Did Dooku let Anakin win/was he holding back?

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xPRIMEx

juggernaut74
Dooku was told to kill Kenobi to test Anakin to see if he'd turn to the Darkside and that if things started to go wrong he'd help him. The endgame was for Dooku to be captured and arrested only to be released after Order 66.

Dooku also mentioned before the battle that the war was taking its toll on him.

So you decide.

ares834

juggernaut74
Yes Dooku does start to go into "kill" mode but goes back into "playful" mode.

We just went through this for gods sake.

Sheev

juggernaut74
I speak the truth and I realize it hurts but not one thing I said was untrue.

You guys are the ones he should not listen to

xPRIMEx

Sheev
Yeah, definitely read the novels for yourself. You'll see that ares and myself are absolutely correct.

juggernaut74 just likes to spin things to fit into his own headcanon. Pay him no mind.

juggernaut74
What did I make up?

Sheev
To put it lightly, you're god awful at interpreting context, and you try to add your own little twist on the information that is provided so that it fits into this headcanon bubble you've created for yourself.

But like I said, when xPrime reads the novels for himself he'll get it. smile

juggernaut74
You say that Dooku started to go for the kill which he did but you neglect to mention that Dooku got control of things again and started to slip back into his "playful" mode and that is when Sidious decided to intervene and goad Anakin into using his rage and fury. That confused Dooku to the point if he thought Sidious had lost his mind and that is when Anakin get the upperhand. Do you understand context?

It's pretty clear had Sidious not been there to aid Anakin into getting a rage boner he would have lost.

Oh and as I said earlier before the fight even started Dooku clearly stated the war was taking it's toll on him and he was ready to take it easy. So there's that.

Rockydonovang
Originally posted by juggernaut74
I speak the truth

As a wise man once said:
Originally posted by juggernaut74
Well you are still riding in the boat by yourself.

Goodluck with that.

sad

xPRIMEx

xPRIMEx

juggernaut74

Sheev
facepalm

Dooku was just surprised that Sidious was ordering Anakin to kill him, as he was hoping that his master would help him. That doesn't mean Dooku was holding back before that when Anakin unleashed his fury. The novel implies the exact opposite ffs.

This is what I mean. You misinterpret the hell out of the context, twist it to try and fit into your little headcanon bubble, then try to sell it as fact. Pure cringe.

xPRIMEx

juggernaut74

juggernaut74
This is taken from the Ultimate Star Wars Updated and it confirms Dooku realized too late:

https://i.postimg.cc/HkS4rvQN/20200411-212833.jpg

xPRIMEx
Yeah he still realized before Anakin used his rage. Which was too late because Anakin was then too powerful for him to defeat.

Galan007
*sighs*

Dooku coming to the realization that Palpatine was not going to stop Anakin from decapitating him does not mean Dooku was holding back against Anakin in the moments leading up to that.

juggernaut74
Yeah it was too late by the time he realized it.

juggernaut74
Originally posted by xPRIMEx
Yeah he still realized before Anakin used his rage. Which was too late because Anakin was then too powerful for him to defeat. The page before the novel states Dooku allowed himself to relax and go back to being playful right then and there is when Sidious started to goad Anakin into getting a rage boner. In fact the novel states at the very final instant Dooku was in bewildered astonishment. What does that mean you ask? It means Dooku was confused and realized too late he was doomed as that canon source I cited references.

YousufKhan1212
Dooku only started being playful again because he mentally unbalanced Anakin with Dun Moch, because Anakin's focus was compromised by his fear and anger that he didn't use properly, but Anakin focuses his anger when Palpatine commands him to, once that happens he beats the living crap out of Dooku. In the film however, Dooku's use of Dun Moch backfires, which is kind of hilarious.

juggernaut74
Originally posted by juggernaut74
The page before the novel states Dooku allowed himself to relax and go back to being playful right then and there is when Sidious started to goad Anakin into getting a rage boner. In fact the novel states at the very final instant Dooku was in bewildered astonishment. What does that mean you ask? It means Dooku was confused and realized too late he was doomed as that canon source I cited references.

Dooku was just playing a part.

https://i.postimg.cc/6p0wnn3g/20200417-203743.jpg

YousufKhan1212
The fact that Dooku thought Palpatine would rescue him is not mutually exclusive with what I said.

xPRIMEx
In other words, Dooku was expecting Palpatine to help if Anakin started to win. So you admit Anakin was winning

ares834
Around and around we go.

juggernaut74
The novels make it pretty clear that Dooku was caught off guard and the canon sources I posted prove it.

Dooku was playing a part that he was unprepared for. Deal with it.

Sheev
Originally posted by Sheev
To put it lightly, you're god awful at interpreting context, and you try to add your own little twist on the information that is provided so that it fits into this headcanon bubble you've created for yourself.

YousufKhan1212
Dooku was unprepared for the revelation that being defeated by Anakin meant that Palpatine would backstab him by not preventing Anakin from killing him. That's what caught Dooku off guard, none of this remotely suggests that he allowed Anakin to win, the same novel goes out of its way to emphasise Dooku shitting his pants and using whatever tricks he can to avoid death (IIRC, Obi-Wan actually pierces Dooku's lightsaber guard at one point). So no, Dooku didn't let Anakin win. Was he holding back? Well, it's possible that Dooku didn't want to kill Anakin, so he would've been pulling lethal punches e.g. beheading Anakin, but we also have to remember that Makashi, which Dooku's entire fighting style is based on, is about inflicting jabs and light cuts on the opponent, an example of this is demonstrated against Obi-Wan in AotC, so Dooku was not under any obligation to ignore opportunites of non lethal victories against Anakin, that's what his fighting style was designed for.

The fact that Dooku didn't realise that Palpatine wasn't going to save his life from Anakin, isn't mutually exclusive with him doing everything he can to prevent himself from having his hands cut off by Anakin.

juggernaut74
This isn't hard to figure out guys come on now. Dooku was playing his part in a test to test Anakin to see if they can turn him to the darkside and realized too late he was fighting for his life. All back up by canon material and not hopes and dreams.

If you take your binders off the truth will set you free.

Eli Vanto
When everyone else agrees on a topic, and you are the only trying to debate otherwise, odds are YOU are the one who needs to take the blinders off.

juggernaut74
I backed up everything with canon facts.

It's right there.

xPRIMEx

juggernaut74

juggernaut74
Originally posted by juggernaut74
This is taken from the Ultimate Star Wars Updated and it confirms Dooku realized too late:

https://i.postimg.cc/HkS4rvQN/20200411-212833.jpg Here it is again.

xPRIMEx

xPRIMEx

juggernaut74
Where does it say that?

Sheev

NewGuy01
thumb up

juggernaut74
Originally posted by Sheev
laughing out loud glad you looked into it for yourself.

I said it from the start, but it's best to just ignore juggernaut74 and his biased, skewed misinterpretation of the facts. thumb up He actually said he partially agreed with me, he said he didn't think Anakin would have won had Palpatine not been there.

Eli Vanto
That's because Sidious coaxed Anakin into using his rage against Dooku. Once he accessed his rage, he beat the absolute shit out of Dooku.

But none of that is canon anyway, because Palpatine didn't say a word to Anakin in the movie until he told him to kill Dooku.

YousufKhan1212
Originally posted by YousufKhan1212
Dooku was unprepared for the revelation that being defeated by Anakin meant that Palpatine would backstab him by not preventing Anakin from killing him. That's what caught Dooku off guard, none of this remotely suggests that he allowed Anakin to win, the same novel goes out of its way to emphasise Dooku shitting his pants and using whatever tricks he can to avoid death (IIRC, Obi-Wan actually pierces Dooku's lightsaber guard at one point). So no, Dooku didn't let Anakin win. Was he holding back? Well, it's possible that Dooku didn't want to kill Anakin, so he would've been pulling lethal punches e.g. beheading Anakin, but we also have to remember that Makashi, which Dooku's entire fighting style is based on, is about inflicting jabs and light cuts on the opponent, an example of this is demonstrated against Obi-Wan in AotC, so Dooku was not under any obligation to ignore opportunites of non lethal victories against Anakin, that's what his fighting style was designed for.

The fact that Dooku didn't realise that Palpatine wasn't going to save his life from Anakin, isn't mutually exclusive with him doing everything he can to prevent himself from having his hands cut off by Anakin.

YousufKhan1212
Originally posted by Eli Vanto
That's because Sidious coaxed Anakin into using his rage against Dooku. Once he accessed his rage, he beat the absolute shit out of Dooku.

But none of that is canon anyway, because Palpatine didn't say a word to Anakin in the movie until he told him to kill Dooku.

This is true.

juggernaut74
Originally posted by Eli Vanto
That's because Sidious coaxed Anakin into using his rage against Dooku. Once he accessed his rage, he beat the absolute shit out of Dooku.

But none of that is canon anyway, because Palpatine didn't say a word to Anakin in the movie until he told him to kill Dooku. The novel not being canon does not help your case at all so you shouldn't say such things.

Because without the novel you have no ground to stand on to prove your claims because those scans are pretty clear I posted that Dooku was playing a part in a ruse. If your playing a part in a ruse your not really trying.

juggernaut74
Originally posted by YousufKhan1212
Dooku switched strategies twice in this fight.

That's what good fighters do.

NewGuy01
Originally posted by juggernaut74
He actually said he partially agreed with me, he said he didn't think Anakin would have won had Palpatine not been there.

Not what's being disputed.

Eli Vanto
Originally posted by juggernaut74
The novel not being canon does not help your case at all so you shouldn't say such things.

Because without the novel you have no ground to stand on to prove your claims because those scans are pretty clear I posted that Dooku was playing a part in a ruse. If your playing a part in a ruse your not really trying. The novel is what you've been using to try and "prove" that Dooku was holding back, you goon.

With out it, your only "proof" is that cropped page you keep spamming, which tells us what we already knew: that Dooku didn't realize Sidious would let him die until he was about to get his head cut off by Anakin.

You are terrible at this.

Sheev
Why are you guys still feeding this inept troll? Seriously?

juggernaut74
Originally posted by Eli Vanto
The novel is what you've been using to try and "prove" that Dooku was holding back, you goon.

With out it, your only "proof" is that cropped page you keep spamming, which tells us what we already knew: that Dooku didn't realize Sidious would let him die until he was about to get his head cut off by Anakin.

You are terrible at this. Dooku was playing a part in a ruse.

It's not rocket science.

NewGuy01
Originally posted by Sheev
Why are you guys still feeding this inept troll? Seriously?

YousufKhan1212
Originally posted by juggernaut74
Dooku was playing a part in a ruse.

It's not rocket science.

Define what the ruse was in this situation.

juggernaut74
That entire scene.confused

YousufKhan1212
Originally posted by juggernaut74
That entire scene.confused

Enlighten us what his role was.

juggernaut74
Go back and do some reading.

It does wonders.

Sheev
https://i.postimg.cc/Y01vmz7Y/tenor.gif

juggernaut74
I already posted a scan explaining from a canon source, twice in fact.

YousufKhan1212
Originally posted by juggernaut74
Go back and do some reading.

It does wonders.

I did all the reading, but you have failed to prove how Dooku not knowing that Palpatine's real plan was to tell Anakin to kill Dooku if Dooku had lost the fight because he thought Palpatine's plan was to stop Anakin from delivering the killing blow if he overcame Dooku, means that Dooku threw the fight or was holding back.

I know what the scene was; Anakin and Obi-Wan fight Dooku/ Dooku removes Obi-Wan out of the fight. Anakin is forced to fight Dooku by himself. Anakin demolishes Dooku once he lets go of his Jedi restraint. Palpatine is pleased by Anakin defeating Dooku. Palpatine tells Anakin to kill Dooku. Dooku is shocked by this revelation. Dooku realises that Palpatine's "Don't worry bro if Anakin beats you I'll put my foot down by stopping Anakin from killing you if he wins, like the good old referee that I am hahaha" was a ruse.

The fact that Palpatine lied to Dooku about rescuing Dooku if Dooku lost the fight, isn't a confirmation that Dooku allowed Anakin to win. Galan007, xPRIMEx and Sheev are on the money on how they explained it to you:

Originally posted by Galan007
*sighs*

Dooku coming to the realization that Palpatine was not going to stop Anakin from decapitating him does not mean Dooku was holding back against Anakin in the moments leading up to that.

Originally posted by xPRIMEx
In other words, Dooku was expecting Palpatine to help if Anakin started to win. So you admit Anakin was winning

Originally posted by Sheev
facepalm

Dooku was just surprised that Sidious was ordering Anakin to kill him, as he was hoping that his master would help him. That doesn't mean Dooku was holding back before that when Anakin unleashed his fury. The novel implies the exact opposite ffs.

This is what I mean. You misinterpret the hell out of the context, twist it to try and fit into your little headcanon bubble, then try to sell it as fact. Pure cringe.

I think you just need to let this go and move on.

Sheev
Originally posted by YousufKhan1212
I did all the reading, but you have failed to prove how Dooku not knowing that Palpatine's real plan was to tell Anakin to kill Dooku if Dooku had lost the fight because he thought Palpatine's plan was to stop Anakin from delivering the killing blow if he overcame Dooku, means that Dooku threw the fight or was holding back.

I know what the scene was; Anakin and Obi-Wan fight Dooku/ Dooku removes Obi-Wan out of the fight. Anakin is forced to fight Dooku by himself. Anakin demolishes Dooku once he lets go of his Jedi restraint. Palpatine is pleased by Anakin defeating Dooku. Palpatine tells Anakin to kill Dooku. Dooku is shocked by this revelation. Dooku realises that Palpatine's "Don't worry bro if Anakin beats you I'll put my foot down by stopping Anakin from killing you if he wins, like the good old referee that I am hahaha" was a ruse.

The fact that Palpatine lied to Dooku about rescuing Dooku if Dooku lost the fight, isn't a confirmation that Dooku allowed Anakin to win. Galan007, xPRIMEx and Sheev are on the money on how they explained it to you:







I think you just need to let this go and move on. Common sense and logical deduction are not his forte, obviously.

Darth Thor
Yeah im sure Dooku allowed Anakin to chop his hands off and then decapitate him.

YousufKhan1212
BUT DOOKU DIDN'T KNOW THAT PALPATINE WAS GOING TO ALLOW ANAKIN TO KILL HIM!!!

juggernaut74
Originally posted by YousufKhan1212
I did all the reading, but you have failed to prove how Dooku not knowing that Palpatine's real plan was to tell Anakin to kill Dooku if Dooku had lost the fight because he thought Palpatine's plan was to stop Anakin from delivering the killing blow if he overcame Dooku, means that Dooku threw the fight or was holding back.

I know what the scene was; Anakin and Obi-Wan fight Dooku/ Dooku removes Obi-Wan out of the fight. Anakin is forced to fight Dooku by himself. Anakin demolishes Dooku once he lets go of his Jedi restraint. Palpatine is pleased by Anakin defeating Dooku. Palpatine tells Anakin to kill Dooku. Dooku is shocked by this revelation. Dooku realises that Palpatine's "Don't worry bro if Anakin beats you I'll put my foot down by stopping Anakin from killing you if he wins, like the good old referee that I am hahaha" was a ruse.

The fact that Palpatine lied to Dooku about rescuing Dooku if Dooku lost the fight, isn't a confirmation that Dooku allowed Anakin to win. Galan007, xPRIMEx and Sheev are on the money on how they explained it to you:



Canon sources say that Dooku was playing his part in a ruse to lure Anakin to the Dark Side that is fact.

Sidious told Dooku that he'd help him if things went wrong which he obviously never did. Dooku didn't know he was fighting for his life until the very end.

This is basic stuff guys for gods sake.

Sheev
The only thing "basic" is your crayon-eating level of intelligence.

juggernaut74
Don't resort to insults again it shows weakness.

Rockydonovang
Originally posted by juggernaut74
You're on a boat on your own.

Goodluck with that.

YousufKhan1212
Originally posted by juggernaut74
Canon sources say that Dooku was playing his part in a ruse to lure Anakin to the Dark Side that is fact.

Sidious told Dooku that he'd help him if things went wrong which he obviously never did. Dooku didn't know he was fighting for his life until the very end.

This is basic stuff guys for gods sake.

Dooku was playing his part in a ruse to lure Anakin to the Dark Side... In the context that Palpatine made up a lie that he was going to stop Anakin from killing him if Anakin wins the fight. The fact that Dooku didn't realise that Palpatine was not going to stop Anakin from killing Dooku doesn't prove that Dooku was holding back. None of this is proves that Dooku allowed Anakin to win.

juggernaut74
I don't think anyone was supposed to win. The point was to get Anakin to the Dark Side.

Had he known he was fighting for his life the fight may have ended differently.

Darth Thor
Originally posted by juggernaut74
I don't think anyone was supposed to win. The point was to get Anakin to the Dark Side.

Had he known he was fighting for his life the fight may have ended differently.


So did Dooku allow Anakin to chop his arms off?

juggernaut74
They say there's no such thing as a dumb question but this makes me wonder.

Darth Thor
There is however such thing as a rhetorical question. But this one seems to have flown over your head.

juggernaut74
Apparently you haven't been paying attention.

What do you think I meant when I said he realized too late he was fighting for his life?

Darth Thor
And Why was it too late?

xPRIMEx
Dooku realized he was fighting for his life BEFORE Anakin used his rage, and well before he had his hands cut off. It was too late because by Anakin was too powerful then, not because his hands were cut off. Dooku was simply outmatched.

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