Registered: Apr 2006
Location: Konoha Jedi Academy
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Ood was not that bad considering he contended with Kun but on the other hand Vodo Might have done way better in his fight against Kun if he had a lightsaber and if kun did not have his double-bladed. Arca sucks he got pwned by a droid he should have sensed that. Thon was Good and I would rate him #2.
What is this list? How the hell does Odan go above Vodo? Explanation please, because I seem to remember Odan "being more of a scholar than a fighter", reading bedtime stories to younglings and Vodo actually training students for some 600 odd years, while doing something important like let's say...training the most powerful force of the era, Exar Kun.
Odan's done some impressive things (his BM, stripping of the Force, fighting Sith, etc.), but really - I'd doubt he'd stand up to Kun (even in his prime) as well as Vodo did; albeit Vodo didn't do good, Odan just wouldn't be able to put up such a fight.
On top of that, Odan isn't physically as strong as Kun - and I doubt he'd be able to break Vodo's stick if he conjured it up, seeing as how it's "more powerful than Exar Kun's lightsaber!".
__________________
"The ability to speak does not make you intelligent." - Sagacious Jedi Master Qui-Gon Jinn.
Might aswell not include any of thise guys.A young mod by the name of Ushgarak,who was an enemie of theirs,even when he was a mod,helped the other Mods hunt down and destroy the Antedilluvians.He didn't betray or murder any of them,he just PWNed them.Now the Antedilluvians are all but extinct.
Hold up. It's my opinion. In his prime when he was likely strong and agile, discovering ancient forgotten force techniques such as Battle Meditation and the Force Blocking technique and battling ancient sith, he was likely a total badass. And with knowledge comes great power.
And one other thing. Who says that you need to break Vodo's stick to defeat him? Why not just outduel him? And again, I'd like to repeat, it's my opinion, so please don't jump on my ass when you can't even disprove said opinion.
I never said it was otherwise, I just asked for an explanation.
Not really, he was never a real fighter. Most of the way Ooroo describes him, the way Odan himself describes himself, and the way we see him at his death pretty much supports that. And he was never shown to be strong physically. Maybe strong in the Force, no doubt about that.
Ancient forgotten techniques? What the hell? Battle Meditation cannot save you in a one on one bout. And Vodo knows the Force blocking technique too apparently.
Yes, and Odan at age 1,000 was tooled with a swipe of the hand by Exar Kun. Odan who had been studying for a thousand years, and had an influx of knowledge. Odan basically was knowledge, however, it definitely didn't increase his power tenfold.
No one? Just a single point that adds to a list of disadvantages for Odan.
Odan likely - from what we know about him - would not be able to stand up to someone like Vodo. Proof that Odan is good with a lightsaber? In TOTJ he barely even used it, it was always his BM that saved the day.
And again, please show me where Odan is said to be good with a lightsaber.
Really? Basically, all your esteemed opinion was just speculation. "He stripped Sith of the Force, so he must be a good fighter", "He must've been a badass because he could use Battle Meditation", or "In his prime he was most likely strong and agile" with no given reasons to support your claims.
Let's ignore the facts like he's never been physically strong (as much is obvious), he's always been more of a bookworm and a savant, and he's never displayed any real skills with a lightsaber. You can add he got killed by Exar quite easily too, even with all that supreme knowledge. While Vodo was busy training people for 600 years, so you know he was practicing his skills with that, and actually can withstand Exar Kun for more than two seconds.
I have no doubt Odan was a capable fighter, but when comparing him to Vodo - I'd hardly put him over in combat.
__________________
"The ability to speak does not make you intelligent." - Sagacious Jedi Master Qui-Gon Jinn.
Last edited by Advent on Jul 15th, 2006 at 02:58 PM
Your words were 'what the hell', which was quite an aggresive reply. If we were in a debate, I would understand, but I was just listing my opinion with no intention of starting a debate.
Actually, GAOTS and FOTSE makes it clear that Odan was going to drop his studies (to a degree) and become more of an active warrior. It was clearly Master Ooroo's wish, and when he died I wouldn't be surprised if Odan would have taken on a new approach to the jedi way. There is also the fact that Odan is seen on the front of one of the comics with his saber ignited, battling the sith.
Yes, ancient forgotten techniques, like Battle mediation and likely many other techniques such as stripping one of the force. And here's something from the 'Power of the Jedi Sourcebook':
'Odan-Urr - Keeper of antiquities. The teachings of Odan-Urr formed a foundation of the jedi code. He spent much of his time studying ancient texts and artifacts and meditating on the force. Master Odan-Urr lived for many centuries during which time he poured over manuscripts at the library of Ossus and presided over jedi assemblies. His insights into the will of the living force were taught for millenia after his passing'
Battle Meditation and the force blocking technique were just examples. And it's logical to assume that Odan introduced the force blocking technique to the jedi order, and possibly could have taught Vodo himself. I mean he was the one to teach Nomi...
Well at this stage, he was extremely old and weak. He even says 'I am old and weak, and there is evil in the galaxy that I cannot stop'. This implies that he maybe believed himself to be the galaxy's ultimate protecter when he was young and in his prime. However he was now too old and could therefor not stop it.
Hold up. Make up yur mind. Is the stick an advantage for Vodo or Odan, because in your original post you implied that it was an advantage for Vodo, but now you directly stated it to be an advantage for Odan.
It seems that he must have fought the sith outside of what we see in the comic. He is even seen fighting the sith on the front cover of one of the comics.
This is never said. However, absence of proof is not proof of absence.
As I said, it was my opinion and yes, I was speculating. Most of my speculation however is based on logical deduction. And please don't twist my words.
I've already adressed these points.
And that's youropinion.
Last edited by Blax XXX on Jul 15th, 2006 at 04:07 PM
I'm an "aggressive replier", so don't take how I say things to heart. I'm quite explicit and sarcastic on these forums, so I do apologize for that.
Really? Care to show me where it makes it clear? And, really, active warrior? Lol, we still see his old ass studying books at the end of his life.
Heh, that kind of reminds me of what I saw last time. A scholar. New book, same Odan.
What are you talking about? Where is he "battling the Sith"? All I see is Odan with his lightsaber ignited, looking as if he's about to swing it and Odan just basically holding his lightsaber.
Oh wait! I forgot his Bruce Lee pose on the cover of GAOTS.
Anyways, Ooroo's wish? When Ooroo died, Odan's *wish* was "I wish I could have just stayed back with you, back in peaceful times...surrounded by my beloved books". Ooroo replies with "You will grow old and die among your precious books and scrolls". From that conversation it hardly implies Odan will become a battle heavy warrior, even Master Ooroo knows Odan's future - a bookworm.
Sadly, Vodo knows the Force blocking technique too. And Battle Meditation wouldn't be used against Vodo because while Odan would be sitting there, he'd receive a fine wooden stick shoved up his ass compliments of Vodo.
Wow. That sure shows me that Odan's a die hard warrior, or even a warrior for that matter. All it says is he studies most of his life, and meditated. Great job on proving Odan became a "more of an active warrior", and that he "took a new approach to the Jedi way". Seems he still did the same old, same old.
And this tells me...?
Oh please. The "I" was not italicized, or gave indication of what you are saying. Maybe if he would've said "...that even I cannot stop", then yeah - however, he said nothing of the sort, and it doesn't imply jack.
Vodo actually was confident enough in his skill to think he could stop Exar Kun, even being 600 years old.
ROFL. "Directly state it to be an advantage for Odan"? LMFAO.
I said directly that it "adds to the disadvantages for Odan". Let me go over that:
"Adds to" meaning just that combines,
"Disadvantages" meaning unfavorable condition, and
"For Odan" meaning just that.
Add three together and you get the outcome: that it adds to a list of disadvantages for Odan. In other words, it's a disadvantage for Odan, and obviously I've already stated it to be an advantage for Vodo.
Wow. You really need to get a grasp on reading comprehension, or just plain stop making sh*t up.
Tell me - what comic is that? Because on the covers of what I see Odan on, he's just holding his saber. And, of course he's battled Sith outside of what we see, he outright stated it. Regardless, he talks about stripping them of the Force, which doesn't imply he's actually can fight with a lightsaber.
However, you cannot just say that. Absence of proof is not proof of absence, but extraordinary claims demand extraordinary proof - ever heard that? I could just as well say that Jack and the Beanstalk existed once because there's no evidence to disprove it.
And yes, I think it's quite a claim to say Odan's a good lightsaber wielding warrior when there's no evidence to suggest such. At all.
I don't. I put in quotes what you basically were saying:
"In his prime when he was likely strong and agile, "
Most likely? Deducting that claim from what exactly?
"discovering ancient forgotten force techniques such as Battle Meditation and the Force Blocking technique and battling ancient sith, he was likely a total badass. "
Likely? Deducting that claim from what exactly?
All he ever says is that he used Force techniques to battle them really.
"Why not just outduel him?"
Deducting that question/assertion [that Odan can outduel him] from what exactly?
I didn't twist your words around, that's basically the message you sent. Your claims are not logically deducted. Do you even know what that is, if I may ask?
__________________
"The ability to speak does not make you intelligent." - Sagacious Jedi Master Qui-Gon Jinn.
Last edited by Advent on Jul 15th, 2006 at 05:10 PM
Well it really upset me, so try and be a tad bit more sensitive.
lol, not that I'm trying to back out of this or anything MOKOTO, but I really don't have the energy to start a debate with someone who replies in such big segments like you. If the source of the debate was something that I really firmly believed in, maybe, but it wasn't. If you want a debate, go here: http://www.killermovies.com/forums/...mp;pagenumber=2
He went there with the intent to stop Exar Kun, he was confident he could, not just because he was his master. Do you really think Vodo would fight for no reason? Because basically, if Vodo didn't think he could win - that's pretty much what he'd be doing.
__________________
"The ability to speak does not make you intelligent." - Sagacious Jedi Master Qui-Gon Jinn.
#1. Odan was a lover not a fighter
#2. Vodo designed his stick to be able to withstand a lightsaber(not sure why I even added the obvious)
#3. Kun designed his lightsaber to increase intensity using only 1 focus crystal or power cell or what not, so when he turned on the second side of his lightsaber it was as if he was using one(Again not sure why I even added this crap).
#4. I don't see how you interpret that Kun "tooled" Vodo based on comic book scans. For all you know it could have been a long fought battle and once he started using the double light saber, that became too much for Vodo to handle.
I would put Mace and Yoda above Vodo and probably on the level of Ulic..
Well, I'll stick my thoughts that Vodo got tooled. It really doesn't matter, but hey - that's what I infer from the comic.
Kun was being contemptuous with him and trying to commute Vodo to the Darkside. As soon as he realizes Vodo won't falter, he casually steps back, ignites the other end of his lightsaber, gives a quick sermon, and then cleaves Vodo in two effortlessly. All with one side of his lightsaber. Add to the fact he was practically grinning the whole fight, and that's how I see it. Not to mention how well he fared as a padawan against Vodo, but now he's a Sith Lord, mastered lightsaber combat, created a new lightsaber which hasn't been seen before, received Nadd's teachings, Sadow's amulet, Sadow's scrolls, and all that stuff.
__________________
"The ability to speak does not make you intelligent." - Sagacious Jedi Master Qui-Gon Jinn.
Jul 12th, 2006 04:33 AM
