As for the fans being pissed off that is new. I thought it was because they chose Keaton to play the part of Batman. Anyway there are quite a few versions of Batman as there are Jokers. As for the kill rule we all know Batman does not kill intentionally but is capable of doing so. This is shown in Keaton’s version the comics and the animated series. In Keaton’s version he did not kill the Joker. He just prevented him from escaping. However we saw he was capable of doing so and that is what makes Batman dark. Even Keaton admitted this when he won the part and study Batman’s characteristics.
I do not agree. Nicholson’s Joker was a chemical genius and established crime lord. His cosmetic stunt was the most dangerous and intelligent stunts of the all the Batman movies.
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No, that's not what I mean.
I mean, Christian Bale is... boring. He doesn't have any emotion. Batman is an emo retard, but he's not [u]utterly[/i] emotionless like Bale is. Bale literally had the same mopey look on his face the entire movie. I'm serious. The man only has ONE look.
As I've said before, you could have replaced all of Bale in all the out of suit scenes with a piece of cardboard and no one would have noticed.
I see where you're coming from, but I clearly don't agree. Bruce Wayne/Batman is an emotionally withdrawn person who happens to be an uber genius as well. He has no real character flaws that are superficial, like lets say alcoholism. His problems are on a philisophical and ethical level that you can see him pondering and acting out if you payed any attention. He is far from the boring Keannu Reeves.
ah, i see what you mean. sure, batman and joker are suppossed to carry each other in the show. that's why they are both always played as polar opposites (this is what happens when an unstoppable force meets an immovable object). both are powerful characters that basically drive the story as two wheels that work in oppositte directions. but this time around the balance was a little....off. they are both supposed to be interesting and powerful but Joker proved to be more so. that was the problem. batman, normally, never falls in Joker's shadow. even in stuff like The Killling Joke, Joker never outshone Bats. i see what you mean though.
emotionally withdrawn is one thing. being a cardboard is another. did you even feel that Bruce was devastated at Rachel's death. it felt more like "rachel is dead. shit."
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"Paid attention"?
I read the damn comics. I know all about Batman's character. His comic book persona is livelier than Bale's performance makes it out to be. Like Sado said, Bale didn't even look devastated. He just had that same exact look on his face that he has every other minute of the film.
Wow, you took one still frame from The Dark Knight, two from Begins and one that wasn't even in either film. That sure does represent ALL of his facial expressions. *obvious sarcasm*
You and I argued about this in another topic. You're still wrong. <----- "Christian Bale Face"
exactly.well done ThunderGod. Burtons Batman was a disgrace to the comicbook.Other than Clooney,Keaton was the worst casting choice for that part.pudgy gut,receding hairline,half bald,short runt Michael Keaton for tall,muscular,handsome,full set of Hair Bruce wayne.What a sick joke and an insult to true Batman fans.
1. Show me a single damn person Batman has ever killed. Capable of doing so? He doesn't kill the Joker, who consistently escapes Arkham like two days later and kills a family or something before being caught. Hell, he let Alexander Luthor Jr. live in Infinite Crisis, who had plans and was actually proven to be capable of causing the death of every being in the universe. Ironically, Alex was killed that day, but not by Batman, by Joker. But the point is, Batman does not kill, for any reason. Keaton can say whatever the fvck he wants. And he made Joker fall to his death, that is killing. Also, Batman killed when not "necessary," like the big black guy, he could have(hell, going by how Batman is supposed to be, SHOULD have) knocked him out, but no, sent him falling down from like 30 stories. Comic Batman would kick the shit out of Keaton for his portrayal of him, although in actuality they both suck anyway.
2. Chemical genius, sure. Strategic mastermind? No friggin way. Ledger's Joker kept the entire city behind him with his plans and plans within plans, you will never be able to prove Nicholson's Joker was a better strategist.
Oh boy you actually are going to make me fine people Batman have killed. Of course the biggest name Joker has not been killed. What about regular criminals that he fights like hench-men. Anyway I will get back to you on people who Batman has killed unintentionally. Let us not forget the famous line from Bale in Batman Begins who had it in his power to save Râ's al Ghûl “I am not going to kill you but I do not have to save you”. What does he do? He lets Râ's al Ghûl die.
This one is for opinion. I do agree that Ledger’s Joker was portrayed to be a criminal mastermind. One thing though, I cannot think of one thing that Ledger’s Joker did that was different from any other villain Batman has fought. Usually the Joker stands out in that department.
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What the hell? What villain has ever waged the same degree of emotional damage upon Batman, caused the same amount of harm to Gotham, and essentially won in the end? Let me get more specific:
1. What villain demonstrated the ability to morally corrupt the most 'good' character within the film?
2. What villain held an entire city under his virtual control through the usage of terrorist antics?
3. What villain spread endless panic and anarchy throughout the people of Gotham?
4. What villain is motivated by an ideology that has nothing to do with personal gain or money? Or more correctly; what villain's entire scheme was orchestrated around proving his ideological point?
5. What villain managed to cause an utter psychological breakdown of Batman's almighty 'no killing' rule, and pushed Batman close to the brink of moral corruption?
6. What villain managed to prevent Batman from achieving his personal goal (achieving a normal life) by leading him to commit indirect murder twice in the film, both of which times the murder was of a character vital to Bruce Wayne's desire for a normal life?
7. What villain left the movie without the answer to his scheme clearly "No! He's ideology is wrong and stems from him being abused by society!", but actually left the possibility open that maybe, just maybe, he had a degree of truth in his apparent madness?
All of these are extremely 'Joker-ish' qualities. The fact that he didn't assault Gotham with laughing gas and an array of silly, gimmicky weapons doesn't make him 'just like any other villain'.
And how is this relevant to the Batman debate? Well, it's everything Batman had to go through this movie. Without him- the emotional center of the movie, the man whose morality is being tested (and, especially in our current times, I can fully identify with that) and destroyed, the man who needs a rather insane disguise and method of operation in order to maintain his sanity, and the man who goes through all of the hopelessness and emotional turmoil, the film would have failed.
KMC Community Forums
Feb 3rd, 2009 09:58 PM
Burtons Batman was a disgrace to the comicbook.Other than Clooney,Keaton was the worst casting choice for that part.pudgy gut,receding hairline,half bald,short runt Michael Keaton for tall,muscular,handsome,full set of Hair Bruce wayne.What a sick joke and an insult to true Batman fans.
