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Which team of assassins wins?

Team Shiva

Talia Al Ghul
https://i.imgur.com/4HaVBcX.jpg

Shiva
https://i.imgur.com/VDb7gN2.jpg

Shado
https://i.imgur.com/Qa5zxlX.jpg


Vs

Team Elektra

Elektra
https://i.imgur.com/Kq5WhFo.jpg

Echo
https://i.imgur.com/hkEhRPL.jpg


Lady Bullseye
https://i.imgur.com/BFj4XOE.jpg

I mean its obvious Shiva would solo

Originally posted by RadZoa
I mean its obvious Shiva would solo

Shiva has better statements, Elektra has better feats. Elektra also has a better team here.

Better than soloing the Batfamily?

Originally posted by Senor Cage
Better than soloing the Batfamily?

That overstating it by a lot. By the end of the recent League of Shadows arc in detective comics (which I believe you are referencing), Cass was stalemating Shiva by herself for much of the fight. Which certainly is still elite, but also not someone who is portrayed as unbeatable on the forums.

Also all of her history should also be taken into account. Some members of the batfamily have also beaten her one on one. Jason Todd, Huntress (silly but happen), and of course Bruce and Cassandra.

Then you have showings like against fake Prometheus who 1-shotted her or Stryx who broke her arm and held her own despite going through a gauntlet of warriors right before their fight.

So while Lady Shiva is an elite fighter her reputation on the forums of being unbeatable and soloing everyone else doesn't hold up under scrutiny. Especially when Elektra has the stats and feats plus her rare ninja mental tricks to give her an edge in a close contest like this.

Stryx even said she felt lucky. But Shiva also owned Batman, which is above anything Elektra has done, IMO.

I wouldn't put that above Elektra owning Wolverine. Stryx was struggling to even stand before fighting Shiva.

Originally posted by Supermutant
I wouldn't put that above Elektra owning Wolverine. Stryx was struggling to even stand before fighting Shiva.

I'd put batman above Logan in the skill department.

But those were Stryx words.

Batman being more or less skilled than Wolverine isn't the debate here. This isn't just about skills, everything goes into who is more formidable. Elektra owned wolvie who has enhances stats, senses, healing factor, nigh unbreakable skeleton and claws, etc. Shiva owned Bats who may have used a couple of batarangs and the rest was h2h.

So I still don't see how owning Bats would be better than owning Wolvie here.

Still waiting on the scans or evidence on how Shiva stomps Elektra. Elektra feats will match Shiva or exceed in speed, strength, basically ever stat or category.

Shiva owned the batfamily and secret six. Those two feats exceed Elektras, imo. Enhanced stats? Batman is considered a meta, who stalemated Karate Kid (3boot). Shiva owned Azrael, who is considered a meta. Having enhanced stats doesnt guarantee a win, skill does. Shiva outclasses Elektra in skill.

Elektra might have a better team, though.

Originally posted by Senor Cage
Shiva owned the batfamily and secret six. Those two feats exceed Elektras, imo.

lol Why? Just because you need it too. I already stated how members of the bat-family and Strix have done much better against Shiva one on one. In one of my previous post I mentioned Huntress instead of Tim Drake. Even though Huntress did much better against Shiva than she should have, it was Tim Drake with a whistling staff that actually beat her in a sparring match. And we know how dangerous a Shiva sparring match is.

Plus much of that secret six was unknown or rebooted characters drastically different than before. Mostly no names.

Anyways Elektra has beaten the Serpent Squad. And the assassins guild both groups equal or better than that secert 6. She also had to protect two others while fighting off assassins guild members, Whiplash, Tiger Shark, Blizzard, Shocker & Boomerang, Jack O Lantern & Blackout, Crossbones, Whirlwind.

https://imgur.com/C2JIiFh

Originally posted by Senor Cage
Enhanced stats? Batman is considered a meta, who stalemated Karate Kid (3boot). Shiva owned Azrael, who is considered a meta. Having enhanced stats doesnt guarantee a win, skill does. Shiva outclasses Elektra in skill

Elektra might have a better team, though.

That's the thing though, Elektra has the stats, and the skills. She also got the mystical ninja powers she can use in a pinch. Got any scans of Shiva owning Azrael. I think they had an encounter but I would like to see it.
But yeah I'm still asking for feats from Lady Shiva that makes her better than what Elektra has done. You state Shiva outclasses Elektra in skill, I'm waiting on the proof.

I've heard a lot about how Lady Shiva would stomp throughout the years, yet all I really see are platitudes. And an uncomfortable amount of less than stellar showings based on her limited appearances.

But not more skilled than Shiva. She'd use that to her advantage. All in all, she has better feats.

I haven't seen these better feats. Still waiting.

I've given you feats, so I guess we'll have to agree to disagree.

Originally posted by Supermutant
That overstating it by a lot. By the end of the recent League of Shadows arc in detective comics (which I believe you are referencing), Cass was stalemating Shiva by herself for much of the fight. Which certainly is still elite, but also not someone who is portrayed as unbeatable on the forums.

Also all of her history should also be taken into account. Some members of the batfamily have also beaten her one on one. Jason Todd, Huntress (silly but happen), and of course Bruce and Cassandra.

Then you have showings like against fake Prometheus who 1-shotted her or Stryx who broke her arm and held her own despite going through a gauntlet of warriors right before their fight.

So while Lady Shiva is an elite fighter her reputation on the forums of being unbeatable and soloing everyone else doesn't hold up under scrutiny. Especially when Elektra has the stats and feats plus her rare ninja mental tricks to give her an edge in a close contest like this.



You kidding? Cassandra Cains is severely underrated on KMC. Jakethebank used to say Cap would beat her easy, and much as I like him, that's an insane statement. Even if one felt Cap beats Cass.


She's a character who ducked and weaved around bullets like a scene out of The Matrix. She left an actual speed trail behind her blitzing thugs in an annual. Broke a giant arsed hole in the side of a prison wall one time, like ten or fifteen times the size of the man she was "rescuing".


My point is, saying Shiva only fought evenly with this beast is no lowball.

Originally posted by cdtm
You kidding? Cassandra Cains is severely underrated on KMC. Jakethebank used to say Cap would beat her easy, and much as I like him, that's an insane statement. Even if one felt Cap beats Cass.


She's a character who ducked and weaved around bullets like a scene out of The Matrix. She left an actual speed trail behind her blitzing thugs in an annual. Broke a giant arsed hole in the side of a prison wall one time, like ten or fifteen times the size of the man she was "rescuing".


My point is, saying Shiva only fought evenly with this beast is no lowball.

This is what happen when you don't read bsdm. I stated that Lady Shiva is treated as unbeatable and stomping everyone, which a poster in this very thread wrote. Elektra alone is very capable of beating her and at the very least it would be a good fight. Also she has better feats.

If you believed that I was lowballing Shiva by stating that Cass was able to stalemate her and really get the better of her at the end of the recent arc, then read again. Cage was stating that Shiva had taken on the batfamily. I basically reminded him that Shiva performed much better in the beginning of that arc than in the end when Cass alone was a match for her.

Anyway Elektra has cut in two a bullet fired from Black Widow at near range.

https://imgur.com/a/pGb6did

And kicked down a brick wall, not that I find that really impressive but you mentioned kicking a wall so.

https://imgur.com/a/Q6sChpb

Originally posted by Senor Cage
I've given you feats, so I guess we'll have to agree to disagree.

That's it, very underwhelming. Those feats have already been match with Wolverine, the Serpent Society, and the assassin guild.

So apparently there are no feats that put Shiva above Elektra. They are on the same level with Elektra having more feats and the extra mystic ninja stuff she can use in a jam.

Originally posted by Supermutant
This is what happen when you don't read bsdm. I stated that Lady Shiva is treated as unbeatable and stomping everyone, which a poster in this very thread wrote. Elektra alone is very capable of beating her and at the very least it would be a good fight. Also she has better feats.

If you believed that I was lowballing Shiva by stating that Cass was able to stalemate her and really get the better of her at the end of the recent arc, then read again. Cage was stating that Shiva had taken on the batfamily. I basically reminded him that Shiva performed much better in the beginning of that arc than in the end when Cass alone was a match for her.

Anyway Elektra has cut in two a bullet fired from Black Widow at near range.

https://imgur.com/a/pGb6did

And kicked down a brick wall, not that I find that really impressive but you mentioned kicking a wall so.

https://imgur.com/a/Q6sChpb


And my point is Cassandra Cain can beat the Bat Family. Her feats and showings are that good..


Shiva stale mating her is a feat for Shiva.

Originally posted by cdtm
And my point is Cassandra Cain can beat the Bat Family. Her feats and showings are that good..


Shiva stale mating her is a feat for Shiva.

Yes she certainly can beat certain members. She can also lose to them as well especially depending on the circumstances. Jason Todd recently had the advantage over her.

Shiva doesn't get her feats though, anymore than Shiva gets Batman's feats. Elektra doesn't get Daredevil or Ironfist feats. So your point doesn't have real meaning here. Elektra would certainly have a more difficult time matching Cass feats than Shiva's.

Shiva may be the most skilled person in this thread but Elektra is no slouch AND she has actual powers. Her respect thread lists some of them. Team Elektra wins.

Originally posted by zopzop
Shiva may be the most skilled person in this thread but Elektra is no slouch AND she has actual powers. Her respect thread lists some of them. Team Elektra wins.

Shiva beat badgod. Elektra cant do that.

Originally posted by zopzop
Shiva may be the most skilled person in this thread but Elektra is no slouch AND she has actual powers. Her respect thread lists some of them. Team Elektra wins.


She rarely uses the Silent Scream though. At this point it may as well be written out of continity along with Thor's "Hammer Sense" precognition.

Against Shiva, no powers are needed.

Cass would stomp Nachios, imo.

Pre-Flashpoint could stand a chance. Maybe.

Originally posted by cdtm
Cass would stomp Nachios, imo.

disagree and not relevant here.

Stilt is Elektra Assassin canon? I can't remember.

As far as I know, it is.

Originally posted by Supermutant
disagree and not relevant here.

Stilt is Elektra Assassin canon? I can't remember.


Shiva's track record absolutely is relevant here.


Stilt, say what you will, at least I never resort to these dirty lowball tactics. I ALWAYS give the devil his due.

Originally posted by cdtm
Shiva's track record absolutely is relevant here.


Stilt, say what you will, at least I never resort to these dirty lowball tactics. I ALWAYS give the devil his due.

Your belief that Cass would stomp Elektra is irrelevant to Shiva's actually record. Also please pinpoint the lowball that I am doing if you are referring to me.

Originally posted by Supermutant
Your belief that Cass would stomp Elektra is irrelevant to Shiva's actually record. Also please pinpoint the lowball that I am doing if you are referring to me.


Lets start with the complete hand wave you did to another poster when presented with valid feats earlier.

"I"m not impressed" indeed. You're like Cage's evil twin.

Originally posted by cdtm
Lets start with the complete hand wave you did to another poster when presented with valid feats earlier.

"I"m not impressed" indeed. You're like Cage's evil twin.

A hand wave? Again did you not read my reply to Cage. He mentioned Shiva owning Batman and my reply wasn't a hand wave. It was Elektra owning Wolverine. He also mentioned Shiva owning the Secret 6. My reply was Elektra defeating the Serpent Society and the Assassin's guild. I also stated the context involving Shiva and the batfamily and strix.

I'm pretty sure you missed where I called Shiva an elite fighter as well.

Originally posted by Supermutant
...Cass was stalemating Shiva by herself for much of the fight. Which certainly is still elite, but also not someone who is portrayed as unbeatable on the forums.

So anything else you wish to make up? You accuse me of lowbailing when I asked for feats to show why Shiva would stomp Elektra. And the very few feats that have been shown I have presented Elektra feats that at least matches that.

Do you have any feats that prove Shiva stomps Elektra, that Elektra count match or out perform?

Shiva wouldnt stomp elektra, but she would win.

Originally posted by Senor Cage
Which team of assassins wins?

Team Shiva

Talia Al Ghul
https://i.imgur.com/4HaVBcX.jpg

Shiva
https://i.imgur.com/VDb7gN2.jpg

Shado
https://i.imgur.com/Qa5zxlX.jpg


Vs

Team Elektra

Elektra
https://i.imgur.com/Kq5WhFo.jpg

Echo
https://i.imgur.com/hkEhRPL.jpg


Lady Bullseye
https://i.imgur.com/BFj4XOE.jpg

All pics deleted already...

Well, here is some more.

I'm only using Rebirth feats and beyond, not outdated feats, since there is some continuity changes and many stories seem not in continuity anymore.

Fights off some of the Dark Knights

https://i.imgur.com/91MtBt7.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/c8cxprj.jpg

Had Batman down, so Cassandra had to step in. Cassandra did do a number on her at the end, but STILL couldn't finish the job. It was Ra's who put Shiva down from a sucker attack.

https://i.imgur.com/c8cxprj.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/EihFuSd.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/pZENQc5.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/J3fsND4.jpg

Before that, Shiva was toying with Cassandra. Probably not realizing her true potential, but Shiva did own Batman, too.

https://i.imgur.com/nlZHQJm.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/BfJvsiP.jpg

1st encounter with Cassandra and Batman

https://i.imgur.com/dt3eVwk.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/y0JHZDh.jpg

Vs Batman

https://i.imgur.com/RoWhLhH.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/vNlDS4M.jpg



I doubt Elektra could do that to Batman and walk away. Just me.

Takes out some of the Secret Six. Note that Black Alice has Cheetah's powers, which means she SHOULD have enhanced senses and speed.

https://i.imgur.com/i780yqh.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/pqEtsnD.jpg

Vs Styx

Toys with guys like Catman. Note, that Catman was able to go toe to toe with Aquaman for a bit.

https://i.imgur.com/Gksf2Un.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/5fbrA2C.jpg

Stryx admitting that Shiva could have beaten her.

https://i.imgur.com/295wH5W.jpg

Originally posted by Senor Cage
1st encounter with Cassandra and Batman

https://i.imgur.com/dt3eVwk.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/y0JHZDh.jpg

Vs Batman

https://i.imgur.com/RoWhLhH.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/vNlDS4M.jpg



I doubt Elektra could do that to Batman and walk away. Just me.

Batman just got his arm f*cked up... and he's still throwing that stupid dart thing with said arm... facepalm facepalm facepalm

No wonder Shiva was able to catch it.

I disagree, Danny had the raw skill advantage.



You're ignoring the very important context that she was using dirty tactics like blind siding, was armed, was trying to KILL him. Yet he managed to disarm her and hold her off while sticking to non lethal techniques.



If Rand wanted to, he could have used her own sai against her. Instead, he threw it away.

Using just Rebirth will only give her a few feats. Still those that have been showed have already been discussed and answered. I'm still going to show some Daredevil and other stuff, but I really don't see anything in those two arcs to make Shiva better than Elektra.

Getting shot dead by Ras Al Ghul certainly was a low showing for her.


Originally posted by cdtm
I disagree, Danny had the raw skill advantage.

You're ignoring the very important context that she was using dirty tactics like blind siding, was armed, was trying to KILL him. Yet he managed to disarm her and hold her off while sticking to non lethal techniques.

If Rand wanted to, he could have used her own sai against her. Instead, he threw it away.

meh Don't see it. Elektra certainly wasn't trying to kill him. She stated in the first scan, she didn't even want to fight him. But he tried to follow her so they fought. He probably just didn't want her to get her weapon back. Any way you look at it, that fight was very competitive. Plus when DD questioned her, Elektra was really trying to help the defenders in her own way looking for info or something like that. But yeah she wasn't performing lethal techniques either.

What do you think would happen if Danny didn't block that sai when he was on the ground?


Or that kitchen knife?


Even Frank Castle was terrified of her in Ennis's run, which says a lot. He normally doesn't fear characters like Spidey, because he knows he has a moral code against killing.

Originally posted by Supermutant
meh Don't see it. Elektra certainly wasn't trying to kill him. She stated in the first scan, she didn't even want to fight him. But he tried to follow her so they fought. He probably just didn't want her to get her weapon back. Any way you look at it, that fight was very competitive. Plus when DD questioned her, Elektra was really trying to help the defenders in her own way looking for info or something like that. But yeah she wasn't performing lethal techniques either.

Rand was a pussy who had to kamehameha her, otherwise he would get anally raped

Originally posted by Supermutant
Using just Rebirth will only give her a few feats. Still those that have been showed have already been discussed and answered. I'm still going to show some Daredevil and other stuff, but I really don't see anything in those two arcs to make Shiva better than Elektra.

Getting shot dead by Ras Al Ghul certainly was a low showing for her.




meh Don't see it. Elektra certainly wasn't trying to kill him. She stated in the first scan, she didn't even want to fight him. But he tried to follow her so they fought. He probably just didn't want her to get her weapon back. Any way you look at it, that fight was very competitive. Plus when DD questioned her, Elektra was really trying to help the defenders in her own way looking for info or something like that. But yeah she wasn't performing lethal techniques either.

That wasnt a low showing. She wasnt aware.

Plus, batman commented that he beat her befor. However, she was "playing the part", then owned him. I dont see Elektra owning guys like DD or IF.

Elektra used the same fighting style she always uses, even when shes going non lethal and danny used the same fighting style he always uses in every fight. Neither one was holding back or going harder than normal until the end when Danny had to use a full upper body chi explosion to stop from getting fully beaten

Originally posted by cdtm
What do you think would happen if Danny didn't block that sai when he was on the ground?


Or that kitchen knife?


Even Frank Castle was terrified of her in Ennis's run, which says a lot. He normally doesn't fear characters like Spidey, because he knows he has a moral code against killing.

He would have gotten stabbed.

And stabbed again.

Non lethal though. Elektra is that good able to slice the headband clean off an opponent in mid combat without leaving a scratch. It would have been much easier for Elektra to just kill her than to make that cut, the comic tell us.

https://imgur.com/4puzyFE

Anyways its clear in the same comic that the fight took place that Elektra wasn't trying to kill him or any of the Defenders. She was just trying to gather info and intel.

https://imgur.com/QcyBjEp
https://imgur.com/JgrDc8I

You should know better than this bsdm. Unless she is under mind controlled like from the Hand or manipulated like from Kingpin (those days are long gone), she isn't killing heroes. Just like the Punisher, she will mess a hero up if they get in her way, in a non lethal way. She certainly will kill a villain, but Ironfist of course isn't a villain.

Originally posted by Supermutant
He would have gotten stabbed.

And stabbed again.

Non lethal though. Elektra is that good able to slice the headband clean off an opponent in mid combat without leaving a scratch. It would have been much easier for Elektra to just kill her than to make that cut, the comic tell us.

https://imgur.com/4puzyFE

Anyways its clear in the same comic that the fight took place that Elektra wasn't trying to kill him or any of the Defenders. She was just trying to gather info and intel.

https://imgur.com/QcyBjEp
https://imgur.com/JgrDc8I

You should know better than this bsdm. Unless she is under mind controlled like from the Hand or manipulated like from Kingpin (those days are long gone), she isn't killing heroes. Just like the Punisher, she will mess a hero up if they get in her way, in a non lethal way. She certainly will kill a villain, but Ironfist of course isn't a villain.


Nice scans.



We agree it was very competitive. And just a fun read, captured the excitement of cinematic Kung fu fighting better then most comic book martial arts throwdowns. Too bad Bendis had to leave for Superman, he was actually good with Defenders.

Shiva held off azrael, batman, batwing, Cassandra, etc.. for a time. The team you mentioned isn't as skilled or technological as the one Shiva went up against.

Plus, owning Batman is more impressive, seeing as the opponents he's abused over the last few years (Deathstroke, Bane, etc...) yet, Shiva made short work of him.

He got distracted at the end, to be fair. And he wasn't using his tachyon field.

Sil does have some good strength feats, but this is the only time he was said to be Class 10.

--
Anyway, keep up the good work. Nice to see someone putting dctards in their place, for a change.

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
He got distracted at the end, to be fair. And he wasn't using his tachyon field.

Sil does have some good strength feats, but this is the only time he was said to be Class 10.

--
Anyway, keep up the good work. Nice to see someone putting dctards in their place, for a change.

Seems like they increased his strength but took away his mutant power there. Even though his power mutant was mentioned in the beginning, strange. I was looking for other references where he was stated to be class 10, of course I didn't find any. Most places don't even list his strength.

Marvel should bring him back. I don't care for the newer one in the suit. Looks like they followed after the movie SS somewhat.

Originally posted by Supermutant
Seems like they increased his strength but took away his mutant power there. Even though his power mutant was mentioned in the beginning, strange. I was looking for other references where he was stated to be class 10, of course I didn't find any. Most places don't even list his strength.

Marvel should bring him back. I don't care for the newer one in the suit. Looks like they followed after the movie SS somewhat.

Seems like Bendis didn't know what he was doing, tbh.

And yeah, his son is not even half as good of a villain as he was. Though I enjoyed him making Whor look stupid.

Originally posted by Senor Cage
Shiva held off azrael, batman, batwing, Cassandra, etc.. for a time. The team you mentioned isn't as skilled or technological as the one Shiva went up against.

Plus, owning Batman is more impressive, seeing as the opponents he's abused over the last few years (Deathstroke, Bane, etc...) yet, Shiva made short work of him.

So Elektra has defeated Taskmaster, Hawkeye, Daredevil, Domino, Bullseye, Silver Samurai, Wolverine, Punisher and these are just the major names that people would know. She has other good showing like owning multiple SuperSkrulls.

The Lady Shiva side is basically just this but she grabbed Batman and had him in arm bar. Let's pretend we haven't seen Bruce get out of worse than that. And we are going to ignore not only Batman other fights against her but other members of the bat family as well, when she didn't do as well.

At least Cage isn't hiding though, its pretty obvious his opinion is that Lady Shiva wins just because she is a DC character.

And Cage is a sneaky one, don't think it slipped past me that you snuck 3-booted Karate Kid into this discussion on page 1. Have Shiva faced Karate Kid, Deathstroke, or Bane? I think not, she doesn't get Batman feats.

I'm certainly not even attempting to give Elektra, Wolverine feats or Daredevil feats. My point from the beginning has been when you look at their own feats Elektra is more impressive. She stands on her own, there's no need to play the ABC logic game.

Lady Shiva lives off of other's accomplishes a bit too much, then excuses are made for her less than stellar showings. She has the big grand statements of how nigh unbeatable she is, but her feats doesn't match up to it.

I think I have proven my side. I still might post some of her esoteric abilities when I get around too it. But I never wanted to make an Elektra respect thread here although that's where its headed lol.

Originally posted by Supermutant
So Elektra has defeated Taskmaster, Hawkeye, Daredevil, Domino, Bullseye, Silver Samurai, Wolverine, Punisher and these are just the major names that people would know. She has other good showing like owning multiple SuperSkrulls.

Add Crossbones and Lady Bullseye to the list.

yeah it not an exhaustive list but I forgot to post this LB one

https://imgur.com/a/O5Fpa5e

She would go on to beat upgraded mist form LB too.

Originally posted by Supermutant
So Elektra has defeated Taskmaster, Hawkeye, Daredevil, Domino, Bullseye, Silver Samurai, Wolverine, Punisher and these are just the major names that people would know. She has other good showing like owning multiple SuperSkrulls.

The Lady Shiva side is basically just this but she grabbed Batman and had him in arm bar. Let's pretend we haven't seen Bruce get out of worse than that. And we are going to ignore not only Batman other fights against her but other members of the bat family as well, when she didn't do as well.

At least Cage isn't hiding though, its pretty obvious his opinion is that Lady Shiva wins just because she is a DC character.

And Cage is a sneaky one, don't think it slipped past me that you snuck 3-booted Karate Kid into this discussion on page 1. Have Shiva faced Karate Kid, Deathstroke, or Bane? I think not, she doesn't get Batman feats.

I'm certainly not even attempting to give Elektra, Wolverine feats or Daredevil feats. My point from the beginning has been when you look at their own feats Elektra is more impressive. She stands on her own, there's no need to play the ABC logic game.

Lady Shiva lives off of other's accomplishes a bit too much, then excuses are made for her less than stellar showings. She has the big grand statements of how nigh unbeatable she is, but her feats doesn't match up to it.

I think I have proven my side. I still might post some of her esoteric abilities when I get around too it. But I never wanted to make an Elektra respect thread here although that's where its headed lol.

I'd give the edge to elektra if it were pre-flashpoint shiva. But Rebirth Shiva is another beast. Elektra would have trouble with Batman, yet Shiva tooled him quite easily. Hell, she'd have a hard time against Cassandra and Azrael.

Reason I stated Batman's feats, is because Batman would constantly own some of the best streets in DC, but Shiva in the LOS arc was just on another level. Ultimately, it was Ras who took her out, and Batman needed his help.

https://comicvine1.cbsistatic.com/uploads/scale_super/14/144096/4481560-8192016704-twohi.jpg

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
https://comicvine1.cbsistatic.com/uploads/scale_super/14/144096/4481560-8192016704-twohi.jpg



Jason is a badass though

Yeah but Jason is using techniques from Shiva there.

So actually, Shiva beat Shiva

but Jason looks sexier doing it

Jason knew better how to apply Shiva's techniques than Shiva herself

Also, remember how Tim raped her with a box of chocolates.

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
Jason knew better how to apply Shiva's techniques than Shiva herself

Also, remember how Tim raped her with a box of chocolates.

Tim is a dork, and his costume is so ugly I don't know why he still exist in DC

Shiva sucks so much, probably even Powerless Superman could beat her.

Anyone mention Shadowdragon yet?


That suit did let him dodge an incrementally increasing his speed Superman, who was clearly struggling to hit him and using his super speed, based on the comment "IMPOSSIBLE!"

And Shiva owned him.

That just shows how pathetic Superman's combat speed really is.

Still better than thor's

Well, no doubt about that.

Thor has what, thousands of years of experience? And some minor degree of superspeed thanks to his Asgardian physiology?

Yet when it comes to actual performance, he's still still slower than a rookie Daredevil (Matt was on the beginning of his career when he schooled Thor).

Superman is no fighter, just a dumb farmboy, but it's safe to say he'd blitz Thor to shreds before Thor even realized he was in a fight.

Originally posted by cdtm
Anyone mention Shadowdragon yet?


That suit did let him dodge an incrementally increasing his speed Superman, who was clearly struggling to hit him and using his super speed, based on the comment "IMPOSSIBLE!"

I did, I even posted the entire fight between Shiva and Shadowdragon on the 2 page. Here again

https://imgur.com/a/vLo2lt5

If someone tried to use this fight against Superman, I bet they would be immediately attacked. Its funny how Shiva can pick a discarded mop handle (stick ?) and parry a weapon that hurt Superman.

https://comicvine1.cbsistatic.com/uploads/original/11115/111151571/5000952-4239321019-36636.jpg

Makes as much sense as Elektra blocking Class 10 blows from SS

Who, even without the tachyon field, should be wielding his indestructible Black Blade made by Muramasa, lol.

Comics.

Back to the skilled fighters list, Boomerang is basically a SFW version of Bullseye and Elektra punked him, too.

Even though he teamed up with Shocker against her.

Puma, too.

https://i.imgur.com/A4kEIPx.jpg

Helluva feat, running through a gauntlet of villains here.

Great catch, I couldn't make out who Puma was when I posted that earlier.

He mostly relies on his enhanced physicals and senses, but he's pretty skilled for a Spider-Man villain.

He caught Cap's shield, for example.

Puma and Whirlwind are the only villains in the pic that didn't get mentioned by Elektra. Clearing that gauntlet is a really good feat, I repeat myself.

Let's have some fun with a match this feat game. Starting with strength feats:

Here Elektra lifts two adult males over her head.

https://imgur.com/qXQ1kO2

If the Lady Shiva side matches this feat then they can post a feat for Elektra to match.

That was with 2 arms. Shiva picked someone up with one arm and threw him.

https://imgur.com/HGbURnF

If we're using all feats.

Rebirth picked up cassandra with one arm and threw her.

https://imgur.com/WRnms9i

Pinning someone against the wall =/= throwing him and it's a less than mediocre feat for any street, lol.

Picking up 2 people isn't that great.

I agree, but it's far better than what you've posted.

What are Shiva's good strength feats?

Originally posted by Senor Cage
Picking up 2 people isn't that great.

lol of course not, I was starting off with easy feats to see if Shiva could even match those.

Seems like she can't based on what you have shown. Cassy doesn't weigh more than the average adult male.

Anyway just took keep this going, here's Elektra koing Morbius with one attack. A double sai handle to the side of the hand. Could be used as a striking and/or skill feat.

https://imgur.com/igWBiKg

And that was back when Morbius was actively using his increased shapeshifting powers.

Nice find

Elektra has never owned someone like Batgod. End thread.

She has. His name is Daredevil.

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
And that was back when Morbius was actively using his increased shapeshifting powers.

Nice find

Your Puma catch still was nicer. IIRC symbiote Spiderman even alluded that Puma was too fast for him in close quarters, and Wolverine was impressed with his speed. Too bad Elektra's fight with him was off-panel, it would have been cool to see it all.

Originally posted by Senor Cage
Elektra has never owned someone like Batgod. End thread.

Lady Shiva has never owned someone like Wolverine. So this thread was ended a while ago, in that case.

Originally posted by Supermutant
Lady Shiva has never owned someone like Wolverine. So this thread was ended a while ago, in that case.

Nobody compares to Batgod.

Shadowdragon?

And didn't she toss Supergirl?

Originally posted by Supermutant
Your Puma catch still was nicer. IIRC symbiote Spiderman even alluded that Puma was too fast for him in close quarters, and Wolverine was impressed with his speed. Too bad Elektra's fight with him was off-panel, it would have been cool to see it all.

Symbiote didn't enhance Parker in 616 canon and Wolverine was drugged, to be fair.

But sure, he is fast, even in his human form:

http://i.imgur.com/5NKy8C6.jpg

lulz@ the Donald Trump comparison.

It was off-panel, but we know that she has defeated all of those villains, while being on the run between the fights and protecting Crow, Matchmaker and Kento.

Originally posted by cdtm
Shadowdragon?

And didn't she toss Supergirl?

Cassandra Caine too.

Originally posted by cdtm
Shadowdragon?

And didn't she toss Supergirl?

again bdsm on page 2.

Dang. Shiva owned a kryptonian. Kryptonian>>all.

You're really bad at this.

Originally posted by Supermutant
Lady Shiva has never owned someone like Wolverine. So this thread was ended a while ago, in that case.

Kara>>Hulkbusters.

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
Symbiote didn't enhance Parker in 616 canon and Wolverine was drugged, to be fair.

But sure, he is fast, even in his human form:

http://i.imgur.com/5NKy8C6.jpg

lulz@ the Donald Trump comparison.

It was off-panel, but we know that she has defeated all of those villains, while being on the run between the fights and protecting Crow, Matchmaker and Kento.

yeah that's why I just stated what they said about his speed. I didn't mention that he gutted wolverine b/c of Wolvie's weaken condition. lol that trump comparison is really funny now.

Definitely highly impressive stuff even if all of it wasn't directly shown on panel. For instance beating Puma is more impressive than owning Catman. Also added in was the extra significant hurdle of her having to protect others that you highlighted.

This is actually very fun to see how well Elektra has done across the board in a variety of different and difficult matchups.

I dont know. Rebirth Catman was able to dodge Aquaman, in addition to cutting him. Catman is no joke. Even Manta wasnt able to do that so easily.

Originally posted by Supermutant
again bdsm on page 2.




Three Hulk Busters vs one Shadowdragon, who wins?


Seriously though, do Hulk Busters have any good feats aside from being tasked with taking down Hulk?


I bet Iron Fist or Cage could take them.

Originally posted by Senor Cage
Kara>>Hulkbusters.

Actually I posted Elektra paralyzing Red She Hulk with one attack with her sais in comparison to Shiva flipping Supergirl over.

Elektra quickly defeating the hulkbusters and crimson dynamo was in response to Shiva beating Shadowdragon.

And the hits keep on coming. Here's Elektra throwing her sai into Rulk's neck causing him some pain.

https://imgur.com/e3g4wSZ

Able to get right back up from Rulk throwing her across a room.

https://imgur.com/E8tfHuX

Originally posted by cdtm
Seriously though, do Hulk Busters have any good feats aside from being tasked with taking down Hulk?

Sure they do, like the time when a single Hulkbuster gave Dark Avengers trouble.

Originally posted by cdtm
Three Hulk Busters vs one Shadowdragon, who wins?


Seriously though, do Hulk Busters have any good feats aside from being tasked with taking down Hulk?


I bet Iron Fist or Cage could take them.

They should be able to take Shadowdragon as well. He has one feat of making Superman look silly. And against Shiva he mentioned something about conserving power on his suit. The only way those two showing would remotely make any sense.

Originally posted by Supermutant
Actually I posted Elektra paralyzing Red She Hulk with one attack with her sais in comparison to Shiva flipping Supergirl over.

Elektra quickly defeating the hulkbusters and crimson dynamo was in response to Shiva beating Shadowdragon.

And the hits keep on coming. Here's Elektra throwing her sai into Rulk's neck causing him some pain.

https://imgur.com/e3g4wSZ

Able to get right back up from Rulk throwing her across a room.

https://imgur.com/E8tfHuX

Just doing that to someone with reflexes such as kara is pretty impressive. She basically manhandled a kryptonian, who is faster than she-hulk.

Originally posted by Senor Cage
Just doing that to someone with reflexes such as kara is pretty impressive. She basically manhandled a kryptonian, who is faster than she-hulk.

You think Supergirl used her reflexes or speed there?

Originally posted by Supermutant
You think Supergirl used her reflexes or speed there?

Well, Shiva did out maneuver Shadowdragon. Why didn't Kara use her speed against Shiva?

The more I learn about Shiva, the less I respect her.

She's all hype, yes? All those years blowing her scarce few feats out of proportion... and for what?

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
The more I learn about Shiva, the less I respect her.

She's all hype, yes? All those years blowing her scarce few feats out of proportion... and for what?

the question is who would you rather fuk

Elektra or Shiva

Hype? It took all of the Dark Knights to take her down, along with ras.

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
The more I learn about Shiva, the less I respect her.

She's all hype, yes? All those years blowing her scarce few feats out of proportion... and for what?


She killed Richard Dragon.

No, she got stomped and it was Dragon's plan to get killed:

http://i.imgur.com/rLCRB57.jpg

He said he had no idea.

He lied.

He floored Shiva in that fight and had her dead to rights, but he allowed her to get up.

Originally posted by Senor Cage
Well, Shiva did out maneuver Shadowdragon. Why didn't Kara use her speed against Shiva?

So you believe that a kryptonian using their speed and not holding back severely, is slower than a street leveler?

And Elektra actually paralyzed and defeated the Red She Hulk with one attack, not just some brief ownage that didn't have a lasting effect.

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
The more I learn about Shiva, the less I respect her.

She's all hype, yes? All those years blowing her scarce few feats out of proportion... and for what?

Exactly, she has a lot of hype but not that many feats to support it. Especially when using only rebirth feats, that's why her side keeps bringing up the same feats over and over.

And those feats are not any better than what Elektra has consistently done. It didn't take long to get a concession in the feat vs feat comparison.

Cdtm mentioning the Richard Dragon fight is all kinds of retarded.

First she got decked by him and he allowed her to get up, pissing her off as he was holding back.

Then he had her dead to rights, but the fight was interrupted.

So it's 2:1 for Dragon in that fight and Shiva's "win" is very dubious at best, as seen above.

Tbf though, Shiva has a LOT fewer appearances than Elektra.

Yes, even DC considers her crap, that's why she doesn't get much panel time.

She does have a whole lot of crazy fanboys, though.

Originally posted by Supermutant
So you believe that a kryptonian using their speed and not holding back severely, is slower than a street leveler?

And Elektra actually paralyzed and defeated the Red She Hulk with one attack, not just some brief ownage that didn't have a lasting effect.

Didnt cassandra go toe to toe with kara too? Batman one-shotted Grundy (who was taking on Gotham), shiva was able to humiliate SG, who has better reflexes, speed, etc... most top tier streets have these types of feats, which is why I dont put too much stock into who has the greater strength or speed in comics. When it comes to these types of battles, it comes down to skill.

Originally posted by Senor Cage
Didnt cassandra go toe to toe with kara too? Batman one-shotted Grundy (who was taking on Gotham), shiva was able to humiliate SG, who has better reflexes, speed, etc... most top tier streets have these types of feats, which is why I dont put too much stock into who has the greater strength or speed in comics. When it comes to these types of battles, it comes down to skill.

So you didn't mean this.

Originally posted by Senor Cage
Dang. Shiva owned a kryptonian. Kryptonian>>all.

These types of battles comes down to a lot of different things. Stats are important as well as skill, so is tech or esoteric powers like Domino's luck. Skill isn't the only thing.

By with that being said, Elekta's skill is elite. She doesn't take a back seat to Shiva in skill. Certainly not based on anything presented thus far. Elektra has used pressure points attacks, fought w/o being able to see, etc. She is someone that is capable of re-training Daredevil similar to how Shiva re-trained Bats. She recently became his new "Stick."

https://imgur.com/a/V60hh8g

Don't forget that she retrained Wolverine, too.

Originally posted by Supermutant
So you didn't mean this.



These types of battles comes down to a lot of different things. Stats are important as well as skill, so is tech or esoteric powers like Domino's luck. Skill isn't the only thing.

By with that being said, Elekta's skill is elite. She doesn't take a back seat to Shiva in skill. Certainly not based on anything presented thus far. Elektra has used pressure points attacks, fought w/o being able to see, etc. She is someone that is capable of re-training Daredevil similar to how Shiva re-trained Bats. She recently became his new "Stick."

https://imgur.com/a/V60hh8g

Of course stats count somewhat, but when it comes to MA/street battles skill is what counts most. I'd peg Shiva just as skilled, if not more so than Elektra. I'd also put Batman above Matt, skill wise too, imo.

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
Don't forget that she retrained Wolverine, too.
no doubt on 2nd page

The final result was so good, Logan was able to dodge and block strikes from Stick.

She also trained the Punisher, being consistently shown as superior to him... and Frank, despite preferring guns, is easily Black Widow level.

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW


The final result was so good, Logan was able to dodge and block strikes from Stick.

She also trained the Punisher, being consistently shown as superior to him... and Frank, despite preferring guns, is easily Black Widow level.

on 2nd page as well. She owned Pun in ways that even Daredevil and Spider-man haven't come close too.

Originally posted by Supermutant
on 2nd page as well. She owned Pun in ways that even Daredevil and Spider-man haven't come close too.

Pfft. Batman owned him too.

Originally posted by Supermutant
on 2nd page as well. She owned Pun in ways that even Daredevil and Spider-man haven't come close too.

That she did.

Matt and Pete get raped by him most of the time, actually.

When Shiva was growing up, she wanted to be Elektra

Shiva and Cassandra gaining some good feats lately.

Shiva brief fight w/lightning with Ishmael (Who earlier owned the Outsiders)

https://i.imgur.com/hJZYeQ1.jpg

Brief fight with Cassandra

https://i.imgur.com/xNWaSdn.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/X7WeNVt.jpg

Shiva and CC first meeting in the series

https://i.imgur.com/Y8SRzJ2.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/CKxwuSH.jpg

Pretty good feat, since CC did this later

https://i.imgur.com/ivK88xG.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/L8uWlvK.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/TQqyn7a.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/VkYU0Go.jpg

Elektra is a pretty weak fighter so most likely Shiva would solo.

Shiva is a poor man's Elektra.

Originally posted by RadZoa
Elektra is a pretty weak fighter so most likely Shiva would solo.

She was soloing the entire batfamily.