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Home » Star Wars » Star Wars: Literature & Expanded Universe » How can a non force user duel with a force user?


How can a non force user duel with a force user?
Started by: Happy_Sith

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Happy_Sith
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Registered: Apr 2008
Location: United Kingdom


 

How can a non force user duel with a force user?

Makes little sense to me.

A Jedi has the ability to block a blaster bolt, and from the novels I get the impression that this sort of thing is second nature. Lots of blaster bolts may be difficult, but it would be uber lame to get killed by some street punk with a blaster.

Yet I was going over Drew's RoT and a non force using Twi'lek manages to out-duel an actual Jedi! I was shocked when I read it originally, and I have read nothing further that explains such an event.

Why does the force user not simply apply the technique that they use for blocking blaster bolts (very fast) to blocking a sword? Why do they not use the technique to exploit the non force user's defence?

Well, if they could they would, so I am asking for a description of the technique used for blocking blaster bolts.

Qui Gon claims that Jedi can see things before they happen, but is this true? Or is it a typical Jedi metaphor/lie?

Thanks.

Old Post Oct 18th, 2008 09:48 PM
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Fan Skywalker
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Re: How can a non force user duel with a force user?

quote: (post)
Originally posted by Happy_Sith
Makes little sense to me.

A Jedi has the ability to block a blaster bolt, and from the novels I get the impression that this sort of thing is second nature. Lots of blaster bolts may be difficult, but it would be uber lame to get killed by some street punk with a blaster.

Yet I was going over Drew's RoT and a non force using Twi'lek manages to out-duel an actual Jedi! I was shocked when I read it originally, and I have read nothing further that explains such an event.

Why does the force user not simply apply the technique that they use for blocking blaster bolts (very fast) to blocking a sword? Why do they not use the technique to exploit the non force user's defence?

Well, if they could they would, so I am asking for a description of the technique used for blocking blaster bolts.

Qui Gon claims that Jedi can see things before they happen, but is this true? Or is it a typical Jedi metaphor/lie?

Thanks.


I dont think Qui gon was lying the jedi have precognition they see whats going to happen before it happens and react accordingly so it makes them looks fast (am not sure jedi are fast enough to deflect blaster shots without the force). How a street punk non force user beats a jedi in a duel i dont know, we do know that a good fighter like the fetts can kill jedi so if this twi lek was really good it's possible.

Old Post Oct 18th, 2008 10:31 PM
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Enyalus
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Johun Othone just simply sucked. Hardcore.

However, exceptionally skilled killers can take down Jedi. See Jango Fett's fight with Obi-Wan in AOTC for more evidence.

Old Post Oct 18th, 2008 10:36 PM
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Happy_Sith
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Registered: Apr 2008
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Re: Re: How can a non force user duel with a force user?

quote: (post)
Originally posted by Fan Skywalker
I dont think Qui gon was lying the jedi have precognition they see whats going to happen before it happens and react accordingly so it makes them looks fast (am not sure jedi are fast enough to deflect blaster shots without the force). How a street punk non force user beats a jedi in a duel i dont know, we do know that a good fighter like the fetts can kill jedi so if this twi lek was really good it's possible.


Actually, the Jedi did win the duel in the end despite being out-fought for some of the fight, and the natural precognition should have made it easy for the Jedi.

Is there no answer in any Star Wars book?

It seems like a pretty big discrepancy.

Old Post Oct 18th, 2008 10:39 PM
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Happy_Sith
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Enyalus
Johun Othone just simply sucked. Hardcore.



I factored that in smile

Old Post Oct 18th, 2008 10:40 PM
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JayJohn85
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Registered: Oct 2008
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Poison and many other nasty non direct attacks....Kotor 2 good old atton killed plenty.


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Old Post Oct 18th, 2008 11:15 PM
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Happy_Sith
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Yes, assassins could take Jedi. I recall Atton explaining that to the Exile - said it was easier than some would think.

But my question is regarding the direct methods when the Jedi is on guard.


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Old Post Oct 18th, 2008 11:19 PM
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jaden101
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i believe Jango fett killed several jedi with his bare hands at Galidraan


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Old Post Oct 19th, 2008 12:06 AM
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Fan Skywalker
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Re: Re: Re: How can a non force user duel with a force user?

quote: (post)
Originally posted by Happy_Sith
Actually, the Jedi did win the duel in the end despite being out-fought for some of the fight, and the natural precognition should have made it easy for the Jedi.

Is there no answer in any Star Wars book?

It seems like a pretty big discrepancy.


Seems the authors the only ones to blame for these jedi's stupid loses.

Old Post Oct 19th, 2008 12:06 AM
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Happy_Sith
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Registered: Apr 2008
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On a similar note, I am also curious about Grievous.

I have read LOE and Dark Rendezvous as well as watching some of the Clone War Cartoons, but I still think that a Jedi - any Jedi - should defeat him with the force.

I know if I had these abilities Grievous would be scrap in seconds. No lightsaber nonsense.

Science Fantasy it may be, but my goodness... the whole concept of GG is awful!


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Old Post Oct 19th, 2008 02:04 AM
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truejedi
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Registered: Oct 2005
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Happy_Sith
On a similar note, I am also curious about Grievous.

I have read LOE and Dark Rendezvous as well as watching some of the Clone War Cartoons, but I still think that a Jedi - any Jedi - should defeat him with the force.

I know if I had these abilities Grievous would be scrap in seconds. No lightsaber nonsense.

Science Fantasy it may be, but my goodness... the whole concept of GG is awful!


i agree with this one completely. i was reading the beginning of this thread, and i was going to mention grievous, and how it makes absolutely NO SENSE that he killed four jedi with two sabers in LOE. But You already made my point for me. It just doesn't make sense.

Also: speaking of bounty hunters and such: from Jedi Twilight:

"No ordinary humanoid could contend with a jedi one on one and expect to win. Even a true teras kasi adept, harnessing his own inner enrgy and drawing on decades of honed skill, could hope , at best for a draw, and there weren't more than a handful of those in the galaxy."

that's pretty good indication that the fetts had to be flukes.

Old Post Oct 19th, 2008 05:11 AM
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Lord Lucien
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Perception and motor skills as we know them only go so far in humans, but how about other species? Even humans whose brains are able to acquire more skills, move the body faster, learn easier etc. A Jedi can only block so much, parry so many times. Their bodies get tired too. And it's abundently clear that they can only "forsee" so much and so far. Otherwise any Jedi would be able to block everything, always. They're more capable beings, not Gods. They can be overwhelmed and out-matched by another more capable, more skilled opponent.


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Old Post Oct 19th, 2008 05:22 AM
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truejedi
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good point. a jedi of one species shouldn't be beaten by a non-force user of that same species, but not necessarily true of inter-species duels.

Old Post Oct 19th, 2008 05:23 AM
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Lord Lucien
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Again though, depending on the indiviudal's connection to the Force and their amount of training compared to the training and abilities of the opponent.


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Old Post Oct 19th, 2008 05:53 AM
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Enyalus
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In Path of Destruction it's noted that an entire battalion of soldiers isn't worth one trained Sith Lord.

And for the most part, the Sith and Jedi of the era seemed pretty "meh."

Old Post Oct 19th, 2008 06:13 AM
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REXXXX
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I usually assume that statements about Jedi being invincible against the average being is referring to fully trained Jedi and that the normal folk are not particularly skilled.

Jango Fett seems to be an exception, as are a few others in the Star Wars universe.


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Old Post Oct 19th, 2008 07:25 AM
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Enyalus
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Captain REX
Jango Fett seems to be an exception, as are a few others in the Star Wars universe.


...Bane would throw a moon on him. confused

Old Post Oct 19th, 2008 07:32 AM
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REXXXX
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...of course.


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Old Post Oct 19th, 2008 07:40 AM
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Happy_Sith
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Registered: Apr 2008
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Lucien A
Perception and motor skills as we know them only go so far in humans, but how about other species? Even humans whose brains are able to acquire more skills, move the body faster, learn easier etc. A Jedi can only block so much, parry so many times. Their bodies get tired too. And it's abundently clear that they can only "forsee" so much and so far. Otherwise any Jedi would be able to block everything, always. They're more capable beings, not Gods. They can be overwhelmed and out-matched by another more capable, more skilled opponent.


Your point about other species is well taken. I have considered it myself often enough when playing through a game or reading one of the novels.

As for Jedi not being God like, I would say that they actually should appear God like, with the ability to easily block blaster bolts.

I suppose games like KOTOR fuel the idea that non-Jedi (Mandalorians) can compete against a Jedi, even if there is no specific Canon example of, say, a Jedi being out dueled by non force enhanced skill.

Meh, most of the EU I have been exposed to comes before ROTJ - I am not too fond of the storyline after it. I have heard odd rumors (bounty hunters dueling Vader, for example) but have not bothered to follow them up.

Old Post Oct 19th, 2008 01:31 PM
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Happy_Sith
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Enyalus
In Path of Destruction it's noted that an entire battalion of soldiers isn't worth one trained Sith Lord.

And for the most part, the Sith and Jedi of the era seemed pretty "meh."


I recall such a statement and it seemed to be fueled by emotion. I did not take it literally even if the speaker actually meant it.

Old Post Oct 19th, 2008 01:34 PM
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