Kas'im is the better duellist, but I think Galen is good enough to hold his own if it comes to blade-to-blade. Plus he's a lot more powerful with the Force. So I'd say he wins.
Galen takes the Force contest for obvious reasons, and for those same reasons I hope that it is equally obvious that Kas'im takes sabers. The fight that matters most, the 'all out' portion of the contest, is also going to Kas'im. He has shown the ability to protect himself against a superior Force user (Bane) and is among the best swordsmen featured in the series.
Kas'im would have a hard time dealing with Marek's Force powers. From what I have seen of the game though, the majority of Starkiller's attacks take the form of ridiculously powerful TK and Force lightning. Force lightning can be defended against, and as a Sith Lord Kas'im would have a familiar understanding of the technique. This leaves Marek's utterly ridiculous (I said that already didn't I?) TK. Kas'im has shown defense against TK. He protected himself from an attack by Bane that was described as being a "massive shock wave [that] shook the very foundations of the great Rakatan Temple. The concussive blast had enough power to shatter every bone in Kas'im's body and pulverize his flesh into a mass of pulpy liquid." PoD 186. Kas'im threw up a shield 'at the last possible instant.' His Force defense was enough to protect against Bane (albeit without Orbalisks) and I feel that it would be enough to protect against Marek, as he could tank a full out TK assault with a spur of the moment defense.
Kas'im has contended with a high level combatant who eclipsed him in mastery/power in the Force, yet won the duel. (That he died is irrelevant, as it was from atmospheric factors and not by Bane's direct attack.) His mastery of the blade and apparent ability to cope with strong Force attacks suggest that he would be able to keep up with Marek. I'd give the all out portion to Kas'im 6/10 times.
Kas'im only defended against a fraction of Bane's attack; an Umbaran shadow guard replicates the feat in RoT, against an older and more powerful Bane:
The energy that wasn't blocked by the strongest of the guards went and bowled over the other four; with Kas'im, the energy that wasn't blocked blew apart the foundations of the temple. If Kas'im had managed to actually contain all of the energy that was directed at him and the structure, it would be far more impressive.
It is basically the same objection, so I see no need to respond to each individually:
As far as I know, Force protection simply does not work like that. I don't know of a single case of Force defense in which the victim's defense protects the surrounding area; there is always collateral damage. That Kas'im could block a blast that would 'shatter every bone in Kas'im's body and pulverize his flesh into a mass of pulpy liquid' speaks highly of his combat defense. It seems like this would be enough to protect against Marek.
Re: Umbaran Shadow Assasins:
Bane let off a Force Wave with no warning or preparation. There is nothing to suggest that it was as powerful as an attack that charged up during the pretentious speech that Kas'im gave at the end of their duel.
In general:
Force attacks w/prep time > Force attacks w/o prep time.
Generally speaking, the aggressor doesn't usually attack the environment as Bane did. If we limit this to telekinesis, and then further limit it to attacks were actually defended against, I can come up with the following examples off the top of my head:
1.) Obi-Wan vs. Anakin (RotS): The Force-push contest ended with both of them being hurled at least a dozen meters away from the focal point of the energy. They are surrounded by the corpses of slaughtered Separatist leaders and the remains of dismantled droids. No noted collateral damage.
2.) Raynar Thul vs. Luke (DN: TSW): Raynar Thul attacks Luke with the combined Force-potential of every Force-sensitive member of an entire colony. Luke blocks it. They are surrounded by a ten meter-high pile of Killik corpses and destroyed droids, as well as standing "Bugcruncher" droids. No noted collateral damage.
3.) Asajj Ventress vs. Anakin (CWC): Ventress attempts to Force-push Skywalker away while he is charging up the stairs at her; he simply runs through the attack, with the only effect being that his shirt is torn into tatters. No noted collateral damage.
I could list at least a dozen instances where the attack isn't defended against and there is still no collateral damage, which would indicate that the attack is directed solely at the target.
Doubtful. Marek's lightning overloaded an AT-AT, and Darth Vader couldn't fully defend himself against the young man's telekinesis.
A valid point, but keep in mind that the Force Wave Bane used against the Shadow Assasins was during RoT. At that point he was much more experienced and powerful than during his fight with Kas'im and he wasn't exhausted from a gruelling battle.
We have to take into consideration of few aspects of the fight - was Kas'im a great melee fighter? As an assasin, Starkiller would be trained in the fighting arts - probably something similar to teras kasi. Kas'im is superb with the lightsaber and Starkiller was tutored in Shien. From the game (I still haven't read the book), Starkiller's Force push and FL were incredibly strong. He ripped through Mariss Brood's & Shak Ti's Force shields. As it is stated, Starkiller used the Force unlike any other Force user. Vader taught him and literally "unleashed" him.
On to the battle - Kas'im would quickly recognize that he was the better lightsaber artist, but Starkiller's fighting style would unnerve him. This is the guy (Starkiller) who kept coming after Vader and won so it is safe to assume that he would employ the same tactics.
__________________ "Great men are forged in fire. It is the privilege of lesser men to light the flame . . . whatever the cost"
About that, I once read a post by someone who claimed that Galen's fighting style was especially effective against double-bladed sabres. Does anyone have any idea if this is accurate?
Not sure, but he did outfight and overpower Marris Brood with the Force. But before the brawl, he killed a Bull Rancor. And she did use two lightsabers.
__________________ "Great men are forged in fire. It is the privilege of lesser men to light the flame . . . whatever the cost"
Who did even he even faced that used a double bladed saber? The only thing I could think of is PROXY mimicking Darth Maul.
I'm going completely off topic here but, what is with all the newbie posters here and putting senior member under their names when they don't even have over 200 posts? Dammit people use some common sense, if you haven't been at KMC for a full year and don't have a 1000(s) of posts then your not a senior member. That's my mindless rant for the day.
Last edited by Elite Hunter on Jan 4th, 2009 at 01:34 AM
If thats the case I'll be a senoit member in about six months. By the way, wasn't Galen Marek able to hold off against Paply's lightning? His lightning is far more powerful than Bane's powers and, even if Palpatine isn't using any effort, is still pretty impressive considering that Starkiller hadn't much training compared to Kas'im and Bane, and from what I've seen from my TFU game, Galen has very powerful Force capacity. But he is greatly lacking in lightsaber skills, as he had to resort to a particularly aggressive use of the force to clip his opponents up the ass.
__________________ 'Say Hello to the Bad Guy'- Razor Ramon
Elite, I don't know how many posts I have on here, but it was KMC who gave me that status. Don't know why either. How do you contact them about it? I don't know if you're ranting at me though.
Anyway, Maul used Juyo as his primary lightsaber technique. I'm not sure how well Shien would be able to defend against a double blade. Plus Starkiller's unorthodox way of handling his lightsaber might be a disadvantage.
__________________ "Great men are forged in fire. It is the privilege of lesser men to light the flame . . . whatever the cost"
Kas'im knows every combination in every form and has a counter to each sequence. Starkiller is ruined if it comes down to sabers.
His powers are what will determine the contest. I don't think that Marek's TK is >>>>>>(times a lot) than Bane's, even if it is more powerful.
Wait, what?
Can you explain why Starkiller's fighting style would 'unnerve' Kas'im? Keep in mind that Kas'im had memorized every combo and response in every form. (Starkiller didn't know Vaapad, so they are even.) On top of that, how is persistence off putting? Kas'im wouldn't expect Marek to quit, so his refusal to give up is largely irrelevant.
Jan 3rd, 2009 06:28 PM
That's my mindless rant for the day.
