KMC Forums - Wolverine vs. Spider-Man

quote: (post)
Originally posted by The MISTER
I just want to know if the best argument for Wolverine beating Spider-man is that Marvel said so and since they said that he can, then he can, despite being slower and weaker with less experience superheroing, no ranged options, far less manueverability, and no way of winning the battle except for hand to hand frontal strikes?

Please tell me why Spider-man has to allow Wolverine to get in h2h range when he can move around on walls and his VERTICAL is five stories?

Who wants to say that Spidey's supporters are fanboys and are in denial and at the same time say that Wolverine can vertical three stories?

Spider-man benches 10 tons and jumps fives stories: Marvel makes sense

Wolverine benches 6 tons and jumps three stories: that would also make sense.

Wolverine benches 1000 pounds and jumps three stories: It happened whether it makes sense or not but the bad thing is that Wolverine's supporters want to say that it MAKES PERFECT SENSE!! Please!

I don't have to find a picture of Spider-man jumping fifteen stories and find a drawing of him lifting a 30 ton train car to support his victory over the drastically overrated Wolverine. If he wasn't drastically overrated then nobody would be able to say that he got hit by Namor and didn't fall.

Why is it that Wolverine has been shown to hang with Spider-man in the past? The same reason that he can jump three stories and take shots from a class 100 character without being knocked down.

He looks cool so nobody cares that he's only physically as capable as a peak human. I know that I don't.

But Jinzin I would like to think that you could do better than saying whatever Marvel says can happen, will happen the same way every time.

So far that's the only thing I've heard from anyone that has made a good argument for Wolverine at any point in this discussion. Edit: Eventually the only argument that his supporters use that has merit.

Cause Marvel said it can happen, and if you fanboys don't like it, tough!

What ever happened to basing your opinions on your knowledge of the characters and awareness of the feats that are consistent with their capabilities?

Wolverine can't move fast enough to avoid Spider-mans webbing and he can't force Spider-man into a place where he'd have the opportunity to slash him. He can't break the webbing and if it hits him in the face he's hindered long enough to be completely immobilized.

the thing is I've actually felt that I debated decent points....and I constantly have to remind people around here of what they are....spiderman's strength is virtually a non-factor....spiderman's speed is only above wolverine's for so long...and then the same exact thing that happened to mrs. marvel vs. sabes...will happen to spidey vs. wolvie.. he'll tire..wolverine will evade his punches, and slip threw his offense more and more...(now that makes sense given wolverine's healing factor, and I'm giving spidey the benifit of the doubt that he'll even fair out very well to begin with when wolverine's supposedly one of the best h2h fighters in the MU.....)

what's not logical...to say that spiderman's going to immediatly attempt to completely webb wolverine up because we know he can (even though he does that in .005% of his fights)...but then immediately saying that wolverine won't perform to the best of his fighting abilities because he never applies it....even though he's been shown to apply it over and over and over again.....

I would however, just like to say that this thread is hilarious in some aspects.....I find it interesting how spiderman fans always assume for the purposes of this fight that EVERY single advantage will be in spidey's favor...
for instance, the battlefield....apparently spiderman will be fighting logan in a place where there are high walls on all sides, the quarters of the walls will be close or far apart depending on how it best suits spiderman for the moment....there will be piles of cars around for spidey to smack logan with....and a least two to three feet of water on the ground to drown him with... laughing out loud

stats: I like how the only stats that are relivent to this fight are speed and strength....any stats that would incline that wolverine brings more to the table than spiderman is wrong...

Now about the shield files of nick fury stats...he has wolverine at an overall powerlevel of 9...spiderman's at an 8...according to shield (and marvel) spiderman's outclassed by wolverine...
I think you're misunderstanding the stats..they are taking the characters and adding more than just simplistic physical attributes...but...they are also distributing the stats on an individual level....you're thinking that the stats imply what wolverine can do when faced with a human army or something in comparison with spidey....when the stats are actually an indication of individual, overall, powerlevels...and wolverine edges spidey out there...

In any case your logic for that seems inherently flawed to me....by your logic...wolverine can't beat spiderman 1 on 1 because spiderman's the harder guy to beat....yet, by that same logic 100 wolverines could take down 100 spidermans because wolverine brings various attributes to a team that spiderman does not... it doesn't make a whole lot of sense...now if your reasoning for this was because of logans tactical mindedness I would point out that while captain america is very tactically minded he can bring in the same principals and apply them to a one on one fight..which is what he does...wolverine can do the same...but your thought on the subject was that wolverine can employ teamwork tactics better.... I'm not so sure about that...I mean spiderman's been on his fair share of teams and team ups and he seems to get along just fine....(now it comes to a point when experience is factored in and then out again...for instance, logans surley had more physical confrontations than spiderman, but it was a moot point since spiderman's had oodles of experience as well...the same thing applies here) in any case I think it's interesting you feel this way considering the bad rap that wolvie was getting for his lack of cooperative skills in the trio thread...well that and the fact that the only decent showing spiderman's EVER had against wolvie....wolverine was in action with a team.... but if those stats were how you think they were distributed than captain america would be the top tier hero in them due to the same reasoning...he however id below both of these characters...because...they're distributed on an indivdual level.....

the issue here is not whether or not wolverine can do the things he's done, the issue is your inability to accept the characters as they've been given to you because ou simply don't agree with what has been published....does bad writing happen? of course it does...but to imply that every instance of wolverine humiliating spiderman was bad writing is somewhat ridiculous...the biased lied on spiderman's side, out of their 5 encounters 4 of them took place in spiderman titles, yet the writing is bad because the spiderman writers nor marvel felt that spidey could beat logan..not once not twice...but 4 times?...how many more times does he need to beat the guy before it's considered to be something within his capability to do? now please don't tell me that i spiderman beat firelod 2 more times that spidey fans wouldn't use that as the end all be all to spiderman fights for the forums...cause you and I both know very well that they would....did I say that wolverine jumping 30 feet into the air makes sense...no...but I did speculate on how he could do so if regular human being that don't reside in a comic book fantasy can jump 10 to 12 feet into the air with (coompared to wolverine) a minimal amount of training.....of course comics don't make sense...but the say/imply that my argument is weaker because I've seen a character do a feat a number of times and have come to the conclussion that said character can preform said feat at his own will....is kinda...well....dumb.....I also find it very interesting how people have attempted to downgrade my credibility although I'm one of the few (and very few at that) around here who is supporting my assumptions with proof..... "he doesn't have credibility...all he has......are facts..." roll eyes (sarcastic)

Now everytime wolverine fans start bringing up feats...people instantly start to disregard said feats and start throwing around the word inconsistant where the word doesn't even apply to the points in question...for instance...spiderman's strength in this fight....IS USELESS... people keep claiming that spiderman can incapacitate logan by rendering him unconcious...he can't... sure wolverine used to be a character that got KOed by people like sasquatch, vindicator, hulk, and juggy quite easily...wolverine, however is no longer that kind of character...if I were to use (and when I did use) all of spiderman's early unimpresive feats and dismal failures..people simply chalked it up to spiderman having been to young or inexperienced...his early failures vs. his newer impressive feats have nothing to do with inconsistancies in their opionion...he's just developed stronger faster and better over time....logan.. in turn... has developed stronger over time...but you ask them and he's to be considered inconsistant...(not that he isn't but common all comic book characters are inconsistant...)... Logan has fought the hulk 10 or 11 times now...several of which he lacked an adamantium skeleton..and he's only been KOed 3 times..3 KO's vs. the strongest physical power in the MU is nothin to be ashamed of..especially when two of those were by a cheap shot, and the third was by multpiple hits to the back of the head from a possessed and pissed off hulk.....wolverine has consistantly (more times than not) taken his punishement and retained conciousness...logan has consistantly fought characters in the class 50 to 100 range...(guys that spiderman's even admitted would splatter him if they landed one hit) and wolverine's not only retained conciousness but he beats them or fights them to a standstill...THEN...wolverine's fought spiderman....he took "everything" spiderman had and smiled at the webhead for his troubles...he took hits from a pissed off spiderman with the upgrades and stood up after it like nothing happened....saying that wolverine's gonna get KOed by spiderman in this fight is illogical...saying that he'll do it because wolverine's an inconsistant character is irrational...

spiderman's speed..alreagy argued....the only real threats spiderman has is his agility and webbing...but because...wolverine is garanteed a one hit kill/ko if he lands a punch and because spiderman has to use a ton of webbing while hitting him with it, while catching him in an uncomprimising position, WHILE needing to dosomething to KO him before he gets out.....i think his webbing's at a slight disadvantage vs. wolverine's claws...this puts spiderman against the odds more than it does wolverine....\

the truth of the matter is that I'm just getting tired of people trying to discredit the character when it's something the wolverine fans haven't done to spidey...(sure we've belittled the people we're arguing against but..)...we've never tried to take anything away from spiderman simply by saying he can't do that...he can't do this...it doesn't make sense....blah blah blah....that considered...we're arguing against spiderman...while you guys argue against wolverine-the way you think he should be......tell me...who's argument is weaker for it again?

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"damn jinzin, you're a real trooper, you provde fact after fact and pages and pages of proof and these wanton miscreants just keep at it"~MERC