Click HERE to see this thread with all of the graphics, features, and links.

who wins

If there aren't any restrictions placed on the Surfer, what would stop him from genetically removing their powers?

Originally posted by Stoic
If there aren't any restrictions placed on the Surfer, what would stop him from genetically removing their powers?

Gotham and Gotham Girl both just punching him?

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Gotham and Gotham Girl both just punching him?

https://thumbs.gfycat.com/CheerfulElegantAmericanavocet-max-1mb.gif

Well.... I agree, Surfer and Thor are both much more versatile, and of they can get their attacks off, and they are the right attacks, then they would win. The debate is around whether they can, and would, choose the right attack and enact it.

But am amused that in this thread Surfer is rewriting DNA, whilst in another thread, against Hulk, they'll just fire generic energy blasts and punch....

This can be said about any of the Justice League as well (or anyone) When does anyone use all of their powers when they are fighting anyone on the Justice League? Did Orion use all of his abilities when he fought Superman? Did Martian Manhunter use all of his abilities when he fought Wonder Woman? It's not just the Hulk buddy. This applies to comics, period.

I understand - but when I brought it up against WBH (a guy Thor and Surfer actually know and have fought before), Stoic argued that they would rely on their fists and energy blasts:

Originally posted by Stoic
All of these tactics are bullshit. Thor would dive in and get owned. The Surfer would feel as if he were a part of the big bang as a thunder clap all but erases him. They wouldn't immediately go for tactics that they rarely use. They'd stick the usual blast or punch out routine and they'd die.

So am mystified as to why suddenly Surfer is rewriting DNA....

Yet would fight and blast Hulk truly no hypocrisy there lol

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
I understand - but when I brought it up against WBH (a guy Thor and Surfer actually know and have fought before), Stoic argued that they would rely on their fists and energy blasts:



So am mystified as to why suddenly Surfer is rewriting DNA....

Manipulating his energy is what was argued. You remember right? I honestly didn't even think about him turning WB Hulk's powers off, which would actually work if he were allowed to get that close. However, as we all know, WB Hulk didn't need flight or speed because he had the power to turn the Herald tier to dust from over a world away.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Yet would fight and blast Hulk truly no hypocrisy there lol

Stop throwing eggs dude.

Originally posted by Stoic
Manipulating his energy is what was argued. You remember right? I honestly didn't even think about him turning WB Hulk's powers off, which would actually work if he were allowed to get that close. However, as we all know, WB Hulk didn't need flight or speed because he had the power to turn the Herald tier to dust from over a world away.

But that was not your argument, you remember that right?

Your point was that they wouldn't immediately go to tactics they rarely use (your words).

Yet here, he's busting out DNA rewriting like it's the latest fashion.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
But that was not your argument, you remember that right?

Your point was that they wouldn't immediately go to tactics they rarely use (your words).

Yet here, he's busting out DNA rewriting like it's the latest fashion.

The Surfer has used this tactic several times though. He pulled a similar stunt with Savage Hulk, and in most run-ins that they have he leeches power from him adding it to his own, but this requires time that he wouldn't have with that version of the Hulk. Not to mention that WB Hulk was pretty intelligent, not quite as intelligent as he is in human form but smart enough to end the Surfer the moment the fight began.

So in retrospect, something as harmless as turning the Gotham duo's powers off would play right into Norrin's character, while it would be WB Hulk's choice to allow him enough time to pull the stunt off. These two are nowhere near as powerful as WB Hulk was.

I'm now confused what your point is.

Would he or wouldn't he start a fight with WBH by attempting to drain?

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
I'm now confused what your point is.

Would he or wouldn't he start a fight with WBH by attempting to drain?

He could try whatever he wanted, but draining WB Hulk wouldn't work as that version knew how to actively tap into and control the amount of power needed. This was something that no other version was able to do. Red Hulk tried and failed and he drained the Surfer, as did Arm'Cheddon, and he also drained the Surfer. So yes, the Surfer would've made the attempt but he would've failed. This is something that the Gotham duo would not have the luxury of leaning on. Are you still confused?

Originally posted by Stoic
He could try whatever he wanted, but draining WB Hulk wouldn't work as that version knew how to actively tap into and control the amount of power needed. This was something that no other version was able to do. Red Hulk tried and failed and he drained the Surfer, as did Arm'Cheddon, and he also drained the Surfer. So yes, the Surfer would've made the attempt but he would've failed. This is something that the Gotham duo would not have the luxury of leaning on. Are you still confused?

Cool.

So you've backtracked and agree that no, he wouldn't just be blasting and punching.

Thanks.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Cool.

So you've backtracked and agree that no, he wouldn't just be blasting and punching.

Thanks.

No I didn't. Thor and the Surfer simply wouldn't have enough time to do anything at all.

Surfer is too much. Especially based off of his latest showing.

Surfer being a Pacifist isn't a good argument. I'm leaning towards the team DC though....Thor isn't much help

Originally posted by Stoic
No I didn't. Thor and the Surfer simply wouldn't have enough time to do anything at all.

Fair enough.

In THIS thread, we have two combatants who have speedblitzed Flash.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Fair enough.

In THIS thread, we have two combatants who have speedblitzed Flash.

And we have one that has Cosmic Awareness, and can move thousands of times FTL speed which the Flash wasn't moving at when blitzed. Not to mention that the Flash, Superman, Surfer, Quick Silver and every other speed demon in comics has been hit by characters far slower than they are.

Didnt even know who these two were until I read up on them and their feats just now, if they get the jump on Thor and Surfer then they win, if not........still sounds like one epic battle.

Originally posted by Stoic
And we have one that has Cosmic Awareness, and can move thousands of times FTL speed which the Flash wasn't moving at when blitzed. Not to mention that the Flash, Superman, Surfer, Quick Silver and every other speed demon in comics has been hit by characters far slower than they are.

Yet apparently WBH can get THUNDERCLAPS off faster than he can react.....

Slower characters hitting faster characters are PIS.

Iow everyone has to fight at his worst for Hulk to have a chance- I can agree with that notion finely explained by friend Stoic.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Yet apparently WBH can get THUNDERCLAPS off faster than he can react.....

Slower characters hitting faster characters are PIS.

The Surfer flies fast like Hal, he doesn't throw punches or move his limbs fast like Superman, So, sure he'd be able to begin the gene, or energy manipulation, he just wouldn't have the time to complete the transaction before getting defeated. We also have to take into consideration that the Gotham duo aren't as powerful as that version of the Hulk. Judging by power set and feats, the Gotham duo aren't one shot beating Thor and the Surfer.

Originally posted by Adam Grimes
Iow everyone has to fight at his worst for Hulk to have a chance- I can agree with that notion finely explained by friend Stoic.

This wasn't just any ordinary Hulk though. He wasn't a herald level threat. His intestines took a full hit from a being capable of hitting with the force of Hercules if he was 133.5 times stronger, and he was in a relatively calm state according to canon. While holding back he beat Wendigo and Bi-Beast that were amped 1000X their base. Using him as a basis to compare how things would turn out in this case is faulty logic. He could literally KO Thor and the Surfer while significantly holding back.

Can the Gotham duo win here? Sure they can. I just don't think they'd win if both teams are fighting to the best of their abilities.

Ugghh.. Hate the Gotham duo.
The JL were jobbed hard against Gotham.
Id like to think they were taking it easy on him.