psylocke ordering Parasite to sleep won't stop Parasite from absorbing energy, since he can still absorb energy while unconscious.

DarkSaint85
That's pre 52.

Plus, let's not pretend like Parasite is some genius....He's thicker than two short planks nailed together. Prime candidate for misdirection.

Senor Cage
Parasite still absorbed psychic energy post flashpoint. And it depends how much he will absorb from Fantomex beforehand. Fantomex would be a light snack. Fantomex is good, but he can still be defeated.

DarkSaint85
But how would he know where to absorb from??

Fantomex was misdirecting a multiversal reality warper, iirc.

Power levels don't matter here....It's power set that's the problem.

Yes, Parasite can absorb surrounding energy in a giant AoE attack that likely kills his team mates as well.

But if he tries that (highly unlikely), the way it works is that he would only THINK he's draining psychic or whatever energy. But in reality he's just sitting there doing nothing. Fantomex is like the Black Mercy plant in DC. For all of Superman's powers, for example, once it's on you and you are being misdirected by it, nothing you say or do or sense is actually real.

Parasite would believe he's winning. That he's draining everyone and getting more powerful....But the misdirection means he's literally just sitting there.

shiv
Manta's Optic Blast

Psylocke Archangel Fantomex

Do They Have a FTL Defense?

Cheetah's Direct Strike

Can They Act Faster Than Cheetah?

Parasite's Powers

Can They Contain The Parasite In A Green Lantern Class Force Field?

Do They Carry S.H.I.E.L.D., S.W.O.R.D., M.S.C.U. or Star Labs Class Restraints as Standard Equipment?


Even If Fantomex Had Prep Time:

Deathstroke would walk right through his fake news and Terminate Him.

With his trusty -- sentient -- magic -- extra dimension -- active + passive eldrich energy weapon slash telepathic battle computer.

Deadline
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
But how would he know where to absorb from??

Fantomex was misdirecting a multiversal reality warper, iirc.

Power levels don't matter here....It's power set that's the problem.

Yes, Parasite can absorb surrounding energy in a giant AoE attack that likely kills his team mates as well.

But if he tries that (highly unlikely), the way it works is that he would only THINK he's draining psychic or whatever energy. But in reality he's just sitting there doing nothing. Fantomex is like the Black Mercy plant in DC. For all of Superman's powers, for example, once it's on you and you are being misdirected by it, nothing you say or do or sense is actually real.

Parasite would believe he's winning. That he's draining everyone and getting more powerful....But the misdirection means he's literally just sitting there.

I agree with you're argument, however I think the only threat is Cheetah can she take out Fantomex before he can do anything?

XLR87T3
Cheetah can solo

DarkSaint85
Originally posted by Deadline
I agree with you're argument, however I think the only threat is Cheetah can she take out Fantomex before he can do anything?

I honestly don't know. Because I don't know WHEN his misdirections work.....If they're like Longshot's powers , for example, which are always passively on when he's in danger, then arguably it doesn't matter.

For example. At what point did the misdirect happen here?

https://i.postimg.cc/1tdH3W7t/v-X7-VKRK-d.jpg

Was it when Wolverine was mid leap? Mid slash? Just before? That's what I mean when I say I don't know.

DarkSaint85
Or here. Wolverine is obviously killing their soldiers, so something is happening (was it actually him slashing, though? Nobody knows for certain):

https://i.postimg.cc/P5qQ1nGx/GXvuxv0-d.jpg

And that at SOME point, the misdirection occurs. But when and how long it took mid battle, I don't know:

https://i.postimg.cc/bwFHTV8R/fr28-V0-C-d.jpg

Sin I AM
People are lowballing Fantomex when he's really that hax. He was has having a full on fight with Gambit on Attilan and the guards couldn't see anything.

DarkSaint85
It took the Goat Faced Monk (who was a multiversal reality warper I think) bending reality just to undo his misdirection:

https://i.postimg.cc/jj1fMdCr/image.jpg

DarkSaint85
Oh yeah....The Goat is Jamie Braddock. https://i.postimg.cc/KYWwC0Vj/Uncanny-X-Force-023-016.jpg

Senor Cage
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
But how would he know where to absorb from??

Fantomex was misdirecting a multiversal reality warper, iirc.

Power levels don't matter here....It's power set that's the problem.

Yes, Parasite can absorb surrounding energy in a giant AoE attack that likely kills his team mates as well.

But if he tries that (highly unlikely), the way it works is that he would only THINK he's draining psychic or whatever energy. But in reality he's just sitting there doing nothing. Fantomex is like the Black Mercy plant in DC. For all of Superman's powers, for example, once it's on you and you are being misdirected by it, nothing you say or do or sense is actually real.

Parasite would believe he's winning. That he's draining everyone and getting more powerful....But the misdirection means he's literally just sitting there.

Nah, parasite would absorb him first. You're assuming that fantomex would target him first.

DarkSaint85
No.

I'm assuming Fantomex does a wide scale misdirect, which affects the entire area. Which is his MO. He avoids fighting as much as possible.

Senor Cage
He could, if he doesn't get absorbed first. Parasite can also do a wide scale absorption. So, it basically comes down on who gets the first attack off.

DarkSaint85
Which is Fantomex`s usual MO.

Parasite doesn't do a wide AoE attack right off the bat, certainly not at distance, and not when surrounded by team mates.

Senor Cage
He absorbs people at a distance a lot. If there Is a group of people attacking hes absorbed them in the past. He usually absorbs top tiers with a lot of power, but if he knows hes fighting a team, he'd to a wide attack

DarkSaint85
Got scans of n52 doing this? When surrounded by team mates?

Senor Cage
Yes, let me find them. We've seen fantomex lose to someone like gambit and karnak went toe to toe with him. Hes not unbeatavle.

DarkSaint85
And we've seen Steve Trevor out react Cheetah. Let's not do the low showings lol.

Senor Cage
Fantomex usually has a few of those. Has he ever pulled a misdirection on someone as fast as Cheetah (who tagged Flash)?

DarkSaint85
Yeah but Cheetah has fewer showings.

So her low showings should be givne more weight.

How many n52 showings does Cheetah have? Out of all of them (I think she has 3, lol) Steve tagged her once.

If you can prove Fantomex has 33% of his misdirects failing, I'm happy to concede.

Sin I AM
Originally posted by Senor Cage
Yes, let me find them. We've seen fantomex lose to someone like gambit and karnak went toe to toe with him. Hes not unbeatavle.

Not a fair characterization. He wanted to get caught with Gambit. Karnak was written up in IvX

Senor Cage
But we know fantomex hasn't affected someone as fast as cheetah. Superman couldn't pick her up. I doubt fantom would.

Sin I AM
No. He hasn't. If Cheetah goes for him first there is a probability the SS would win. Tbh Ive always considered F-Mex powers to be passive like Longshot or Dominoes yet not as faulty. And he seems to have more control or atleast he's more aware of the results. So I'm still leaning towards him..and not because I dont think Cheetah is fast enough but because I dont think in character she'd go for him first. Or that she'd just blindly rush the field leaving her team in the dust.

Senor Cage
The thing is, cheetah doesn't have to go for him first. Cheetah is fast enough to kill all of them before any of them get an attack off.

Sin I AM
If his powers arent passive yes. If so then no. And she'd have to kill them all in one trip. I can't see her doing that..knowing her history

Deadline
Originally posted by Senor Cage
Fantomex usually has a few of those. Has he ever pulled a misdirection on someone as fast as Cheetah (who tagged Flash)?

Deathstroke has tagged Flash. I don't think Cheetah is as fast as Flash I suspect she is Marvel speedster speed. In another words her rushing the team will be like dodging a bullet except that Fantomex doesn't need to physically avoid her has to think before she gets to him. Fantomex thinks at superhuman speed.



Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Yeah but Cheetah has fewer showings.

So her low showings should be givne more weight.

How many n52 showings does Cheetah have? Out of all of them (I think she has 3, lol) Steve tagged her once.

If you can prove Fantomex has 33% of his misdirects failing, I'm happy to concede.

To be fair unless there is evidence that a character has drastically changed in the nu52 we can still use old showings a lot of characters have not changed at all and a lot of history from the old DC is in nu52.

Senor Cage
Cheetah was able to make the whole JL look slow. And with her bite, she can make X-Force her slaves.

Philosophía
Darksaint is rubbing Fantomex, but it's Golgo that uses the powers of illusion in all of his posts.

Who's really fooling who?

Deadline
Originally posted by Senor Cage
Cheetah was able to make the whole JL look slow. And with her bite, she can make X-Force her slaves.

None of them had misdirection powers.


Originally posted by Senor Cage
She still has the bite, which can still mess with Fantomex or anyone on the field.

https://i.imgur.com/CebAJXm.jpg

You see that scan? In less time it takes for WW to shout Fantomex would have misdirected her.

Senor Cage
Fantomex's thought process is a lot slower. In a forum match, they'd be toast.

shiv
FYI

In that scan Cheetah has the speed to close the distance between herself and The Kryptonian faster than Superman or Wonder Woman can Think, Act or React, Deliver A Little Speech, Bite Superman, Sink Her Teeth Right In His Super Dense Invulnerable Neck, Draw Blood, Snarl and make a Clean Getaway all in the time it takes WW (who is no slouch herself) to say 1 word.

Geezus People Let Fantomex Die Already.

shiv
It will be a quick end for Fantomex


He won't even feel a thing

DarkSaint85
Originally posted by Senor Cage
Fantomex's thought process is a lot slower. In a forum match, they'd be toast.

But how can she do it when Parasite is draining her? Remember, you said he started the fight by AoE draining....and she starts the match being closer to him than Fantomex.

Then you have to prove that Fantomex's powers depend on his thoughts.

Where are the scans of n52 Parasite starting fights with a massive AoE attack when his team mates are near?

shiv
Parasite has trained and worked with Cheetah, Manta, Deathstroke and Deadshot.

He'll Drain The Field Without Draining His Teammates

StyleTime
Originally posted by Senor Cage
It's not like Parasite hasn't absorbed psychic energy before. He overloaded, yes, but Brainiac's power (even a portion of it) is beyond Psylocke's.

https://i.imgur.com/6wdFBLW.jpg

Shouldn't use Pied Piper's example, as he uses the Anti-Life equation, IIRC.
That was a temporary mutation Parasite had, back when he could even absorb inertia too. Also, yes, that is not the Nu52 one.

I wasn't suggesting Psylocke would overload him. I'm pointing out that Parasite drained a comatose victim who couldn't attack him. I don't think anyone in current continuity has even attacked him psychically yet.(?) Additionally, we know that Parasite's abilities are limited by proximity.
https://postimg.cc/3W1vVrqB
https://postimg.cc/RW6JW7Zs
https://postimg.cc/872JM7F1

It's not the same as Psylocke, who is standing .5 km away per the forum rules, making him take a nap.
Originally posted by Senor Cage
BTW, Psylocke ordering Parasite to sleep won't stop Parasite from absorbing energy, since he can still absorb energy while unconscious.
She can also turn off his powers though.

Deadline
Originally posted by shiv
FYI

In that scan Cheetah has the speed to close the distance between herself and The Kryptonian faster than Superman or Wonder Woman can Think, Act or React, Deliver A Little Speech, Bite Superman, Sink Her Teeth Right In His Super Dense Invulnerable Neck, Draw Blood, Snarl and make a Clean Getaway all in the time it takes WW (who is no slouch herself) to say 1 word.

Geezus People Let Fantomex Die Already.

No she hasn't you're just saying that. All cheetah did was move faster than Superman could react WW had time to react and saw what was happening. WW was talking before Cheetah had finished biting Supermans neck, so clearly Fantomex will have time to react.



Originally posted by Senor Cage
Fantomex's thought process is a lot slower. In a forum match, they'd be toast.

Theres no proof. How fast can she run?

Senor Cage
Shes faster than Flash and WW. Shes pretty fast.

Senor Cage
Seeing as Superman reacted to Flash, that's a lot faster than Fantomex can think.

StyleTime
Fantomex's powers almost certainly are a casted ability though. I've addressed this in other threads, but part of the brilliance of Remender-era(Morrison too) Fantomex was that he messes with the perceptions of the reader as much as the characters in the story. Remender didn't show Fantomex cast every time because we're supposed to be drawn into the ruse ourselves. We're supposed to go "Oh shit! Shadow King made Wolverine kill Fantomex! The Horsemen took out X-Force! It's over!", then smirk as we realize that Fantomex duped us just like everyone else. It's a narrative device used for excitement/suspense. It's one of the flaws of isolated battleboard scans. Fantomex, especially from that run, is hard to separate from the context of the story he was in. You really have to read the entire narrative sequence to understand it. It's not as simple as Deadpool decapitating someone.

We've seen him cast it enough to know that's how it works though, even if we don't get shown the ability every time. When it fails, we see Fantomex standing their with his hand out casting it. We've literally seen him speak the illusion into existence multiple times, and he's been in too many situations where an autocast is simply implausible. Take AoA Iceman warning Fantomex not to try it, since he won't be able to locate his mind for it work anyway. It's clearly something Fantomex does consciously.

Now, maybe some think Fantomex can get off the misdirect before Cheetah closes in on them, but that's a different thing. I disagree obviously, but I find it more reasonable than Fantomex having a passive misdirection aura.
Originally posted by shiv
Parasite has trained and worked with Cheetah, Manta, Deathstroke and Deadshot.

He'll Drain The Field Without Draining His Teammates
If Fantomex succeeds, he won't realize they are his teammates.

Deadline
Originally posted by Senor Cage
Shes faster than Flash and WW. Shes pretty fast.

Er I don't think so somehow. So shes Faster Than Light is she? She's so fast she can travel back in time? She on a similar levle to Zoom now?

Originally posted by Senor Cage
Seeing as Superman reacted to Flash, that's a lot faster than Fantomex can think.

And Deathstroke has reacted to Flash. So Deathstroke is faster than Flash? Use some common sense please. I'm also getting the impression that Cheetah jumped Superman, like they were in a forest somewhere and she burst out of nowhere.

beatboks
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
But Parasite would need to Target him.

And in doing so, would likely target his team mates instead.
Like so:

https://i.postimg.cc/V6Z9NZvh/6r-J9my2-d.jpg

He's badly injured here, btw.

Parasite has never targeted any power he simply feels it and drains it. It also doesnt matter how it works because he drains everything, memories, psychie, life force etc.

Also what would it matter if he absorbed his own team as well? The whole team doesnt have to survive to win a fight. Im a team fight if 1 character is left standing at the end that characters team wins. I don't see any way that any of them a beating parasite when he can simply absorb everything they all are (both sides)

He gets hungry absorbs everyone onnthe field and as hes the onlynone left standing his team wins

cdtm
Originally posted by StyleTime
Fantomex's powers almost certainly are a casted ability though. I've addressed this in other threads, but part of the brilliance of Remender-era(Morrison too) Fantomex was that he messes with the perceptions of the reader as much as the characters in the story. Remender didn't show Fantomex cast every time because we're supposed to be drawn into the ruse ourselves. We're supposed to go "Oh shit! Shadow King made Wolverine kill Fantomex! The Horsemen took out X-Force! It's over!", then smirk as we realize that Fantomex duped us just like everyone else. It's a narrative device used for excitement/suspense. It's one of the flaws of isolated battleboard scans. Fantomex, especially from that run, is hard to separate from the context of the story he was in. You really have to read the entire narrative sequence to understand it. It's not as simple as Deadpool decapitating someone.

We've seen him cast it enough to know that's how it works though, even if we don't get shown the ability every time. When it fails, we see Fantomex standing their with his hand out casting it. We've literally seen him speak the illusion into existence multiple times, and he's been in too many situations where an autocast is simply implausible. Take AoA Iceman warning Fantomex not to try it, since he won't be able to locate his mind for it work anyway. It's clearly something Fantomex does consciously.

Now, maybe some think Fantomex can get off the misdirect before Cheetah closes in on them, but that's a different thing. I disagree obviously, but I find it more reasonable than Fantomex having a passive misdirection aura.

If Fantomex succeeds, he won't realize they are his teammates.


It was the same stuff seen in Naruto every week. Sasuke, Itachi, or Naruto fooling their opponent and audience.

Fantomex's abiliity is one of the most formidable forms of illusion casting in comics, but I do tend to think it's about as overrated as Midnighters Battle Computer. If Parasite is indeed capable of battlefield wife mass draining, I'd probably put that over a mass illusion cast, personally.

StyleTime
Originally posted by cdtm
It was the same stuff seen in Naruto every week. Sasuke, Itachi, or Naruto fooling their opponent and audience.

I've said it before, but misdirection is basically genjutsu in a western comic.

DarkSaint85
Originally posted by Deadline
Er I don't think so somehow. So shes Faster Than Light is she? She's so fast she can travel back in time? She on a similar levle to Zoom now?



And Deathstroke has reacted to Flash. So Deathstroke is faster than Flash? Use some common sense please. I'm also getting the impression that Cheetah jumped Superman, like they were in a forest somewhere and she burst out of nowhere.

Batman has also reacted to Cheetah. She's hardly an unrecognisable blur - he even realised who it was:

https://comicnewbies.files.wordpress.com/2014/08/the-cheetah-infects-superman-1.jpg
100% agree, she's tagging Flash and Batman in that scan.

But if she IS faster than Flash, based on that scan, and Flash has outraced light, and we are scaling off her...you see where this leads?

Cheetah>Flash>light, but not so fast that Batman can't see her sneaking up on them, recognising her and shouting out a warning, lol.

Originally posted by beatboks
Parasite has never targeted any power he simply feels it and drains it. It also doesnt matter how it works because he drains everything, memories, psychie, life force etc.

Also what would it matter if he absorbed his own team as well? The whole team doesnt have to survive to win a fight. Im a team fight if 1 character is left standing at the end that characters team wins. I don't see any way that any of them a beating parasite when he can simply absorb everything they all are (both sides)

He gets hungry absorbs everyone onnthe field and as hes the onlynone left standing his team wins

You're not understanding me.

Fantomex would make Parasite THINK he's draining X-force. But he's not. He's literally just sitting there.

And IF he tries draining everyone, that hurts his team more than X-force - because he starts draining Cheetah of her speed.

Senor Cage
Batman is Batman though. Marvel doesn't wank Fantomex like that. Plus, Batman has superior speed feats to Fantom.

DarkSaint85
Originally posted by Senor Cage
Batman is Batman though. Marvel doesn't wank Fantomex like that. Plus, Batman has superior speed feats to Fantom.

Flash has superior speed feats to Cheetah. Yet, you seem to ignore it based on this showing.

So why can't I use Batman?

How about I use Steve Trevor?

Am still waiting on your Parasite scans, btw.

Senor Cage
You use Steve, then I'll use Karnak. stick out tongue

Either way, it would be difficult to find examples of fantom using his illusions on someone that fast.

DarkSaint85
Originally posted by Senor Cage
You use Steve, then I'll use Karnak. stick out tongue

Either way, it would be difficult to find examples of fantom using his illusions on someone that fast.

You really think Karnak is applicable to Steve Trevor, a normal human guy? Troll. But don't forget, Fantomex has more showings than Cheetah - so sure, he has low showings (lol @Karnak, comparing it to Steve) but they are diluted by his highs.

Cheetah, on the other hand, only has about 3 or so showings. One of which, her best, has a human (Batman) recognising and reacting to her sneak attack in a jungle. Not looking good for how fast she is.

I thought you were digging up Parasite scans for me?

Senor Cage
At least cheetah has combat feats displaying her speed. Fantomex doesn't have any feats of pulling off an illusion against a speedster such as her.

DarkSaint85
Originally posted by Senor Cage
At least cheetah has combat feats displaying her speed. Fantomex doesn't have any feats of pulling off an illusion against a speedster such as her.

Combat feats like against a human?

https://i.postimg.cc/zXFC7Vvz/RCO017-w-1497447393.jpg

I'm beginning to think Cheetah is all hype. Cale dodged her just fine in that first panel. Don't forget, we are using Rebirth Cheetah, whose origin is completely different from n52.

Where are the Parasite scans?

shiv
Originally posted by StyleTime


If Fantomex succeeds, he won't realize they are his teammates.

DarkSaint85 speculated The Parasite might drain Cheetah (if he tried a wide range drain)

Like he doesn't know how to use his powers.

Fantomex can not cast or think faster than Manta's Light Speed Optic Blast

Or Cheetah's Assault

And Deathstroke will Terminate Him If They Don't


PIS OFF

Deathstroke's Magic Sword isn't going to pretend it hasn't identified E.V.A. and Fantomex and can't make Deathstroke see where to blast, shoot or stab Fantomex.

Senor Cage
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Combat feats like against a human?

https://i.postimg.cc/zXFC7Vvz/RCO017-w-1497447393.jpg

I'm beginning to think Cheetah is all hype. Cale dodged her just fine in that first panel. Don't forget, we are using Rebirth Cheetah, whose origin is completely different from n52.

Where are the Parasite scans?

If you say so, but shes still considerably faster.

deathslash
Originally posted by Senor Cage
At least cheetah has combat feats displaying her speed. Fantomex doesn't have any feats of pulling off an illusion against a speedster such as her. if we're talking about speed feats, then psylocke guts her as she runs by.....

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-Oss3_Io0ubA/U2rdAEfb8XI/AAAAAAAAEig/5f2_k-BRLHg/s1600/X-MenNoMoreHumans.png

That's quicksilver that just got casually put on his ass

Senor Cage
Cheetah is much faster though.

beatboks
Originally posted by DarkSaint85


Fantomex would make Parasite THINK he's draining X-force. But he's not. He's literally just sitting there.

And IF he tries draining everyone, that hurts his team more than X-force - because he starts draining Cheetah of her speed.

Miss Direction only works for powers that require a direction parasites Powers don't he doesn't have to aim if you're within the vicinity/ range of him he can drain you.

In his first appearance he drained without even knowing he had the ability just because people were in his presence their life's force was sucked from their bodies. He literally killed an entire busload of people without knowing he had the power clearly he doesn't need to aim anything (i.e it doesnt matter what he THINKS hes doing).

Parasite has the ability to give power back as well as take he has even transferred powers from one to another. he used ability to amp Solomon Grundy when Grundy fought Superman he used his ability to give the powers of airwave to Airwaves enemy he toyed with Superman on multiple occasions by taking his power and giving back a little back like giving him just enough of his durability so he can take this punch

In any case as I said if he drained everyone regardless and didn't try to give power back to his own teammates he's got all their power they're all screwed He's Still Standing ergo his team wins because hes all thats left standing at the end.

deathslash
Originally posted by Senor Cage
Cheetah is much faster though. you brought up cheetah blitzing a character that moves faster than light. I just brought up Psylocke blitzing a character that moves faster than light.

I would love to see you prove that new52 or rebirth Cheetah is "much faster" than quicksilver though. It would be interesting to see how much weight you put into two or three feats when one of them consists of having trouble with human opponents.....

Flyattractor
Originally posted by deathslash
if we're talking about speed feats, then psylocke guts her as she runs by.....

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-Oss3_Io0ubA/U2rdAEfb8XI/AAAAAAAAEig/5f2_k-BRLHg/s1600/X-MenNoMoreHumans.png

That's quicksilver that just got casually put on his ass

So when did this Massive DBZ Level Power Up Happen?

Looks like a pile of Bullshit to me.

Kazenji
But how would you know, You don't read comics.

Flyattractor
Not Crappy X-Men or Marvel Comics. That is True!!!

Senor Cage
Originally posted by deathslash
you brought up cheetah blitzing a character that moves faster than light. I just brought up Psylocke blitzing a character that moves faster than light.

I would love to see you prove that new52 or rebirth Cheetah is "much faster" than quicksilver though. It would be interesting to see how much weight you put into two or three feats when one of them consists of having trouble with human opponents.....

Quicksilver moves ftl?

Flyattractor
Originally posted by Senor Cage
Quicksilver moves ftl?

He probably shops at the same Power Up Store as Psylocke.


Cause I don't remember her having Super Strength...at least on that level.

deathslash
Originally posted by Senor Cage
Quicksilver moves ftl? he's been capable of moving ftll for a long time.

https://qph.fs.quoracdn.net/main-qimg-8f28e0ab1c0e9dd786ca858f852cc0d1-c

Senor Cage
So, hes flash level in speed? Cheetah was toying with Flash.

deathslash
Originally posted by Senor Cage
So, hes flash level in speed? Cheetah was toying with Flash. and psylocke's toyed with Quicksilver and has far better skill feats. Do you see the problem now?

Before Cheetah can even blitz Fantomex, she has to first get past someone with an incredibly similar feat, far more skill, powerful tp that puts her on par with Omega level mutants, and powerful tk that she can use to flatten mountains. Psylocke can simply lift cheetah into the air, take her out with a psychic knife to the brain, or use her tp to make cheetah think her allies are actually her enemies.

DarkSaint85
Originally posted by beatboks
Miss Direction only works for powers that require a direction parasites Powers don't he doesn't have to aim if you're within the vicinity/ range of him he can drain you.

In his first appearance he drained without even knowing he had the ability just because people were in his presence their life's force was sucked from their bodies. He literally killed an entire busload of people without knowing he had the power clearly he doesn't need to aim anything (i.e it doesnt matter what he THINKS hes doing).

Parasite has the ability to give power back as well as take he has even transferred powers from one to another. he used ability to amp Solomon Grundy when Grundy fought Superman he used his ability to give the powers of airwave to Airwaves enemy he toyed with Superman on multiple occasions by taking his power and giving back a little back like giving him just enough of his durability so he can take this punch

In any case as I said if he drained everyone regardless and didn't try to give power back to his own teammates he's got all their power they're all screwed He's Still Standing ergo his team wins because hes all thats left standing at the end.

N52/Rebirth, please. Your examples and feats aren't valid

DarkSaint85
Originally posted by Senor Cage
So, hes flash level in speed? Cheetah was toying with Flash.

Cheetah never toyed with Flash. Rebirth retconned her

Senor Cage
How was rebirth retcon her? And she toyed with the flash twice during that issue

Senor Cage
So, pre-flashpoint parasite stomps on his own? stick out tongue

DarkSaint85
Originally posted by Senor Cage
How was rebirth retcon her? And she toyed with the flash twice during that issue

Her origin is completely different. There's no magical tribe with the horn etc now.

Originally posted by Senor Cage
So, pre-flashpoint parasite stomps on his own? stick out tongue

Depends on the Parasite.

But then, current Wolverine is the Phoenix, so let's not pick and choose versions, OK?

Let's stick to n52, which you have to post anything for.

Senor Cage
You're speaking of an amp for wovie. Parasites powers have always been his and you can argue that his absorption powers only increased.

DarkSaint85
Originally posted by Senor Cage
You're speaking of an amp for wovie. Parasites powers have always been his and you can argue that his absorption powers only increased.

So post the scans of N52 Parasite draining with an AoE attack whilst his team mates are around.

Senor Cage
He's absorbed people without touching them before, so why wouldn't he use his powers here? Plus, there are no scans of Fantom doing it to speedsters or teams.

Senor Cage
Would this do? Parasite absorbing a group of thugs, while he was a member of Suicide Squad.

https://i.imgur.com/l6UpCzT.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/xZS1OTk.jpg

Senor Cage
Parasite Vs the Justice League. Absorbing a portion of the SF (He could of absorbed it all), absorbing Hal's ring, making Wonder Woman go mad, absorbing Cyborg, etc... Parasite SOLOS.

https://i.imgur.com/omHZACa.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/hWsSFB9.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/3fUv4Bq.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/tIRptpx.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/IjEj34Y.jpg

Senor Cage
https://i.imgur.com/MhPgT6F.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/EHKP9YB.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/za2ifun.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/TUk1cTn.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/SPU9ZRn.jpg

DarkSaint85
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Got scans of n52 doing this? When surrounded by team mates?

So let's see...

Originally posted by Senor Cage
Would this do? Parasite absorbing a group of thugs, while he was a member of Suicide Squad.


Lol, so no.

Originally posted by Senor Cage
Parasite Vs the Justice League. Absorbing a portion of the SF (He could of absorbed it all), absorbing Hal's ring, making Wonder Woman go mad, absorbing Cyborg, etc... Parasite SOLOS.


Lol, so no.

Originally posted by Senor Cage


Lol, so no.

So in other words, when n52/Rebirth Parasite's surrounded by team mates, he doesn't do AoE wide mass drains over the entire battlefield.

Thanks.

Let's see how Parasite deals with enhanced humans who are willing to kill.

https://i.postimg.cc/dVtgC8Yy/RCO014-1468865875.jpg

Even with Midnighter's healing factor.

https://i.postimg.cc/5NpRf6CN/RCO015-1468865875.jpg

Yeah, but Fantomex ain't Midnighter!

That's right.

Fantomex has bullets which never miss.

https://i.postimg.cc/qq41TTB3/Thats-not-even-the-weirdest-thing-the-britain-corps-04417d37049.jpg

DarkSaint85
Psylocke vs Parasite, anyone?

https://i.postimg.cc/xdK6XC4Z/RCO009-w-1468210668.jpg

DarkSaint85
Originally posted by Senor Cage
Would this do? Parasite absorbing a group of thugs, while he was a member of Suicide Squad.


The next scan:
https://i.postimg.cc/d0bmjKzy/RCO016-1469309880.jpg

Not looking great here, lol.

NEXT issue:

https://i.postimg.cc/QCwXH0Bh/RCO007-1469319862.jpg

NEXT issue:
https://i.postimg.cc/QCH88Rdf/RCO005-1469309822.jpg

NEXT issue:
https://i.postimg.cc/63H6N9t7/RCO020-1469298301.jpg

So much for this uber absorber who drains everything, lol.

DarkSaint85
Parasite LITERALLY explaining how his powers work. By touch.

https://i.postimg.cc/QVGR2P99/RCO007-1469389979.jpg

What was the starting distance again? Lol.

AlbertoJohnAvil
Parasite is another wildcard. How would the team specifically counter his near limitless absorption?

DarkSaint85
Originally posted by AlbertoJohnAvil
Parasite is another wildcard. How would the team specifically counter his near limitless absorption?

A: he's not limitless
B: he needs to touch to absorb a lot of the time
C: he can be shot.
D: he can be mind controlled.

Deadline
DS is killing it. Will post later.

DarkSaint85
I DID see Golgo saying Fantomex doesn't misdirect teams.

Here, he misdirects the Horsemen (a group). Whilst HE'S ON A DIFFERENT PLANET:
https://i.postimg.cc/5H5jtpf8/2-Inerplanetary-Long-Range-Misdirection-2.jpg

Here, he misdirects...ok, a team of two (lol), but it IS Phoenix Jean Grey and Professor X:
https://i.postimg.cc/PLmx3ycP/4-Misdirection-Jean-Charles-4.jpg

Here, he misdirects a team of goons AND Shadow King controlled Deadpool, Archangel, and Wolverine:

https://i.postimg.cc/XZK1GvcP/Uncanny-X-Force-008-011.jpg
................
https://i.postimg.cc/HJ0Nr1qB/WFgZJBy.jpg

Yeah, he's done it a few times, lol.

I'm surprised that with all this talk of who has tagged who, Wolverine hasn't been mentioned.....

Sin I AM
Probably because folks forsee him battling it out with Deathstroke. While Wade will have his hands full with Deadshot...cancelling each other out. The rest are more or less wildcards. Warren is being written off as well.

StiltmanFTW
Originally posted by Senor Cage
https://i.imgur.com/MhPgT6F.jpg


I love this scan.

Parasite is becoming my favourite character thumb up

deathslash
Originally posted by Sin I AM
Probably because folks forsee him battling it out with Deathstroke. While Wade will have his hands full with Deadshot...cancelling each other out. The rest are more or less wildcards. Warren is being written off as well. I actually see Wade taking on Slade while Logan guts Deadshot and then guts Black Manta.

Sin I AM
Originally posted by deathslash
I actually see Wade taking on Slade while Logan guts Deadshot and then guts Black Manta.

If Wade fought Slade he'd lose. He bullshits too much. Logan will wreck Deadshot. Manta would be wise to play support and snipe from afar.

deathslash
Originally posted by Sin I AM
If Wade fought Slade he'd lose. He bullshits too much. Logan will wreck Deadshot. Manta would be wise to play support and snipe from afar. a decade ago I might have agreed with you, but Deadpool has actually gotten significantly more impressive over the years and seems to take his fights a lot more serious than he used to. Also, he's fighting to the best of his ability.

Sin I AM
Originally posted by deathslash
a decade ago I might have agreed with you, but Deadpool has actually gotten significantly more impressive over the years and seems to take his fights a lot more serious than he used to. Also, he's fighting to the best of his ability.

You'd have to point me in the right direction. I havent seen anything that suggest he'd even split with DS.

Senor Cage
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
A: he's not limitless
B: he needs to touch to absorb a lot of the time
C: he can be shot.
D: he can be mind controlled.

I dont think so. Its widely known he doesn't need to touch. Fantomex. I see you posted some team stuff, but those teams aren't as formidable as the SS. Fantomex would need to try and do it fast enough,while dealing with parasites draining.

DarkSaint85
Originally posted by Senor Cage
I dont think so. Its widely known he doesn't need to touch. Fantomex. I see you posted some team stuff, but those teams aren't as formidable as the SS. Fantomex would need to try and do it fast enough,while dealing with parasites draining.

Your scans mostly showed him touching.

Aren't as formidable? Professor X and Jean Grey. WITH THE PHOENIX?

Lol

Over 0.5km? He can do it easily. I showed him doing it from a different planet lol.

Senor Cage
Mostly but not all. And in terms of speed, you haven't showed fantom doing it to someone as fast as cheetah. No PIS, in a forum match, the speedsters get the advantage.

Deadline
Originally posted by Senor Cage
Mostly but not all. And in terms of speed, you haven't showed fantom doing it to someone as fast as cheetah. No PIS, in a forum match, the speedsters get the advantage.

We don't need to theres no proof shes any faster than Quicksilver or Speed Demon. Her tagging Flash doesn't prove shes as fast or faster than Flash because Batman and Deathstroke have both reacted to Flash.

Lots of characters who are slower than speedsters have tagged speedsters even without PIS. What you're forgetting he doesn't have to physically move he just has to think.

Flyattractor
What kind of GUN and Ammo are Deadshot allowed to use here? Is he Limited to some pussy 9mm or something or can he use Big Sci Fi Comic Book Guns in This?

Deadline
^ He uses his regular equipment.

StiltmanFTW
Originally posted by Deadline
^ He uses his regular equipment.

Don't waste your time with Fly.

He's a bot.

Flyattractor
Originally posted by Deadline
^ He uses his regular equipment.

So Lawton wasn't given any intel on who he was going to be shooting at then?

Senor Cage
Originally posted by Deadline
We don't need to theres no proof shes any faster than Quicksilver or Speed Demon. Her tagging Flash doesn't prove shes as fast or faster than Flash because Batman and Deathstroke have both reacted to Flash.

Lots of characters who are slower than speedsters have tagged speedsters even without PIS. What you're forgetting he doesn't have to physically move he just has to think.

Quicksilver isn't a good example. Hes not as agile, durable strong, nor does he have the healing of cheetah.

Deadline
Originally posted by Senor Cage
Quicksilver isn't a good example. Hes not as agile, durable strong, nor does he have the healing of cheetah.

Strength, durability and healing isn't going to help against a misdirection. You don't get it YOU need to prove shes faster than Quicksilver. You just have her tagging Flash and that proves nothing.

Originally posted by Flyattractor
So Lawton wasn't given any intel on who he was going to be shooting at then?

Just common knowledge.

Senor Cage
Originally posted by Deadline
Strength, durability and healing isn't going to help against a misdirection. You don't get it YOU need to prove shes faster than Quicksilver. You just have her tagging Flash and that proves nothing.



Just common knowledge.

I said it before, it depends on who gets the first attack off. I just don't feel comfortable giving Fantomex the advantage, when cheetah is faster than he can think. On top of parasites drain, manta, shade, etc...

Flyattractor
Originally posted by Deadline



Just common knowledge.


I dunno. I think Floyd is smart enough to bring something better then standard 9mm ammo to this fight.

Just sayin...

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