Terminator 2 takes place in 1994. (35 years in the past from 2029).
Terminator 3 takes place in 2004. (10 years after T2).
Here's what I think happens:
The original Judgement Day date was July 29th, 2004. However, when Cyberdyne gained the CPU from the Terminator's head, it pushed Judgement Day closer, due to the future technology.
Judgement Day then became August 29th, 1997.
But when the CPU was destroyed, along with Cyberdyne, it returned everything to normal. Judgement Day then was returned to July 29th, 2004.
Cameron did screw up the timeline(s) so it is not gana make perfect sense. Here is the thing: Before we try to make sense of a movie or series of movies involving time travel we need to figure out what theory of time travel they are going by. In T1 they (presumably) went by the theory that the future is set. Otherwise where did John Connor come from? They also cut out 2 scenes in T1 that explained that cyberdyne developed skynet, and a later scene that showed that the building where the T-800 was killed in was Cyberdyne, and that Cyberdyne Mgmt hid everything so they could study it. Thus explaining how skynet was created in the first place.
In T2 they went with the theory that the future is not set when they blew up Cyberdyne and killed Miles Dyson. From this point on there is really no point in trying to make sense of it because it wont work. The future is either set or it isn't, it cant be both. But if you want to get really crazy with it here is a thought: what if the John Connor who sent Kyle Reese back was really not Kyles son? That was a different John Connor. Once Reese went back he changed the future erasing that John from existance and (luckily) created a new one. Thanks to his mothers experiance she prepared him from birth so it is no coincidence that he would go on to lead the resistance just as the original John did. Crazy, and obviously not intended, but the only way to put it together.
I've always thought about that. If you're not going by the time-travel loop theory, then Sarah's assuming her son with Reese is going to be the same John Connor she would have had all along. But it seems the original John had a different father. Pretty risky bet there if you asked me.
Ya good thinking, Kyle. Endanger the existence of John by sleeping with his mother.
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Don't remember that?
but That just makes it more messed up....... according to the computer in T2 john is 10 so it makes it 1995.
so T3 and the SCC messed it up royally cause in SCC sarah is alive in 1999 when she died in 1997 according to T3
unless if they go back in time to 1997 where she dies?
as for the trees and snow they are in LA i don't think the trees change or there is snow unless it's in the mountains but T1 was in may and john born in feb
t2 summer some time
Then again T3 does say T2 happened 2 years before old Judegement Day (97), so that means they think T1 took place in 81 or 80. Which brings up a point. Is there any reference at all that says T1 took place in 1981 in T1 or T2?
That's a good theory, but that means the John who sent Kyle back is most likely not his son, and it destroys the loop theory.
I'm happy to admit the creators ****ed up, and it can't be solved. Doesn't exactly mean the films are bad, just T2 and T3 are flawed.
I'm pretty sure that at the beginning of T1, just before Arnie appears in the "present" day, there is some writing on screen saying "LOS ANGELES, 1984 1:52AM"...
I think so too, but in any case the police computer says John was born in Feb 1985 so T1 happens in 1984.
The whole franchise is a grandfather paradox.
If John sent a woman warrior or even a terminator back in time to 1984 would he disappear in 2029?
How could skynet exist in 2029 if they didn't send a terminator back to 1984 for cyberdine to get the cpu and arm?
and i've gone crosseyed
Maybe it's like Bill & Ted, where they just think that they will use the time machine later and go back in time and put the keys by a tree so they will have them when they need them in the future, but they have to remember to do it later otherwise it won't happen.... but it did happen, so it doesn't matter anymore?
Something that nobody in this thread seems to have considered, which surprises me based on the complexity of some theories proposed, is that Judgement Day is August 29, 1997, period.
Look at it this way:
Judgement day was 8.29.97, Reese told this to Sarah so she quoted it as the day in T2. This is all the pertinent information.
Ignore the third movie, stop bashing Cameron for messing things up, and look at some facts. James Cameron made TWO movies around the Terminator movie. He did NOT write the third movie, he is only in the credits as a writer due to the inclusion of characters he created. The ONLY Canon is found in Terminator and Terminator 2.
Final answer in the true canon of the series is this:
Terminator sent back to destroy Sarah and is destroyed.
Terminator sent back to kill John and the company designing Skynet is destroyed.
Judgement day is averted, the war never happens in the T2 timeline.
It's a multiple timeline theory and it works. It just seems pointless to take what is essentially high budget fan fiction and try and mash it into a series that is already complete.
But to try and give an explatnation, I see it like this:
John Conner's father is Kyle Reese.
The Terminator and Kyle are sent back in one timeline, this happens irregardless.
When the terminator is destroyed, nothing significant has changed because this event always happened.
It isn't until the destruction of Skynet that the future was changed to remove Judgement Day.
Of course, while that could explain the parentage, it doesn't explain why the war happened in the first place. Maybe the first time around Kyle destroyed the Terminator completely and Sarah didn't have the final confrontation with the endoskeleton that caused her to realize she was a part of this fight so she didn't go trying to warn people and accepted that Judgement Day would happen regardless of her actions.
That would mean she didn't blow up the research and Judgement Day actually occured.
So yeah, there is a possibility that in a slight alteration of the timeline Skynet went online and that in the second timeline the alteration didn't occur and Sarah stopped Skynet.
It is still possible to assume that Kyle was always John's father as long as he always goes back.
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Jan 7th, 2006 10:49 PM
