If PF is aspect of TOAA, he could chose me easily as avatar, and me and PF would be the same, listnening each other. Mutation or not, PF could chose eaisly normal human, why not, it's aspect of TOAA, and then it would be the same with human.
avatar isn't someone whose chosen. An avatar is an incarnation. You should look up some religious works
A good example is Jesus. Jesus isn't called an avatar because the term isnt a Christian one, but hes something like one. You see, Jesus is both fully human and fully God. How? its a religious thing. Jesus is also the same as God but different from God, being his son. Again, a religious thing. Another example- in the Hindu religion, Rama is an avatar of Vishnu. He is Vishnu in human form, both human and God.
The Phoenix mythology is steeped in religious language. Its not surprising that religious concepts like these pop up within it.
PF can easily possess someone or something, like the bug, or Emma, or a kangaroo for all it matters. that doesnt make it an avatar.
__________________ "Blood and flame and sacrifice..."
I don't believe Jesus was incarnation of God, but was his son (two different beings). And if Jesus would be incarantion of God, it's still different, God in human form. Jean is not incarnation nof PF or TOAA. It's mutant that was chosen to be it's avatar, so then they are the same, but PF can leave her, and she will be left wih her powers.
And anyway that is compeltely different. Yes, it could take me, it would chose me to be it's avatar.
first of all, thats not the Christian take on things, whatever you believe, Christians say that Jesus is God and also his Son, they are the same and also different.
second, read above scan. It says Jean is an incarnation of the Phoenix Force (passion of creation). "She is an archangel made flesh..."
third, I already posted scans of Jean b*tchslapping the Phoenix after it goes and possesses Emma. Now how would she do that, I mean she's little ol Jean and its the almighty Phoenix! "How do you do that, Jean Grey? Without me, withot my power..."
"Because I am you, dont you remember? Now get out of that stupid body..."
now if you want to keep saying stuff like "oh it could leave her... it could def. take me..." without any real proof, feel free.
Im sure it could take anyone and possess their body, like it did with beetle/Emma/whatever. But it can't be them. It and Jean are the same. How can you leave yourself?
__________________ "Blood and flame and sacrifice..."
Orthodox beleive Jesus is his son and not God. Jean Grey=completely diffeten than PF. They aren't the same beings. He mutation didn't create Phoenix, if it would than it would mean they are the same, but it didn't creat PF, so they are different. Rachrl Summer is also it avatar.
Read Endsong. It says it there. It's been stated repeatedly in the past through Claremont's backstories. Jean and the Phoenix are the same.
And I'm not sure what Orthodox you're speaking of, but Eastern Orthodox Christians do believe that Christ is God. If you want to argue about the Nicene Creed, that's a different ball of wax. Orthodox (meaning true) Christianity, as passed down by the original disciples of Christ, states that Jesus Christ is God, and is the Son of God.
The analogy that FieryBalrog made is a very good one, I think. Others can certainly WIELD the Phoenix, but not all can BE the Phoenix.
Yes, it is true that Jean's mutation didn't create the Phoenix Force (as it was created by Feron), but Jean's ultimate and final mutation was to become and completely assume the mantle of the Phoenix, it was all predestined. Since the Phoenix is genetically Jean's power, she was able to pass it on to Rachel, even though Ray did have to renounce some of the Force, her genetic tie with it cannot be severed. So the PF is actually many personalities but at the same time, one single consciousness.
if you repeat it enough times, it might be true! "He mutation didn't create Phoenix" completely misses the point. Why would her mutation have to create the Phoenix for her to be the incarnation of the Phoenix? Did Jesus have to create God after he was born in order to be his human incarnation?
Rachel Summers received a portion of the Phoenix/Jean fragment that was returning to the coccoon after the death on the moon. She also has a unique relationship to it... because its her mother.
Oh, and Orthodox people probably will be offended by your remarks, because they very much believe that Jesus is both son of God and God. They believe in the Nicene Creed- thats the criteria for being Christian, and one of the major requirements of the Nicene creed is the criteria I stated. The idea that Jesus and God are not the same is one of the Gnostic heresies.
The difference between the Orthodox and the Catholic branches of the Church, apart from matters of dogma, is that the Orthodox church believes the disciples of Jesus were equal and that the Church is not meant to have a titular head, while the Catholics believe Peter was first among equals and that there will be a titular head of the Church who is the spiritual heir of Peter.
__________________ "Blood and flame and sacrifice..."
xpolsive, just to let you know that in uncanny x-men # 17 the writers called storm one of the most powerful mutants to ever walk the earth, and has never really let loose with her powers
are you sure its not x-men vol. 2 # 17? I own Uncanny 1- 137 except for the reprints in the middle. #17 is with the original team and its about Magneto laying traps for the X-men after coming back from the Strangers prison planet...
__________________ "Blood and flame and sacrifice..."
well it must be volume 2. but it has archangel and colossus easily being beaten by the x-cutioner. then storm comes in and electrifies the air around x. the attack is so powerful it breaks through his force-field and he is forced to teleport away from the attack. after the gtround was on fire and stuff and they thought storm killed him, but she knew he had teleported
yeah, altering her perceptitations to see heat and energy patters- she can see hidden objects as well as anybody that is invisable. also i liked how she was using electrosis. actually when i think about it, storm could defeat anyone that had a brain by shooting a blot into their head and shorting out all the synapses in their brain like she did to the hulk in cable # 34(i think)
Ah..Just like Cyclops could blast anyone in the face at maximum power or Emma walking around pushing bliss buttons or Jean annihilating planets on a stroll throughout the Universe...
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Jun 8th, 2005 01:14 PM
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"How do you do that, Jean Grey? Without me, withot my power..."
