If it's Vader as of ROTS, Sidious and Dooku win this easily. His abilities at that point are weak.
If it's a more skilled Vader -- ESB or ROTJ -- it's a more even fight. I'd bet on Yoda and Vader to win the sabers contest, Sidious and Dooku to win the Force contest (Yoda may be more "powerful" individually than any of the opponents, but his Light alignment prevents him from unleashing his power in quite the same way as his opponents can), and Yoda and Vader to win the sabers + force contest, though only barely. Yoda needs to cover Vader against the force lightning to a large extent for their team to really work.
1.) Sidious and Dooku. For the life of me I can't see Dooku beating Vader, but I can't see Yoda winning against Sdious. Yoda dies by his hand, Dooku dies by Vader, Vader dies by Sidious.
2.) Sidious gets thrown across the room just as a powerful bolt of lightning combines with Dooku's to render Vader gasping for breath. They then team up and kill Yoda.
3.) Same as above, ultimately. Dooku may die.
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I don't know how a ROTJ Sidious would fare with a lightsaber, but, I'm taking Vader and Yoda for the first one.
Depends on the match-up for number two.
Probably Yoda and Vader, but close.
Hahaha, can that old women playing Sidious really outsaber Yoda from RotS? And Anakin won against Dooku because of his fighting form and strength. Vader can lift a man with one arm and has mastered form V a long time ago.
In a force fight, the Yoda/Vader tag team would make a line of defence of incoming lightning and Vader would strangle the old geezers using the farce from behind Yoda's shield.
hahaha, oh WOW. I are in an debate. I feel like the mighty Sorgo in his prime.
Round one goes to Yoda and Vader. Sidious hasn't kept up with his lightsaber skills enough to match Yoda, this time. He will die and so will Dooku.
Round two is firmly in Sidious and Dooku's favor, however. RotJ Sidious has twenty years with the Galactic Empire's unprecedented resources at searching the galaxy for dark side secrets. He's obviously a fair bit superior to his RotS Sidious days. Which means, yes, he's better than Yoda in Force skills. He can put Vader down and then either defeat Yoda himself, or double team Yoda with Dooku.
Round three? Tough, but I say Sidious. Dooku will probably die.
1. I assume that ROTJ Sidious is the same as ROTS Sidious is with a blade. So he ties Yoda, Dooku beats Vader, then Dooku and Sidious beat Yoda.
2. Sidious fries Vader in a second, then the duo wtf pwn Yoda. Sidious has increased with the Force since ROTS and then he was slightly above Yoda. Yoda was even with him at best.
3. Sidious ebats Yoda, and even if you're one of them Vader fanboys who puts Vader over Dooku, then Dooku at least holds off Vader until Yoda dies, then Sidious and Dooku together pwn Vader.
Proof that Sidious hasn't kept up his saber skills? if you can provide proof, I may reconsider about #1.
WTF? Um... Sidious dedicated himself to studying the Force and running the Empire. He left "hunting the Jedi" to Vader, dark side adepts, and various other Imperial agents. He implies, at several points in RoDV, that Vader was his lightsaber. If memory serves me correctly, he even labels him specifically as such. It's just like with Maul and Dooku. Once they were trained, he left the lightsaber alone.
I'd like to see some proof that he has kept up with his lightsaber skills.
You were the one who made the statement that Palpatine didn't practice, so you provide the proof. You know this is the way it workd, Gideon. Yes, Vader hunted down the Jedi, not Sidious. But Sidious could have still practiced, Sate Pestage ran the empire, Vader ran the military, one can only sit in his throne and look at his galaxy for so many hours. And Maul was Sidious lightsaber, too, so did Sidious practice during the PT? If not, then he'd be at least as good with a blade in ROTJ as he was in ROTS, and better if he practiced between trilogies.
That's right, I did, and - if I may say so - that is an excellent tactic to avoid a question (not answering it at all, deflecting it with a statement). But, it's overused and obvious: you don't have proof that Sidious practiced his lightsaber skills during the OT.
Ah, excellent. Then, would you be so kind as to offer some support to this claim? You were the one who made the statement that Palpatine could have practiced, so you provide the proof. You know the way it works, Darthsith.
Pestage didn't run the Empire completely, nor did he do it for Palpatine's entire reign. The most evidence that seems to support that is when Sidious ended up distracted with the Vader/Skywalker/Death Star/Rebellion affairs, which was a small fraction of his time as overlord of the galaxy.
This is your proof? Pathetic. Really, Darthsith, all you have to offer is your "guess" that Palpatine couldn't have "sat in his throne and watched the galaxy for so many hours"? You'd think that unlocking the secrets of the Force and maintaining supreme authority over the most powerful regime in galactic history would help take some off of the "galaxy watching" frenzy...
No. We know that Maul used training droids to maintain his prowess after Sidious indoctrinated him in lightsaber skills, and LoE confirmed that, since Dooku was already a master swordsman, Sidious didn't need to train him at all in that area. Combine this with the facts that his lightsaber was locked in a statue for 13 years and he was Chancellor of the Galactic Republic, and that there is no implication of him training at all, I think it's an easy answer. Especially when one considers Maul's accounts of Sidious during Maul's training and comparing them to what we saw/read in RotS.
Right - let's try that again. Operating under the extremely supported theory that Sidious didn't maintain his skills with a lightsaber for 13 years prior to RotS, and the extremely supported theory that he didn't do so during the PT. That's 33 years that he didn't actively use his lightsaber - except for two instances during the RotS timeline. That didn't exactly recall a decade of lost skill, Darthsith.
You're right - I do have no proof. But neither do you, if you do post it and I'll agree, if not then what you say holds no water. Since there is no reason to think that Palpatine wouldn't practice during the countless hours in his throne room then if there's no proof either way that automatically is what happener until proof otherwise is stated.
There no reason to assume that he wouldn't practice, unless it's stated somewhere, in which case I shall concede my case immediately. So provide proof or concede.
He pretty much did run it completely, so for the time that he did run it Palpatine could easily have practiced during his endless horus of free-time.
Again, there's no reason to assume that the most powerful Sith Lord ever couldn't train, unless it's stated somewhere. Yes, Palpatine doesn't need to sit and look over the galaxy for more than two thousand hours a year. That gives him more than enough time to slept, eat, practice, jerk off, and everything else that he does.
In that case, even if Palpatine didn't train at all during the OT he'd still be as strong as he was during ROTS.
Okay, fair enough but you lose more in the first few years then you do in the decades after that, so he'd still be on par with Vader at least, even if he didn't practice, do you agree?
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Apr 12th, 2007 02:43 AM
