Here I am inviting opinions from all Dark Side players, because the game cannot run properly unless this has been discussed.
Zink intends to take a Nemesis template for the upcoming campaign, more specifically a Bane, an ex-Jedi Master.
This greatly changes the style of the Dark Side campaign, entirely changing the focus. It stops being an exercise in a leaderless group of equals held together by shared need and circumstance, and becomes more an issue in exercising power and Dark Side team running. In several ways, it actually reduces the contrast from the game before- though it will still be a 100% player run affair, either way.
The Nemesis is in charge. That is how it works. The 'Megalomania' characteristic enforces this in the rules, in as much as if anyone is seriously rivalling the Nemesis for leadership, it has to be resolved in the death of one or the other.
Therefore the group is under the direction of another player. The Dark Siee group will not therefore work unless everyone is happy both with being under direction of another player at all, and, more to the point, being under the direction of that particular player. This is not meant to be an exercise in criticism, and I do not want anyone to think that way. It is simply that some players might not like the group dynamic of being led in a particular person's style.
The Jedi- where leadership is less contentious of an issue anyway, because they work so much better as team players, they are led by Gundy, and Gundy being a fully adult woman (who watched the original Star Wars film back in '77 when she was 14) fits the Master vibe very well; she also has a lot of practice. I repeat what I said before, it is NOT easy to play a Master, and it is just as hard Light Side as Dark. If it is going to be introduced into the campaign, it is very important to the quality of the campaign that it is done right.
All if you by accepting the Nemesis in the group also, by default, accepts that your character accepted him also. If one of you did not, or would not, oin your opinion, then you would not be in the game, having either left or been eliminated before play starts. This will never happen- I will ban a Nemesis as an option before it does.
Now, if the Nemesis thing is done right, it can bring rewards- the rewards of a well organised and efficient group. But it can also be a disaster as players simply amongst themselves- and this will be a dangerous time to do that!
A Nemesis has one other problem to face- coming in new, the vets- especially Galder and Rah- have spent experience points and, on the idea that the starting templates are roughly balanced, are in relative terms actually more powerful than the Nemesis overall (although the Nemesis will still have the highest aggregate of force powers, sabre skill and force pool). This makes a Nemesis' position more tenuous- the worry that Galder, in particular, would have a good chance of killing him. Galder and Takuan working together would be very difficult to stop indeed. Again, intelligent play and power poltiics will sort this out- that is half the job of a Nemesis. But it is not easy!
So, I want you guys to think about, and give some feedback, on the following points:
1. Are you ok with the different style of play of having a Nemesis in the group has?
2. Will you be ok specifically working underneath another player in an effectively forcible fashion?
3. Will you be ok with the overall group dynamic that will create, looking at who will be in charge and who will work under him?
4. Zink, do you think you are up for the job?
Any other comments you want to make are welcome.
One other thing- if you go ahead with this, then I think it would be a good idea if you guys actually defined how the group works as an organised force with a lead figure. Who does what, what style do you have (Kuylen ran things like a military squad, you may not), what are your broad objectives? Tactics? Typical actions in a day? Does your group have a name?
The set-up would be that the new players would all have been working for the Nemesis already, and the vets, who used to work for Galder, have met the Nemesis since- in fact, the Nemesis will have been, for one reason or another, moving out to the Outer Rim and have heard of the exploits of Kuylen's people, and maybe also Kuylen's people heard of this Nemesis. At some point in the intervening two years, the two groups meet, and the vets agree to work for this new guy. So they would be the relative outsiders; the other new players would have known each other longer.
Also, as detailed in the story summary aside from your background merits you have spent, as the game starts you are currently in an 'unachieved' position- no home, no organisation under your control, and few ideas about what to do next, so if you want to have been part of something large before that is fine, but either you left or it failed and got destroyed, or whatever.
A lot to think about if a Nemesis is involved! Without a Nemesis, you are just trying to survive day by day, with one, we have to look at some things in more detail.
So, think about all that, and give me some feedback!
__________________
"We've got maybe seconds before Darth Rosenberg grinds everybody into Jawa burgers and not one of you buds has the midi-chlorians to stop her!"
"You've never had any TINY bit of sex, have you?"
BtVS
Last edited by Ushgarak on Apr 13th, 2005 at 10:09 PM
I think Rah will manage living under the thumb even if he is power greedy.
I'm happy to give it a go, if it seems like its not working we'll just mutiny and kill Zink and let him role another dude to play with or something.
It might be a good idea to discuss aims objectives so we can sort out a leadership ladder. With our gained xp Galder, Tarkuan and Rah could become Generals again in charge of our own sections/missions under the direction of Zink. This, perhaps, would also give us an opportunity to have our own version of a padawan - an evil NPC that we sort of control that looks up to and answers to us.
So long as it fits in with the overall plot I wouldn't mind seeing Rah further himself by starting some sort of thug outfit/protection racket dealing in information and intimidation.
If the Dark Side group dynamic breaks down, you could well find yourselves dead, btw.
Do remember that you are starting off with zilch, btw...
The point has also been raised about availability... if the group is following a Nemesis and then he cannot get on for a period of time it could be tricky.
As ever, I can work around things, but this is also a complication that should be considered.
__________________
"We've got maybe seconds before Darth Rosenberg grinds everybody into Jawa burgers and not one of you buds has the midi-chlorians to stop her!"
"You've never had any TINY bit of sex, have you?"
BtVS
Last edited by Ushgarak on May 12th, 2004 at 11:00 AM
hmm..i don't know what to say. It would be silly to deny the advantages of having a nemesis....however....there's something unknown to me..and that is zink's play style....it has to be competent. Takuan would hate it if thigns would stray TOO much outside his opinions on how to do it. AND...if we don't like it...i would be totally open to an alliance in putting him out.....but that's tricky...all the lost time with a character, adn so on...
overall, though..i'm willing to give it a try. But i'm asking zink to think well if he's able to do it..
Fair points!
We could still try it and kill the Nemesis off if it doesnt work out. That way Zink at least gets to have a go, give him the chance to acid test so to speak.
well...with kuylen it was one thing...more or less fixed into the bigger plot.
but in this cae...i WOULD rather risk my character..then follow something i don't agree with by far.
Just to be clear, I don't just mean some of you may kill each other- I mean it is a dangerous time to be divided. Your enemies will NOT decrease just because you factionalise.
__________________
"We've got maybe seconds before Darth Rosenberg grinds everybody into Jawa burgers and not one of you buds has the midi-chlorians to stop her!"
The real reason I didn't get on enough was that I was bored with Wraith. He was too...average, IMO.
I'm sure once Nume is operational, I'll be on much more. I can be competetive, so Nume will be, as Wraith wasn't since he got tossed aside a few times due to my absences. Don't want that happening to a leader, do we?
When I say kill him, I was thinking more along the lines of - The groups not happy, Zinks not happy so the nemesis dies very quickly in a horrible 'accident' or something. Zink has a new character ready to go, gets brought in and we carry on from there.
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May 11th, 2004 10:05 PM
