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the comic version of darth vader.

go!

Vader, easily.

Force Choke.

wouldn't his field negate force attacks though?

No, because it only negates powerful attacks.

Alfred or Jarvis could strangle him to death.

Steven Seagal would massacre an army of Wundarrs

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
Steven Seagal would massacre an army of Wundarrs

Current, no less.

Originally posted by DeadpoolXXX
wouldn't his field negate force attacks though? The Force isn't some generic energy attack that is thrown at an opponent or w/e(unless you're using attacks like Force push, Force lightning, etc.) It is literally the energy field that surrounds/encompasses... Everything.

So all Vader has to do is constrict the Force around Aquarian's neck, and *poof*, he's strangled to death.

Originally posted by Galan007
The Force isn't some generic energy attack that is thrown at an opponent or w/e(unless you're using attacks like Force push, Force lightning, etc.) It is literally the energy field that surrounds/encompasses... Everything.

So all Vader has to do is constrict the Force around Aquarian's neck, and *poof*, he's strangled to death.


But that's what ki is.

DV can apparently use force choke from light-years away. Therefore it most likely an attack that does not travel through space but is instant. Could be wrong

On the other hand, the Ysalamiri are a proof that the Force can be nullified within a given region.

Originally posted by Magnon
On the other hand, the Ysalamiri are a proof that the Force can be nullified within a given region.

Yes, but by a totally different mechanism. The Aquarian's null field only negates energy above a certain level - not ALL heat is negated, otherwise he'd freeze; not all light, otherwise he'd be blind; not ALL sound, otherwise he'd be deaf etc etc.

So if he just stood there, Aunt May could walk up to him and burn him with a candle, but not a flamethrower (as an example; the energy level of a candle may well be too high). Penguin could walk up to him and strangle him, but would be unable to punch him. Think of the field as similar to Dune's Holtzman shields - to bypass it, you need to go slow on the attack.

Aquarian HAS been strangled before (and his field was still operative even when unconscious) so Vader doing a choke would be within reason, especially if Aquarian is just standing there.

A lightsabre would be useless, as would throwing things at him or force lightning, however.

Who says he'd be able to exert enough pressure to do more then annoy him? Those metal tentacles couldn't even maintain a grip. And it's not like a force choke is super casual to do, Vader seems to put a lot more focus behind it then say, Obi-Wan doing the old Jedi mind trick.

Originally posted by Galan007
The Force isn't some generic energy attack that is thrown at an opponent or w/e(unless you're using attacks like Force push, Force lightning, etc.) It is literally the energy field that surrounds/encompasses... Everything.

So all Vader has to do is constrict the Force around Aquarian's neck, and *poof*, he's strangled to death. isn't chi very like the force? Isn't that where Lucy's got his idea for the force?

Originally posted by cdtm
And it's not like a force choke is super casual to do, Vader seems to put a lot more focus behind it then say, Obi-Wan doing the old Jedi mind trick. It's extremely casual for Vader to do.

Originally posted by h1a8
DV can apparently use force choke from light-years away. Therefore it most likely an attack that does not travel through space but is instant. Could be wrong You're not wrong.

When Vader uses the choke, he isn't sending a TK wave hurling at his opponent's neck or w/e. He is precisely manipulating/constricting the Force around their trachea.

Originally posted by Galan007
It's extremely casual for Vader to do.


He almost always holds out his hand and visably puts deliberate effort into it.


Which implies it takes more force then a kitten could put out.

Originally posted by Old Man Whirly!
isn't chi very like the force? Isn't that where Lucy's got his idea for the force?

Similar, yes. Though there are many different beliefs of how qi/chi/ki works, exactly.

He was obviously also inspired by the Voice from Dune, too.

Originally posted by cdtm
He almost always holds out his hand and visably puts deliberate effort into it.


Which implies it takes more force then a kitten could put out.
Nope
https://ibb.co/QbCBk7K

Originally posted by cdtm
He almost always holds out his hand and visably puts deliberate effort into it.


Which implies it takes more force then a kitten could put out. The hand gesture thing is primarily inserted for visual purposes -- so that we, the audience, know what ability he's using... He doesn't need to use hand gestures at all, though:
https://i.imgur.com/4pLDLqX.mp4

https://ibb.co/f1LdmgL
https://ibb.co/sjscLyS


That said, even if Vader *had* to use hand gestures to preform the choke, that certainly doesn't mean he's putting some great deal of effort into it:
https://ibb.co/XLqgj34

https://ibb.co/TbrYySR

https://ibb.co/wd3s8xx

https://ibb.co/khtd2Gd

...And loads of other examples. As abilities go, Vader's choke is about as casual as it gets.

Todd never clicks on KMC links, Galan.

Aikido hold worked fine on Wundarr, so it doesn't matter if Vader uses gestures or not.

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
Todd never clicks on KMC links, Galan.

Aikido hold worked fine on Wundarr, so it doesn't matter if Vader uses gestures or not.


Akido literally uses no power at all though.


Contrast with the metal arms that couldn't even keep enough grip on two fleshy's.


Since the force isn't aikido, it's a fair question to ask whether he can grip a throat any more then he could force push him away.

Cap needed to lift his arm, grab Aquarian's thumb and hold it in place.

That's some tremendous effort, compared to a mere gesture.

You trolled yourself into a corner, Galan is PMing globals now, so they can take you out like trash you are.

Originally posted by cdtm
Akido literally uses no power at all though.


Contrast with the metal arms that couldn't even keep enough grip on two fleshy's.


Since the force isn't aikido, it's a fair question to ask whether he can grip a throat any more then he could force push him away. When Vader chokes someone, he is literally just compelling the Force around his target's trachea to constrict. I don't know how much more "low energy" it gets.

Originally posted by Galan007
The hand gesture thing is primarily inserted for visual purposes -- so that we, the audience, know what ability he's using... He doesn't need to use hand gestures at all, though:
https://i.imgur.com/4pLDLqX.mp4

https://ibb.co/f1LdmgL
https://ibb.co/sjscLyS


That said, even if Vader *had* to use hand gestures to preform the choke, that certainly doesn't mean he's putting some great deal of effort into it:
https://ibb.co/XLqgj34

https://ibb.co/TbrYySR

https://ibb.co/wd3s8xx

https://ibb.co/khtd2Gd

...And loads of other examples. As abilities go, Vader's choke is about as casual as it gets.
Inconclusive. Vader needs to raise his hands, so Aquarian speed blitzes him

How would it work on suggestion?


Or loud noises like a Canary Cry?


Or Purple Man's suggestion?

Or misdirection?

i guess i'm just curious why aquarians field wouldnt be able to recognize the energy from vader's tk as a threat and cancel it out?

Because it doesn't just nullify threats. That's the misconception.

It nullifies energy above a certain level. Someone could burn him with a candle, as an example, but not a flamethrower. Aunt May could strangle him, as could Batman, but Batman can't punch him.

so how low does the energy need to be for the field to ignore it? because force attacks seem like a pretty considerable amount of energy manipulation.

Originally posted by DeadpoolXXX
so how low does the energy need to be for the field to ignore it? because force attacks seem like a pretty considerable amount of energy manipulation.

Low enough that he can be grabbed by say, Cap, or choked out by the Quantum Man. Low enough that he doesn't freeze to death (*some* heat can go through) low enough that he can hear (*some* sound gets through), low enough that he can see (*some* light gets through) etc etc.

I saw a Force choke as the same amount of energy as a normal choke with hands. Maybe if Aquarian had armour plating in his neck, which necessitated more energy to be applied, then a Force Choke would be negated.

Originally posted by DeadpoolXXX
so how low does the energy need to be for the field to ignore it? because force attacks seem like a pretty considerable amount of energy manipulation. Some Force attacks do require a significant expenditure of energy... Like when Vader TKs an AT-AT, or Palpatine Force Lightnings a Rebel fleet.

But as mentioned ad nauseam: Force chokes are different in that respect. All Vader is doing is precisely constricting the Force around his target's trachea. He can give them a light "harder daddy" squeeze(just enough to slowly strangle the target into unconsciousness)... Or he can end things right away, by completely constricting/crushing the trachea.

Either way, there isn't much energy being used. It's basically the difference between Vader slowly constricting the Force in a very small area, or rapidly constricting it.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
I saw a Force choke as the same amount of energy as a normal choke with hands. A few of Vader's victims have described being Force choked as akin to an invisible hand around their neck. So yeah, it at least feels similar from the target's POV.

so he's creating an invisible hand construct around their throat? why wouldnt the field register and block that?

That's what it feels like from the target's perspective. What Vader is really doing is influencing the Force directly around the circumference of their trachea, and constricting it.

It's more akin to a severe asthma attack: the trachea tightens more and more until the victim goes unconscious... If he wants you to die slowly, that is.

So if Aquarian's null-field can negate the energy of an asthma attack, then I guess it could negate Vader's choke. But since Aquarian wasn't an asthmatic afaik, I don't think any proof exists to support this(the fact that he was physically choked-out on panel notwithstanding.)

Originally posted by DeadpoolXXX
so he's creating an invisible hand construct around their throat? why wouldnt the field register and block that?

Because it's too loW for the field to negate

fair enough. aquarian and vader are so broken in forum fights.

Originally posted by DeadpoolXXX
so he's creating an invisible hand construct around their throat? why wouldnt the field register and block that?

Because Cap's aikido hold worked perfectly on Aquarian.

Vader is not going full savage like Windu did with Grievous in Legends (with Force Crush) --- Force Grip/Choke is more subtle (usually, that is, unless Vader is angered or wants to end things quickly with a neck snap), more precise; targets only the neck and throat area.

We still can't be sure of how it would really work, because Force doesn't exist in the MU and Wundarr is incredibly obscure, Saint is his only fan in the omniverse.

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
Because Cap's aikido hold worked perfectly on Aquarian.

Vader is not going full savage like Windu did with Grievous in Legends (with Force Crush) --- Force Grip/Choke is more subtle (usually, that is, unless Vader is angered or wants to end things quickly with a neck snap), more precise; targets only the neck and throat area.

We still can't be sure of how it would really work, because Force doesn't exist in the MU and Wundarr is incredibly obscure, Saint is his only fan in the omniverse.


Yep.

A shame, Wundarr's Null Field could be as fun as Speedball's kinetic field, which has been far more explored.

Speedball vs Wundarr would be the stuff of legends.

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
Because Cap's aikido hold worked perfectly on Aquarian.

Vader is not going full savage like Windu did with Grievous in Legends (with Force Crush) --- Force Grip/Choke is more subtle (usually, that is, unless Vader is angered or wants to end things quickly with a neck snap), more precise; targets only the neck and throat area.

We still can't be sure of how it would really work, because Force doesn't exist in the MU and Wundarr is incredibly obscure, Saint is his only fan in the omniverse.

It would absolutely work, and Wundarr would die.

Vader via Force Crush

Debatable. Cap is Cap, Ben Grimm likely couldn't muster enough force to strangle him.

Debatable. Cap is Cap, Ben Grimm likely couldn't muster enough force to strangle him.

Has his field failed to stop and attack that actually tried to kill him because it was too weak before? Plus who says Vader'a force hold would be registered as weak?

Originally posted by Genii96
Has his field failed to stop and attack that actually tried to kill him because it was too weak before? Plus who says Vader'a force hold would be registered as weak?

Yes.

https://i.postimg.cc/d0prH6Sp/Quasar04-013.jpg
https://i.postimg.cc/nLWBSxLn/Quasar04-014.jpg

He can be choked out.

As for the Force Hold being weak....I am saying it is weaker/equal to a chokehold, which works as seen.

Also, Marvel Zombies Deadpool managed to bite him:
https://i.postimg.cc/ZqQrF4P2/MZ3-1-Odororeo-DCP-010.jpg

He healed himself of it, though, something that no one else in the entire Marvel Zombies universe could do, though it took time. But the main point is, DP was able to bite him (note how his blade can't get through though).