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Can God create a rock so heavy that not even he can lift?
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Classic NES
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by masterbruce

however, once you're not omnipotent, you can no longer become omnipotent.

Whwere are these extra conditions coming from?

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Sep 9th, 2007 02:42 AM

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Starscream M
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Sandai Kitetsu
Whwere are these extra conditions coming from?

it's not an extra condition, it's logic

an inomnipotent (limited) being can not make himself omnipotent (limitless)

however, an omnipotent being can make himself inomnipotent

its common sense really

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Sep 9th, 2007 02:44 AM

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Classic NES
Balloooooooooooooon

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quote: (post)
Originally posted by masterbruce
it's not an extra condition, it's logic

Omnipotentence is a supra logical concept, my friend.

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Sep 9th, 2007 02:45 AM

Starscream M
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Sandai Kitetsu
Omnipotentence is a supra logical concept, my friend.

accepting that, I still don't see any flaws with my reasoning of how god can create an unliftable rock just by losing his omnipotence

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Sep 9th, 2007 02:46 AM

Smurph
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by masterbruce
omnipotent = can do anything

therefore, an omnipotent being can become not omnipotent.

however, once you're not omnipotent, you can no longer become omnipotent.

Are you seriously making the implication that someone who can do anything would have to make a sacrifice to overcome a simple paradox?

Supra logical... it's ineffable.

Sep 9th, 2007 02:50 AM

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Starscream M
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by SnazzySmurph
Are you seriously making the implication that someone who can do anything would have to make a sacrifice to overcome a simple paradox?

so what if he has to make a sacrifice...he still succeeds at creating a rock that he can't lift right? that's all the question poses...never said anything about not making any sacrifices, which is the trick part because no one thinks that way.

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Sep 9th, 2007 02:54 AM

Smurph
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by masterbruce
so what if he has to make a sacrifice...he still succeeds at creating a rock that he can't lift right? that's all the question poses...never said anything about not making any sacrifices, which is the trick part because no one thinks that way.

If you can do ANYTHING, you don't have to make a sacrifice, or trade anything, in order to defeat a simple little paradox.

It's INEFFABLE.

Sep 9th, 2007 03:00 AM

Classic NES
Balloooooooooooooon

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Is this really that hard to get?

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Sep 9th, 2007 03:03 AM

Starscream M
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by masterbruce

1. God is omnipotent.

2. By asking him to create a rock he can't lift, basically all he has to do is give up his omnipotence.

3. He creates a rock and then removes his omnipotence.

4. Now, he can no longer lift the rock and is no longer omnipotent.

Therefore, God, an omnipotent being, has succeeded at creating a rock he can't lift

this is called thinking outside the box for a solution

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Sep 9th, 2007 03:06 AM

Soljer
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by masterbruce
this is called thinking outside the box for a solution

No, it's called an invalid argument, and repetition of a falsehood does not change it's truth value.

You keep trying to pass it off as a 'solution' when it is not one.

You've solved nothing. You're incorrect. Try to wrap your head around it.

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Sep 9th, 2007 03:41 AM

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Starscream M
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Soljer
No, it's called an invalid argument, and repetition of a falsehood does not change it's truth value.

You keep trying to pass it off as a 'solution' when it is not one.

You've solved nothing. You're incorrect. Try to wrap your head around it.

you calling it incorrect doesn't make it incorrect. you have to say WHY it is incorrect.

as far as I know, my solution does not violate any conditions set by the paradoxical question

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Sep 9th, 2007 03:45 AM

Soljer
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by masterbruce
you calling it incorrect doesn't make it incorrect. you have to say WHY it is incorrect.

as far as I know, my solution does not violate any conditions set by the paradoxical question

Sure it does.

You're implying that an omnipotent being could ONLY accomplish something by stripping away his omnipotence.

Hence, he wasn't an omnipotent being to begin with.

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Sep 9th, 2007 03:51 AM

Starscream M
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Soljer
Sure it does.

You're implying that an omnipotent being could ONLY accomplish something by stripping away his omnipotence.

Hence, he wasn't an omnipotent being to begin with.

no, I never said it was the ONLY way to accomplish it.

is there another way to do it without defying logic, perhaps, but I don't know it.

or maybe as you and others have suggested, there is no other LOGICAL way, hence ineffable.

however, I am saying the solution I offered is ONE feasible solution within the bounds of logic for God to accomplish the task, at least that's my opinion.

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Sep 9th, 2007 03:56 AM

Supermanluv
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I bet evryone on here agrees its a paradox though ?

Sep 9th, 2007 03:59 AM

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nvrbeenwthagirl
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by masterbruce
basically, with this rock thingy, you're asking if a being with no limits can set a limit for himself

then the answer would be no, so I change my original answer

Then the being wouldn't be unlimited. A being with no limits could limit themself. But an Omnicient being would do such a thing. this was why the beyonder was an idiot.

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Sep 9th, 2007 04:00 AM

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batdude123
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Supermanluv
I bet evryone on here agrees its a paradox though ?

This is the definition of a paradox.

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Sep 9th, 2007 04:01 AM

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Merlyn
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Argh..

These type of threads are ridiculous. roll eyes (sarcastic)

Am I the only one who realizes that an omnipotent being can do anything?

Such a being has the power to literally write/change ANY conceptual "laws" he wishes...

Such a being is beyond logic and explination.

Making a thread like this is to belittle said being's power down to "human standards", thus no longer making the being in question, omnipotent. smile

Sep 9th, 2007 06:10 AM

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Smurph
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by SnazzySmurph
Anyways one last time for this thread, say it with me everybody...

IT'S F*CKING INEFFABLE, DIPSHITS!