Before your thread gets closed specify where the fight takes place. We are also to assume that this is standard Fallen and standard Optimus Prime: no super power form for Prime, right?
'08 Hulk would lose. '05 Hulk, which tanked a nuke, would rip the Crybertronians, who were harmed by 50. caliber bullets and RPG's, in half.
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"The Daemon lied with every breath. It could not help itself but to deceive and dismay, to riddle and ruin. The more we conversed, the closer I drew to one singularly ineluctable fact: I would gain no wisdom here."
Hang on, the only this they got messed up with were Sabot rounds. Not necessarily regular arms fire.
As impressive as 2005 Hulk's feats were, I believe them to be neutralised here, as The Fallen would just TK him off of the floor whilst Prime went to work, again, or would send Hulk skyward to orbit.
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"Van Zan is the Pinocchio of feces." - Lestov16
Last edited by Sadako of Girth on Jan 6th, 2011 at 10:25 AM
Well, the feats are inconsistent, which is a bit homo.
In the first film, Blackout single handedly took out an army base. It was also shown that 'normal' arms didn't do jack (including .50 cal) and they needed 'high heat sabot rounds' to do any real damage as it was implied as their particular weakness.
In Transformers 2 though, all this was kind of muddled up as Cybertronians were being damaged by all sorts of lesser weapons I believe (could be wrong).
"Sabot rounds" are not "special", don't let the movie fool you. They're basically just armor piercing, stuff you'd use to take out enemy armor. That's it. It's not like they're some sort of futuristic high tech special rounds or some crap. People use them in hunting rifles.
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"The Daemon lied with every breath. It could not help itself but to deceive and dismay, to riddle and ruin. The more we conversed, the closer I drew to one singularly ineluctable fact: I would gain no wisdom here."
Last edited by Tzeentch on Jan 6th, 2011 at 10:55 AM
Yes, we've already discussed this in long detail. I don't know if it was with you or DDM.
Sabot rounds aren't special, neither are HEAT rounds, but the combination of the two actually don't exist. So it is special and 'futuristic high tech' in a way.
Anyway, it was implied to be their particular weakness, kinda like kryptonite.
Well, obviously not since they've been destroyed by other forms of ammunition. It's their "kryptonite" in the same way that a sabot or HEAT round would be the "kryptonite" of a tank.
It's non-sequential though really. Point is that '03 Hulk has tanked much more powerful things than sabot rounds and can easily dish out much more damage than a heat or sabot round, ergo he'd crush any transformer.
That's also non-sequential though I guess, considering this isnt '03 Hulk.
__________________
"The Daemon lied with every breath. It could not help itself but to deceive and dismay, to riddle and ruin. The more we conversed, the closer I drew to one singularly ineluctable fact: I would gain no wisdom here."
Last edited by Tzeentch on Jan 6th, 2011 at 11:20 AM
Not in the first film, which as the point I was making.
Ah, but its not a sabot or a HEAT round. Its a "High HEAT SABOT round", which doesn't exist.
Its also not accurate to say that its the 'kryptonite' of a tank (in effect, attempting to ignore the fact that it was THE particular weapon they needed to harm the Cybertronians, (again in the first film)) since a tank can be destroyed by many other things: land mines, sabots, HEAT rounds, missiles, misc explosives etc etc.
Kryptonite implies a unique and specific weakness.
Why are you proscribing purely to the first film at all? One of the people in this thread didn't even exist in the first film.
That aside, that's a limitless fallacy. It was never stated nor implied that the only thing that could harm a transformer is a sabot or heat round.
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"The Daemon lied with every breath. It could not help itself but to deceive and dismay, to riddle and ruin. The more we conversed, the closer I drew to one singularly ineluctable fact: I would gain no wisdom here."
Actually, I said their feats are inconsistent. I pointed out what happened in both films. You chose to challenge my points/feats I made for the first film, and I've done my best to explain them.
Not really. I'm sure sufficient force such as from a nuke would take them out. Thats overkill, but just an example.
Again, a Superman analogy (lol):
While kryptonite is well known to be one of Superman's few weaknesses, it is not a limitless fallacy. As you may well know, he was killed by Doomsday via brute strength.
Having a weakness does not imply you are invulnerable otherwise.
Well regardless of what the rounds were called, the way it was explained was it was the high heat involved with the particular rounds being used being so high that the TFs couldn't deal with it.
But yes, the consistancy in the Bay movies is dire.