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I don't recall anything in canon saying that Yoda was diminished in RotS at all.

I never like it when they have Jedi growing weaker with age. Yoda explains fairly clearly in ESB that if you have the force, most other factors become neglible.

But, yeah, I do remember that the "Path of the Jedi" book had a little passage about Yoda having been able to lift 6 of the 7 Muntuur Stones before he was 700, but then only 5 afterwards.

yeah, I thnk I remember that passage too Zentrex. Prime Yoda may be = Rots Sidious

Possibly.

It's hard to compare since most of Yoda's feats come from before RotS and most of Palpatine's after. Palpatine at this point had created Anakin and clouded the Jedi's powers. Not much in the way of crazy TK feats.

Then again, it seemed like Yoda opted to leave the fight because he knew he wouldn't be able to keep up if he kept fighting. So maybe it was his lack of stamina getting in the way? If he'd been younger, it very well could have been a fight between complete equals.

I mean, Yoda disarmed Palpatine in sabers, and countered pretty much everything else Palpatine threw at him(both literally and figuratively.)

My take is that as of RotS, Yoda > Palpatine in sabers, and ~ in the Force.

Originally posted by Galan007
I mean, Yoda disarmed Palpatine in sabers, and countered pretty much everything else Palpatine threw at him(both literally and figuratively.)

My take is that as of RotS, Yoda > Palpatine in sabers, and ~ in the Force.


Going by the script, yeah that seems to be the case. The novelisation however had it more in Palpatines favour. But the film doesnt really support that tbh.

I meant ROtJ Sid, not Rots, sorry

Originally posted by Zentrex
I never like it when they have Jedi growing weaker with age. Yoda explains fairly clearly in ESB that if you have the force, most other factors become neglible.

But, yeah, I do remember that the "Path of the Jedi" book had a little passage about Yoda having been able to lift 6 of the 7 Muntuur Stones before he was 700, but then only 5 afterwards.

Any other instances of force wielders lifting Muntuur stones for comparison?

Also prime Yoda would be during the high republic potentially? Or maybe it'll be pre-prime

Originally posted by hutchy1345
Any other instances of force wielders lifting Muntuur stones for comparison? We know very little about the Stones.

In Fragments from the Rim (1993), it was stated that Ferleen Snee had lifted all 7 stones, though it is also noted that the feat had never been verified:
https://i.imgur.com/LmyrKBL.jpg

However, the SW Encyclopedia (2008) confirmed that Master Snee had indeed lifted all the stones:
https://i.imgur.com/nciAqBb.jpg

A Manual for Students of the Force (2010) only had the number of stones at 6, and states that Fae Coven(the Grand Master who wrote this book from an in-universe POV) was able to lift all of them:
https://i.imgur.com/iUGhAXe.jpg

*Yoda notes that after he reached 700 years old, he could only lift 5 of the stones(implying that he had been able to lift all 6 before that)... But Yoda's power in the Force diminishing due to age never made much sense to me -- especially factoring in his feats from the microseries, where he's throwing Separatist warships around like they're made of cardboard. So personally, I don't put much stock into that... Unless the heaviest of the stones were made of dwarf star material or some shit. /shrug

Originally posted by hutchy1345
Also prime Yoda would be during the high republic potentially? Or maybe it'll be pre-prime That may or may not have been the case for Yoda in Legends(depending on your interpretation of the above quote.) Only time will tell how canon depicts his younger years.

Originally posted by Galan007
My take is that as of RotS, Yoda > Palpatine in sabers, and ~ in the Force.

people always say Yoda > Palpatine in sabers but forget a crucial point and that is the terrain where the battle was fought favoured Yoda; they fought on that little podium where Sidious was planted and Yoda was moving all around him; advantage Yoda. Now, later on the advantage clearly became Sidious' when it came time to switch to the Force but for those who claim Sidious was outclassed, especially taking the Maul/Savage fight into account. Had this fight taken place in say, the Geonosian Arena then I think the saber battle between Sidious and Yoda would be a much different encounter

Originally posted by relentless1
people always say Yoda > Palpatine in sabers but forget a crucial point and that is the terrain where the battle was fought favoured Yoda; they fought on that little podium where Sidious was planted and Yoda was moving all around him; advantage Yoda. Now, later on the advantage clearly became Sidious' when it came time to switch to the Force but for those who claim Sidious was outclassed, especially taking the Maul/Savage fight into account. Had this fight taken place in say, the Geonosian Arena then I think the saber battle between Sidious and Yoda would be a much different encounter


You forget, the Saber battle began on neutral ground. It was Palpatines own choice to move it to the podium. He clearly didnt feel it was going to go well for him on neutral ground.

Originally posted by Galan007
I mean, Yoda disarmed Palpatine in sabers, and countered pretty much everything else Palpatine threw at him (both literally and figuratively).
He left the fight, though. He probably figured that he couldn't keep it up. Maybe he could attack and defend just as well/better than Palpatine, but not for extended periods of time?

AND, for whatever it's worth, when Palpatine was launching the senate pods at Yoda, he still "countered" them, but not with an equally impressive telekinetic feat.


Wouldn't Palpatine have been more cautious of Yoda, then? And wouldn't Yoda have won?
In the movie, it looked (at least to me) like Yoda only kept up with Palpatine's TK/FL through second winds from his determination to save the jedi. But in spite of those second winds, still couldn't maintain the taxing performance.

In Sabers, the movie version only proves that Yoda = Palpatine.
It was filmed with the idea that in saber fights, when you get to a certain level (essentially perfect efficiency in your movements), improvment becomes impossible, and therefore the outcome of the fight is based on outside factors.
Now while I don't believe that Yoda had an inherent advantage (as Relentless1 argued), it's fairly obvious that what happened when they were dueling was environemental.

@Total Warrior:

In Canon, probably not.
In Legends, definitely not.

Sidious was already "stronger than the jedi" at the time of the Prequel Trilogy. He started as an "event horizon in the dark side," and then further delved into it more completely over the next 20 years.
I don't think going from lifting 5 stones to 6 measures up.

Now I do believe most authors assumed that PT Yoda is in his prime, but even going by the idea that he was stronger at some point, he wouldn't approach the Lusankya-lifting, Byss-draining, Battle-minding the entire imperial fleet at the Battle of Endor, accidentally Vader-killing Palpatine.

You might be right in canon, but here's all we have so far:
-Yoda lifting a mountain pre-PT (but you can chalk that up to the mountain being made from bluestone)
-Palpatine winning against Yoda in TCW
-Palpatine invading the World Between Worlds, while Yoda could only access a hint of it.

Originally posted by Darth Thor
You forget, the Saber battle began on neutral ground. It was Palpatines own choice to move it to the podium. He clearly didnt feel it was going to go well for him on neutral ground.

we don't actually see what got them on the podium to begin with so that's pure speculation