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Kylo and Rey question
Started by: The Lost

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Gehenna
Sorgo

Registered: Feb 2015
Location: Yet to be found


 

Kylo and Rey question

Now, I don't think it's crazy to suggest Kylo and Rey are equals in force power (I'm not sure about actual ability in the force, though) but is there anyone that considers Rey on par with Kylo in terms of lightsaber skill?

I consider Kylo to be the better and more experienced LS duelist but, for those that disagree or think Rey is better, I'd like to know why you do.


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Old Post Jan 4th, 2018 04:05 PM
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Zenwolf
Senior Member

Registered: Dec 2013
Location: United States


 

Kylo is clearly the more and better experienced lightsaber user, I can't imagine self training with a staff(...even if it somehow translates to other melee weapons...) puts = to someone who had instruction from a Jedi Master who was trained by 2 other Jedi Masters + having who knows what else in terms of experience.

I mean if it was that easy, then I really see no point of there being instructors for anything really.

Kylo clearly has more accolades and more reason to be the better duelist at the least, I'd also say more mastery of The Force even if raw power is equal because The Force wills it.


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Last edited by Zenwolf on Jan 4th, 2018 at 04:12 PM

Old Post Jan 4th, 2018 04:10 PM
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Gehenna
Sorgo

Registered: Feb 2015
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The argument I seem to see the most is that Kylo is potentially worse because of his TFA Rey duel loss but there was a lot going into that, including injury. For some reason, a lot of people aren't treating the Bowcaster shot with as much respect. This is a weapon that sent people flying like 5-7 feet back during the film (I understand that shot distance is a factor here but this still brought Ren to kneel after the shot) and Ren basically took that shot, was bleeding, hitting his wound, and was previously injured by Finn whilst toying with him.

Rey had to legitimately tap into what seemed like the depths of her raw force power to get an advantage over Ren after spending the majority of the fight on the defensive. Also, in TLJ, Ren seems to be more capable when dealing with the Praetorians. Correct me if I'm wrong, but the Praetorians all seem to have similar combat capability, yet Rey killed one and killed one more after struggling with him. Ren was able to murder three of them in open combat and struggled with the last only after losing his lightsaber.


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Old Post Jan 4th, 2018 04:22 PM
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Nephthys
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They did about as well against the Praetorians imo. Any difference would be negligible at best.


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Old Post Jan 4th, 2018 04:25 PM
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Zenwolf
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Registered: Dec 2013
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by The Lost
The argument I seem to see the most is that Kylo is potentially worse because of his TFA Rey duel loss but there was a lot going into that, including injury. For some reason, a lot of people aren't treating the Bowcaster shot with as much respect. This is a weapon that sent people flying like 5-7 feet back during the film (I understand that shot distance is a factor here but this still brought Ren to kneel after the shot) and Ren basically took that shot, was bleeding, hitting his wound, and was previously injured by Finn whilst toying with him.

Rey had to legitimately tap into what seemed like the depths of her raw force power to get an advantage over Ren after spending the majority of the fight on the defensive. Also, in TLJ, Ren seems to be more capable when dealing with the Praetorians. Correct me if I'm wrong, but the Praetorians all seem to have similar combat capability, yet Rey killed one and killed one more after struggling with him. Ren was able to murder three of them in open combat and struggled with the last only after losing his lightsaber.


Well Chewie's bowcaster was varying in ability, sometimes it sent guys flying, the other times when they hit the trooper just dropped.

I think the bowcaster is more powerful than the standard blaster even in the New Canon, so even with not going by the higher showings, that's still an impressive feat for Kylo(though he did also have armor I believe around the section hit) regardless.

I recall Rey running more than anything, but yeah she did and Kylo did seem more capable compared to Rey in the Guard fight(he was also duel wielding at one point), so that should make it clear he is the better melee combatant for sure.


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Old Post Jan 4th, 2018 04:28 PM
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Gehenna
Sorgo

Registered: Feb 2015
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Nephthys
They did about as well against the Praetorians imo. Any difference would be negligible at best.


What makes you think this? Could you explain?


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Old Post Jan 4th, 2018 04:36 PM
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Gehenna
Sorgo

Registered: Feb 2015
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Zenwolf
Well Chewie's bowcaster was varying in ability, sometimes it sent guys flying, the other times when they hit the trooper just dropped.


This is true, which I thought was strange. I mean, the troopers were running toward Chewie (one coming down stairs) and one that was stationary was still sent back, although not as much as earlier. Maybe the bowcaster has strength settings I don't know about? Who really knows.

quote:
I think the bowcaster is more powerful than the standard blaster even in the New Canon, so even with not going by the higher showings, that's still an impressive feat for Kylo(though he did also have armor I believe around the section hit) regardless.


Oh yeah. I'd agree.

Also, I believe Kylo was hit where there was just robes (unless he had some plating underneath I did not know about). He is wearing a belt but he is not shot in that belt. Just slightly above it on his left side. You can see it when Kylo encounters Rey and Finn in the snow after killing his father (You see the hole above that belt or hard wrap around his waist and he even punches that area).

quote:
I recall Rey running more than anything, but yeah she did and Kylo did seem more capable compared to Rey in the Guard fight(he was also duel wielding at one point), so that should make it clear he is the better melee combatant for sure.


I'd agree.


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Old Post Jan 4th, 2018 05:22 PM
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Stigma
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Registered: Jul 2013
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Rey is hotter.

Old Post Jan 4th, 2018 05:25 PM
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Gehenna
Sorgo

Registered: Feb 2015
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Stigma
Rey is hotter.


That ain't even a debate.

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Old Post Jan 4th, 2018 05:30 PM
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Rebel95
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Registered: Mar 2008
Location: US


 

quote: (post)
Originally posted by The Lost
The argument I seem to see the most is that Kylo is potentially worse because of his TFA Rey duel loss but there was a lot going into that, including injury. For some reason, a lot of people aren't treating the Bowcaster shot with as much respect. This is a weapon that sent people flying like 5-7 feet back during the film (I understand that shot distance is a factor here but this still brought Ren to kneel after the shot) and Ren basically took that shot, was bleeding, hitting his wound, and was previously injured by Finn whilst toying with him.

Rey had to legitimately tap into what seemed like the depths of her raw force power to get an advantage over Ren after spending the majority of the fight on the defensive. Also, in TLJ, Ren seems to be more capable when dealing with the Praetorians. Correct me if I'm wrong, but the Praetorians all seem to have similar combat capability, yet Rey killed one and killed one more after struggling with him. Ren was able to murder three of them in open combat and struggled with the last only after losing his lightsaber.

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Old Post Jan 4th, 2018 07:36 PM
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Nephthys
The Gr8est!!!!!!!!

Registered: Dec 2007
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by The Lost
What makes you think this? Could you explain?


Obviously I don't have the opportunity to do a blow by blow analysis but they seemed to do about equalled well. The idea that Kylo is better because he fought more of them at once ignores that Rey simply took her opponents out faster imo.


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Old Post Jan 4th, 2018 07:41 PM
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Gehenna
Sorgo

Registered: Feb 2015
Location: Yet to be found


 

quote:
Obviously I don't have the opportunity to do a blow by blow analysis but they seemed to do about equalled well.


I don't share that impression.

Okay, so I just revisited it and I was initially incorrect. Rey actually kills a total of 3 and Kylo kills a total of 5 (Kylo and Rey kill one each during the beginning when they are fighting back-to-back that I had forgot about. There is a total of 8 Praetorian guards.)

quote:
The idea that Kylo is better because he fought more of them at once ignores that Rey simply took her opponents out faster imo.


After re-watching the fight scene just now, that's definitely false. Rey is fighting the one dual-wielding dagger-like weapon guard and, in the time she is facing that single guard, Kylo kills three guards (stabs the first one through the chest, decapitates the next one, and stabs the last one in the side when he's using his LS and a Praetorian weapon and gets him to the ground where he murders him. After that, he loses his saber and the guard grabs him) so I'm not sure how Rey is taking out her opponents faster.

When they are both struggling with their attackers who grapple them, that also happens roughly around the same time.


Also, the number of guards matter in this context for comparison. Like I said, we have no reason to believe that the Praetorian guards aren't similarly skilled and Kylo killed three whilst he took on four of them in the middle of when Rey was struggling to defeat just one. I might also add that Rey wounds the dual-wielding attacker that she struggles with and is also wounded in the arm by that fighter after he takes advantage of an opening.


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Last edited by Gehenna on Jan 4th, 2018 at 08:54 PM

Old Post Jan 4th, 2018 08:52 PM
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