NO IT ISNT. its your own assumption, and its dead wrong. jedi can only sense power when its being used. thats why quigon didnt know ani was force capable, until their conversation and then the blood test. thats why yoda didnt know how powerful luke was until he lifted the xwing with minimal training. remember that bugged out expression on his face? there was a reason for that.
yes they do. they have to USE THE FORCE or be blood screened. describing it as "some kind of trick" doesnt succeed in thwarting the facts.
this is all jumbled, so ill just say this:
what does luke and leia have to do with it? perhaps yoda sensed that the babies could sense their mother's emotion. whats your point?
as far as seeing the view screen, gee, do you think that perhaps anakin was using the force to see the images? could that have been why they sensed him? but then again, they never claimed to have sensed his abilities did they?
I spoke about the babies, because Obi-Wan and Yoda already knew they were going to be strong in the Force...and Luke didn't lack strength in the Force to pick up the X-wing...yoda didn't wanted to see if he had the strength to pick it up..he wanted to know if he could control his powers it's all about control...like he said...
To sense force powers you have to use your own force powers...and that is what Qui-Gon didn't do in the shop! That's why he didn't sense anything...you call it my assumptions...but it is just your assumtions that people have to make an action in the Force so that other people can sense it. I agree that if people use the Force it is easier to feel someone's power...but I don't agree that people can't sense someone's Force strength if they don't use the Force at all...
The council did say Anakin was strong in the Force...they even sensed more...Ki-Adi-Mundi sensed that he was strong in the Force and Yoda saw that his future was clouded...did Anakin do something evil..dark so Yoda could sense it? nope!
You just don't want to admit that you said one mistake...Shmi wasn't Force sensitive...
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"The greatest hero is the one who learns to face his fears and overconquers it!"
'There, Qui-Gon discovered a young slave boy named Anakin Skywalker, who was strong in the Force. Sensing the boy's potential, Qui-Gon liberated Anakin from slavery'
Direct quote from the starwars.com databank, they can sense the abilities in the force in others.
__________________ Recently Produced and Distributed Young but High-Ranking Political Figure of Royal Ancestry within the Modern American Town Affectionately Referred To as Bel-Air.
obiwan and yoda knew because they were anakin's offspring. thanks for adding to my point on heredity.
and yes, yoda was testing luke, but as per usual you have missed the point. it was intended that yoda look intensely surprised that luke managed to lift the xwing. that was the first time yoda really sensed his power. thats why he looked surprised. are you going to tell me that frank oz just had a seizure and thats why yodas face looked like that? and to further my point: "this one, a long time have i watched". yoda sensed luke through the force, but never sensed the depths of his power. why? because until then he never really tapped his potential. unless you think dodging a remote and force grabbing a lightsaber are impressive feats.
here's another bit of proof for you.
"perhaps you are not as strong as the emporer thought"
(luke uses the force and demonstrates his skill and power)
"impressive....MOST impressive"
luke's own father, who could sense where luke was hiding on hoth, did not know how powerful he was. sensing the feelings of others and sensing their power do NOT go hand in hand.
and i suppose thats fact again? because you said so?
too bad thats the way it is. thus the reason the twins remained safely hidden from vader, as well as why quigon did not immediately sense anakin's power, or more to the point that he had ANY capability in the force.
why are you trying to put words in my mouth? thats so weak and annoying. please dont do that. and please learn to read what i type or dont waste my time.
AS I SAID, anakin used the force to see the screen. COMMON SENSE FFS. also the audience only sees part of the test, which could have been far more extensive. and, blow my mind, but they just might have been informed of his midi count as well. perish the thought, i know.
and at what point did i say that she was force sensative? please quote where i said that.
i suggested that there is no proof that she wasnt force capable. and i am correct in saying so. there is no proof. ignoring what i say, putting words in my mouth, and dancing around key points only manages to derail the topic (case and point, here we are) and bore everyone. so if you dont want to debate sensibly and only want to prove yourself right by touting opinion as fact and distorting the argument, then you're going to have to find another dance partner.
What is this, the Matrix? Is Qui-Gon supposed to focus like Neo and see a halo around Anakin's head and signs pointing to him saying 'THE. CHOSEN. ONE.' everywhere? Not really. If anything, he could probably sense that he was strong in the Force, but really, you can't sense that he's the Chosen One; besides, he was too old. But after Qui-Gon gathered some facts, he decided that's what Anakin must be, due to the lack of a father and the absurdly high midichlorian count.
Qui-Gon sensed "something" in the royal starship hyperdrive bay before they set out; had to be Anakin.
And the answer to the headline is no. Lucas made note of this at the AOTC press Q & A in 2002 when the media hounded him about that "are you allowed to love?" line. Jedi are not monks; attachment, (marriage) is forbidden.
PVS...too bad you also miss a lot of what I say...for example...I said that Yoda wasn't looking at Luke's strength to lift up the X-Wing...he was watching at his concentration...he already knew that Luke was strong in the Force...so why test him on that?
and you said it just yourself...how could Yoda sense Luke's potential in the Force...if he wasn't using force powers...but still he could sense it from even another planet...
okay you never said she was force sensitive...but like I said..I say that Jedi can sense someone is strong in the force or not without that person using Force powers...
and if you dont have to use your force powers to sense another persons force capabilites...why can't normal people do it then if they don't need Force powers? That's why I called it a fact...
__________________
"The greatest hero is the one who learns to face his fears and overconquers it!"
i was only stressing that not only did quigon turn his back on a potential jedi, but the prophetic 'one'. just to forsake the base hit and knock it out of the park. there was no way for quigon to tell, since he neither inquired nor was present when anakin was (inadvertantly) using the force. after learning of his extraordinary skills (podracing) and shmi's words of "he was meant to help you" appealing to quigons naive side, THEN he realised he was dealing with a powerful being. had the conversation never come up, and had anakin never used the force around him, he could have roomed with ani and shmi for months and still not have known.
then ask GL, because he instructed frank oz (or whoever's job it was to operate yoda's facial expression) to give yoda an expression of absolute dumbfounded awe. it was the first time he felt the true depth of luke's power. "HOLY SHIT" if you will. and yes, yoda WAS testing his abilities, or more accurate, his ability and belief in said abilities. how else could luke have "failed" if he wasnt being tested? c'mon dude
NO he didnt sense luke's power. he was WATCHING luke, just as luke was able to sense the pain of han solo and chewie, who have zero force potential (as far as we know)
which i take with a grain of salt, because its based on nothing.
Luke failed because he didn't concentrate enough...like I said many times before...I could also add that he was afraid to fail...but that has nothing to do with his strenght...
And you assume that Yoda can watch everybody on any planet...Luke must be strong in the Force for Yoda to see him...He knew where Luke was...concentrated on his strength that is how he was able to see him. The stronger he is...the easier it is for Yoda to sense him.
Luke was able to sense the pain of Han and Chewie? So could Anakin of Shmi! Cause everybody has midi-chlorians otherwise they wouldn't even be alive like Qui-Gon said...that gives them some strength in the Force but not enough to be Jedi of course...
__________________
"The greatest hero is the one who learns to face his fears and overconquers it!"
the point is that yoda was surprised by luke's strength, obviously meaning he could not sense the depth of his power. i thought that was simple to grasp, but alas...
again you're trying to twist my point.
never said that did i? i said that a a force user can observe a non force user.
again you put words in my mouth.
based entirely on blind assumption as nowhere in the saga is this even HINTED at.
again you tout opinion as fact
so a force user can sense the feelings of a non force user. thanks for enforcing my point. so, that would make ability in the force irrelivent. whether or not one jedi can sense the power of another jedi who is not using that power is never answered, but the evidence against is strong. if you would read my points you would see why. the emporer and vader could not sense luke or leia...or yoda....or ben. why? because they were not USING their abilities, and thus creating a disturbance in the force.
that was how the sith finally caught on. lukes use of his power on dagobah created a disturbance in the force, as did ben when he used his powers aboard the deathstar.
the force is an energy field. a jedi acts as a conductor, NOT a battery. when not using the force, they are just people with a shitload of midis.
Dude nevermind...You say I twist your words...I don't...
I said the following things:
-Jedi can sense emotions from aswell people not strong in the Force as well as strong in the Force...they can sense their strenght. Yoda sensed Anakin's emotions who is strong in the Force...Qui-gon sensed the emotions of the neimodians who are not strong in the Force.
-Jedi can sense the strenght of people strong in the Force indeed better when they are actually using their Force powers.
-The further a person is...the more difficult of course it becomes for a person to sense someone...because you would have to concentrate so hard which makes it almost impossible for someone to sense someone else from another planet. Vader sensed something familiar on the deathstar...he could sense obi-wan...but obi-wan wasn't using force powers...like I said it's easier to sense someone when they are using force powers...that is indeed the reason how Vader was more sure that Obi-Wan was present on the death star because he was beginning to use the Force
-If you don't need to use the Force to sense someone strenght or emotions, why cant someone weak in the Force sense something.
Thus the explenation...Qui-Gon couldn't sense Anakin's Force powers because he didn't use the Force on him, because he never assumed he had potential...cause for sensing someone's strenght you have to be pretty strong in the Force...like Jedi.
__________________
"The greatest hero is the one who learns to face his fears and overconquers it!"
you used the point of yoda watching over luke to prove that yoda sensed his power. thats how it came up. and with that proven irrelevant, whats the point in mentioning that? yeah i agree, but what it have to do with anything? moving along...
based on what? name a single scene that hinted at this? all i see is proof that when not using their power, a jedi's power in not detectable at all. the reasons i have mentioned and will not repeat for a third time. give me evidence, not guesses dressed up as fact.
all i can say to that is "horseshit" because its based on absolutely nothing. no evidence, not so much as a hint of distance being a factor in sensing others. in fact quite the opposite.
in this paragraph is a valid point...finally
you touch on the only hint of evidence to support your claim. although it is also widely debated that obiwan could have been mind tricking the stormtroopers searching the ship and/or masking his presense, presumably the reason that vader only sensed him when the ST's began searching the falcon. so its all speculation on both sides as to just why vader sensed ben at that moment and not before, and just what ben was doing in there.
again you are pulling points from the air which i have NEVER EVEN SAID> i NEVER said that you dont need to use the force to sense others, only that they cant sense another's POWER through telepathy, and especially when that force user is not USING the force. why is this so difficult????
ok, lets tout some REAL facts shall we?
1-the force is an energy field that surrounds us, penetrates us, and binds us (loose quote, i dont feel like going through the script)
2-the midis are microscopic organisms which aid the jedi in CONTROLLING the force. a jedi is not a battery. they dont store up the force in their bodies. they USE it, and when they dont, then they are, like i said, just people with alot of midichlorians. simple deduction.
3-vader and palps could not sense obiwan, nor yoda, nor leia, nor luke. why? because they were not using the force. thus the force was undisturbed. when luke trained under yoda, his power created a ripple in the still pond that was the force. that is what was meant by "disturbance".
4-distance means nothing. again, it was never once even hinted that distance was a factor in sensing the emotions of others or sensing the power one is weilding.
stop thinking of the jedi as walking batteries and you just may grasp what i'm saying. the pieces of the puzzle are there in the script. put it together.
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Feb 15th, 2006 09:49 PM
