You couldn't care less that they are proven to rely on faulty evidence, intimidation tactics and proven lies? You couldn't care less that many of them contain actual conspiracy theories (the Catholic one being a prime example) that have been debunked so many times its not funny?
And you ask if we are paranoid? We are seeing the truth, without ignorant acceptance blinding our views. Clearly Chick is fully in line with your warped view on the world. A person wont see a lie when the lie is 100% in line with what they already believe. But that doesn't make it the truth. It is ignorance.
For yet another time - Chick Tracts are propaganda. They are woefully incorrect. And they degrade your religion. If you really care about God and Jesus you should speak out against those who sully them by associating them with lies and hate. But you don't. You accept and "could care less" about the mass of negatives they contain.
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From even the greatest of horrors irony is seldom absent.
Gaaaahhhh. My opinion? It isn't baseless - it is based upon sound and evidenced fact. I am not making it up. I have no reason to. But any person with even a little knowledge of the subjects he is talking about, or even a smidgen of common sense, knows that the Tracts lack any validity in their claims.
Do you honestly believe there is a Catholic conspiracy behind the Holocaust and they are planning another in the US even now? Do you honestly believe that university professors threaten students with jail if they don't support evolution? Do you honestly believe people who play Dungeons and Dragons are all part of secret devil worshiping cabals with pentagrams and real spells? Do you honestly believe all that psuedo-history to do with Masons? Do you honestly believe Buddhists have missionaries arrested to be beaten?
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From even the greatest of horrors irony is seldom absent.
Why are you so interested in what I believe? Who am I? It does not matter what I believe, I see absolutely nothing amiss with Chick Tracts just like you see nothing wrong with evolution. It is a two-way street.
Why? Because you make blanket statements without backing them up. "I see nothing wrong with Chick Tracts, maybe all those who don't like them are just being paranoid."
So tell me, you didn't answer the question. Look at the examples I gave, and tell me in each case if you believe them.
Because you are flapping them around like gospal, when they are anything but. Tell me in each of those examples whether you believe the claim... or not.
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From even the greatest of horrors irony is seldom absent.
The only folk that I know of who do not like chick tracts are unsaved folk. I have yet to meet someone (in real life not on a forum) who is saved, who does not like chick tracts or see the value in them.
Stop dodging the question. It would be easy to simply go True/false for each of the examples I gave.
Why do you want to avoid answering?
And you must have a very small group of people you associate with, because I know there are huge Christian numbers who think they are mud. First of all the Christians he badmouths. Second of all - rational Christians who see them for lies. Third - evangelical Christians who realise non-Christians are mostly disgusted by the nature of the Tracts and are harder to convert by more intelligent means.
But again - please, answer the question. Lead by example and tell us do you believe the claims I just posted.
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From even the greatest of horrors irony is seldom absent.
Oh, so you think that I am under obligation to answer your questions in the manner that you just dictated for (or because) if I do not, then I am as you say "dodging the question?" As a favor I will tell you that I agree with the message contained in Chick Tracts as they relate to the message of the gospel: salvation through Jesus Christ. That is the crux of Chick Tracts. Many of the short stories are hypothetical or fictional (but some are historically true) designed to dramatize and arrest your attention.
Tch, tch. If someone asks a person a question, and the person avoids it, what are they doing? In layman's terms it is called dodging.
And you aren't obliged to do anything. It is a forum. But don't act so shocked that when you make baseless blanket statements people will question you.
And besides, it still seems to me you are avoiding the question. "You believe in the message" do you? So the ends justify the means do they? It is ok to lie, misdirect, demonize etc to convert? That is ok because the message is to your liking? Maybe I should become a Christian in the old tradition, convert with a guns. But when a person has converted I will say "ha, it wasn't loaded, it was merely there for dramatic effect" and you would support me because the message is to your liking.
I know they are fictional, obviously they are comics, but they are portrayed as accurate. I gave examples, you don't want to tell me whether you believe those examples. Fine, I will assume your reluctance to answer is because you know they are false, and you think if you admit that it will degrade you claim the tracts are good.
But I will ask again anyway - I gave specific examples. These examples for the either a minor part, or a major part, of the Tracts purpose. The anti-Catholic ones message hinged on a Catholic conspiracy. It was not being port forward as a hypotethical - but fact. So tell me do you believe the claims being made in the examples I gave you?
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From even the greatest of horrors irony is seldom absent.
Have you not heard of ignoring someone because you do not deem that person worthy of your time? If I don't answer a question it is because I don't have the time, don't feel like wasting my time, or I don't want to give that person the time (of day). But never will I dodge a question.
Last edited by JesusIsAlive on Sep 15th, 2006 at 02:15 AM
So, you don't want to waste time? Yet you have responded 4 times.
You don't want to give me the time of day? 4 posts in response to me.
Don't have time? Yet you have had time to write this. And three other posts skirting around the question.
Let me reiterate - you support Chick. You claim they are fiction - fiction based on what he thinks is Truth. Both the Mason and the Catholic one present a theory that is no true. This isn't an eye catcher or drama - this is a theory he believes in a fictional setting. They are both false - bad evidence, misinterpretation, conspiracy theory.
Why do you not wish to give a true/false answer to the Chick examples I gave? They are taken straight from the Tracts you support so. Why the reluctance to lead by example?
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From even the greatest of horrors irony is seldom absent.
The word sweet pickles is starting to formulate on my lips (once it does it is too late Samura, I will have to consign you in the same category with others on this forum who continue to overlook things that I say clearly). I did not say that Chick Tracts were fictional and that is it end of story. I qualified what I said about some of the dramatized stories being hypothetical and fictional, just like the parables that Jesus told,
Which does not work. He, in the anti-Catholic tract and anti-Mason tract presented a theory as fact. He presents psuedo-history as fact. In the Dungeons & Dragon Tract he has the game merely being the front for Satanic cults recruiting teens. He presents it as fact. This is the whole crux of such tracts - these claims that should make people convert now.
It is a unworkable claim that such tracts are merely "parables." Which is why I am asking if you believe the claims that he has put forward. What is so hard to understand? Why are you so determined not to confirm or disagree with such claims?
And even if it is completely fictional - which is isn't, how is it just or right that he uses such monstrous fiction to get people in line with his thoughts? I know, gay men with demons sitting on their heads - Innocent. The idea that Hindu's are murderous. Innocent.
Sweet pickles? I think I will have to knick name you the Dodger then. Because that is what you are doing. You are doing you up most to avoid answering a question about claims Chick presents as fact and reason why people should turn away from there current faith/philosophy. You are doing your best to avoid confirming or denying whether is is right to create lies to convert.
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From even the greatest of horrors irony is seldom absent.
I understand, I mean I am not a stupid person. I am just mentally strong enough not to allow you or anyone else to induce, coerce, force, or manipulate me into your box so that you can say, aha! We got him now. I told you what I believe, let us just leave it at that. I support Chick Tracts and you do not. Case close.
Who was trying to force you into a box? It seems only you have some reason to believe there is danger in actually committing to an answer. You come along, make a blanket statement about how people who claim Chick is using propaganda are paranoid (that is a box my friend) and when questioned on it, and asked questions in relation to that claim, why you twisted and turned and did everything but answer.
You even threw up a smokescreen "They are fictional settings" - of course they are. They only claim to use real facts in fictional settings, real theories. They claim to be true. Yet would you commit? Lead by example? No. You backed out.
You refused to confirm whether you believe in what they are saying. You simply "believe the message"...
And to Hell with the way he does it - correct? To hell with the lies? To hell with the insulting mistruth? To hell with the gross misinterpretation? To hell with all of that, his heart is in the right place, right? And here I was thinking the Bible advocated truth, justice, and the like. Here I was thinking the Bible said how the truth of its word was enough. But no, it is fine some judgemental and prejudiced fool is lying in his mass produced Chick Tracts because his message if ok. That is what you are saying?
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From even the greatest of horrors irony is seldom absent.
Dude, get up, go outside (if you are not already) get some fresh air. Take a deep breath. Say to yourself, "this discussion is not that important nor serious." Then come back inside the house sit down and try to enjoy yourself. These discussions are supposed to be light not depressing and serious.
The error in that whole post is that I am not enjoying this. Immensely.
And yes, I am outside. Laptop, pile of data to be entered, distraction from assignment. I think I could sit here all day (until I need to get a cup of tea.)
And you still aren't willing to commit on anything. It makes it hard to take your glowing endorsement of Chick Tracts seriously when you won't even support the claims he is making.
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From even the greatest of horrors irony is seldom absent.
KMC Community Forums
Sep 15th, 2006 12:25 AM
