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So?

Compared to the Current Canon? I mean I guess he could be in the Top 10 at the least.

Compared overall in the history of SW? He's kinda low imo.

That's kinda depressing

We know virtually nothing about the depths of canon Luke's abilities right now. He had acquired an IMMENSE wealth of knowledge from which to build his power around, though -- and I'm not just talking about his time with Yoda.

In theory, he would've had knowledge on... Just about everything there is to know about the force in canon.

One of the best traits Luke had in the OT is that he's not an effing tryhard, he tries to enjoy life, have fun and is not a zealot of the Force. Rey is a lot more rigid than Luke (Finn is the more loose character in this trilogy)

Originally posted by Darth Thor
^ Really? Because remember those Holy Jedi texts bores him "page turners they were not hmm"

Now of course Rey will read those books start to finish, and learn every secret. Watch this space for the true legacy of the Jedi to be left in Reys hands. In the comics we see that Luke eventually finds Jocasta Nu's makeshift 'school' and trove of Holocrons:
https://i.imgur.com/Ch9B5YU.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/ihWmjjP.jpg


And before her death, Jocasta had recorded ALL of her knowledge(pertaining to the Jedi/Sith, and Force in general) onto these Holocrons in hopes of restarting the Jedi Order from scratch:
https://i.imgur.com/NQOMOYy.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/ucgXQeG.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/n36At5M.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/fOJNGEb.jpg


And in the same arc, Palpatine himself confirmed the ridiculous extent of Jocasta's knowledge:
https://i.imgur.com/Tfwy2Ug.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/S5cV8FD.jpg
"Jocasta Nu knows everything Not just secrets of the light side of the Force. The dark side as well. Secrets that were not theirs to keep. Secrets even of the ancient Sith. Jocasta knows them all."


...And this is aside from Luke scouring the galaxy(post-RotJ) for any and all ancient Force-related relics/texts he could get his hands on, in search of finding the origin of the Jedi/Force.


So yeah, theoretically his knowledge of the Force should have been absolutely immense. /shrug

Figured it was worth mentioning that two separate novels have now mentioned Luke pulling Star Destroyers out of the sky during the Battle of Jakku...



Granted, these are just the recollections/stories of a few random characters in the SW galaxy, but it's interesting that two different canon sources have mentioned this feat.


And tbh, it's not entirely without precedent. In the comics Luke was able to shake an entire Star Destroyer with a single TK attack:
http://i.imgur.com/a8CUvWKm.jpg http://i.imgur.com/JnkxXx1m.jpg

...And that was pre-ESB Luke, who had virtually NO formalized Jedi training whatsoever.


Again, the quotes certainly aren't irrefutable... They're just some food for thought.

You know, it sure would have been nice to see this kinda shit in TLJ...

No not really. Power creep is gay.

Originally posted by ares834
You know, it sure would have been nice to see this kinda shit in TLJ... Yes it would have. Even if it was just a random comment like the ones galan posted. SOMETHING that actually built Luke's character a bit would have been nice to get in the movies.

Originally posted by NemeBro
No not really. Power creep is gay. You must have REALLY hated Legends Luke then.

Originally posted by NemeBro
No not really. Power creep is gay.

I mean pulling SDs out of the sky would be a bit much, but I would have liked to see a Luke who was, you know, powerful. At least on par with the greatest of the CW Jedi like Anakin or Yoda.

Johnson really did an awful job

Disney ruined Luke Skywalker in canon unfortunately. Luke could be an intimidating presence and warrior but he just disappeared because of failing Kylo Ren? What is this? It is like as if they had no story to tell about Luke.

Almost like it had already been told over 30 years ago.

An Heir to the Empire type story except with obviously an older Leia, Luke, Han could have worked...

Or what would have been ideal is a Harry Potter style Jedi Academy focusing on younger students, and Luke and Leia would be the headmasters, Jedi Council.

But oh no we dont want to focus on young kids because of Phantom Menace.. Stay Away Stay Away.

But pretty much anything would have been better than remaking the OT and calling it the ST. While butchering OG characters in the process.

And of course a cohesive story that was planned from the beginning would have helped too.

I really do wonder how Abrams prepared to create Episode 7. Did he read any SW material? Because to me it seems like he really had no idea what to do

Originally posted by Total Warrior
Did he read any SW material?

Of course not.

He was a *fan* of the OT movies only. Not the PT or the EU or TCW.

Funnily enough Rian Johnson has read some EU stuff, given he got the idea of Lukes Force projection from Dark Empire.

The takeaway here is that Vader can tank planetary destruction, and his son can rip Star Destroyers out of the sky.

Anything else is just semantics.

Originally posted by Total Warrior
So?

Not as strong as canon Rey or Palpatine

A loser that can't even beat Leia (or Rey for that matter).

And needed an old man nap after creating an illusion for a 5 minutes. On ther hand, Snoke, a mere creation of Sidious, can apparently nuke his Jedi Temple from who knows how many light years away.

I'd probably say in between Prime Kenobi and Mace Windu. Top 5 Jedi in the canon are probably:

1. Yoda
2/3. Mace/Anakin
4. Luke
5. Kenobi

You forgot:
0. Rey

If Luke is legit pulling down Star Destroyers from space then hes above Yoda.

We never saw him do anything like that.

Originally posted by Psychotron
We never saw him do anything like that.

This is canon, not films only.

Theres been stories of him doing that. After the shit we saw in this movie it looks more and more likely that legit happened.

Originally posted by Darth Thor
This is canon, not films only.

Theres been stories of him doing that. After the shit we saw in this movie it looks more and more likely that legit happened.

They sound more like, and forgive the double entendre here, legends.

Originally posted by Lord Stark
They sound more like, and forgive the double entendre here, legends.


They did, yeah.

But after this film I have no doubt they are true.

Besides in Canon you have a pre-ESB Luke shaking a Star Destroyer without even realising what he did.

So for Jedi Master Luke from the ST Universe to be pulling one out of the Sky doesnt seem far fetched at all.

Originally posted by Darth Thor

Besides in DISNEY you have a pre-ESB Luke shaking a Star Destroyer without even realising what he did.


Lol, when?

Disney Luke is Dooku-level.

Originally posted by Lighter332
Lol, when?

In the Star Wars comics.

Originally posted by Darth Thor
In the Star Wars comics.

Post pics.

Galan? Do you have the pics somewhere?

I posted them on the previous page of this thread.

Luke's illusion feat in TLJ surpassed anything we've seen a force user do in any of the films.

Pretty sure Grandpa Sheev just put Old Man Luke to shame.

He's probably above Vader and definitely above RoS Kylo and Rey, anyone who says otherwise doesn't truly understand how much Luke was toying with Kylo in TLJ.

Originally posted by Galan007
I posted them on the previous page of this thread.


Ah yes, sorry that was lazy lol


Originally posted by Tzeentch
Luke's illusion feat in TLJ surpassed anything we've seen a force user do in any of the films.


Was a powerful display for sure. But he did it from a Force nexus and died doing it.

But the main problem is its impossible to quantify how powerful that makes him.

Originally posted by Tzeentch
Luke's illusion feat in TLJ surpassed anything we've seen a force user do in any of the films.

lol

Originally posted by Jmanghan
anyone who says otherwise doesn't truly understand how much Luke was toying with Kylo in TLJ.

And with Rey.

Originally posted by Darth Thor
Was a powerful display for sure. But he did it from a Force nexus and died doing it.

But the main problem is its impossible to quantify how powerful that makes him.

Tzee was probably just kidding.

It's a non-feat. Johnson trolled us all.

Huh? Luke projecting himself across the galaxy is a pretty cool feat. Honestly, I thought it was a really clever and it made Luke come across as a true Jedi master.

^ Yeah and it was consistent with the guy who threw is Lightsaber away in front of the Emperor.

Man I just saw the Luke cut scenes from Battlefront where hes helping that Imperial officer. And it makes me sad thinking of what we could/should have gotten and how he was presented to us in TLJ.

It's so weird that TLJ gives us that Luke scene which perfectly encapsulates the character and then it also gives us a "Luke" who contemplates killing his nephew because of a bad dream.

in star wars as a whole, luke has planetary illusions and can easily move billions of tons with the force.

Illusions are lame. It would have been fine if Luke was going to live through VIII, but killing him off like that was stupid. It was anticlimactic.

Originally posted by Psychotron
Illusions are lame. It would have been fine if Luke was going to live through VIII, but killing him off like that was stupid. It was anticlimactic.


Nah ares is right. That bit did right by the character. Issue was he needed Rey to find himself. And that he spent years sat around feeling sorry for himself whilst He knew full well his nephew and former pupil was sending the Galaxy to shit.

JJ retconned so much in this film, but he didnt retcon this main issue with TLJ.

Originally posted by ares834
Huh? Luke projecting himself across the galaxy is a pretty cool feat. Honestly, I thought it was a really clever and it made Luke come across as a true Jedi master.

Yeah, but... it only worked because Kylo is a moron and it got Luke killed.

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
Yeah, but... it only worked because Kylo is a moron and it got Luke killed.


Well better than him dying by having Kylo kill him directly. That would be BS. And lets face it, we knew this trilogy was going to send off the original 3 one way or another.

But imagine if Kylo actually had a brain and figured out it was a trick...

Originally posted by Darth Thor

JJ retconned so much in this film, but he didnt retcon this main issue with TLJ.

Rian Johnson was a red-herring - JJ Abrams was the Executive Producer for The Last Jedi.

JJ Abrams could have changed anything he wanted right then and there.

The fault for The Last Jedi lies with JJ Abrams.


Think of Rian Johnson as Snoke (puppet/decoy) and JJ Abrams as Palpatine.

^ Kind of insulting to Palpatine but okay..

Actually someone said to me that Kathleen Kennedy is Reys grandma which made me laugh.

Originally posted by ares834
Huh? Luke projecting himself across the galaxy is a pretty cool feat. Honestly, I thought it was a really clever and it made Luke come across as a true Jedi master. Now that more context has been provided about the feat, it impresses me a lot more. Luke pouring his own living force into the cosmic force in order to project his very essence(it was not just a simple illusion or w/e) across the galaxy and interact with Leia and Kylo like that really is pretty extraordinary.

So extraordinary, it killed him haw-som

Originally posted by Galan007
Now that more context has been provided about the feat, it impresses me a lot more. Luke pouring his own living force into the cosmic force in order to project his very essence(it was not just a simple illusion or w/e) across the galaxy and interact with Leia and Kylo like that really is pretty extraordinary. They could have given us a better fight though

I wonder if his essence could have held an actual
Lightsaber and fought Kylo. That would have been so bad ass, without Kylo looking like a dummy like Stilt points out.

Originally posted by Darth Thor
I wonder if his essence could have held an actual
Lightsaber and fought Kylo. That would have been so bad ass, without Kylo looking like a dummy like Stilt points out.

1) The Force Doppelganger was leaving no footprints.

2) Artillery blaster barrage passed right through it.

3) Even Kylo the Brainless realized it was intangible (though it took him ages and he had to poke it with his saber to make sure).

--
Even medieval spellcasters from worlds based on Dungeons&Dragons can cast harmful illusions.

Luke created a shitty one and died from the effort.

Disney Luke is the worst Jedi ever.

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
1) The Force Doppelganger was leaving no footprints.

2) Artillery blaster barrage passed right through it.

3) Even Kylo the Brainless realized it was intangible (though it took him ages and he had to poke it with his saber to make sure).

--
Even medieval spellcasters from worlds based on Dungeons&Dragons can cast harmful illusions.

Luke created a shitty one and died from the effort.

Disney Luke is the worst Jedi ever.


He was able to touch Leia though. And Kylo and Leia both held those dice from the Millennium Falcon before they disappeared.

Originally posted by Darth Thor
He was able to touch Leia though. And Kylo and Leia both held those dice from the Millennium Falcon before they disappeared.

Yes. Very limited interaction.

Battle-wise, it was a non-feat, unless your opponents are as easily duped as Ben the Half-wit.

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
Yes. Very limited interaction.

Battle-wise, it was a non-feat, unless your opponents are as easily duped as Ben the Half-wit.


Thats what im saying. WOULD HAVE been bad ass if they went that route, as physical interaction was already shown as possible.

Desann made two illusions of himself without needing to meditate on it

Stronger than ROTJ Palpatine if he ****ed up Snoke.

Originally posted by XSUPREMEXSKILLZ
Stronger than ROTJ Palpatine if he ****ed up Snoke.

Luke never ****ed up Snoke - Snoke is grown looking that way on purpose.

Originally posted by XSUPREMEXSKILLZ
Stronger than ROTJ Palpatine if he ****ed up Snoke.

As much as id love this to be true, it would all depend on what kind of Saber skills/training Snoke has. Which as far as we know is still nothing.


Originally posted by Lighter332
Luke never ****ed up Snoke - Snoke is grown looking that way on purpose.


And yes this is the other problem. With the films ignoring so much of the comics and novels, we really have to take the one Snoke = Palpatine statement from the one source book (posing as Lukes journal) with a grain of salt.

Originally posted by Darth Thor
He was able to touch Leia though. And Kylo and Leia both held those dice from the Millennium Falcon before they disappeared. His robes were also blowing in the wind.

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
Yes. Very limited interaction.

Battle-wise, it was a non-feat, unless your opponents are as easily duped as Ben the Half-wit. Luke's projection could almost certainly be sensed in the force as though Luke himself were actually there. So Kylo wouldn't have known any different until he made physical contact with it.

Originally posted by Darth Thor
And yes this is the other problem. With the films ignoring so much of the comics and novels, we really have to take the one Snoke = Palpatine statement from the one source book (posing as Lukes journal) with a grain of salt.

TROS makes it clear Snoke was nothing but an empty sock-puppet created and controlled by Palpatine.

Originally posted by Darth Thor
As much as id love this to be true, it would all depend on what kind of Saber skills/training Snoke has. Which as far as we know is still nothing. We don't know what the 'battle' between Luke and Snoke entailed.

But we do know that they definitely had a run-in, and it apparently didn't go in Snoke's favor:
https://i.imgur.com/TngzSjc.jpg

We also know that Snoke came to respect AND fear Luke:
https://i.imgur.com/JdqxVvB.jpg


So as of now, all signs point to Luke being more powerful than Snoke.

Originally posted by Darth Thor
we really have to take the one Snoke = Palpatine statement from the one source book (posing as Lukes journal) with a grain of salt. Luke would have obviously been using RotJ Palpatine as a measuring stick for Snoke's power here:
https://i.imgur.com/ts5q5Zy.jpg

And in Luke's opinion, Snoke ~ RotJ Palpatine.

Originally posted by Galan007
His robes were also blowing in the wind.

Luke's projection could almost certainly be sensed in the force as though Luke himself were actually there. So Kylo wouldn't have known any different until he made physical contact with it.

Or maybe Kylo's Force Senses suck

Originally posted by Galan007
We don't know what the 'battle' between Luke and Snoke entailed.

But we do know that they definitely had a run-in, and it apparently didn't go in Snoke's favor:
https://i.imgur.com/TngzSjc.jpg

We also know that Snoke came to respect AND fear Luke:
https://i.imgur.com/JdqxVvB.jpg


So as of now, all signs point to Luke being more powerful than Snoke.

Luke would have obviously been using RotJ Palpatine as a measuring stick for Snoke's power here:
https://i.imgur.com/ts5q5Zy.jpg

And in Luke's opinion, Snoke ~ RotJ Palpatine.

TROS pretty much retcons all of that - now it is revealed that Snoke was nothing more than a sock-puppet used by Palpatine.

Batches of Snokes are grown like chia-pets by Palpatine in a cloning-Vat.

Palpatine had so many Snokes, he could hand them out as gifts to his guests at parties.

^ Where does Disney canon back that idea of Luke > Vader in ROTJ?


Originally posted by Galan007

We also know that Snoke came to respect AND fear Luke:
https://i.imgur.com/JdqxVvB.jpg


So as of now, all signs point to Luke being more powerful than Snoke.




Well Snoke doesnt quite admit being his inferior there. He seems to think a dark side Luke would take Kylos place at Snokes side.

That said im sure its been mentioned somewhere that Snoke is using Kylo to destroy Luke, implying he cant do it.

Originally posted by Galan007
Luke would have obviously been using RotJ Palpatine as a measuring stick for Snoke's power here:
https://i.imgur.com/ts5q5Zy.jpg

And in Luke's opinion, Snoke ~ RotJ Palpatine.


Well in the Force. We still have no idea how good Snoke is in Sabers.

The fact that Snoke wasn't even fit to become Sidious's apprentice is telling. Honestly, as of now, he is sub-Maul.

Originally posted by ares834
The fact that Snoke wasn't even fit to become Sidious's apprentice is telling. Honestly, as of now, he is sub-Maul.


Does Disney Sidious even want/need an apprentice though?

Cant quite recall what his plans for Kylo were.

According to the VD, Snoke was testing and grooming him too become a Sith. He was designed to act as Kylo's "final crucible". Kek what a cuck.

Originally posted by Lighter332
TROS pretty much retcons all of that - now it is revealed that Snoke was nothing more than a sock-puppet used by Palpatine.

Batches of Snokes are grown like chia-pets by Palpatine in a cloning-Vat.

Palpatine had so many Snokes, he could hand them out as gifts to his guests at parties.

Good point. I forgot about the tank full of Snoke clones.

Originally posted by Darth Thor
Well in the Force. We still have no idea how good Snoke is in Sabers. Oh Snoke would most likely be garbage in sabers. He's still a borderline cripple, after all.

I'm just talking about his power with the force.

Originally posted by Darth Thor
Does Disney Sidious even want/need an apprentice though? Nope. The 'one Sith' concept seemed to be in full effect in this film.

There's no reason for Palpatine to have a proper apprentice, when he already held the power of every Sith in history. All he was essentially looking for was a new vessel to transfer his essence/power into(until he stumbled upon the 'dyad-powa!!!' that could restore him, of course).

Originally posted by Galan007
Oh Snoke would most likely be garbage in sabers. He's still a borderline cripple, after all.

I'm just talking about his power with the force.





Oh I forgot it was confirmed somewhere that his guards were there for his protection Because hes a Cripple.

Meh hes useless. I still think even TLJ Kylo could have taken him in a fair 1 v 1 confrontation. So its little surprise Luke screws him up.

Originally posted by Darth Thor
Nah ares is right. That bit did right by the character.

No, that was completely wrong. Luke should have raised his X-Wing and gone there in person. Luke is the guy who confronted Darth Vader and the Emperor without fear. Imagine if Luke sent an illusion to Vader and Sidious in ROTJ. IT would have been terrible from a movie making perspective. Completely weightless and anticlimactic. And Luke is not some pacifist. He slaughtered Jabba's men when they refused to let Han go.

The original plan for IX when Colin Trevorrow was still attached to it was that Luke was going to train Rey and fight Snoke himself, while Rey and Ben deal some Sith Sorceress. Clearly the illusion in TLJ wasn't supposed to kill him in the first versions of the script. That's just one more thing Rian ruined.

Originally posted by Psychotron
No, that was completely wrong. Luke should have raised his X-Wing and gone there in person. Luke is the guy who confronted Darth Vader and the Emperor without fear. Imagine if Luke sent an illusion to Vader and Sidious in ROTJ. IT would have been terrible from a movie making perspective. Completely weightless and anticlimactic. And Luke is not some pacifist. He slaughtered Jabba's men when they refused to let Han go.




He took out Jabbas men after asking him multiple times to give up Han and even then was offering to compensate for him, after which Jabba responded with throwing Luke in with Rancor and feeding Han and Luke to the Sarlaac.

He literally gave Jabba one last chance before he was about to attempt to feed Luke to the Sarlaac.

He didnt slaughter the Ewoks when they were captured by them. He trusted in the Force to present itself with a peaceful solution. Heck even when he went to confront Vader and Palpatine in person he did not go there to fight. They wanted him to fight.

And in the end he throws his Lightsaber away leaving himself defenceless in front of the Emperor himself.

So no of course he wasnt a complete pacifist. He is willing to fight, but Yoda taught him a Jedi uses the Force for knowledge and defence, never for attack.

So aiding the Resistance to escape and survive without having to kill anyone (including his own nephew), was in line with a Jedi Master incarnation of the Luke we saw in ROTJ.

All his scenes and story build up before that part however was total BS. Also him dying probably should have been better justified. And yeah we should have at least got a flash back of Luke confronting Snoke and messing him up.

While I loved the whole illusions scene itself, Luke shouldn't have died. That was horrible and ruined the otherwise cool sequence. There was that great fakeout with his "death" with the reveal that he isn't actually there but then he dies anyway. It's awful. "Luke's dead! No he's alive! No he's actually dead!" Dreadful. Just constant flipflopping. It also prevented Luke from getting any real redemption in the series and from us getting to see him actually fight. **** Rian.

Cool as the projection feat was, if Luke had to die in TLJ no matter what, then I would have preferred him to have been present on Crait(in the flesh) for that encounter... Everything Luke did would have been SO much more impressive if he would've *actually* been there, and would have showcased the true "Jedi Master" that we were all hoping to see.

The projection thing would've been an excellent choice if they were going to have Luke survive into RoS... But instead Rian gave us the shittiest version of each scenario.

Originally posted by Darth Thor
He took out Jabbas men after asking him multiple times to give up Han and even then was offering to compensate for him, after which Jabba responded with throwing Luke in with Rancor and feeding Han and Luke to the Sarlaac.

He literally gave Jabba one last chance before he was about to attempt to feed Luke to the Sarlaac.

He didnt slaughter the Ewoks when they were captured by them. He trusted in the Force to present itself with a peaceful solution. Heck even when he went to confront Vader and Palpatine in person he did not go there to fight. They wanted him to fight.

And in the end he throws his Lightsaber away leaving himself defenceless in front of the Emperor himself.

So no of course he wasnt a complete pacifist. He is willing to fight, but Yoda taught him a Jedi uses the Force for knowledge and defence, never for attack.

So aiding the Resistance to escape and survive without having to kill anyone (including his own nephew), was in line with a Jedi Master incarnation of the Luke we saw in ROTJ.

All his scenes and story build up before that part however was total BS. Also him dying probably should have been better justified. And yeah we should have at least got a flash back of Luke confronting Snoke and messing him up.

https://media.giphy.com/media/b9aScKLxdv0Y0/giphy.gif

Originally posted by Darth Thor
He took out Jabbas men after asking him multiple times to give up Han and even then was offering to compensate for him, after which Jabba responded with throwing Luke in with Rancor and feeding Han and Luke to the Sarlaac.

He literally gave Jabba one last chance before he was about to attempt to feed Luke to the Sarlaac.

He didnt slaughter the Ewoks when they were captured by them. He trusted in the Force to present itself with a peaceful solution. Heck even when he went to confront Vader and Palpatine in person he did not go there to fight. They wanted him to fight.

And in the end he throws his Lightsaber away leaving himself defenceless in front of the Emperor himself.

So no of course he wasnt a complete pacifist. He is willing to fight, but Yoda taught him a Jedi uses the Force for knowledge and defence, never for attack.

So aiding the Resistance to escape and survive without having to kill anyone (including his own nephew), was in line with a Jedi Master incarnation of the Luke we saw in ROTJ.

All his scenes and story build up before that part however was total BS. Also him dying probably should have been better justified. And yeah we should have at least got a flash back of Luke confronting Snoke and messing him up.

Luke's a Jedi, of course he tried to be diplomatic first, but when the chips are down he's not afraid to pull out his lightsaber and start swinging. He's a Jedi KNIGHT after all.

Luke's act of throwing away his lightsaber is symbolic, and you know that being a big SW fan. It was about rejecting hate and the dark side, not rejecting combat as a whole. The Emperor is still defeated with violence, but from Vader instead. The Jedi are willing to kill when they have to as long as they do so with a clear mind.

Yoda's speech rings kind of hollow considering he and Obi-Wan wanted Luke to kill Vader and Sidious. In fact, they both tried to assassinate them in ROTS.

Except they would have died anyway if Rey wasn't there to lift those rocks. Also, I have repeat myself here but if they wanted to kill off Luke it should have been in person. From a purely cinematic perspective it has far more weight. It could have cemented Kylo as a real villain, instead he looked like a joke (again).

I still think that a simple illusion killing him made Luke look really weak. In comparison you have Snoke, just some Palpatine puppet, nuking Luke's temple with the Force from light years away without breaking a sweat.

Originally posted by Psychotron
Luke's a Jedi, of course he tried to be diplomatic first, but when the chips are down he's not afraid to pull out his lightsaber and start swinging. He's a Jedi KNIGHT after all.

Luke's act of throwing away his lightsaber is symbolic, and you know that being a big SW fan. It was about rejecting hate and the dark side, not rejecting combat as a whole. The Emperor is still defeated with violence, but from Vader instead. The Jedi are willing to kill when they have to as long as they do so with a clear mind.

Yoda's speech rings kind of hollow considering he and Obi-Wan wanted Luke to kill Vader and Sidious. In fact, they both tried to assassinate them in ROTS.

Except they would have died anyway if Rey wasn't there to lift those rocks. Also, I have repeat myself here but if they wanted to kill off Luke it should have been in person. From a purely cinematic perspective it has far more weight. It could have cemented Kylo as a real villain, instead he looked like a joke (again).

I still think that a simple illusion killing him made Luke look really weak. In comparison you have Snoke, just some Palpatine puppet, nuking Luke's temple with the Force from light years away without breaking a sweat.


Im not claiming hes a complete pacifist. Just that in character thats his preference so it was fitting for the character to display that kind of a feat and subverting expectations.

Yoda and Obi-Wan seemed to have changed their philosophy a lot post ROTS. Youre right they went on an assassination mission, and the Jedi were soldiers during the Clone Wars.

But we see their change in what Yoda teaches Luke and in how Ben Kenobi deals with Maul. Its that change in philosophy that makes him so attuned to the light side and hence so much > Maul by this point.

And Luke possibly takes their teachings to him even further, as despite their change and teachings they expect him to kill Vader, which he refuses to do. And this was before Vader/Palpatine were triggering and tempting him into embracing the dark side. Point was he defeated the Sith without killing anyone. And it was never in his plan to kill Vader. (Although he was happy to distract both Sith whilst the Rebellion blow them all away).

I agree Lukes death wasnt justified the way they did it. And I have also stated we should have at least got a flash back of Luke messing up Snoke. And yeah lets not pretend TLJ Luke was consistent as a pacifist either given how he contemplates murdering his nephew in his sleep.

Just saying, the way he stopped the First Order wiping out the Resistance was actually very Luke. The rest of the film was not.

I have no idea how Luke expected the Resistance to flee, or why he didnt tell Leia what he was doing. TLJ isnt a good movie Lmao

We dont know for sure it was Snoke who shot the lightning in that comic, so wait for confirmation. But it does seem from the comics that it was indeed Luke who f***ed Snoke up.

We also know from the comics that even a pre-ESB Luke has so much raw power that he can shake a Star Destroyer without even realising it.

Originally posted by Galan007
In the comics we see that Luke eventually finds Jocasta Nu's makeshift 'school' and trove of Holocrons:
https://i.imgur.com/Ch9B5YU.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/ihWmjjP.jpg Are we even 100% sure that's Luke though? Its not like it was said to be him in the issue.

Originally posted by Sheev
Are we even 100% sure that's Luke though? I don't know who else you think it would be, but yes, I'm positive that it is Luke:
https://i.imgur.com/Y0C5sra.jpg
*last sentence.

Ahh cool thx.

Not that we really needed anymore confirmation that it was Luke who found found Jocasta Nu's school, but I thought I may as well include this:
https://i.ibb.co/ckKg9jD/Star-Wars-The-Rise-Of-Kylo-Ren-c002-NA-p011-dig-Marvel-a-Kraa-HQ.jpg
Luke: "This might be even better than Jocasta Nu's cache..."



And Soule confirms:
https://i.imgur.com/yN85gVE.jpg

Can't believe posters here forced you to prove something so obvious.

I know the art wasn't the best in Vader V2, but I never questioned whether or not it was Luke. Seemed clear as day right off the bat.

We have little evidence that indicates Luke is the all-powerful Jedi he was supposed to become after RotJ. The illusion feat he pulled off in TLJ is very impressive, but that's about it. We don't see him do much else, and that's not enough.

Logic, however, suggests he was one of--if not the--most powerful Jedi to ever live, based on his potential and the incredible amount of knowledge he had managed to gather by TLJ.

Originally posted by Petrus
the incredible amount of knowledge

fEIrL2kHHcc

lol.

I used to think the implication in TLJ was that Luke had not read the ancient texts.

He definitely did though. He learned the projection technique from one of the texts, for example.

Originally posted by Galan007
I used to think the implication in TLJ was that Luke had not read the ancient texts.

He definitely did though. He learned the projection technique from one of the texts, for example.


That was definitely the implication. But as usual the Canon EU does its best to justify and improve upon the ST.

So this technique-

https://i.postimg.cc/qMsfWHpc/1.jpg
https://i.postimg.cc/Mp5CK0Mv/2.jpg



Was Luke actually peering into Kylo's future there??

He was just sensing what was on his mind.

Originally posted by Eli Vanto
So this technique-

https://i.postimg.cc/qMsfWHpc/1.jpg
https://i.postimg.cc/Mp5CK0Mv/2.jpg



Was Luke actually peering into Kylo's future there?? From the film:


From the novel:


Luke read his mind/emotions, and 'worst-case-deduced' what Ben would become based on what he sensed at the time.


tl;dr
Rian is a ****ing idiot.

so is that a new ability also??

No.

The only 'new' force powers in the ST films that I can recall off hand are: Kylo using force stasis to freeze the blaster bolt, Luke's force projection, Snoke's mind bridging, force ghost Yoda conjuring lightning, Rey and Kylo's dyad shenanigans, and Palpatine's fleet-busting lightning.

Cool thx


On an unrelated note-- if Yoda's ghost had been communicating with Luke all those years, I wonder if he ever told him about the World Between Worlds??

Or also if Anakin's ghost had ever told him about The Ones of Mortis??

TWBW was mentioned in the ancient texts that Luke read, so it's possible that he may have asked Yoda about it.

...Or simply learned about it from said texts. /shrug